2021-05-13 Special Joint Meeting with West Ada School District VE IDIAN
City Council Regular Meeting
City Council Chambers, 33 East Broadway Avenue Meridian, Idaho
Thursday, May 13, 2021 at 5:30 PM
Minutes
Limited Seating is Available at City Hall. No Transportation Will be Provided to the Off-Site
Tour Location.
MERIDIAN CITY COUNCIL ROLL CALL ATTENDANCE
PRESENT
Councilwoman Liz Strader
Councilman Brad Hoaglun
Councilman Treg Bernt
Councilwoman Jessica Perreault
Councilman Luke Cavener
Mayor Robert E. Simison
ABSENT
Councilman Joe Borton
WEST ADA SCHOOL DISTRICT BOARD OF TRUSTEES ROLL CALL ATTENDANCE
PRESENT
Trustee Ed Klopfenstein
Trustee Sheena Buffi
Trustee Rusty Coffelt
Trustee Rene Ozuna
Trustee Amy Johnson
Dr. Mary Ann Ranells, Superintendent
ALSO ATTENDING
Dr. Derek Bub, Principal
Marci Horner, Planning and Development Administrator
ADOPTION OF AGENDA
DISCUSSION TOPICS
1. Individual Introductions of Meridian City Councilmembers and West Ada School
District Trustees
2. Presentation: Development Application Coordination and Analysis - Miranda
Carson, City of Meridian and Marci Horner,West Ada School District
ADJOURNMENT
6:21 pm
POST-MEETING SITE TOUR AND NOTICE OF QUORUM
3. The Meridian City Council and West Ada School District Board of Trustees will
attend a guided tour of Owyhee High School, 3650 N. Owyhee Storm Ave, Meridian,
ID 83646 following adjournment of the meeting.Although a quorum of members
will attend, there will be no business conducted and no minutes will be taken.
Item#1.
Meridian City Council - West Ada School District May 13, 2021.
A Joint Meeting of the Meridian City Council and the West Ada School District was called
to order at 5:33 p.m., Thursday, May 13, 2021, by Mayor Robert Simison.
Members Present: Robert Simison, Luke Cavener, Treg Bernt, Jessica Perreault, Brad
Hoaglun and Liz Strader.
Members Absent: Joe Borton.
Also present: Chris Johnson, Bill Nary, Miranda Carson, and Dean Willis.
ROLL-CALL ATTENDANCE
MERIDIAN CITY COUNCIL ROLL CALL ATTENDANCE
Liz Strader Joe Borton
_X_ Brad Hoaglun _X_Treg Bernt
X Jessica Perreault _X Luke Cavener
_X_ Mayor Robert E. Simison
WEST ADA SCHOOL DISTRICT BOARD OF TRUSTEES ROLL CALL ATTENDANCE
_X_ Ed Klopfenstein _X_ Sheena Buffi _X_ Rusty Coffelt
_X_ Rene Ozuna _X_Amy Johnson
_X_ Dr. Mary Ann Ranells, Superintendent
Simison: For the record it is Thursday, May 13th, at 5:34 p.m. We will open our meeting
with roll call attendance, Mr. Clerk.
Johnson: We will call the West Ada School Board to order and start with the Pledge of
Allegiance.
(Pledge of Allegiance recited.)
ADOPTION OF AGENDA
Simison: First item up for us is adoption of the agenda.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: I adopt the agenda as published -- I move that we adopt the agenda as published.
Hoaglun: Second the motion.
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Simison: Motion and second to adopt the agenda as published. Any discussion? If not,
all in favor say aye. Opposed nay. The ayes have it and the agenda is adopted.
MOTION CARRIED: FIVE AYES. ONE ABSENT.
DISCUSSION TOPICS
1. Individual Introductions of Meridian City Councilmembers and West
Ada School District Trustees
Simison: So, first of all, welcome to everybody. We appreciate getting together for this
evening's joint meeting. It's going to be a great opportunity to get an update on how our
staffs have been working together, as well as to meet the members of the board and take
a tour of the new facility in the community. So, without -- unless there is any other
pleasantries or other things that we need to do, let's jump right into it and get the
information and, then, we will move on to some food before we move out to go do the
tour. So, with that why don't we go around and do some introductions and let's start down
there with you, Councilman Cavener, and just work our way around.
