2022-06-16 Meridian Planning and Zoning Meeting June 16, 2021.
Meeting of the Meridian Planning and Zoning Commission of June 16, 2021, was called
to order at 6:02 p.m. by Chairman Andrew Seal.
Members Present: Chairman Andrew Seal, Commissioner Patrick Grace, Commissioner
Maria Lorcher, and Commissioner Mandi Stoddard.
Members Absent: Commissioner Steven Yearsley, Commissioner Nick Grove and
Commissioner Nate Wheeler.
Others Present: Chris Johnson, Joy Hall, Kurt Starman, Bill Parsons, Joe Dodson, and
Dean Willis.
ROLL-CALL ATTENDANCE
Nate Wheeler X Maria Lorcher
X Mandi Stoddard Nick Grove
Steven Yearsley X Patrick Grace
X Andrew Seal - Chairman
Seal: Good evening and welcome to the Planning and Zoning Commission meeting for
June 16th, 2022. At this time I would like to call the meeting to order. The Commissioners
who are present for this evening -- evening's meeting are at City Hall and on Zoom. We
also have staff here from City Attorney and Clerk's offices, as well as the City Planning
Department. If you are joining us on Zoom this evening, we can see that you are here.
You may observe the meeting. However, your ability to be seen on screen and talk will
be muted. During the public testimony portion of the meeting you will be unmuted and,
then, be able to comment. Please note that we cannot take questions until the public
testimony portion. If you have a process question during the meeting, please e-mail
cityclerk@meridiancity.org and they will reply as quick as possible. If you simply want to
watch the meeting, we encourage you to watch this streaming on the city's YouTube
channel. You can access it at meridiancity.org/live. With that, let's begin with roll call.
Madam Clerk.
ADOPTION OF AGENDA
Seal: All right. The first item on the agenda is the adoption of the agenda. There are no
modifications, so can I get a motion to adopt the agenda?
Lorcher: So moved.
Stoddard: Second.
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June 16,2022
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Seal: It has been moved and seconded to adopt the agenda. All in favor say aye. Any
opposed? Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. THREE ABSENT.
CONSENT AGENDA [Action Item]
1. Approve Minutes of the June 2, 2022 Planning and Zoning
Commission Meeting
Seal: Next item on the agenda is the Consent Agenda. We just have one item on the
Consent Agenda and that is to approve the minutes of the June 2nd, 2022, Planning and
Zoning Commission. Can I get a motion to accept the Consent Agenda as presented?
Grace: So moved, Mr. Chairman.
Stoddard: Second.
Seal: It has been moved and seconded to adopt the Consent Agenda. All in favor say
aye. Any opposed? Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. THREE ABSENT.
Seal: All right. At this time I would like to briefly explain the public hearing process. We
will open each item individually and begin with the staff report. Staff will report their
findings on how the item adheres to the Comprehensive Plan and unify -- Unified
Development Code. After staff has made their presentation, the applicant will come
forward to present their case and respond to staff comments. They will have 15 minutes
to do so. After the applicant has finished we will open the floor to public testimony. Each
person will be called on only once during the public testimony. The Clerk will call the
names individually of those who have signed up on our website in advance to testify. You
will, then, be unmuted in Zoom or you can come to the microphones in Chambers. Please
state your name and address for the record and you will have three minutes to address
the Commission. If you have previously -- previously sent pictures or a presentation for
the meeting, it will -- it can be displayed on screen and you or the clerk will run the
presentation. If we have established that you are speaking on behalf of a larger group,
like an HOA, where others from that group will allow you to speak on their behalf, you will
have up to ten minutes. After all those who have finished -- after all those who have
signed in in advance have spoken we will invite any others who may wish to testify. If
you wish to speak on the topic you may come forward in Chambers or if on Zoom press
the raise hand button in the Zoom app or if you are only listening on a phone, please,
press Star 9 and wait for your name to be called. If you are listening on multiple devices,
such as a computer and a phone, please be sure to mute the extra devices, so we do not
experience feedback and we can hear you clearly. When you are finished if the
Commission does not have questions for you, you will return to your seat in Chambers or
you will be muted on Zoom. You will now no longer have the ability to speak and, please,
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
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remember, we will not call on you a second time. After all testimony has been heard, the
applicant will be given another ten minutes to come back and respond. When the
applicant is finished responding to questions and concerns, we will close the public
hearing and the Commissioners will have the opportunity to -- to discuss and hopefully
be able to make final decisions or recommendations to City Council as needed.
ACTION ITEMS
2. Public Hearing for Pickleball Court Subdivision (H-2022-0025) by The
Land Group, Inc., Located at 4050 W. McMillan Rd. at the northeast
corner of N. Joy Street and W. McMillan Rd.
A. Request: Annexation of 4.96 acres of land to be zoned from RUT in
the County to the R-4 zoning district.
B. Request: A Preliminary Plat consisting of 14 single-family residential
building lots and 4 common lots on 4.58 acres of land in the
requested R-4 zoning district.
Seal: And with that at this time I would like to open the public hearing for Item No. H-
2022-0025 for Pickleball -- Pickleball Court Subdivision. We will begin with the staff
report.
Dodson: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Just getting the presentation up for you. All right. So,
as noted, the first one before us tonight is for Pickleball Court. The requests before you
tonight are for annexation and zoning and preliminary plat. The request for annexation is
for 4.96 acres of land to be zoned from RUT in the county to the R-4 zoning district and
the preliminary plat consists of 14 single family residential building lots and four common
lots on approximately four and a half acres of land in the requested R-4 zoning. The
subject four and a half acres currently contains a barn or other agricultural building or two.
The previous home appears to have been removed according to the latest aerial imagery.
Subject site is abutted by two public roads, McMillan Road to the south and Joy Street to
the west. Abutting the north and east property lines are existing R-4 developments,
Vicenza Subdivision to the east and Summerwood to the north. The subject property is
designated as medium density residential on the future land use map, which allows
residential development at three to eight dwelling units per acre. The proposal for 14
building lots on four and a half acres constitutes a gross density of 3.06 units per acre,
which is nearly at the bottom of the allowed density. The medium building -- the minimum
building lot size proposed is 8,000 square feet, which is the minimum lot size for the R-4
zoning district as well. The adjacent developments to the east and north are of similar
density and lot size, which make this project consistent with the existing development.
