1994 03-08MERIDIAN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION
AGENDA
TUESDAY, MARCH 8, 1994 - 7:30 P.M.
CITY COUNCIL CHAMBERS
MINUTES OF PREVIOUS MEETING HELD FEBRUARY 8, 1994
(APPROVED)
1. FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR ANNEXATION AND
ZONING WITH A PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR MERIDIAN MEADOWS BY
RONALD HENRY: (APPROVED)
2. FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR ANNEXATION AND
ZONING FOR SUMMERFIELD SUBDIVISION BY MAX BOESIGER AND
HUBBLE ENGINEERING: (APPROVED)
3. REQUEST FOR ANNEXATION AND ZONING WITH A PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR
HAVEN COVE NO. 5 BY INTERWEST DEVELOPMENT AND DAVID
COLLINS: TABLED AT FEBRUARY 8, 1994 MEETING: (TABLED
UNTIL APRIL 12, 1994 MEETING)
4. PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR ANNEXATION AND ZONING WITH A
CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR ASPEN GROVE ESTATES BY
SHEKINAH INDUSTRIES AND POWER ENGINEERS: (CITY
ATTORNEY TO PREPARE FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS
OF LAW)
5. PUBLIC HEARING: REQEUST FOR PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR FINCH CREEK
SUBDIVISION BY BORUP CONSTRUCTION AND HUBBLE ENGINEERS:
(APPROVED)
6. PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR PRELIMINARY PLAT WITH A CONDITIONAL
USE PERMIT FOR MERIDIAN ENERGY BY MERIDIAN ENERGY AND
TOM EDDY OF PACIFIC LAND SURVEYORS: (CITY ATTORNEY TO
PREPARE FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW)
7. CLARIFICATION AND DISCUSSION BY WAYNE CROOKSTON ON SPORTSMAN
POINTE NO. 5 SUBDIVISION: (TABLED UNTIL APRIL 12, 1994
MEETING)
MERIDIAN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION MARCH 8, 1994
The regular meeting of the Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission was called to
order by Chairman Jim Johnson at 7:30 P.M.:
Members Present: Charlie Rountree, Jim Shearer, Moe Alidjani, Tim Hepper:
Others Present: Will Berg, Wayne Crookston, Shari Stiles, Wayne Forrey, Gary Smith,
Max Yerrington, Walt Morrow, Morgan and Marilyn Plant, Marshall and Mary Smith,
Anna Doty, Ted Hanson, Bruce Tuttle, Jim Witherell, Nathan West, Reece and Belle
McMillan, Gary Hambly, Aulie Roberson, Jack Siemson, Bruce Borup, Ron and Bonnie
McKague, Robert Smith, Thelma Bross, Richard Bross, Chuck and Lynn Salisbury,
Jack Anderson, Dale Newberry, Richard Caller, Jeff Lincoln, Tom Mercer, Tom and
Barbara Geile, Diane Beaulieu, Celeste Fleminier, Dyane Thompson, Dave Thompson,
Elwood Rennison, Dana Harper and Melinda Harper, Tim and Heather Odd, Dan and
Debra Alderson, Todd Montrous, Bev Donahue, Jim Mercle, Bruce Thompson, Mike
Preston, Gene Pressley, Terry Mitchell, Erik Hanson, Tom Poores, Don Bryan, Larry
Sale:
MINUTES OF PREVIOUS MEETING HELD FEBRUARY 8, 1994:
Johnson: Are there any corrections, additions or deletions?
Alidjani: Mr. Chairman, I have one. On page 12, the 6th line after Mr. Ronald
Henry's talk and Henry said, "this is 8,000 square feet lot the largest building will be
17,675 1 believe there is an error here. We can't have a 17,000 square foot building
in an 8,000 square foot lot.
Johnson: We need to review that, do you recall that Wayne?
Crookston: I don't.
Alidjani: Let me read it here, its says the density is 2.7 lots per acre, we are
requesting an R-4 zoning with the minimum of 8,000 square feet per lot the largest
building will be 17,675.
Shearer: I think that is building lot.
Alidjani: So scratch the building and put lot or add lot.
Johnson: Any other corrections? If there are no further corrections to the minutes
I'll entertain a motion for approval.
Rountree: Mr. Chairman, I make a motion we approve the minutes of the previous
meeting.
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 2
Alidjani: Second
Johnson: Its moved and seconded to approve the minutes approved as written with
the correction, all those in favor? Opposed?
MOTION CARRIED: All Yea
ITEM #1: FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR ANNEXATION AND
ZONING WITH A PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR MERIDIAN MEADOWS BY RONALD
HENRY:
Johnson: This now has a new name, Fawcett's Meadows. You have digested the
Findings of Fact and Conclusions of Law are there any corrections, any discussion?
On item 19 Wayne, we have still have that one typographical error that keeps
cropping up the net to not. Are there any other changes?
Rountree: Mr. Chairman, I make the motion that the Planning and Zoning Commission
hereby adopts and approves these Findings of Fact and Conclusions of Law.
Alidjani: Second
Johnson: Its moved and seconded to approve the Findings of Fact and Conclusions
of Law as prepared by the City Attorney, this is a roll call vote.
ROLL CALL VOTE: Hepper - Yea, Rountree - Yea, Shearer - Yea, Alidjani - Yea
MOTION CARRIED: All Yea
Johnson: Any recommendation to the City Council?
Rountree: Mr. Chairman, I make a motion that the Meridian Planning and Zoning
Commission hereby recommends to the City Council of the City of Meridian that they
approve the annexation and zoning as stated above for the property described in the
application with the conditions set forth in these Findings of Fact and Conclusions of
Law and that the applicant be specifically required to tile all ditches, canals,
waterways and that all ordinances of the City of Meridian, specifically including the
development time requirements, and enter into the required Development Agreement
and if the conditions are not met that the property be de -annexed.
Shearer: Second
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March 8, 1994
Page 3
Johnson: Moved and seconded to pass a favorable recommendation onto the City
Council as so stated, all those in favor? Opposed?
MOTION CARRIED: All Yea
ITEM #2: FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR ANNEXATION AND
ZONING FOR SUMMERFIELD SUBDIVISION BY MAX BOESIGER AND HUBBLE
ENGINEERING:
Johnson: Any corrections to these Findings of Fact, any discussion? There is a typo
on item #24, page 6. Meridian School District shouldn't be a period in there. 1
believe that is all I have.
Hepper: Mr. Chairman, I move the Meridian Planning and Zoning Commission hereby
adopts and approves these Findings of Fact.
Shearer: Second
Johnson: Moved and seconded to approve the Findings of Fact as prepared by the
City Attorney, roll call vote.
ROLL CALL VOTE: Hepper - Yea, Alidjani - Yea, Shearer - Yea, Rountree - Yea
MOTION CARRIED: All Yea
Hepper: Mr. Chairman, I move the Meridian Planning and Zoning Commission hereby
recommends to the City Council of the City of Meridian that they approve the
annexation and zoning as stated above in the conclusions of law for the property
described in the application with the conditions set forth of the findings of fact and
conclusions of law and that if the conclusions are not met that the property be de -
annexed.
Rountree: Second
Johnson: Moved and seconded to pass a recommendation onto the City Council, all
those in favor? Opposed?
MOTION CARRIED: All Yea
ITEM #3: REQUEST FOR ANNEXATION AND ZONING WITH A PRELIMINARY PLAT
FOR HAVEN COVE NO. 05 BY INTERWEST DEVELOPMENT AND DAVID COLLINS:
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TABLED AT FEBRUARY 8, 1994 MEETING:
Shearer: Mr. Chairman, David Collins, the engineer, requested that this be tabled for
another month and 1 think he can confirm that if necessary. So, I move that we table
this until next month.
Hepper: Second
Johnson: Its moved and seconded that we table item #3 until our next regularly
scheduled meeting, all those in favor? Opposed?
MOTION CARRIED: All Yea
ITEM #4: PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR ANNEXATION AND ZONING WITH A
CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR ASPEN GROVE ESTATES BY SHEKINAH
INDUSTRIES AND POWER ENGINEERS:
Johnson: I will now open the public hearing, is there someone representing the
applicant that would like to come forward and address the Commission, please do so
at this time.
Mlke Preston, 420 Bitterroot, Boise, was sworn by the Attorney.
Preston: Mr. Chairman, my name is Mike Preston, I'm President of Shekinah
Industries, Inc. representing the Aspen Grove development here tonight. I have a map
that I would like to speak while I'm explaining my development, is there a way that
I can kind of put it here?
Johnson: Yes, is there another easel Gary or is there another one?
Preston: I could put it over there but I can't reach it to point.
Johnson: Is there anyone from the audience that can help you, did you bring
anybody with you?
Preston: Is that reasonable? I'll try to explain what I'm talking about from here if I
can. Okay, we are located along the lower portion of the map is Franklin road and
the lest side of the map is Locust Grove. The top of the map points south the way
I've got it oriented there. What we are proposing here is a 33 acre development, its
essentially a 40 acre piece with approximately 7 acres out of the easterly side there.
There are 4 residential homes on those 4 lots and to the north of the project is open,
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its not really agriculture because it hasn't been farmed for awhile. To the right side
of the map is a pasture and residence up along Franklin road, to the north of the
project which is the bottom on the right side is the brick factory, the Builders
Marketplace I believe they call it and just to the right of that is an industrial
subdivision and its open farmground where Locust Grove comes in about midway on
the east side to the left portion of the map there are several large lot residential uses
along there, open pasture and what not. What we are proposing is 33 acres of
primarily homesites and 3.7 acre commercial development right at the corner of
Locust Grove and Franklin. The Comprehensive Plan in Meridian for this area shows
a mixed use for this site and I wasn't sure what that meant, so in talking with Mr.
Forrey he explained to me what the City wanted to see in a mixed use area was
something that blended with the overall area. The overall area has commercial use,
industrial use, residential use, and agricultural uses at this time. So, its a difficult
thing to, it would be fairly easy to put in an industrial or commercial use there that
would fit nicely but there is no need for that right now. So, we decided to go ahead
and put a little commercial right at the corner a neighborhood type we show 9,000
square foot of professional office, 30,000 square foot of commercial a gas station/
car wash type facility. Now what I would like to propose for the Commission tonight
is not any kind of a specific approval of the commercial other than general commercial
and I believe Ms. Stiles in her report indicated that any of the commercial uses would
need to come back in for a specific commercial use for whatever it is. And I would
like to go along with that because I'm generally just proposing commercial in this area
And it might change. I am not here tonight saying I'm going to build that commercial.
I'm only here tonight saying that I will build a residential on this and I would like to
probably sell is to a commercial builder who would then come back in and specifically
get your approval for whatever exactly he is going to build. So, with that I'd like to
start talking about traffic circulation which is very important. There are proposed a
140 units, one of the units is an existing home that will be lived in. We have one
other home on this site and I'm going to convert it to a club house and office. Traffic
wise for these 140 homes we are proposing 2 main accesses, one is Locust Grove
and we'll have coming out of the development we'll have 2 bays, one for right turns
and one for left turns and then one coming in. So there will be 3 lanes on the Locust
Grove side, the same thing on the Franklin Road side so that we'll be able to handle
that amount of traffic. We anticipate about 1400 vehicle trips per day from this
development because there is 140 units. All the streets that we show there, the main
streets are 41 foot wide paved streets that will be built in conformance with ACHD
standards as far as the structural thickness of the streets. What we are proposing
though, the reason they are 41 foot is rather than going curb gutter and sidewalks we
are proposing to go all pavement and then striping the sidewalks. There will be on
street parking just like an Ada County street, 41 foot pure pavement is equivalent to
a 36 foot street with curb, gutter and sidewalk, it provides 4 foot sidewalks and
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parking and 2 travel ways. The curb takes up some room that you can't drive on and
you can't walk on so if you don't have the curb you can make it just a tiny bit
narrower. The reason I'm proposing this is primarily for drainage purposes. Rather
than collecting all the water and disposing it underground which now tends to be
frowned on through an absorption field we are going to let it fall and stay where it is.
Rather than concentrate it and put it pipes and go to one central area where you have
a whole bunch of water we are going to have the water soak into the ground more
or less where it falls. You can't do that if you have curbs and gutters. Now, all the
street I could never get that approved of course through Ada County Highway District
but we are proposing on this development to have all private streets that will be
maintained solely by myself as the owner of this project. All the land will remain in
one ownership as far as the residential. The homes that we are proposing here, what
we are trying to do is provide a very needed service to Meridian and that is to provide
affordable homes. There is a tremendous market for it and its something that is really
needed. There is a general concern I think by the community that because these are
a lower priced homes that they are lower quality homes. I need to really speak to this
Commission about that because that is a mis-conception by the public. The reason
we can put these homes here for less money than we can build a standard stick type
built home is these homes are built in factories. There is a tremendous savings in
labor cost by doing it this way and the weather doesn't slow it down and you can
just do it on an assembly line in a factory and do it very well. The actual structural
standard of the home many times are greater than the stick built homes that you will
find in the community because every one of these homes will have 2 x 6 walls with
that extra insulation they'll have vinyl windows that are more insulated than the
aluminum type with the gas fill in between them. They're higher insulation standards,
they're all insulated in the floors, I want to mention that these, all thought they are
built in a factory and transferred to the site will all every singe one of them will be
attached to a permanent foundation. The homeowner will not be me it will be the
person that lives in it will own the home, the carport, each home will have a double
car port, an 8 foot by 18 foot storage space and complete landscaping. They will not
move into this until its complete with the pressurized irrigation system and all the
sidewalks and what not. It will be a complete facility. Now, 1 have developed a
project south of Meridian called Willow Creek Heights and it was a very needed
housing development and it was a very successful development. And we provided
a lot of, I didn't build any homes but the builder provide a lot of 1050 square foot
homes and we sold them about as fast as we could get the construction done. It was
very successful. In that the homes were all 3 bedroom, 2 bath, 2 car garage homes
and they are extremely small. Now the starter families that live in them and so forth
it was about all they could do to buy them and then after they bought them there are
things like drapes, and landscaping and maybe storage facilities and fencing and
irrigation systems and that type of thing to consider as a homeowner. One of the
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March 8, 1994
Page 7
problems is that they are stretched to the limit and they can't afford much more than
those houses for at least the first several months if not few years. And we've had
with a standard subdivision you have covenants and restrictions which you do your
best to enforce but its difficult to do quite frankly. In this development I'm very
concerned with the quality as well I know the neighbors are that are probably here
listening to this. I am going to specifically structure the ownership of this to ensure
quality. I'm going to own it and if it goes down in quality that is going to mean
direct loss of income to me. I am going to have not covenants and restrictions but
anyone that puts their home on that property will have a direct agreement with me
as to what they will and will not do in relation to the exterior maintenance and up
keep of that home. Its an agreement directly with me rather than just a general
covenant and through that document I believe that we can maintain the quality of this
development through time much better than has been done in many subdivisions quite
frankly. Its a very needed service and one of the reasons that this project is unique
in the fact that it does have carports. Now a lot of the modern type manufactured
housing developments attach garages right to the homes and 1 considered that but the
way I've situated each of the car ports with the home was for a very specific purpose
and that was to provide a completely private outside living area with each unit.
Many times when you send these homes in there, there is very little screening
between the side area and the street and certainly the side are and the next home.
Now these will have completely private areas in every space like any single family
subdivision that provides the fences and what not. So that each home and family will
have private outside living. They will be completely landscaped, the units, your
standard home set back from the street usually 20 feet, these units as I've got them
located on my plan are closer to 30 feet. There is going to be a great distance from
the street to the home. We are going to have expensive landscape, sod the whole
bit before the people move in. Everyone will be controlled they will not be able to just
bring in their home, set it up and then fix it up the way they want to. They will not
be allowed to do that. They will buy a brand new home, and brand new homes that
we'll have to do this carefully because we don't want to exclude anyone but we are
going to be the salespeople of the homes to ensure that they are all homes that have
complete sheet rock inside and quality finish throughout. Now there are 2 or 3
manufacturers of those homes that provide that and we are going to try to be
salesman of those that we can only sell within our park nowhere else, but we are
going to set them up completely before the people can move in and close their
homes. Another feature is that they will in the financing of their homes finance the
landscaping, concrete work, car port and storage within the whole package, but
because they could if they wanted to relocate that home if they were unhappy with
this, have to do so by crane, but because of all the landscaping 1 will provide that I
will buy back all the fixed furnishings at the cost that they put them in from them if
they decide to do that. We propose to maintain this park in a quality that no one will
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 8
ever want to move out. We were proposing in our application to you that the sewer
system, water system, drainage system, irrigation system and street system all be
private within the bounds of this development. By that I mean I would own and
maintain and operate them. Mr. Smith in his letter and the staff report indicated that
they had to be constructed in conformance to City standards to avoid infiltration etc.
And of course we would be totally willing to do all of that. 1 would like to leave it
tentative in relation to the water system, it may be more appropriate to go with a City
owned water system rather than private owned, it may work out better and I haven't
had time to discuss that with Mr. Smith. So, either private or public whatever is best
for the situation here. I think for water circulation and pressure distribution it might
be better to leave it public because on a private system you only have one tap and
you can't use all the pipes that you are putting in there to tap in somewhere else for
proper circulation. Now, buffering and landscaping around the unit. We have a few
residential, there are 2 homes adjacent down in the lower right hand corner, there are
4 homes over in the white area, they are large acre homes and they are on a hill and
they are oriented to the east away from the development. I understand some concern
has been expressed about the density here and I can understand that and I don't
know exactly. I understand that I need to agree to a development agreement with the
City and I propose that to screen the entire area with a 6 foot solid cedar fence to
screen out these units. If that is not adequate with the adjacent owners we want to
consider their concerns, we're open to a different type of screening. Now. it has
been suggested that we reduce the density around that and I suggest that because
of the Comprehensive Plan as being mixed use and this is extremely expensive
property that we go ahead and allow the increased density that is needed to afford
to put these homes on here. You can't really put affordable housing at a lower
density quite frankly, but rather than reduce the density just totally separate this use
from those neighbors out of respect for their concerns and we can do that with some
kind of a total solid barrier that can be 6 or 7 feet whatever needed high. There will
be no 2 story units in this entire development, they are only single story. Now, I
probably left a few things out and I would like to have time for rebuttal, I'm not sure
what the concerns are from the neighbors. Right now I'd just open it up to your for
questions.
Johnson: Thank you Mr. Preston, yes we will want to reserve that right to call you
up later if we have some questions that may be answered at this meeting. Do the
Commissioners have any questions for the developer?
Alidjani: Would you let us know what is the minimum and maximum square footage
on those houses.
Preston: Well, one of the things that we are trying to do, I left that out. In the
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Willow Creek Heights development that was stick built, most of them were 1050
square foot homes out there, this was outside the City of Meridian. That was great
and that was affordable, what we are trying to do here is to provide larger homes at
a lower cost because 1050 square foot home is not a very big home even for a small
family. We're hoping that most of the homes will be at least 1300, or 1400 square
foot. We do want to reserve the right for a few 1100, 1200 square foot homes as
well. I believe your ordinance calls for, you can have half of the homes under 1300
square feet, we'll probably, is that not correct?
Alidjani: I'm not sure.
Preston: I believe it is that you can go a certain percent, 10%-1000, 20%-1200
you've got a specific graduation. And I would certainly conform to that, but I think
most of my homes will be above the 1300 square foot minimum.
Johnson: Any other questions, any other Commissioners have any questions?
Rountree: What is happening on the south end coming off of Locust Grove, you have
a I can't see your drawing very well but it looks like its a stub street or a culdesac
street.
Preston: That is correct, its a hammerhead street coming off serving 5 units and that
isn't tied to the rest of the development. I'm only going to have 5 homes served with
that small street.
Rountree: So there isn't aed: connect?
Preston: There is not. I'm proposing that there shouldn't be there. We've got
adequate circulation coming out to Franklin and Locust Grove. Most of the homes
will come out on Franklin Road I'm sure that will be the general circulation pattern for
this development and personally in respect to the neighbors I don't think that it should
be tied together there. Its been suggested that we have a tie street to the south,
because this is a private development and private streets I would hope you would not
request that they are not public streets, I don't really want, this is a totally contained
entity and we don't want that extraneous traffic and its not really needed from the
respect that you've got Locust Grove and Franklin. And streets east of the cemetery
or west of the cemetery that will totally serve that area without access here.
Rountree: Do you have any floor plans or elevations of the types of manufactured
homes you propose?
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Preston: We are extremely concerned, there are a lot of manufactured houses that
don't look very nice in my opinion from the street. And we are not going to allow one
of them in our development. We are going to have 4 to 1 pitches, we are going to
have all different kinds of roof elevations, porches, in sets, bay windows and so forth.
We are extremely concerned about how this looks from the street. And I did bring
some examples, they are very beautiful homes. I honestly don't believe there is
anyone is this room that would be not wiling to live in these type of homes. I've
walked into them furnished and they are absolutely beautiful. The floor plans of these
homes because they actually do better planning on them because they build so many
of them are many times better than the ones that are stick built homes. The floor
plans are much more unique they have angled walls and beautiful kitchens and
master bedrooms, master bedroom suites and so forth. Incidentally none of these
homes will have anything but the type of siding you see on the stick built homes all
around town they have the same type of roofs the composite shingles type roofs and
so forth. These are not the mobile homes, this is not a mobile home park that we are
talking about here. These are beautiful homes with very stylish exteriors, and most
of the suppliers won't qualify to be in this park because I'm not going to allow them
in. We will spec them out, the Golden West builds a very good quality home for the
price and that is going to be our prime home those are the brochures that you see.
