2022-11-17 Meridian Planning and Zoning Meeting November 17, 2022.
Meeting of the Meridian Planning and Zoning Commission of November 17, 2022, was
called to order at 6:03 p.m. by Chairman Andrew Seal.
Members Present: Chairman Andrew Seal, Commissioner Patrick Grace, Commissioner
Maria Lorcher, and Commissioner Mandi Stoddard.
Members Absent: Commissioner Steven Yearsley and Commissioner Nate Wheeler.
Others Present: Joy Hall, Kurt Starman, Bill Parsons, Sonya Alan, Joe Dodson, and Dean
Willis.
ROLL-CALL ATTENDANCE
Nate Wheeler X Maria Lorcher
_X Mandi Stoddard (Vacant)
Steven Yearsley X Patrick Grace
X Andrew Seal - Chairman
Seal: All right. Good evening, everybody. Welcome to the Planning and Zoning
Commission meeting for November 17th, 2022, and at this time I would like to call the
meeting to order. The Commissioners who are present for this evening's meeting are at
City Hall and on Zoom. We also have staff -- we also have staff from the city attorney
and clerk's offices, as well as the City Planning Department. If you are joining us on Zoom
this evening we can see that you are here. You may observe the meeting. However,
your ability to be seen on screen and talk will be muted. During the public testimony
portion of the meeting you will be unmuted and, then, be able to comment. Please note
that we cannot take questions until the public testimony portion. If you have a process
question during the meeting, please e-mail cityclerk@meridiancity.org and they will reply
as quickly as possible. If you simply want to watch the meeting, we encourage you to
watch the streaming on the city's YouTube channel. You can access that at
meridiancity.org/live. We are getting a feedback. All right. And away we go again. With
that let's begin with the roll call. Madam Clerk.
ADOPTION OF AGENDA
Seal: Okay. The first item on the agenda is the adoption of the agenda. There are no
modifications, so can I get a motion to adopt the agenda as presented?
Lorcher: So moved.
Grace: Second.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 2 of 34
Seal: It's been moved and seconded to adopt the agenda. All in favor say aye. Okay.
No opposed. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. TWO ABSENT.
CONSENT AGENDA [Action Item]
1. Approve Minutes from the 11-3-2022 Planning & Zoning Meeting
Seal: Next item on the agenda is the Consent Agenda and we have one item on the
Consent Agenda, which is to approve the minutes of the November 3rd, 2022, Planning
and Zoning Commission meeting. Can I get a motion to accept the Consent Agenda as
presented?
Grace: So moved.
Lorcher: Second.
Seal: It's been moved and seconded to --
Stoddard: Second.
Seal: -- moved and seconded to adopt the Consent Agenda. All in favor say aye. No
opposed. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. TWO ABSENT.
Seal: At this time I would like to explain the public hearing process. We will open each
item individually and begin with the staff report. Staff will report their findings on how the
item adheres to our Comprehensive Plan and Unified Development Code. After staff has
made their presentation the applicant will come forward to present their case and respond
to staff comments. They will have 15 minutes to do so. After the applicant is finished we
will open the floor to public testimony. Each person will be called on only once during the
public testimony. The Clerk will call the names individually of those who have signed up
on our website in advance to testify. They will, then, be unmuted in Zoom or you can
come to the microphones in Chambers. Please state your name and address for the
record and you will have three minutes to address the Commission. If you have previously
sent pictures or a presentation for the meeting, it will be displayed on the screen and you
or the Clerk will run the present -- presentation. If you have established that you are
speaking on behalf of a larger group, like an HOA, where others from that group will allow
you to speak on their behalf, you will have up to ten minutes. After all those who have
signed up in advance have spoken we will invite any others who may wish to testify. If
you wish to speak on this topic you may come forward in Chambers or if on Zoom press
the raise hand button in the Zoom app or if you are listening on a phone, please, press
star nine and wait for your name to be called. If you are listening on multiple devices,
such as a computer and a phone, please, be sure to mute the extra devices so we do not
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 3 of 34
experience feedback and we can hear you clearly. When you are finished the
Commission -- if the Commission does not have questions for you, you will return to your
seat in Chambers or be muted on Zoom and no longer have the ability to speak. And
please remember we will not call on you a second time. After all testimony has been
heard, the applicant will be given another ten minutes to come back and respond. When
the applicant is finished responding to questions and concerns, we will close the public
hearing and the Commissioners will have the opportunity to discuss and hopefully be able
to make final decisions or recommendations to City Council as needed.
ACTION ITEMS
2. Public Hearing for Sessions Parkway (H-2022-0046) by KM
Engineering, LLP. located at 2700 N. Eagle Rd.
A. Request: Development Agreement Modification on the existing
Development Agreement (Inst.#104129529) to remove the subject
property from the agreement in order to enter into a new
Development Agreement for the proposed project.
B. Request: Preliminary Plat consisting of 5 building lots on 5.32 acres
of land in the C-G zoning district with a request for City Council
approval of an access via N. Eagle Rd./SH-55.
Seal: So, at this time I would like to open the public hearing for Item No. H-2022-0046,
for Sessions Parkway and we will begin with the staff report.
Allen: Thank you, Mr. Chair, Members of the Commission. The first application before
you tonight is Sessions Parkway. It's a request for a development agreement
modification. This application does not require Commission action. City Council is the
decision-making body. And a preliminary plat. The preliminary plat is what's before you
tonight. This site consists of 5.32 acres of land. It's zoned C-G and is located at 2700
North Eagle Road. This property was annexed back in 2003 with a development
agreement, which was later amended in 2017. The Comprehensive Plan future land use
map designation is mixed-use regional. The applicant is requesting approval of a
preliminary plat, consisting of five commercial building lots on 5.32 acres of land in the C-
G zoning district with a request for City Council approval of a right-in, right-out driveway
access via North Eagle Road and State Highway 55. Approval of the preliminary plan is
contingent upon City Council's approval of the concurrent development agreement
modification application. One driveway access is proposed at the northern boundary,
which will serve as a backage road along Eagle Road and will connect to the property to
the south. The jog in the roadway will result in traffic calming and reduced speeds, which
is desired, especially if the access via Eagle Road is approved, which will intersect the
backage road. Two driveways to the east are proposed for interconnectivity with the
future residential development. ITD has issued a letter of acceptance of the revised traffic
striping conceptual drawings. Final approval of the proposed access and associated
improvements will be determined once all documentation have been provided and the
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 4 of 34
permit is signed. A 35 foot wide street buffer is proposed along North Eagle Road, State
Highway 55, with a ten foot wide multi-use pathway in accord with the Pathways Master
Plan. Decorative pedestrian lighting is also required along the pathway. A 25 foot wide
buffer is required on the subject property along the eastern boundary adjacent to future
residential uses with lot development. Written testimony has been received from the
applicant's representative Givens Pursley. They are requesting removal of all four
changes to the concept plan recommended by staff in Section 8 of the Staff Report, A-1-
A. Staff is recommending approval of the proposed preliminary plat contingent upon
compliance with the development agreement provisions and conditions of approval in the
staff report. Staff will stand for any questions.
Seal: Thank you, Sonya. Would the applicant like to come forward? Good evening.
Hopkins: Thank you. Good evening, Mr. Chair, Members of the Commission. I have a
presentation I think Sonya is going to bring up.
Seal: And we will need your name and address for the record and the floor is all yours.
Hopkins: Stephanie Hopkins with KM Engineering. 5725 North Discovery Way in Boise.
I'm here super excited to represent our client and the developer for Sessions Parkway.
We have been working on this project for a few years now on various components and
we are really excited to be showing you the preliminary plat, as well as discussing the
development agreement modification we will be requesting from City Council and an
access -- right-in, right-out access to State Highway 55 or Eagle Road. So, just to get
you situated -- and, actually, a little bit of history on this project. It was originally annexed
into the city in 2003 as part of Red Feather Estates, which is located to the southeast as
you can see on the map here. In 2015 additional property was annexed and zoned and
a conditional use permit was also approved for multi-family use. That is the DA that's
current on the property now and what we are requesting to modify with City Council. We
also did a property boundary adjustment for this property in 2020 that created the current
configuration that you see here. So, Sessions Parkway is about 5.3 acres and it's outlined
in yellow. We are surrounded by existing development, most of which to the east is
residential in nature. So, there is some multi-family to -- directly east and that was -- it's
currently under development and under this -- the same development company that's
working on this project. There is retail and professional service uses to the north.
Regency at River Valley, which is a multi-family development to the south. The Village,
which has a variety of commercial and non-retail uses. There is some professional offices
and other types of uses in -- in the development there. And, then, there is a county land,
as well as State Highway 55 or Eagle Road to our west. Kleiner Park is also a large
regional draw. Pretty great civic use that has a variety of pathways and playgrounds and
places for people to recreate. It's quite large, so -- this is the preliminary plat that we are
asking for your approval on this evening, comprised of five lots, range in size from about
36,000 square feet to 63,000 square feet. Cross-access will be granted internally to each
of the lots and we are planning on connecting to Copper -- Copper Canary, which is to
the south. They recently came through with a development agreement modification
sometime last year and we will comply with whatever they decide to do with their backage
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 5 of 34
road that goes through their property. So, as part of our preliminary plat we will provide
25 feet of landscaping to the adjacent residential use, The Village apartments to our east,
and we will be integrating the site with vehicular and pedestrian connectivity as I will show
later. So, as part of this application to City Council we will be requesting a right-in, right-
out location -- or an access point to Eagle Road, which is shown on our south boundary
through that private driveway. This is something we have been coordinating with ITD for
the past couple of years. They have approved a conceptual striping plan and recently we
were coordinating with them and they said that, you know, this is conceptually approved,
we just need to submit the formal permitting once construction plans are finalized and we
are kind of further along in the process. So, we have also -- our clients have been
coordinating with the Copper Canary property a fair amount on this access point. I know
the city's been talking with that property as well as us for a while on consolidating the
access points that are currently used to our north and south. So, this is the existing
concept plan that's in the development agreement that we will be asking to modify. It
shows four different pad sites, which were associated with four lots. We have changed
the concept plan to be more consistent with the lots that we are now requesting, which
are five, as well as different vision for the property. So, along with our development
agreement we are asking for two conceptual plans to be attached. We are -- both concept
plans include a convenience store, which is at the northwest corner of the site and the
first concept shows a drive-through, which will be at the southwest corner. The first
concept shows three building pads of different sizes on three different lots and the second
-- this is just a -- a rendering to kind of give you an idea of how it would be landscaped.