With the existence of Joy Street along the entire west boundary, the subject property
should act -- or I should say the subject project should act as a transition towards a higher
density approved at the corner of Black Cat and McMillan further to the west. Access is
proposed via a new local street connection to Joy Street, which is an existing local street
that directly connects to West McMillan Road, which is an arterial street. Access to all
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June 16,2022
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proposed homes is from within the new local street in the subdivision. No opportunity
exists for a future stub street to the existing development, because there are no existing
stub streets. This would also be the case for any pedestrian connectivity as well, since it
is only the rear lot lines of homes abutting the property. The applicant is required to
dedicate additional right of way from McMillan Road along the south, as well as widen the
paved surface area adjacent to the site. The applicant is also required to reconstruct Joy
Street as half of a 33 foot wide local street section abutting the site, which includes curb,
gutter and sidewalk. The applicant has proposed both of these and is showing the correct
right of way, as well as the correct improvements. ACHD has approved the proposed
road connections and layout. Staff also supports the proposed road layout. Because the
project is less than five acres in size, UDC minimum for open space amenities does not
apply. However, the applicant is proposing some open space, which staff has analyzed.
The applicant is showing three main areas of open space. The required street buffer
along McMillan, an open space lot along the north boundary of the project, which is Lot
12, and an additional grassy area in the southeast corner of the site, which is noted to be
a future gravity irrigation pond. The applicant should add an exhibit in more detail to the
landscape line that shows how this pond will be constructed and what it will look like to
ensure compliance with CDC standards. Specifically, staff wants to ensure it will not be
a mosquito breeding ground, which is outlined in our code. The applicant -- sorry. Within
the Lot 12 open space lot, the preliminary plot has the notation that a pickleball court will
be present. The applicant should revise the landscape plans to depict the proposed
amenity and its location, but the applicant has requested flexibility and the type of sports
court to be installed. Therefore, the applicant has requested a modification to staff's
recommended DA provisions regarding the proposed amenity and staff does support that
flexibility. As of--well, as of this morning there was no public testimony on this application
and pretty sure that's still the case. Staff does recommend approval of this annexation
and project is generally consistent with the comprehensive plan and is a logical expansion
of city zoning. The requested revisions, after speaking with the applicant that I noted are
before you here with strikeout and underline. 1-A is a DA provision and, then, the bottom
two are actually site specific conditions. The applicant has also -- and I believe they have
a specific slide in their presentation regarding the placement of the sidewalk along
McMillan and the applicant would like that provision or that condition modified as well. I
have read that and I am fine with their proposed language or some variation of it in order
to ensure that the sidewalk is either within the right of way or within the -- the common
lot. Either way they have the minimum amount of landscaping, so I'm fine with their
revisions. And after that I will stand for any questions.
Seal: Okay. Thank you, Joe. At this time would the applicant like to come forward?
Good evening. Please state your name and address for the record.
Gardner: Sure. Matthew Gardner. Gardner Homes. Our address is 2078 West Everest
Lane in Meridian, Idaho. 83646. As stated earlier, this project is located on the northeast
corner of North Joy Street and West McMillan. You know, the project consists of one
parcel. The property is currently zoned RUT in Ada county and is in the City of Meridian
area of impact. The Comprehensive Plan map -- future land use map designation is
medium density residential. The designation allows for the dwellings as discussed earlier.
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June 16,2022
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The development will take access from North Joy Street as explained earlier and feed
itself. In total, the Pickleball Court Subdivision includes 4.58 acres with 18 total lots.
Sorry. Getting behind. Eighteen total lots. Three of those are common lots and 14 are
single home dwellings. The Pickle -- Pickleball Court Subdivision -- it kind of hard to read
and do this at the same time. Sorry. Get back to this side. Okay. These homes are
planned as one and two story single family homes of similar size and styles. We have
built these homes in the surrounding subdivision in Summerwood and in Vicenza and
BridgeTower West. So, they are conducive with -- with the homes surrounding. The
common areas, including the centrally located common open space lot, are designated
to be easily accessible to the subdivision homeowners. Sidewalks are proposed
throughout the project to promote walkability and easy access to the amenities. The
public street frontage improvements will be constructed with the development. We did
remove the home as stated earlier for safety reasons. We kept finding the doors broken
down and -- and clothing and shoes and all sorts of things inside, so we did remove that,
because it was a safety hazard and have that permit. But the barn and the outbuilding
will be removed with the construction of the development. The stormwater from the
project will be collected, managed, and retained on site as stated on the landscaping plan
in -- I think it's a lot -- I can't remember. Sixteen is it? I believe. And we do have that
being drawn up, so we can provide that when it's available. The -- the platting -- we are
fine with everything, other than the -- the notes that we requested, as you have already
stated. And we have read the staff report and agree with the staff's analysis and
recommendations with just those few exceptions and we are grateful for you and we
appreciate all you do. Thank you.
Seal: Okay. Thanks very much. Are there any questions for the applicant or staff? All
right. Seeing none, we will go ahead and move on to the public testimony portion. Madam
Clerk, is there anybody signed up?
Hall: Theodore A. Lye.
Seal: All right. Come on up and give us your name and address and --
Lye: It's Theodore Lye. Ted Lye. 4945 North Bolsena Avenue, Meridian, Idaho. 83646.
And my home is directly to the north -- or to the east. So, it would be the -- their backyard
would be right in my backyard and we have had other development just north of their
development that they just finished here last year and the fugitive dust is one of the big
concerns I have and I would just like to find out about their fugitive dust control, because
the dust was terrible in our backyards and we weren't even close to that development
there and now it's going to be right in my backyard. So, I'm curious about the fugitive
dust. And, then, the -- the gentleman that spoke earlier talked about the single level and
two story homes and we would like to see behind our home, you know, some single level
homes, because, you know,just the big two story homes looking right down into our home
and I don't know if I would address you or the City Council, Planning and Zoning, about
that issue, but that's another one of my concerns and if I got that correct, the developer
is Gardner Homes. Is that correct?
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June 16,2022
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Seal: I believe so, yes.
