2020-06-09 Regular MeetingMeridian City Council June 9, 2020.
A Meeting of the Meridian City Council was called to order at 6:01 p.m., Tuesday, June
9, 2020, by Mayor Robert Simison.
Members Present: Robert Simison, Joe Borton, Luke Cavener, Treg Bernt, Jessica
Perreault, Brad Hoaglun and Liz Strader.
Also present: Chris Johnson, Adrienne Weatherly, Bill Nary, Bill Parsons, Joe Dodson
and Joe Bongiorno.
Item 1: Roll-call Attendance:
__X__ Liz Strader __X__ Joe Borton (6:51 p.m.)
__X__ Brad Hoaglun __X__ Treg Bernt
__X__ Jessica Perreault __X__ Luke Cavener
__X__ Mayor Robert E. Simison
Simison: Okay. Well, with that we will call this meeting to order. For the record it is
Tuesday, June 9th. It's 6:01 p.m. We will begin this meeting tonight with roll call
attendance.
Item 2: Pledge of Allegiance
Simison: Item No. 2 is the Pledge of Allegiance. If you will, please, rise and join us in the
pledge.
(Pledge of Allegiance recited.)
Item 3: Community Invocation with David Snyder of Twenty Six Eight Church
Simison: We will move on to Item No. 3, our community invocation. It will be delivered
by David Snyder -- Pastor David Snyder of Twenty Six Eight Church. If you will all join us
in the invocation or take this as a moment of reflection. Pastor Snyder, thank you for
joining us.
Snyder: Thank you for letting me be here tonight. Appreciate being able to pray for the
city. Let's pray together, everybody. Father, we bless you tonight and we think that living
in this city is amazing because you love us, because you have protected us and given us
great provision and I pray, Lord, tonight that the City Council, Lord, would be granted
wisdom in all that they have to do. We pray not only for wisdom, but for the provision that
they need to accomplish the task before them. Father, I pray for Mayor Robert, just bless
you, Lord, for his leadership and the way that he has positioned Meridian for blessing and
growth. I pray, Lord, for business leaders and ask, Lord, that you would give them the
favor that they need to continue to help the City of Meridian grow and, Father, most of all
in these tumultuous times we are praying that what we are doing in Meridian would be a
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light to other cities and communities, that they would be able to look here and say what's
going on there and we would be able to be a voice, Lord, of hope and of peace for other
places. Lord, would you bless this city in every way, in the name of your son Jesus whom
we love, amen.
Simison: Thank you much, Pastor Snyder. Appreciate your time this evening.
Snyder: Thank you.
Bernt: Pastor David, love you, buddy.
Snyder: Love you, too, man. Have a great day.
Bernt: Yep.
Item 4: Adoption of Agenda
Simison: We will move on to Item No. 4, Adoption of the Agenda.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: There will be the continuance with Item 6-B. When we get there we will announce
that. Other than that, I don't believe we have any changes, so I move that we adopt the
agenda as presented.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, second the motion.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to adopt the agenda as published. Is there any
discussion on the motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay.
The ayes have it.
MOTION CARRIED: FIVE AYES. ONE ABSENT.
Item 5: Future Meeting Topics – Public Forum
Simison: Item No. 5, Future Meeting Topics. Did we have anyone signed up this evening?
Weatherly: Mr. Mayor, we did have people signed in, but only for a current land use item
that is not open for public hearing.
Item 6: Action Items
A. Reconsideration Request for Findings of Fact, Conclusions of
Law for Delano Subdivision (H-2019-0027) by Boll Cook
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Investments, LLC, Located at 14120 W. Jasmine Ln. and 2800 E.
Jasmine Ln.
Simison: Okay. Then we will move on to our Action Items and go to Item 6-A, which is a
reconsider request for Findings of Fact, Conclusions of Law for Delano Subdivision, H-
2019-0027, and I will turn this over to Mr. Nary.
Nary: Thank you, Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council. You have before you a request
for reconsideration. Under our city ordinance these have to be filed within 14 days of a
final decision. This was filed timely for that. Basically, Mr. Clark has requested you to
reconsider the decision that you have made on the Delano project that was concluded a
few weeks ago. The findings have been approved by the City Council. It's within your
purview to either grant or deny his request based on the letter that's in front of you. There
is no public testimony at this stage of the proceeding s. If the decision is made to deny
his request that would be it. We would issue an order based upon that -- based upon that
decision and Mr. Clark can take that where ever the law would allow him to go. If the
decision is made to reconsider that request , you would, then, set this for a new public
hearing at a future date. The applicant would need to pay the cost of noticing this project
and you have a new public hearing, basically a reset back to the last public hearing you
had on this project based upon the reasons Mr. Clark has raised in his letter as his basis
for making this request. So, again, no public testimony. There is written material in your
packets, both from Mr. Clark, as well as some of the neighbors in regards to this. The
sole real point in here was Mr. Clark had raised that the Council had not specifically raised
their -- what their specific objections were during the course of the hearing and, therefore,
he did not have the opportunity to address those when the hearing was still open , so that
those concerns that were raised were not able to be addressed by the applicant or even
by the opponents or the neighbors. So, that's it before you. Again, there is no testimony
of Mr. Clark or the neighbors in this case. It really is a decision within your purview.
Simison: Thank you, Mr. Nary. Council, any questions for Mr. Nary?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: Mr. Nary, can you -- I know you can't speak on behalf of the applicant, but I
just wanted clarification. It's my understanding that they have a potential solution to the
concerns that were presented by -- by Council Members during that hearing. Is -- is that
-- is that what their -- their -- their request is involving? I'm not -- I'm not necessarily --
maybe I misunderstood what you were saying that, I'm not necessarily in agreement that
Council was unclear about their concerns. I think that Council was very clear. I'm just
wanting to understand if the intention having the reconsideration is because they have
some solutions that they would like to present or how it would be different from the first
hearing.
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Nary: So, that's a great question, Council Member Perreault. I mean that -- the basis of
the request is -- is as I stated that what's stated in Mr. Clark's letter was he wasn't able to
address the Council's concerns because those were not clarified prior to closing the public
hearing. He, therefore, goes on -- and, really, the rest of the information is not really
relevant to the decision point. It is his desire to rehear this and he has raised some of the
issues in this letter that they may be able to address, but, really, the decision point for the
Council is whether to grant that opportunity for a second -- a new hearing and that's within
your purview on whether or not, again, those opportunities to be heard were not presented
or you believe they were. They had the opportunity to present those.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: A follow up for Mr. Nary that, apologies, I would like to get clear on is whether
today our decision has -- the scope of what we are deciding has to be limited to whether
or not they had that opportunity or if it is a broader scope of decision that we do think
there is an additional solution that's interesting and, therefore, we want to rehear it and
we can grant that opportunity, as opposed to just agreeing with him that the basis of our
decision was not correct.
Nary: Well, that's -- that's a great question, Council Member Strader, and it's a little bit
different question. So, under our code the reconsideration can only consider whether or
not the decision needs to be reconsidered and, again, I think the broadest interpretation
of that would be that under Mr. Clark's request that there was an adequate opportunity to
present all of the information necessary for the Council to make a good decision in this
case. If the Council wishes to reconsider their decision entirely, then, under the rules that
we have used previously the Council could reconsider their decision. It's a little more
complicated from a procedural standpoint , because now we are not talking about our
reconsideration ordinance, we are talking about a reconsideration of the decision entirely
and so if you would like me to go through what that would take I could do that, if that's the
direction you want to consider.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: Sorry, Bill, I didn't quite follow that. So -- so, we would not be -- we would be
-- we -- we are reconsidering whether to have a public hearing. That's -- that's the scope
and if Council, through that public hearing, were to change or return its original vote, then,
that is -- that's what you are referring to; right?
Nary: No. Not exactly. And I'm sorry it's -- it's a little confusing. Again, we are trying to
-- trying to stay within the confines of our ordinance. So , the reconsideration is as I have
already stated. What Council Member Strader is asking is can the Council reconsider the
decision entirely, not based on the reason that Mr. Clark's raise , but you have simply
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changed your mind, for lack of a better way to state it. If that's an aven ue you want me
to explain how to do that process I can if you would like to. I just don't want to make it
more confusing.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Yeah. You know, I -- I'm -- I'm in favor of reconsideration, just based on the fact
we had a very lengthy discussion about North Cent repoint Way and it was a good
discussion, there was disagreement, but I think that was central to the fact of when that
was going to be developed, but my recollection is that -- that did occur after we closed
the public hearing and that did not afford the applicant the opportunity to possibly offer a
solution to that to help with the traffic and -- and not create traffic through the -- through
the subdivision, through other folks areas of subdivisions and houses. So, you know, to
me that -- that was what it was, we just disagreed on that one point and that was a matter
of if we had a potential solution that he could have offered, it doesn't mean that it will be,
you know, redone in terms of the final decision, but that does give us an opportunity to
explore it further to determine is that's a workable solution. So, that's -- that's where I'm
coming from.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: A question I think maybe for -- for Mr. Nary. In terms of process, should this be
something Council wants to entertain, are there any limitations to motions being made
from Council Members who voted in the affirmative or the negative on the original motion
to deny?
Nary: Council Member Cavener, you are reading my mind. So, on the reconsideration
request, no. If the Council wants to proceed, anybody can make the motion to either
affirm or deny the prior decision, and it can be seconded by anybody. Again, I -- I don't
want to go down the path of alternative options until you want to get there , because I don't
want to make it confusing. So, for this portion of the decision anyone can make the
motion.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: One -- one point that I want to bring up is, obviously, when we first heard this
application we voted, we were all in attendance, it was close as we all know. This evening
Mr. Borton is not available, he is working, and I would very much like to have everyone in
attendance when we vote on this. I know we have 60 days to accomplish this. We have
plenty of time. This is not -- this does not need to happen this evening. There is not a
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time crunch. We have plenty of time to re -- review this. I would just -- my
recommendation would be to continue this until we had a full Council , including Mr.
Borton.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: It's an interesting point that Council Member Bernt raises. Perhaps maybe if
Council is at least amenable, maybe we move this to the end of our agenda in case
Council Member Borton is able to join us --
Bernt: Good point.
Cavener: -- later and, then, maybe perhaps have that conversation about what future
steps make the most sense.
Bernt: I'm okay with that, Mr. Mayor.
Cavener: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: I'm -- I'm okay with that -- that request from Council Member Cavener. I don't -- I
haven't reached out to Mr. Borton, so I don't know what his schedule looks like, but I'm
definitely open to moving this until later on. No problem.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: With that I guess I would move that we -- I guess, Mr. Nary, help me if I screw
this up -- move item -- or continue Item 6-A later this evening following Item 7-C.
Nary: Yes.
Bernt: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to continue Item 6-A to become Item -- is it 7-D
in that case under ordinances or is a new number eight or just leave the number as is and
just take it up later?
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Just asking Mr. Nary for --
Nary: Mr. Mayor, as long as it's still -- you are moving it as an action item it's fine to me if
it's a new A-8 or an eight becomes a new nine. As long as it's clear it is an action item
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and since that's what it has been labeled to begin with, it would remain that. So, that's all
that really matters from an agenda standpoint.
Simison: Okay. So, we would move this to Action Item No. 8 on the agenda.
Nary: Yes. And I have reached out to Council Member Borton to see if he might be
available, so --
Bernt: I think -- Mr. Mayor, I think everyone has. I think his phone is blowing up as we
speak.
Simison: Well, I have not, but there we go. So, there is one. So, is there any discussion
on the motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay. Okay. We
will take that up later in our meeting.
MOTION CARRIED: SIX AYES. ONE ABSENT.
B. Public Hearing for Cedarbrook Subdivision (H-2020-0012) by
Toll Southwest, LLC, Located at 4185 S. Linder Rd.
1. Request: Annexation of a total of 118.58 acres of land with R
-2 (9.48 acres), R-4 ( 65.45 acres) and R-8 ( 43.66 acres)
zoning districts; and,
2. Request: A Preliminary plat consisting of 330 buildable lots,
38 common lots and 4 other lots on 118.58 acres of land in
the proposed R-2, R-4 and R-8 zoning districts.
Simison: So, Item No. 6-B is a public hearing for Cedarbrook Subdivision, H-2020-0012.