Pedestrian connectivity would be provided on the north, south, and the ten foot multi-use
pathway on the west side adjacent to Eagle Road. There would also be some plaza
spaces that are on the south side, kind of along here. If you can see my cursor. And this
would provide a -- a nice central area for folks within this entire region to hang out,
especially if they are coming over from Kleiner Park to access maybe a convenience store
or get to some of the other commercial uses that are in this area. This is our second
concept plan, which includes the convenience store, as well as the drive through. This
one shows a hotel concept, which would go across the three property lines and if this was
the concept that was going to be pursued we would just do a property boundary
adjustment to consolidate those lines to make sure it wouldn't be an issue for building
code stuff and this also shows the plaza spaces on the south side, as well as pedestrian
connectivity throughout. I will show you a couple of exhibits later that kind of highlight the
pedestrian connectivity to make it a little bit clearer, too. And, then, a rendering -- so, you
can see how nicely landscaped it will be. It will be really consistent with what's in the area
as far as the ten foot multi-use pathway and we will provide a nice -- kind of a -- a last
puzzle piece for this area, because it's really an in-fill spot that's been undeveloped for
quite some time, so -- so, this is the city's future land use map that's associated with the
Comprehensive Plan. The area in brown is mixed-use regional and that's the land use
that's designated and kind of guides how the property develops in the future. East of
Eagle Road between Ustick and Fairview -- so, it's kind of like an L-shape here is about
150 acres. So, our site is about five acres. It's a pretty small percentage of the overall
land use for this area, most of which has already been developed with some civic uses
or commercial uses, as well as some professional uses in the -- The Village apartment --
or The Village shopping center. And, then, there are grocery and kind of some
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 6 of 34
professional and retail uses to the north, as well as the multi-family that we kind of talked
about earlier. This is a pedestrian connectivity exhibit to show you exactly how much
pedestrian connections this development will be providing. So, The Village apartments
are located on the east side here. Quite a few pedestrian connections throughout that
development and we will be marrying the two projects together by bringing kind of the
east-west connections through and, really, it will provide -- if you can -- I look at Kleiner
Park -- if you go further west you can take a variety of paths up north and if you wanted
to access maybe this drive-through restaurant there would be a few different options to
get over there. So, we felt that this would really show kind of how this project will help to
bridge that gap and -- and contribute to the overall kind of open space and pedestrian
connectivity here. So, this is the proposed access to State Highway 55. As Sonya
mentioned, you won't be making a recommendation on this tonight, but it is important I
think to this project, because it's going to be an integral part of how the -- the site is
accessed. It's also going to help alleviate a lot of issues, I guess, that would --that already
exist on Eagle Road. So, I think we are all familiar with Eagle Road. It's a road that's
supposed to be a pretty high traffic volume and fast pace, but there are a lot of access
points and so this project would consolidate four of those existing access points, the
Copper Canary's property here, this access point was supposed to be temporary. So,
with this -- the access point that we are proposing here as a right-in, right-out that would
eliminate these four access points and really create a more consolidated place for cars
to safely enter and exit. So, we are in agreement with the majority of the staff report and
appreciate their analysis and all the coordination that they have helped us on through this
project. But there are a few conditions that will be associated with the development
agreement that we would like to request modification of. So, we -- our counsel submitted
some -- a memo basically outlining these -- these conditions and how we would like to
change them and I just want to go through it quickly, so that we can kind of cover that.
The first one is the first condition under the development agreement conditions and it's to
depict nonretail, commercial, office or civic uses for a minimum of 50 percent of the
development area on Exhibit X1.0, which is the first concept plan that showed the three
buildings on the east side, unless Commission or Council finds that this isn't applicable,
because this property is part of a larger mixed-use regional designated area. This doesn't
apply if their property develops with the hotel as proposed in Exhibit 2. So, in order to
afford flexibility for our client, we really would like to modify this condition -- or remove this
condition, because we do feel that given the size of the property, which is about five acres,
in the overall scheme of the mixed-use regional land use it's a pretty small piece and we
feel that the intent of the mixed-use regional zone has been fulfilled with all of the other
uses that we have kind of talked about. So, the civic that's Kleiner Park, the commercial
uses in The Village, as well as to the north and, then, you know, some of the professional
service uses that are available to the north, as well as to the south, as well as the multi-
family residential properties and, then, a variety of single family residential properties as
well within this kind of mixed-use regional zone. And the second one was related to
specific details for the integrated plaza slash open space area shall be provided with a
first certificate of zoning compliance. The applicant can relocate open space plaza areas
depicted on the plan with director approval once specific tenants are known. We request
to keep the plaza areas as we have shown on the south part of the site and this is really
so that we kind of know what to expect for folks and, additionally, we -- we would prefer
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 7 of 34
that these not be associated with the first certificate of zoning compliance. It's pretty
limiting depending on who comes in first and if it's not contiguous with whichever property
comes in first it would be hard to --to make that happen. So, that's how we are proposing
to modify that condition. And the third condition was on concept plan one, labeled as
X1.0. Again, that's the first concept with the three buildings on the east side. Some or all
of the buildings along the eastern boundary should be rotated and/or relocated in a shared
plaza area or green space area added to a more central location within the development
for better integration, including a central pathway connection to the open space and front
pad sites. We request to keep this building alignment as shown for concept one with the
plaza spaces and open spaces on the south. This will really afford more flexibility for
future tenants and will allow them to configure the buildings in whatever way they would
like to within the building pads, as long as they meet the setbacks and dimensional
standards for the C-G zone and would provide a nice buffer for residential uses to the
east from the future commercial that will be located there, as well as Eagle Road. We
also feel that this building alignment will provide better visibility for commercial users from
Eagle Road, which is important for the viability of their businesses and to make sure that
they are contributing to the economy here, so -- and the fourth one is -- if the site develops
with concept plan two, which is labeled as X2.0, the applicant shall construct a five foot
sidewalk on the east boundary and provide a decorative crosswalk across the drive aisle
of the multi-family portion of the development to enhance pedestrian connectivity. We
request that that sidewalk remain as depicted on the concept plan, which I will bring up.
We believe that the additional pathway along the east boundary will be redundant,
because there are already several options between and through The Village apartments.
We don't think that this pathway would benefit anyone that would be using the hotel or
the commercial properties and think that it would just be an unused pathway essentially.
So, prefer to keep the pathway directly adjacent to the hotel, so those folks can use it and
easily access shopping and other services to the north and south. We do agree, though
-- I -- I think staff had written that they wanted a connection right down here to The Village
apartments and we agree to do that connection. We think that makes a lot of sense and
we will follow code requirements as far as special pavement or differentiating it from the
pavement. So, as I mentioned, we are really excited for this project and it's been a long
time coming and I think, you know, having two concept plans attached to this development
agreement will provide our client the flexibility that's needed to really make it a successful
project. It fulfills a lot of the city's goals and I think it will be a wonderful addition to
Meridian. So, excited for it and I will stand for questions if you have any. Our development
team is here as well. Our client and counsel if you have questions for them they can
come up and answer those.
Seal: Okay. Thank you very much.
Hopkins: Thank you.
Seal: Commissioners, do we have any questions for applicant or staff? None? All right.
Thank you very much.
Hopkins: Thank you.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 8 of 34
Seal: We will get back to you after the public testimony.
Hopkins: Okay.
Seal: Madam Clerk, do we have anybody signed up? Okay.
Hall: We have a Leo Bertz. No? So, don't see anybody else wanting to come up and
testify at all? Do we have anybody online?
Starman: Mr. Chairman? Not to testify, but may I just add a piece of clarification --
Seal: Absolutely.
Starman: -- for the Commission in particular. So, this is one of these hybrid applications
where we are -- and you saw from the presentation this evening, particular from the
applicant, where a lot of discussion relative to the proposed modification to the
development agreement and, then, we also have the topic as part of the application is the
preliminary plat and so this is one of those odd types of applications in the -- in our Unified
Development Code where it talks about the responsibilities of the Commission, vis-a-vis
the department director, vis-a-vis the City Council. The Commission is tasked as a
recommending body relative to the preliminary plat, but with respect to the proposed
modification to the development agreement, the recommending body, so to speak, is the
community development director, not the Commission. So, even though you heard a lot
of testimony about the proposed modifications to the development agreement, that's
really not directly within your purview. So, just I wanted to sort of clarify that piece. But I
would also say it may be difficult to talk about one without the other and so I don't want
you to feel artificially constrained and if you need to talk about the bigger picture to
understand, you know, the preliminary plat better, I think that's all fair game. But I just
wanted the Commission to be aware that, really, in terms of -- from the code perspective
your recommendation is specific to the preliminary plat. That all make sense? Okay.
Seal: Thank you very much. Appreciate the clarification on that. Nobody else wants to
come up and testify? I was going to say would the applicant like to add anything or close
with anything? Okay. With them signifying no, can I get a -- a motion to close the public
testimony?
Grace: Mr. Chairman, I would move to close the public testimony.
Lorcher: Second.
Seal: It's been moved to close public testimony for File No. H-2022-0046. All in favor
say aye. No opposed. Motion carries. The public hearing is closed.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. TWO ABSENT.
Seal: Who would like to go first?
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 9 of 34
Lorcher: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Commissioner Lorcher, go ahead.
Lorcher: So, based on City Council in regard to our goal tonight, the way the buildings
are situated and the open space and all that, that's the develop -- that's the development
agreement; correct? We are really talking about whether or not this is designed for mixed-
use regional or-- or retail -- or retail or general commercial; correct? Based on where the
buildings are.
