1978 03-13
Meridian Planning & Zoning
Planning and Zoning Commission meeting opened for workshop.
March 13, 1978
Members present: Lee Mitchell; Jim Kling; Annette Hinrichs; Don Sharp
Chairman, Willard Rowley absent
Presentation was given by APA Planner, Ray Hamilton.
The APA is after interaction to discuss problems in the community and
identification of the problem areas.
Planning and Zoning Question: What does the 120 day period mean on the
area of impact.
APA Answer: Has to be adopted by ordinance; must have a bearing if there
is a decrease in impact area and it has to be accomplished by
ordinance.
Survey: The intention was to show where Planning and Zoning attitudes stand
in relation to community attitudes, it was iiot.meant to be scientif-
ically precise but rather a general reflection.
APA: There was a representative sample Ray Hamilton would leave up to
Pat Joy to disprove. There was a good representative sample and a
good response rate, error was down from 5~ to 3% or less, it was not
pulled out of a hat. Worked with BSII on Survey, quality control and
wording of the questionaire. It was a self administering questionaire.
Self-administering questionaires are always more structured, could not
be open ended, because computer does not work like that.
Basically want to cover the various sections at this meeting, after
community viewpoint and how Planning and Zoning perceives the City
and its problems.
Problems, physical nature of area in terms of what problems do you
think you havey Example: Soil Conservation for analysis of area,
a detailed soil survey. There are some problem areas due to soils
that contain high water tables and soils that contain properties
of hard pan and bedrock.
Problems include the placement of water and sewer lines, dwellings and
Industrial centers.
Flood Plain has been recended by HUD. There is a copy of the letter,
Planning and Zoning had requested to be excluded.
Planning and Zoning Question: Is J-U-B Engineers supposed to give data oa
on these types of physical problems?
APA Answer: They will more than likely do a project by project detailed
analysis.
General: Carl E~.lsworth was supposed to be avaiable for this kind of analysis
but the City Council has not decided to pay for this sort of thing.
Mr. Ellsworth is supposed to be dropping in on meetings and help
out with this project.
Planning and Zoning should talk internally to decide what problem
areas are.
APA: Community Facilities - Example: Fire and Police protection
Have all the standards been met?
Do we have good police protection; has the
Chief of Police been in and requested various
things?
Planning and Zoning: Only on bike paths, concerned with patrolling them if
they were off streets. A possible problem is Motorcycles
using them to get away from police and endangering
pedestrians.
Meridian Planning and Zoning .2. March 13, 19'78
APA Question: Has the Police Chief mentioned other areas, is he up to strength?
Planning & Zoning Answer: Feeling is that he is working on that with the
City Council but has not talked to Planning and
Zoning per se
APA Question: How does the citizens feel - do they feel there is adequate
protection?
Planning and Zoning Answer: The Police Chief's report showed crime down
around 1']9~.
Fire protection - the City is close to getting some paid full
time people, it's going to be needed in the
near future.
School population is stable in Meridian at this time
In the future it is realized that there will have to be as
improvement in facilities; additional Police, Fire, Maintenance
and City Hall personnel and equipment.
APA: Category: Schools
Planning and Zoning: Needs for schools is going to increases; there will be
a need for new facilities. Problem is how to finance,
need for a system where new growth pays for increase in
new facilities.
General feeling in all service areas - new growth should pay
for a major portion of the expenses.
APA: Need to identify problems before policies can be developed
Planning and Zoning: Identification of problem with school growth is getting
the schools located in the proper places, land for
schools and financing.
APA: School locations and sites should be purchased in advance of growth.
General feeling: What about dedicating land
Federal dollars for financing?
Pat Joy Question: Can the Planning and Zoning require developers to dedicate
land?
Planning and Zoning Answer: Yes, but problem is who do you require it from?
If subdivision is X or Y size, how do you make
it fair to all the subdividers?
APA: What you are looking at is that if you have an area that you know is
going to develop to saturation and you are going to need an elementary
school, then in your general plan you can designate a general area.
You do not have to pinpoint rather, within this certain area if
development at X density on X acres. Accordinly so we can fullfil those
needs we need a site, developers will be willing to work with you.