We do have a request by the applicant to continue this until July 7th, 2020. Mr. Nary, do
we need to open up the public hearing?
Nary: Yes, we do.
Simison: Okay. So, I would like to open this public hearing at this time and I guess we
don't have to take staff comments, but I would ask for any questions Council has at this
point in time in regard to this request for continuance.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Well, the question would be maybe for the -- the city clerk. The applicant's
requesting July 7th. Just curious what our agenda looks like for that particular meeting.
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Johnson: Mr. Mayor? Mr. Mayor, Mr. Cavener, I'm looking right now July 7th Apologize.
It will take one second. But you have a limited agenda that evening with two public
hearings currently.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Follow up for Chris. Chris, how are we looking the week after?
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, Councilman Cavener, I'm going there right now.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: One second, Council Woman.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, Councilman Cavener, there are also two public hearings that night.
Of the two weeks they both look to be about even with the amount of testimony and public
involvement you may be expecting, so I believe either night would look good at this point.
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: Just had a quick question. Wondering if we -- sometimes the applicant will
speak when we -- when we do the continuations. Wondering if we have any knowledge
of why the 7th was -- is the 7th significant for them or is it just when that was the next
available opportunity?
Simison: I think I will ask Mr. Parsons if you would like to speak to that.
Parson: Certainly, Mr. Mayor. I'm not privy to a specific hearing date requested by the
applicant. I think they just wanted to give staff enough time to react to the ACHD 's
commission on this application. We anticipate some minor changes to the plat and so I
want to give staff adequate time to amend their staff report based on the Commission's
agenda. That gives us about two weeks. So, we feel comfortable with that 7th date, but
certainly there is no heartburn from staff if it's the 7th or the 16th. We can manage it either
way.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Just for Council's benefit, the reason why I think why I'm inquiring is I know that
we are going to start navigating back into holding Council meetings in Council Chambers
in some degree, inviting the public in. I just want to make sure that we are being mindful
of how many people we are putting in Council Chambers and just making sure that we
are -- we are not making our citizens feel like that they are -- they are, you know, putting
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June 9, 2020
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anything in jeopardy to come and testify in favor or against. I know, obviously, we will
have the opportunity to continue to use the Zoom platform. I just -- something I want us
to be mindful of as we are scheduling continuances.
Simison: Council, any further questions or do you feel you need to hear from anybody
else before you make a motion on this topic? Or if you don't want to make a motion we
can have staff go right into this presentation.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Hearing that staff has an adequate time to review the information that will be
coming from ACHD, I would move that we grant the continuance to July 7 th for
Cedarbrook Subdivision, H-2020-0012.
Strader: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to continue this item to July 7th. Is there any
discussion on the motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Those opposed
nay. The ayes have it. We will add that to the July 7th.
MOTION CARRIED: FIVE AYES. ONE ABSENT.
C. Public Hearing Continued from May 26, 2020 for McKay Farm
Subdivision (H-2020-0030) by Fairbourne Development, LLC,
Located Near the Half-Mile Mark on the West Side of S. Eagle
Rd. Between E. Amity Rd. and E. Lake Hazel Rd.
1. Request: Annexation and Zoning of 10.5 acres of land with an
R-8 zoning district, and
2. Request: A Preliminary Plat consisting of 42 building lots and
9 common lots.
Simison: So, that moves us to Item 6-C, a public hearing continued from May 26th, 2020,
for McKay Farm Subdivision, H-2020-0030. I will turn this over to -- I'm sorry, I didn't --
haven't pulled up my cheat sheet for this evening. Is this going to be Mr. Parsons? Are
you the one speaking on the item? Or is it Joe?
Dodson: Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Can everybody hear me all right?
Simison: Ye s.
Dodson: Appreciate that. All right. So, as Mr. Mayor, states -- stated, Council heard this
item a couple of weeks ago and so I don't want to rehash everything, but I will go into the
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main points. Just to reiterate, this is a request for annexation and zoning of ten and a half
acres with an R-8 zoning district preliminary plat that consisted of 42 building lots and
nine common and they are proposing one building phase. Of the nine common lots four
of them are common driveways. One of the main points discussed in the previous hearing
was a proposed amenity and what that might look like . The applicant and I have
discussed this proposed amenity and Mr. Johnson, the applicant, provided staff with this
rendition and it is a larger picnic shelter, roughly 16 by 32, 34, which is larger than what I
think you should get on a picnic shelter, which is good. If Council does approve of this
conceptual design and size, staff recommends that Council add an additional condition
requiring that the applicant build something significantly similar to this submitted elevation
that is not written specifically in the staff report. In addition, one of the major concerns in
the previous Council meeting was the need for a parking plan. The applicant has provided
staff with that parking plan as shown here that shows all of their required parking dictated
in yellow and the garage parking orange on the driveway and the available street parking
in coral color. All of the on-street parking is in addition to the required -- to make a specific
notice that. I understand the concern with the common driveways. My belief is that the
available on-street parking around the center area should provide some adequate extra
parking. In addition, if you notice the common drives do tend to stop right at the property
line, so the guests of the lots in the very end of the common drives -- so, their driveways
are larger than typical driveways.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor? Mr. Mayor, I don't mean to interrupt, Joe. But two points. It's really
hard to hear Joe and -- but most importantly Dean is not able to hear Joe at the moment
and so is there a way in which we can have Joe do something with his audio to make it
so that he's more -- so we can hear him better.
Simison: Joe --
Dodson: I apologize.
Simison: Whatever you -- if you can speak closer to the mic or louder.
Dodson: Sure. Absolutely. I don't want to yell. I don't want to put the coach voice in.
Bernt: It's okay to put the coach voice on, buddy.
Dodson: All right. How much of that did you miss, Council Member Bernt?
Bernt: Well, I heard it. There is some others that didn't. So, we just need to confirm that
Dean if Dean can -- if Dean can hear this okay, Dean, can you raise your hand. Boom.
Dodson: Awesome. Okay. Thank you. So, to reiterate, this is the proposed parking plan.
The yellow is the garage parking. Orange is the driveway and the on-street parking is
dictated in that coral color. Also I wanted to note that the lots located at the end of the
common drives do tend to have larger driveways that could be used for additional parking.
The applicant did not show that specifically as additional parking , but that would be
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available there. Again, the street sections are proposes as 33 feet wide, which do allow
on-street parking on both sides of the street and also again parking plans are not a
requirement in the code, but, obviously, greatly appreciated by Council and so that's why
the applicant did want to provide this and appreciate the opportunity to provide that .
Another issue that did come up is the access to this and, again, in order to develop more
than 30 homes the applicant did propose that emergency access to Eagle , but the only
available access is going to be through the adjacent Sky Mesa Subdivision to the west. I
believe those were the main points of discussion . If I -- if there are any questions from
Council I'm happy to answer them.
Simison: Council, any questions?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: Joe, I would imagine that on that emergency access off of Eagle Road that
they will have signs, but is it possible that the -- that cars may try to access that to get to
their property more quickly?
Dodson: Council Woman Perreault, Council, I surely hope not, but it will be bollards.
There will -- there will be bollards up there, as is normal with the common drives. Mr.
Bongiorno -- sorry -- sorry, Joe. I forgot your name there for a second. He has approved
of this emergency exodus and as a standard requirement there will be those removable
bollards there.
Perreault: Thank you.
Dodson: You're welcome.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Joe, you may have touched on this, but I -- I missed it. I recall when this was
last before us I had brought up some concerns about the -- the sidewalks around Eagle
Road and connectivity. Can you address that or did the applicant provid e any updates
around that?
Dodson: Councilman Cavener, yes, that is something that came up from the Council. It
has not been specifically addressed since then between the applicant and I, but as I did
state a couple of weeks ago, the landscape buffer is adequate for the sidewalk to be built
within that and not necessarily at the edge of right of way on Eagle. Again, I -- I did not
place that specific condition in the staff report, so if that's something that Council would
like, I do recommend adding it as a condition, that it be built, you know, before certificate
of occupancy or however you would like to word that and --
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Cavener: Okay.
Dodson: -- and it be built within the landscape buffer.
Cavener: Great. Thanks, Joe.
Dodson: You're welcome.
Simison: Any other questions at this time from Council for staff? Okay. Well, then, I will
recognize the applicant Mr. Johnson. I got to get out my handy dandy timer to recognize
you for ten minutes, if you are so inclined, but I will turn this over to you. If you could state
your name and address for the record. Or 15 minutes. Sorry. Fifteen minutes.
S.Johnson: All right. Thank you, Mayor, and -- my name is Sam Johnson. Address is
2701 East Pine in Meridian, Idaho. 83642. And I certainly do not plan to take 15 minutes,
but I appreciate you having me back here tonight and Joe's done a great job of presenting
the -- the two exhibits that we have provided to hopefully address your concerns that we
had a couple of weeks ago here with the parking plan and the on-street parking shown in
that coral color. There is -- there is quite a bit of parking available on this site. I know that
common driveway parking or lots that -- that have access on a -- on a common drive,
which there will not be any parking allowed on the common drive, but where do those
visitors park? You know, there are three common driveways that are very close to that
central park and with the allowed parking all the way around it on street that I believe is
-- is quite adequate for -- for any visitors coming to those homes. And, then, the other lot
-- the other common driveway in that bottom left corner, there is a common lot on the side
of the -- it's Lot 45 just the -- you know, down the street -- across the street and down a
little bit there is quite a bit of on-street parking that will not be interfering with any
driveways or any other access. So, I feel like there is a lot of parking availability here.
So, hopefully, this addresses your concerns. And, then, Joe, if you could go back to the
-- the shade structure exhibit, that -- that drawing or that rendering is what we have had
planned to do on this site. This is the old homestead of the McKay family that owned this
property for a long time and farmed the property for a long time and this is the -- the --
their old dairy site and home and so we want to do a little bit of a farm feel to this shade
structure and make it fairly sizable to , you know, allow, you know, 25 people or so. So,
this is very close to what we want to do. We may have to do some kind of enclosures to
help with bird nesting and such, but this is the basic idea. So, if this is agreeable, happy
to make this part of the conditions that we -- that we substantially conform or -- or build
something to this standard. Other than that, I guess I will stand for questions.
Simison: Thank you, Sam. Council, any questions?
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
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Hoaglun: Yeah. Mr. Johnson, we went through this before and I just want to reconfirm,
because I recall your answer on the landscaping that would be along Eagle Road up
against the back fence there to the -- to the houses. You were amenable to having that
done sooner as opposed to later. I just couldn't remember was that phase one or what
part of the construction process would that go in?
S.Johnson: Mr. Mayor, Commissioner Hoaglun -- or Councilman Hoaglun, we -- we will
want to -- it's all done in one phase. The -- the entire project is -- is one phase and we
want to landscape that berm -- that buffer along Eagle with our initial construction and
with, you know, part of our condition to -- to do so and build that out. Since the -- since
the -- we still have to work out detail with ACHD as far as the timing of their widening, it's
planned to be in 2023, but we certainly want to landscape as much as possible of that --
that buffer along Eagle Road.
Hoaglun: Thank you.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: Mr. Johnson, I, unfortunately, did not get a chance to watch the Planning and
Zoning meeting video, but I wanted to follow up on one of their concerns regarding the
residents of this community potentially using the Sky Mesa amenities and just curious --
I live in a neighborhood where we had that same challenge and our HOA had spent a lot
of money -- costs that have been incurred to us because of the neighboring community
that's tied together through the street and there is a misunderstanding by those residents
that they belong to the same association, because the streets are all connected. So, just
curious if you have had a chance to chat with the Sky Mesa representatives or maybe if
there might be some signs that are put up. What are your thoughts on that?
S.Johnson: Yes, Mr. Mayor and Council Woman Perreault, we had several -- I had
reached out several times to the developers of Sky Mesa. We were not able to come to
an agreement trying to -- my proposal to them was to be part of their HOA and to help --
and, then, I would pay for some of the infrastructure of those amenities my pro rata share
and -- and become part of the neighborhood, since they are wrapping around three sides
of this -- of this property. But we were not able to come to any kind of -- really any kind
of discussion or agreement. And, yeah, I understand the concern. I know that their --
their community pools are planned to be either badge accessed or a code from those --
the actual neighbors that pay for those amenities, but we couldn't come to an agreement,
so we certainly can put up some kind of signage that -- and notify the homeowners when
they are buying the property -- or buying a house in this project that they do not have
access. You know, I -- I -- I live backing up to another subdivision's park. I enjoy it. I use
it and -- and I pay for my park, but I don't pay for that park, but I use it. So, it's hard to
police that. But it's certainly something that we can put an effort toward.