Starman: Mr. Chairman and Commissioner Lorcher, like I said, it may be difficult to break
those things apart, the preliminary plat, which is within your purview as a recommending
body, vis-a-vis proposed change to the development agreement. But, really, the issue
before you is a preliminary plat and maybe staff can -- our planning staff can put that back
-- that slide up. Do you have a slide that just shows the preliminary plat? Yeah. So,
really, this -- this is -- if you wanted to kind of zero in like what precisely is your
recommendation, it's relative to the preliminary plat that's on your screen now in the
Chambers here. Your recommendation is relative to the preliminary plat before you, but
to the extent you need to talk about the bigger picture of the concept plans that you saw
and how it might relate to this topic, I think that's fair game.
Lorcher: Okay. Well, with that being said, I mean to put in a mixed-use, I'm a little
concerned about convenience store with the high traffic off of Eagle Road. I'm trying to
think if there is anything else like that right there, but because of the right-in and right-out,
I don't know how much use the convenience store would get because it would be
challenging to get in and out of there. Is there a gas station proposed with it as well? So,
a gas station as well. And, then, some kind of drive-through, which we have plenty along
Eagle Road. I -- I guess, you know, without getting into the weeds, you know, the City
Council may -- or the city planners made recommendations as far as how the buildings
should be situated for the developmental -- development agreement, which should be
followed. But if we are just talking about our recommendation of whether or not this
should be a drive-through, a convenience store, and some stores, I guess I would like to
hear from you who have had more experience with this and whether this would be in the
best interest of the city.
Seal: Well, I will kind of go about it a little different way. I mean looking at the -- at the
plat -- I mean, you know, you are looking at a bunch of squares, you know, or -- or odd
shapes on a -- on a map, then, basically anything that can go there that would fix -- you
know, fit mixed-use residential, so -- or mixed-use basically. So, with that I mean it is
difficult not to get into the weeds a little bit on the DA plan, so -- on the DA modification
and -- I mean the -- the one thing that I will say is the -- the hotel-motel, that seems to fit
a lot better. For me if it fits a lot better mainly because with the residential all being lined
up creates that wall effect, which is hideous. So, it's not -- to me that is just a -- it creates
a dead space behind the -- the commercial use buildings with the apartments. It's hard
to see back there. You know, that -- that in and of itself is -- is a concern for me with that.
That also affects, you know, obviously, the layout of the preliminary plat, because if you
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 10 of 34
do turn the building sideways, then, you know, is this plat well adjusted for that? I don't
know the answer to that. Not a -- I'm not that kind of engineer. So, I mean there are --
that's -- that's the biggest concern that I have with it as the preliminary plat and the DA
modification kind of come together, so -- I mean the others -- you know, other than that I
have no big issues with that. I know there has been a lot of work done with ITD in order
to get, you know, the right-in, right-out in order to get the access points created as they
are. The property to the south has been, you know, through here before. You know, we
have had a lot of conversations about this piece of property. So, in all I'm happy to see it
develop. You know, I mean to me this is an in-fill project for sure. That said, you know, I
think either the -- the hotel or turn the building sideways has been recommended by staff,
would be in your best interest for sure in order to make sure this fits correctly and is, you
know, of good use for the community. As far as the -- some of the other things that have
been in there -- I mean I -- I understand this is a small piece of a larger piece of mixed-
use. That said, I -- I like properties to stand on their own. I -- I always use the example
of we have developers that come in and say, well, I -- we don't have -- need to have as
much common space, because, well, there is a school next door to us, you know, without
making any kind of contribution to the school at all. You really can't rely on your neighbors
in order to fill in what you are supposed to be doing. That's the way it has been. That's
the way it should be. So, I'm not going to rely on my neighbor to augment my goals. So,
I -- you know. And that's just a recommendation as you go to City Council. I'm sure they
will -- I can't speak for any of them, but, you know, I watch their meetings every week, so
fairly certain that that's going to come up. Does that help, Commissioner Lorcher? I
mean it's, essentially, that's, you know, how I'm tying it all together is it is difficult to not
tie in everything from the DA mod, but it is -- you know, it's not in our purview in order to
recommend approval for that. So, City Council does listen to what we have to say
sometimes, so that's the recommendations that I would give is either go with the hotel
plan or turn the buildings and, then, you know, reconfigure some of that public space --
or open space that's out there in order to fit in with the recommendation that Sonya has
made. We can't tell you how to design your property, we can just tell you what might work
and what might not and, then, it's up to you to design it.
Grace: Mr. Chair, I don't -- I don't have a whole lot more to add. I -- other than I really
would echo your recommendation that the -- I guess of the two options I really like the
idea of the hotel as well, to the extent that that carries any weight with City Council that
would be my recommendation. I like some of the things I see. I -- I like the -- the
abandonment of some of the -- some of the access points into one. That's a -- I think
that's a positive. I did have a question similar to maybe Commissioner Lorcher whereby,
yeah, the folks going northbound I guess on Eagle, it's -- it's an easy access. The folks
coming south -- southbound -- I guess they would have to go Ustick and, then, around
like that other parallel road escapes me at the moment, but-- and, then, come in the other
way. Or go in through The Village. So, yeah, the convenience store doesn't bother me
per se, other than if it's -- if it's only accessible one way I guess that could be -- you -- you
could ask, you know, the value of it, so -- so, not -- not a whole lot to add, but just --just
some comments, hopefully, for consideration for City Council or others.
Seal: Okay. Commissioner Lorcher, go ahead.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 11 of 34
Stoddard: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Yes, go right ahead, Commissioner Stoddard.
Stoddard: Yeah. I just wanted to kind of echo the same exact stuff. You know, I'm -- I'm
really happy to see the consolidated access points. I'm really glad to see it being
developed. I think that's great. Same -- I -- I don't mind the convenience store at all and
I definitely agree also that -- that I think a hotel in that space would be nice, especially
with the subdivision, you know, behind it. I think it would just kind of be a nice transition
there and so -- anyway, I just kind of have the same kind of thoughts and feelings.
Seal: Okay. Thank you. Appreciate that.
Stoddard: Uh-huh.
Lorcher: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Commissioner Lorcher, go ahead.
Lorcher: Sonya, with -- do we have to add anything into our approval as far as
modifications are concerned or is it as is? Do we need to add anything in or --
Seal: I think -- and that question probably stems from the -- the modifications that Sonya
has in the staff report really are not related to the preliminary plat.
Lorcher: Oh.
Seal: So, I think that the recommendations that we give are on the preliminary plat, albeit
you can include a recommendation in a motion, so --
Lorcher: All right. Mr. Chair?
Seal: Go right ahead.
Lorcher: After considering all staff, applicant, and public testimony, I move to approve to
City Council File No. H-2022-0046 as presented in the staff report for the hearing date of
November 17th, 2022.
Grace: Second.
Seal: It's been moved and seconded to approve Item No. H-2022-0046 with no
modifications. All in favor say aye. No opposed? Motion passes. Thank you very much.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. TWO ABSENT.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 12 of 34
3. Public Hearing for Centrepoint Apartments (H-2022-0072) by MGM
Meridian, LLC., located at 3100 N. Centrepointe Way, near the
southwest corner of N. Eagle and E. Ustick Rds.
A. Request: Conditional Use Permit for 213 multi-family residential units
on approximately 10 acres in the C-G zoning district.
Seal: All right. At this time I would like to open File No. H-2022-0072, Centrepoint
Apartments, and we will begin with the staff report.
Dodson: Mr. Chair, just give me one second, so I can pull up the applicant's -- so we are
ready for that when we get there.
Seal: Sorry. Time's up. We are continuing it.
Dodson: It's okay to be mean tonight. That's --
Seal: I was going to say, I don't get a lot of opportunity to be mean to you, so I got to take
advantage of it.
Dodson: Sounds good.
Seal: Thanks, Joe.
Dodson: All right. Now we are back. Here we go. So, my first item tonight as noted is
for Centrepoint Apartments. The application before the Commission tonight is for a
conditional use permit for 213 multi-family units on approximately ten acres in the C-G
zoning district. The application encompasses one of two parcels that surround the hard
corner -- the southwest corner of Eagle and Ustick Roads. These parcels were part of a
development agreement modification and CUP in 2019 that removed the subject parcels
from existing DA to enter into a new DA to obtain approval for a new athletic club and
spa, which code calls an indoor recreation facility, and that was known as Villasport. The
CUP approval for that has expired and the property has been sold to the current owner.
Earlier this year the applicant did receive a new DA modification. 2022-0035 was
approved the end of July, approximately. To enter into a new agreement with a concept
plan depicting multi-family residential on the ten acre piece and commercial space on the
smaller one acre piece that's directly along Eagle Road that is not part of the CUP. You
can see it vaguely here in the bottom right. The subject CUP is the next step in
establishing the approved use and concept plan and the submitted site plan elevations
are substantially consistent with the concept plan within the DA. Through the recent DA
modification staff found that the proposed project and additional multi-family units to be
generally consistent with the mixed use regional designation, because this subject area
is-- consists of several retail, restaurant, office and residential uses available to the region
and the addition of these units would not over-saturate this area with residential. The
main points of discussion through that MDA process regarding traffic, parking, and the
proposed building heights -- I just lost my place. I'm sorry. There we go. The applicant
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 13 of 34
did an abbreviated traffic study to obtain updated traffic generation counts. ACHD did not
require a full traffic impact study, because the proposed project generates less than 40
percent of the anticipated vehicle trips from the previously approved Villasport site. So,
that one anticipated about 3,200 trips. This one anticipates less, about 1,250 trips. This
is a significant reduction of vehicle trips for the adjacent local streets and the private street
to the southeast, as well as the intersection of Eagle and Ustick. In addition, parking for
the units was heavily discussed by the City Council. City Council required that each area
of the project to be self parked, so that residents would not have to cross any drive aisle
or cross Centrepoint Way to get to their assigned parking space. So, it's kind of broken
into three pieces. You have the west side -- west of Centrepoint Way, three here that had
to be self parked. The central section had to be self parked. And, then, this area had to
be self parked. Through -- sorry. This -- this parking issue coincided with the originally
proposed building heights of four stories for the three largest buildings in the center.
Through the public hearing process the applicant reduced the building height of those
three buildings to three stories and proposed a new two-story building along the west
boundary. Following the changes to the building height, which reduced the unit count,
the applicant was able to self park each area of the site as directed by City Council. The
submitted site planning continues compliance with the DA provisions from the Council.