Lye: And I would like to compliment Gardner Homes. You know, they have several of
them in Bridgetower West and -- and they are nice homes and I know people that live in
them and like them, but that's -- that's the questions I have is -- and I would also like to
see the plot and they said that Lot 12 is going to have the pickleball court, so I'm kind of
curious if we are going to have people playing pickleball in our backyard. So, that's the
only questions I have.
Seal: All right. Thank you very much, sir. Madam Clerk, do we have anybody else?
Hall: No, we do not.
Seal: All right. Is there anybody in Chambers that would like to come up and testify? I
haven't looked on -- do we have anybody on -- we have nobody online. Okay. Would the
applicant like to come back up and answer those questions and anymore that we may
have, please.
Gardner: Sure. Mr. Lye, thank you. I appreciate the compliments. In our online meeting
you stated those same --same issues you --you were suffering. For the north I apologize,
I wasn't involved in that, but we have built homes in there. We can only mitigate the
fugitive dust by watering it down as per the regulations that we will be held to by the city
and the government and watering those down at certain intervals. The good news, I
believe is this will be done in a more wetter climate in the fall and the winter, so -- at least
that's what we are hoping, so dust should be kept at a minimum I would believe. As for
two story and single story, not sure which ones will go where, but as the homeowners we
are just following suit with what's already recommended there and -- and what's
surrounding which are two story and single story. Thank you.
Seal: Okay. Thanks. And a question on the height of the homes real quick is -- is your
aim to kind of match as close as you can lot for lot? You know, if there is a two story on
the other side of the fence, two story and single story, kind of try and match that up?
Gardner: As we are able, yes. The lot sizes are pretty close to the same square footages,
but some are -- have a smaller building envelope, so we -- it will be hard to -- to try to do
that, but we will do that where we can.
Seal: Are there any other questions?
Grace: Mr. Chairman?
Seal: Go right ahead.
Grace: As it relates to the -- I guess it's the pickleball courts or other -- otherwise
recreational courts, is that something that will be used? Will it be lighted? Will it be used
late into the night to your knowledge?
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June 16,2022
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Gardner: So, our intention, as we were talking earlier, not to put lights, just to prohibit --
and, obviously, the HOA can design the CC&Rs in a way to -- you know, obviously, quiet
hours. I believe Meridian City starts at 10:00 p.m. and so we are hoping by not allowing
lights -- or us not installing lights will prohibit noise past 10:00 o'clock if there is such. But
we plan on landscaping to try to minimize whatever noise may be caused.
Seal: Okay. Any other questions?
Dodson: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Go right ahead.
Dodson: I just wanted to point out to the president's question that the court is proposed
at this here, sir. This lot here. Yes, sir. So if you are to the east, you will have some
homes in between. But I just wanted to -- even for the Commissioners I wanted to point
that out, so that everybody is clear where a Lot 12 is. I realize I said it, but you probably
can't read the numbers on your screen, so --
Gardner: Sorry.
Dodson: -- be the northernmost lot there.
Gardner: The one showing the three trees.
Dodson: Yep.
Seal: Okay. Awesome. Thanks, Joe.
Gardner: Thank you.
Seal: All right. Thank you very much. Okay. Can I get a motion to close the public --
public hearing?
Grace: So moved, Mr. Chairman.
Stoddard: Second.
Seal: Okay. It's been moved and seconded to close the public hearing for Item No. H-
2022-0025, Pickleball Court Subdivision. All in favor say aye. Any opposed? Okay.
Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. THERE ABSENT.
Seal: Okay. Who would like to go first?
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June 16,2022
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Grace: Mr. Chairman, it seems pretty straightforward from my perspective. I don't have
a lot of comment.
Seal: Okay. I tend to agree with that. So, Commissioner Lorcher, if you have anything
to add or if anybody would like to throw a motion out there I'm all ears.
Lorcher: Mr. Chair, I like the fact that it's R-4, so that -- that five acre parcel is not overly
constricted with buildings. So, that's good, too.
Seal: Okay. The only comment that I will make that caused me a little pause on this is
just where we are at with the road situation there and that the road report is fairly old. We
did recommend a denial for, you know, obviously, a large -- much larger subdivision that
was there in the McMillan area. So, this one being small and only being a few homes I
think is just a different beast altogether. So, that's the only -- like I said, that's the only
thing that kind of gave me a little -- a little bit of pause on here, but I just don't think it's the
same thing. With that anybody want to take a stab at it? And, please, make sure to
include -- if -- if you do make sure to include the -- what would we call in, Joe? It's your
agreement with the applicant's proposed amendments?
Dodson: Mr. Chair, I did add the one -- the fourth bullet point I added from the applicant's
slide, just to make it easier for you guys. But a simple motion stating per staff's
presentation is --
Seal: Okay.
Dodson: -- fine with me and I will know the language to change.
Seal: Okay. Perfect.
Grace: Mr. Chairman, would you be looking for a separate motion on that, then, or to
incorporate it into the --
Seal: Just integrate it into the original motion.
Grace: Okay. I will try.
Seal: Excellent.
Grace: Mr. Chairman, after considering all staff, applicant and public testimony, I move
to recommend approval to the City Council of file number H-2022-0025 as presented
in the staff report for hearing date of June 16th, 2022, and including the staff
presentation --
Seal: Recommendation?
Grace: -- recommendations without any modifications.
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June 16,2022
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Seal: Okay. Can I get a second?
Stoddard: Second.
Seal: Okay. It has been moved and seconded to recommend approval of Item No. H-
2022-0025, Pickleball Court Subdivision. All in favor, please, say aye. Any opposed?
Okay. Motion carries. Thank you very much.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. THREE ABSENT.
3. Public Hearing for Pinedale Subdivision (H-2022-0001) by Pine Project,
LLC, Located at 3275 W. Pine Ave. (Parcel #S1210417400)
A. Request: Annexation and Zoning of 1.22 acres of land with a request
for the R-15 zoning district.
B. Request: A Preliminary Plat for 12 building lots and 2 common lots
on 1.22 acres in the requested R-15 zoning district.
Seal: All right. And at this time I would like to open H-2022-0001, Pinedale Subdivision,
and we will begin with the staff report.
Dodson: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Hopefully this looks familiar to those of you who are here
-- I believe the first hearing in April is -- was before you guys at that night. So, long story
short, on -- I believe it was April 7th, applicant submitted a plan. We went to hearing here.