Perreault: Thank you.
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June 9, 2020
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Simison: Council, any other questions?
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, I did have one other. I just wanted to confirm, if I might --
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: -- with the applicant that I believe he also had agreed that the lots -- was it 32,
40 and 50 were going to be single story in the development; is that correct?
S.Johnson: Councilman Hoaglun, yes, that is correct. Lots 32, 40 and 50 of Block 1,
single story only.
Hoaglun: Thank you, Mr. Johnson. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
Simison: Council, any further questions? Okay. Thank you, Mr. Johnson. This is a public
hearing. Did we have anyone sign up to testify on this item?
Weatherly: Mr. Mayor, we did not.
Simison: Okay. Well, we do have quite a few people on today's call. So , if this is an item
that you would like to testify on, if you can raise your hand and we can bring you in to
testify on this item or if you are on the phone -- I do see we have at least one person on
the phone. You can press star nine to indicate your desire or wish to testify. My cursory
walkthrough does not show anybody who has raised their hand . If the clerk can confirm
that.
Weatherly: Mr. Mayor, from my perspective that is correct.
Simison: Okay. Well, then, Mr. Johnson it is yours to close. If you were -- would like to.
Otherwise, I will just turn this over to Council.
S.Johnson: Thank you for your time. I will turn it over to you.
Simison: Okay. Thank you. So, Council, any questions or further action as it relates to
closing the public hearing?
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: Just wanted to thank the -- the applicant for more details. It helped out quite a bit.
I still have a concern about the common driveways in this subdivision. I noticed that that
wasn't changed at all. So, I don't know if the applicant wants to respond to that or if -- but
I just wanted to make that clear before we closed the public hearing and -- and went from
there.
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June 9, 2020
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S.Johnson: Mr. Mayor, Councilman Bernt, yes, appreciate the -- that reminder. The
common driveways we haven't proposed to change the number of lots that those -- those
give access to. We believe that three is -- is a workable and doable number on those --
on each one of those. There are quite a few and, yes, these lots are -- are -- are packed
in there, but we didn't feel the need to increase -- or sorry. To decrease the number of
lots on those common driveways, so we left the plat as is and -- and the -- the -- the
request from last hearing a couple of weeks ago to remove the -- that condition that P&Z
put on still stands. We would like to have that -- that's condition removed if the Council
so sees it, that's -- that they agree with that.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Sam, before we close the public hearing I just -- again, we talked about this the
last time you were here and I asked staff for some insight. I don't know if you had any
comments or suggestions or recommendations on the -- the sidewalk challenges that will
face this property.
S.Johnson: Mr. Mayor and Council Member Cavener, the -- the -- I have learned and see
that the development to the north -- or part of Sky Mesa that is just to the north along
Eagle Road, they have submitted for their final plat for that section. So, they are ahead
of me with any kind of improvements that they will put along Eagle Road and -- and that
also includes the Taconic and Eagle intersection. So, their sidewalk will most definitely
be in prior to mine. That will connect my property to Taconic and then -- so, when we
come in we will have our improvements to make and connect to that sidewalk and , then,
that will give our residents access to that intersection , so they can cross Eagle Road.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor, follow up if I may.
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Sam, again, my memory may not be correct, but if I recall when you were before
us last time your request was to delay those sidewalk improvements until there were
some roadway improvements that were -- that were planned around Eagle Road. If I'm
hearing you correct, you are not anticipating any delays with sidewalks because of the --
the project that's occurring north of you, is that -- am I hearing you correct?
S.Johnson: Council Member Cavener, there is -- in the ACHD staff report they are
recommending that the sidewalk and the wait -- the -- the widening of Eagle Road in front
of our property wait until they do their widening of Eagle Road in 2023. Excuse me. And
they have -- as part of that would be the sidewalk, but I'm wanting to have that sidewalk
in when I build the rest of my subdivision and do the landscaping on that -- on that buffer.
So, I'm hoping that I can have that -- I don't see why ACHD would not want me to put in
a sidewalk -- put it in the appropriate place that meets their future needs and -- and I can
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June 9, 2020
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landscape up to that. So, if -- if -- I am agreeable to having that sidewalk installation be
part of the condition for occupancy.
Simison: Just one item on that and I don't know exactly how this works, because we often
will be asked by ACHD -- because we do prefer detached sidewalks, that they will ask us
to fund the difference between the sidewalk and the road. So, I understand what you are
trying to do, Mr. Johnson, in terms of putting it in, but want to make sure that you will also
be responsible in this project to finishing the landscaping that would occur between the
sidewalk and the curb-gutter when the rest of that road is put in.
S.Johnson: Mr. Mayor, yes, absolutely.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, question for Mr. Nary. In this instance where the -- the applicant
desires to put in a sidewalk prior to the widening of the road , you know, they look at the
setbacks and do all that, but yet ACHD may say, no, please don't do that, yet we want it
as soon as possible, who prevails in that situation?
Nary: Well, that's a great question, Council Member Hoaglun. I think -- and Bill Parsons
is still on the call. We had a brief discussion about how we could position this either -- I
think in the DA and I don't know if that was an acceptable resolution , Mr. Johnson, of
where to build this and basically putting it in a separate lot. Again, if it's out of the right of
way it really is the city's call. If it's anywhere near the right of way or incorporated within
the right of way it's, obviously, ACHD's call. So, I think -- I think the desire has always
been make sure it's completely out of the right of way, so it can get built at the city's timing
or the developer's timing, rather than ACHD.
Dodson: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Yes, Joe.
Dodson: Yes, I agree with Mr. Nary that as long as that pathway is constructed within the
landscape buffer, which is already outside of the ACHD right of way, then, there will be no
issue with the ACHD widening. Unless they completely change their street widths
between now and 2023 to make it wider.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I keep coming back to the tot lot. You know, I know it's something that came up
-- it's a great legacy that Council Woman Milam left us. You know, I -- I don't love the
common driveways. I -- I understand what, you know, Councilman Hoaglun's point was
the last time about, look, if we need to look at our common driveway standards maybe
we just need to look at them. I appreciate the parking plan. I feel like that helps me get
over the hump. I'm anticipating some friction with the Sky Mesa Subdivision over their
amenities and I'm just wondering if -- you know, if where we ended up with was the
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June 9, 2020
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limitation on the single story homes, adding an additional amenity of a decent tot lot, and,
then, you know, having the applicant obligated to finish that sidewalk along Eagle Road
and all the other additional improvements if -- you know, that would kind of get us all over
the hump. So, I was curious what the applicant's opinion was about adding that tot lot
with the idea being, you know, maybe that helps avoid people going elsewhere to other
subdivisions to use their amenities.
S.Johnson: Mr. Mayor and Council Woman Strader, I'm -- I guess I'm -- I'm -- I'm -- I
understand the concern and I -- there is -- I think no matter what we put in this -- because
of the amenities elsewhere, whether it's Sky Mesa or Century Farm or even -- you know,
clear across the valley, if some -- if the amenities of a community are -- are so appealing
that they are going to draw people there, you know, it's -- it's impossible to stop them and
-- and, you know, I know that there is going to be controlled access to the pools for Sky
Mesa. Pathways, walkways, all of that is supposed to be connectivity and amenities to
the community at large, so I'm -- I'm -- I believe and we believe that having a -- an
additional amenity with -- you know, what's -- if you say substantial -- a tot lot apparatus
of some sort, you know, who is to say what's that line -- what is substantial, what's not.
Again, I go back to if this -- if a tot lot is -- is required -- you know, an additional
requirement, then, we will -- we will deal with that. We don't agree with it or we would
have proposed that. You know, this is not a -- a huge neighborhood and we believe that
the open space and this shade picnic structure is -- is something that's going to be used
and appreciated by all in the community. So, you know, that's -- that's why we have
proposed what we have. So, if -- if the Council feels like there is -- another amenity is
required, then, maybe condition that it's another amenity and maybe -- and give us the
opportunity to pick which amenity that might be. But, again, we have met the code and
-- and we have -- we have talked about that previously and we believe what we have
provided is -- is a -- is fairly substantial for this size of community.
Strader: Mr. Mayor, follow up.
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: Your point -- I get your point. I -- you know, I think what I'm trying to drive at -- I
will be curious what my fellow Council's opinion is on that. I understand what the code
requires, but, you know, I'm trying to create a better balance I think is what I was getting
at. A better balance in terms of, you know, your neighborhood offering quite a bit for those
residents there and for their kids to play there. So, that maybe the Sky Mesa kids come
over there and maybe, you know, the kids over here kind of go down the pathway and
maybe somebody like lets them in the pool every now and then and maybe there is a
better balance that -- that might just provide for a better outcome. But, you know, I will
defer to everybody else and we will have that discussion. Thanks.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: For the record real quick that Councilman Borton has joined us as of 6:51.
Council Woman Perreault.
Meridian City Council
June 9, 2020
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Perreault: Yeah. I'm struggling with this extra amenity conver -- you know, discussion as
well. Well, not the discussion, but the potential requirement, and I think, you know, the
-- the poor pedestrian connectivity here is really why I'm in favor of that second amenity,
because if -- if we know for sure that that sidewalk is going to go in when this project is
constructed and not three years later, those -- those residents will have access to Hillsdale
Park. That's the official name of that park. They will have it -- they will have walking
access to Hillsdale Park and then -- and, then, they would -- you know, had that area been
a little bit further down the road they would have a walking access to Discovery Park at
some point and Discovery Park is a little farther out. I know that there is a -- we had a
hearing for development just south of this one , which I think got approved if I remember
correctly and so there should be some sidewalks that are being connected to the
intersection at Eagle and Lake Hazel and so with good pedestrian connectivity there is
access to two nice sized parks where a tot lot may not be required , but that -- that
connectivity doesn't exist yet, so just keeping that in mind, that's where I'm -- I'm having
a hard time kind of going back and forth on this.
Simison: Well, Council, I'm not the developer or ACHD, but I think your timing between
the road being constructed and these homes being built and occupied is not going to be
that far off based upon the work that still has to be done in this project and when ACHD
typically builds their projects within their calendar year. You know, I'm -- the south
Meridian has huge connectivity problems, but the situation where I look at Locust Grove
and I see connectivity problems galore with no solution coming, but in this case I see a
solution that will be there within a year or less of homes being occupied, which is -- as far
as I'm concerned, quite frankly, a blessing compared to what others are waiting for for
connectivity issues, not -- and I don't hear the developer trying to skirt the need to put in
a sidewalk. The question was going to be even if he puts in his sidewalk where is it going
to go and for how long and the one thing we know is by 2023 it should go someplace.
S.Johnson. Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Mr. Johnson.
S.Johnson: To speak a little to the timing of -- of our projects, we have our connectivity
and our sewer and water will come through the Sky Mesa project and through our one
access point, which, again, are -- that access point -- originally when we sat down with
the city and the ACHD staff we had a connection to Eagle Road, but that was one of the
first points of discussion just to -- to say we don't want that -- or staff didn't want that. So,
I guess don't penalize me for not having another connection. The timing of this -- you
know, at least Boise Hunter Homes, who is developing Sky Mesa, says that they will be
connecting to my property on that road the very last phase that they plan to build. So,
that means that everything to the north up to -- near Taconic, which is actually underway
with their final plat number four, they have approval for Sky Mesa Highlands to the south
and so there will be substantial homes -- a lot more development around me. I'm going
to be the last person in line, I guess, so there will -- if that's -- if that holds true sidewalk
along Eagle Road to the south, to the north, all of that will be in prior to me getting
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June 9, 2020
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occupancy and approvals. So, that's right now from my -- my knowledge is what the --
the timing of my project is.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: That being said, Mr. Johnson, are you thinking that -- that the homes will be
ready to be occupied sometime in 2022?
S.Johnson: That's my hope. Council Woman Perreault, the -- the -- you know, they do
have a lot of homes and lots to build out, but if the market continues to go the way it is I
would think that 2022 would be the first people moving into finished homes.