Johnson: Have you reviewed the City's ordinance on manufactured housing?
Preston: I didn't know you had one.
Johnson: Basically its a clone of Boise's manufactured housing zoning, with some
variations. You may want to get familiar with that as soon as possible. More
questions?
Rountree: You mentioned several times the need for affordable homes, the
community need, do you have any specifics relative to that?
Preston: Well, I was involved in the development of a home in the $80,000 price
range and it was extremely successful and the people that when we started 1050
square foot home, double car garage, 3 bedroom, 2 bath started at about $68,000
today that same home is about $75,000 or $80,000 and there is just a tremendous
need. There is a tremendous number of people that can only afford that level of
home. Now I would like to be able to provide a home in the $50,000 of $60,000
range but its not possible that I know of to do it because there are probably a lot of
people in that range too.
Rountree: I want to make sure I understand the concept. You will own the land and
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March 8, 1994
Page 11
the homeowners will purchase the homes. You've indicated that if those homes are
not kept up you will suffer a loss, would you explain the rational?
Preston: Yes sir, I believe that I didn't explain that we are going to have both adult
an adult area only and a family area. The adult area is up along Franklin road and
there is about 85 family areas and 54 adult areas in this project. To keep the people
and the rent up you have to have a quality living environment. The adult people that
wilt live here will, the majority of these people will just buy their homes outright and
the home without foundation, landscaping or anything else many of these homes will
be in the $80,000 to $90,000 range. They will be 2,000 to 2,500 square feet and
I'm talking these are much bigger and more expensive homes than the surrounding
homes, they are going to be very elaborate. The family homes I don't expect to be
that elaborate but it will vary. We are talking about homes in the $100,000 range in
the adult area. Now to attract the adult people that want to travel and so forth, they
have to be in a high interior styled neighborhood. Now on the outside of this project
we've got industrial uses, its not unattractive or anything else like that, but it is
industrial. So its extremely important that we keep the appearance inside of our living
area top notch to keep these people happy. They will not pay the top rent if we
don't. At least that is my opinion sir.
Alidjani: Just for the record, this catalog that you showed us one of them they have
approximately the square footage price of $36, is that about what we are looking at?
Preston: That is for the homes with drapes, with all the appliances that is correct that
is a pretty typical you can find them for around $31, but these are more like $36,
$37, $39.
Alidjani: So just for the record if they have a 1100 square foot home we are only
talking about a $36,000 price?
Preston: Well you have to add about $30,000 onto that. There is tremendous
amount of additional cost besides just the home sir.
Alidjani: We are talking about the house only is going to be about $40,000, then you
have to add the foundation, the grass and landscaping in order?
Preston: Yes, if you have an 1,100 square foot one that would be about right. That
is about as low as you can get about $40,000. Now that is lower than stick built
primarily because of labor. It is not because these are inferior, they are actually better
homes in many ways than the stick built.
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Alidjani: I have looked at a couple of them called American Heritage, one in Caldwell
and one on Pine Street.
Preston: And those are Golden West homes, that is the type that we are talking
about.
Hepper: What was your side yard set back, you said 30 feet on the front, any idea
on the side yards?
Preston: Well the minimum on one side will be 5 feet.
Hepper: And what about on the other side?
Preston: And it will have a 6 foot fence along it at foot out. They vary as you can
see from the layout. Some of these homes are long ways with the street and some
of them are longways against the street although it varies throughout.
Hepper: Now is that 5 feet from building to building or to the property line?
Preston: Property line.
Hepper: Do you have any idea what the overall density of the project is?
Preston: Yes sir, its 4.76 units per acre. We are providing 2 parks in the family area
we've got a full court outside basketball and a full volleyball in its park for the family
concerns. In the adult park we've got shuffleboard and horseshoe areas, small areas.
At the club house we'll have complete kitchen facilities and a large rec room and
upstairs and down its a daylight basement type home and outside in a little park we'll
have the gazebo type for barbecues and what not for all the residents.
Hepper: Did you say its private sewer or public sewer?
Preston: I'm proposing private, built to City standards.
Hepper: Would there be a lagoon or what?
Preston: Oh, no we will tie into your system. All the effluent will go into the City
system, but I'm proposing to just maintain the lines myself.
Hepper: But it will all tie in with Meridian?
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Preston: Yes, sir and built completely to your standards.
Johnson: Any other questions from the Commission? Wayne does our manufactured
housing ordinance permit car ports? It is my understanding its 2 car garages. You
may want to review that because there are some restrictions in there.
Hepper: There are also some square footage restrictions too.
to
Johnson: I think its 500 per half as I recall, you may want to look at there because
there are things in there that will cause you some problems if you don`t. Thank you
Mr. Preston, this is a public hearing, anyone from the public like to address the
Commission.
Diane Beaulieu, 1895 Star Lane, was sworn by the Attorney.
Beaulieu: I live on North Locust Grove on the north side of Fairview. One of my
concerns is the amount of traffic. I have a copy of a letter that was sent to Steve
Sherer at Ada County Highway District and they said that Locust Grove would
eventually be a 5 lane road. I think it is very important that now we look at that in
the future and not just plan the easement for 3 lanes and then when you go to 5 you
have to rip out the berms and bring a road right to the back of peoples property, right
to the fence. Plan for 5 lanes plus the berms, trees. And the reason I suggest trees
is for noise control, they are going to be all ripped out probably on North Locust
Grove when they go to 5 lanes. Another concern I have is the amount of open area.
When we have a developer put aside certain amount of area I don't think he should
be able to count the berms if that is going to be taken away eventually when the
roads are widened. In this park that with the number of homes that are there I
concerned about the number of vehicles that will be sitting on the road in what are
dead cars. I concerned that there is an ordinance so that the place looks clean and
well kept. Also the number of animals, when you have that great of a density of
people. I would like to see an ordinance dealing with the number of animals in that
park. Also irrigation is a real concern. It should mandated and followed through that
street drainage does not go into any irrigation canals. That water is used for crops,
for gardens and for animals. One other thing, Franklin road right now is not wide
enough and built to handle that amount of traffic I think that needs to be dealt with
before you put that many homes in. Thank you.
Gary Hambley, 2250 Cadillac Drive, was sworn by the Attorney.
Hambley: I didn't come here to really oppose this project, my biggest concern is
traffic. I live on Locust Grove, well right off Locust Grove and Locust Grove is
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basically right now a dead end street. There is only one way out of it and that is
Franklin road. So there ingress and egress be it Locust or Franklin even on Franklin
they've got to turn towards Eagle the freeway. The traffic is bad enough right now
trying to get onto Franklin. Tonight I had to follow a couple of my neighbors down
here and we waited even this late a minutes to 2 minutes no bid deal. Another 300
or so cars of this project plus how many in the commercial who knows 30,40, 50
(End of Tape). I think ultimately what we are going to run into is that we are going
to have to put a light on Locust Grove and right now Locust Grove doesn't even
continue north which I'm sure that is under review. That was my biggest concern is
basically ingress and egress. Where the commercial property is I do think should be
sidewalk, curb and gutters. Everytime I've gotten a commercial building I've always
had to put sidewalks, curbs, and gutters. I think drainage should be in ground maybe
there is a different philosophy in Meridian, but I do most of my building in Garden City
and in Garden City we all have to have on site drainage. The traffic, I don't know
how to handle that. I looked at it 2 exits on Franklin road doesn't accomplish
anything. The same thing if you eliminate the one on Locust Grove because again
you are going to have the same traffic passing in front of it. So, I don't know really
how to handle it. I think we need some other system than what we have. I guess
you people are the authorities on that. I won't take anymore of your time, I
appreciate your time.
Johnson: Thank you Gary, any questions of Gary? Anyone else from the public?
Elwood Rennison, 990 Mustang Street, was sworn by the Attorney.
Rennison: One of the main concerns I have here tonight is Meridian as a community
is dedicated to having good schools, good education and also a good way of life.
And I feel that putting in a lower class type subdivision you will jeopardize that
considerably. And when I say considerably jeopardize this our schools are over
crowded now. This will put a lot of pressure on the schools, Meridian Junior High,
Meridian High School, Intermediate School, Grade Schools. Well, Boise they are
putting in custom homes, they have families that are taking pride in what they have.
They are taking families that fix their places up, they do their own landscaping,
they've got an investment. This particular planned community doesn't appear to have
that, there is no pride and ownership. If the homes go for $40,000 they are not
going to be much of a home. If you look around at the prices that houses go for,
granted a lot of people need available housing, but I don't think Meridian should
sacrifice their quality of life and have more lower income housing. I think they should
strive for better quality housing, better communities. Our police force they are
stressed out as it is. These streets are all privately owned, privately maintained, is
the City going to be responsible for doing the policing? The City the way it is set up
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 15
right now doesn't have any regulations based on the covenants that are suggested
of controlling anything within this particular area that is being proposed. We see
Eagle as being quite an upper class place because they are making sure the houses
going in are good quality and individual ownership. I think that is really important for
our area. As Mr. Hambley said and the other lady, Franklin Road and Locust Grove
is really not designed to handle the automobiles in that area. That puts quite a bit of
pressure adding another 200 cars or families plus another 1400 vehicles a day
through the area. The road has a lot of traffic now, a lot of pressure because of the
new Eagle interchange and the Meridian interchange we have here puts a lot of
pressure through that particular area. The sidewalks, curbs and gutters that have
been proposed you see that in trailer parks, you don't see that in housing
subdivisions. Whether lower class or upper class or whatever. I'm a civil engineer
and I know that asphalt has a certain amount of light, it has to have maintenance, the
sun takes life away from it after a certain amount of time and its not the best thing
you can ask for. Its not a clean atmosphere, its hard to keep clean. If you have
sidewalks then you have a certain amount of landscaping then people could park
beside sidewalks. that is what I would like to say to you gentleman tonight. But I
really think that our education and community should come first in looking at this
particular subdivision.
Johnson: Thank you Mr. Rennison, any questions? Anyone else from the public like
to come forward.
Marshall Smith, 398 South Locust Grove, was sworn by the Attorney.
Smith: We have on Locust Grove and Franklin road now a number of worries.
Number 1 right now we have all the traffic that the roads will bear. If you live there
like I do you'd know that its wall to wall particularly in the morning and the afternoon,
but anytime of the day or night you are going to have traffic in there. If you add to
that density you add a lot of complication to a lot of those of us who moved on. I
moved on to that place, I hope I can live there until I die. We also have a water
problem out there, we have found on our wells and the water if it comes out of the
private thing or whether it comes from Meridian unless the well is quite a ways
removed, that density of people will have quite an effect on the aquifers. We also
have a wetland situation there. We have Five Mile Creek which goes right through
the corner there and that commercial thing I don't know how you would, you'd have
to have a lot of expense to get that thing covered up and properly drained at that
corner. That is where Five Mile goes across there and its gone across there since the
crust of the earth cooled. Anyway Five Mile Creek supports a number of game
animals, we have both ducks and geese. On a lot of our places on the east and we
support them and enjoy them. We have muskrats in the creek, any number and
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something like that will offer a hazard to them. I think you should consider that.
Anybody with the intelligence of a the average ripe zucchini knows that you cannot
put a bunch of mobile homes in and you got trash fill. Anybody that has lived half
as long as I have even knows that its the way things go down. If something like that
moves in most of us who have been homeowners there for the last 10 or 15 years
and longer we couldn't give a home away if we tried to escape. You can run but you
can't hide. So, needless to say you know how I feel about it, I have become without
wanting to be the new acronym, I'm a NIMBY. You know what a NIMBY is, not in
my backyard. And I couldn't emphasize it more than I know how because I'm not
much of a speaker but I want to tell you that I hope that the zoning which is
supposed to protect us and keep from some greedy developer coming in. They don't
have to live there, they get in and back their bucks and then its by -by. We live with
it.
Johnson: Anyone else from the public?
Lynn Salisbury, 2031 Cadillac Drive, was sworn by the Attorney
Salisbury: I find myself in a very tenuous position here, as a person who works for
a social service agency, I'm fighting against low affordable housing. I guess I'm a
NIMBY also. My concern when I heard about the number of units that is going into
this subdivision was the traffic. I know that has been expressed by all of the
speakers who have to drive that road. I have people when I'm turning into Locust
Grove off Franklin pass me on the right. This is not an unusual occurrence, they go
off the road and pass me on the right because I'm slowing them from proceeding into
Meridian. I'm nervous and I'm a trainer. So I'm concerned about he traffic, I'm
concerned about the amount of traffic Franklin will handle and also Locust Grove. In
our subdivision we have quite a few children who ride their bikes up and down that
area and into Meridian. And without a bike lane there with that amount of traffic that
is going to put them at danger. My other concern is for the look of the area. The rest
of the area is developed into acre lots, then there is a subdivision just past us that has
half acre lots and there are several of the houses that have more than acre lots that
they are sitting on. If they are interested in developing this residential I would like to
see it match the neighborhood rather than be so dense where it just totally doesn't
match the neighborhood it is just a contrast and those were my concerns. Thank
you.
Johnson: Thank you, anyone else?
Bob Newfeld, 995 Mustang Street, was sworn by the Attorney.
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Newfeld: I live in the Locust View Heights also that is southeast of the proposed
development. I think my primary concern is the density also. Traffic is a big part of
it and as the lady just mentioned that area may be zoned for multiple use but if you
take a look at the area from the cemetery in Meridian which is east of there, I'm sorry
west all the way to the mall all the commercial development is on the north side of
Franklin Street. There is no commercial development on the south side whatsoever,
that is all residential. I don't think this density is in keeping with that. Also from
Eagle road to the cemetery they are all at least half acre lots, as you get closer to the
cemetery to this area here there are a number of homes that are on larger lots than
just an acre or half acre, but between Eagle and here they are all half acre or acre
sized lots. I don't think any commercial building south of Franklin road really fits in
and I certainly don't think that the density of housing fits in with the existing housing
there at the present time. That is all I have to say.
Johnson: Thank you very much.
Jim Witherell, 215 South Locust Grove, was sworn by the Attorney.
Witherell: I represent the 4 lots, that little white area or what is left. We have made
a joint written submission, that is the easiest way for us to handle it. We have based
this on the plat we were given, the plat which was in City Hall which is not that plat.
This is the third plat that I have seen. Now the little irrigation ditch which belongs to
the Meridian Irrigation District and is regulated by the Army Corps of Engineers and
the Bureau of Reclamation comes and goes, in the plat I have has a building on top
of it. So when they ask for public comment, developers please give us the accurate
stuff in order for us to comment properly. That is all I've got to say.
Johnson: Thank you, is there just one copy of this sir?
Witherell: Yes, we didn't really know the procedures.
Johnson: That is fine we appreciate it.
Robert Smith, 335 South Locust Grove, was sworn by the Attorney.
Smith: I'd like to voice my opposition to this type of a development. I'll point out to
you the lot that we live in. I own 2 1/2 acres, this is my piece of property right here.
This piece of property is 410 feet deep to the west. There is 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 units
on 410 feet of property. The density of this is nothing but a glorified trailer park. I
think Meridian, and I've lived in Meridian my entire life deserves more than another
trailer court. That type of development and I don't have any problem with
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development, we expect it eventually but it should be quality homes and something
that would be in contrast to what the rural development is out there now. Again, the
property has about 12 inches of top soil on it and it has about a 14 inch layer of hard
pan and then goes into a gravel that is about 35 feet deep. Originally we stopped a
gravel pit from being built on that entire piece of property through a lot of testimony
and now it has turned into a housing project. When the drain, it will really create a
problem for us drain wise. It now has a tremendous amount of groundwater that
travels on that hard pan layer. The lay of the land is now to the east (inaudible)
normal Five Mile Drain. And also I have seen since I have lived here the Five Mile
Drain run clear over Franklin road. It drains water clear to Gowen Field. So when you
figure all of what is going to take place there and what he is calling a commercial
portion of that, how are we going to cover up the Five Mile Drain? I wish you would
consider deeply turning this project down thank you.
Johnson: Is there anyone else that would like to address this application, yes sir.
Morgan Plant, 300 South Locust Grove, was sworn by the Attorney.
Plant: Commission members, we Morgan and Marilyn Plant are expressing our strong
opposition to the application of Shekinah Industries for annexation and zoning of the
33.1 acres covered in your February 15th letter. Our opposition is based on the
following reasons. This type of zoning and use will severely lower the current values
on surrounding residential property. The City of Meridian needs to continue to attract
quality residential developments. This development would not be an asset to our
neighborhood nor the City of Meridian. This development would greatly increase the
already existing traffic problems on South Locust Grove and Franklin Roads. This
development would greatly add to the already grossly over burdened educational
facilities of the Meridian School district. This development would accelerate the
pollution of the groundwater system in this area. This development would severely
disrupt the surface irrigation systems that have been in place for some 60 to 70
years. This development would destroy the quality of life and the lifestyle of the
neighborhood that has been established over the last 20 years. This development
would violate the covenants established when that property was sold by Henry Frost
and subdivided. It would set a precedent for the open ground surrounding this
immediate area. And we are adamantly opposed to a little Hollywood, high volume,
high impact housing development. The open area I'm speaking of is directly south
of this property its owned by Hendren and the other property I'm speaking to is
directly south of Marshall Smith's property and that is 80 acres. I feel that if you
open the door for this type of a little Hollywood development look for people being
here for 500 permits to go on that property to the south of us. I strongly suggest
that you oppose this and do not grant this permit, that is all I have to say.
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Johnson: Thank you sir, is there anyone else at this point? Did you have one other
comment Gary? You've been sworn so just add to your prior testimony.
Hambley: There were a few things that I didn't understand. One was the public
irrigation, I'm just curious where is he going to get his water is there going to be a
well. He'll have to answer that I guess. I bring up wells saying that we have a lot
of contamination in our area. I would say close to 40% that have had to go deeper.
Last year we got a letter and we all had ours inspected, some passed and some
didn't. I'm afraid that if there are any wells at all in this project be it irrigation or he
said something about City water or his own water, I don't know what he means by
his own water. Be it a well I am in opposition to that. I apologize but that is all I
have to say.
Johnson: Thank you, is there anyone else.
Beverely Donahue, 3775 North Locust Grove, was sworn by the Attorney.
Donahue: Okay, I was listening to the testimony tonight and I had some kind of
concern on page 29 of our Comprehensive Plan that we had done. On 6.8U new
urban density subdivisions which abut or are proximal to existing rural residential land
uses shall provide screening and transitional densities with larger more comparable lot
sizes to buffer the interface between urban level densities and rural residential
densities. Now, you have people that have 1 acre, 2 acres around there and 5 acres
and all the sudden you want to put a gob of homes in there which doesn't go with
the Comprehensive Plan at all what we had discussed when we were putting that
together. A couple other problems I see is when he is talking about an adult park I'm
kind of confused so you mean 2 people, adults who want to buy an adult building in
there let's say down the line they want to have children and they own the house can
you evict them because they have child, maybe in their 40's or 50's? Because only
adults are allowed to live there. Or if adults, older people live there, grandparents and
they want their grandchildren for the weekend, where are these children supposed to
play if the other adults in that area don't want children? So there is a major concern
there. Also, I want to clarify something he said a volleyball court, I would like to
know the dimensions that the volleyball court is going to be, because I have a
problem getting what the standard size is. So, if we could get that I would be
happy.. Second, size of parks, is there any specific size of park that it is supposed to
be, like house square footage. Because when people say a park is it like 5 acres, is
it 3 acres and what is going to be in the park, is there a basketball court for these
kids to play in or is going to be green grass or swing sets whatever, mainly concerned
for small children. Because this is low housing and low housing people need a place
for their kids to play. Since there is only going to be 5 feet between each fence the
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kids are going to need a little bit more room I think. Also I had a couple of thoughts,
the cemetery is just down next to it. We have had a lot of vandalism with that
cemetery too. I am kind of concerned if these kids don't have a place to play or
anything what about the cemetery down the road. Because we have had headstones
and things already damaged, who is going to be responsible and liable for that? As
well as for schooling we've talked about the education thing, will a school bus be able
to get into there to pick up those children? Like what kind of bus stops where are
these kids going to be picked up from? These are just a couple of things that I'm
concerned about, thank you.
Johnson: Thank you Beverly, anyone else that would like to come forward?
Gene Pressley, 255 South Locust Grove, was sworn by the Attorney.
Pressley: I guess the thing that I'm most concerned with is the drainage from behind
in the fields. Now, when I had my house built in there 26 years I'm one of the small
white area there. The county sent a little gal out there and she took some water out
of field drain that I have placed in my house because all the water from behind was
running into my basement. And she said it had bacteria in it, the gentleman from the
county called me and I told him if he went out behind there and took a bushel basket
to pick up all that horse manure that it probably wouldn't have bacteria. After which
he properly hung up. But what I am concerned with really is the fact that is does run
out in my pasture and along the fence between Mr. Smith and I and I'm concerned
with the County chemical things that are going to be coming down into that soil and
coming out in my pasture. Thank you.