The submitted plan to show compliance with all dimensional and specific use standards,
including, but not limited to, building height, setbacks, access and the required parking.
Access for this development is proposed via a shared drive aisle connection to Ustick,
which is this here. It's an unnamed -- it connects to Cajun Lane, so everybody just keeps
calling it Cajun Lane, but technically it's unnamed, just to be specific there. It is also --
access is also via a public street connection to Centrepoint Way. So, Centrepoint Way is
here. Both Centrepoint Way and the drive aisle are existing today. Specific to the
proposed apartment buildings access is proposed via drive aisle connections to
Centrepoint Way and the drive aisle on the east side. So, there is three connections to
Centrepoint Way. Through here crossing each other. One here. On the east side you
have the access here. And, then, these access points here. The shared drive aisle, like
I noted, does connect to North Cajun Lane to the south, which is a private street. It
connects from Ustick through Jackson Square to the south and, then, out to Eagle Road.
This drive aisle was previously acquired with the previous Villasport approvals and the
Wadsworth site that's on the hard corner for cross-access and interconnectivity to and
from Ustick. In addition, the Bienville Square plat, which is the plat to the south, requires
cross-access that depicts it on the plat over Cajon Lane and out to Eagle Road from this
site, which furthers that there was anticipation that traffic -- some form of traffic would flow
from this project to the south and out to Eagle Road. North Centrepoint Way is an existing
local street that connects the Bienville Square Subdivision, which is known as Jackson
Square, to this site and to Ustick Road via that public road. It is signalized at the
intersection of Centrepoint and Ustick. Since publication of the staff report ACHD did
issue their final staff report and is not requiring any additional road improvements for the
proposed project due to the reduction in anticipated vehicle trips from this site. So, the
two things that they required previously was, quote, unquote, Cajun Lane to be
constructed, a right-hand deceleration lane to be constructed here, which has been
constructed already. That was the requirements at the time. This applicant is proposing
to widen Centrepoint Way here to help -- and stripe this area for a right-hand turn lane
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 14 of 34
and a center and through lane here. So, should -- that was discussed at Council, not
required, but it was proposed by the applicant and it should help the -- any traffic
movements in that area. According to the site plan, the applicant is proposing 449
spaces, with 205 of them to be covered by a carport or located within a garage. Twelve
spaces are in attached garages for the buildings D and E and they are tuck under
garages. Six on each building. Code would require 380 parking spaces, with 189
covered. Therefore, the applicant is proposing parking well in excess of code. In addition,
as noted the DA requires that each section of the site is self parked and the applicant has
complied with that as well. The applicant is proposing to complete the arterial sidewalk
along Ustick and proposes multiple micro paths throughout the site for added -- added
pedestrian connectivity. Staff supports the proposed sidewalk and pathway network,
except for the lack of connectivity at the very southern -- at the southeast corner of the --
where the southern micro path does not connect anywhere. So, this area right around
here. There is no internal connection to this micro path from inside the site and it also
does not connect to any sidewalk along the shared drive aisle, because there is just not
enough room right here to add a sidewalk. So, there is minimal opportunity to access this
desirable micro path within the site. Therefore, staff is recommending a loss of one
parking space around this planter island. I don't really care which side, just somewhere
in there, and, then, add another sidewalk connection to the north, so that it can cross this
drive aisle -- cross this drive aisle and connect to the sidewalk there to have another
access point from inside the site. The proposed landscaping complies with all UDC
requirements. In addition, the applicant is depicting dense vegetation that exceeds code
requirements within the south and west buffers, with some of the proposed trees -- trees
to be evergreen variety for year around screening. Specifically the buffer along the south
and west boundary is 25 feet wide. Code would only require ten feet, so that the applicant
is required -- proposing a much bigger buffer than would be required. In -- prior to the
hearing there were two pieces of public testimony, both from neighbors. Mr. Steve Grant.
He had questions about the continuation of a brick wall or a CMU wall along the west
boundary and also noted traffic concerns with Centrepoint Way. Specifically asked about
would it be striped for the right-hand turn lane, et cetera. And, then, Mr. Schofield, who
lives to the west and abuts the shared property boundary on that side, had concerns over
the two-story building looking into his backyard, as well as the wall along the boundary
as well. The applicant is proposing to continue the wall along the west boundary as
required with the development agreement. Staff did recommend approval as the project
complies with UDC requirements, as well as the DA, with just some conditions of approval
regarding some minor things. Other than that staff will stand for any questions.
Seal: Thank you very much. Would the applicant like to come forward? Good evening.
Just need your name and address for the record and the floor is yours.
Koeckeritz: Good evening. My name is Elizabeth Koeckeritz. I am with Givens Pursley
and I'm here on behalf of the applicant MGM Meridian, LLC. Mike Mafia with MGM will
be presenting with me and other representatives of the applicant are here and available
to answer questions, including our architect Trevor Schur, who is with BIDE, and our civil
engineer Brandon McDougald, who is with Kimley Horn are here with me today. And we
also really want to thank Joe for all of his help here on this. He has really helped us figure
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 15 of 34
out and massage this over the months to try to get a plan that's really going to work well
for everyone and we also want to say congrats on your last public hearing here. Okay.
So, moving on. Okay. We are proposing -- just to give you a little bit more of a
background, we are proposing to develop the Centrepoint mixed-use project. It's
approximately -- the overall parcel is 11 acres and it's near the intersection of Ustick and
Eagle Roads. It is an in-fill site. There has already been approved for a drive-through on
the commercial portion. The corner is also developing with a commercial use and, then,
south along Eagle is additionally a commercial use. We are only here tonight for the CUP
for the multi-family portion of the development. As mentioned, the property is designated
mixed-use regional on the FLUM, which calls for the mix of employment, retail and
residential uses, with residential densities ranging between six to 40 units per acre. We
are proposing just slightly under 20 units per acre. As the staff report notes, adding higher
density residential on the site will support the surrounding commercial and employment
uses, providing nearby customers and employees that want to be able to walk to work.
The staff report also finds that this multi-use development will not over saturate the area
with residential. The site is zoned C-G and we are not seeking any rezone. It has C-G
zoning to the north, the east across Eagle Road. The little in-fill site partially to the south
and, then, there is -- directly the residential to the south is R-8 and R-15. There are two
R-2 residences located along the western boundary of the property. With that I will let
Mike take over here.
Seal: Good evening. Just start with your name and address -- or sorry. Yeah. Name
and address and the floor is yours.
Mafia: Good evening, Commissioners. Mike Mafia and owner of these two parcels on
Meridian and Ustick and I am the owner -- sole owner of this property. I'm a private
developer. I do select projects. I'm passionate about development and -- and taking a
responsibility very seriously. I target projects that are in-fill and have immediate proximity
to amenities such as this site. I went back through my notes. My first meeting with Bill
and Joe was 14 months ago and came and worked with several local developers and
consultants with a blank slate trying to figure out what is the best approach for this site.
It's -- it's the second busiest intersection in Idaho, so it's -- it's very dense, it's very busy.
The site did have some inherent limitations. You can see the -- kind of odd shape to it,
but it also has this Milk Lateral that divides the site with a 30 foot setback and, then, it has
the two drive aisles, Centrepoint and the unnamed Cajun Lane, which bifurcates the site
and it creates -- created some challenges. Working with staff and various consultants we
looked at various uses commercial, multi-family and decided that this was the -- the best
use. Even though we are not here for the CUP, there is a retail portion on Eagle, with a
strong connection to the multi-family site. As Joe mentioned, we started with our MDA
application in front of Council. Just quickly, this was the original site plan. It was 259
units. It was a four story building, elevator served, and we were using the parking field to
the west for kind of that central portion of the development to qualify the parking and,
again, as Joe mentioned, the feedback from Council was to go back to the drawing board
and self park each quadrant between those drive aisles. This is where we came back --
there were also some concerns about the -- the height of the buildings from neighbors
and we ultimately reduced this to a three story core -- three buildings in the middle and,
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 16 of 34
then, the western building is a two-story building and, then, to the east are those, Buildings
F, and are also three stories with tuck under garages. But this shows the evolution of the
site plan and, then, for our CIP hearing or application we -- and to give you -- to back step
a little bit, through this process we had two pre-application meetings, both for the MDA
for the CUP, two neighborhood meetings and several meetings with staff. So, the site
plans I'm going through was actually 12 months of work of -- of -- of modeling and -- and
working with Joe and the -- the change in this -- this CUP application was we increased
our open space between the three larger buildings and increased the -- the turf area that
was mentioned in the staff report. I will speak to it later, but we did add voluntarily more
screening than required, particularly to the west, with a mix of deciduous and evergreen
trees. I have met with the neighbors, I understand their concerns for screening and
believe we will be able to mitigate it. That two-story building to the west, you know the
first floor is ten feet at the finished floor and, you know, we are confident we can get
evergreens to -- you know, to that elevation fairly quickly. Here is an updated rendering.
You know, as I spoke earlier, I have toured this market -- I have been working in Boise
for a long time with developers going back 20 years and, you know, I really try to focus
on which projects are successful, borrow from those successes and, then, avoid the
failures and this vernacular is -- I would say a somewhat contemporary approach on -- on
a -- on a Craftsman style home. I think we will complement the area and blend with it and
make that transition from a very, you know -- you know, high traffic commercial area to
-- to the residential transition, especially with the three story and kind of the breaks in the
elevations. On our vertical elements we have board and batten and, then, on the
horizontal we have a ship lap and, then, the -- you know, the decks are -- are enclosed
with one side open. There was a comment in the staff report to incorporate to meet the
design standard and we will include brick or masonry to -- to reflect that comment. We
have interior walk-ups and -- and you can't see it in this plan, but I do focus a lot on our
landscape plan and creating spaces that are approachable, promote gathering. Too
many projects, in my opinion, are overdone with, you know, dry rock beds and pavement
and we are really trying to promote a landscape that emulates the natural environment,
the high desert. People come to this area for -- for that connection to the outdoor spaces
and we -- we intend to borrow from it and something I -- I pay a lot of attention to. These
are just some select elevations. I think -- I think that's all I have for now. Turn it back
over to Elizabeth.