Planning and Zoning Commission recommended denial to City Council of that plan.
Applicant went to City Council, asked for a remand from City Council, back to P&Z with
revisions to the plan and City Council approved it. The request for remand I should say.
And that's why we are here again tonight. So, the applicant did revise the plan. So, I will
get into that now. So, as with the previous discussion or previous request, it is a request
for annexation and zoning of 1.22 acres of land with a request for the R-8 zoning district.
It was previously for the R-15 zoning district. So, that's one major change. Secondly, it
includes a preliminary plat for seven detached single family building lots and one common
lot, when previously it was nine lots with two common lots, including a common driveway.
So, as I will note again, the applicant has revised the plan multiple times to address
concerns noted by staff, as well as the Commission. So, when we originally met with
them we were at 15 lots, then, we were at 12 and, then, we were at ten and, then, nine
and now we are at seven. So, from a planning perspective and just working with the
applicant, the applicant is clearly responsive to discussion. The applicant is proposing to
construct detached single family dwellings within this proposed layout, which is seven
lots. At a gross density of 5.74 units per acre and average lot size of approximately 4,400
square feet. It was previously 3,200. And the minimum lot size is just over 4,000 square
feet, where previously the minimum lot size was approximately 2,250. The proposed use
of detached single family within the R-8 zoning district is a permitted use and the proposed
plat meets all UDC requirements. Access is proposed via extension of West Newland,
which is an existing -- existing local street at the west boundary. It is proposed to
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June 16,2022
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terminate within the site as a full cul-de-sac per ACHD standards and requirements. The
existing access comes from a private access across the Ten Mile Creek, which is this.
This is a vehicular bridge right now that kind of snakes in here. That access will be closed
upon development and in addition it's off site and will be utilized as a pedestrian, bridge
and multi-use pathway with the Foxcroft Subdivision to the northeast. Staff has included
a DA provision regarding that. Sorry. Let me see. The Newland Street cul-de-sac is
depicted with a 48 foot radius. According to the ACHD staff report, they have approved
this, but have noted that the condition --there is a condition that the cul-de-sac is -- should
be widened to a 50 foot radius. This may reduce the lot size of Lot 6, which is along the
boundary here and maybe even Lot 5 to less than the 4,000 square foot lot size. Staff
finds that if this is the case, there should be room within these five lots to move some lot
lines around and -- and ensure continued compliance with the minimum lot size. The Ten
Mile Creek runs along the entire east property line and requires a hundred foot easement,
which is depicted here. A hundred feet here. It's 50 feet on each side from the center
line. It covers the buildable area of this plot even more. So, yes, the encumbrances of
the cul-de-sac and the creek easement. Staff has included a DA provision requiring side
loaded garages where possible in order to help with these encumbrances and reduce the
amount of curb cuts onto the cul-de-sac. This type of design can force longer driveways
that go deeper into each site, which allow for more off-street parking. The design also
creates an opportunity for the living area of each home to be closer to the street, because
the living -- living area setback is ten feet, whereas the garage setback is 20 feet. So,
essentially, that allows for more building area than which is shown on the site plan
currently. However, staff does note that the lots may not be wide enough to accommodate
the required parking pad for side loaded garages. The applicant should continue working
to mitigate these issues and revise the plat accordingly, unless Commission or Council
removes staff's recommended DA provision and just go with front loaded garages. There
were previously 13 pieces of public testimony for the previous approval. There was one
additional piece for the remand, but it discussed objection to 12 lots, which is not being
proposed and hasn't been proposed for many, many months. So, maybe they like seven.
But they have responded to 12. Staff does recommend approval with the conditions noted
for this small county enclave. To be frank, I think this is probably one of the best things
we are just going to get here. When you have seven lots on a cul-de-sac, it's just not a
lot of room, so should Commission have questions I will answer them.
Seal: Okay. Thanks very much. Would the applicant like to come forward, please? Good
evening and welcome back. Please give us your name and address for the record and
the floor is yours.
Conti: Good evening. I'm Antonio Conti. 7661 West Riverside Drive in Garden City.
83714. First I want to apologize, I missed the last meeting. I was visiting my elderly
parents in Switzerland, so I tried to do the offline thing, but that didn't work well. What we
are proposing here it's another iteration of this project. We are coming down to seven
lots. Seven lots, it's -- you know, they are averaging 4,000 square feet. We are at total
-- we are proposing an R-8 zoning versus the R-15 that we had originally, which matches
with the zoning of the parcel adjacent to the site. We are proposing -- how do we move
-- arrows? Thank you. There we go. The site 1 .2 acres. Single family residential about
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June 16,2022
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58 percent worth of the lots will be able to have a house. We are about 20 -- 19 percent
with the open space and 22 percent is the cul-de-sac. We tried several ways to get rid of
the cul-de-sac, doing hammerhead, private roads, but there as no way around it.
Including the size to 50 feet as mentioned, we can make that work. We have plenty of
space and some have bigger lots to fit an additional two feet. Not too concerned about
that portion of it. The gross residential density is about 5.7 dwelling units per acre, which
is pretty much in line with what we are asking for. We have -- you know, this is just a
picture of the site. The site right now -- it's -- you know, it's a mess. There is an
abandoned house and is -- is moving everything out, just clean it up, trying to get a little
bit more pleasant. As we showed, the common area is going to be along the canal. We
are going to have a sidewalk all along the common area connecting the foot bridge that
connects to the Foxcroft Subdivision to the northeast and, then, it's going to tie into the
Union Pacific Railroad, which my understanding is going to be a future path in the long
range plan of the City of Meridian. Here is some --just some elevations. We have done
this elevation in other places. We understand we are trying to make some side load
garage. That's beyond my understanding. I don't do houses. Don't understand houses.
I'm sure that the architect may be able to come up with some solution. There is some
really creative solutions out there. May not be all of them side loaded, but I'm sure we
can get someone in there as requested. Just more picture of what they are proposing. It
just -- the smaller houses designed for, you know, older gentleman like me that have no
kids. So, that's -- that's the plan. Any questions?
Seal: Okay. Any questions for the applicant or staff at this point? Okay. One -- one
quick thing, Joe, for you. The 4,000 square foot lot that is -- that's nothing that could be
an alternative compliance. I mean that is code; correct?