Johnson: Thank you, did you also submit written testimony? I thought you did that
is for the record, anyone else?
Marilyn Plant, 300 South Locust Grove Road, was sworn by the Attorney.
Plant: First of all, I am just retiring after 26 years of teaching in the public schools
here and that has all been at Meridian High School. I have gone through split
schedules and I know what it does to the kids. I'm not going to be there now, but
I know if we continue with the way we are going and stuff like this you know there
is going to be a lot of kids. You are damaging what is happening to our educational
system. The teachers are working hard, the schools are working hard to give these
kids a good education, but you can't just keep pushing more and more kids in there
and expect them to come out with better and better educations, its just not possible.
So I really want you to take the schools into consideration because the child is my
primary interest here. A couple other things, is the animal control you get that many
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residents in there how are the animals going to be limited or is each household going
to be limited to one dog and one cat, 2 dogs, 2 cats where does it stop. And my
neighbor Marshall Smith brought up the fact that the wetlands and all of the animals.
We have Canadian geese that are raising their families down there, we have blue
heron the muskrats, the ducks and so forth. You get dogs like that, they start
packing and what is going to happen to those animals? Because they aren't going
to stop at the gates of that, they are going to be out and around. One other thing is
the trash, Morgan and I spend a lot of time going up and down in front of our place
just picking up trash from the dead end street. You add that much more traffic we
are going to out there everyday picking up trash, what kind of control is there going
to be on that? Thank you.
Johnson: Thank you, is there anyone else that would like to address the
Commission?
Bel McMillan, 870 South Locust Grove, was sworn by the Attorney.
McMillan: When I first moved out there I moved out there to be in the country. I
have lived in Meridian my whole life, I have watched it grow and I hate it but anyway
I feel that this is not going to do anybody any good because Meridian is so crowded
now that the whole town of Meridian it is going to put force on the police, its going
to put force on the schools, its going to put it on our sewer, our water and just the
whole thing. I don't think that Meridian needs to grow any further than it is. I have
animals on my lawn, I have pheasants on my lawn, quails on my lawn even a raccoon
and I don't want to move out. We are making all this room for all these people to
come in why don't they take first pride in the people that helped build Meridian and
consider us first. Where are we supposed to go, are we supposed to buy into this
low income junk yard. That is all I have to say.
Johnson: Anyone else? Mr. Preston, did you want to take a few minutes or would
you rather not?
Preston: Okay very briefly gentlemen, one thing I failed to mention was in relation to
traffic was that Franklin road is proposed to be a 5 lane road. Ada County Highway
District is already stated that they need from center line south to this property 45 feet
for a 90 foot right of way that will adequately provide all the area needed for that 5
lane road. And all the landscaping and so forth that I have shown here is outside of
that area. Irrigation wise some of the neighbors in the white area, one gentleman
stated that we had a house over the top of the ditch and that probably is within our
confines and their irrigation supply will totally not be affected in any way. From that
lower right hand corner of their property on it will be piped and certainly not under
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 22
any houses. The roads are private but will have total access by any public including
emergency, garbage collection, police, fire what not and an easement will be granted
of the these roads that will state that. So they'll be as far as any vehicles are
concerned open to anyone. They will not be gated private streets. Sometimes
projects do have gated streets we are not proposing that here. The questions were
asked where is our water coming from I stated it possibly would be a private system
but it definitely does tie into Meridian's system and no wells will be constructed to
provide water here at least I don't think Meridian will have to provide water for this
development. Irrigation wise, the system will be taken from the irrigation supply that
currently supplies this property, no wells will be drilled in this area. The neighbors are
absolutely correct, it will increase the traffic in this area. Ada County Highway
District is currently under design, they have hired a consulting engineer to re -design
the bridge of the Five Mile Drain right now. They are going to widen Franklin Road
all the way though here I'm sure it will be done before this development is finished.
It will be able to handle the traffic from this development, a 5 lane road will have
tremendous more capability to handle, I mean it will be way more than this type of
a development. However they are right in the fact that there will be more traffic in
this area and they will have probably longer wait times at Locust Grove and Franklin
there is no question about that. It is really a difficult thing to talk about we sort of
intimate that people that are going to live in these homes are of less quality than the
other people and the homes that we are putting in here are going to have a much
higher value than the homes that are adjacent to this that is an absolute fact of life.
Now, I'm talking about the homes not counting all the property that these folks own
because that is worth a lot of money but I mean just the homes the homes we are
providing will be of higher quality. I live in a very nice home, these homes are nicer
than the home I live in. They absolutely are they are extremely well built. They are
insulated, have better windows. The thing of it is there are manufactured houses that
people see that are not very attractive that is an absolute fact and I'm going to be
very careful to make certain that the street appearance of these homes is going to be
very unique and a good looking project. Most of the homes, there has been a lot of
terminology about a mobile home park. Let's talk about mobile home parks, these
mobile home parks that we have are usually the homes are sitting within 10 feet of
the street and they don't have any landscaping in front of them because you can't
put landscaping in front of them you have to be able to pull them in and out and so
forth. That is not the type of development that we've got here. You do bring them
in on a trailer but you set them and tie them down to a concrete foundation like any
other house and they are extremely quality products. The people that live in them,
I know that a good share of the adults, that was another question will these be young
people that could later have children? No the adult area will be retired folks, older
folks that are beyond the family stage. Yes they can certainly have their
grandchildren live with them or visit them or whatever. Anyway we are trying to I
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think what we proposed here is an affordable housing project that can give families
a little more square footage than a stick built product can simply because they are
labor saving techniques in the construction of them. That is the only reason, not
because they are lower quality. So with that gentleman.
Alidjani: One of the ladies asked the size of the park and also the volleyball.
Preston: Well I've got my volleyball court 60 foot wide and I believe 120 foot long
and I'm not going to say that is the Olympic official size because I don't know what
it is. The size of the parks, there are 3 park areas the family park is the bigger one
and it has a full basketball court on it. It will be an asphalt type of basketball court
standards at each end. The volleyball court sitting beside it and all total there is I
think and acre and a half of park not counting where the club house is.
Johnson: Thank you Mr. Preston, does anyone have anything else before I close the
public hearing?
Plant: I'd like to submit my comments in letter form.
Johnson: Yes we will take that for the record.
Donahue: Just a thought, these are low housing homes what if somebody decides
to come in and since they are only $80,000 wants to buy 3 of them and make them
rentals, is there such a stipulation. They don't care as long as they are making the
payments on the thing, there is no care or attitude towards keeping the house up.
That is one of my concerns. My second one would be if these are pre -fab homes lets
say one catches on fire they are so close are there fire retardant roofs. You get one
gust of wind and you are talking how close those homes are what about fire safety.
Alidjani: How close are they?
Donahue: Well if there is 5 feet and 5 feet and then the next one starts.
Alidjani: That is the house I'm living in right now.
Donahue: 10 feet in between your home?
Alidjani: Yes
Beaulieu: I just have one concern and that is noise, he is planning on putting a cedar
fence between properties that is a hard material and it will not take care of any of the
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 24
noise. You need to have some type of bush or tree something that the noise can be
taken into. That is real important when you have that many people and that traffic.
Johnson: Thank you, do you have an answer to anything Mr. Preston and then we
can get on.
Preston: As I stated earlier in relation to the buffer that fencing material we propose
cedar and if the homeowners want something that is a little more sound proof we re
open to that masonry or whatever. One thing I didn't answer is about the animals
and with these densities we've got to have very strict guidelines and I believe and I
will state so on the record that I hadn't really given it consideration before, but I think
what we have to do with this type of a development is only allow inside type, that
they won't have the dog runs and so forth outside. Its a tremendous problem in our
other subdivisions and I think that would be probably a wise thing to do. Now, in
relation to the can someone come in and but 3 homes and rent them out, like any
other subdivision in town the answer is yes they could. However, the original owner
that is renting them out is still subject to that agreement. This is not covenants and
agreements its an agreement with me and I am not going to come in and make a fast
buck and leave, this is my livelihood and I'm going to be here for a long time
hopefully. So, I'm not leaving town this is going to be my livelihood and I'm going
to see that is stays a nice area.
Reece McMillan, 870 South Locust Grove, was sworn by the Attorney.
McMillan: My main concern on this deal is the traffic where he shows a 3 lane road
coming out on Locust Grove. Now, is that going to have a stop sign on that road,
is Locust Grove going to have a stop sign on it to stop the traffic we normally know
on out to Franklin Road. The increase of traffic on there is going to be tremendous
because in 1969 1 built me a little house farther down south a nice quiet place, no
hard feelings to my neighbors down here, Locust View Heights built behind us, one
way in and one way out. And this is just going to add to all the traffic congestion on
this end of it. So what are we going to face when it comes to the last quarter of a
mile on Locust Grove before you get to Franklin. That is my main concern, thank
you.
Preston: Only a stop sign on my streets, certainly not on Locust Grove.
Johnson: Okay, 1 will close the public hearing then. What is your pleasure
gentlemen?
Alidjani: Well I personally have, Mr. Chairman, 1 have some concerns regarding the
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March 8, 1994
Page 25
private road, private water system, private sewer system, no irrigation drainage of any
kind for water in the winter time. I do realize we have to have findings of fact and
conclusions of law, but I guess I have some concerns. Mr. Counselor, do we have
a problem on any private roads, do we have anything existing at this time other than
those mobile courts?
Crookston: Do you mean are there any other ones? (End of Tape) There have been
particularly in the lower housing, James Court, Hope Arms.
Alidjani: How about the trailer court such as Embassy?
Crookston: Those are private.
Alidjani: So I guess my question is how our law enforcement officer would
(inaudible) is it just like a regular subdivision then. Do they have a problem?
Crookston: They have full access.
Johnson: Anyone else?
Hepper: The proposed plat is car ports and our ordinance calls for garages, the plat
doesn't meet our City Ordinances, therefore the plat will probably have to be re-
designed. Do we even act on this plat since its not an accurate reflection of what or
City Ordinance requires?
Johnson: What is our situation regarding a non -conforming plat?
Crookston: Well we really don't have much control over it at all until it is annexed,
but.
Hepper: That would be the first step annexation and zoning and then the plat.
Crookston: Well, they can do it at the same time, our ordinances do state that we
are supposed to process as many applications at the same time particularly from the
same applicant as possible. If it doesn't meet our ordinances you have to deal with
it under the existing ordinances.
Johnson: We would still address those items under the findings of fact and
conclusions of law.
Crookston: Well, we don't prepare the findings in relationship to the plats.
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Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 26
Johnson: That's right, we can still address those items in the findings of fact.
Crookston: We could.
Shearer: They were brought up. I move we have the Attorney prepare findings of
fact and conclusions of law on this project.
Rountree: Second
Johnson: Moved by Commissioner Shearer and seconded by Commissioner Rountree
to have the City Attorney prepare findings of fact and conclusions of law on this
application, all those in favor? Opposed?
MOTION CARRIED: All Yea
Johnson: We will now take a five minute break.
(FIVE MINUTE RECESS)
Johnson: I'd like to call the meeting back to order.
ITEM #5: REQUEST FOR PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR FINCH CREEK SUBDIVISION BY
BORUP CONSTRUCTION AND HUBBLE ENGINEERS:
Johnson: This is a public hearing is there someone representing the applicant that
would like to address the Commission at this time, please do so.
Jim Merkle, 9550 Bethel Court, Boise, was sworn by the Attorney.
Merkle: Mr. Chairman, members of the Commission I'm Jim Merkle of Hubble
Engineering representing the applicant. I received a packet from the City and I do not
believe the ACHD comments were in there, but I have them right here and I would like
to pass them out. We had out tech review last Friday and their Commissioner
meeting is tomorrow to act on these. So in there it says they are not official until the
hearing, but that is tomorrow. In the second or third page there is a vicinity map in
there that kind of shows everything in quarter/ half mile around there. It kind of
shows you how this piece sits in relationship to the other subdivisions in the area.
This preliminary plat application consists of 44 lots on 14.7 acres which is about 3
lots per acre. Located directly north of the Hunter Point subdivision and directly west
of Couger Creek subdivision and Howell Tract subdivision. We are about a 1/4 mile
west of Locust Grove and about 800 feet south of Ustick. I would like to point out
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Planning & Zoning Commission
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Page 27
this property was annexed and zoned R-8 in 1993 along with the application for the
Howell Tract subdivision. The applicant is proposing home sizes on this subdivision
with a minimum of a 1300 square foot with an average value of $105,000 to
$120,000. Access to this subdivision will be from the Howell Tract, existing on the
northeast corner. There are 2 accesses into that subdivision, Cougar Creek at the
south, Hunter Point at the south and then there is a proposed stub out to the north
piece of property. We are also providing a pedestrian link between the south area
coming up there and you can see the little white swath through there over to the east
of Cougar Creek, that is a pedestrian access. This is where the existing 18 inch south
slough trunk sewer has been installed. The applicant has participated in a
construction and realignment of the south slough from Locust Grove to approximately
to the point where the big blue line ends. Not where it comes down and goes to the
west but where it ends. That has already been graded ad realigned to that point.
This is in response to the City's request for a greenbelt along the south slough. They
allowed and 18 foot road on the north side of that realignment for the Nampa
Meridian Irrigation District for their maintenance purposes and an 15 foot wide area
on the south for the City's green belt. The applicant is also proposing to allow the
extension of that green belt area to the south through the south slough at that
bottom and then back up to the property on the west. The City needs to realize that
for about 600 feet down there at the bottom the slough is not, the center line of the
slough is right on the property line_ So half of it is in Hunter Point subdivision, half
of it is in this subdivision. So we don't really have control of the whole slough
easement in that area. All the streets within the subdivision will be built to Ada
County Highway Districts standards with 50 right of ways, 36 foot back to back
streets and 5 foot sidewalks as required in the City of Meridian. Sewer for the project
will be extended from the existing 18 inch south slough trunk, its comes up from
Hunter Point and then through that pedestrian easement and up to the north and then
continues on to Locust Grove, that was just constructed probably 3 or 4 months ago.
City water will be provided for the subdivision from existing lines in Cougar Creek,
Howell Tract and Hunter Point. Regarding irrigation canals, the Onweiller Lateral
which is the blue line at the top kind of meandering over to the west corner runs
along the north property line. Depending on the pipe size required by the Nampa
Meridian Irrigation District we will pipe that ditch per the City ordinance or if it is 48
inches in diameter or greater we will request a variance to allow us to fence that
when we go to Council for our final plat. The south slough along the bottom will
remain open because in addition to irrigation that acts as a drain and sometimes there
is water all year round in it and it wall also be open for the green belt path for the
City. The applicant is not proposing to install pressurized irrigation to the lots at this
time. If you have read through the City Engineers comments on your staff report I
would like to address several of them. His items 1 through 4 we will comply with
that, we understand those and those can be minor changes made. Number 5
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Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 28
regarding Onweiller and the south slough, I have already addressed that. Regarding
the green belt and the possible piping of the Onweiller. Number 6 there are a couple
of lines in the legend we can clarify that, I agree there are a couple confusing things
regarding where the slough is, but I pointed out that is where it was realigned. I think
that is what he was talking about there. Number 7 that is regarding our pedestrian
access at the bottom there, he is talking about providing a gravel access for the
sewer line so the easement over the top of the sewer can be accessed and that is no
problem that can be easily accounted for when we do our final design. Number 8 we
will comply with that. Number 9 applicant should address the need for a stub street
to the west, ACHD's input is needed. We have counted them up there are 3 street
accesses to the east and there is one to the north part and one to the west there and
there is one to the south and there is one to the north plus we have the greenbelt
access through there so we have, I lost count I think there are 6 or 7 accesses
between vehicle and pedestrian in and out of the subdivision and we didn't really feel
it was appropriate to have another one to the west. Also if you look at those ACHD
comments on the site specific requirements basically they say construct in accordance
to the submitted plan so in other words they are not requiring a stub to the west.
The 10th one regarding the concern about where the groundwater is I know the City
has had some problems in other projects. Prior to the final design we will have a
company go out and dig test holes and find out where the highest groundwater is,
where the hardpan is, the sand and gravel is to conform with our drainage design of
the subdivisions. Items 11 and 12 we will comply with those. Regarding the
Zoning Administrators, Shari Stiles's comments, I have addressed the green belt issue
on the slough. In fact as I have mentioned the green belt is already graded to about
a 1/3 of the way across the project so we already understand that there is going to
be a greenbelt through this project. One concern that we have though is the City
hasn't provided and specifications or standards for the greenbelt path yet. However,
we are allowing room for it in our design. I have addressed the irrigation district, the
ditches, I have addressed the collector street she talks about. The vicinity map she
talks about so she can see the whole area is provided in that ACHD handout. So in
conclusion I would request that you approve this preliminary plat this evening so we
can continue the process in the City. If the Commission has any questions I'll be
glad to try and answer them for you.
Johnson: Thank you Mr. Merkle, any questions of the representative?
Alidjani: Any problem with ACHD comments?
Merkle: No, we met with them last Friday at their tech review and hashed out
everything they needed to do.
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Hepper: Are you aware of what the minimum house size is in the surrounding
subdivisions?
Merkle: I should be I worked on them, one of them is 1300 and one of them is 1350
and I can't remember which one is which. I know across the street in Chamberlain
its 1300. 1 believe these 2 are 1350. To the south I'm not sure he used the
gradation, I'm not sure.
Hepper: I think it was 1350 to the south I'm not sure what it is to the east.
Merkle: He is proposing 1300, I'm not sure if he has a problem with 1350, 1350
would be fine to conform with the others.
Hepper: Yes, I think we need to be consistent with the other subdivisions in the area.
I'm not sure what the other subdivisions are but I don't think we want to be less than
the other subdivisions. Pheasant Point, is that one 1300, that one might be 1400.
Merkle: Its 1350
Hepper: It slips my mind right now but I think we need to be consistent with the
other subdivisions in the neighborhood.
Merkle: He kind of nodded his head that 1350 would be fine.
Hepper: I think that is something that we need to investigate.
Johnson: Thanks Tim, any other questions for Mr. Merkle? This is a public hearing
is there anyone from the public that would like to address the Commission at this
time?
Bruce Borup, 1135 E. Ustick Road, was sworn by the Attorney.
Borup: As Jim stated, this is more of a follow up of what Jim stated but this project
is part of the conceptual plan of what was annexed in previously to this date we are
trying to stay consistent with the projects around us. we are being surrounded on the
east and the south by 3 other projects. Addressing the issue of a park being in this
area was not mentioned to us during the original annexation plan. We being the
smaller project of the 3 in that area felt that the greenbelt land that we were giving
that several others aren't along the south slough or the Finch Lateral as has been
named on other plats that being on our property and us giving that land was sufficient
for our share. Also Jim mentioned we have 6 stub outs or access roads into this
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 30
project, the ACHD felt that was sufficient for our project. Other projects surrounding
us with twice as many lots and have 20% less access roads. The sewer already
being through our project that was put into service in Cougar Creek and the Howell
Tract. While they were doing that they stubbed out sewer for 9 of our lots while
they were going through our property. With all of this in consideration the project
being somewhat underway and surrounded almost to the point of a fill in project we
request that you approve this preliminary plat to allow us to continue through the
development stage.
Johnson: Thank you Mr. Borup, any questions for Mr. Borup? Anyone else from the
public like to address the Commission before I close the hearing?
Beverly Donahue, 3775 North Locust Grove, was sworn by the Attorney.
Donahue: Looking at this the only question I have is now is if we on North Locust
Grove went to a 5 lane highway like the letter I have at home is there room for 5
lanes with this subdivision coming down the street on Ustick. And that the easement
would also be pushed back that there would still be trees and everything farther back
yet for the 5 lanes. And also the concern I have is I'm already having trouble getting
down Locust Grove and Ustick on the roads being so dirty from the other
developments and I have called a couple times on it. Is it asking too much that
maybe the developers could kind of try to keep the roads cleaned off. With the rainy
season coming with the mud when they get them fixed again. Thank you.
Johnson: Thank you, anyone else? Seeing no one I will close the public hearing at
this time. This is a request for preliminary plat.
Rountree: Mr. Chairman I make the motion that we pass a favorable recommendation
on to the City Council on this submitted preliminary plat.
Alidjani: Second
Johnson: Its been moved and seconded to pass a favorable recommendation of
approval to the City Council, all those in favor? Opposed?
MOTION CARRIED: All Yea
ITEM #6: PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR PRELIMINARY PLAT WITH A
CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR MERIDIAN ENERGY BY MERIDIAN ENERGY AND
TOM EDDY OF PACIFIC LAND SURVEYORS:
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 31
Johnson: I will now open the public hearing and request that the applicant address
the Commission with their presentation on this project.
Bruce Thompson, 17411 NE Union Hill Road, Redmond Washington, was sworn by
the Attorney.
