2015-07-21 Budget�VEFZ IAN, -
CITY OF MERIDIAN
CITY COUNCIL SPECIAL MEETING
BUDGET WORKSHOP AGENDA
Tuesday, July 21, 2015 at 8:30 AM
City Council Chambers
33 East Broadway Avenue, Meridian, Idaho
1. Roll -call Attendance:
X David Zaremba X Joe Borton
X Charlie Rountree X Keith Bird
X Genesis Milam X Luke Cavener
X Mayor Tammy de Weerd
2. Adoption of the Agenda Adopted
3. City of Meridian FY2016 Budget Meeting Presentation
Adjourned at 1:20 p.m.
Meridian City Council Special Meeting Agenda — Tuesday July 21, 2015 Page 1 of 1
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please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
Meridian City Council Budget Workshop July 21, 2015.
A meeting of the Meridian City Council was called to order at 8:30 a.m., Tuesday, July 21,
2015, by Mayor Tammy de Weerd.
Members Present: Mayor Tammy de Weerd, Charlie Rountree, Keith Bird, David
Zaremba, Joe Borton, Genesis Milam and Luke Cavener.
Item 1: Roll-call Attendance:
Roll call.
X David Zaremba X _ Joe Borton
X__ Charlie Rountree X_ Keith Bird
__X__ Genesis Milam __X__ Lucas Cavener
__X Mayor Tammy de Weerd
De Weerd: Okay. I will go ahead and start our budget workshop. Thank you for being
here. For the record it is Tuesday, July 21st. It's 8:35. We will start with roll call
attendance, Madam Clerk.
De Weerd: And I will, before I turn this over to Stacy -- we have been really pleased with
how many people have been watching the budget hearing for last month. We had around
360 views and so this is being streamed and it seems that people are taking an interest in
our budget process. So, that's -- that's the good news. So, I will turn this over to Stacy to
kick us off.
Item 2: Adoption of the Agenda
Bird: Are you going to adopt the agenda?
De Weerd: Oh, I'm sorry. Item No. 2 is adoption of the agenda.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I move that we adopt the agenda as published.
Bird: I'd second it.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second to adopt the agenda as published. All those in
favor say aye.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 3: City of Meridian FY2016 Budget Meeting Presentation
De Weerd: Item No. 3.
City of Meridian Special Meeting Budget Workshop
July 21, 2015
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Kilchenmann: Good morning and welcome to the second session of the FY-2016 budget.
Everybody has been asking me what's the agenda. What's the schedule? It's like it's a
day at the Improv. We are going to start out with me. That's the only thing that's set on
the agenda and, then, we will probably just see how it goes, answer your questions,
everybody is available to provide further information and we will go ahead and go through
the summary and try to set -- what we call set the budget. So, at the end of the day we
need to have a final budget number in order to meet the hearing notice requirements, but
you can -- you can set the budget here and, then, at the public hearing you can go down,
you just can't go up. So, I'm going to start out by giving you just an overview of the
revenue and, then, some random facts that I thought might be interesting. So, first of all,
this is looking at our total City of Meridian budget and this is a look back at 2012. The '16
budget draft has an additional -- and this is citywide -- FTE count of 11. Our increase in
overall personnel cost is five percent, so that's the whole cost of personnel, not just the
cost of those particular people. That compares from an eight percent increase in 2015, a
seven percent increase in '14, a two percent in '13. We have about 87,000 in ongoing
operating costs, 1.2 million in one-time operating costs, about 24 million in capital and 1.8
million in replacement equipment and vehicles and I look on this as kind of a holding your
breath budget, because we can feel the world is about to explode around us, so I'm going
to go through some factors that change the way we did our duty revenue projection a little
bit and I think everybody tries to be pretty conservative in that what's going to happen next
kind of mode. So, when I do the forecast I usually dive in and I try to start with building
starts, because almost all of our revenue is driven by building starts, how many people
live here, where do they live, how many square feet of commercial space do we have, et
cetera. So, starting with single family building starts, it's surprising that it's been
consistent since 2013 and that is expected to be to 2017. It's just been pretty steady, the
same amount of building starts and this is true for the city and the state. So, this is a look
at the Treasure Valley, Meridian, and the state. So, with the exception of 2014, which was
a little different, housing starts went down, that's when the market finally heated up a little
bit and people were able to sell the houses that had been in foreclosure under market
and, then, the really key thing that impacted this forecast is the switch to multi-family
building and if you read the revenue manual and I'm sure you hear it in the news --
De Weerd: I did. Word for word.