It gets down to implimentation, developers can dedicate the site, or
give fees in lieu of a site, or you can work on policies that give
some flexibility in terms of giving developers a break by density
trade-offs. Example: Developers dedicate a part of or a full
school site, a portion of money instead. Maybe the developer should
be entitled to recoups some of the cost. The only way you can do that
without giving some property is to increase his allowable density,
give him a density trade-off. This concept can be used on more than
just school sites; Parks, Open space bike ways, etc. It is not an
all or take nothing situation. There are also land trades. Boise is
doing that now. There are also combined sites; schools and parka. The
cost is less prohibitive.
Planning and Zoning should come in with a functional plan, a detailed
facilities plan to include staging, phasing and then a capitol improve-
ment program; list priorities and put them on a one to five year basis,
list emplimentation and where financing is coming from.
Meridian. Planning and Zoning 3 March 13, 1978
APA (cont'd):
Need to avoid playing catch-up with lead time and lag time, when you
are playing catch-up you cannot plan.
F}nphasis on facilities plan and capitol improvement; facilities plan
differs from general plan - it is more specific. Another functional
plan would be parks and recreation; another is a detailed trans-
portation plan.
Need a logical progression of priorities as a City. Capital improve-
ment is a one year-five year plan on where you want to go, your goals
and objectives and their implimentation - plus what comes after that.
A year to year update so that you have a long range plan, as well as
a short range plan.
An additional thought is a Cost/Benefit Analysis of busing of school
children.
General: Discussed implication of busing school children and whose problem
it would be and if it could be effectively resolved by the
community.
APA: If there are costs paid by the community through tax dollars, more
afficieat siting could reduce energy consumption, capitol outlay for
operation and maintenance, personnel, etc.
General: A general plan is not specific-what follows will be the functional,
specific, plan to accomplish this. Someone will have to work with
the various service agencies of the City- Fire, Schools, Sewage,
Water, Police, etc. Each facility is a separate agency.
APA: What we are taling about is indirect benefits and costs. There are
savings if it is planned right. If it is not functional, feasible
and serves some kind of purpose, some benefit. The point is to plan
in advance for what needs arc - this highlights the need for specific
recommendations. This is why we need problem identification for
detailed plans. Example: Solid Waste - where is the land fill going
to be? Is there going to be incc~patible uses? What about long term
effects? Traffic patterns2
Planning and Zoning Question: How to get around exploding land costs for
future City service needs.
APA Answer: Purchase well in advance. Do not pinpoint any location but
specify general locations.
General: Discussion on land speculation, tax base, externalaties of public
good and economics of public choice, government decisions and
effect on business structure. Financing is the root of the problem.
APA: Other areas listed, libraries, sewer and water, parks and recreation.
Planning and Zoning Question: When does some service become adequate
verses frills.
APA: Other broad areas in terms of public facilities: public facilities
plan is lacking, equality and magnitude of public facilities.
Priority decisions will have to be made. Facilities should be
studied in more detail. Capitol improvement plan should be developed.
Problems anticipated with public growth.
Planning and Zoning Question: Has the planners set out criteria for priorities?
APA Answer: It 3s not the planners job to dictate what priorities are, our
job is to say these are what our priorities are. For example: Capitol
improvements; how do we do it, what is the best method for doing it.
Start to define it, what federal fiuiding is available, state grants or
funds timing for lining those things up to reduce lead time as much
as possible.
•
Meridian Planning and Zoning .4. March 13, 1978
APA: Another area, Aesthetics
General: Discussion: Don't go overboard, the City shouldn't have to design
or maintain, costs are prohibitive, niceties. bcample: Visual
quality, buffer zone, underground utility lines; depens on
perspective, developer does not have to do it if the City does not
require it. The City can foster that by incentive. Planning and
Zoning has no way of demanding which trees to leave.
Planning and Zoning Question: Other illustration of incentives
APA Answer: There are a lot of things. Some flexability in terms of
requirements, a relaxation of requirements or give something.
It is a trade-off, you give them something if they give so much
landscaping or they give a good design and we will relax X criteria
here.
Planning and Zoning Question: What would you give a industrial complex
E~:ample: Nahas
APA Answer: First, they do not have to pay for all of the trunk line going to
their complex. The City participates in part of the bill.