Thompson: First I'd like to thank the Chairman of the Commission and the
Commissioners for this opportunity to present our 54 mega watt cogeneration power
plant to you and the citizens of Meridian. I am the Senior Vice President of Meridian
Energy Inc. which is the developer and general partner of the limited partnership
which owns this project. We certainly welcome questions from the Commission and
the citizens here in the audience when we finish with our presentation. It is getting
rather late in the evening and in the interest of keeping our presentation concise and
to the point we have organized various parts of the presentation and I would just like
to take a couple of minutes to tell you how we intend to do that. The first part of the
presentation is an 8 minute video which we would like to show. The project that we
are proposing for the community is very similar to a 125 mega watt cogeneration
power plant that is located in Sumas, Washington. This project went into operation
approximately 8 months ago, it is considered a state of the art facility burning natural
gas, very clean and quiet and I think well represents the type of project that we are
proposing to build here. Mr. Terry Mitchell of our company will be presenting that
video. The second portion of our presentation is a short slide show which has slides
of our project in Sumas, Washington. We will be able to point out the features of that
project that are similar to the one that we are proposing here. Another part of that
slide presentation is various site plans and illustrations of the project that we propose
to locate at the intersection of Pine Street and Locust Grove. The next part of the
presentation will be a brief summary by one of our consultants Mr. Erik Hanson on the
air quality analysis which is part of our project. The next part will be a short
presentation also by Mr. Erik Hanson on the environmental noise analysis that was
preformed. Finally, we would like to have an opportunity with our legal counsel Mr.
Tom Pores and myself to discuss the various staff recommendations that have been
put forth by the City staff and your planning director. Also, I'd like to make you
aware and the audience that we have prepared and environmental assessment for the
project which analyzes the effects of the project during construction and operation.
That document was submitted as a part of our variance application, conditional use
application, and preliminary plat application. To kind of set the record straight there
has been a change in the factual information in the environmental assessment. Some
of you will remember the discussion in the environmental assessment regarding the
interconnection that will be done between Meridian Energy Inc. and Idaho Power
Company. New information has come to us that the type of service that is proposed
in the environmental assessment and the routes have changed and at a later date we
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 32
will submit an official addendum which will discuss this new information and the
changes in the line routes that are being proposed by Idaho Power Company. Along
with that when we get through with our presentation there are several staff members
from Idaho Power Company that are here that could answer questions of the
Commission or the audience. Before we go into the video, I'd like to say just a few
things about the project and why its here. One of the (inaudible) companies of
Meridian Energy Inc. is in the private power business. In the late 1970's the Federal
government passed the law which required (inaudible) utilities to purchase power from
private companies. This was the first time in the history of the electric business that
this was done. It spawned a new industry in the nation which in some states like
California private businesses independent power companies now produce something
like 20% of the power that is now produced. We are excited that this project is here.
We've had a very good working relationship with Idaho Power Company. I think there
are many positive benefits to this project that we bring to the community. There are
several reasons why the site at Locust Grove and Pine Street was looked at. When
we met with Idaho Power over a year ago we decided there are a couple crucial
issues that are necessary for siting a project like this. One would be located close to
services, in this case with an interconnect that we don't have to go very far to do
that. Secondly this project is fueled by natural gas and we had to be able to
interconnect with the Northwest Pipeline Corporation underground transmission line
which is located several miles west of the City limits. To do that we had to have a
right of way or street access that would allow us to connect to that line with our own
private line. The Union Pacific right of way borders this site which is virtually a
straight route about 2 112 miles to interconnect with the Northwest Pipeline, secondly
with a combination of Locust Grove and Franklin Street and Black Cat Road is the
second alternative we are able to build our gas line underground and get to that
interconnect without disturbing a lot of property, making a lot of turns, staying
underground with 2 possible routes. So if you look at the Locust Grove sub -station
or the Cloverdale sub -station that Idaho Power owns and operates. Look at the
industrial zoning in the City and access with right of ways to Union Pacific and
Franklin Street and others this is a very suitable site for this type of project. We have
a lot of information to go through tonight but again we are anxious to have questions
from you and the audience about what this project is, what it means for the
community, and how we are going to be a good neighbor and fit in. I'd like to move
on now with the 8 minute video, I think you'll enjoy seeing that. I think as some of
you are aware there are 2 of your Commissioners that traveled to our project site in
Sumas, Washington recently and also there are 2 residents in the Maws Addition
which is located across the street from our proposed site that also visited our project
last week. We would hope that some of you or all of you would share your
comments particularly some of the residents that were able to go up and see our
facility. So, at this time I would like to introduce Mr. Terry Mitchell who is Vice
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March 8, 1994
Page 33
President of Meridian Energy Inc. and handles our Gas Management and
Transportation issues with our project and we'll go to the video and show that and
then we will move on to the slides.
Johnson: Bruce thank you, I think at this point I'll interject just some procedural rules
that might work best for your presentation. If all questions and comments be
addressed through the Commission we would appreciate rather than individual
interchange. Also, those testifying if you wish to ask questions feel free to do so, we
are here to gather testimony we may not be able to answer your questions at this
meeting. If you prefer to put your testimony in the form of a question naturally you
are welcome to do so, but you may not get your answer this evening because of the
complexity of this application. Go ahead Bruce.
Terry Mitchell, 500 Aloha Street, Seattle, Washington, was sworn by the Attorney.
Mitchell: As Bruce mentioned the power plant that some of you have visited is our
most recent project. It is about twice the size of what we propose in Meridian, but
a lot of how that plant works and looks is similar to what we propose here. So, it is
the closest thing we can present to show you people a sort of look see ahead of time.
Most people are familiar with housing projects and what that sort of thing looks like,
but when you mention power plant 1 know I used to get a gut reaction as this
humongous piece of machinery sitting there belching smoke and making noise. Its
not the way they work nowadays, so this video I think is positive both from the
standpoint of showing what the power plant really looks like and more importantly
from what the community that we built this in what they expressed as their concerns
from before we built the plant and after we built the plant. Really the purpose of the
video was to interview the community and then get their assessment of the impact
of this plant. So if 1 could I'd like to start this, I'm not sure how best to see this it is
coming on this little screen for everybody. Is that going to be sufficient for the
Commission? There are also copies of this video here at City Hall if people want to
come and borrow it.
(EIGHT MINUTE VIDEO PRESENTATION)
Mitchell: I would like to take a couple of minutes and show a couple of slides that
show a little bit more detail about the plant, that as Bruce gets into his conversation
about what the Meridian plant will look like we can make some comparisons.
(SLIDE SHOW PRESENTATION)
Mitchell: This is an aerial view of the plant and it is going to be pretty similar to what
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 34
the Meridian plant will look like in the fact that this half f the plant is a lumber drying
operation, this is a lumber storage building. These are dry kilns where lumber is taken
and dried. This is really the power plant itself, here we have the primary gas driven
turbine that draws the generator and produces electricity. Heat exhaust in this turbine
is put into a heat recovery generator where steam is generated and put into a second
turbine which is inside this turbine and produces more electricity. Some additional
steam is piped over to the dry kilns. The cooling that cools that steam back down so
the water can be recirculated, this is the cooling tower that functions. The control
room building is this building here. Our switch over that goes to a sub -station along
the street (inaudible). This site here is about 17 acres its similar size to what we are
doing in Meridian, except the power outfit for the plant will be smaller (inaudible).
Further all of this machinery here which if you are close to it you can here the
turbines, this will all be housed inside a building which will reduce aesthetic problems
as well as any sound problems. Primarily the lumber (inaudible) smaller kilns. One
additional thing Bruce will show is we have a piece of property about this big about
3 or 4 acres on one side by an area of one of the subdivisions that will be dedicated
to the City for a park. This again is a close up of the power plant itself showing the
primary turbine, air in -take comes in here and feeds the turbine and turns the
generator the exhaust goes into the steam generator. All of this is modular built
inside these cabinetries.
Johnson: Excuse me, Wayne would you tilt your microphone forward.
Mitchell: Again when the main turbine is inside housing in here, it turns the generator
back here the heat goes up inside the steam generator which is this large structure
(inaudible). The water circulates around, turns the steam. The steam goes inside this
other building draws from the second turbine which is in this housing and produces
more electricity. The steam that comes out of that turbine is cool and the condenser
the water circulates around that condenser (inaudible) is cooled in towers. The
primary need for water at the plant is to replace what is evaporated from the plant.
This is also where you would have primary discharge from the water that is used to
cool the condenser eventually has to be recycled and discharged. This is part of our
water treatment plant. We have to have very clean water for these turbines because
of the pressures and temperatures to operate that. Even the cleanest water will cause
(inaudible) and major maintenance problems, we have a multi-million dollar water
treatment water plant that takes City water and cleans it up even further. I will just
run through these real quickly these are all part of the water treatment facility. The
control room is something (inaudible) it is basically PC based type system. It is all
duel system redundant, constant monitoring 24 hours a day totally operated from this
one area. The steam that comes from the power plant through this pipe again feeds
lumber drying kilns, this is the lumber drying storage shed. These kilns are just giant
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Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
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ovens (inaudible) hot water steams pass and heats up and dry the lumber (inaudible)
its not necessarily associated with the power plant. This multiple use of energies is
very efficient in the fact that we are using one fuel source to drive the turbine and
using the waste heat from that turbine to drive the lumber turbine and to perform and
industrial process like this. One thing (inaudible) our own natural gas pipeline to
connect with the Northwest Pipe line one of the routes we are looking for running this
line is to tie on to Northwest at Black Cat Road just near Union Pacific Railroad tracks
and run it right down along the railroad tracks. Another alternative route we are
investigating is to come down Black Cat and up Franklin and Up Locust Grove to the
plant. This is a fairly small line its about a 6 inch diameter and it will be a steel
underground pipe. The structure at the corner of Black Cat will be constructed by the
Union Pacific Railroad tracks will be constructed by Northwest Pipeline. Its basically
a tap and a meter station. This is the one up in Sumas it looks similar to this. We
will have a meter regulator inside a housing and then a (inaudible) for putting the odor
that is in natural gas that you can smell when it leaks. From here I think I will turn
this back over to Bruce because he wants to discuss the site plans for the Meridian
project.
Thompson: What I would like to do is to distribute some of these site plans, if you
would just pas them amongst yourself and kind of follow along with what is on the
screen. Also, there is a site plan here with a little more detail and the artist
illustration, just be kind enough to see if we can get a copy to everyone. I'm not
going to use a microphone, I'll just stand here and just project. What you see is the
artist illustration of what the project would look like. There are 2 views here, on the
top is a prospective drawing primarily on behalf of the Maws subdivision residences
so they would have an idea of what they might be looking at. We do plan to do
extensive landscaping and beautification around the site. After a number of years the
landscaping will mature and grow and we hope to provide a very solid screen and
block to the project. On the layout is a plain view of what the project would look like.
I think it represents a pretty good idea that thereabout after say 10 years or so of
what you might expect to see there. (End of Tape). What I would like to do is to
spend a little time talking about what we have in the project. What you saw on the
slides this is very similar to the project in Sumas, Washington. We have
approximately 17 acres on the plat of which a net 15 acres is available to develop.
This is flat farmland it is vacant, its been growing for a number of years. Fortunately
no wetlands, it is not in a floodplain so from our prospective it is a good piece of
ground to develop for this kind of use. What we proposed on the site is 3 parcels,
the southern 1/3 would be the location of the power plant, the second lot in the
middle would be the lumber remanufacturing, dry kilns and warehouse which takes
up about 5 acres, the power plant about 3 acres and in the northern part we propose
to dedicate and develop a neighborhood park for the City. The City's Comprehensive
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Plan has indicated that there is need for additional recreational area in this part of
town. We felt it was a good idea, we would provide a natural buffer and provide
some additional community recreation to the community. This parcel is about 3
acres, we will develop the park as you see, with landscaping on 3 sides the soils from
the larger side will be moved here graded, leveled and hydro -seeded. One of the
things we think is very important is to provide a screen or a block to a plant
particularly with residential uses to the north and our landscape plan which is over tot
he left on the other easel we propose a very dense planting of poplar trees about 5
to 6 foot on center and at mature growth we believe that 40 or 50 feet high will
provide a very natural screening. On the access to the project we are showing
improvements on Locust Grove we are not sure exactly how this particular street is
going to be classified by the Highway District but we have agreed that at a minimum
Locust Grove would be improved to a 41 foot improved road section. Which would
be curbs, gutters and sidewalks all the way along this on the east property line.
Some of you are aware in the Highway District improvement plan that Franklin to
Fairview in the future will be upgrading this street to I believe a minor collector status
or arterial I'm not sure which. Anyway, during construction we would at least be
putting in the sidewalks, curbs, and gutter and matching existing pavement on Locust
Grove road and later one the Highway District would come through after it decided
what kind of improvements would be done here would complete the rest of the street
improvements on both sides of the right of way. Also, as a part of the Pine Street
improvements I believe Pine would be improved to a 90 foot right of way, 70 foot
curb section and sidewalk shown here and curb, and gutter. Our main access would
be off Locust Grove road and Franklin. We have agreed with the City that during the
construction period of this project if the project is approved we would limit access of
construction vehicles and traffic to only Locust Grove road and Franklin and not Pine
and North Locust Grove road. The main part of the project development, the lumber
remanufacturing facility I want to make sure you understand that this is not a lumber
mill operation. We do not produce any raw materials, we do not use logs, this is a
custom milling operation where we take dimension lumber or green lumber, industrial
grade lumber and we dry it to customer specifications and then we plane it. There
will be a planer line located in the warehouse facility which will take the dry lumber
product and simply shave it, smooth it down and most of this lumber will go out into
the new manufacturing market which you will find that wood used in door frames,
window frames, furniture, stock, cabinet bases, molding strips and so forth. Very dry
lumber, very straight, not crooked, very little moisture content. On the average we
would have about 4 to 8 truckloads a day of lumber that would come in to the facility
so not a lot of traffic generated there. Along with that is a sticker stacker operation
which some of you may be familiar with what that is. In order to dry the lumber and
to allow the trapped moisture to be released in the drying process we have to put
little sticks in between each layer of the wood so that when it goes into the kilns it
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March 8, 1994
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will be dry. The kilns are a little bit smaller then at the Sumas operation this facility
would use about 11,000 pounds an hour of low pressure steam from the power plant
to dry the lumber and all it is, is a big sauna. The lumber goes in, it stays there for
various periods of time, the moisture is evaporated it comes out of the atmosphere
in the form of steam and condensation. After the lumber is dried it goes into the
warehouse and is stored or is planed and goes out on the truck. Pretty simple
operation we do need a lot of area for truck movement and so forth, and outside
storage of lumber. We are showing one major access into the lumber storage area
here and one major access into the power plant. These driveway openings will be
constructed according to the Highway Districts standards. The main portion of the
plant is the power plant. As Terry mentioned all of the rotating machinery and power
equipment will be located inside the power house, nothing will be outdoors the boiler
and so forth will all be in here. The offices up front, the building stands about 80 feet
high, the stack is about 10 feet higher. The building shown right here, a parking area
up front. This facility will have about 16 full time employees, 2 or 3 of those will be
management people that we would hire, the rest of the employees we would hope
be hired out of the local labor pool and from the Boise area. The lumber
manufacturing area to start with will probably have about 15 employees and in the
future as we expect this business to grow perhaps 20 or more. The area shown in
the gray is asphalt paving, all the other white areas would be crushed rock and would
be leveled of course and would have no impervious surface on the whiter shaded
areas. The cooling tower is located in the back of the project site in the south. It
was put there for several reasons, one we wanted it the furthest away from the
residential areas as possible, secondly we want it in an area that would be buffered
on both sides of the property line and a substantial distance on both sides. The other
structure located to the rear of the property is a small sub -station that is proposed to
interconnect with Idaho Power, we show the interconnect at Idaho Power will design
and construct coming in on the west property line. They have asked us to dedicate
a 30 foot easement along this line for them to bring in their electric service which
would take a 90 degree turn here and come into the sub -station. A retention pond
on the western side which would be used to collect the storm water that comes off
all the paved surfaces would go into a vile filtration swell which is a treatment system
and then as required by local ordinances that water would be disposed of in tile which
would drain onto the site. Our power contract with Idaho Power specifies that the
plant is base loaded which means it will virtually run just about everyday of the year.
since the plants burns natural gas we rely on Northwest Pipeline Corporation for that
gas they have indicated to us that there is a possibility very mild one that we could
be curtailed and in order to meet our power delivery to Idaho Power we have to have
stand by fuel so we propose to build a 350,000 gallon diesel fuel storage facility
which would be used as stand by fuel in case natural gas is not available. In the
history of the Northwest Pipeline Corporation those of you that use natural gas either
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in a furnace or hot water heater they have not had any curtailments here for years
and years. We feel it is necessary as risk mitigation to provide for this fuel. It is
really quite a small tank, it only stands about 28 feet tall if I recall. Most of the year
we will maintain a very small amount of fuel. We kept the tank small so it could be
re -fueled by the bulk oil facility located in Boise. So, if we did have a period of 4 or
5 days that we have to switch to diesel fuel, tanker trucks commonly you see in this
area would be coming into the site to replenish this tank. The last (inaudible) that is
shown here is a little bit more detailed on the landscape plan but we believe very
much in beautification and making our projects fit in and look good. Like a business
park this area shows a grassed yard area on the frontage of our property with bark
and an assortment of trees and low growing vegetation. The grass area would be
sprinkled, we feel that the driveway areas are quite tastefully landscaped, similar to
what we have at Sumas which is a very fine addition to the community. Landscaping
also extends on the western line again to kind of shield and block our project. Overall
we think the project is a good one for the community we have an excellent track
record in designing, developing, opening and managing our facilities. We like this
community, we would like to build this facility here. We will have a positive impact
as far as taxes go, the creation of new jobs, we will spend approximately about $2
million a year on supplies, equipment purchase, and payroll which is very significant
during construction. About a million and half in sales tax, if this project is approved
by the City all the rest of the permits are acquired we would plan on starting
construction in August of this year with approximate 14 month construction schedule,
the plant would be substantially complete in October of 1995, it would go through
about a month of testing and under our contract with Idaho Power we are supposed
to deliver our first kilowatt of energy on December 1st 1995. And on January 1,
1996 we would start commercial operation, we have a 25 year contract. Not only
are we the developer, we are also part owner of the project and will maintain our
presence here for the length of the contract. That concludes my presentation on the
site plan. The next segment of this presentation was a discussion of the
environmental noise analysis that was done and I would like to introduce Erik Hanson
who is a consultant who preformed that analysis. The firm that he works for also
conducted the remodeling analysis for the air quality report that was submitted to the
Idaho Department of Health and Welfare as part of our permit application. So I would
like to turn this segment over to Erik Hanson to discuss the results of both of those
studies that were done.
Erik Hanson, 3400 188th St Sw, Lynwood, Washington, was sworn by the Attorney.
Hanson: I work for the the firm of Mccully, Frick and Gillman, sounds like a law firm
but it is an environmental consulting firm. We specialize in air quality and
environmental noise and that is the role we served on this project. We served the
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same functions on NESCO's Sumas project. We work for both public and private
clients for performance of projects such as Meridian Energy and also for regulatory
agencies like Environmental Protection Agency and Idaho Division of Air Quality. We
try to take the scientific perspective in all of this and I would like to talk about air and
noise tonight. They are usually some of the key concerns with cogeneration projects
and yet it is sort of awkward to summarize in 5 minutes. I don't want to trivialize
people's concerns about air and noise issues by trying to generalize everything but
at the same time I don't want to drive everybody crazy and annoy you with jargon
and numbers. So, I am going to try and to put things in perspective in a relatively
general fashion and then I'll be happy to answer more specific questions if they come
up. I would like to discuss air quality first and to try to avoid the numbers game I
would like to put it in a perspective of IDEQ's regulatory process. There are
essentially 3 sorts of permits they are quality permits that a project like might be
subject to. One of them applies to the projects that are to be developed in an area
that exceeds air pollution standards and the County is part of non -attainment area for
particulate matter. Therefore if the emissions of this plant exceeded a certain
threshold it would be required to do this new sorts review. Essentially it has to go
out and off set its emissions by somehow controlling some other source. The
particulate matter emissions from this plant are approximately 25% of that threshold,
it is considered a minor source by Idaho Division of Environmental Quality, therefore
it is not subject to those provisions. Another layer of air quality regulations is called
prevention of significant deterioration. And those regulations are designed to prevent
an area that currently meets air quality standards from degrading to the point where
they reach those thresholds and where human health is threatened. And again the
emissions from a plant like this are to small for this project to be subject to those
regulations. It is considered a minor source by EPA and by IDEA. The permit
process that does apply is the same process that applies to virtually all industrial
sources. It is simply permission to construct and operate. That permit process is one
that we supported Meridian Energy's application on, we calculated concentrations of
various air pollutants under various meteorological conditions, we discussed available
control technology and so forth. That permit has been submitted to the air quality
people at IDEQ, we have received a letter that states the application is complete, and
they are reviewing it right now. They will be going over that permit and then drawing
up a draft permit that will identify exactly what the emissions limit will be required of
the plant. I would like to point out that the permit is available for public view and
public comment, that agency will have its own comment period of the air conditions.
Essentially what it includes the permit application discloses all the emissions sources,
it describes the plant, how many operating hours, how much natural gas in
consumed, what the stack perimeters are, how high the stack goes and so forth. It
identifies the control equipment that would be used to control air pollution. And it
also includes air quality analysis that identifies air pollution concentration at worse
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case locations, that is something that we did. I can assure you that if review that
permit application and IDEQ's separate and independent evaluation you'd find that
concentrations were all well below federal and state standards to protect human
health. I don't anticipate any significant issues in terms of the permitting process.