Kilchenmann: You can -- it's just a national switch. It's a change in the way people live
and it changes the way we forecast and it changes the way we serve our population. So,
multi-family permit and connection fee revenue from multi-family permits are not as easy
as residential and generally the revenue is -- actually turns out to be less and as I
mentioned, this big C change, changes our service delivery. So, the way Fire and Police
respond to the dense population in an apartment building, is not the same way they
respond or the service they provide to subdivisions. The way they respond to a
commercial growth is not the same as the way, again, that they respond to lots of open
space in a subdivision and the thing we -- or I and pessimistic economists, always think
about, whenever we have a boom -- and if you look at that section graph and you see
where the multi-family units have gone, that's definitely a boom, what's next? Boom.
Bust. So, I kind of keep that in mind in my negative side of my brain, which everybody
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says is fairly large, but we want to try to be right in the middle. We don't want to be so
conservative that we don't let you spend anything, but we want to be cognizant that it can
go like this, like it did last time. Commercial. Commercial revenue is hard to project,
because projects vary in size and value and the fee calculations are complicated. We are
kind of -- where we would kind of spend some time using Accella and digging into this so
we can forecast it -- do a better job of forecasting it and maybe even change a bit the way
we charge -- or the way we charge those fees. So, for -- and, interestingly enough, a lot
of people don't understand how small a portion commercial revenue is compared to
residential revenue. For example, in connection revenue in '14 we collected 6.2 million
dollars. Only 14 percent of that was from commercial. So, that's a fairly small percentage
and, you know, this graph shows you the variations in commercial and again, as we know,
commercial kind of follows residential. Property tax. That's another one. So, the tax we
collected in '14, 31 percent of that was from commercial, the rest of it was from residential.
So, this is kind of interesting, things to know about that balance between commercial and
residential. And that's from our viewpoint. Of course, there is multipliers of jobs and sales
tax and so forth in the economy, so this is just looking selfishly at the City of Meridian. So,
we are going to talk about property tax, because we need to talk about property tax and
how it will affect our residents. So, let's remember that the tax year is tax year '15 and we
will collect it in '16. So, I switch back and forth between tax year and talking about our
fiscal year. Because we collect it a year later. So, new construction can be added in
using the prior year levy rate, but we will be adding in about 1.3 million in property tax
revenues from new construction. We can also add in annexations, which is going to be
about 76,000. That's from Meridian Heights. And, then, we get to increase our property
tax by three percent over the prior year and that's 724,000. So, that adds up to our
revenue being about up two million dollars from last year. So, you are working with two
million dollars more in tax revenue. So, we say, well, how is that going to that impact our
levy rate? Our taxable value increased 14 percent, so that's just every increase from your
individual house valuation going up to new properties on the market -- that's everything.
So, increased 14 percent. New construction actually decreased 18 percent over last year.