Seeond, another thing is the City pay for part of the cost of
streets that go in if they do X and Y.
Planning and Zoning:Question: We would be subsidizing them?
APA Answer: No, you are not number one, your tax base is up, your employment
base is up because of what your multiple ratio is that you gain
everything back. It depends on if you want them there and how
you want them there. How much is it going to cost them and
what are you willing to pay and where are you willing to make
the trade-offs.
Another thought is a potential problem with defining what is
Urban and Rural. Need specific standards as well as philosophical
intent. What is rural, what is urban if we can get it defined then
there will be less problems in the future.
Another area-solid waste management, what will the landfill of
the future Look like; will we use Ada County land fill; what
about the traffic patterns for the trucks.
Suggestion Committees come together and put ideas on paper.
Planning and Zoning: Draft a letter bringing all committees when have had
input, to Planning and Zoning, together to draft policy
statements; Need copies of proposed inputs from all
interested parties.
Draft letter to community interest groups.
Will turn things to Pat Joy to draft a letter to
Steve Gratton, Community Development Committee;
Bill Ames, Traffic Committee; Wally Lovan, Industrial
Committee; Optimist's; School Board; Senior Citizen's;
Meridian Ministerial Association; Agricultural
Committee through County Agent Doran Peterson; and
Chairman of the Dairy Board.
APA: Next meeting will have some policies
Planning and Zoning Question: What are the rest of the APA catagories?
APA Answer: Historical; Archaeological; Housing; Deteriorization;
mix; demand, vacancy rate; Growth - is Meridian influenced by
Boise market in terms of labor force and rapid growth rate;
transportation for circulation conflicts, i.e, traffic patterns
and grade crossing at railroads.
Would like Planning and Zoning to make a list. Other questions,
areas of concern and ideas to think about.
Meridian Planning and Zoning ,5, March 13, 1978
APA Answer (Cont'd)
Transportation, bicycle and pedestrian walkways, equestrian
network highways incompatible with certain uses - noise levels,
what about areas of transition.
Staging and road construction - is the grid system the best way
to go; do you need a road every mile; is it most efficient.
How about problems with resource or energy; orientation of
housing and future solar energy - are homes orientated North
and South. What about problems of through traffic patterns -
what about re-routing,
General: Discussion of effects of traffic flows.
APA: Are regulations adequate - are they in the ordinances, urban design,
functional and specific plan.
Planning and Zoning Question: Problem of how do you change present land
use patterns.
APA Answer: The market place will decide you cannot dictate but you can
give guidelines, this gives business stability for investment
because areas are designated for certain uses through zoning.
Would like Planning and Zoning to write down and identify
problems. APA will also list more areas at next meeting -
would also like input from City Council and other interested
groups to get abroad view paint.
Need input by next week to consolidate and coordinate responses.
Workshop meeting adjourned 10:10 P.M,
Planning and Zoning Commission
__
Attest: -' ~ ,
~ t ,~~a~~%' i.7Jl
i~ ATRICK , Actin~8ecretaxy
~~~
cc: Mayor & Council;P&Z Commission;Hein;Stuart;Schoen;
Ann;Welker;Shults;Fitzgerald;Hamilton;J-U-B
Minutes, C'~.p r a.h End i ua. ~'1 Matz.
_. _. / ~~~
j` 3-~~ 7d
March 20th Hearing before P & Z MAR 1 3 ~gjg
COMMENTS J
Conditional Use
Nourse's Third Addition
14 East Carlton
Request:
Formerly a Church, Now requesting by Mr. & Mra Edwon F. Jones to convert
to Office uee.
1. Fire Department:
Not recommending approval unless all remodelling is done in accordance
with Uniform Building and Fire & Live Saving Codes.
2. Mr. Howell and Mr. Laing, have indicated that they did not sign the Fetition.
3. Meridian Post Office:
No comment
4. Richard Williams:
The Senior Citizens have expressed a desire to secure uee of thin build-
ing for their facility. as you know they have nothing in Meridian.
would like to see this property used by them and not for office.
5. Nampa Meridian Irrigation District:
The developer should submit a drainage plan to them for approval
Aerald J, Cox
City Clerk
Sec. of P. & Z.
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