This is by air pollution standards a very clean plant with the combustion of natural gas
as the primary fuel. Very low sulfur .05% diesel fuel as a back up fuel during gas
curtailments and the use of state of the art technology to control nox emissions and
that selective cellet reduction the buzz work SCR for controlling nox. That was the
same system used in the Sumas project that the Mayor was talking about there. I'd
like to also reiterate this was the first time I had seen the video, the plume you see
is coming from the cooling tower it is not coming from the stack, that is water coming
out of the cooling tower, you do not see a plume coming out of the stack of the
power generation equipment. And that is as much detail as I was planning to go into
on the air quality side. I am going to skip to the noise unless you want me to get into
specifics about either emissions or concentrations or whatever. The noise analysis,
I first visited the site in December. At that time 1 visited with Melinda Harper, we
discussed some of the neighborhood concerns, she is a resident of the Maws Addition
and that has really been my focus. Both for the air and noise but particularly for the
noise. We talked a little bit about neighborhood concerns and also tried to pick up
locations where we should measure existing sound levels and calculate sound levels
from the plant if it were constructed. We picked 5 locations for sound level
measurements. Essentially they were selected to represent houses that are bordering
or ringing the site. We took a 24 hour measurement at Todd Montrose's house, its
I believe right next door to Melinda's. It was the only house around that already had
the fence installed. Its on north Locust Grove road, he was the first on the block to
have a fence that now everybody has and we decided that was the best place to do
it because it was more representative of quieter sound levels they get today now that
they have a fence that will obstruct some of the traffic noise. I also took 15 minute
measurements at 4 other locations south of the site. The nearest house in the Maws
Addition northeast corner of the site and there is a Ione house that is sort of along
North Locust Grove road just east of the site. So. I tried to take measurements
representative of those locations at 5 different times of the day. We found sound
levels that were typical of urban areas and traffic was without a doubt the dominant
noise source. There seems to be a time several times a day when several school
buses rumble up and down those roads, and a fair amount of air traffic as well.
Distant freeway traffic in the background provides sort of steady level background.
Superimposed on those background levels should be the power plant noise and
traveled to Sumas and took more measurements at that facility. Recognizing that its
got more than twice the power generation capacity it turns out that the lumber
operation is slightly larger than the one that is proposed here as well. I took a number
of shortcuts in the noise analysis. I consider it to be a screening level analysis and
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March 8, 1994
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I believe it was conservative in every aspect. In other words the power plant
numbers that I used, for example the lumber drying operation is actually going to be
smaller than the measurements I relied on because I didn't take into consideration the
fact that the cooling tower would be blocked by an 80 foot tall building that houses
the power generation equipment. I didn't allow for any blockage of sound by
buildings, I didn't take into consideration air absorption, or absorption of the sound
travelling across the ground. This is the simplest sort of measurement evaluation
technique you can take simply allowing for distance and tenuation. I also only
allowed 10 decibels of reduction for the enclosure that would go around the power
generating equipment. The typical house reduces traffic noise by 20 to 30 decibels
and I am very confident that we could get at least 20 decibels of reduction from the
building. I didn't take that into account, this is a straight level analysis. The power
plant would run 24 hours a day, the lumber operation would run daytime only. The
lumber operation is the one that is sort of in the center of the site. The 24 hour
source is at the end of the site and the farthest from most of the housing. What did
I find, typically, again it is difficult to quantify the sound levels because they vary up
and down when I take a breath it instantly becomes quiet in here when there is a lull
in traffic on Pine Street and North Locust Grove Road it drops down to 40 decibels
on the otherhand it could be 70 or 80 decibels when a particular vehicle goes by. So
it goes up and down, almost all federal standards rely on an hourly average sound
level even a 24 hour average sound level LEA's, LDN's that sort of terminology. The
24 hour level there is a one decibel change calculated for the Maws Addition as a
result of the project. Roughly goes from 66 existing for example to 67 at one of the
locations, at Todd's house it might go to 61 to 62 that is the enclosed backyard area.
Very small in a 24 hour value, if there is a lull in the traffic it might be 40 decibels at
that area and yet the power plant might be and the lumber operation might be 53
during the day, at night it drops down to about 5 decibels so its down to 50. 1 try
not to get into numbers, all I'm trying to say is that its approximately the same sound
levels that we are observing today on an hourly average basis. We've got a constant
power plant source essentially 24 hours a day, we've got lumber mill that clicks on
during the day. But we've got receding properties that go up and down, on average
its almost exactly what the receiving properties are, the residences. There are times
when there are lulls in traffic when the power plant will increase sound levels, it will
be audible, there are other times of the day when there is traffic present and the
power plant won't be audible at all.
Crookston: I'm sorry for interrupting you, but in your testing I assume that you tested
on site, is that right?
Hanson: Did I measure sound levels on the site of the power plant? I happen to
stand on site at one location only because barking dogs wouldn't let me get any
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March 8, 1994
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closer to the house I was trying to represent. But, normally what we try to do is to
go to the residences and stand on their property. We are interested in their
background.
Crookston: How do you test, or how do you produce the sound that is respectively
going to come from the plant to test.
Hanson: Okay, I'm sorry I didn't make that very clear. I went to Sumas and took
sound level measurements at the existing facility at a reference distance. In fact one
of them was on the, at very different distances from different sources. So, I could
take if I had 60 decibels for example at one location with the one in Sumas. I can
scale that 60 decibels up or down depending on the difference in distance between
my measurement location and prediction location at the site. Then I can add those
2 levels together the power plant plus the measured background. The trick and the
difficulty is picking which background sound level to use at the existing location, do
I do it at the lull in traffic or do I do it when a big truck goes by. And that is why EPA
and most State agencies end up using these LEQ's where it is an equivalent sound
level. I get into some of that detail in the technical report and I know its not exciting
reading.
Crookston: I guess my simple question is did you actually produce sound at the plant
site and measure it in the Maws Addition?
Hanson: No, we measure it at one location and know that sound diverges at 6
decibels each time the distance doubles. so we know how loud it is going to be at
another distance. And again it was a simplified thing, I didn't take into account
ground absorption or atmospheric absorption. I'm quite confidant that the numbers
we generated here err on the high side. That concludes my summary unless you have
additional questions about the noise?
Hepper: I have a question on the Nox, does that have an odor to it?
Hanson: I don't believe it does, it certainly doesn't have an odor at the
concentrations that would be exposed to it in everyday life no.
Happen Would the power plant have any plans when we get inversions here in the
valley, we get those in the winter quite often where the fog and everything settles in
low, would that cause any problems?
Hanson: No, any industrial source is going to have an regional contribution and that
is always a concern. I would say certainly in the immediate vicinity of the project that
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is the least time of concern. In fact it is a relatively hot plume, there is a considerable
amount of plume rising. In fact the highest concentrations that we modeled are
observed in windy conditions when just like a smoke stack from a wood stove you
see it curling behind a house. Those tend to be the conditions under which we see
the highest ground level concentrations and those are what we observed in our
modeling and compared with ambient standards. The inversion conditions that you
are talking about are always an air quality and there is this incremental contribution
to the regional air quality problems.
Hepper: Okay, we've got several plants around the State, there is one in Lewiston,
there is a coal mill, there is a sugar beet factory over in Nampa. Some of them have
an odor and I just wanted to make sure that we aren't going to have something right
here in town that is going to cause us some odor problems.
Hanson: I have been involved in quite a few cogeneration projects and I never
smelled an odor related to the cogeneration project.
Johnson: Somewhere in your presentation material I believe it indicated that the
State of Idaho does not have established noise level standards and that therefore are
tailoring or measuring everything based on Oregon and Washington standards.
Hanson: That is correct
Johnson: I just wanted to clarify that.
Hanson: We tried to look at federal standards and we also compared them with
Oregon and Washington Standards and it complies.
Johnson: Anybody else have any questions? Okay Bruce, next chapter or verse.
Thompson: Thank you very much Mr. Chairman, our final presentation is from Tom
Pores our legal counsel and you are aware that there has been a series of
recommendations provided to the Commission from the Ada County Highway District
and from your own staff and from other outside agencies. As a part of our project
approval there are 2 applications that you are considering a preliminary plat and a
conditional use application. I am not exactly sure of your procedure, our Surveyor
Tom Eddy is here from Pacific Land Surveyors and we didn't have time today to meet
with Tom to see how he is going to participate so I need to apologize to him a little
bit. If you are going to, if the plat is formerly presented then he would have to do it.
I'm not sure what your procedure is. If it isn't necessary to do that then we would
like to move on with Mr. Pores and our legal counsel would like to make some general
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comments about the recommendations from the staff and various agencies that have
had a chance to look at it.
Johnson: We can move on can't we Wayne, we don't have to have the plat
presented at this point?
Crookston: Well, I think you do if you are going to ask for approval. Not at this
point.
Johnson: What is your preference to have the plat presented now or to move on with
he presentation?
Thompson: Well, I think perhaps we would like to finish our comments and if it is
necessary for Mr. Eddy to present the plat we could do that if you don't feel it is
necessary then in the interest of keeping the meeting short and getting people home
that may not be required. It has been filed and it has been reviewed and if there are
questions of Mr. Eddy I'm sure we could answer them and I think we could too.
Johnson: Okay, let's move on.
Tom Pores, 1 1 11 3rd Avenue, Seatle, Washington, was sworn by the Attorney.
Pores: Mr. Chairman, Commissioners, my name is Tom Pores, I'm with the firm of
Foster, Pepper and Scheffleman in Seatle and I'm counsel to NESCO and Meridian
Energy Inc. I assisted them with preparation of applications for this project, both the
plat application and the conditional use application. Also, in the insuring that the
environmental review for this project is thorough. I would like to restrict my
comments to the response of the recommendations of City staff and Ada County
Highway Department. First referring to the March 4, 1994 memo from Wayne Forrey
we agree with all the recommended conditions in his memorandum. Including his
recommended findings. I would like to refer specifically to his finding #8 regarding
the environmental assessment. In his finding he agrees that with the analysis in the
environmental assessment that the project would not have a significant adverse effect
on the environmental impact. And while that language doesn't have any reference
to any particular criteria in the zoning ordinance I believe it responds to all the
environmental criteria in the zoning ordinance. By recognizing the level of
environmental review and analysis that has gone into this project and that has been
presented in the environmental assessment and in the application documents. So,
there is substantial evidence in your record which has been included with the
applications and the environmental assessment to support this finding. I would also
like to bring to your attention attachment A to the conditional use permit application.
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We did this document in order to clarify exactly how this project responds to the
perform standards and criteria of the zoning ordinance that relate to industrial
developments of this character. We also wanted to respond specifically to all relevant
policies in the Comprehensive Plan that might have any bearing on this project and
so we took all of those from the Comp Plan, we drafted them out at length and added
a response that applies to each of those in order to demonstrate that this project
complies with the Comprehensive Plan. As Mr. Forrey found in his findings 9,10,11,
13, 14, 15, and 17 he was quite specific on each of these categories. All of those
findings incorporate factual information we presented in that attachment a to the
Conditional Use Permit application. It is a useful document for you to review and we
believe that it should be the foundation for findings and conclusions in this project.
The next comment letter I would like to respond to in the City Engineer's
memorandum of March 4th. We also agree with the conditions of approval
recommended by Mr. Smith. Except for a couple of comments, his condition #3
which refers to a water assessment fee. We want to put you on notice that the
applicant is going to be making a substantial contribution to the construction of a new
well for the City, a new artisan well, Well No. 16. We will need to negotiate an
appropriate fee for the hook up of this project to the City's water system. I don't
believe there is sufficient information at this time to determine what the appropriate
fee is because the costs haven't been determined for that new well. It may not be
appropriate to use a hook up formula that is designed for residential properties in order
to assess a fee for this project. So that remains to be negotiated with the City. With
respect to his condition #4, having to do with re -using our discharge water to irrigate
City parks, we have no objection to that. We would make that water available to the
City for re -use but we wouldn't want to have any responsible for its subsequent use
or treatment. so we would want that reflected in the conditions. The Fire
Department did not give specific comments to the City but rather gave a list of
questions. I believe that the environmental assessment answers most of those
questions. They are linked primarily to code issues and those issues will be resolved
at the appropriate time when detailed engineering plans and drawings are submitted
for building permits. I don't think those issues are such that they need to be resolved
at this time. The last comment letter that we received was from the Ada County
Highway District. We would support those conditions of approval with the exceptions
of conditions 1, 2, and 3. And we would urge you to reject those conditions in your
findings and conclusions. Those conditions would seek a dedication of right of way
for future realignment of Locust Grove Road on the west side of the project and
designation of that as an arterial. To our knowledge that realignment and
construction project is not certain at this point in time. I'm not certain exactly of
what its planning status is, but we believe that dedication of right of way would be
justified by any impacts coming from this project. So, the site plan for all of the
buildings and the utilities on this site have left that area open. They don't encroach
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March 8, 1994
Page 46
on any potential right of way for that realignment, but nonetheless we don't believe
that a dedication of right of way is appropriate at this time its premature. We would
also like to clarify condition #8 in the Ada County Highway District comment, if the
City opposed construction of the Locust Grove west of the right of way for the
realignment then the Locust Grove Road in its present alignment will need to be
upgraded. That is where we have proposed access to this project and Meridian
Energy would construct the improvements along this right of way width. We would
want this condition #8 to reflect that and be modified similar to condition #4 and 6
to provide compensation to the developer from the transportation benefit zone that
the road sits in. That would be appropriate in that circumstance. Those are the only
comment letters that we received and that ends my comments. Do you have any
questions?
Johnson: Thank you very much Mr. Pores, any questions? Do you have a further
step?
Thompson: Mr. Chairman, that concludes our presentation, if there are questions we
could certainly proceed onto those. Thank you
Johnson: Thank you Bruce, does anyone have any questions?
Crookston: I have a question, I noticed that Larry Sale from the ACHD is here and I
wonder if you could approach and I could ask you a question?
Larry Sale, 3505 Windsor Drive, Boise, was sworn by the Attorney.
Crookston: First of all, I would like to state thank you for coming.
Sale: I appreciate your stalling the meeting until I could get here. As usual the
Chairman did a good job.
Crookston: My questions pertain to what Mr. Pores just addressed about the
realignment of Locust Grove. Can you address what the situation is there with Ada
County Highway District?
Sale: This has been somewhat of a circus and I haven't apologized to Mr. Thompson
I'll do so again for the confusion. As much as I would like to know everything that
goes on in this county there are some things that get by me. About the time when
Mr. Thompson was discussing his proposal with me as a development a proposed
development, our traffic services people were working with Mr. Forrey and your
people regarding your Comprehensive Plan adoption. While I was telling Mr.
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Thompson that I didn't know of any plans of realignment of Locust Grove Road our
traffic services people and your Comprehensive Plan was saying Locust Grove Road
was going to be relocated and realigned. So, Mr. Thompson certainly was given a
nice welcome to our County. Hopefully we will do better in the future. I did write
him back or call and correct my error. The basis for our staff report as adopted by our
Commission is based in your map 3 of our Comprehensive Plan. Which shows Locust
Grove Road as a minor arterial street it shows it extending across the Interstate and
shows it being realigned between Franklin road and Fairview Avenue or Pine. That
being the case we would acquire half of that right of way along the west boundary
of this property 45 feet. We would require the dedication or deposit to our trust fund
for the cost of a sidewalk along that frontage. We would also require or purchase
additional right of way along the north boundary for future widening of Pine. With the
planned realignment of Locust Grove, existing Locust Grove then is designated a local
street as opposed to an arterial or a collector. As a local street it is not eligible for
the purchase of right of way, there is no right of way really needed in this case there
is plenty of right of way I think. The developer is required to improve a local street
along his frontage that is both in your regulations and in ours. (End of Tape) Am I
going to far out of field for the question?
Crookston: No you are not.
Sale: There are other references in your Comprehensive Plan, page 54, statement
2.7U - designate Locust Grove Road from Fairview to Overland as a minor arterial.
Policy 3.3 - extend Locust Grove via an overpass to connect with the southern leg
south of 1-84. Going on the cost of constructing an overpass is significant to say the
least. In order to justify that construction it in our opinion would be necessary to
realign Locust Grove Road because its purpose as a minor arterial would be to carry
traffic from your growth areas on the south side of Interstate to the commerce area
on the north side. Its our staff opinion that it would be very difficult if not impossible
to justify to ITO and our own taxpayers the construction of an overpass at Locust
Grove if that road only went to Overland and in a direct and were not extended north
as a straight connection to Fairview. Back to the gentlemans comment about our
conditions and condition #8 in particular. If east Locust Grove existing Locust Grove
is a local street he is required to install curb, gutter and sidewalk along that frontage
and match the existing pavement, extend the pavement to the lip of the gutter for no
compensation. That is the established cost of development along an existing local
street. Now, for the confusing caveats, if the City redesignates Locust Grove in your
Comprehensive Plan as a collector in place and decides not to realign it then it is
incumbent on the Highway District to acquire right of way if any is needed and to pay
for those same improvement not with the sidewalk to pay for those improvements
excluding the sidewalk along Locust Grove as we would on Pine. Have I got you
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confused enough, how about another question.
Crookston: Well, I have a follow up does the failure of the City to request to have
Locust Grove realigned so that it eventually becomes if you will a straight road north
to south, what is the effect on that in having the overpass on up the freeway on
Locust Grove?
Sale: Your silence in this application was taken, let me retry that. We consider the
language in your Comprehensive Plan to be your statement that in fact your
Comprehensive Plan says the street will go through here. So, you don't have to say
it, it is up to us to help implement that plan. It would be my preference if the City
took a deliberate action to amend your Comprehensive Plan to not show the
realignment. As the gentleman said, they are not encroaching on it and I gathered
from that they don't want to sell that right of way to us at this time. As long as that
line is shown on your Comprehensive Plan I will make a concerted effort to acquire
that right of way now before the value of the land increases substantially. Since the
2 years of the adoption or the implementation of the Impact Fee Ordinance we have
yet to have an occasion where we could not get together on the value of right of way
preservation which is what this is, it is corridor preservation. It may be some years
before anyone is involved in the construction of the road but as long as that big green
line is on your Comprehensive Plan map it is incumbent on me to preserve that right
of way.
Crookston: But, if for some reason the City did not request the realignment does that
impede the possibility of having the overpass of the freeway with Locust Grove?
Sale: Yes, I believe so. Let me go back to my previous statement. Having said all
that obviously we are not going to get into a fight with the City. If the City says we
don't want that street through there we will probably back off. But, we want you to
know upfront that probably shoots down your overpass.
Johnson: Thank you Larry. Is Mr. Eddy here to present the preliminary plat? Did you
want to do that now sir. Apparently it needs to be done.
Crookston: I think it does if they want it approved.
Johnson: I'm just going by your guidance here that we need to get that out of the
way. Do you physically have anything. Are we just asking for questions.
Crookston: The hearing is also on the preliminary plat.
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Pores: Excuse me, if I could try to correct what perhaps might be a mis-perception
of Bruce Thompson's remarks. When he asked if you want Tom Eddy to present the
plat I think what he meant was to make a presentation about it. The plat has been
presented with the application. So, as far as we are concerned you have the plat
under consideration this evening and all of the discussion that we have given, the
testimony that we have given and the comments that the public will make are
considered to be both on the plat and the conditional use permit application. That has
been my understanding and I would like the City Attorney to confirm that.
Crookston: I think that is fine and I have no objection to that whatsoever, but it
needs to be brought up that there are people that wish to testify on the plat now is
the time to do it.
Johnson: That was noticed in the hearing.
Crookston: Right
Johnson: So, its been done
Pores: The plat has been presented in the application for preliminary plat, we have
all of our background material that has been attached to that. The comments that we
have given have been with respect to both that and the conditional use permit.
Johnson: Well I was confused, I kind of got the idea that maybe there was going to
be a formal presentation on that plat. We have the plat and if you are ready for the
public hearing we are ready for the public hearing.
Pores: Yes we are. The only confusion is that we didn't talk to Mr. Eddy before the
hearing this evening so we didn't know if he had any remarks to make or not.
Johnson: Thank you very much, apparently he does not. This is a public hearing
would someone like to come forward and address the Commission on the application?
Ted Hanson, 1882 Benttley Avenue, was sworn by the Attorney.
Hanson: Just to cover what he was talking about a few minutes ago in the
realignment, on this board over here is this to scale? And if so you have North Locust
Grove coming out here and you are coming right into this berm and trees you have
here. You said you were designating 30 feet for a power line?
Johnson: You have to talk to us and I can't see, if you get on the other side maybe.
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Thank you very much I appreciate it.
Hanson: We are talking about realigning Locust Grove road, if this is to scale this
berm and trees are dead center of this (inaudible). Idaho Power has a 30 foot right
of way, they designated that, they have already given that to them. So you want
part of the right of way back from Idaho Power to bring this road on through.
Johnson: Okay, we will address that ,we will have someone address that.
Hanson: And what is the future of putting an overpass across the freeway this is the
first I have ever heard of it.
Johnson: It was in the Comprehensive Plan the people worked on the transportation.
Hanson: I don't see how it fits in. Okay, a few other things here on this water
supply, how much water are they going to use a day. Is it just a normal industrial
usage.
Johnson: No, it is very high water usage.