Dodson: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Mr. Dodson.
Dodson: Yes. I'm just wanting to reiterate on this sidewalk issue, since it's coming back
around, code does dictate along arterials and collector roadways that there is five foot --
at least five foot detached sidewalks. So, that is something that is requiring code to be
within that landscape buffer. Now, for this subdivision and including that one to the north,
that is recently come in for final plat, as Mr. Johnson stated. So, that pedestrian
connection to the multi-use pathway along Taconic and, then, out to Hillsdale is going to
be there. When is kind of just determined when this subdivision actually does get built.
But, again, as long as it's in that landscape buffer should not have any bearing. ACHD
shouldn't have any bearing on that sidewalk and pedestrian connection.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: It feels like we have gone around and know where we stand and unless any
other Council Member has a question or objection or something , I would move that we
close the hearing on this item.
Bernt: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to close the public hearing on H-2020-0030. Is
there any discussion on the motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye.
Opposed nay. The ayes have it.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
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June 9, 2020
Page 20 of 50
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: I appreciate Sam and his team for, you know, providing the details necessary for
us to make a more educated decision this evening. I'm not in love with this project. I wish
there could have been something different in regard to common driveways. Not a huge
fan of them. I get this is only ten acres and I understand that, you know, there is just so
much he could have possibly have done to change it up. However, I do like what he has
done with the sidewalks and I'm grateful for him and his team for agreeing to -- for that
connection. I think this would be really important. In regard to the tot lot, I'm not going to
hang my hat on that. I -- I'm sitting in -- currently in an open space amenity committee
right now. We are discussing these very same things and -- and I'm learning more and
more about amenities and -- and finding out that one of the least used amenity in our
communities are tot lots and so they sound great and they look great, but they are
underutilized and since there is a -- there is a park right across the street that -- that --
where folks from the subdivision can -- can go and congregate and recreate and have a
good time, I think that I'm okay with that. My personal belief , if I were moving into a sub
-- I would appreciate more open space and appreciate the -- the -- what -- the layout of
the open space and the common areas, excuse me, that he's provided. So, not super in
love with it. I don't think it's a terrible project. I don't think it's a spectacular project either.
So, I'm generally in favor of this one going forward.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: Well, I appreciate Councilman Bernt's comments. I -- I think the park information
is very helpful. I -- I had forgotten about that. You know, it sounds like the timing of that
connection or the ability to access that isn't too bad. I think I can live without it. You know,
I'm kind of tempted to just support the Planning and Zoning Commission in terms of
almost their exact recommendations, but I look -- I don't love it. I feel like it's -- it's
generally going to fit for this small of an area. Appreciate the sidewalk, but I feel like they
need to do that anyway. Appreciate the limitation to single story. I don't know. I -- I
personally am inclined to just ask for them to add an additional amenity without specifying
necessarily what it is, but I'm not going to fall on my sword over denying the project on
that on this one. So, I think I'm in a similar place.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: Yeah. I agree with much of what Councilman Bernt and Council Woman
Strader had said and the only thing I want to add is just that we always -- we always
encourage our -- the owners and the developers to get together and see if they can make
the developments more cohesive and to flow better with -- with, you know, vehicles and
pedestrian access and amenities and it's unfortunate that this wasn't i ncorporated into the
bigger association. I think that would have made a great scenario for all involved and I
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June 9, 2020
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don't know what the history is. Perhaps there was a conversation about Sky Mesa, you
know, purchasing this -- or Boise Hunter purchasing this property. I don't know. I -- I think
it's -- it is challenging that it's this piece that -- that is surrounded by this -- this other large
development, but that being said, that's not what we are here to decide, so I agree that
there are things that I like and things I don't and I think I'm generally in favor -- not in love,
but in favor enough to -- to vote for the application.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: I think I share a lot of the same sentiments of my colleagues, although I'm
leaning towards the other way. I keep looking at this project trying to convince myself that
it's good enough. I just can't quite get there. You know, I'm a firm believer that we give
applicants a -- you know, every fair shake to level up and bring a development that meets
the values of our community and this just does not check the box for me. It goes back to
again -- I think I mentioned this two weeks ago. I have got, you know, a mini Council
Member Milam sitting on my shoulder saying minimum, minimum, minimum and -- and
the only things I'm really seeing that's changed from what we heard two weeks ago is that
it's a -- it's a really nice picnic shelter. I'm really looking forward to learning more from our
open space committee, but I would argue the only thing I think gets used less than a tot
lot is like a picnic shelter. So, to me there is just still so many unknowns here that -- and,
then, you add on top of that, you know, when we -- when we first heard this it was before
a levy election for the school district and while the levy has no impact on future schools,
to me it's a good sign about where district patrons feel about investing in our kids and with
the levy being very very unsuccessful, I have significant concerns about the district's
ability to find public support for bonds for future schools and we talk every week about the
challenges in the south side related to Hillsdale and so with this being so close to me that
kind of tips me going in the opposite direction, so I'm not supportive. I think that we could
have seen something better. I think we have seen way better projects in Meridian and
you all know that I'm a cheerleader for the south side . I think the south side is special
and I just think that we could have had a much better take in a project like this for south
Meridian.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I guess I would be curious. It is somewhat of an -- it's becoming an in-fill project
and I guess I would be curious if Councilman Cavener had -- had a vision that most of us
agree on of what -- what a better product would look like that would be enough that the
applicant could move forward with it if we -- if we sort of agreed on what that looked like.
In other words, is it an additional amenity? Is it additional open space? Is it restricting
the common driveways? I guess I'm coming back a little bit to the -- the Planning and
Zoning Commission recommendations, which if we followed them it would be very
restrictive on the applicant, but they would be getting an approval and there would be
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June 9, 2020
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significant changes required that -- that would kind of require them to up their game. I
guess I'm just wondering, you know, where -- what his opinion would be about falling back
to something more similar to the Planning and Zoning Commission, if that would get him
there.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor, if I can respond.
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Great question, Council Member. I appreciate you asking. Yeah. I think that
he -- I think you and I are kind of landing on the same place , so if -- if a motion is fairly
restrictive, similar to where the Planning and Zoning Commission is, those alley load over
there, it just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. You know, I would like to see what --
again, a more usable amenity. I always try and refrain from , you know, kind of putting my
fingers on types of projects. I try and be really transparent about what I think ki nd of
represents the values and the needs of the community. We rely on our subject matter
experts in the development community to kind of -- to bring that. You know, maybe I --
maybe I have just been conditioned by Council Member Milam to talk about , you know, a
tot lot or a playground, something along those things, but I don't care what corner of
Meridian you go to, we are a community for young families and young families will want
to take advantage of that. I think we discussed when -- when this was last before us
about if this was an age restricted product and if I recall -- I mean this isn't even really a
planned community. I think the -- the business plan is to turn around and sell the lots to
a handful of different builders to kind of build everything under the sun. So, to me it gets
back to what's going to make this neighborhood build a sense of community in Meridian
and -- and I think if we lost some lots, if we increased our open space, if we added a more
usable amenity and, then, moved that alley load or common drives, those are the things
that I would be more comfortable with to be supportive.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun hasn't yet spoken.
Hoaglun: Well, Mr. Mayor, Council Woman Perreault and, then, Council Woman Strader
mentioned the similar things about this really being an in-fill. You know, the last one in in
a development, it has to -- to fit from a financial standpoint, from the area that you have
to work with. I agree that -- I wish it had been part of the whole collective development
when -- when that was done, that I think it would have been different, but how you can
make it fit now -- and there is a lot more restrictions on it. You know, we are not that far
off from what the Commission changed to the staff recommendation. I mean he's agreed
to limit those particular lots to a single story. Instead of a tot lot it's a picnic shelter and I
like the looks of it. It's a nice picnic shelter. You know, city code allows up to six lots that
could be served by a common drive and in the last meeting Councilman Bernt had talked
about, you know, from a percentage basis how -- who many that is and I think he's onto
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something that we need to look at those things and kind of mayb e figure out a way that
it's less impactful, because, yeah, having just three with four, that's 12 of 42, you know,
that -- that has a much higher percentage than if you had six in a , you know, 400 home
subdivision. So, per four. So -- you know. But that's something we have to look down
the road. We can -- I don't -- and to me the -- these -- these fit. They are -- they are tight,
but they fit for this project and maximize the space, but provide open space. So, with
what the -- with -- with the developer willing to put in the landscaping and sidewalks as
soon as practicable and we could say, you know, before a building permit's issued putting
in a picnic shelter, changing the lots to two from three, I'm fine with three and we can take
a look at city code and maybe do some things in the future. I mean it's -- it's -- it's -- you
know, like Councilman Bernt said, it's -- I'm not in love with this, it's -- it's okay, you know,
and it serves the need and we move on and we see things here from this an d other things
that we see that need to be tweaked in our -- in our code to make it more amenable for
-- whether it's amenities or styles or different things like that and, you know, I'm open to
looking at that, but for -- for this particular project I think they did the best they could with
what they had to work with in this particular situation.
Simison: And, Council, just from my perspective, you know, I look at my own home and,
you know, we have got a tot lot, swing set in our backyard. Many of my neighbors do as
well. We have got a city park two blocks away that we can all -- or three blocks away that
we can all walk to, which has plenty of amenities as well and I have a small rectangular
large backyard kind of across the street from me where all the families send their kids to
go play, because it's the closest thing to their home and has some open space for people
to do things and I -- when I look at -- I know this was brought up by the -- I believe the
applicant last time, but I do view the open space in front of roughly two-thirds of the homes
in this subdivision out their front door, where if you have kids and you want to see them
all go play together, I think that that in and of itself is a great amenity to have in an area
that I think the open play aspect is sometimes lost when it's over programmed and over
encumbered by other things. I don't think that most people are going to leave the
subdivision and go over to Hillsdale Park. I don't -- not without getting in their car and
driving over there. It's -- it's -- it's a hike, you know. So, I think it's really a question of
whether or not you believe in what this offers to the people that may choose to move into
a more compacted area and I think that -- that it has a nice benefit to being surrounded
or overlooking a majority just in a large open space. It has a certain feel that I don't think
we have a lot of that in our community, to be honest with you.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: So, a couple of things that have been mentioned that struck me. I'm sitting
here thinking about if I lived in a community like this would I use the picnic shelter and
very unlikely. I mean unless I was having like a family re union or something, which I
probably would rent -- rent a shelter from the Parks Department, I don't know that I would
ever just take a picnic that I could have in my backyard on my patio down the street or,
you know, to a picnic shelter and wondering abou t the -- really -- really the usability of it
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and I think Councilman Cavener is right that it might be -- it's probably less used than a
tot lot on the list of amenities. So, that being said, I'm always very conscious of not
wanting to continue applicants several times, because I know they have deadlines and
timelines, but I'm curious based on what Councilman -- Council Woman Strader has
mentioned about maybe just -- you know, do we need to ask the applicant to just look and
-- just to review the amenities altogether. The picnic shelter -- I know they have already
had work done to have those renderings done , which were beautiful and very helpful.
The visuals are very helpful. But do we or should we consider asking the applicant to
reassess whether they need two amenities and what they should be, because I know I --
it's very unlikely I would go sit at a picnic shelter down the road from my house if I have a
patio in my backyard.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: My opinion -- I think we have continued this once to address some of that
specifically. I think what we have received from the applicant was their response. To your
point I don't like continuing for continuing sake or to -- I think we gave a fair shot for them
to bring back something. I think asking them to come back yet again -- we would just go
through another two hours of conversation that -- and likely into the same result one way
or another. So, my decision won't be based solely on adding an additional amenity or
not.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: I move that we approve item -- let's do this. McKay Farms, Item No. H-2020-0030,
as presented with -- with an addition of allowing the developer to add a usable amenity
that will help with the project.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, I will second the motion for discussion.
Simison: I have a motion and a second and I'm expecting discussion.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I would support that motion. I'm assuming that it will also just include the
limitation to single story homes on Lots 32, 40 and 50 and, then, it would also reference
the completion of the sidewalk and the landscaping buffer as stated previously.
Bernt: Yes, ma'am.
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June 9, 2020
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Hoaglun: Second agrees.
Simison: Is there further discussion on the motion? If not, then, I will ask the clerk to call
the roll.