Koeckeritz: All right. Thank you. I just want to point -- we are just going to focus a little
bit on some of the cross-sections, because we do know some of the neighbors continue
to be concerned about having any sort of residential development here. They were also
-- I don't know how many of you were here for the Villasport. They were also very
concerned about that and we actually believe this is a much better fit for the neighborhood
than the Villasport. As you can see on this cross-section, this is a three story building
and it is -- the Villasport was only ten feet from the property boundary, which made it 65
feet from the nearest home. Here we are a hundred feet from the property boundary and
we are 155 feet from the nearest home behind us. Villasport had also received a variance
to be able to have speakers within 25 feet of the property line. That has been eliminated
and, instead, there will be trees and a pathway through that area. Here is a cross-section.
The two homes to the direct west are understandably somewhat concerned about this
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 17 of 34
development coming to their neighborhood. In this case the -- we are 25 feet from the
property boundary. Then the house is an additional 95 feet away, which creates 115 feet
total. There are going to be -- on the upper floor of this building there will be six balconies.
The balconies are the private open space required by code and so we anticipate that
being, as Mike mentioned, about 16 feet if you were standing on the second floor and you
were a tall person looking out and so we do --we are trying to do a heavy mix of deciduous
and evergreens to really help screen that property. In addition, the neighbors had asked
for the masonry wall and we have agreed to do that along this boundary as well to really
help continue to alleviate any noise and sound concerns there. We do meet all of the
CUP criteria. I will go through really briefly. We accommodate the use. We meet all the
city code. As Joe mentioned, it is harmonious with the Comprehensive Plan. We are
compatible. We are not adversely affecting other property. We are right in the middle of
the city. There is -- all the public utilities are there. This is not excessive traffic. It's
reduced traffic. Noise, smoke, fumes, glare, odors, none of those sort of things. And
there is no historic features on this site. Also for multi-family, as I will discuss here briefly,
there is ample open space, lots of amenities. It's quality buildings and designs and really
try to integrate into the surrounding community. Just touching briefly on the comp plan, I
have two slides on this. I could have had many many more. It hits at least 14 goals of
the Comprehensive Plan, including its in-fill development and a growth area. It's in the
center of the city. It's a place where residents can live, shop, dine and play all in close
proximity. There are diverse housing options. It's a mix from studios to three bedrooms.
There is great pedestrian access and public services are available. We don't have to go
through all of them. Traffic is always a concern. As mentioned there are 1 ,600 fewer
daily trips than the Villasport. That doesn't mean there is no cars, but there is definitely
less and that results in 80 fewer weekday morning trips and 166 fewer weekday p.m. trips.
One of the things that the neighbors to the south have raised is the concern about the
cars cutting through their development and getting out to the road -- out to Eagle Road
where their development has a right-in, right-out access on Bourbon Street and what they
found -- what the traffic engineers found is that cars will be going around the edges of
that development, but not through it on the private interior streets and they estimate that
there will be 30 outbound trips in the a.m. peak hour added to that intersection where cars
are trying to make the right-hand turn to get onto Eagle to get to the Interstate. Because
of the right-in, right-out there is hardly any inbound and, then, at night there will be 15
outbound trips in the p.m. hour. As far as open space, the code requires approximately
2.23 acres. We are providing 2.53 acres and possibly more, depending on how you want
to interpret different portions of the code. In any event it's over -- there is excess open
space here that does not include the arterial street buffer. As we have talked about there
is enhanced landscaping on the west. The masonry wall on the west. There is the
pathway along the southern boundary and, then, there is also micro paths throughout.
will show on our last slide we have already incorporated the micro path that Joe just asked
for. That's already been added, because the connectivity and the ability to get in and
around this is really important. The amenities include a clubhouse with a business lounge,
multiple plaza areas, swimming pool, fitness facility, outdoor kitchen, a dog run, the micro
path system through this area and a bicycle repair room. I knew I was running out of
time. And here is the revised site plan where we did eliminate the parking space. We
have widened that road. One of the neighbors were concerned about Centrepoint. ACHD
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 18 of 34
is recommending that it be widened. We are absolutely agreeing to widen it. And, then,
we have also straightened the sidewalk along Ustick. And with that we will stand for any
questions.
Seal: Thank you very much. Commissioners? Go right ahead.
Grace: Mr. Chairman. Just one quick question. Ms. Koeckeritz, does that Cajun Lane
-- does that -- is that an out -- an outlet to Ustick?
Koeckeritz: It is. It's a right-in, right-out onto Ustick.
Grace: Okay. So, Centrepoint is, obviously, a light and a pretty big intersection.
Koeckeritz: Yes.
Grace: So, there won't be a light there, it will just be a right-in, right-out?
Koeckeritz: Yes.
Grace: And can you -- can you attempt to get into that left lane to go north on Eagle Road
from there? Because that's a little further closer to the intersection; right?
Koeckeritz: Because of how close it is to the intersection I think that would be pretty
difficult, depending on the time of day, of course, but it would be -- I would think fairly
difficult to go across those lanes of traffic to get onto Ustick to go north.
Grace: Yeah. Okay. And, then, just a separate question, but a -- but another one. The
-- there is just two lots to the west of that two-story.
Koeckeritz: Yes.
Grace: There is just two homeowner lots there.
Koeckeritz: Yes.
Grace: Okay. Thank you.
Seal: Commissioner Lorcher, anything? Commissioner Stoddard, do you have anything?
Stoddard: No. I'm good.
Seal: Okay. Do we have anybody signed up to testify?
Hall: We have. Jared Schofield.
Seal: Thank you. Good evening, sir. Name and address for the record, please.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 19 of 34
Schofield: Jared Schofield. 1566 North Leslie Way. I have one of the properties
immediately -- immediately on the west side of this property. First I would like to say I --
I have had the chance to meet Mike and he is -- he is a good guy. I don't mind him at all.
It's just my biggest concern with this -- well, I have several concerns. My biggest one is
the safety and security of my family. When this was originally -- when I purchased my
property 12 years ago this was -- we were told it was going to be non-retail commercial.
So, anticipating, you know, whatever it be -- doctor's offices, dance studio, whatever it
may be. Something that's going to have set hours. It's going to be -- not going to be a
large structure. It's two-story. It's not going to have people there all night. You know,
very limited. The block wall that's actually there already was also going to stay -- was
going to be built and along the same alignment that it currently exists, which was also
shown in Villasport's plan and every other plan that has been submitted before that. So,
we would still like to see that wall on that same alignment and we would like to see -- or
not have people looking into our backyard. I have small children and any of you as
parents probably have similar concerns of -- with small kids of people staring directly into
your backyard as they are playing and spending their time out there with their friends and
1, as a parent, am deathly terrified. I have three girls. I'm -- in this day and age security
and safety of my family is my first and utmost priority. But I do appreciate Mike wanting
to add additional full -- or additional trees to be able to create a landscape buffer there.
That is very much appreciated. The only problem I have with that is that if this is not an
immediate buffer. This is something that will not occur -- those trees will not reach a
height of any kind of cover for four to five years at the soonest. That's just reality. I wish
it was the -- I wish it wasn't that way, but, unfortunately, it is. I have nothing against Mike
and the development. I -- you know, I like what he's done with the main structures. They
look -- I mean they will look nice. I -- I believe personally I think the number of people this
will bring in is going to do -- it will and truly create a headache on traffic. We already have
people -- and Mike has seen it, too. He's seen it today. People that cut down Centrepoint
at a high rate of speed, cut through the neighborhood to be able to get out by Jimmy
John's onto Eagle. They also do the same thing when traffic starts to get backed up --
backed up every morning, they cut down Leslie Way and do the same thing traveling
down that road at 40 to 50 miles an hour when kids are getting out of school to be able to
access onto Eagle. People have found the shortcuts. That's the nature of people. People
are lazy. They want to go faster. But this is only going to increase that. It's going to
increase the safety risk to the kids that are walking down Leslie Way or down Centrepoint
to get to River Valley Elementary. That -- this whole community needs it to be safe and,
again, not opposed to it, but we would like to -- we would like to see something safe for
our kids and our families. Thank you for your time. Do you have any questions?
Seal: Thank you very much. Appreciate that.
Hall: There is no one else signed up, Mr. Chairman.
Seal: No one signed up? Anybody in Chambers that would like to -- ma'am, come on
up. Oh. Wait until you get up to the microphones there.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 20 of 34
Bailey: Good evening. Thank you for letting me speak. I wasn't going to say anything
tonight, because every time that --
Seal: Oh. We need your name and address for the record.
Bailey: Janet Bailey. 2925 North Centrepoint. I know they are going in. I have been
adamantly opposed to this whole thing since it started, because I live on Centrepoint. I
am the neighborhood watch chair. I started it. I walked every neighbor in that place, so
I know what is happening in that neighborhood. Traffic is speeding down Centrepoint. I
don't know if you have current records, but we had a crime come through our
neighborhood and now I know this is not related, but it's an increase. My husband's tires
were slashed and four others on the street were. Then we had another accident -- a huge
accident at the entrance of Ustick and Centrepoint just a couple weeks ago. So, these
-- these kinds of things are increasing and with putting all of those apartments stacked in
there and the -- the top layer they took off, they shoved it over in the corn -- the corner
where the -- the narrow Centrepoint -- I -- granted if he's going to, you know, expand it,
yea. But the traffic coming around that corner -- somebody's going to have a problem.
Somebody's going to look for somebody to sue, because they -- the traffic is just sitting
there. I tell my kids don't go out. Lag back. The traffic -- everybody runs it -- in the
morning you -- it's several light changes to get through. In the afternoon Eagle and Ustick
is backed up so far that you can't get out there and adding all of this extra parking is going
to add extra traffic in the neighborhood. I have seen it. I watch it. I live it. I don't know
what the studies are. They don't live there. They don't know. But the people that do live
there -- I mean that was our retirement there and it's to the point where that whole
neighborhood -- it's so stressful now thinking about what's coming and how it's changing,
it -- it -- I feel like, oh, my God, how do I get out of here? There is a lot of retired people
in there. A lot of older people and these -- this added traffic, it's going to make it worse.