Hanson: Very high because of the evaporation. In this it you didn't say whether in
your Washington plant had an planing mill, does it. Planing mills are usually quite
noisy in my experience and it carries quite a way. So, 1 presume you are having extra
sound proofing in this prefabricated steel building where this operating. And you say
it operates daytime only is that 8 hours or 10 hours or 12 hours for your planing mill?
Johnson: Okay, we will get you an answer for that also.
Hanson: On this fuel for your back up and you are using diesel fuel. My experience
in using diesel fuel is that it doesn't have an excessive storage value it generates an
algae and I'm just wondering are you going to store it for a length of time and then
dispose of it back onto the market and get fresh fuel? I think that pretty much covers
what I had.
'ThAok
Johnson: Tier} you Mr. Hanson, we will have a rebuttal to address those issues.
Anyone else?
Don Bryan, Locust Grove, was sworn by the Attorney.
Bryan: I have many concerns a lot of them were already stated and a few things you
have to take into account before you take any action on this project. One is water
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supply source, 2 is the cloud during the inversion and how that is going to hang over
our little valley, 3 is the trucks the 4 to 8 trucks coming in and out of there everyday
and which route they are going to be taking through town, around town, down
Franklin to Boise or out to the freeway or what their direction is. My biggest concern
is the one that they have conveniently added an future addendum to and that is the
location of the transmission lines coming into or going out of the power plant. Now
they have them drawn in facing right down Locust Grove Road and they said that
they have gotten word with Idaho Power that they have gotten realignment or
something hasn't been clarified until the future plans come through. I don't know
when the future is, I would hat to see this thing go ahead and get further along and
approved and find out the transmission lines go someplace. I don't know if you
gentlemen want big transmission lines in front of your house, but I sure don't care to
have them in front of my house. And it looks to me like they are heading right down
to Locust Grove sub -station on McMillan and Locust Grove. So that is my biggest
concern is the location of those transmission lines and I think the sooner we can get
a clarification on where those lines are coming and going to the better. Do you have
any questions?
Johnson: I don't, does anyone have any questions. Next, is there someone else?
Dana Harper, 1004 North Scrivner Way, was sworn by the Attorney.
Harper: We have known about this project since the beginning and we have done a
lot of research on the water aspects, pollution aspects and so forth. We, my wife
and I have come to and many of our neighbors have come to the conclusion that
several of the issues that affect this community have been addressed real clearly and
real straight forward by Meridian Energy. But, there are a couple of things that I think
do need to be looked at here and the major issue we are concerned about is this
incoming power line. There are several, we have seen 3 different proposed routes
and the preferred one is down Locust Grove Road and as anyone in the community
knows there are several new neighborhoods which that bound that area and we are
talking about young families. people with many wives in the home 24 hours a day
with young children 24 hours of the day. We know that the EMF debate is a heated
one, there are certainly a lot of experts that would tell you that there is no problem
with EMF whatsoever. My view is that even if there is a debate how can you justify
putting that in young neighborhoods when there is any kind of a question
whatsoever. Especially when you have a corridor such as Eagle Road which is an
industrial corridor, no one would be exposed to those high EMF ratios for more than
8 hours a day. I think that is a factor that really needs to be looked at strongly, thank
you.
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March 8, 1994
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Johnson: Thank you I appreciate your comments, yes sir.
Tom Mercer, 1635 East Meadowood, was sworn by the Attorney.
Mercer: I too would like to address the issue of the power lines down by the drawing
the east side of Locust Grove. My property backs to Locust Grove with ACHD
widening Locust Grove it appears that it will take a portion of my property, I'm kind
of willing to accept that but with a power line also on the same side I consider it a
rather negative aspect to not only my property but the general aesthetics of the whole
corridor with the residential section. I would hope you would, that there would be
consideration to perhaps ask if it could be routed a different way. Eagle was
suggested or other locations. Thank you
Diane Beaulieu, 1895 Star Lane, was sworn by the Attorney.
Beaulieu: I am not going to talk on the technical issues because I don't have the
environmental study in my hands, but one thing as I looked at the cooling tower with
our inversions. When you go by the sugar beet factory when there is an inversion
everything comes down on the road and it poor visibility. Are we going to have that
problem in that location, that was my only concern.
Johnson: Would someone else like to address the Commission at this time?
Melinda Harper, 1004 Scrivner Way, was sworn by the Attorney.
Harper: Member of Planning and Zoning, audience I had the opportunity of visiting
the plant in Sumas last week. 1 would like to say that when I was first informed of
the project down in the area my husband and I just purchased our property for our
home and needless to say 1 was not thrilled at all. I was quite disappointed actually.
So, when I was approached about this plant 1 figured it was probably because I was
home and nobody else was. In my heart I was very negative about this plant, but in
reviewing the literature and reading it and trying my best to understand it and in
talking in detail with Mr. Thompson and Erik Hanson when he came and did the
environmental assessment and the noise studies and in reviewing the plant actually
visiting it I have been pleasantly surprised. I was quite surprised by the methods,
they are the most technological advanced of this system type. The plant was very
clean there was no waste, any waste at all on the plant was actually being generated
from a facility across the street which was your typical lumber ripping operation that
was going on. The landscaping was very tastefully done, the plants were quite
mature when they were installed. And I know that the power company did their best
to listen to the concerns of the community, the residents and I feel that they probably
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went above and beyond even what was required for them. Because (inaudible) that
they are trying to be good neighbors. (Inaudible) there is concerns that I have, I do
have concerns about the power voltage and the line configuration. I do understand
that I hope its possible that Idaho Power will review other routes other than the route
for North Locust Grove straight up. I understand that it is the idealized route there
are no bends in the line and it is cost efficient and I understand from their view point.
However this is a residential corridor and we have to the east of us Eagle road which
could be considered an industrial corridor and I hope that Idaho Power will consider
reviewing at least using part of that line as much as possible and to take into
consideration the residents that are living in that area. I also hope and I encourage
them to have some sort of community workshop that they are willing to contact
neighbors who are affected by this be it either by letter or contacting neighborhood
association members, presidents and asking them to help and get a chain going of
communication down the road. I do not want to see North Locust Grove straightened
out, I say this strictly as very selfish because I back it. And I don't really like to see
it. I do not understand exactly why there is a need for a road going over the freeway
on North Locust Grove. We do have an overpass at Eagle and at the Meridian off
ramp I do not understand the necessary need at this time at least. Perhaps this is
something down the future, (inaudible) overpass actually east on the rest of the City
as we are heading towards Nampa because that tells me that is where the next big
growth spurt is going to be, but I may be wrong. I appreciate the diligence that you
members are paying towards this project and if any of us in Maws Addition or I'm
sure I can probably speak for them or the residents who are here from Chateau
Meadows if we can help in any way we would love to become involved. We are not
panicky residents but we do like to feel that our needs can be addressed so that we
in turn can help you in the decision process. Thank you very much.
Johnson: Thank you Melinda, the City does appreciate your concentrated efforts.
We know you spent a lot of your personal hours on this and we do appreciate that.
Someone else?
Dale Newberry, 1410 East Pine, was sworn by the Attorney.
Newberry: My concern is whether the transmission lines are going to produce a
magnetic field that is going to interfere with our equipment. We have a couple million
dollars worth of high tech equipment and I'd hate to have electrical interference there
with that equipment. Secondly, the interference with the busses on the existing
street, it seems to me like if we did bring Locust Grove through and put the driveways
on the other side it would minimize the interaction between the trucks and the
busses. Thanks
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March 8, 1994
Page 54
Johnson: Thank you Dale, I saw another hand.
Gregory W. Said, 130 East Idaho Street, was sworn by the Attorney.
Said: In the interest of time and hopefully addressing some of the concerns of the
individuals here. Its Idaho Power's understanding that as part of the process that will
go on in conjunction with Meridian Energy having this project sited that Idaho Power
will have to go through a similar process before this very group to discuss the siting
of the transmission lines that would be required to interconnect Meridian Energy. And
with that in mind we have prepared a fact sheet that would give you a little bit of a
perspective of the way we see our involvement in conjunction with this project. That
I will pass out. I think at the same these are being distributed through the audience.
The main thing that I would like to state at this point in time that if you look on the
back of the sheet you can see that Idaho Power has identified 3 potential routes for
the transmission line to interconnect Meridian Energy. We have also listed as
alternatives for the possibility of any combination of the 3 alternatives that we
preliminarily identified. We understand that we will need to work through this
process to ultimately identify the path that would ultimately be used to interconnect
Meridian Energy.
Johnson: Actually your fact sheet does it detail the route or does it just refer to
them? It doesn't seem to detail the route or does it?
Said: You are correct.
Johnson: I see references to the alternative routes but I don't see detailed.
Said: Essentially the first route is directly from our Cloverdale sub -station travelling
west to the Meridian Energy project.
Johnson: The Cloverdale sub -station is located where for the record?
Said: Cloverdale and Franklin. And then it would head directly west to Meridian
Energy and then north to our Locust Grove sub -station and Locust Grove and
McMillan. The second route would have that same connection from the Cloverdale
sub -station to Meridian Energy but the point at which the line would north would be
different in that it would head north at the mid-section between Locust Grove and
Eagle Road. And then the third alternative would head north along Eagle road.
Johnson: Those are detailed I think in the presentation as I recall or the alternatives
routes are in there they are just not in this fact sheet. I don't think the public would
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be able to tell where it was going by this fact sheet. Any questions of Idaho
Power's representative?
Rountree: Just a point of clarification that with or without this proposal Idaho Power
has to build an interconnect line between Cloverdale and Locust Grove sub -stations.
Said: That is our desire, because of the growth in the Meridian we see the need to
have the circuit built from Cloverdale to Locust Grove.
Johnson: Thank you, is there anyone else from the public that would like to come
before the Commission?
Ted Hanson: In his proposal there in going to the Cloverdale sub -station would look
logical. We've got these humongous steel towers running along the railroad that you
could just ducktail out of this thing and go right to where those towers are. They
have done that back in Boise going right down the tracks.
Johnson: The ones that run down to the mall I think.
Todd Montrous, 1026 North Scrivner, was sworn by the Attorney.
Montrous: As far as growth is concerned with the power lines I agree with the
gentleman that said bring them down the railroad tracks that would be the least
impact on growth as far as your community or residential areas would look
aesthetically nice and stuff. The power lines will detract from that and going across
the railroad tracks would be your best option I feel.
Johnson: Thank you for that comment, anyone else?
Sale: Mr. Chairman, members of the Commission this may answer a couple of
questions that was raised. The obvious question about the right of way and the
conflict with the power line along the west boundary and the landscaping. Again if
the alignment is changed on Locust Grove road we would acquire half of the right of
way at this time with no plans for immediate construction. We would enter into a
license agreement with Meridian Energy to allow them to use that property as the
agreement would allow for the term until the roadway might be constructed. It would
be advantageous to perhaps both the taxpayers of Ada County and the rate payers
of Idaho Power Company if we acquired that right of way and then they put their
utility structures in the right of way. If they put the structures in then we have to go
back in and buy the right of way and move those, it is a great cost, added cost of the
road. I think we could reduce cost for both parties upfront if we bought the right of
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way now and then they put the poles in at the edge of the right of way. There is
with regard this is just kind of an aside to Meridian Energy that is still an unfinished
matter regarding a gas line in Franklin road that they have inquired about, the ball is
in their court. I just remind them that if they wish to pursue that route that they do
need to get back with us. Thirdly, and I would certainly like this to get in the
minutes, obviously it will. I would like Mayor Kingsford to know this, the Meridian
Energy project will probably not pay an impact fee a road impact fee. And the
explanation of that maybe will allow you to understand why we can't just change
impact fees for a little reason. The formula which determines the amount of impact
fee on any particular use has 2 credit factors in it. One of those credits against the
cost of the impact fee is a credit that is given for fuel tax that vehicles will pay while
travelling their homes and whatever and the facility. And a second is a credit for
property tax which is paid at Ada County Highway District to that portion of the
property taxes which is paid to Ada County Highway District for the construction of
roadways. It seems based on information that Meridian Energy has submitted that
the payment of property tax to the Highway District will be sufficient that their credit
will be larger than their impact so they will not pay a road impact fee. If you could
let the Mayor know that I would appreciate it. Lastly, I would urge that you retain the
Highway District's requirements as stated. If conditions change regarding the
alignment of Locust Grove we will change the conditions. We will make sure they fit
the situation, but I would ask that you not amend our conditions or requirements as
the gentleman requested. This is A part of that statement, B part is that it is a
subdivision and requires our approval anyway those will be our own requirements and
we will impose them anyway. That is all I had to say Mr. Chairman and Commission.
Johnson: Any questions of Mr. Sale? Thank you Larry. Is there anyone else that
would like to come before the Commission at this time? Mr. Forrey are you raising
your hand.
Forrey: Thank you Mr. Chairman, 17 years ago I worked for Larry Sale and now I
have that rare pleasurable opportunity to turn the tables on an old boss. On map 1,
Larry referred to map 3 on the Comprehensive Plan, but on map 1 for clarification
purposes let me explain a few things in terms the routing of Locust Grove Road.
Given the growth in the community and citizen input during the formation of the
Comprehensive Plan update the thinking was and the policies that support that
thinking now were that we should phase in some traffic improvements. So, on map
#1 in the Comprehensive Plan Locust Grove Road is shown for improvement by ACHD
in year 1998 to a 3 lane facility in its current configuration. And I will just refer to
that as the offset or dog leg, it is not straight through. So, the plan that citizens,
ACHD, APA, ITD and the City of Meridian have endorsed and is memorialized in the
plan is that it would go to 3 lanes improvement in 1998 in its current configuration.
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Larry is correct however though on map 3 which represents way out into the future
about 20 to 22 years from the year 2015 we do anticipate based on forecast traffic
volumes and levels of service that Locust Grove would be extended in a straight new
alignment which would cut through the west edge of this property. So, there is a 2
policy approach here, our interim solution to Locust Grove is to leave it in its current
alignment and improve it to 3 lanes. That was also based on 2 important things, one
is the current alignment of Locust Grove is considered a traffic calming measure, it
does not force traffic through and adjacent to Maws subdivision or other planned
residential developments along Locust Grove. The thinking was also that 20 to 22
years from now there would be mature subdivisions in terms of landscape and that
type of thing up next against Locust Grove so that when the widening and any future
improvement 20 to 25 years from now it would have less impact because of the
mature trees and established neighborhoods. So, that was the thinking in the
Comprehensive Plan in terms of an interim improvement and a long term
improvement. So, to ask the City what is our opinion of Locust Grove we are really
looking at a long term policy Larry and when in fact we had a 2 tiered policy. Also
the Comprehensive Plan does indicate that even in year 2015 Locust Grove would still
be a minor arterial we have policies that indicate a minor arterial is not to penetrate
into or disrupt the character of a residential neighborhood. So we have to take that
into consideration in terms of Maws and subdivisions north. Several, Mrs. Donahue,
Mrs. Beaulieu spoke and they live north of Fairview on Locust Grove. So we have to
consider the impacts to those neighborhoods as well. Our plan also indicates that a
bike lane will be developed in 1998 from Pine to Ustick on North Locust Grove Road.
So those are the anticipated improvements in the near term on that issue. I hope that
helps clarify the City's policy.
Johnson: I don't think it really helps.
Forrey: That is good planning I guess.
Johnson: Not at this time of night, you have confused us. Do you have another
point?
Forrey: Yes, just looking at the information that Idaho Power submitted and just a
quick check it appears that alternative routes 1 and 2 do not comply with the
Meridian Comprehensive Plan. Alternative route 3 definitely does comply with he
Comprehensive Plan but that is a separate issue. Idaho Power will provide power to
the site they are going to make those improvements with or without Meridian Energy.
It is not Meridian Energy's responsibility to pay for anything over and above the
normal site development cost for energy at that site. That is the responsibility of
Idaho Power that is a separate issue and they committed tonight to involve the public
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 58
and the City will cooperate with that and we will give them assistance interpreting the
Comprehensive Plan and work with them. I would be happy to answer any questions
Mr. Chairman.
Forrey: Thank you Wayne, any questions of Mr. Forrey?
Hepper: Wayne did you visit the Sumas plant in Washington?
Forrey: I did.
Hepper: Could you give us a feel of your overall feeling of that project?
Forrey: When I first learned of the file, I thought it was a local energy company and
then I saw the Washington mailing address and I asked the Mayor about it and he
said well one of these days they are probably going to make an application and I
would like you to get familiar with that because we don't know the ins and outs. I
made a trip up to Sumas at my own expense in October of last year 1993. 1 went up
to the plant, I spent about a half a day there. I interviewed the Mayor, the citizens
in a restaurant, plat personnel, the foreman manager. I guess like Mrs. Harper I came
away pretty impressed by the cleanliness, the technology that is incorporated. 1 knew
that Maws Addition was an issue here in Meridian so I paced out 600 feet and I've
always tried to think of things like how would a blind person interpret noise. Because
if you see something I think you have the subconscious knowledge that there is going
to be noise if you see something that is supposed to make noise. So, you walk out
600 feet, you turn your back to it and close your eyes and I couldn't hear it. You
could here the grass in a breeze kind of rustling. I walked to 400 feet and you started
to know even a blind person would acknowledge there is something out there I don't
know what it is. At 200 feet you definitely know you are adjacent to an industrial
facility of some type. I wasn't a high pitched sound, it was kind of a background dull
noise much like traffic on a highway (End of Tape). So, I did that because I wanted
to come back to Meridian and pace it off and I did. So, I in my staff recommendation
that I made to you I am very confident that this is compatible given the character of
land use at this site, given that we have a very important subdivision Maws Addition
and its very proximal to this but at 600 feet I didn't hear it enough that it would be
an impact in my opinion. So, as Planning Director I made the recommendation that
this be approved given the safeguards that have been presented in the environmental
assessment the noise document, the air quality document and all of the other
operating permits that he State and Federal agencies and I think those should
comprise our conditional use permit. I think its compatible at that location.
Johnson: Thank you Wayne, any other questions? Anyone else have anything they
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would like to bring before the Commission on this application? I appreciate all of you
that have testified, I will now close the public hearing.
Rountree: We have some questions we might want to ask I know he does and I have
one question.
Johnson: I will reopen the public hearing.
Rountree: I have a question for Bruce and he is busy right now, Bruce I have a
question for you. Related to another measure we talked about to reduce noise in
Sumas was the possibility of putting the cyclone at ground level and that was not
mentioned. Is that going to be considered?
Thompson: When we had to tour in Sumas last week I did mention to the
Commissioners that as additional noise mitigation measure would be possible for us
to take the mechanical cyclone off the top of the truck dog and put it on the ground
level and because that cyclone stands up about 80 feet in the air and as Diane
Thompson and Melinda Harper noted in our tour they could hear the clanging of the
wood particles at they hit the outside of the metal cyclone. The answer is yes we
could do that at very little cost. And that would have a positive visual impact you
have several cyclones on some of the wood products firms in the community so you
know what they are. We didn't recommend in our environmental to do that, but from
2 aspects the visual aesthetics and sound that would be a positive measure that we
could do is to move that onto the ground. Mr. Chairman if I could I need another hour
to discuss the project. Anyway I think it is appropriate to respond to a couple of
questions that were raised by the people that spoke. I would like to do that and I will
do that very quickly. The first gentleman that spoke asked about the right of way for
Idaho Power. As we have shown and stated on our preliminary plat we did not show
a 45 foot dedication on our west property line. We did show a 30 foot easement that
we would dedicate to Idaho Power to bring in their service into our facility. We still
object to the dedication of the right of way on our west line, we don't feel that it is
justified at this time. We have the same concerns as the City does and the
community people that live there. The disruption that a new arterial would cause by
that dedication and improvement. If in fact the City Council and the Planning
Commission do decide that the dedication makes sense and is appropriate then
certainly we would no object to it and we would provide that 45 foot easement that
the Highway district could purchase at the same time the Idaho Power easement that
is required if in fact it is located on that side which I believe it will be would be within
part of that Highway District easement probably starting from the back of the
sidewalk in the appropriate distance. Not knowing for sure what is going to happen
with this issue because there seems to be different ideas an policies w have located
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our structures on the site that if this road is dedicated in the future and improved it
would not interfere with the use as you see them on the site plan. The landscape
strip, the 20 foot border that is shown on the west line could exist within the Idaho
Power easement as long as the trees and vegetation are the proper heights and don't
interfere with ground clearance. There is no conflict on that west line. The second
issue raised was the noise of the planer line. In keeping with our good neighbor
policy in the City of Sumas we agreed within the lumber warehouse to completely
enclose the planer machinery, the motor, the knives and so forth and the control are
inside the building. Which cuts the noise down substantially. I believe the
manufacturer that put in that facility in Sumas, Washington had to live with the 65
decibel level outside the enclosure and as a couple of the Commissioners and 2 of the
residents toured our facility they discovered that it was quite quiet inside the facility
and very little noise went outside the building or the structure. The other item he
asked about was the storage of fuel and as I mentioned in my presentation we are
going to keep a minimum of fuel in the diesel storage facility. Probably well less than
a 100,000 gallons perhaps 25,000 to 50,000. We expect if we are ever curtailed by
Northwest Pipeline Corporation that we would have at least 5 days notice that is in
our agreement with them so we would have time to bring in fuel by truck. The
gentleman that spoke is correct the fuel does age and it becomes a waste fuel, algae
can grow inside the tanks, so you don't want to store very much there. We would
keep a very small amount. If we do have to get rid of that older fuel after it lost its
BTU content it will be taken out and handled by a firm that deals with spent fuel or
old fuel and will be disposed of properly under current regulations. The other person
that commented asked about water use. The project is a large water user,
approximately 500,000 gallons a day and most of that is make up that is lost in the
cooling tower by evaporation. Our analysis of the City's water plan and available
water and their future improvements in drilling the wells indicates that there will be
adequate water supplies out of the new well that they intend to bid and drill in the
eastern portion of the City limits which is well no. 16. All indications are that there
is ample water supplies underground to handle our project needs. There is no
question about the vapor from the cooling tower and in our environmental assessment
we did address 2 issues with the cooling tower. One is ice fog and ice crystals and
I do have to admit that under certain ambient weather conditions particularly during
the winter when it is cold and we do have an inversion it is possible for several hours
that there will be a cloud produced and that could result in fog on the ground level
particularly in the nearby roads that is very possible. As you would have with any
industry that produces any kind of water vapor or steam and that would only happen
at very few incidences during the winter which would be very rare but certainly it is
possible that it could happen. The issue on the potential conflict of traffic from our
project and the school district busses. I had the opportunity to meet last week with
the School Superintendent and the Chairman of the School Board and we had a very
•
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 61
good meeting, very positive, very upbeat and I assured both the Chairman of the
Board and the Superintendent that we would sit down with them and work out a kind
of a traffic plan particularly during construction. I know there are 2 periods during the
day when busses leave the bus barn and come back and we would do our very best
to coordinate our construction traffic during the day with the times the busses leave
and return the bus barn. I also made a commitment to them that during operation of
the plant and in future years that we would try to schedule our deliveries in and out
of the plant not conflict with bus traffic. I think we can easily work that out with
them so they are satisfied and we are. We are very conscious of that problem I must
add though with the future interim proposed improvements of Locust Grove Road
from Franklin to Fairview that it would go a long way of solving some of the issues
on that street because it would be 3 lanes and center turn lane. I would like to make
a few comments about what Larry Sale had to say. I want to get on the record that
we have had an excellent working relationship with Larry. I met with his staff many
times, he is a straight shooter, we've have gotten along with him well and I think we
do have a bit of a conflict on what is going to happen with this potential dedication
on West Locust Grove but I think squarely its the Planning Commission and City
Council decision. My feeling is that the Highway District will support whatever
decision the City makes and we would support that decision also. Thank you very
much for your time. We have enjoyed having this opportunity to present this project
to you and we hope if there are other questions and other information that you would
like to see that you would let us know. Also for the people that are here there is an
additional hearing or perhaps more that might be held. The City Council must also
hold a public hearing and review the applications that we have submitted. So, this
isn't the last time that people will have an opportunity to comment and participate
with your review of this project. On behalf of Meridian Energy Inc. and our staff and
the owners and other and the people that were here I would like to thank you. We
feel that we have a good project here and we would like to do it in your community.