Dodson: Yeah. That is correct. Mr. Chair, yeah. That's code. Can't get around the
minimum lot size.
Seal: Okay. And, then, the --the side load garages that was -- I mean is that, essentially,
a best effort statement, more or less in the staff report, or is it more mandatory than that?
Dodson: Mr. Chair, I actually made it a DA provision. So, if Commission wants to
recommend that it be removed as a DA provision and more of a best effort, that --
understand. We are just trying to help with the off street parking issues and -- I mean you
can't park in the cul-de-sac in general, but people tend to, so I was just trying to find a
creative way to help get some longer driveways to have some more off-street parking for
the residents and help maybe mitigate some of those issues that Chesterfield has stated
that they already have. But, space permitting, it may or may not be allowed. So, if a DA
provision isn't appropriate because it is so hard and fast, then, I could understand
softening that.
Seal: Thank you. Anybody else have questions for the applicant? Commissioner
Lorcher? All right. Thank you very much.
Conti: Thank you very much.
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June 16,2022
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Seal: Okay. At this time we will move to the public testimony portion. Has anybody
signed up?
Hall: There is not.
Seal: Nobody signed up and still nobody online I would imagine. Nope. Okay. With that
if there is no other questions, applicant, do you have anything else to add it all? If not
that's okay. And come back up and -- more than welcome to come back up.
Conti: The only item, if I can request, is that the garage -- to make it look flexible. Just
because it's that difficult lot, a difficult parcel. If you can make some flexibility and leave
it up to staff to work out the final detail that would be appreciated.
Seal: Okay.
Conti: Thank you very much.
Seal: Thank you, sir. Appreciate it. And with that can I get a motion to close the public
testimony portion of file number H-2021-0001, Pinedale Subdivision.
Stoddard: So moved.
Grace: Second.
Seal: It's been moved and seconded to close the public hearing for Item No. H-2022-
0001. All in favor say aye. Any opposed? Okay. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. THREE ABSENT.
Seal: Who would like to chime in first?
Grace: Mr. Chairman, just a discussion point. About the side loaded garages, are we
being asked to put in a -- to approve the recommended DA provision which would
preclude the ability to do that?
Dodson: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Go right ahead.
Dodson: Sure. I will answer that for you, Commissioner Grace. That's right. I just want
to make sure. It's currently a DA provision, so if-- if Commission agrees with it --whoever
makes the motion agrees with that you would just say I recommend approval to City
Council as presented in the staff report. If you want to modify that you would say I agree
-- recommend approval with the following modifications and, then, you could state you
recommend removing it as a DA provision or recommend being more specific that says
four lots or only two lots or where applicable, something like that to soften it. We could
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
Page 13 of 23
recommend removing it as a DA provision altogether and adding it as more of a plat
condition, which is usually, in general, a little more flexible and, then, offer some of that
flexibility in there as well. But it's already in the staff report as a recommendation, so if
you don't want to offer flexibility you would have to modify it.
Grace: Mr. Chairman. Right. I understand that piece. I'm just -- it's already in the staff
report, but what does it do? What does it say?
Dodson: Oh. It specifically states that the applicant shall include side loaded garages.
Grace: Shall include them.
Dodson: Yes. As a provision. Correct,
Grace: Okay.
Dodson: So, seven lots you -- you know, math -- you can't get all sideloaded garages
there, but you -- if you wanted to further soften it you could just -- I think even adding
where applicable would -- and per the discussion, myself and the applicant would work
together to figure out where we can or cannot do that.
Seal: And that -- that's where we -- generally speaking in the past when something like
this comes up, if it's -- if there is a -- because there is a lot of moving parts to it where
there --the cul-de-sac's actually going to get bigger, the lot lines are going to be adjusted,
so -- I mean generally speaking, what we -- the way that we have worded it in the past is
that the applicant continue -- continue to work with staff on the provision for, you know,
whatever it happens to be. So, that way if -- that's -- when I have done that in the past
that's my way of supporting staff, but understanding that -- that they understand that that
might need to change just because of the amount of change that's coming forward.
Grace: Right. And I think that's probably, Mr. Chairman, where I would fall is to not go
toward the rigidity of including it, but giving some flexibility that they could work it out as
needed. Personally that's where I am on it.
Seal: Good.
Parsons: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Yes, sir.
Parsons: This is Bill. Joe and I were having a sidebar conversation, too, and you certainly
can strike that condition all together and just add a provision that they get design review
approval for their homes prior to getting a building permit. We -- we have that authority
in the code to do that. Typically we don't want to do that with single family homes,
because it's not required, but this is annexation -- or a rezone annexation, so you have
that ability for staff to work with the applicant on those home designs before they get to a
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
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building permit and that way we can massage those elevations, make sure they are
compatible with the surrounding developments and maybe curtailing some of those
issues you may be having, whether or not homes fit on these lots or not. It's kind of that
second chance of getting -- making sure something fits here. It's -- we will leave it up to
how you want to proceed tonight, but just throwing out another option for you.
Seal: Okay. Thank you. Commissioner Stoddard? Commissioner Lorcher, is -- anything
to add?
Lorcher: Mr. -- Mr. Chair?
Seal: Commissioner Lorcher, go ahead.
Lorcher: I appreciate the builder continuing to revise to make best use of the space. It's
so tiny at one, 2.2 acres, taking out the shared driveway is a big improvement and having
all of the units on the cul-de-sac where they have individual access I think is key. I lived
in a -- on a cul-de-sac in Parkside Creek previously and the more driveway space you
could have the better, because all those driveways spill on to each other with no
landscaping in between many times and so if there is multiple cars, having a bigger
driveway will be key to keeping that cul-de-sac clear.
Seal: I would one hundred percent agree with that. That -- that is the one concern that I
have is I always think of the, you know, Super Bowl weekend parties and things like that
where you get two or three of those houses that decide to have an event like that and the
next thing you know parking is a big issue where generally speaking on any given night
it's not necessarily going to be. So, that and the service vehicles that have to go through
there, if there is anything -- one vehicle on the street in a cul-de-sac can cause that to
become less than fun for the service vehicles that need to get in there. Thank you.