Cavener: Sure. Good afternoon. Good evening, everyone. Luke Cavener, I'm on the
Meridian City Council. Oh, been on -- I'm in the fourth year of my second term. So,
have been on City Council for eight years. A West Ada student. Go Buckskins. Go
Appaloosas. Go Jaguars.
Coffelt: Hi. Rust Coffelt, trustee for Zone 4. Newest trustee on the board. So, I took a
seat at the end of January and live -- represent the Zone 4 and I live in the city of Eagle.
Hoaglun: I'm Brad Hoaglun, Seat 3, which means nothing right now, but someday might
when it comes to the districts. I was elected here in 2019, but previously served '08 to
'15 and this my second go round here.
Perreault: Jessica Perreault. I started my term in January of 2020 and prior to that served
three years as Planning and Zoning Commissioner with Mr. Bernt here and so, yeah, I
look forward to being around for a while.
Ozuna: I'm Rene Ozuna. I have been a West Ada trustee for five years now. I represent
Zone 5. I'm a Meridian resident. I also am a parent of kids in our district and a grandchild
in our district.
Johnson: She's also vice-chair of the board. Amy Johnson. And West Ada school trustee
for Zone 2, which is south Meridian and parent of kids in the district and graduated from
the district. Recently been chair since December.
Bernt: Council President Treg Bernt, just announcing our reelection campaign. Been on
the -- a City Council member for four years and I think I'm going to do it again. So, excited
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to be here this evening and appreciate West Ada being here. You guys are great partners
to have and excited to go see the high school.
Simison: Robert Simison. Been Mayor since -- 16 months, 18 months, I don't even know
how long. It's been a long year. Live in south Meridian. I have three kids in the West
Ada school -- two kids in the West Ada School District now, as one graduated last year,
but excited to meet the new board members and see where the West Ada District is going
to go over next future, so --
Bub: Derek Bub. Recently appointed superintendent. I will start July 1st. Extremely
excited to get to know you guys and develop that partnership or continue that partnership.
I have two kids in West Ada Schools, so passionate about education. Currently serve as
principal at Centennial High School.
Strader: -- and I'm in my second year of my first term on City Council and I have had kids
that have gone to West Ada schools. Homeschooling currently. And I will see what I have
for you. Excited about the partnership that we have and especially what we are building
together.
Buffi: I'm Sheena Buffi. I was appointed in November for a one year appointment. I live
in West Boise. I have three kids in West Ada and, then, one recently graduated in 2000.
Klopfenstein: I'm Ed Klopfenstein, I'm in Zone 1, which is the central Meridian area. I
have got three kids who have graduated from here. One is getting her doctoral now.
Another one is just finishing up her master's and third is training athletes for Tokyo. So,
pretty busy. Loved what we -- our district and our community has done for my kids and
wanted to pay back, so -- and also love the fact that the biker bar is getting painted, so --
Carson: Miranda Carson. I'm a coordination planner for the City of Meridian doing
education and transportation planning. I worked for the West Ada School District for five
years as transportation liaison and, then, spent about 14 months in South Florida doing
transit community development. I have two kids. Also a COVID homeschool mom right
now. We will see next year.
Ranells: Good evening. So nice to be here. I'm Mary Ann Ranells, the superintendent
of the West Ada School District, in my sixth year and appreciate everything we have done
together to help take care of our kids. It has luscious challenges this year.
Horner: I'm Marci Horner. This is my ninth year with the West Ada School District and
my first year as the planning and development administrator and I'm happy to be here
tonight.
Simison: Excellent. Well, thank you. So, with that we are just going to go on to Item 2
and turn this over to Miranda and Marci. Mr. Nary.
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Nary: Yeah. I'm Bill Nary. I'm the city attorney. I have been in this position for almost 17
years and prior to that I was on the City Council for three years and I have lived in Meridian
for about 35 years. So, I have had four kids graduate from the Meridian school -- or West
Ada School District. So, I'm a very big supporter of the district and the schools that we
have and already told Dr. Ranells personally I'm happy she's been able to retire and she
stepped into this district at a very tumultuous time. I don't know why she did it, but I'm
glad she did. But anyway -- so, that's -- that's -- that's who I am.
Johnson: I'm Chris Johnson, City Clerk. I have been with the city three years and the
last year I have also become IT and whatever else is going on in this room, so -- thank
you.