So, the amount of new construction was 18 percent less. So, our levy rate went from .004
to .0038. Now, caveat. These exact numbers will change and we don't get the complete
numbers until October and, then, they will actually shift a bit more in the spring. But that
gives you the basic picture. I mean it's close. And, again, you can see taxable value up,
levy rate down. So, we have six different places that we have been following for years
and years and we have taken six actual revenues throughout the city and I put space out
in different sectors and what's interesting this year, because when we looked at how the
property was valued, it was all over the place. We had property that had a loss of three
percent in their value and a property that went up 18 percent in value. So, it was
interesting, we usually see them kind of move in the same direction. The average was a
five percent gain. So, I think if you looked at everybody as a whole property value went
up about five percent. Well, that's property tax, how it's going to affect our residents. Now
we are going to look at ours again going back to the whole city. So, replacements for
computers, we have got 197,000 and I broke it out by department. Vehicles and engines,
a million. Equipment and furnishings about 600,000. Again, for the whole city. And some
personnel stats to look at that kind of break down the merit pool. I have give you
employee counts. I'm not going to read through all of them. Then you see on the right-
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hand side explains each component of increase in salary for people who are established.
The FTEs we already have. So, built into the base that you're not going to see separated,
built into each person's wage is the -- police STEP plan is 97,000. Firefighter contract is
two percent across the board is 90,000 and, then, the three percent merit pool breaks
down as I have shown it below. So, it ends up being 200,000 for the General Fund and
233,000 for the Enterprise Fund. So, that's just kind of a way to look at it in a summarized
way and how it affects each department. So, moving to the General Fund, this slide is
summarizing their whole and what their additions are. So, first we look at what's -- what
are the ongoing additions. So, we have personnel and operating on the top, about 870 in
personnel and 80,000 something in operating. Their one-time operating. Renew capital,
5.7. And replacements of 1.7. Their FTE request add up to 8.5. New FTEs. We use
funds -- for our capital we are using -- a portion aren't just from new revenue for the year,
we are using park impact fees of 783,000 for part of that rec center or a home park and
the design for the 77 acre park and, then, we are using fund balance to buy the rec center
of two -- about two million. We are putting into the fund balance from community
development we estimate about 725,000 and that's probably low, because I -- especially
on the commercial side I don't -- I keep that projection pretty low. Last -- the last time was
1.4 million. I'm guessing the 725 could be more around maybe one, 1.2 million, that we
will put into the fund balance. So, after we make the 14 transfer we will end this year with
3.9 in the Capital Improvement Fund. So, this is looking at the unrestricted General Fund
balance and our operating reserve and I -- it's a simplistic look taken from the audit report
and I -- as we talked about, I lowered the operating reserve by two million, so instead of
taking the four months, I just made it a flat two million. So, it's kind of been maintaining
and we stay pretty consistent. It shows it going up, because I reduced the reserve. This
is what our final budget -- or the draft budget that you're looking at looks like compared to
the General Fund -- or to last year's -- the '15 final budget and it's always a little confusing,
because we look at the '15 budget, we have got all the carry forward amounts in there and
that and could be from three years ago, two years ago, one year ago. So, it makes the '15
budget look a lot higher than the '16 budget, because I'm not -- I don't have a carry -- we
don't have carry forward in there. But it lets you compare personnel, it lets you compare
operating, let's you look at what new capital is. Well, I imagine when we put the carry
forward in it will probably be somewhat less than the '15 final budget. Okay. Now I'm
going to switch to the Enterprise Fund or what we call the proprietary fund and look at
their fund balance. They are not like a governmental fund. They have their own set of
accounting standards and their fund balance on their audit report is calculated, but
differently than it is on the General Fund. So, they have two fund designations. One is
net investment in capital assets, because capital assets minus accumulated depreciation.
That's because it's a tool that the government -- or that the businesses uses to create
revenue and, then, they have unrestricted net assets, which we always call the fund
balance when we think of fund balance. That's cash and investments available to pay the
cost of operations and it's sort of really a plug number, so it's difference between liabilities
and net assets. So, to really predict what it's going to be you have to predict what the
cash out-flows and in-flows are going to be, you can't just look at the budget. So, you
have to estimate how much will actually be spent, the timing of the spending, how you will
collect revenue and the timing of the revenue. So, the only other fund designation that
you are allowed to use or are restricted are net assets, which is rare and that would be
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like -- it has to be something imposed by an outside credit body, like if you have a bond
and you had to keep a reserve balance. So, this is what the Enterprise Fund revenue
looks like and it's just a comparison of the last three years and on the lower right-hand
side shows things that had an impact on the budget -- on their revenue between '15 and
'16. So, a new fee, some changes in their rate calculation and changes in their
assessment fee. Now, their assessment fee is interesting how long it takes for the
assessment fee to actually be charged, because there is all these building permits that are
already in the hopper that have to be charged at the old rate, so when we went through
and calculated their revenue we didn't see -- so, they made a change in October and we
didn't actually see it start to affect permits coming in until the end of December, January.