Anybody else? I will take a motion. Anybody?
Grace: Mr. Chairman, I have been writing. I will make an attempt.
Seal: Commissioner Grace, go right ahead.
Grace: Mr. Chairman, after considering all the staff, applicant, and public testimony, I
move to recommend approval of City Council -- to the City Council of file number H-2022-
0001 as presented in the staff report for the hearing date of June 16th, 2022, with the
following modification: That would be to relax the requirement of the DA provision
regarding the side loaded garages in favor of allowing the applicant flexibility to work
through those issues with staff.
Seal: Second from anyone?
Stoddard: Second.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
Page 15 of 23
Seal: It's been moved and seconded to approve Item No. H-2022-0001, Pine Pinedale
Subdivision, with the aforementioned modification. All those in favor, please, say aye.
Any opposed? Okay. Motion carries. Thank you very much.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. THREE ABSENT.
4. Public Hearing for Lot 8 Retail Building (H-2022-0034) by Larson
Architects, located at 3333 W. Chinden Blvd.
A. Request: Conditional Use Permit for a drive-through establishment
within 300 feet of another drive-through facility on 0.9 acre of land in
the C-G zoning district.
Seal: All right. At this time I would like go ahead -- like to open Item No. H-2022-0034
for Lot 8 Retail Building and we will begin with the staff report. I will slow down a little bit.
No.
Parsons: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Seal: Thanks, Bill.
Parsons: I'm -- I'm covering the next two items for Sonya this evening. She had some
prior engagement, so I was happy to fill in for you this evening. So, both of these projects
that you will be hearing are pretty much similar to one another. They are right next to
each other in the same development, so in the interest of time and just making everything
expeditious for us this evening I will go into a little bit more detail probably in this CUP,
but just know some of that will carry over into the next presentation in a more brief version,
so that we can have you act on both these applications this evening. So, the first CUP
tonight is for Lot 8 Retail Building and the reason why this conditional use permit is in
front of you this evening is because it's within 300 feet of another drive through. If you
had a chance to read the staff report, we did note that with the -- this CUP and the one
you will be listening to next hearing item, there will be a total of six in this Costco
development. So, there is quite a few happening -- quite a few drive throughs happening
in this development, which is kind of a common theme these days with what's been
happening in the last several years. So, this particular site sits on 0.9 acres of land. It's
currently zoned C-G and it's located at 333 West Chinden Boulevard. If you -- if some of
you recall this property was annexed in 2018 with the Lost Rapid Subdivision annexation
and the current comprehensive plan designation for the property is commercial, which
that C-G zone is consistent with that designation. On the screen before you it does show
you the revised landscape -- or site plan and the landscape rendering for the proposed
lot. I would mention to the Commission that -- if you can see my cursor here and if you
had a chance to look at the previous exhibit, the lot lines don't quite marry up to the current
configuration of the property. We did note in the staff report that these two lots will have
to go through what we call an administrative property boundary adjustment to change the
configuration of the property. So, the way you see these lots -- or the way of these sites
are designed tonight they are not actually the way they are configured now, but they will
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
Page 16 of 23
go through that process if they get approval tonight to change the boundary of those lots
in order to meet these new -- these configurations that you see. UDC does require that
the applicant provide adequate stacking and comply with UDC 11-4-3-11 . If you had a
chance to look at the staff report we did -- the site -- this particular site does comply with
those drive through standards. You will also note that there is a -- those lot lines are
shared for -- have shared access, so there will be cross-access between both properties
as well. The applicant does have to address some pedestrian connectivity. That's one
of the requirements of our drive through standards is that they have safe pedestrian
access and they need to demonstrate that on a site plan. Not only does this one have it,
but so does the next one and so I have -- in earlier -- previous e-mails today I did -- we
did get a correspondence that they are working those issues out and as they go through
that certificate of zoning compliance with staff, they should address some of those
concerns moving forward. So, we are pretty confident that that can be accomplished
between the two properties here. You can see here that this particular lot will house a
multi-tenant building and, then, the drive through is on the westernmost tenant space and
it will be a -- a restaurant use. Staff did analyze the parking against UDC standards,
because this is a -- a food service facility we are going to apply the more restrictive parking
standards for restaurants, which is one per 250 square feet of gross floor area and this
site, again, does exceed UDC standards. Here are the building elevations. I have -- I
have worked with the applicant for many years, so I have no doubt as they go through
the process with staff that they will meet the architectural standards manual and we will,
again, verify that at staff level if they get approval tonight. I have had a chance to look at
the public record. There was no public testimony on this application and we did receive
a response from the applicant in agreement with the conditions of approval. With that I
will conclude my presentation and stand for any questions.
Seal: All right. Thank you, Bill. Would the applicant like to come forward? Good evening,
sir. If you could give us your name and address for the record and the floor is yours.
Larson: Yes. Good evening, Mr. Chairman, Members of the Planning and Zoning
Commission. My name is Cornel Larson. My address is 210 Murray in Boise, Idaho, and
I'm here tonight representing the applicant on the project. Bill did an excellent job of
presenting the -- the staff report and we are in agreement with the staff report. We would
be happy to answer any questions if you have those, but at this point in time we are okay
to move forward. We do have the engineer working on the lot line adjustment that was
mentioned and we have adjusted the site plan to most of the staff conditions. We have a
few other ones with the adjacent lot we may need to address, but we can work through
that.
Seal: Okay. Thank you very much. Is there any questions for the applicant? All right.
Thank you very much. Appreciate it and we will see -- Madam Clerk, do we have anybody
-- public -- anybody signed up for public testimony?
Hall: No, there is not.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
Page 17 of 23
Seal: All right. If anybody in Chambers would like to come up. I saw a hand. No? Okay.
Waving Bill to come up, because he's already talked, so -- all right. Seeing none, if the
applicant has nothing further to add you can signify no. Okay. Thank you, sir. Any
questions for the applicant or staff from any of us before we close the public hearing
portion?
Grace: Mr. Chairman, just a quick question for staff. The picture on the site plan revised
that I'm looking at here, those -- it looks -- you said that the window -- the drive-through
window is on the west end of that building. What's -- what's the remainder of the building
going to be? Is it -- is it all the same establishment?