Roll call: Bernt, yea; Borton, yea; Cavener, yea; Hoaglun, yea; Strader, yea; Perreault,
yea.
Simison: All ayes. Motion is agreed to.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
D. Public Hearing for Victory Commons (H-2019-0150) by BVA
Development, LLC, Located at 130 E. Victory Rd. and 3030
S. Meridian Rd.
1. Request: Preliminary Plat consisting of 12 building lots on
16.74 acres of land in the C-G zoning district.
Simison: Thank you very much for your -- for the applicant's and staff's work on that item.
With that we will move on to Item 6-D, a public hearing for Victory Commons, H-2019-
0150, and I will turn this over for staff comments. Or open the public hearing for staff
comments.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Perhaps maybe while staff is getting their -- their microphone situation resolved,
I just -- before we maybe jump into the public hearing, I just wanted to put on the record
I live in the neighborhood that's adjacent to this proposed project. I don't live within 300
feet of the project and I haven't attended any Planning and Zoning Commission or
neighborhood meetings around this project, but just wanted to note for the record it is
adjacent to me, but I haven't participated in any of the other processes.
Simison: Thank you, Mr. Cavener.
Parsons: All right. Mr. Mayor, can you hear me?
Simison: Yes.
Simison: Perfect. Pleasure to be with you here tonight. So, the next project on the
agenda this evening is the Victory Commons preliminary plat. The subject property
consists of 16.74 acres of land. It's currently zoned C -G within the city limits and the
properties have two addresses, one being 3030 South Meridian Road and the other is
130 East Victory Road. But the project is located on the northeast corner of Meridian and
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June 9, 2020
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Victory Roads. Some history on this particular property. It was annexed and platted in
2003 and, then, just recently, approximately six months ago, this body did approve a
development agreement modification to basically terminate the previous DAs and have
the applicant enter into a new DA that had a new concept plan. As part of that approval
and because of that approval there is actually three certificate zoning compliance
applications that we have already approved for this site and one of those structures are
currently under construction as we speak tonight. The Comprehensive Plan for this
particular property is commercial and the current zoning of C-G is consistent with that
designation. Sensitive arrows. The -- the preliminary plat that's before you this evening
-- so, to get you oriented the left hand of the screen is north and , then, the right, of course,
is south, which is Victory Road and Meridian Road would be on the southern edge of this
exhibit as well. So, the plat consists of 12 buildable lots, again, on 16.74 acres of land
and the applicant is proposing to develop this in two phases. So , the first phase is the
area that is not outlined in red and, then, of course -- so, the first phase would be the
northern half, the second phase the southern half , which is outlined in -- in red for you this
evening. The site is currently developed with a commercial nursery and a multi-tenant
building. As I stated earlier, there is an existing urgent care facility that's currently under
construction along the north boundary of the site. Other uses approved for the site include
a retail paint store and a multi-tenant flex building that you can see here on the northern
half of the exhibit, which, again, is consistent with the DA modification that this body did
approve approximately six months ago. On this exhibit before you I have a couple arrows .
They depict the access point that is approved for this particular development. The first
access, which is the purple arrow on the south end of the exhibit, shows the right-in, right-
out only access to Meridian Road. This was a topic of discussion as part of that DA
modification in which both ITD and City Council approved that access point. As part of
that approval ITD did require the applicant to set aside some additional right of way, put
in a decel lane for future widening of Meridian Road as well and, then, there is an access
point to Victory Road, which is a full access at this point. In looking at the ACHD staff
report they have concluded that the project meets all the current thresholds of the
proposed development and they have not required any additional improvement s to
Victory Road. I would also mentioned to Council that all of the lots within the subdivision
are subject to a cross-access agreement as required in the recorded development
agreement. The applicant was required to submit a landscape plan for the prop osed
development. Per city code Meridian Road is an entryway corridor, which requires a
minimum 30 foot wide -- 35 foot wide landscape buffer and, then, Victory Road is
designated an arterial road and that requires a minimum of a 25 foot wide landscape
buffer. Again as part of that DA modification the applicant was required to put in all of the
buffer requirements along Victory Road and Meridian Road with the first phase of
development. I would also mention to the Council that you can see here along the
northern boundary -- or I guess the northeastern boundary the applicant is required to do
a 25 foot wide landscape buffer when you have commercial uses to a residential use.
The plans that are submitted this evening do depict that buffer and the applicant will work
with the irrigation district and the city to make sure that the landscaping as shown can go
in as proposed by the applicant. As part of the DA modification the applicant did provide
conceptual building elevations for the proposed development. The three structures that
are currently under development on the site were found to be -- comply with those
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June 9, 2020
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requirements and did meet the standards of the architectural standards manual. All
futures -- all future structures in this development are required to comply with the
elevations in the amended DA, the design standards in the UDC 3-A-19 and those in the
ASM or the Architectural Standards Manual. The Planning and Zoning Commission did
recommend approval at the May 7th hearing. Testifying in favor was Geoffrey Wardle.
There was no one testifying in opposition, commenting, or submitting written testimony
on this application and there was no testimony discussed during the public hearing as far
as public testimony I should say. Key issues of discussion by the Commission included
the height of the proposed structures. If the Council remembers, there is a restriction in
the DA that restricts the heights of the buildings on this site to 35 feet and that was also
a discussion as part of the DA mod. There was some discussion of a pedestrian
connection from the adjacent residential subdivision. Again, that was a DA provision that
was -- the applicant agreed to and is currently complying with and extending that pathway
from the subdivision to the north into the site along Meridian Road. Timing for the Victory
Road access. Some of the Commission was concerned about another way in and out of
this development, since it was phased as part of two phases. Rest assured that the -- I
shared with the Commission that the secondary access point will be required when there
is a certain amount of square footage threshold constructed on this site and the
applicant's also required to have cross-access with the C-store that's located on the hard
corner. So, there is going to be another right-in, right-out only access to Meridian Road
between this development and the existing developments at the hard corner. Planning
and Zoning Commission had discussed the parking ratio for this particular development.
Again, I informed them that there is a concept plan and that the parking ratios approved
with the three CZCs that have already been approved for the site met the minimum
parking standards per city code and, then, I also informed the Commission that the
landscaping along Victory Road would be installed prior to occupancy of the first building
on the site. The applicant and I have discussed that requirement. They are aware of it
and so moving forward they either install it or put up a bond for that improvement. So ,
any Commission changes that were -- were not -- there weren't any Commission changes
required of the staff report and there are no outstanding issues for Council this evening.
In looking at the public record I have not seen where there was any written testimony
provided after the Planning and Zoning Commission. So, with that both staff and Planning
and Zoning Commission are recommend -- recommending approval of this plat and I will
stand for any questions you may have.
Simison: Thank you, Mr. Parsons. Bill, could you just clarify for me that -- you said right-
in, right-out, but I will be -- one of my biggest concerns with this corner is actually the exit
out of the convenience store onto Victory Road due to the exit being so close to the
intersection and going through turn lanes. My guess is eventually that enters -- that's
going to be required to be a right-in, right-out only by ACHD at some point in time or ITD.
So, where is the right-in, right-out and how is the cross-access, if that -- if that ever doesn't
become right-in, right-out, how would people get out to go west on Victory -- or east on
Victory?
Parsons: Yeah. Mayor, Members of the Council, no one's going to be able to get back
out onto Victory from Meridian Road. They are going to actually have to drive through
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June 9, 2020
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that development and use the current access -- or the future access to Meridian Road.
It's actually the current access that they have now that serves the multi -tenant building
and the nursery. So, as it stands now that the access for the gas station -- I think they
have an access to Amity as well -- or, excuse me, Victory and they also have a right-in,
right-out to Meridian Road. So, I'm -- right now as -- as you alluded to -- or at least what
I said in my testimony is ACHD has not restricted that access at this point, but I imagine
as traffic warrants and things increase, that may be restricted at some point. So, cross
-- cross-access will be critical in the future, but as I mentioned to you, Mayor, in looking
at the staff report ACHD has not required any further traffic pattern changes to Victory
Road at this point.
Simison: I understand. I guess my question, Bill, is based upon the -- what we are seeing
up on our screen is cross-access going to require someone to go essentially north out the
back of the convenience store? If that -- if that access to the convenience store ever went
away cross-access would require them to go north, work their way around through to
come out at the access point that is currently shown on Victory through this other --
through the project?
Parson: Yeah. Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, absolutely. That would be the only
way they could go out, except for, like I said, if you look at the right -- at the very low --
the very bottom of the screen there, the convenience store does have an access to Amity
there.
Simison: And that's what I'm talking about. I think eventually that one will be restricted
to a right-in --
Parsons: I don't have any doubt about that either. I'm sure at some point that will close
and, then, everyone will have to funnel internally to get out to Meridian Road and
potentially Amity -- or, excuse me, Victory.
Simison: Okay. Thank you. Council, any further questions for Mr. Parsons?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault got you just by a hair.
Perreault: Bill, I did not see any elevations in the file. Do you have any copies of those
that you can put on the screen?
Parsons: Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, I guess, Council Woman Perreault, are you
wanting what we have approved with the CZC or what was submitted and improved with
the development agreement?
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June 9, 2020
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Perreault: Oh, I apologize. I thought you were referencing the elevations that have been
submitted with this as examples, but I was -- I was looking -- I realized that we are just
considering the preliminary plat. I thought maybe the elevations might be just helpful to
get a visual of what it is they are -- you know, they are attempting to do, just because
sometimes these two dimensional plats are hard to -- to visualize, but it's -- I just wanted
to clarify there -- there weren't any submitted with this application ; correct? You are
referring to ones from the DA modification?
Parsons: Yeah. Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, Council Woman Perreault, that is
correct. I -- this particular case -- and in an effort to keep it simple I did not attach any
elevations to this project, because I knew the development agreement had that covered.
But I'm happy to drag over the elevations if you would like to see them.
Perreault: I don't recall -- I'm wondering if this was -- was this approved last -- in 2019?
Because I don't recall this application since I have been on Council.
Parsons: Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, Council Woman Perreault, yes, it was
approved October, November last year. I don't think you we re sworn in yet. So, it
predates your -- your term.
Perreault: Okay. Thank you.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Yeah. Question for Mr. Parsons. Bill, I think I read -- it was either the staff
report or in the P&Z minutes that there is a requirement for a ten foot wide sidewalk along
Meridian Road; is that correct?
Parsons: Yeah. Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, Councilman Hoaglun, a portion of it
is. So, in the development agreement -- or as part of that development agreement
modification the applicant was required to extend a portion of that pathway along the
Meridian frontage, which, basically, ties into -- so, if you look at this slide that I have in
front of you here, the -- in that northern corner there is -- is the urgent care and the
applicant is expanding that pathway up to that -- essentially that intersection or close to
that new curb cut into the site from Meridian Road and at -- anything south of that new
intersection will remain the five foot wide detached sidewalk with an easement. So , if and
when the city desires to widen that, include a pathway, that it could be built in the future.
So, a portion of it's being constructed and a portion of it's being preserved through an
easement for future expansion if needed or desired.
Hoaglun: Okay. Mr. Mayor, Mr. Parsons, thanks for that explanation. That helps.
Simison: Council, any further questions for staff at this point? Okay. Thank you very
much. With that we will ask the applicant to come forward. And if you can state your
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June 9, 2020
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name and address for the record. It looks like we will have Mr. Wardle before us today
and you will have 15 minutes.
Wardle: Thank you, Mayor. Thank you, Members of Council. Glad to be with you. Bill
did a great job covering the topics in the staff report. To give you a brief overview of this,
for those of you who are new and who didn't hear this last fall, this does implement a
development agreement that was am ended in late 2019. Bill, if you can click to the next
slide. Or --
Johnson: Mr. Mayor. Mr. Wardle, you should have control of the screen. You should
have a pop up asking if you want to control.
Wardle: There we go. All right. So, background. This property was part of an application
in 2003 culminating in its zoning and annexation in 2004 with a development agreement.
The zoning has been consistent with the Comprehensive Plan that was in place at that
time and as it went forward. The development agreement was amended in 2006 and the
initial Mussell Corner Subdivision was platted and that's how and when the -- the
convenience store was constructed and as part of that implementing the requirements
that were imposed then were provisions for master cross-access throughout the site. So,
to the Mayor's question, it has always been contemplated by the City of Meridian, the
property owners, Ada County Highway District that in order to head east on Victory you
would have to use the internal circulation through the site to traverse your way over there.