So, if you look at the components of their fee for a three year look, utility sales are pretty
consistent, 70 to 75 percent. Connection fees, their pieces of the pie is staying pretty
consistent. Then this is looking -- drilling down into water and sewer fees, the 70 to 75
percent of their fees. An interesting note is that when we looked at water, between 2013
and '14, the gallons literally were the same. They literally flowed the same amount of
gallons, despite that increase in customer accounts. So, water -- water is a tricky one,
because it's so dependent on weather. Obviously, people are conserving -- using
pressurized irrigation. So, just as a side note, water is not really paying for itself. If you
just look at water operations and water revenue, you can see the revenue -- the accounts
are going up, the cost isn't going down, but we are not -- we are selling the same amount
and, then, water and sewer sales shows a breakdown. Sewer being the greatest
percentage because it's a more costly operation and, then, connection fee revenue. So,
we spend a lot of time on our connection fee revenue and we are going to make some
changes in how we report this through Accella and, again, they are very affected by the
switch to multi-family. So, when we tried to break it apart and we had to go back in and
literally sometimes bill permit by permit, multi-family -- when we looked at '14 actual
averages about 1,200 per unit, whereas residential is 3,000 per home, the average, and
commercial, again, we tried to -- well, what's a metric and how much are we earning on
commercial, because it's decided or estimated based on the ARU account and, again,
these are averages, but it turned out to be 102 -- 102 dollars per square foot or another
way we looked at it -- what is the value of the project that assessment fee would turn out
to be about one percent. So, that's something that we will continue to look into and
evaluate. So, here is what their budget looks like at a glance and I broke it apart between
-- the bulk of it is capital, so I just showed water and wastewater and Public Works didn't
have much, so they don't -- they are not shown on here. Just something to look at. How
much -- if we do broad categories and don't look at each individual line item where the
funds are, then it totals 19.2 percent. You see for water the bulk of it is waterlines and
mains and wells and for the treatment plant is the treatment plant. So, here is what their
final budget looks like and, again, we have got that carry forward. So, again, I think there
they will be pretty comparable if we take the carry forward out, the two years. So, this is
what we have. This is what's here. There is a lot that's out there that's not in this budget,
so the next fire station -- that's just inevitable, we really need to seriously talk about the
next fire station. So, there is now in operating about 1.3 million. If we do a rec center we
don't have the personnel and operating, probably about four to five hundred dollars in
ongoing operating. Parts house. We collect about 500,000 dollars right now in fee
revenue that goes into the General Fund. Of course, we have got the EPA permit lurking
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out there that, you know, we have talked about a lot. Support staff. I mean we spend a
lot of time in our directors meetings talking about how do we prioritize, what tools can we
use. We need to know the cost of service and we need to decide on the cost service. We
need to measure results. That takes people. That takes time. It's hard to build that into
somebody's already full-time job and it's going to take some type of tool to record it,
because you know how thrilled you are with 4,000 Accella spreadsheets. So, we need a
tool sometime in the future that we can just corral all this data and, then, easily report it
back. Health insurance. That's a problem for everybody. Everybody. Not us. Not just
employers. It's a problem for everyone. The cost. The firefighters are concerned about --
well, if we retire early we want some kind of insurance that's post-employment. Well,
that's outrageously expensive. So, there is those kinds of issues to look at. I'm sure you
-- these are just a few that just came to my mind. I'm sure everybody else could come up
with other issues, too, but I think by in large this is a fairly -- like I said holding your breath
budget, like let's be conservative, let's really figure out where we are going to go and not
everything explode. Are there any questions?