2. Presentation: Development Application Coordination and Analysis -
Miranda Carson, City of Meridian and Marci Horner, West Ada School
District
Simison: All right. With that I will turn this over to Miranda and Marci.
Carson: So, if it's okay with everybody I'm just going to stay seated. So, I was asked
tonight to just give an update on the coordination efforts between West Ada and the City
of Meridian. So, in August Marci and I met a few times to look into student generation
rates --to look at the student generation rates first. That was kind of the jumping off point.
To go back a little bit, when I first began my first week I was asked to make a coordination
plan for the City of Meridian with West Ada and I also worked with Marci on that. What
can we coordinate on? What questions do we have for each other? And, then, in August
we developed the student generation rate -- or I should say we updated it. West Ada has
always had a student generation rate that they use for development. So, we updated it
using census data, mostly local data. We did get a little bit of private homeschool data
from the National Center for Education statistics and, then, State Department of
Education and census data as well. A lot of analytics went into it. A few meetings I would
say went into it and that's where we got our student generation rate and that's probably
been one of the biggest pieces of our coordination having that -- that puzzle piece to use
when we are analyzing the impact of development. So, ongoing, as developments come
up, Marci and I both create separate impact reports. The school district submits their
letter and, then, I submit a school impact table as well for Council to review and we do
those reports in separate bubbles, which I think is good. I think it promotes some
transparency in the process. We do discuss the reports occasionally afterwards just to
look at how our numbers line up. Sometimes you might notice that there are slight
differences in the numbers just based on like statistical ways we do it, one to two kids
differences. We also occasionally have conversations -- what kind of development is
this? We are seeing a lot of new types of development in our area that aren't just cut and
dry high rise apartment or single family homes. We are seeing a lot of different types
coming in. So, we do have conversations occasionally of what -- what is this
development? Is it single family? Is it multi-family? What kind of numbers are we going
to see coming out of that. We also have pre-application meetings. For every developer
that wants to come into our city. They can come to the city staff beforehand and have a
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pre-application meeting to see what they will need before they go through the lengthy
application process. Marci is invited to attend or any West Ada representative is invited
to attend those. Marci generally attends. Sometimes Joe Yochum also will attend and
weigh in on issues. I also weigh in on any issues that might be related to students or --
or children, just because I have the background from West Ada, as well as other planning
issues that come up. We also have other cross-involvement. So, this year West Ada and
Boise invited representatives from every city to attend their student attendance area
committee. Is that the name of the committee? I think it's school attendance area
committee. So, they invited representatives from every city to attend as ex-officio
members to assist in that process however we could. So, I did attend some of those early
meetings and help however I could do that process, questions that parents on the
committee had regarding development or transportation that was coming in the valley or
different school districts, as well as how the committee had worked in the past. There
was I think three of us in the room that had sat on prior committees. So, just some
questions from the history of how those committees went as well and as a city I was very
grateful -- or as a city staff member that -- that city staff was invited this year to be on that.
So, I do appreciate that we had a seat at that table as ex-officio members. We also have
seats on our table for ex-officio members from the school district. So, we have our
Transportation Commission that Ian Updike serves on as an ex-officio commissioner to
help with any transportation related issues we have and weigh in from the school district
perspective. He also serves on our school zone subcommittee for the Transportation
Commission to look at more individual school zones and any transportation-related issues
around those and also this year I was invited to serve on the district's safety bus area
committee for the schools that were impacted in our area of development. So, we have
a lot of cross-involvement that's not just development. That's a lot of other things where
we have overlap between city staff and district staff and it's been great this year to have
that coordination between the two and get to talk to the different West Ada members. I
know other city staff members talk to West Ada staff as well, it's not just me. There is
planners that reach out to them. So, the coordination efforts between West Ada and City
Council are not just me and Marci, there is a lot of that network that come together. So,
that's been really great to see. Marci and I are in -- I would say weekly communication
with each over development issues, transportation issues, enrollment counts, anytime we
need those Marci is very quick to respond with those counts to help anything that we need
and, then, also we just -- we bounce ideas off each other when it comes to the statistical
analysis side of things or the AGS, the more technical side of things. So, those are all the
ways that we have coordinated and it was a lot, you know, in a short amount of time. But
I will turn it over to Marci if she has anything to add.