Now, currently there are buildings that will be modified and there are -- there are a variety
of other structures that will need to be modified as we redevelop this from the existing
Victory Greens use, but that is the plan that -- that that access would be a full access to
the east with right-in, right-out out of the convenience store and, then, where Bill identified
a -- an approved access onto Meridian Road that would be right-in, right-out. In the
original development agreement it had a -- a different site plan and it contemplated a
western themed project and the building standards and the building designs at that time
were -- were very much a pole barn western themed, which was fine, but as we move
forward with users, you know, the determination was made that we needed to significantly
modify the site plan for internal circulation issue matters and also for design. So , in 2019
this body approved an amendment to the development agreement that i ncluded additional
conditions of approval, one of which conditions of approval we agreed that the buildings
would be limited to 35 feet in height. Even though this is a C-G zone that would permit a
significantly higher elevation, we made that commitment due to the comments that we
heard from the neighborhood and the questions posed by the City Council. As you see ,
this is the first -- the -- the design configuration of the first phase that we modified with
that development agreement. The -- phase one is the northern piece, which will provide
that access to the north onto Meridian Road. Originally the 2004 development agreement
maintained a temporary access at the very very north , but it was always intended that
that would be subject to relocation when a full development application came forward.
So, we made that -- the contemplated plan here is for a variety of uses from -- as Bill
indicated that we do have three CZC applications that have already been approved with
a Saltzer health clinic under construction in that northernmost parcel that you see there
at the north is what's currently under construction and, then, south of that access drive --
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June 9, 2020
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or south of the Meridian Road access is a retail building that we have a user for and is in
for permitting and, then, those larger buildings in the back are contemplated to be a flex
space with a variety of uses for sale and for lease. So , as we move forward the 2019
development modification -- development agreement modification replaced the prior 2004
and 2006 development agreements. It modified the site plan , modified access and
eliminated the western theme design standards , replacing it with the ones that Bill has
outlined for you that were integrated into that. This preliminary plat is a resubdivision of
that 2006 Mussell Corner Subdivision as we replat and reconfigure a portion of it. There
have been some additional parcel boundaries and the whole purpose of this preliminary
plat is to implement the development agreement consistent with what was approved in
2019. As Bill indicated, we have outlined this work in two phases. We recognize the
conditions of approval relate to certain improvements that have to be done on Victory
Road, even though that's not in the first phase , and that work either is or will be done as
Bill's outlined and in the phase one of this project we will have five -- five lots that will
initially proceed and, then, everything will come forward to the south. When we come
forward with the plat for the southern most piece along Victory I anticipate that we will be
required to come back before Council with a more specific plan as that was preserved for
future improvement and future evaluation. So, as Bill outlined, 12 building lots, C-G zone,
intended to enhance the commercial node that was previously approved here in 2004
when the property was annexed. The northernmost parcel currently under development
-- and as Bill indicated that is where connection to the existing micro path has been
requested to the neighborhood to the east of the Kennedy Lateral and that will be
constructed and installed and the second retail building will be just to the south of that
and as Bill indicated that is a retail user who has already been in for permit. So, we are
in general agreement with the conditions of approval. The conditions are consistent with
the development agreement and we will be proceeding forthwith with the northern phase
one as the Saltzer health facility will be completed we anticipate in just a few months
providing that urgent care facility to the residents of south Meridian. So, with that we
believe it complies with all UDC requirements and request approval as recommended by
the staff and the Planning and Zoning Commission. And with that I will stand for any
questions.
Simison: Thank you. Council, any questions?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Bernt: Mr. Mayor? I defer.
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: Would it be possible for Bill to bring the landscape plan back up? And, then, I
have a question for the applicant. That shows the buff -- I have a question about the
buffers. Okay. I just wanted to make sure that I understood that on the -- that full length
of the north side, which is going to be behind the flex spaces, that is a 25 foot buffer to
the -- the residents; is that right?
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June 9, 2020
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Wardle: Correct. But it's also within a larger easement for the Kennedy Lateral.
Perreault: Okay.
Wardle: And there is some degree of elevation change there. So, that's what Bill meant
when he indicated that there would still be some design work to be done with the irrigation
company and the city on that. But, yes, it's a 25 foot easement -- a 25 foot buffer on our
property.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor, a follow up?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: Mr. Wardle, do you happen to know the -- the full distance from the -- the south
side of the buffer to the fence line of that subdivision?
Wardle: Mr. Mayor, Council Member, I do not, because a portion of that fence line is
adjacent to a common area that's platted as part of that. So, a portion of that easement
-- I mean what you're seeing there is -- as to the east and it's -- it's a rather substantial
facility. There is a significant amount of distance between the two. So, it is 25 feet on our
property, but it's 25 feet on our property, plus there is additional space to the north
adjacent to those parcels.
Perreault: Thank you.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: Geoff, just one question. Do you -- do you guys project any tenants that will -- that
will require more parking than what you have planned for that would make a -- have a
problem parking?
Wardle: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Bernt, no, I mean that question came up at Planning
and Zoning and as Bill answered I mean it's zoned C-G, we are going to have to comply
with all of your parking requirements. Of course it's going to be very much site specific
and as to this location we are certainly not contemplating any types of the larger office
buildings that you are seeing elsewhere. So, these are intended to be small users and
it's something we are hypersensitive to, because you have got to thread that needle.
Bernt: Not going to be a popular restaurant in there or anything?
Wardle: I -- I -- I don't have any idea of any restaurant users for that site yet, Council
Member Bernt, but if we do the beauty of restaurants is the parking demand for
restaurants is counter cyclical with office, so -- except at lunch on Thursday.
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June 9, 2020
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Perreault: Mr. Mayor, I have a similar question.
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: So, we are starting to see restaurant users put in drive-thrus, even in these
flex spaces. Any anticipation that will happen? We don't get to hear those, they go
through the conditional use permit process that the Commission decides. Is there any
way to put a limitation on that and not -- I would prefer that that not be permitted.
Wardle: Well -- I mean it's not -- I -- it's a C-G zoned use. It's a C-G zoned use with a
very specific design. You are right, there are those types of users that we have seen go
into flex space, but here are the flex spaces. The visibility is such that if there is a drive-
thru user it will be out on one of the pads on either Victory or Meridian Road. I just can't
see -- I can't see a drive-thru user wanting to be interior on those flex spaces. I mean --
and that was a conscious decision on how we spaced it and located it, but you would
have more intensive retail uses to the street and the -- the flex -- the flex use to the back.
But never say never, because you never know what a user wants and that's why we come
back for conditional use permits.
Simison: Council, any additional questions at this time? Okay. Thank you very much.
Did we have anyone signed up to testify on the item this evening?
Weatherly: Mr. Mayor, we did not.
Simison: Okay. Well, just like in previous conversations for those who are still tuned in,
I think that we have a lot of people still waiting to get back to the first item that was on our
agenda, but if there is anybody that would like to testify on this item, please, raise your
hand by clicking the button at the middle bottom of your screen to -- and we will bring you
in to testify and if you are on the phone and you would like to participate press star nine.
And we will give this just about 30 seconds to see if anyone would like to testify. I am not
seeing anybody raise their hand otherwise. I will just confirm that with the clerk that they
agree.
Weatherly: Mr. Mayor, I agree.
Simison: Okay. Well, with that, Mr. Wardle, would you like to make any final comments?
Wardle: No. We are ready to proceed with your decision.
Simison: Okay.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
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June 9, 2020
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Cavener: Quick question for Mr. Wardle. My wife's asked me to wrap up a couple of yard
projects. How much longer is that nursery going to be around, so I can get those wrapped
up this summer?
Wardle: Obviously it's a phased redevelopment and we are starting on the north. So,
you know, I wouldn't wait too long. But you will have some time.
Cavener: All right. Appreciate the reprieve.
Simison: I hear they might be having a fire sale, so pay attention.
Bernt: I doubt it.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: No other questions, I move we close the public hearing on Item 6-D, Victory
Commons, H-2019-0150.
Bernt: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to close the public hearing. Is there any
discussion on the motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay.
The ayes have it.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: I move we approve Item 6-D, a preliminary plat for H-2019-0150, Victory
Commons.
Bernt: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second. Is there any discussion on the motion? If not,
clerk will call the roll.
Roll call: Bernt, yea; Borton, yea; Cavener, yea; Hoaglun, yea; Strader, yea; Perreault,
yea.
Simison: All ayes and the motion is agreed to.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
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June 9, 2020
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Simison: Council, I have had a request to take a few minutes to a llow people to take a
quick break, so with that I'm going to call a recess until 8:00 o'clock. That should hopefully
give everyone time to take care of what they need to. So, we will -- we will see you back
here in 12 minutes.
(Recess: 7:48 p.m. to 8:02 p.m.)
E. Combined Public Hearing for Ordinance 20-1881: Deannexation
Plan Amendment) - First Amendment to the Meridian
Revitalization Plan and Ordinance 20-1882: Union District Plan
Simison: Okay. Council, I'm going to call us out of recess. It is 8:02 and we will move
on to Item 6-E, which is combined public hearing for Ordinance 20-1881, deannexation
plan amendment. The first amendment to the Meridian Revitalization Plan and Ordinance
20-1882, Union District Plan. Council, we left this public hearing open last time for any
additional public comment. I will ask the clerk if anyone has signed up to testify on this
item.
Weatherly: Mr. Mayor, we did not have any sign-ups.
Simison: Okay. If there is anyone who is on the call that would like to provide testimony
on this item, if you could, please, indicate by hitting the raise hand button in the Zoom
platform or star nine on the phone and we will bring you on to testify for this item. Council,
I'm not seeing anybody who would wish to provide testimony on this item, so with that I
would be happy to entertain a motion.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Appreciate, Cameron, your team, Ashley, everybody at
MDC, Mr. Kushlon, your report. One, thank you for all the information, but, two, for the
extra week for us to at least invite the public to one more opportunity to provide some
testimony on this. As you all know, this is an issue that I have taken very very seriously
and have weighed the pros and cons back and forth. As I alluded to last week, I'm -- I'm
supportive, but I appreciate having one more opportunity for our public to weigh in. If -- if
none of my colleagues have any comments, I'm happy to make a motion. Okay. Mr.
Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Do we need to have the ordinance read one additional time or because we
have continued it from last week are we good to -- to move forward?
Simison: I think we need to close the public hearing and this process will be taking place
in the next ordinance reading.
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June 9, 2020
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Cavener: Okay. Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: If that, then, I move that we close the combined public hearings for Ordinance
20-1881 and 20-1882.
Perreault: Second.
Hoaglun: Second.
Bernt: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and several seconds to close the public hearing. Is there any
discussion on the motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. The ayes have
it.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 7: Ordinances [Action Item]
A. Third Reading of Ordinance 20-1881: An Ordinance of the City
Council of the City of Meridian, Approving the First Amendment
to the Meridian Revitalization Plan Urban Renewal Project,
Which First Amendment Seeks to Deannex Certain Parcels from
the Existing Meridian Revitalization Project Area; Which First
Amendment Amends a Plan That Includes Revenue Allocation
Financing Provisions; Authorizing the City Clerk to Transmit a
Copy of This Ordinance and Other Required Information to the
County, Affected Taxing Entities, and State Officials; Providing
Severability; Approving the Summary of the Ordinance; and
Providing an Effective Date
Simison: So, with that we will move on to Item 7-A, which is the third reading of Ordinance
20-1881, and I will ask the clerk to read this ordinance by title.
Weatherly: Thank you, Mr. Mayor. This is the third reading of Ordinance 20-1881, an
ordinance of the City Council of the City of Meridian approving the first amendment to the
Meridian Revitalization Plan Urban Renewal Project, which first amendment seeks to
deannex certain parcels from the existing Meridian Revitalization Project area; which first
amendment amends a plan that includes revenue allocation financing provisions;
authorizing the city clerk to transmit a copy of this ordinance and other required
information to the county, affecting taxing entities, and state officials; providing
severability; approving the summary of the ordinance; and providing an effective date.