Johnson: Thank you Bruce, Mr. Mitchell would like to address the Commission.
Mitchell: As Vice President I hate to publically correct my Senior Vice President, but
as Vice President of Fuel Management I figured for the matter of record 1'd better get
this straight on our diesel fuel. Our plans are at least based on what we are told by
our gas pipeline company is that probably for the first 3 to 7 years of plant operation
we won't even have to have diesel fuel in the tank at all. We will build the tank when
we are building the plant but we are not likely to be curtailed under our contract at
all during that period. In their estimation we would not be required to have diesel fuel
in the tank. When we do go to have diesel fuel in the tank there is a shelf life
problem, it lasts 1 to 2 years. We will probably fill the whole tank not just a partial
filling because that reduces the chance of inoxidation and bacteria. In our fuel supply
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 62
contract we would negotiate a but back provisions where whatever fuel we didn't use
in any given winter the fuel company would buy back from us and therefore we don't
have the degradation problem and we are not really talking about having waste fuel
hauled away or anything like that. I just wanted to correct that.
Johnson: In any of the other plants do you have the diesel fuel back up?
Mitchell: None of the other plants have we been in the position where we had to
have diesel fuel back up.
Johnson: I didn't think so. Thanks, are you guys going to let me close the public
hearing now?
Crookston. My questions were answered.
Johnson: Okay, I will now formally close the public hearing. I appreciate everyone
that testified. I appreciate the presentation, very professional. We need some
action.
Rountree: Mr. Chairman I make the motion that we have findings of fact and
conclusions of law prepared on the conditional use permit application.
Shearer: Second
Johnson: We have a motion and a second to have the City Attorney prepare findings
of fact and conclusions of law on the conditional use permit for Meridian Energy, all
those in favor? Opposed?
MOTION CARRIED: All Yea
Rountree: Action on the preliminary plat would come after the findings of fact
correct?
Shearer: Yes
ITEM #7: CLARIFICATION AND DISCUSSION BY WAYNE CROOKSTON ON
SPORTSMAN POINT NO. 5 SUBDIVISION:
Crookston: Mr. Johnson who owns Sportsman Pointe and their properties applied to
the City in 1992 for annexation and zoning of the property basically at the corner of
Locust Grove and Overland road. A portion of the property was within the then
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 63
existing Urban Service Planning Area. There was a portion that was south of the
Urban Service Planning Area boundary and the City could not annex that property.
And the City did go ahead and annex the property that was north of the Urban
Service Planning Area boundary and told the applicant that the City could not annex
the property south. The City and Mr. Johnson did do that, he has subsequently
planned subdivisions that was south of the Urban Service Planning Area and has
requested the City to annex that property he actually lost a little bit of touch of it
himself and wanted the City to take action to annex it and so we checked into the
process as to how far he had gotten on the land south of the Urban Service Planning
Area boundary. The only thing that had been done was the initial public hearing
before the Planning and Zoning Commission the rest of it was tabled because it was
not within the Urban Service Planning Area and told him we would deal with it on his
application after we amended the Comprehensive Plan and enlarged the Urban Service
Planning area boundary. He is now asking the City to annex that property that was
south of the Urban Service Planning Area boundary but is now within the Urban
Service Planning Area boundary. So, since it last ended at the P & Z commission the
P & Z Commission needs to bring that off the table and basically approve the
annexation and zoning and then there will be a public hearing before the City Council.
Johnson: IN essence the original application dealt with the area we had no
jurisdiction to act on that so we tabled that portion of it. Now, since it is in the area
we can act on that. That is where we are at.
Crookston: That is correct.
Johnson: So, we need a motion at this point then.
Shearer: Did we get the findings of fact done and so on? Where are we at exactly?
Johnson: Our findings of fact didn't address that area.
Crookston: I do not recall, what are you shaking your head about Will?
Shearer: He wasn't here he doesn't know.
Crookston: He has reviewed the material.
Johnson: It is my recollection that because it wasn't in our jurisdiction we didn't
address it in our findings of fact.
Berg: No, but we notified that the public hearing was of that whole area and we had
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Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 64
a public hearing on that whole area but then according to the records in reviewing it
you could only approve that portion that was in the jurisdiction that was in the Urban
Service Planning area.
Shearer: Did we approve the findings of fact?
Rountree: With it included?
Berg: Well, I think the findings of fact had that included and you just approved the
findings of fact totally.
Johnson: I think we need to know for sure.
Berg: 1 don't think it was separated out as far.
Crookston: I don't think it was separated.
Berg: In the minutes that I reviewed.
Johnson: Well, we can entertain a motion based on that assumption that being the
case.
Forrey: Mr. Chairman, members of the Commission and Counselor, given that we are
now looking at an annexation of additional property for Sportsman Point have we
missed an opportunity for a development agreement or is that opportunity still
present?
Crookston: I think it is still there. It is a new annexation.
Forrey: I would recommend if we have that opportunity to put that as a stipulation
in the new findings or in the motion because that is one way we could achieve good
development there.
Johnson: That is a good point, that is why you get the big bucks. Is there a
recommendation?
Rountree: Mr. Chairman, I make a motion that we have staff review the findings of
facts of the previous action of P&Z on this application. Discuss Comp Plan revisions
and have Counsel make changes to those findings of fact that would be appropriate
to get us to the current level of the Comprehensive Plan and present that information
at our next regularly scheduled meeting in April.
Planning & Zoning Commission
March 8, 1994
Page 65
Shearer: Second
Johnson: We have a motion and a second, any discussion on that? That delays is
another month that is my only discussion point. All in favor of that motion?
Opposed?
MOTION CARRIED: All Yea
Rountree: I make another motion to go along with that the submittal of the findings
of facts that we also get a preliminary plat for consideration for the piece of property
in question so we can act on that as well.
Shearer: Second
Johnson: Okay, a second motion to include a preliminary plat, all those in favor?
Opposed?
IuLilIiI�L1Hl�lll1��_1R�'
Rountree: I move we adjourn
Shearer: Second
Johnson: Moved and seconded we adjourn, all those in favor? Opposed?
MOTION CARRIED: All Yea
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 11:50 P.M.
(TAPE ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
UL
JIM SON, CHAIRMAN
ATTEST:
WILLIAM G. BERG, JR., CITY CLERK
MERIDIAN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION
AGENDA
TUESDAY, MARCH 8, 1994 - 7:30 P.M.
CITY COUNCIL CHAMBERS
MINUTES OF PREVIOUS MEETING HELD FEBRUARY 8, 1994
1. FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR ANNEXATION AND
ZONING WITH A PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR MERIDIAN MEADOWS BY
RONALD HENRY:
2. FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR ANNEXATION AND
ZONING FOR SUMMERFIELD SUBDIVISION BY MAX BOESIGER AND
HUBBLE ENGINEERING:
4.6_� 3. REQUEST FOR ANNEXATION AND ZONING WITH A PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR
HAVEN COVE NO. 5 BY INTERWEST DEVELOPMENT AND DAVID
COLLINS: TABLED AT FEBRUARY 8, 1994 MEETING:
�JGL 4. PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR ANNEXATION AND ZONING WITH A
CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR ASPEN GROVE ESTATES BY
SHEKINAH INDUSTRIES AND POWER ENGINEERS:
` V,a, `j 5. PUBLIC HEARING: REQEUST FOR PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR FINCH CREEK
SUBDIVISION BY BORUP CONSTRUCTION AND HUBBLE ENGINEERS:
/LL 6. PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR PRELIMINARY PLAT WITH A CONDITIONAL
USE PERMIT FOR MERIDIAN ENERGY BY MERIDIAN ENERGY AND
TOM EDDY OF PACIFIC LAND SURVEYORS:
7. CLARIFICATION AND DISCUSSION BY WAYNE CROOKSTON ON SPORTSMAN
POINTE NO. 5 SUBDIVISION:
0 •
MERIDIAN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION
AGENDA
TUESDAY, MARCH 8, 1994 - 7:30 P.M.
CITY COUNCIL CHAMBERS
Q �O/vved . MINUTES OF PREVIOUS MEETING HELD FEBRUARY 8, 1994
e0"ec--fib# /page /ZL uddidio.z al
1. FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR ANNEXATION AND
ZONING WITH A PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR MERIDIAN MEADOWS BY
RONALD HENRY: i� L'/c-
{-ecom e4en d� & C/C, /a aPovor�,
2. FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR ANNEXATION AND
ZONING FOR SUMMERFIELD SUBDIVISION BY MAX BOESIGER AND
HUBBLE ENGINEERING: ap�rwed flF f C/G
/'ecomrnenas "t, C/C �-a ayjorowe-
3. REQUEST FOR ANNEXATION AND ZONING WITH A PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR
HAVEN COVE NO. 5 BY INTERWEST DEVELOPMENT AND DAVID
COLLINS: TABLED AT FEBRUARY 8, 1994 WETING:
-fab/ed @7-A vegtccdtofC'o//:ns ur�f,lne� rK
4. PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR ANNEXATION AND ZONING WITH A
CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR ASPEN GROVE ESTATES BY
SHEKINAH INDUSTRIES AND POWER ENGINEERS: o917 -
(1/2'y at6*ney74�i jxo/-Act,w�Cv�2c�ufions�/40w
5. PUBLIC HEARING: REQEUST FOR PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR FINCH CREEK
SUBDIVISION BY BORUP CONSTRUCTION AND HUBBLE ENGINEERS:
6. PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR PRELIMINARY PLAT WITH A CONDITIONAL
USE PERMIT FOR MERIDIAN ENERGY BY MERIDIAN ENERGY AND
TOM EDDY OF PACIFIC LAND SURVEYORS: kle
o/2y attoi-ney - vv creOake fiamyr oyt �/corc/ud.�t o�/aw
7. CLARIFICATION AND DISCUSSION BY WAYNE CROOKSTON ON SPORTSMAN
POINTE NO. 5 SUBDIVISION:
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The Honorable Mayor and City Council
City of Meridian
In the matter of Aspen Grove Estates, petition for annexation and rezoning.
March 5, 1994
We, the undersigned, are the affected residents adjoining the development on the
east, the holders of the domestic water right which is being impuned, and part of a
Neighborhood Coalition being formed to enjoin this development.
Say the undersigned:
We are Archie T. and Ernestine M. Roberson, property owners of 185 South Locust
Grove Road, and we have lived at this location for 23 years. This property is two
acres, dependent upon surface irrigation, and we are duly subscribed to the Nampa
Meridian Irrigation District.
We are James N. and Ann C. Witherell, property owners of 215 South Locust Grove
Road, and we have lived at this location for 15 years. This property is one acre,
dependent upon surface irrigation, and we are duly subscribed to the Nampa
Meridian Irrigation District.
We are Gene and Vernadene Pressley, property owners of 255 South Locust Grove
Road and we have lived at this location for 26 years. This property is one acre,
dependent upon surface irrigation, and we are duly subscribed to the Nampa
Meridian Irrigation District.
We are Robert R. and Jeri Smith, property owners of 355 South Locust Grove Road,
and we have lived at this location for 27 years. This property is 2.5 acres,
dependent upon surface irrigation, and we are duly subscribed to the Nampa
Meridian Irrigation District.
So identified, and having discussed this project with Ada County Development, Ada
Planning Association, Nampa Meridian Irrigation District, Central District Health,
Ada County Highway District, the Idaho Department of Water Resources, the Idaho
Division of Environmental Quality, and Bureau of Reclamation, we oppose this
project.
6 0
It is our opinion that this proposal 1s simply an In -Your -Face, Smash -And -Grab
attempt to hide a trailer park behind the assumed naivity of the Meridian City
Council; unannexed, it could not be otherwise developed. It is further our opinion
that this development is intended for resale to other parties not specified in the
proposal, and produce caveat emptor of conditional use through successors or
assigns: Shekinah Industries, Inc., titles or registers no equipment in Idaho, nor
does its owner title or register other than personal vehicles.
We draw our opinion as follows:
1. THE DEVELOPER HAS NOT PROCEEDED IN GOOD FAITH
1.1 The Plat submitted to the affected parties has the wrong legal discription: it
describes property approximately three miles from the actual location. This
seriously handicapped the affected parties in doing research. Given other factors,
we believe this was a deliberate ruse to confuse the affected parties and impede
their response.
1.2 The Plat submitted to the affected parties is entirely different from that
submitted to Council. The Plat given to the affected parties clearly illustrates a
trailer park, with different ingress and egress, ditchwork, layout lines, and
roadwork. Nor were the particulars legible. This, too, seriously handicapped the
affected parties from doing research. Given other factors, we believe this was
also a deliberate ruse to confuse the affected parties and impede their response.
1.3 Both Plats portray development of property not owned by the developer. This
property on the east and south is bounded by an irrigation lateral owned by the
Nampa Meridian Irrigation District. This ditch, and all receiving ditches, are
shallow and designed for syphon delivery; this ditch could not be covered over.
Nor can access to this ditch for present waterusers be restricted. However, the
Plats show this ditch, and its easements, as housing units with all access denied
to the current waterusers This development cannot proceed without license from
the Irrigation District. THE IRRIGATION DISTRICT HAS NOT BEEN CONTACTED FOR
LICENSE - OR EVEN PROJECT FEASIBILITY - by the developer. The The Plat,
therefore, is a serious distortion of fact; this ditch and easements considerably
reduce the land shown as developed.
z
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By this instrument, be it known to the developer that the affected parties, joinly
or severally, will not negotiate irrigation sale or access changes. The system is
serviceable to the water users, as is, and any change would not benefit the users.
1.4 It is required in Bolse, and strongly suggested by the County, that developers
meet with affected parties prior to submission. Moreover, it is conventional
business sense to gauge impact of development, tortious or physical, as a simple
matter of project feasibility. Our first awareness of this development was the
meeting notice. We were never approached about the development nor, to our
knowledge. was this property ever surveyed. It is not now, nor has it been staked.
All aspects have been kept secret from the affected parties. We believe this was
done in order for the developer to confuse and disorganize the affected parties -
thereby manipulate public comment.
These facts established, we quote from page 3 of the developer's proposal: "We
want to be good neighbors to the five adjacent residents".
This is patently false, and begs question of all statements made in the proposal.
2. NATURE OF THE DEVELOPMENT
Let it be clear: this property can be residentially developed undercurrent zoning.
However, because of soil problems and high watertable, the area can only sustain
one household per acre. Thirty one such residences could be developed at a profit
by the developer, as is. The issue, then, is not development. The issue is the
severity of profit the developer wants.
The developer asks the City for annexation, which the city has no obligation to
grant.
The developer also asks for rezoning of a 3.6 acre parcel to commercial use to
enable the building of a gas station/mini-mart/carwash and office complex
although there is no shortage of commercial land in Meridian (indeed, there are
several hundred acres available for this type of development just across the road).
And there is no shortage of gas stations/mini-marts/carwashes, and office space -
there is ample supply, extant. Therefore, there is no rational need for this
s
rezoning, or any of these services. The issue of need aside, there are problems
which will be addressed in part 4, below.
The developer further asks for rezoning of a 33.1 acre parcel for Planned Unit
Development.
A PUD customarily means an apartment complex, wherein the residents are
transient (no vested interest in the property) and the landlord collects rents for
the use of rooms. This contrasts to a mobile home park, wherein the residents are
non -transient, the tenent owning the rooms (a vested Interest In the property) and
the landlord collects rents for the use of space.
A second distinction is that a PUD, as a permanent structure, appreciates in real
value and is assessed by comparable structures in the same area. In contrast, a
mobile home is a temporary structure, assessed as personal property whether or
not a Real Property Declaration has been filed (this can be rescinded by the owner
at any time), and depreciates in value. The tax assessment of a mobile home is
based on the owner's declaration (there are no standards among mobile homes to
enable comparision), as arbitrated with the County Assessor.
A third distinction is that there are major restrictions on mobile homes. To be
blunt, the depreciating nature renders them ugly, they are fire hazards, and they
are lower rent housing, catering to lower income tenents even if that was not the
original Intent. Boise City prohibits mobile home development. Ada County tightly
resticts them, requiring setbacks, maximum screening, and limits density. They
also require planned and aesthetic transition from high density to low density
housing, and, we are informed by Ada Development, do not approve such units
where there is opposition because such development, prima facia, reduces property
values, and make the agency a corespondent.
There are no such restrictions on Planned Unit Development, which assumes a
permant, value appreciation, and regulated environment.
Aspen Grove proports to be a hybrid of mobile home and planned unit development.
That is, it has all the physical charactoristics of a mobile home park, and will
predictably have all the social and environmental problems of a mobile home park.
By the way in which the rent is transacted, it is a PUD. But like a PUD, and unlike
a mobile home park the tenents at Aspen Grove will have no vested interest.
a
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2.1 ASPEN GROVE IS A MOBILE HOME PARK
The developer uses the term Manufactured Housing, apparently to infer what is
arranged as a trailer park, looks like a trailer park, and will behave like a trailer
park, is something else. This tact opportunizes on the image of other
Manufactured Housing developments, such as the Biddick (Weathervane)
Subdivision which is an excellent subdivision. But opportunizing fails to note that
in these subdivisions the resident is also the owner (with a definite vested
Interest) and that these subdlvisions have made clever use of doubles and triples
so that they blend with the adjoining housing.
Please note that nowhere in the proposal does the developer say the proposed units
will either be purchased new, or that they will be other than trailers in the
conventional sense.
Whatever imagery, Aspen Grove is arranged as a trailer park, has freestanding
carports (the size of these, and the units, are questionable as no scale is provided)
like a trailer park, and there is no attempt to blend the units with the surrounding
residences - like a trailer park. The density of units is extreme, like a trailer
park, and on what scale can be rationalized from property boundaries, some of the
units scale only 10 X 30 feet, and are scarely 10 feet apart.
Density is described as averaging 4.76 units per acre. Such, units are not
physically divisible, for true analysis the number is 5 units per acre. The market
is targeted at families in need of 'affordable housing'. This translates to lower
and per se low incomes Assume each family is 'typically' four with both parents
working and two children in school. Also assume the 'typical' family has at least
one dog or cat (assume pets are allowed, catering to 'start-up' families as the
proposal calls them), and two cars (neither particularly new - the average car in
Ada County is 9.1 years old, based on Idaho Transportation Department
information.
The density, therefore, is not simply 5 units per acre.