Horner: Yeah. I -- I really appreciated having a part -- having a partner with Miranda and
collaborating with her. She has been very valuable. She's a statistical genius, if you don't
already know. She does great with data analysis. So, I have really appreciated being
able to work with her and kind of just being able to contact her at any time. In addition to
what Miranda has spoken about, I would be happy to share some of the areas that I have
been focusing on. I have been very intentional about gathering information on future
developments and being more involved in those applications from earlier on in the
process, as Miranda said. I really appreciated the invitation by -- not just the City of
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Meridian staff, but other municipalities whose families we serve to be involved in and be
invited and participate in those pre-app meetings where we sit with the developers --
which allows me to proactively gather data, instead of reacting to the data later on. I have
been systematically tracking the developments from -- throughout this process. So, from
the application through the preliminary plat and final plat approvals and, then, I am
continuing to talk them through the construction phases until I see that students are
starting to live and move into those subdivisions. With this information I hope to be able
to refine our student generation rates and I think it's important during this crazy time of
growth in our area that we do reanalyze our rates to determine if the numbers that we are
using are accurate and, then, I have just finished this project I'm super proud of, I just
consolidated all of the development data in all of their various stages from all of the seven
agencies that our students live in, so it's into one source, so that I will be able to easily
collect -- have a collective picture of what kind of growth is happening in our area. For
example, it might be by attendance area, it could be by -- I will take a school like --
attendance area like Meridian High School that is predominantly City of Meridian
population, but also as developments in the city of Kuna and Canyon county, maybe some
Ada county or Star Middle School that does have a portion of -- a really strong growing
portion of Meridian, but also in Star, which is growing immensely, and Eagle. So, that will
allow me to look at that. All of that information in the picture. So I'm really looking forward
to starting to use that information.
Johnson: We have come a long way from where we were at last year.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Yeah.
Strader: Are we addressing questions openly or through you or --
Simison: Council Woman Strader, let's just go through me, that way it --
Strader: Perfect. Thank you so much and I can tell it's like night and day the coordination
level and the data we are getting is really improving a lot and I appreciate the coordination.
Probably the biggest thing I have seen and I know Councilman Cavener has brought it up
and a few other folks on City Council as well -- now I can tell we are developing this multi-
family student generation rate and it feels like it's very far from what we were using
previously, like students per unit or per -- per residential unit. It's much smaller, to the
point that a 360 unit multi-family development we think has 36 kids coming into the school
district and I guess I'm a little nervous, personally, to see such a huge change in the
student generation rate and understood that, yes, these are analytics to come up with
something, but that was my exact question was what are your intentions? Can you find
examples to back test to see -- hey, we thought this many kids would have come in, here
is an old development where we could have applied it and, then, see. But what are we
doing to test that assumption? And the reason I think it's important, especially now is that
we are really making decisions live based on that student generation rate. So, if you
could just give us more of a flavor for that.
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Carson: Yeah. So, I can speak to that. So, we actually were using zero students per unit
for multi-family in the past and eight for single family. So, we came up from zero to .1.
Zero was being used not because we thought -- or I say we, because I worked at the
school district at that time. Zero was not because West Ada, you know, thought that there
wasn't going to be students coming from multi-family homes, but there was such a small
fraction of multi-family homes in our area that using zero for multi and .8 for single family
was evening itself out very well. We were still getting good estimates and the estimates
were coming back properly and with -- with good actual data to back it up in the future.
So, we came up with the -- we came up from zero to .1, because we saw there was more
multi-family coming in and we needed to look at how those would bring kids in. So, we
looked at the school, we looked at the students -- student age population per household
and the number of households in the area, not just in the City of Meridian, because it is
West Ada issue as a whole and not just the City of Meridian and we looked at what ratio
of apartments to single family homes we have in the area and compared those numbers.
We looked at methodologies from other districts, but we didn't look at other districts
numbers to drive that, we only looked at local data to drive that .1 and the only piece that
wasn't local data was about -- I think it was three percent of students from -- are
homeschooled or private school based on a national survey. There wasn't local statistics
based on -- for homeschool and private school, so we used that national survey. Every
other piece, aside from that small three percent, was local data that was used to -- to
drive those numbers and, yes, we can in the future and we do have a plan to meet. Marci
and I already have -- I don't think we have it on the books, but we discussed meeting
again in the spring of this next year to look at -- okay, what actual numbers are we coming
up with. Now that these new developments that I spoke to earlier are coming in and they
are coming in different than we have ever seen them before, what kind of numbers are
we getting from those developments? What kind of student generation is -- is being pulled
from those and we will have to do it again as Meridian has a shortage of single family
homes, those families will be moving into multi-family homes temporarily until we get
caught up with our single family homes in the area. So, we will continue to refine that
number each year as needed until things start to even out, if things ever started to even
out with growth here.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: I think -- and I was thinking, Miranda, that's -- that's fantastic. I'm really happy
to hear that -- that you are getting actual data information and it's not based on a guess
or an estimate and -- and I would imagine it looks really different across cities as well.