Parson: Mr. Chairman, Members of the Commission, we don't know at this point. All we
know is that the one tenant is at this west side of the building. It could be anything from
retail to whatever is allowed in the C-G zone and that's why when I was presenting to you
I had mentioned that we used the more restrictive parking standards to make sure that
there -- there are additional restaurant uses going in there that we have accounted for
that additional parking.
Grace: Okay.
Parsons: So, we have taken the worst case scenario, but I think the applicant may be
better suited to answer that question.
Seal: Go ahead.
Larson: This is Cornel Larson again. The tenant on the west end we have worked a
lease on going with an ice cream facility, so we anticipate it being a little bit of a low traffic
condition since it is ice cream. The other one would be a bulk furniture type of tenant that
would be on -- on the east side of that -- or the three bays on the east side. In addition,
we actually designed the parking and the layout so that if the whole building did go to a
restaurant at one time we would have adequate parking for that and that's been an
ongoing discussion in the City of Meridian about adequate parking for restaurants for a
few years. So, we have tried to address conditions that we could at this point in time.
Seal: Okay. Thank you very much.
Grace: And, Mr. Chair, I was just trying to inquire that whoever does -- whatever tenant
does move in there there that occupy, that they -- they take that subject to knowing that
there is a -- a drive through around the building.
Seal: Right.
Grace: So, as long as they are aware, yeah.
Seal: Yeah. It looks pretty similar to the layout of one of the other establish -- or the
buildings that are there that has drive through on the end and, then, other businesses that
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
Page 18 of 23
are already there. So, it's -- there is already something like this established over there on
the Ten Mile side of it. And it seems to work okay so far. As far as I know. Quick question
for staff. The -- the pedestrian traffic study, I mean, essentially -- or pedestrian traffic
safety, we don't have to do anything special in a motion to ensure that that's included,
that's already included in the staff report as a recommendation and it will be handled?
Okay.
Parsons: That is correct, Mr. Chairman.
Seal: Excellent. Just wanted to make sure of that.
Parsons: On this particular application, yes.
Seal: On this one. Okay. Good -- good note there. With that if I can -- and if there is no
other questions, can I get a motion to close the public hearing for H-2022-0034.
Lorcher: So moved.
Stoddard: Second.
Seal: It's been moved and seconded to close the public hearing for File No. H-2022-
0034. All those in favor say aye. Any opposed? Okay. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. THREE ABSENT.
Seal: All right. If there is any -- anybody wants to add anything further or we can just
move right to a motion for this one.
Lorcher: Mr. Chair?
Seal: Commissioner Lorcher, go right ahead.
Lorcher: I'm going to go ahead with a motion.
Seal: Okay. Please do.
Lorcher: After -- after reviewing all staff report and public testimony, I motion to approve
File No. H-2022-0034 as presented in the staff report with no modifications.
Stoddard: Second.
Seal: Okay. It's been moved and seconded to approve Item No. H-2022-0034. All those
in favor, please, say aye. Any opposed? Okay. Motion carries. Thanks, sir.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. THREE ABSENT.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
Page 19 of 23
5. Public Hearing for Slim Chickens (H-2022-0028) by Larson Architects,
located at 3369 Chinden Blvd.
A. Request: Conditional Use Permit for a drive-thru establishment
within 300 feet of another drive-through facility on 1 .13 acres of land
in the C-G zoning district
Seal: All right. Bill, do you want to do -- I won't call it part two.
Parsons: Yeah. Let's do part two. CUP part two.
Seal: Excellent.
Parsons: So, the last item on the agenda tonight is the Slim Chickens conditional use
permit. So, this is the parcel just directly to the west of the one you just acted on. This
site will consist of 1.13 acres and it's again zoned C-G and it -- it's located -- the address
is 3369 West Chinden Boulevard. Again, a lot of the --the public testimony that I provided
-- or at least the staff report I gave you on the last one applies here as well. You can see
here where the property line is changing, so that they can accommodate some of that
additional parking for this particular restaurant use. This building will be a single tenant,
approximately 3,000 square feet and, again, it is a restaurant use, so we did apply that
same parking ratio, one per 250 square feet, which this site will have 35 total parking
spaces in excess of UDC standards. Probably the -- the biggest concern that staff had
with this particular layout was just the pedestrian -- demonstrating that pedestrian safety.
Sonya did note that in the staff report and asked you guys to weigh in on that topic,
whether or not the applicant has done adequate pedestrian circulation on the site. As I
mentioned to you, did receive an e-mail from the applicant today that they are, again,
working with the adjacent property owner to mitigate some of that concern. I would
mention to you that staff did recommend that we had some additional pedestrian signage
going in this landscaping to help mediate some of that concern and let ongoing traffic --
that stacking in this lane to watch for pedestrians that may cross along the stacking lane
here and, then, the applicant also changed their elevations and added this vestibule and,
then, had a doorway on the north side and south side of that vestibule, so that they would
facilitate pedestrians coming from the walkways that they are providing along -- along --
excuse me. Using those sidewalks that are along the east side of the building. So, I think
from our perspective, as long as there is additional signage and the applicant's working
with the owner to the -- to the east, I think we can probably get there. But, again, staff did
ask that you weigh in on that and whether or not you felt there was adequate safe --
pedestrian safety happening on the site as well. The applicant is in agreement with the
conditions of approval. They did reach out to staff and ask about some additional
speakers within the patio area. We let them know that there was really no approval
processes as part of tonight's deliberations and, then, they have some deficient
landscaping that they can work with staff on through the alternative compliance process.
So, they are -- they are aware of what they can do moving forward if they get an approval
tonight. So, with that I will just conclude my presentation and stand for any additional
questions.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
Page 20 of 23
Seal: Thank you. Applicant like come forward, please. Need your name and address
for the record and the floor is yours. Thank you.
Pengra: Certainly. Thank you, Planning Commission. My name is Chris Pengra, the
applicant. I live at 9398 North Bell Street in Eagle Mountain, Utah. So, we came up here
to be with you this evening. I'm a planning commissioner for the city that I live in, so I
appreciate your time and also I understand that I am the only thing standing between you
and getting back to your family, so I will keep it really brief. One, just -- since there was
some correspondence going back and forth with staff today, we have been able to work
through all of those items with our engineer and, essentially, we are in agreement with all
of the conditions as presented in the staff report. So, we don't have anything. We can --
we can address any remaining issues that the staff identified. And, then, we have been
working with the -- with the property owner next door to put in that pedestrian access.