And I don't care what he says about building the corner, I -- I disagree and I know there
is a lot of people in there that disagree and we have even requested a gate, because
people will turn down Centrepoint, flip a u-ey and go back. The lady on the corner that's
at the beginning of the subdivision, she counted cars. She counted like 40 cars within 30
minutes that flipped it and went back out. So, like Jared said, there are -- they have
learned the shortcuts and they are zooming down Centrepoint -- maybe they don't cut
Cajun, but they can get out going down the end of Centrepoint and following it around,
you come out by Discount Tire. So -- sorry, I -- I wasn't going to say anything, but I just
think that this needs to be heard over and over again. So, thank you.
Seal: Thank you very much. Anybody else in Chambers like to testify? All right. I don't
think we have anybody online that is -- oh, looks like we got one person online raising
their hand.
Hall- You can speak if you unmute yourself.
Grant: My name is Steve Grant. I live at 1534 North Leslie Way. Can you hear me?
Seal: Yep. We can hear you. Go ahead, please. Thank you.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 21 of 34
Grant: A couple of concerns. Number one, the alignment of the wall that J.R. spoke of,
just so you are aware the -- the -- the -- the alignment of the wall sits five feet --
approximately five feet to the east of the property line and I'm not sure what Mike has in
mind in terms of continuing that wall along the same alignment, but I would hate to see it
jog five feet going -- bump beyond the property line to where the -- it's a masonry wall
that's going to require footings and -- and to maintain the same alignment is I think the
appropriate thing to do for aesthetics. The second comment I have is the traffic
justification for Villasport was based on that being a commercial property. This is all
residential. So, I think the peak hour impact on -- on Centrepoint with people coming off
the west -- those two-story apartments trying to turn left onto -- to -- to exit -- or exit that
facility is going to be a problem and I just think that the road is not wide enough, even if
they widen -- so there is a right-turn lane on -- onto Ustick from Centrepoint, that's -- that
helps, but I think traffic is going to stack and create all kinds of problems that I'm not sure
a traffic study is taking them into account. Thank you.
Seal: Thank you, Steve. Appreciate it. Okay. Would anybody else like to testify? All
right.
Dodson: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Going once. Going twice. You can't testify, Joe.
Dodson: No, I can't testify. No.
Seal: Go ahead.
Dodson: Since it's come up twice I did want to discuss the wall placement. That's
something that staff and the applicant had discussed with the Police Department and they
don't want to create this five foot dead zone between a wall and a fence, which typically
is where crime does occur in those dark areas that nobody can get to very well and police
can't see. So, we had decided to shift the wall back towards the property line, because
of the existing structures, as well as the required footings for a wall it's not going to be
exactly on the property line. I don't know where engineering wise, but probably at least a
foot away and, then, continue it down and up to Ustick. So, there was a thought behind
that. It's not that we are trying to change the -- what's already there, it's just they -- they
don't want to create a dead zone in there, you know, because of the CPTED things.
Seal: Okay. Thanks. Appreciate the feedback on that.
Dodson: Yes.
Seal: Go ahead.
Grace: Mr. Chairman, just a follow-up question on that, Joe. Is -- so, if there is like a --
a little bit of a foot strip or -- or so, will that be closed off on the cap at the ends or could
someone --
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 22 of 34
Dodson: I'm assuming it will be capped to some degree, but if not I mean you would be
standing on rock or brick or something that's going to be sloped that will go into the bottom
of the adjacent fence. So, it's not going to be a place you can really get to much.
Grace: Yeah. Okay.
Dodson: So, it will be a lot harder than five.
Seal: Okay. All right. Would the applicant like to come back up?
Koeckeritz: Elizabeth Koeckeritz at 601 Bannock. Just in response to a couple of things
that were just raised, the alignment of the wall has been discussed and it is something
where -- itjust makes sense to put it as close to the property boundary as possible. There
is also,just from a liability standpoint, of being an owner and having this extra dead space
on the backside of your wall where you don't know what's going on, you can't see it,
becomes difficult to maintain and so he is looking at placing the wall as close to the edge
of the property boundary as possible. As far as the traffic goes through the subdivisions
to the south, there is an easement -- a cross-access easement and there has been since
2006 back when this was called the Sadie Creek Development and it was Sadie
Commons below. Could you bring up our presentation again? Where the neighborhood
to the south did grant a perpetual nonexclusive easement for cross-access by vehicular
and pedestrian traffic, but not parking upon and over roadways that may exist from time
to time. They will design and build the roadways in such a fashion as to permit reasonable
access through and across parcel B, which is the one owned by our clients and their --
their parcel B and provide parcel A, which is what's currently before you tonight and parcel
C, which is the corner lot, access to Eagle Road. And so that has been in place. The
development was built with this cross-access agreement in place. Their traffic comes
through Centrepoint through this development and vice-versa. It's been there for quite
some time. Additionally this is still, we have to remember, 40 percent less traffic than the
last approved use here. Any development always is going to bring traffic, but this is
significantly less than what's been there before. additionally, although there was the
addition of the smaller two-story building, there was still a net loss between the original
proposed plans and what's before you today. We reduced the number from 259 units to
213 units. One of the other things that has come up is the question about traffic speeding
on Centrepoint Way and it's kind of hard -- I don't know if I have a good depiction of it, but
we have -- do you have approval where the road will start at 40 feet wide up by the
intersection to Ustick, so that you have got space for the turn lanes and, then, at the
intersections where the drive aisles are it is going to narrow down and taper to 33 feet
and, then, it will widen out again. But that's really sort of a built-in traffic calming along
that road and, in fact, the applicant is working with ACHD and ultimately, if possible, would
like that to be even more of a constriction, it's just that right now that's where ACHD is on
it and so it is somewhat of a traffic calming device there. And, then, just, finally, we
absolutely understand the neighbors concerns. I know the applicant is -- to the west the
applicant is looking at faster growing trees, making sure that some of the trees are
evergreen. They don't plant immediately -- they don't grow immediately. It does take
some time. There was some discussion with City Council about -- could you bring in
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 23 of 34
bigger trees, like bigger caliper trees, and what it came down to after talking about that
and meeting with the forester, as those trees don't do as well long term and they grow
slower and they don't stabilize as well and you are actually much better off putting in the
younger smaller caliper trees and, then, overtime they will grow to that bigger one and
you won't be replacing them, spending the money and the effort of replacing trees that
die and that they are not -- just aren't thriving the way that you would want them to. So,
with that I think I will stand for anymore questions.
Seal: Okay. Thank you. And I -- I have a couple. Mike had indicated that there was talk
about possibly eliminating where that -- where the road squeezes there on Centrepoint.
So, is what you are saying is you are going to have it squeeze, it's just a matter of how
much ACHD allows you to?
Koeckeritz: Yes.
Seal: Okay. That's good, because I -- that part of this is very attractive to me as far as
being able to kind of mitigate traffic in that area. So, the other part of that, too, is I turn
on Centrepoint Way to go over to Fast Eddy's, so that's where I buy my fuel from. But
do see people turn into there and not understand where they are going. So, hopefully,
having this in there will mitigate that as well, so -- I think they get confused as to how they
get down to the -- some of the parcels that are there to the east of you. So, it's -- I think
that that will be helpful in that. As far as the block wall alignment, I kind of understand
how that -- why that is not going to align, so I won't go into that very much, but -- that's
everything I got. Anybody else have any questions, comments? Go right ahead.
Grace: Mr. Chair. Thank you for addressing the size of the trees. I was going to ask that
very question. Could you get some older growth trees that are already bigger in there.
But it sounds like you have already considered that. What about the -- the five foot wall
there on that west side? Is there any ability to go higher to provide -- I'm sympathetic to
-- to this homeowner, the gentleman's concerns about, you know, you can look directly
down into their backyard and he has got children. I'm -- I am sympathetic. I -- I -- so, I
just wanted to ask that question.
Koeckeritz: Well -- and I think -- was it six feet? It's a little -- so, first, it is already a little
bit higher than six feet and there will be the trees -- when you really look, there isn't a line
going across here. I mean -- but once those trees are there it will really help block this.
These are also --these patios they are not extruding off the back even further. If you look
at -- it's not the ideal picture, because it shows an end unit, but they really are sort of
inside. They -- they don't extrude, they are covered on three sides and they really only
have that one wall. I understand the concern, but it really is trying to keep them stepped
back, still meet the code and really work with the neighbors as much as possible with the
design.
Dodson: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Go ahead.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 24 of 34
Dodson: I did want to hit on a couple of those points as well. Mr. Schofield, that -- of the
two properties adjacent, only one has a fence and that's his and it's a chain link, so some
of that dead zone piece is gone. However, they could always input a fence and we would
still have that issue. I want to verify -- I can't remember in code. I think C-G only allows
six foot fence, but it might also be eight feet. Now that I'm thinking about it, I think it's
eight feet. So, I believe they can go up to eight foot if you guys required that, but we
would -- if you make any kind of condition with that I would recommend just making it
broad and work with staff, so that we can verify. But I think that that could help quell some
of the issues that you are having there. But, again, eight feet is only eight feet versus the
second story, which is the main concern here. Staff -- at the Council hearing we did talk
about the growth of the trees and the higher caliper and our parks director specifically
had stated that they do not like when applicants put in the larger caliper trees at the
beginning, because they typically will just -- they will die. Transporting them from where
they are to the new place just usually doesn't work very well. Secondly, we already have
conditions in there that those buffers are to be constructed with phase one. So, they need
to be part of the beginning of the development to help get them established prior to
occupancy, prior to the buildings being constructed, honestly. I don't know if they are
going to do this two-story one first, but I presume they would do the stuff in the center
with the clubhouse and everything first and, then, get to the west of the boundary. Buffer
should still be constructed with those first buildings. So, staff did think about some of this
with the timing of it, but I know that Mike would gladly work with the timing portion of that
as well.