Our area tends to be more suburban and maybe there is more children per household
than other parts of Boise. I am a real estate broker and in my opinion we are going to
start seeing people permanently living in multi-family housing and attached housing and
I think it's going to be a couple of years maybe before we can improve on that, but I hope
that we do continue to analyze this at least on an annual basis, because I think we will
see a shift from those families living in those -- in the apartments and, you know, a higher
dense housing in a temporary way to them being -- living in a permanent way as housing
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costs -- not just the shortage, but as housing costs rise I anticipate that -- that we will need
to reanalyze that ratio for that -- for that reason as well.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, can I ask a question of Miranda or for Council in general. Now you
are getting a different set of data how are you using it in your decision making on the
development piece?
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: And is it trustee president?
Johnson: Chair.
Cavener: Chair? You -- your comment at the start of this about elevating the data is an
understatement, because I think that as the district has really leveled up the information
that they are providing to the Council, I think we as a body have really responded to rely
on that information here. It's an ah-ha moment now that that information is included in
our staff report. Typically a week doesn't go by where there is an annexation that there
is not a comment by the Council related to the data that the district has provided about
students and you have heard Council Members be opposed to annexations or ask for
lower density because we hear -- we have heard from you and your predecessors and
we hear from your patrons, our taxpayers, about the impacts on our schools and so that
data is incredibly critical -- I think for me, for all of us, when we are rendering a decision
about if we are going to approve an annexation. So, I think that's why Council Member
Strader's question was poignant is we rely on this information and so we want to make
sure that we trust the information you are providing is accurate. It's just a shift from what
we have seen in the past, so we want to make sure that getting a better understanding of
what process is to truth those numbers, to Council Member Perreault, we are seeing a lot
of multi-family and we have got multi-families coming around all of us with young kids in
those neighborhoods and so we want to make sure that we are not doing a disservice to
those by not having the most accurate information we have got in the application as well.
Johnson: I don't know if anybody is going to answer, but --
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I can maybe give a similar perspective on -- I think it is rarely the only reason
that an application doesn't move forward, but in my mind it's an incredibly important
reason. If a development is going to put a lot of students into the school system and
many of the schools they attend will be overcrowded, I think that's important to know. The
boundary work I think that's happening gives us a lot of comfort that you guys are
proactively managing the student populations at each school and that for me has been a
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huge development. That gives me a lot of hope that we can manage through it in the long
run. The other thing, too, is it even plays into things like amenities as well. If someone's
making the argument that there are only five kids in this development, I'm not sure if that's
true or not; right? But if the data indicates that, then, you know, we push a lot on tot lots
and certain amenities that are geared toward families if we think families are going to be
living somewhere. So, we also want to make sure development fits what -- what we
expect for the community and the population that's living there is served with high quality
development that meets their needs. So, I would say it's multiple things.
Johnson: I asked the question because we just made it an action on Tuesday and I think
it's kind of important to share the information. First thing -- one of our actions is we are
moving some of our bonding debt forward and keep -- to keep our levy rate the same,
pay off some of our debt earlier. That decision was made on Tuesday. When we did that
we put in an assumption around that process to look at a potential long-term bond to start
to -- be able to have flexibility. Now, this is -- you know, we don't know what that looks
like from a public support standpoint, but I think we have been trying to get to a spot where
we maybe have more flexibility to be able to build schools as development growth is
happening, rather than having overcrowded schools and, then, have this -- and that's one
of the mechanisms today that we are looking at. So, we have -- we are starting to have
those conversations and the data around the development and what you guys are
approving actually helps and help us from a practice standpoint. So, that link that the two
-- Marci and Miranda are making is really -- can be really helpful for that when we start to
look at forecasting.