Meridian City Council
June 9, 2020
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Simison: Council, we have heard this ordinance read for its third time. Is there any motion
or is it just deemed passed upon reading the third time, Bill?
Nary: Mr. Mayor, Members of Council, you will need to vote.
Simison: Okay.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: I move we approve Ordinance 20-1881.
Bernt: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to approve Ordinance No. 20-1881. Is there any
discussion on the motion? If not, the clerk will call the roll.
Roll call: Bernt, yea; Borton, abstain; Cavener, yea; Hoaglun, yea; Strader, yea;
Perreault, yea.
Simison: Five ayes. One abstain. Motion passes.
MOTION CARRIED: FIVE AYES. ONE ABSTAIN.
B. Third Reading of Ordinance 20-1882: An Ordinance of the City
Council of the City of Meridian, Approving the Urban Renewal
Plan for the Union District Urban Renewal Project, Which Plan
Includes Revenue Allocation Financing Provisions; Authorizing
the City Clerk to Transmit a Copy of This Ordinance and Other
Required Information to the County, Affected Taxing Entities,
and State Officials; Approving the Summary of the Ordinance;
and Providing an Effective Date
Simison: Up next is Item 7-B, a third reading of Ordinance 20-1882. Ask the clerk to read
it by title.
Weatherly: Thank you, Mr. Mayor. This is the third reading of Ordinance 20-1882, an
ordinance of the City Council of the City of Meridian approving the Urban Renewal Plan
for the Union District Urban Renewal Project, which plan includes revenue allocation
financing provisions; authorizing the city clerk to transmit a copy of this ordinance and
other required information to the county, affected taxing enti ties, and state officials;
approving the summary of the ordinance; and providing an effective date .
Simison: Council, you have heard this item read for the third time. Do I have a motion?
Meridian City Council
June 9, 2020
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Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I move we approve Ordinance 20-1882.
Perreault: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to approve item 20-1882. Is there any discussion
on the motion? If not, clerk will call the roll.
Roll call: Bernt, yea; Borton, abstain; Cavener, yea; Hoaglun, yea; Strader, yea;
Perreault, yea.
Simison: All ayes and one abstain. The motion is agreed to.
MOTION CARRIED: FIVE AYES. ONE ABSTAIN.
Simison: We will move on to Item 7 -- well, just, again, as Councilman Cavener said thank
you to everyone who worked so diligently on those two previous items and we look
forward to the fruits of that labor. Hopefully coming forward in a timely fashion.
C. Ordinance No. 20-1884: An Ordinance (H-2019-0135 – Allmon
Subdivision) for Annexation of a Portion of the Southeast
Quarter of the Northeast Quarter of Section 30, Township 4
North, Range 1 East, Boise Meridian, Ada County, Idaho, as
Described in Attachment “A” and Annexing Certain Lands and
Territory, Situated in Ada County, Idaho, and Adjacent and
Contiguous to the Corporate Limits of the City of Meridian as
Requested by the City of Meridian; Establishing and
Determining the Land Use Zoning Classification of 10.03 Acres
of Land From RUT to R-8 (Medium Density Residential) Zoning
District in the Meridian City Code; Providing That Copies of This
Ordinance Shall Be Filed with the Ada County Assessor, the Ada
County Recorder, and the Idaho State Tax Commission, as
Required by Law; and Providing for a Summary of the
Ordinance; and Providing for a Waiver of the Reading Rules;
and Providing an Effective Date
Simison: With that we will move on to Item 7-C, Ordinance No. 20-1884, ask the clerk to
read this item by title.
Weatherly: Thank you, Mr. Mayor. This is Ordinance No. 20-1884, an ordinance, H-2019-
0135, Allmon Subdivision, for annexation of a portion of the southeast quarter of the
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northeast quarter of Section 30, Township 4 North, Range 1 East, Boise meridian, Ada
county, Idaho, as described in Attachment “A” and annexing certain lands and territory,
situated in Ada county, Idaho, and adjacent and contiguous to the corporate limits of the
City of Meridian as requested by the City of Meridian; establishing and determining the
land use zoning classification of 10.03 acres of land from RUT to R-8 (Medium Density
Residential) Zoning District in the Meridian City Code; providing that copies of this
ordinance shall be filed with the Ada County Assessor, the Ada County Recorder, and the
Idaho State Tax Commission, as required by law; and providing for a summary of the
ordinance; and providing for a waiver of the reading rules; and providing an effective date.
Simison: Thank you. Council, you have heard this item read. Do I have a motion ?
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, I move approval of Item 7-C, Ordinance No. 20-1884, with
suspension of rules.
Strader: Second.
Cavener: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to approve Item 7-C under suspension of the
rules. Is there discussion on the motion? If not, clerk will call the roll.
Roll call: Bernt, yea; Borton, yea; Cavener, yea; Hoaglun, yea; Strader, yea; Perreault,
yea.
Simison: All ayes. The motion is agreed to.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 8: Action Items
A. [ITEM MOVED FROM 6-A] Reconsideration Request for
Findings of Fact, Conclusions of Law for Delano Subdivision (H-
2019-0027) by Boll Cook Investments, LLC, Located at 14120 W.
Jasmine Ln. and 2800 E. Jasmine Ln.
Simison: Next we will go to Item 8, which is what was moved from earlier, the
reconsidering question of Findings of Fact, Conclusions of Law for Delano Subdivision,
H-2019-0027. Mr. Nary, would you like to reintroduce this so Mr. Borton has the privilege
of hearing your comments, so that we are all on the same page.
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Nary: Certainly, Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, Council Member. So, as we stated
earlier -- so, this is a request by the applicant of the Delano Subdivision for
reconsideration of your decision from a few weeks ago. The decision was final . The
Findings have been approved. This was timely filed. So, your consideration tonight is
whether to grant the request for reconsideration, which would require a new public
hearing. The applicant would, then, need to pay the noticing fees and provide noticing
for this project for a new public hearing. It would be as if you had an additional or a
second public hearing in addition to the one that was previously heard. The other option
is to deny his request for reconsideration and the applicant can take it forward as the law
may allow him to do. So, that's really within the purview of what you have tonight. There
is no additional testimony. We have allowed written testimony, but the testimony really
has to be relevant to the issue and the issue in front of you was as raised by the applicant
was his concern that his opportunity to present a response to the project to the issues
and concerns of the Council was cut off because it was -- because what was raised after
the public hearing was closed were things he was not able to address. Any -- any
testimony -- written testimony that's unrelated to that issue is really not relevant. So , the
only consideration you could consider is whether or not to grant his request or deny his
request. Mr. Borton, before you joined us part of the conve rsation was was there any
other alternatives and I tried to avoid getting into that detail of any other alternatives until
we resolved the issue under our ordinance, under the request for reconsideration. I think
that captured our earlier discussion. So, if I missed something please let me know.
Simison: Sounds good. And if I could get Adrienne or Chris -- it looks like Mr. Hoaglun
got kicked out and he's in the waiting room with his hand raised . If we can bring him back.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: While we are waiting for Council Member Hoaglun to join us I just -- I wanted
to put on the record -- during our break I was going through my e -mail and my text
messages and I received an e-mail correspondence from an individual I used to attend
church with. They were voicing some of their concerns not about the request that's before
us, but similar type of communication we have heard from residents in the Alpine
neighborhood just about the project as a whole. I have taken a screen grab of that and
have provided it to the clerk. It's been added to the public record, but I wanted to disclose
that to the Council and to the public. I know it was likely well intended , but it's a good
reminder for Council and for the public that anything that is important for you to share with
one of us, it's really important to share it with all of us as Council , which is why we have
continued to accept written testimony. So, just wanted to disclose that before we moved
into any deliberations or any motions were made. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
Simison: Thank you, Mr. Cavener. Council, any questions or motions?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
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Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: I just have a question for Mr. Nary. What would be the downsides, for lack of
a better word, to consider a reconsideration on our part -- the city's part?
Nary: Yeah. Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, Council Member Perreault, I guess
there is not really a downside. I mean certainly if that's the purview of the Council it's
totally within your discretion to grant the request and reset it for a public hearing. So ,
from a legal perspective, which is all I can give you, there is certainly no downside. It's
-- it's certainly within your discretion.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor, a follow up.
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: Mr. Nary, if I understood you correctly, if we were to hold a public hearing that
that hearing is just going to cover the -- the applicant's one concern regarding not having
had an opportunity to comment after -- after the hearing had closed; is that right?
Nary: Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, no. It would be a full public hearing. So, it
could be over -- since it wasn't a continued hearing for a limited purpose, this would have
to be a new public hearing under our ordinance. It wouldn't be limited.
Perreault: Okay. I must have misunderstood what you were explaining just a little bit
ago.
Nary: Sorry if it wasn't clear.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: So, as I understand your remarks, Bill, that it's a discretionary call by the Council
that doesn't necessitate a specific finding of legal defi ciency in the process; is that
correct?
Nary: So -- Mr. Borton, so that's what the ordinance states, is that's the basis of the
request and I will pull it up real quickly just since you asked that question. It -- it basically
states you have to state that in the request and basically what Mr. Clark has done is that's
his basis of his request. So, to grant it -- I just want to make sure I have the proper
language out of that. And it just says if the request is properly filed notice shall be
provided. No additional evidence or testimony will be allowed at the meeting. At the City
Council meeting the Council shall consider the request and may affirm, reverse, or modify
after compliance with the procedure. If necessary the Council may direct a new public
hearing and all the procedures and notices that are necessary. So, a written decision has
to be issued upon a find -- or a direction here. So, again, if it's to reverse the decision I
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have to have some basis to put that in the order. But the order can be, again, if it's raised
that he didn't have an opportunity to present additional testimony based on concerns that
were not raised at the public hearing, that's certainly within your purview.
Borton: Thank you. Mr. Nary -- or Mr. Mayor. Excuse me.
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: The reason -- my internet's kind of cutting out. Am I still connected?
Nary: Yes, sir.
Simison: Can you hear me?
Nary: Yes, sir. We can hear you.
Borton: Great. It's cutting out on my end. I will just talk and we will see. The reason that
I asked that question on the scope of what authority we do have is in review of the letter
and the process that we went through I don't necessarily agree that the actio n is legally
suspect or legally deficient. So, with regards to that claim in the request for
reconsideration, I don't -- I don't think that's correct. However, I do understand the
perspective of the applicant in the letter in the footnotes and while this issue with
Centrepoint was discussed in both hearings, I am open to the idea of a reconsideration
in light of what's been presented and what very well might be an agreeable solution to a
very large component of the issues that were discussed in both hearings and caused a
large share of the concerns. So, I know a discussion today isn't a discussion on whether
anything like that would or would not be approved , that only comes from a -- from a new
public hearing as you have described, but I am -- I am supportive of the request. We
rarely grant them, we rarely see them, and even more rarely do we ever grant them, but
I -- I see these circumstances and the unique record in this case to support it, not because
there was anything improper with the substance or the process utilized by the Council in
making its decision. I do think there was ample opportunity to -- to discuss it, but there
was a disconnect and -- and our ultimate goal is try and make the best decision with the
best data for -- for the long term and in this very unique situation I for one think that a
reconsideration makes sense.
Nary: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Yeah. I could help add to that. So, in the ordinance itself, Council Member Borton
and for the rest of Council, it specifically uses the word deficiency, which is also used in
the statute. That does not necessarily have to rise to a legal error. A deficiency as you
define it, as you want to interpret your code. My belief has always been and my argument
has been to a district court on more than one occasion that the intent of these statutes
and the ordinance are to allow an opportunity to address an issue again if it's appropriate
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and whatever that deficiency may be is within your discretion. So, I don't believe you are
setting a precedent that it's a legal error for you to raise issues after the hearing is closed ,
but it's certainly within your discretion to consider on a case-by-case basis that that might
be a valid reason to reconsider other opportunities to hear this over and get it right, as Mr.
Borton said. So, I don't think it requires a legal finding that -- that an error was made and
that a -- if a finding of the efficiency raised was -- is adequate to call for another hearing,
that's within your discretion to do.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Mr. Borton.