Seal: The only question I had on the trees -- I mean we say, you know, larger caliper,
smaller caliper trees, when to me it's height. I don't care how big -- you know, I don't care
how big around it is. If it's 20 feet tall and it's a small, you know, junior tree, then, that's
still better than having a, you know, six foot tree planted there that's going to take 20 years
in order to reach, you know, 15 feet. So, I mean is there something -- some stipulation
we can put in there that the least we provide, you know -- that the applicant provide
something in there that's going to be of some substance and -- and I know this is a small
detail, but at the same time it's -- you know, it's been talked about and it's -- it's something
that, you know, obviously, there is a concern about. So, I mean as far as the fence height,
you know, and the jog in the fence and all that stuff, I think you have to do what you have
to do for that, you know, in order to make it fit. I don't see having the fence at a certain
height and, then, continue it on at a different height as being appealing or -- you know,
that just doesn't seem like something that would be necessary knowing that there are
going to be things that are going to be in there in the future.
Dodson: Well, Mr. Chair, I'm not an arborist, so I can't speak too much on this
landscaping, but I know that Mike has talked about it before. They can find fast growing,
quote, unquote, deciduous trees and, then, ever -- evergreens, again, are going to
probably be the best when it comes to long-term screening. They are year around, but I
will leave that to the applicant.
Seal: Okay.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 25 of 34
Koeckeritz: The site plan does show the mix of trees that are currently being proposed,
but I didn't write them down and I can't read that small of print. But he can speak to what
the mix will be.
Mafia: I mean there is an exhausting amount of trees on there, but it is a mix. I mean
there is spruces and there -- there is some furs and some of them grow 15 inches a year,
some of them grow 25 to 30 inches a year. I have been in this situation before. I just did
a project -- one retail project of the year, because of some of the landscape features, I --
I am very involved. I'm not a -- or a large institutional investor. I talk with the landscape
crews. I make sure they are planted correctly. I mean if a lot of trees fail not just because
of the health of the tree, but they are planted too shallow or too high, they are not irrigated
properly and as a long-term investor, I mean, you know, the -- the year warranty you
usually get on a tree is -- is -- is not sufficient. You are controlling the process from --
from the time you get your order and, you know, historically we are rejecting, you know,
five to ten percent of the specimens, because they are not acceptable. So, I mean I am
-- I am very involved in that process and I don't know -- it's never been conditioned. It's
a tough one, you know, to condition and -- and qualify it. But, you know, I -- I met J.R. on
site today and I spoke to him, you know, specifically about that and my commitment to
getting healthy trees, because you could have the same seven foot or ten foot spruce and
depending on what nurseries it's coming out of, one could be a lot healthier than the other
and that's -- that's the -- that's the importance of long-term growth is, you know, healthy
specimens, so --
Seal: Okay. Yeah. And that's -- I mean my point is just it's hard to condition something
on. No, you have to put in a 12 foot tree. Well, what does that mean, you know, and a
matter of code or any of that stuff. So, it -- it's a concern. It sounds like it's -- you know,
I mean you are working through that. You are going to try and put in the best trees to
provide the best coverage in the best amount of time, so I think that satisfies that for me
for sure. Any other questions, Commissioners? Guys are all done? All right. Thank you
very much. Can I get a motion, please, to close the public hearing for File No. H-2022-
0072?
Grace: So moved, Mr. Chairman.
Lorcher: Second.
Seal: It's been moved and seconded to close the public hearing for File No. H-2022-0072
for Centrepoint Apartments. All in favor, please, say aye. No opposed. Public hearing
is closed.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. TWO ABSENT.
Seal: So, if somebody would like to go first or -- if we have hashed everything out a
motion or --
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 26 of 34
Grace: Mr. Chairman, I -- I feel like I -- I got the answers I was looking for. I appreciate
a lot of the efforts that were done from the applicant to -- not only with the new use,
obviously, but with reductions seems like in a lot of things. So, I think there is a good faith
effort there. I am sympathetic to some of the comments that were made. You know, we
get -- we get comments about these apartments a lot and -- and -- when they come in.
There is no great place to put them it seems like. So, it is where it is. I'm -- I'm comfortable
with the information I got tonight. So, that would be my comment.
Seal: Okay. Any other comments?
Lorcher: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Commissioner Lorcher, go ahead.
Lorcher: After considering all staff and public testimony, I move to approve file number
H-2022-0072 as presented in the staff report for the hearing date of November 17th, 2022,
with the following modification: Applicant work with staff to provide safety and privacy of
the homes surrounding the development.
Grace: Mr. Chairman, I would second that.
Seal: Okay. It's been moved and seconded to approve File No. H-2022-0072 with the
aforementioned modifications. All in favor say -- please say aye. No opposed. Motion
carries. Thank you very much.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. TWO ABSENT.
Dodson: Sorry, Mr. Chair. Playing musical presentations.
4. Public Hearing for Knighthill Center Childcare Facility (H-2022-0070)
by Ethan Mansfield, Hawkins Company, located at 6241 N. Linder Rd.
near the southwest corner of Chinden and Linder Rds.
A. Request: Conditional Use Permit for a Daycare Facility (more than
12 children) located on approximately 1 acre of land in the C-G
zoning district.
Seal: Okay. At this time I would like to con -- or open the public hearing for item number
H-2022-0070 for Knighthill Center Childcare Facility. We will begin with the staff report.
Dodson: Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. So, my last one for my public serving career
for now -- I will probably be back someday. As noted, this is for Knighthill Center
Childcare. It is a conditional use permit for a daycare center located on approximately
one acre of land within the C-G zoning district. Because it is more than 12 children it is
classified as a daycare center within the UDC, which requires a conditional use permit.
The proposed use is a community serving commercial use that is consistent with the
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 27 of 34
future land use designation of mixed-use community. It's proposed location is within the
center of a relatively small commercial development, but very nearby existing residential
-- established residential to the south and southwest. Staff finds that the proposed use
will provide a needed use for the nearby community and offer employment opportunities
beyond just typical retail jobs, like the Dollar General to the left -- to the west. The subject
site is part of an approved short plat that has subdivided the existing lot into two
commercial building lots. This is on the north lot. A salon is administratively approved
on the building lot to the south, but has not yet received final building permit approval.
The proposed use is subject to specific use standards, 11-4-3-9 to be specific. Staff finds
that the project complies or exceeds all required specific use standards, as well as the
UDC dimensional standards, except for one, which is a requirement for parking lot
landscaping. Parking lot landscaping requires at least five feet of landscaping along
vehicle use areas, which does include drive aisles, which would be along the east
boundary where there is no landscaping shown between the sidewalk and the proposed
play areas. The applicant is proposing the required five foot sidewalk, but no landscaping
as noted. Instead, the applicant is proposing multiple bollards behind the sidewalk for
added safety for the proposed play areas, which staff definitely appreciates. The bollards
should help increase the safety and staff finds that a full five feet of landscaping may not
be necessary, but some landscaping should be provided to increase the buffer between
the drive aisle and the play areas. After discussing this with the applicant, staff has
included a condition of approval to provide this landscaping or request alternative
compliance to reduce that buffer area and include dense and decorative landscaping
elements between the sidewalk and the play area. So, again, could be five feet, could be
three, two and a half, that could be done through administrative process after this
conditional use permit. Staff just wants to increase that buffer between. Specific to the
site. Shared drive aisles are located along the west, north, and east property boundaries.
Those are existing. All of these around the edge here are existing. There is an existing
cross-access easement on each of the drive aisles and throughout this commercial
subdivision, as well as for the recently approved short plat. Because there is no direct lot
access to public roadways and each roadway is constructed to its full anticipated widths,
which would be Chinden to the north and Linder to the east, ACHD did not require any
kind of traffic impact study, nor any road improvements with this application. The
proposed daycare building is shown as approximately 10,000 square feet, requiring
minimum 20 parking spaces per code for residential -- for non-residential use, which is
one space per 500 square feet. The applicant is proposing 46 parking spaces, which is
more than twice the minimum. The submitted site plan shows a new two way 25 foot
wide drive aisle on the north side of the building, with two rows of parking, as well as
parking on the west side of the building. The site plan does not show any dedicated pick-
up or drop-off location, which is intentional by the applicant, because through the narrative
the applicant does describe that this -- their policy for the actual operation of the daycare
is for parents to park to drop off and pick up their kids. They don't just toss them out the
door as they go, you know. Staff finds that the excess parking and the proposed operation
for the parking and the child pick-up and drop-off is sufficient. As of 1:30 p.m. today --
should have looked again later, but I presume it's the same. There was no written
testimony for this -- this request and with that staff did recommend approval, because it
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 28 of 34
complies with code, minus the parking lot landscaping, and there is an avenue to correct
that. So, staff will stand for any questions.
Seal: Thank you, sir. Applicant would like to come up and -- good evening, sir. Need
your name and address for the record and the floor is yours.
Mansfield: Thanks, Mr. Chairman, Commissioners. Good evening. My name is Ethan
Mansfield with Hawkins Companies and we are the developers on this project. Our
address is 855 West Broad Street, Boise, Idaho. 83702. 1 will let Joe pull up my very
brief report -- or my very brief presentation. We are seeking a conditional use permit
tonight for a childcare center on one acre of land, located in the northwest corner of
Chinden Boulevard and Linder Road in a -- or, sorry, that's southwest corner of Chinden
Boulevard and Linder Road in a service commercial zone. Joe did a great job outlining
the project, the conditions and his recommendation of approval. I won't add much to say
-- except to say that we agree with the terms and conditions outlined in the staff report.
We are going to go ahead and, you know, work with staff through alternative compliance
to address the landscaping. We are certainly amenable to providing some landscaping
along that -- that part of the -- of the site. We will continue to work with staff and -- to
ensure that our zoning certificate, our design review application and alternative
compliance application comply with the UDC, the architectural standards and all other
applicable ordinances. And, again, I would really like to thank Joe for his time on this
application and his time at the city as a whole. He's been a great planner. It's been really
nice to work with him and I would like to thank you for considering this item tonight and I
would be happy to answer any questions that you have this evening.
Seal: Mr. Grace, go ahead.
Grace: Yeah. Mr. Chairman, just because I had the experience very close by in Kids
Choice down the road, I ask do you have outdoor space -- sufficient outdoor space for
these kids to play in? I see the 10,000 square foot building and the parking and just -- if
you could clarify -- okay.
Mansfield: Yes. We -- Mr. Chairman, Commissioner, we do have about 5,000 square
feet of outdoor space. So, half the area of our -- of our building is out -- outdoor space.