Perreault: I think in general, having been on the P&Z and now on Council, there is a little
bit more confidence as you make the decision. I mean for a while it was just sort of like
-- we know that West Ada -- I mean to be really candid, we weren't even sure that the
numbers we were seeing were accurate and so there was this nervousness, this, okay,
we have the data, but is it really actually helping us make the decision. So, the more we
hear about how the -- how the numbers are being calculated and the more we hear about
the fact that we are getting real data, I think there is a lot more confidence in our ability to
make the right -- what we feel is the right decision, so --
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor. And, Madam Chair, curious if you could give me a high level
understanding --when we look at the numbers and we see, oh, you know, Mountain View
High School is a hundred over capacity and the middle school is 50 under and, you know,
those different numbers that we see and we see the impacts that this particular
development will have, but I don't have a good sense of -- at what point do you start
processing and realize money and the bonding has to -- has to be there, but at what point
do you decide, okay, we have ground for a new school we are going to have to build an
elementary school or a middle school. Is it when you are at capacity? Is it when it's ten
percent over? Or -- because we know you are never completely full, there is the shifting
that you can do. You know, patrons don't like that necessarily, but sometimes you have
to. How -- how does that process work? I mean should we be worried, oh, that school is
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at capacity, we should really pull back or there is limited overcapacity that you can -- you
can handle before really having a serious situation?
Johnson: Well, let me -- let me kind of answer that -- actually defer to Marci for some of
it, but I think we -- where we have been and where we are going are two different things.
So, where we have been is, you know, we almost needed to have built up some public
support by the overcrowded -- like the overcrowding sort of created the demand, created
the burning platform for -- to build the school. But where we are trying to go is to be kind
of joint; right? So, as we see development and that data coming in, you know, we -- you
guys approve things before they are built, so we can use that information to be proactively
looking at where the potential growth is. We haven't done that yet, though, and, then, we
are also proactively talking about how do we create a funding mechanism that allows us
to do that, because we have been bonding so regularly that people get bonding fatigue;
right? And also it's always behind the eight ball. It's always after that fact. So, we don't
know how it will work. I think we are trying to figure out ways to proactively manage it
and it really helps that you guys are not approving everything in one direction and, then,
we are having to figure it out after the fact, it actually helps a lot to have the data working
together and, then, the conversations, so we can see what's coming at us and I would --
Marci can -- you actually do the data, so --
Horner: So -- and it's written into our policy for our attendance area committees when we
are drawing a boundary to determine the difference between a design capacity and a
program capacity. So, it's very familiar to me and maybe not to you all, so I will explain it
a little bit. The design capacity is something that basically our architect says this is the
capacity of your school, this is how many students you can fit into the school, and -- and
the program capacity is a little bit different, because in each school we might have
classrooms dedicated to a special program that we can't fit a classroom full of 25 kids in
that classroom. So, we have to take that classroom count out of the capacity count to
determine how many kids we can actually fit in -- in that school and some of our schools
have many programs. You might have an accelerated program, it might be a Title school,
it might have a PDI classroom, it might have preschool and so those all have to be taken
into consideration. So, I have been working on calculating those and it might change
from year to year as a program changes that -- that number -- the design capacity isn't
going to change, but that program capacity could change and maybe when we see an
area that -- and this has happened before where we see a school that does -- that is
overcrowded, that maybe we can look at moving a program out of that school, put it in a
different school that might be under -- a little bit undercrowded or under capacity, so -- so,
that's -- and I -- coming from the elementary world -- and it's a lot more cut and dry in an
elementary world. You can fit 25 kids in a classroom. You get 32 kids for fourth and fifth
grade, things like that. In high school it's a little bit different, middle school it's a little bit
different, because those kids are moving around so much. So, some of the ways we
determine whether you are --whether we are overcrowded is determining if a teacher has
to leave for their prep and allow another teacher to move into their classroom. So, when
that starts happening we know we are -- we know we are reaching an overcapacity state.
Can we still function that way? Yes. That teacher can leave their classroom, go to the
copy room, go to the staff room, we are not causing harm to children, they are still being
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educated. They might not even know the difference, but that's when we start saying,
okay, now we are -- now we are worried, so -- and that, again, might be different in each
and so that's a coordinated effort that we -- conversations with the principals and the
teachers and what does it look like in your -- in your building? What's happening?