At 130 units (reserve 9 units for 'adult only' since this designation means if they
aren't filled with adults then they'll be filled with families.) there would be
MINIMUM of 512 people, 260 of which are school children, 130 dogs or cats, and
5
0
11
260 aged vehicles. And at least 120 lawnmowers since the landlord will charge
for lawn service in lieu.
However, this minimum would also understate actual density.
Most of Ada County growth is presumed the result of people migrating here from
interstate. Using drivers license surrenders, data provided by the Idaho
Transportation Department shows just under 1,000 drivers, meaning 500
households, moved to Meridian in 1993. The modal age group was 20 - 29 years old.
The rate of growth, however, using the same source with 1991 - 1993, is
declining. This age group tends to have more than two children per unit, per the
1990 census average, by age, by householder. The more probable number of
children would be three children per unit.
The child impact is 390 elementary and middle schoolaged children. crammed into
'47 units per acre This is verging on a new elementary school and produces a
more realistic total of 650 adults and children in the 'family' development.
Unfortunately, as will be obviated below, the taxes generated would probably not
sustain an animal control officer, needed to deal with 130 pets much less school
enhancement or additional buses, nor municipal services (mainly police) needed for
any group of people crammed into small spaces.
Sections 49-114, 49-422, 63-102, 63-1203, and 39-4105,ldaho Code describe
and regulate a mobile home and a manufactured home as the same thing: for
purposes of taxing, for purposes of health and safety, for purposes of regulation.
This applies whether the unit is on wheels, skirted, or permanently attached to a
foundation - or whether it is lifted from a foundation, rewheeled, and relocated.
By whatever euphemism the developer chooses, Aspen Grove is a mobile home park
except for the means of collecting rents. It must be considered a mobile home
park for purposes zoning. It should be recognized that the transition from dense to
very sparce population is measured in inches, not half -miles or quarter miles. It
sould be recognized that screening, inspite of this density, is a cedar fence - half
of the cost of which will be charged to the neighbors and who also will be
expected to bear half of the maintenance cost. Thank you, but the affected parties
already have fences and will not be bound to any fencing costs of the developer. It
must be recognized that there are no setbacks and because of the exteme density,
T
i
and impact on the established neighborhood, a berm, not a (cheap cedar) fence,
would probably be required by Ada Development.
This development sets a serious precident wherein every trailer park in Meridian
could become a PUD, or a 'partial' PUD, and, being much cheaper to develop than a
standard subdivision, the precident of Aspen Grove should attract dozens of
copycat developments
2.2 ASPEN GROVE IS NOT A VIABLE TAX BASE
Section 63-1203, Idaho Code, makes the property value base for all manufactured
homes, the declaration of the owner: thereafter negotiated by the Assessor
(assuming the Assessor has adequate time or staff).
Not only must the units on Aspen Grove depreciate, they are for commercial use
(rental) and will depreciate rapidly - in spite of all the efforts of the property
manager/social director. In business, it is common practice to accelerate
depreciation where the property has a limited lifespan, such as for -rent mobile
homes. It would be absurd to assume that Aspen Grove will not accelerate
depreciation - it is designed to make its profits from equipment rental.
Effectively, tax assessment could turn into an annual squabble between the
declared value of the owner, and the Assessor over depreciating fair market value -
139 times over.
In return for annexation and rezoning, the developer implies the property will be a
high property tax return for the city. It is unclear from the wording of the
proposal whether: the developer considers each of these units, combined with the
real property, will be declared at, baseline, $75,000 - $80,000 or, if all the 139
units combined will have a declared baseline value of $75,000 - $80,000. The
former, the per unit value, couldn't possibly be meant since each unit would be
worth almost as much as the taxable value of our permanent homes on adjoining
properties. The latter, the combined value of all units, could only be meant.
This makes the total, combined baseline value of all units less than one
conventional or adjoining house. This is the declared value for the first year of
property tax assessment. From this baseline accelerated depreciation will begin.
It is our opinion, based upon the developer's stated value, that the developer's
Intent toward the municipal taxbase is as sincere as his desire to be a "good
neighbor".
2.3 ASPEN GROVE MUST DEVOLVE
Aspen Grove has two hallmark features: it has an absentee landlord with no
personal interest in the property or community and; it has transient tenents with
no personal interest in the property or community. All personal and community
interest is left in the hands of a property manager/social director. The manager,
by whatever hat, however, is also a tenent and would be interested property, or
community, by condition of employment (however long between manager
turnovers.)
These conditions of no vested interest by any party, along with depreciating
property and profit driven maintenance, are the well documented, oft decried,
sociology textbook prescription for a slum. No matter how lofty and well Intended
this project might be (and given the developer's 'good neighbor' policy this intent
may not be high), it will inevitably attract slum conditions This has happened
everywhere else so there can be no doubt, whatsoever, that it will not happen here -
the speed of decline depends only upon the selectivity of the property manager, and
the maintainance allowed by the owner's profit margin.
It is an established fact that property values, in proximity, will go down to the
point of being unsaleable, thence degenerating to rentals and devolving to slums,
themselves.
Boise prohibits these conditions by prohibiting 'mobile home' parks, and their
reasoning is obvious. We question why Meridian should permit this type of
development because the development is calling itself a PUD on a technicality.
2.4 ASPEN GROVE IS ENGINERY TO FORCE SALE
In this knowledge, the developer intends to reduce surrounding land values. It then
logically follows that the developer will attempt to secure the adjoining
properties at a fraction of their predevelopment values. in evidence is Browder
Lane. This is a pensinsula of units. It juts out into otherwise rural land and
r
barely attaches to the main development. Browder Lane dead -ends at the house
owned by Brown, one of the developers.
This 'Lane' is a driveway. It is a driveway now and it will be a driveway in the
future. To access the theoretical mini-mart/carwash/gas station, the residents
of the part of the development will have to use South Locust Grove. Its function,
therefore, in conjunction with the commercial area, is only to encircle the
adjoining properties and render them salvage value. Allowed encirclement, too,
would set a dangerous precident.
3. THE DEVELOPMENT IMPERILS SURFACE AND DRINKING WATER
The soil here, like most everywhere in Meridian, is four to six inches of sod,
followed by six to twelve inches of river -cobble rock and clay. Thereafter, it is
hardpan. And, as is also common in Meridian, the water table is extemely high.
Accordingly, this area suffers from serious drainage and high water problems. The
high ground in this area is a low ridge, sloped 10 degrees, on the west side of
South Locust Grove Road. All water on this ground drains slowly, subsurface,
through the adjoining properties.
Because of the drainage problem, all adjoining properties have had to build and
maintain drainfields to collect and divert the subsurface water. In some
instances, two drainfields. Even then, the drainage is so severe that it leaches to
the surface in the properties at 215 and 255 South Locust Grove; the fields on
these properties have standing water much of the year. It is made issue here, that
the planting of trees, as per the developer's landscape plan, would foul these
drains with their roots, a tortlous act.
Central District Health has tested these sumps and found E.coli. The only source of
this contamination, since this water has been channel directly from the upper
ground to the lower, is manure in the upper fields.
These upper fields also effect domestic water supplies. Some of this drainage
percolates into the drinking water supply and, in part, recharges it. At 215 South
Locust Grove, the drinking water depth is less than 20 feet from the surface, and
fluxuates with the field drainage.
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The soil left as Is, provides enough percolation to filter out biological
contaminants from drinking water.
It is on these upper fields that the developer intends to locate 134 of this 139
units. Among his features is Irrigation for the development. Instead of manure,
the surface and potable water supplies are threatened by sulphur leakage from the
private road network, salt from de-iced roads and carports, oil washed from roads
and carports, a large quantity of herbicides and chemical fertilizers, alcohol from
radiator leaks, and by-products from the 'home shops and hobby areas' which the
developer will 'encourage'. These are not organic and would not be filtered before
reaching the watertable.
It is empirically established that whatever goes into the ground on the upper
fields comes out in the water supply of the adjoining residents. If a sewer line on
the development ruptures, we and the watertable are in serous trouble - with the
possibility of total groundwater contamination.
It is also empirically established the the cessation of irrigation on the upper
fields will alter the domestic water table on the adjoining properties. By filings
in September of 1989, all of the foredescribed landowners have been awarded
domestic waterright by the Department of Water Resources.
It has been confirmed by that Department that the developer has not checked to
ascertain any impact on domestic water. And it has been confirmed by Central
District Health that, although the sewer plat was submitted, the developer has not
queried the potential for contamination.
Our water is in jeaprody. surface and potable, directly affecting our health and
safety. And if the table fails as the result of development. ex post facto we are
wholly without city water access with a development in situ For this reason we
intend litigation if development proceeds.
By this instrument, be it known to the developer that the affected parties, joinly
or severally, will not negotiate water right sale or access changes. The system Is
serviceable to the residents, as is, and any change would not benefit the residents.
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N.B. - CENTRAL DISTRICT HEALTH HAS ADVISED THAT SURFACE AND RUNOFF WATER
STANDARDS ARE BEING CONSIDERED.
4. TECHNICAL CONCERNS
In our reply, so far, we have covered the areas of most immediate concern to us.
However, there are several other concerns of more general bearing which we which
to address.
4.1 The office complex is drawn over a drainage ditch owned by the Nampa
Meridian Irrigation District. This is wet six months of the year and in its course
is a wetland; except in the area where the commercial area is intended and here it
has been overgrazed and eroded. The current driveways crossing this ditch are 24
inch culverts, 15 feet pipe length. These culverts barely handle high water in the
ditch at best, and are frequently clogged by debris and tumbleweed. Clogging is
frequent and has raised ditchwater level to three feet deep flooding on the fields.
When clogged, it requires two men working on both sides to free the obstruction.
The office complex will require (again, without a scale to use) about 250 feet of
culvert. And unless the developer can employ very small men that can hold their
breath a long time, the culvert diameter will have to be four feet - for routine
maintenace and to clear obstructions. This diameter may not give enough room for
the building foundations of the professional complex. The developer is targeting
the development to families with small children. No amount of grating is going to
keep children out of this allurement.
Licensure by the Nampa Meridian Irrigation District would be required to make this
project feasible. Moreover, these ditches are wetland, and may be legally
restricted by the Environmental Protection Agency.
Once more, however, the developer has not tested basic feasibility with either of
these agents.
By this instrument, be it known to the developer that if development proceeds,
complaint will be filed with the Environmental Protection Agency to seek a
determination of wetland.
ii
4.2 The gas station/mini-mart/carwash adjoin Five Mile Creek - itself a wetland
had the property at this location not been overgrazed. We find no storm drainage
on the Plat (commercial or residential), but we do estimate the underground
storage tanks will be at or in the Five Mlle watertable. We question this, and a
carwash runoff into the creek. These are major obstacles of project feasibility.
However, the Division of Environmental Quality confirms no query of feasibility or
prohibitions has been made by the developer.
It must also be questioned whether this development would be permitted by the U5
Army Corps of Engineers. Five Mile Creek is part of the Federal Emergency
Management Agency plan, administered by the Corps, to vacuate emergency
flooding. There are prohibitions on development along these watercourses, in
particular private bridgework and backwater encroachment. Permission of the
Corps is basic feasibility. We cannot definatively state that the developer has
made no query to the Corps; the Corps is located in Walla Walla, and there has been
insufficent turnaround time for Corps' confirmation. But with the severity of
shortcomings in the proposal, we can say the developer most probably has not
queried the Corps.
4.3 The road network proposed, depending upon which plat you use, would carry
the commercial traffic at either a 90 degree or 45 degree intersection falling on a
grade, just beneath the crest of the Franklin Road hill. At either degree, exiting
traffic cannot see over the crest, nor could eastbound traffic see exiting traffic
until into the intersection. This is a killer intersection in the making moreso
when commercial trucks servicing the facility are considered. The feasibility of
this intersestion will largely govern project feasibility. Once more, however, the
developer has not queried the engineering requirements with the Ada County
Highway District.
4.4 We see no consideration of the Americans With Disabilities Act. The
landscape plat evidences no ramps, etc, associated with public housing access. We
also discern from the roofline of the 'Community Center' that this structure is
probably the existing residence. In view of all other errors and omissions we must
question if the developer has considered the access and fire requirements, and
being multi -storied an elevator, to convert this to public use.
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4.5 T he developer has placed the 'adult park' at the front, and the 'family park' at
the back. The school bus stop would be at the front, on Franklin Road. This
wanton disregard of tenents' needs, other than commercial, has worn our patience.
5. CONCLUSIONS
It can only concluded by the affected parties, in view of the above, that the
proposal is disingenuous. Its assurances are platitudes, its sincerity Is empty, its
descriptions misconstrue, and Its feasibility research is, obviously, none. It is our
belief, therefore, that the developer is seeking annexation in order to resell the
proposal, or once annexation is had to seek waivers and variances until something
entirely different is built. We request, having shown there is no need or benefit to
annexation:
5.1 That annexation be denied;
5.2 That if annexation is considered further, because of the known water
problems, it is within reason and legal demand, that an indefinate moratorium be
placed on this area until Central District Health can establish water runoff
standards. In lieu, it is within reason and legal demand to place a five year
moratorium on this area.
5.3 That if development is considered, because of the known water problems, it is
within reason and legal demand, that any developer be required to perform a five
year (five irrigation seasons) test on the long range effects on runoff and
domestic water before proceeding.
5.4 That if this testing could ensure development, that suitable, transitional (non -
high density, development be allowed. A trailer/mobile home/manufactured home
development is not reasonable and should be prohibited by Meridian as it is in
Boise.
5.5 That any housing developed in this area under the foredescribed conditions be
conventional, low density owner/resident.
5.6 That any other development be prohibited.
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The aforesaid we believe to be the true representation of fact, and our opinion in
this matter:
,
Requested copies to:
Nampa Meridian Irrigation District Central District Health Department
Ada County Highway District Bureau of Reclamation
Ir.]
i
March 3, 1994
PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION
CITY OF MERIDIAN
MERIDIAN ID 83642
Commission Members:
��irrecGj 3- S- 9�
We, Morgan and Marilyn Plant, are expressing our strong opposition
to the application of Shekinah Industries for annexation and zoning
of the 33.1 acres of land covered in your February 15 letter
concerning this public hearing.
our opposition is based on the following reasons:
1. This type of zoning and use would severely lower current
values on surrounding residential property.
2. The City of Meridian needs to continue to attract quality
residential developments. This development would not be
an asset to our neighborhood or the city of Meridian.
3. This development would greatly increase the already
existing traffic problems on South Locust Grove Road and
Franklin Road.
4. This type of development would add greatly to the already
grossly overburdened educational facilities of the
Meridian School District.
5. This development would accelerate the pollution of the
groundwater system in this area.
6. This development would severely disrupt the surface
irrigation systems that have been in place for some 60-70
years.
7. This development would destroy the quality and life style
of the neighborhood that has been established over the
past 20 years.
B. This development would violate the covenants established
when Harry Frost subdivided the property.
9. It would set a precedent for development of the "open"
ground surrounding this immediate area, and we are
adamantly opposed to the creation of a "Little Hollywood"
high volume, high impact housing development.
We encourage you to reject this application.
Sincerely
Morgan and Marilyn Plant
•
CLOVIRALE - LOCUST AND MERIDIAN EIRGY
INTERCONNECTION PROJECT
FACT SHEET
Introduction
It's no secret to anyone that Idaho is growing.
Estimated annual growth for Ada County and the surrounding area is 3.3 percent, with some localities
experiencing annual growth rates as high as five percent. This also means increased demand for
electricity and requires Idaho Power to build new electrical facilities to provide service. Electric lines
are the highways over which Idaho Power transports electricity from its power plants to your home
and businesses. If that system is not upgraded and expanded in anticipation of future needs the company
and its customers run the risk of reductions in service reliability.
Transmission reliability in this area is closely related to the number of lines and their capacity. As
electrical loads increase, the probability of a power outage increases unless new transmission lines are
built. Future expansion plans are necessary to maintain the high quality of service to our customers as
the area grows.
Meridian Area Plan
Idaho Power is under pressure to address growth -related concerns in the Meridian and West Boise
areas. Although these concerns are both immediate and long-term in nature, the company proposes
both aspects be addressed through a single transmission line expansion project.
• The immediate need is an interconnection between the company's transmission grid and the
proposed Meridian Energy Co -Generation Power Plant at Pine St. and Locust Grove Rd. This
independently -owned project is scheduled to be connected to Idaho Power's transmission grid by
December 1, 1995. Existing transmission facilities are inadequate to meet this need.
• Expected future growth will require Idaho Power to expand the transmission substation at Locust
Grove and McMillan roads within ten years. Energy will be transmitted to the substation from Idaho
Power's Boise Bench Substation on Amity Rd. A major portion of the transmission line necessary to
carry this energy has already been built, connecting Boise Bench to a substation at Cloverdale and
Franklin roads.
Idaho Power proposes building a transmission line between the Cloverdale Substation and the Locust
Substation at the same time it builds the line necessary to interconnect with the Meridian Energy Co -
Generation Power Plant.
Project Description
Idaho Power proposes to construct a double circuit (3 wires for each eircuit plus 2 wires for shielding
from lightning) 230,000 volt or 230kV transmission line between Cloverdale and Locust substations.
Completion of this project would provide the necessary circuit to interconnect Meridian Energy with
Idaho Power's transmission system. Based on growth projections, the line would soon be required for
the area whether or not Meridian Energy is built. Construction of the line at this time will enable the
company to provide reliable electrical service to customers in the area long into the future.
The transmission line will be on single -pole steel structures designed to operate two circuits at 230kV.
However, Idaho Power would initially operate one of these circuits at 138kV for connection to the
Meridian Energy Plant. As the area continues to develop both circuits would eventually operate at
230kV. The transmission line would also be constructed to provide for one distribution circuit
mounted beneath the transmission circuits.
The number of structures erected and their locations and spacing would depend on the selected route for
the project.
Line Route Alternatives •
Idaho Power has identified several alternate routes to provide 230kV service from the end of the
existing transmission line to Locust Substation:
• Alternative Route 1. This route is the most cost-effective for connection of Meridian Energy and
Locust Substation. It would be placed to accommodate planned improvements to Locust Grove Road in the
future. Because of this efficiency, the cost of this alternative is also the least expensive at
approximately $2.7 million.
• Alternative Route 2. This route travels through a less populated area, and is more costly than
Alternative 1 due to the additional line length and sharp angles in the line. The estimated cost for this
alternative is approximately $3.5 million.
• Alternative Route 3. This route follows planned corridors for future road widening
improvements, specifically along Eagle Road. It is not possible to continue this route north to McMillan
Road because existing transmission facilities along Mcmillan Road occupy the right-of-way. This route
and the connection to Meridian Energy is much longer than the previous alternatives, and thus the cost
is estimated at $3.4 million.
• Alternative 4. The above three routes were identified by Idaho Power Company. Any combination
of the above three alternatives or other alternatives identified by the public during the company's
public participation process will be added to the list of alternatives.
The Next Step
Idaho Power wants to consult and to work with representatives of local government, the business
community and concerned members of the public. Idaho Power fully intends to develop a project that
best meets the needs of the customers of the Meridian -West Boise area and the company.
OFFICIALS
WILLIAM G. BERG, JR., City Clerk
JANICE L. GASS, City Treasurer
GARY O. SMITH, P.E. City Engineer
BRUCE D. STUART, Water Works Supt.
JOHN T. SHAWCROFT, Waste Water Supt.
KENNY W. BOWERS, Fire Chief
W.L. "BILL" GORDON, Police Chief
WAYNE G. CROOKSTON, JR., Attorney
March 9, 1991
To: Max Yerrington
Walt Morrow
Ron Tolsma
• HUB OF TREASURE VALLEY
A Good Place to Live
CITY OF MERIDIAN
33 EAST IDAHO
MERIDIAN, IDAHO 83642
Phone (208) 888-4433 a FAX (208) 887-4813
Public Works/Building Department (208) 887-2211
GRANT P. KINGSFORD
Mayor
COUNCIL MEMBERS
RONALD R. TOLSMA
MAXYERRINGTON
ROBERT D. CORRIE
WALT W. MORROW
SHARI STILES
Planner & Zoning Administrator
JIM JOH NSON
Chairman - Planning 8 Zoning
Would you please make a motion at the next Council meeting to eliminate the Planning Director's
requirements on: 1. Englewood Subdivision
2. Saddle View Subdivision
3. Kentfield Manor Subdivision
to negotiate an agreement to furnish a lot for a future Fire Sub -Station. The Fire Department no
longer needs to look at these sites for a Sub -Station. Your vote on this would allow the City to
sign off on their final plats.
Thank OU for your help on this matter.
Robert D. Come '
cc: Mayor
Fire Chief
Shari Stiles
Wayne Crookston
City Clerk
March 3, 1994
Will Berg
City Clerk
Meridian, ID
Dear Mr. Berg,
My wife and I are currently working to open "The Playground". This
is a Project that will have a driving range, R,V, overnight camping,
36 holes of miniature golf, and batting cages.
In taking plans in for review it was stated that we must install water
main several hundred feet beyond where it is needed, As this will con-
stitute a considerable hardship I request the opportunity to petition
the city council to waive this requirement at the city council meeting
on 3-15-94. Please put us on the agenda for the meeting. Your assist-
ance is aonreciated.
sincerely,
Dr. Michael Clarke
PUBLIC MEETING SIGN-UP SHEET
NAME: PHONE NUMBER:
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