So, yeah, five out of 15,000 square feet will be outdoors. There will be an infant
playground and a playground for the older children, split roughly equally.
Grace: And I see that's on the east side of the building, which is smart.
Mansfield: Thank you, Commissioner.
Lorcher: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Commissioner Lorcher, go ahead.
Lorcher: Ethan, what are the bollards?
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 29 of 34
Mansfield: A bollard is design -- is a -- I have not looked up the definition recently, but in
this case it will be a -- like vertical -- kind of vehicle deterrent that -- that, essentially, if
anything were to hit that it would stop whatever is hitting it. We have it detailed in our
landscape plan, which I believe is included in the materials submitted. I don't have it
printed tonight, but -- okay We don't have it available, but I would be more than happy to
provide that -- a cross-section of the bollard if that's of interest. Essentially, the bollards
in this case -- about three feet tall, four feet tall, designed to stop any vehicular momentum
from affecting the fence that surrounds the play area.
Lorcher: Is it like a Jersey barrier? Like a big concrete barrier?
Mansfield: No. No. No. These are decorative bollards. They are typically used when
pathways. Well --
Dodson: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Go right ahead, Joe.
Dodson: It-- like they usually have them at banks, the big concrete posts that are sticking
out of the ground to protect tellers. Anything like that. About three to four feet high.
Usually made -- they are made out of concrete or they are metal with a plastic thing over
the top to make them look prettier. But it's just -- yeah, they are definitely meant to stop
vehicles from running over anything that it is behind them. You can kind of see it. There
is quite a few -- one, two, three, four, five, six, seven -- you know, 11 or 12 along the east
boundary spaced in such a way that a car can't fit between them either, which would be
the point of keeping vehicles from getting anywhere near the play area.
Lorcher: Okay. So, you are also propose -- you are proposing these -- am I saying it
right -- bollard?
Dodson: Yes. Yes, ma'am.
Lorcher: A bollard and landscaping; is that correct? Or is it one or the other?
Mansfield: Mr. Chairman, Commissioner Lorcher, we originally proposed the bollards and
staff asked us to include some landscaping, which we agreed to do in addition to the
bollards.
Lorcher: Okay. Thank you.
Seal: Yeah. And I will -- I will go out on a limb here and, Joe, this might be a question
for you, but -- and the reason I ask that is because my son used to go to school at
Compass, so we have been through here a lot and people zip up and down this street
where the bollards are going to be at, so it -- is it possible to shift the building over and
put the parking on the other side or is that just -- is that a nonstart -- well, I mean just from
a code perspective is that something that would even be allowed? Because I -- I mean it
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 30 of 34
looks like the parking on the other side is accessed directly from the street, where that --
that would not be possible on the other side on -- if they were to put that on the east side;
correct?
Dodson: Mr. Chair, I would -- code wise there is nothing that would prohibit the site for
-- this area being flipped basically.
Seal: Okay.
Dodson: It -- I don't necessarily see a physical issue with that, except that the drive aisle
on the east side is probably more used and we don't typically like backup parking into
those more frequented drive aisles, because you can create a lot of vehicular conflicts
there. I would presume that -- was it Mr. Wiley who owns the overall subdivision would
not like that at all. I think that would probably be the biggest hurdle, which is the drive
aisle on the west is a lot less used, because it's closer to the -- it's -- this area would
basically be adjacent to a portion of the parking for Dollar General and I think even the
southwest corner of it is actually just adjacent to the building really. So -- yeah.
Seal: Okay.
Dodson: So, it will be -- should be less frequented. I see your point though. I do get that.
I'm sure the applicant does as well, but because that east side one is used so much more,
I do have questions and qualms with that backup parking there. I just feel like it's going
to create a lot of issues.
Seal: Yeah. And I understand that as well. So, just -- I mean my concern is just having
kids in there. I understand the bollards and that should mitigate that. But should and
does are two different words, so, you know, that's about the only concern I have with it at
this point is just how to better protect that side of it. I mean, obviously, you are putting
bollards in there, so there is a concern. So, just anything we can do to kind of mitigate
that further would be good, but I don't know what -- what, if any, choices there are to do
that. Yeah. Not sure.
Dodson: I'm not sure either, Mr. Chair. I -- the only thing that could come to mind is just
putting the play area adjacent to the parking spaces and pull the building to the east, but,
frankly, I have jumped the curb in a car before and if there were bollards on the other side
I probably would have landed on top of them, rather than hit them. Granted. I was in a
'58 -- they aren't very heavy, but -- so I feel like the same concern would probably exist.
It's just unfortunate with just the size of the site and you have so many drive aisles, I -- I
don't think it's avoidable, honestly.
Seal: Okay.
Dodson: The bollards is great. I had not thought of that and I'm glad that the applicant
and the team did. Now, I think, again, at least a couple feet of landscaping will make that
even safer. I think that that's going to be much preferred.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 31 of 34
Seal: Yes. Go ahead.
Grace: And where I was going with indicating that I thought it was smart was that,
obviously, that afternoon sun --
Seal: Yeah.
Grace: -- presents a better place for the playhouse -- playground. It could be awful with
the kids playing in the direct west side --
Lorcher: Taking the kids in sun -- sunshine. Okay. Got you.
Grace: Thank you.
Seal: Any other questions? Do we have -- I'm sure we don't have anybody signed up to
testify.
Hall: No one signed up.
Seal: Sir, would you like to testify at all? You sure? All right. Does the applicant have
anything else to add?
Mansfield: I think I'm good. Thank you.
Seal: All right. Thank you very much. With that, can I get a motion to close the public --
or public testimony portion of File No. H-2022-0070?
Grace: So moved.
Lorcher: Second.
Seal: It's been moved and seconded to close the public hearing for File No. H-2022-
0070. All in favor, please, say aye. No opposed. Public hearing is closed.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. TWO ABSENT.
Seal: Okay. And with that I will take any discussion, a motion --
Lorcher: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Commissioner Lorcher, go right ahead.
Lorcher: We need daycare, so -- and this is a -- seems like a good location, because it's
-- it's Linder and -- and Chinden; right?
Seal: Uh-huh.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 32 of 34
Lorcher: So, there is lots of families around there. So, it looks good.
Grace: Yep. And it's a good -- it's a good artery for people to drop people off on their
way to work, so --
Lorcher: Right.
Grace: -- I would be ready for a motion, Mr. Chairman.
Seal: Feel free. Feel free.
Grace: After considering all staff, applicant, and public testimony, I move to approve File
No. H-2022-0070 as presented in the staff report for the hearing date of November 17th,
2022, with no modifications.
Lorcher: Second.
Seal: It's been moved and seconded to approve File No. H-2022-0070 with no
modifications. All in favor please say aye. No opposed, so motion carries. Thank you.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. TWO ABSENT.
Starman: Mr. Chairman, before your quick -- your colleagues are quick to make a motion
to adjourn, can I take care of a little housekeeping for like 60 seconds?
Seal: Possibly.
Starman: Possibly.
Seal: Go right ahead.
Starman: Mr. Parsons asked me -- he had to step -- step away this evening, but you may
recall -- Commissioners, you may recall we made a commitment to provide some training
to the Commission periodically from time to time as -- as the calendar allowed. So, I think
that Mr. Parsons and our planning manager Caleb Hood and I may -- may collaborator as
well, but we are looking to provide some training to the Commission on your -- at your
December 15th meeting. So, if you want to just sort of kind of make a note of that, we
will follow up in writing. If that's a problem for a majority of the Council -- or for a majority
of the Commissioners we can look for an alternate date. But right now we are thinking
December 15th and in terms of topics we spoke a little bit with Commission -- with the
Chairman Seal earlier this evening and we are thinking about when each of you became
a Commissioner we provided some one-on-one training, somewhere like 90 to -- 90
minutes to two hours worth of training and we are thinking about doing kind of a summary
of that or a condensed version of that, kind of a -- a refresher course so to speak and kind
of just sort of -- now that you have had some time in the seat and you have had some
experience doing what you are doing, to kind of go back over that might be more
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 33 of 34
meaningful to you now that you have actually, you know, had some time to make
decisions. So, I just want to mention those two things for you that we are looking at
December 15th. We may start like at 5:15 before the usual 6:00 p.m. starting time and,
then, we will try to, you know, keep -- keep to a condensed schedule. So, we will likely
survey the group -- maybe I would ask the city clerk's office to survey the group to confirm
attendance, that we have enough Commissioners that can attend and, then, if you have
any -- if individual Council -- Commissioners have any particular topics or issues that you
would like us to address, feel free to drop a note or an e-mail or phone call to Bill Parsons
and we would be happy to try to accommodate that as well. Thank you for letting me do
that, Mr. Chairman. Appreciate it.
Seal: No problem. Thank you. Appreciate it.
Lorcher: I was hoping he was going to do a 60 second training.
Dodson: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Yes, sir.
Dodson: Before we adjourn I just wanted to say thank you all for your time and I mean
professionally thank you for making the commitment to be volunteer for this and I
appreciate working with all of you and those that are not here tonight. Again, on to my
next adventure, but I'm sure I will be in front of you again in my next role.
Seal: That -- we wish you the best for sure and it has been a pleasure to work with you
and we will -- I look forward to giving you a bad time when you are in Chambers.
Dodson: Yes.
Seal: We have -- we have already been told that anything submitted by your firm will be
heard last --
Dodson: Oh, that's --
Seal: -- forever.
Dodson: My wife will love that, so --
Lorcher: Good luck.
Seal: Thank you very much, Joe.
Dodson: You're welcome. Have a good night.
Seal: You, too. Thank you.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
November 17,2022
Page 34 of 34
Lorcher: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Commissioner Lorcher, go right ahead.
Lorcher: I motion we adjourn.
Grace: Second.
Seal: It's been moved and seconded that we adjourn. All in favor please say aye. We
are adjourned. Thank you.
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 7:50 P.M.
(AUDIO RECORDING ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS.)
APPROVED
ANDREW SEAL - CHAIRMAN 12-1-2022
ATTEST:
CHRIS JOHNSON - CITY CLERK 12-1-2022