Because I might not be able to -- it's easier -- like I said, it's easier in elementary where I
can say you have this many fifth grade classes, this many fourth grade classes, but in
those high schools when -- when you have a lot of different classes. So, that's just
something that we have to figure. But, like I said, there is a little bit more leeway when it
comes to -- that's why we can see Mountain -- Mountain View at their number is so
overcrowded, because teachers are moving around during their prep. Does that help
answer your question?
Johnson: The other piece -- and I think it's a credit to Dr. Ranells and the staff-- well, last
summer -- so, we have -- between when we met last time and now we have a policy on
this that defines design capacity, defines program capacity. We actually define
emergency for some -- like an additional emergency capacity. I can't -- that's not the right
name, but -- so, that's defined. So, we are all speaking the same language, we are all
using the same counts and the same numbers and, then, we have -- in that policy we also
define how we will do boundary line attendance areas and who is involved in that, which
is why we have ex-officio members from the cities now. So, it's all -- that new policy was
adopted in July or August. So, that's changed and that's allowed us to have a better
framework for managing and talking through some of these things.
Hoaglun: So, Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Just to follow up -- and I guess the answer is it depends. That's very helpful,
because it -- it gives us a better understanding that I think from Miranda's presentation to
us making sure we understand that, hey, there is a red flag here, they really are at
overcapacity, they are going to have to shift boundaries if a development has this impact
and making sure we -- we understand that, because it sounds like we just can't go by the
number alone, because there are other -- other things in play. So, that would be helpful
from our end, then, to make sure we are truly understanding the situation and not just
look at the number-- and I know, you know, the patrons and people testify about, oh, look,
you know, it's -- it's overcapacity, don't approve the development, when -- when actually,
yes, you can make it work, it will fit, it's -- nothing is going to be at risk. A child's education
is not going to be at risk. But there might be ways we have to make sure we fully
understand the situation as it's presented to us, instead of just the number alone. I don't
know what that is, but I will let you work on that.
Simison: It's almost like you need an odometer on the side of the school district that
shows overall capacity moving with what's approved. Any further questions or comments
at this?
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Klopfenstein: Sometimes it's all -- it's not just classroom, it's also busing and I think the
south Meridian area where myself and Chair Johnson have -- those are our zones, we
have seen so much development coming into those south areas and there is so much
backed up need, especially because the pandemic kind of brought us back away from a
bond, that, really, if you would think about, you really should think we really probably need
three schools in the middle of -- three elementary schools and a middle school in that
south area and this year it got so packed that for next year -- we decided this year that
next year we would be busing excess kids from south Meridian to north -- to above the
freeway -- north of the freeway and that's an extreme. I don't think we have ever done
that before and so that tells you how bad the situation is back in the south Meridian area,
where if we could get some additional funding to be able to do additional elementary
schools, it would really relieve a lot of the pressure. We have done a number of things
thanks to suggestions from -- from the Mayor and from Chair Johnson, you know, to help
relieve some of that and that's why we are able to bring some of the kids north, but it's a
temporary fix and so there is definitely some serious situations going on.
Johnson: Just a follow up. We always -- we know the serious areas in our area, but the
other serious area is out where we are going to go towards and I think, Marci, you correct
me if I'm wrong, but we are actually seeing faster growth in the northwest -- west Meridian
area than we are even in south. So, what you have heard about, you could just add
additional in that -- to that area. Is that --
Horner: That's correct. And in combination with Star, which is also exploding and that
very west part of Eagle. So, those are definitely areas that I'm like honed in on and have
a little heart failure over.
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: Madam Chair, would this be an appropriate time to update us on the school
boundary progress? I haven't been keeping up on what's happening with that process.
Johnson: Yeah. I will actually -- Marci would be the best person to answer, because she
is pretty much --
Horner: Yeah. I got some -- a few extra gray hairs this -- from the amazing process and
-- and, again, so grateful for the policy that we have that sets the guidelines. We did have
the attendance area committee -- obviously create our proposal to draw a boundary line
for Owyhee High School and, then, we also made some adjustments with some -- a
couple of other schools. So, Chaparral Elementary was on a modified schedule --
schedule. Seven Oaks Elementary located in Eagle was also on a modified schedule. In
order to utilize our buildings and -- and help alleviate some overcrowded schools near
those schools, we asked the amazing boundary committee to -- attendance area
committee to look at those areas and -- and see if we can find a solution to those, as well
as the -- the overcrowding at Hillsdale Elementary, which was causing students to go to
over overflow schools, for lack of a better term, so -- so, they ended up creating a
proposal. Our board approved the proposal. So, we have an attendance area for Owyhee
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High School. We made some minor adjustments to a couple of -- to a couple of middle
schools. Very minor. They -- very few students were affected by those and, then, we
actually--actually touched into double digits, so I will just say elementary schools to make
some -- some pretty effective changes. So, I will be interested to see if the predictions
are -- with the continued growth are going to be close, hopefully, but -- but I feel really
good about what we have -- what we were able to do and spread out some of that growth
from some of those schools that were really really crowded.