Then I had a -- a very few slides. Let's see. I don't know if those slides will be shown,
but I will just tell you very briefly, Slim Chickens is a brand that's brand new to Idaho, so
this -- this will be the first store in Idaho. It's a pretty rapidly growing brand. They are in
quite a few other states. Have got about 200 stores right now and high quality chicken
and southern hospitality. So, we focus on as friendly service as we can possibly give and
we focus on really high quality chicken tenders. A little bit different than what you get with
a lot of other restaurants that -- that are chicken based and we -- we try to build a really
nice product. So, you will see from the -- from the elevations the architecture is a little bit
unique. We try to build nice buildings that are aesthetically pleasing and offer an
environment where families are happy to come and have a meal and, then, the last thing
is we are a family run group, so we are a family restaurant holding company. You see
pictures of us there. A couple of close friends that are nonmanaging partners and, then,
my father-in-law and my brother-in-law and -- and we are excited to bring something new
to the community. That's my -- that's my presentation. How do I do?
Seal: Perfect.
Pengra: Okay.
Seal: Thank you much. Do we have any questions for the applicant? Or staff I should
say? Commissioner Lorcher, do you have anything?
Lorcher: I'm good.
Seal: Okay. Anybody in Chambers? No? Madam Clerk, do we have anybody signed
up for public testimony?
Hall: We do.
Seal: Okay.
Hall: We have three people, but I do believe they are the applicants. I have a Christian
Michaelson, Chris Pengra, okay, and Josh Richardson -- or Richards.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
Page 21 of 23
Seal: That's okay.
Hall: That's what I thought. Okay.
Seal: I did the same thing for my confirmation, so -- if anybody else in Chambers would
like to testify raise your hand and come on up. No? All right. Seeing no public testimony,
no questions -- applicant, was there anything further you would like to add? Signifying
no. So, I will take a motion to close the public hearing for H-2022-0028.
Grace: So moved, Mr. Chairman.
Stoddard: Second.
Seal: It's been moved and seconded to close the public hearing -- public hearing for File
No. H-2022-0028. All in favor, please, say aye. Any opposed?
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. THREE ABSENT.
Seal: Okay. Does anybody have anything to add on this? I mean the one thing that we
have here is the pedestrian safety. It looks like they are -- to me it looks like they are
complying with everything that's been recommended, so it is a little concerning in some
respects. I mean if-- you know, if it gets really really busy there are going to be cars that
are going to be stacking there and people will have to walk across that drive aisle in order
to get there, but -- I don't know. I guess that just depends on how busy it is, so --
Grace: And -- and I apologize, Mr. Chairman, maybe I -- when you opened it up for
questions to staff maybe I should have asked the question, but what -- it looks like it -- it
says at a minimum staff recommended signage. What other options are available?
Seal: Bill, go -- feel free to -- feel free to answer that.
Parsons: Well, Mr. Chairman, Members of the Commission, I think that's what I tried to
speak to is if you look at this -- and this is a quick plan that was put together, so it doesn't
quite represent the elevations here, but you can see originally the doors had folks coming
in straight into the site and that's where this applicant was able to change their design,
put that vestibule on and, then, modify the entrances into the restaurant portion of the
building so you are not having to enter straight on across the drive aisle, you can actually
go around and, then, hit some pedestrian access -- walkways to get into the building. So,
to me I felt like -- personally for me it sounds like they are meeting what I would look for
as a planner and adding that signage saying watch for pedestrians makes a lot of sense
to me. So, that's why staff -- we just wanted to pose that to you that we have -- we -- we
feel like it's there, but we just want to make sure you understand where we are coming
from with the additional signage and that we -- there is some concerns to have the two
crossings as showing on this plan along here along the north, particularly in this area. I
think some of -- to me I like this one a little bit better, because at least the cars are facing
north and you can see the pedestrians coming down through the driveway. One's a little
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
Page 22 of 23
bit more problematic to me. If I had another suggestion for the applicant I would ask them
to be mindful of what they are doing with this landscape island. If they were to lose one
parking stall and they would eliminate -- they wouldn't need that, because they wouldn't
exceed 12 parking stalls in a row and, then, they wouldn't have that landscaping that
could block visibility for people as well. So, again, there is --there is little tweaks we could
do to sit here and finesse that, but I think signage goes a long way and just by them
addressing the building design I think helps quite a bit as well.
Seal: Okay. Thank you, Bill. Appreciate that. And with that does anybody else have
anything to add? The only thing that I thought is this was going to be -- because it's called
Slim Chickens that they would be -- the logo would be Slim Pickens dropping out of an
airplane on a chicken. That's the first thing that came to my mind, so I will just apologize
for that.
Grace: That changes everything, Mr. Chair.
Seal: It does change everything. Absolutely. So, if anybody would like to take a stab at
a motion I'm all ears.
Lorcher: Mr. Chair, what is the -- what is the number of the --
Seal: This is H-2020-0028 and it is a conditional use permit, so we are approve or deny.
Lorcher: Mr. Chair, I will take a stab at a motion.
Seal: Feel free.
Lorcher: After reviewing staff report and all public testimony, I motion to approve file
number H-2022-0028 as presented in the staff report, with no modifications.
Stoddard: Second.
Seal: It's been moved and approved to -- it's been moved and seconded to approve Item
No. H-2022-0028 for Slim Chickens. All those in favor, please, say aye. Any opposed?
Okay. Motion carries. Thank you very much. Appreciate it.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. THREE ABSENT.
Seal: All right. That was the last thing on there, so can I, please, get one more motion.
Grace: Mr. Chairman, I would move to adjourn.
Stoddard: Second.
Seal: It's been moved and seconded to adjourn. All in favor say aye. Any opposed?
Motion passes. Thank you very much.
Meridian Planning&Zoning Commission
June 16,2022
Page 23 of 23
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 7:04 P.M.
(AUDIO RECORDING ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS.)
APPROVED
6 30 1 2022
ANDREW SEAL - CHAIRMAN DATE APPROVED
ATTEST:
CHRIS JOHNSON - CITY CLERK