Borton: I appreciate that. That's -- I think that's very helpful for us. One of the -- the
scenarios that could illustrate the fact that as to that issue -- and a project on this parcel
could be developed with fewer lots that would not necessitate a second access at all as
an example of, okay, a reason why I disagree with some of the representations in the
letter, but, nonetheless, understand and think that reconsideration is appropriate.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: I think Council -- Councilman Borton said it just about as -- as well as I could
and I -- I'm in agreement with -- with what he is -- what he has shared about giving the
applicant an opportunity to present again and -- and to approve the reconsideration
request.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I wholeheartedly agree. I don't think there is a deficiency in our process
necessarily. I think it's typical that an issue that was brought up would be the basis of a
decision and I don't -- I don't think there is a disconnect in how our decision is made. So,
I am open to I guess looking at this again with a public hearing in -- in light of the solution
that they are bringing forward, but I want to echo Councilman Borton's comments. I don't
think that they are -- I don't agree that there is a legal basis for a deficiency in our process
is the reason that we are doing that.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Yeah. Just wanted to chime in. I -- I would -- I would support a motion to
reconsider this -- this issue.
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Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: Although I believe that that connection from, you know, Centrepoint to Wainwright
is extremely crucial to the importance of this -- of this deal, I don't -- I don't -- I'm the
gentleman that was -- that made the motion that didn't talk before the hearing was closed
and so -- but with that said, I -- I'm open to reconsideration as well and see where it goes
from here.
Simison: I have got a lot of people that are open to it. Does anyone want to make a
motion?
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: I'm happy to make -- make a motion. Just real quick. Good decision, Council
Member Bernt, by waiting for Council Member Borton to come and attend. I think his
feedback and insight has been really helpful to us. Also, Mr. Nary, thanks for your
education. Council Member Borton hit the nail on the head. I don't think in the six years
I have been on Council we have ever granted one of these and so your education to us
on the process has been also very very helpful. With that said I'm -- I'm in agreement
with my colleagues. So, I move that we approve -- I guess this is Item 8-A and grant the
reconsideration request for the Findings of Facts for the Delano Subdivision, H-2019-
0027.
Bernt: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to approve the reconsideration. Is there any
discussion on the motion?
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Mr. Cavener.
Cavener: Just from a process standpoint, I assume the appellant will work with staff to
determine a date for a public hearing or do we need to set that tonight ?
Nary: Mr. Mayor, Members of Council, Council Member Cavener, if I could. Yeah, I would
-- I was going to suggest you vote on the motion first and, then, direct to the staff, but I do
agree with what you just stated. Staff has to review any revisions that are being proposed.
We will have to find a date. We will have to notice. Both newspaper, mailed notice and
sign -- signage. So, it will probably be about six weeks out'ish. So, I want them to work
with them to do that. So, if we could finish the motion and vote and, then, we make that
direction we could do that.
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Cavener: Thank you, Mr. Nary. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
Simison: Okay. If there is no further discussion on the motion I will ask the clerk to call
the roll.
Roll call: Bernt, yea; Borton, yea; Cavener, yea; Hoaglun, yea; Strader, yea; Perreault,
yea.
Simison: All ayes and the motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Simison: So, with that, based on that information and the previous conversation, is there
a time frame, next steps, Mr. Nary, that is being recommended? Has there been any
conversations with staff or --
Nary: Mr. Mayor, not that I'm aware of. I think really if the Council would simply -- and
you can do this by voice vote, too -- make a motion to -- the applicant to -- applicant to
work with staff to schedule a date with the clerk's office to work through -- and to pay for
the public noticing as part of this reconsideration. I think that's probably the -- enough
direction we will need for tonight.
Simison: Okay.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Unless there is any other comments from anybody else, I'm supportive of that.
So, I would move that we direct staff to engage with the applicant and the clerk to find a
date that works for our community to have a public hearing , for the applicant to renotice
as is typical with any other land use application and to pay for those associated fees and
to -- Mr. Nary, am I missing anything from your perspective?
Nary: No, sir.
Cavener: Okay. That would be the end of my motion, Mr. Mayor.
Simison: Okay. I have a motion. Do I have a second?
Strader: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second. Is there any discussion on the motion? If not,
all those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay. The ayes have it.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
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Item 9: Future Meeting Topics
Simison: Okay. Thank you very much, Council. So, we are to our -- I don't know if this
is Item 8-B or Item 9 under Future Meeting Topics. Is there any future meeting topics?
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I would be interested in finding out if my fellow Council Members would like to
add a future meeting topic to our agenda. I will just give a tiny amount of background.
I'm new to Council, but the more I have learned about our Police Department the more
impressed I have become, especially without a lot of background on them, and I feel that
we are doing a lot of things right, but at the same time I don't think that we take anything
for granted and I would love to have either the police chief or a member of staff have an
opportunity, in light of current events, to come and present to Council some detail about
our procedures for the use of force and any other material that they think is important for
us and the public to have as additional background on training and how we could b est
support them.
Simison: Okay.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Council Member Strader asked Council's opinion. I think all of us are very
proud of our emergency responders, police, fire, EMTs, et cetera, both that work for the
city and serve our community. Any opportunity that I think that they can come to share
what are the best practices that really sets them apart from some of the other jurisdictions
across the country I welcome that. I'm proud of them and think this would be a great
opportunity for them to demonstrate what makes them one of the best in the nation.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: Earlier in the meeting Pastor David gave -- gave a prayer and in his prayer, his
invocation, he mentioned that our city is -- excuse me. Is a -- is a light in our valley.
Excuse me.
Simison: Take your time.
Cavener: Doing great.
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Bernt: I -- I couldn't agree with him more. It's been tough. The last couple of weeks have
been tough and I'm sure that many of our citizens feel the same way, but if there is -- if
there is one thing that brings solace to my soul and brings a smile to my face it's great
citizens who care for one another, who have reached out, who have tried to listen and
who have listened and who have tried to make a difference and ultimately I'm so grateful
for that, along with our citizens and the great people that they are, also grateful for our
first responders who wear the badge and who honor the badge. Tracy Basterrechea said
it best in his Facebook post a couple of weeks ago when he said that for one bad apple
that makes poor choices there are thousands of first responders who go out on a daily
basis to protect us all and I'm grateful for them as well. So, I'm grateful for Council Woman
Strader for bringing this up. We spoke earlier and I thought it was appropriate for her to
-- to make this recommendation to Council. I'm grateful for Councilman Cavener for his
support of this recommendation as well and I'm -- and I believe that there is not a Council
Member and along with the Mayor who would not agree with -- with the chief or the deputy
chief or whoever might want him to come speak to us next week. So, thank you so much
for bringing this up.
Simison: And the latitude I'm going to ask is allow me to work with our chief. Based upon
some of the comments that we have seen I don't think this is going to be a simple come
and have a presentation from our police chief or member of our department, if that's the
direction we go, and I don't know if a City Council meeting is -- is the most appropriate
venue in which to do what may be asked to being done. You know, because we have
protocols, we have rules, we have -- it can make it very stifling depending upon what the
expectations of Council is. If you just want to get a presentation and end the conversation
at that point in time that would be one thing. If you are looking to do more than that, then,
I don't know of a City Council public hearing testifying in front of a podium first week back
is how you want to do that. So, if I could take that feedback, have a conversation and
see what makes sense from the community and the Police Department and I will work
with the Council President on options and see where we go.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Bernt: Mr. Mayor, one more thing on top of that. I think that it would make sense to work
with your office -- you know, work with Shandy and Dave as well, I think they have some
great insight on how that process works out as well.
Simison: Yes. That's where I was going.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Maybe just a request if it -- if it works and, again, I don't know if Council Member
Strader is supportive of that, but where -- where Council Member Strader is the one that
brought this as a potential agenda item, I think it would be appropriate to also involve her
in that process as well to make sure the things that she's hoping are -- are captured, both
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that we have shared here tonight and kind of in her mind , that we work to address that as
well.
Simison: Yeah. Councilman Cavener, I assume that your Council President works with
the people and all points in times when you bring up these issues . If he doesn't I will --
we could address that, but I do not try to circumvent his interaction with you all on those
type of issues.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: Sometimes I'm a little clumsy about how I go about it, but I appreciate your
comments. I fully trust you and -- and the chief and the Council President and everyone
and involve me as much as you want to to come up with a good community forum to have
this discussion. I am very proud of us for not shying away from it and I'm proud of us
also, because I think our community really does support our Police Department and this
is a great conversation to have about what we are doing right and that we don't take it for
granted.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: I also appreciate Councilman -- Council Woman Strader recommending this.
I had an opportunity to chat with Council Member this morning about something very
similar. We were talking about this this morning and -- and about whether we would -- we
would want to -- to make that same recommendation and I -- I was talking -- he was
sharing with me all of the -- all the support that the Police Department has been receiving,
which I am incredibly grateful for, and -- and Council Member -- and I appreciate your --
your show of emotion, now I'm going to choke up, because, you know, I haven't been
teary eyed about -- about this necessarily, but I have about the state of our country and
how much difficulty is happening and so I'm thankful that we have an opportunity to praise
our Police Department and our first responders.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I will make one more comment. I -- I agree with that. At the same time I think
it's very clear that a lot of people in our country are hurting and that they may face some
circumstances that, frankly, our Council doesn't face and so I think what I would like to
see from this community forum is -- which I know is true, that our Police Department is
sensitive about that and that if people have concerns that -- you know, that there is a
method for our community to express them and -- and that -- again that we are not taking
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it for granted that -- that we are going to -- we are willing to look at ourselves even when
we think we are doing a good job, that we are willing to look hard at it.
Simison: All right. Well, thank you. We -- we will find a way to effectively have that
conversation.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Question on a totally different subject. Next week are we back at City Council
Chambers for our meeting?
Simison: Mr. Nary, would you like to -- my short answer is yes, but I think there is with
caveats.
Nary: So, Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, the governor has two separate orders --
emergency orders and the second one was the order that suspended the open meeting
requirements of having all the Council -- or at least one Council Member in a room and
the public being allowed into the room. That is set to expire on the 11th, unless the
governor extends that order. We don't know for sure until we know. The governor may
extend the emergency order similar to the one that we put on tonight for the Mayor, but
that's the financial component piece, not the open meeting piece. We have some -- have
had some feedback from the Attorney General's office that they -- that second order may
not be extended, but until that occurs we don't know. At this point potentially we will need
to be back in chambers next week or allow the public in. We have met with the clerk's
office and IT. We think the system will work to still maintain a Zoom meeting. Again, the
law only requires one of you be in the room. Again, you can all be in the room or some
of you could be on the Zoom meeting as well. We can maintain the Zoom platform as a
meeting forum, so that not everyone has to be in the room if they don't want to be and
they can appear remotely and testify as they have been doing for the last couple of
months and so we are -- we are -- we are ready to go forward with it if that's the direction
we have.
Simison: Council, the direction I gave to the directors and to departments today was be
prepared to come just -- much like we did with City Hall, everyone's coming back and we
are doing it from the room and, then, we will peel the layers of the onion out of the room
as necessary and I would say that's the same for you all to determine how many of you
feel like you need or should want to be there. I -- I think it's myself and one member of
Council the minimum need to be in the room. We will be limiting the number of people in
the room to an appropriate number, but it will not look like it did before. If I was a betting
person you are looking at up to 50 seats in that room, somewhere in that -- or 50 people,
including the staff and available for all Council to be present, which puts us closer to about
35 people in the audience is what we are anticipating being able to accommodate.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Meridian City Council
June 9,2020
Page 50 of 50
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: If the Council Members are present at the dais and we have the Zoom meeting
up on our screens is it -- it's going to be essentially the same for us where we will be
looking at the presentation on our computer screen in the Zoom meeting format. There
won't be separate presentation screens from -- from the video screens?
Nary: They will be up on the video screens in the room, too.
Perreault: Okay. That -- okay.
Simison: Council, any other items under future meeting topics? If not, do I have any
other motion for the evening?
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: I move that we adjourn the meeting.
Hoaglun: Second the motion, Mr. Mayor.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to adjourn the meeting. Is there any discussion
on the motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay. We are
adjourned.
MOTION CARRIED: ALLAYES.
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 8:42 P.M.
(AUDIO RECORDING ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
6 / 16 / 2020
MAYOR ROBERT E. SIMISON DATE APPROVED
ATTEST:
CHRIS JOHNSON - CITY CLERK
Meridian City Council Meeting Agenda June 16,2020— Page 75 of 223