Johnson: The projections that Marci gave us when we made the decision showed every
elementary school below the capacity amount. Now, again, it's projections and we don't
know what will come back from COVID, but also we don't have anybody in a cap or
crossing anymore. So, all of--what-- the one challenge we have is just where our school
placement is at we do have to bus some kids from south Meridian over to north Meridian,
because of just the way the numbers go, so -- and that's -- there is no Locust Grove
overpass, that's really a challenge from a time -- or Linder. Yeah. Overpass. That's a
real challenge. Like we would love to have that Linder overpass. Did I say that right?
Horner: Absolutely. And just -- just to follow up another challenge was that we did lose
quite a few students this year and so trying to figure out who is coming back, where they
went, how many did we actually lose, how many moved or how many just was
homeschooling waiting for COVID to have relieved. So, I'm just, you know, crossing our
fingers that the -- that next year is easier.
Carson: So, if I can speak to the COVID point, Mr. Mayor. So, the most recent school
impacts tables that you have received from me do use the updated school boundaries for
the next school year, but because enrollment is down because of COVID, not because
as of the actual numbers, we are still using -- I'm still using enrollment from pre-COVID
with some adjustments for students that have moved to Pleasant View Elementary and,
then, spoke to Marci today, actually, about when do we start using actual enrollment.
West Ada has started using actual enrollment for next year in their letters. I expect that I
will start using it in my tables probably after school secretaries leave, because they are
amazing that they hammer through their work before they leave for the summer to really
get kids into their next schools. So, I plan to start using next year's actual enrollments
that are coming from the district in June.
Perreault: Is there access to data from all the census? Is that going to be helpful when
we get that information? Is it going to be helpful -- do we get information from say how
many students are coming in from out of state for the DMV or is there any -- is there any
other places that we can get the information outside of what you are doing to -- to do
those counts?
Carson: So, I think the census data is the biggest tool. Census data breaks down
population by ages. It breaks down number of households. There are so many
subcategories in those counts that it is such a valuable tool, so it will be -- it will be really
amazing to have that updated data and not just have the estimates, because you get
census data for last year, but a lot of times it's estimates, because, of course, they only
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do the census every ten years. They will still put out numbers from last year, though. So,
that's what we are using. Also the census data typically pulls in the American Community
Survey data as well. So, that is being updated also. But I just lump it in. When I say
census data that typically has the American Community Survey data in as well.
Johnson: We also have on our website now enrollment -- even what are the enrollment
at each school just for a current base, but I wouldn't use that for forecasting.
Simison: Any additional questions or comments? Well, with that let's -- let's add a third
item under discussion topics real quick. It is someone's birthday in this room. Miranda's
birthday. And there is some stuff that was brought in the -- in the back, but I would love it
if everyone could join us in a round of Happy Birthday to Miranda.
(Happy birthday sung to Miranda Carson.)
Simison: With that do I have a motion?
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: I move that we adjourn.
Hoaglun: Second the motion.
Simison: Motion and second to adjourn the Meridian City Council meeting. Discussion?
If not, all in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay. The ayes have it and Meridian
City Council is adjourned.
MOTION CARRIED: FIVE AYES. ONE ABSENT.
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 6:21 P.M.
POST-MEETING SITE TOUR AND NOTICE OF QUORUM
3. The Meridian City Council and West Ada School District Board of
Trustees will attend a guided tour of Owyhee High School, 3650 N.
Owyhee Storm Ave, Meridian, ID 83646 following adjournment of the
meeting. Although a quorum of members will attend, there will be no
business conducted and no minutes will be taken.
(AUDIO RECORDING ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
MAYOR ROBERT E. SIMISON
ATTEST: 6 1 2021
DATE APPROVED
CHRIS JOHNSON - CITY CLERK
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