De Weerd: Council, any questions? Or is your head spinning?
Kilchenmann: So, we decided what we will do is Todd will flip this off and we will start with
the Enterprise Fund. They usually get to be either last or they get to be the second day,
so what we are going to do, like we do normally, we did a presentation and we put up the
summary. So, here is where we are doing the day at the Improv, because they have
already given their presentation, but everybody is ready to readdress any of their
enhancements or answer any questions. So, we will put them up there and I will let Tom
come up -- I don't know if he has something he wants to present in addition or --
Borton: Madam Mayor?
Kilchenmann: I'm going to go sit down.
Borton: Can I ask Stacy a question?
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Borton.
Borton: Before you sit down.
Kilchenmann: Maybe not.
Borton: In the updated revenue figures there is a pretty big change in the projected
ending fund balance in the Enterprise Fund. The original figure was --
Kilchenmann: Yeah. That was -- that was done using the accrual basis of accounting, but
the one on the summary is the cash basis. That's what the change is. The one I did on
the revenue manual is replicating out of the financial statement. You're probably more
concerned with the summary, because it doesn’t have depreciation in it.
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Borton: Is that the same with the General Fund?
Kilchenmann: No. The General Fund should be there. It's cash. Yeah.
Borton: Thanks.
Kilchenmann: It's just the -- in the General Fund we are -- we report on the reserves, so
the audit mirrors the cash basis, whereas the --
Borton: All right.
De Weerd: Okay. Did I understand, Tom, you had a -- no?
Barry: Madam Mayor, actually, I do want to just clarify a couple of the small changes from
the budget workshop on June 5th to today for a full disclosure, the Public Works
Department did include an enhancement between June 5th and today for the safety
program coordinator position. We have been talking to you for several months about that
and we did include that, so we stand ready for your questions in and around that particular
enhancement and I want to make sure -- other than very small ancillary changes, that is
the only one that I am aware of that would be of consequence that perhaps you may want
to have a conversation about this morning. A couple reclassification changes. We are
talking about one or two thousand dollars here or there that was modified, but I think by
and large that is the only principal change that is in our budget that's different than we
presented in June 5th, so --
De Weerd: Okay. Any questions for Tom at this point? Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor, it's not actually a question for Tom, I guess it's a question for
Finance and Legal and Council. Public Works is in the process of transitioning the name
of the wastewater treatment facility to water resource recovery facility. Is that something
that we need to make official, so that in the future the paperwork that comes out about
that division reflects the new name?
Kilchenmann: Mr. Zaremba, I will tell you one thing, it's in the accounting system as
WWTP and it will remain there forever, because it's -- it's memorialized in the accounting
system. You can't --
Zaremba: So, it's not like a name change like that and make the budget comply with what
the department is doing?
Kilchenmann: We can't change it in the accounting system. We can change it on the
Excel spreadsheet.
Zaremba: Okay.
Kilchenmann: And we can change it going forward, but all the history is going to be --
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Zaremba: All right. Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Any other important questions?
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: Tom, we had spoken between the sessions -- one of the items that will be helpful
to clarify is how the -- your current budget request addresses some of the permit's
implementation issues that we last visited in detail in October. We had talked and I
brought up the old financing strategy on the permit, the pie chart that kind of addresses
what gaps need to be filled and -- give us an update on what's being addressed and what
remains to be.
Barry: So, what you're referring to, Councilman Borton, is the rate presentation that we
gave initially in October. We subsequently gave a second rate presentation in May where
we filled the Council in on those detailed as well and in May I presented that we had made
some modifications to the forecast, both from a revenue expense standpoint based on the
rate models and the projections that, essentially -- and with the changes that we made to
that, including level loading and capital projects and also moving out about 23 million
dollars worth of capital projects that are important, but not critical to meeting either the
permit or immediate capacity concerns, that we were able to project that the Enterprise
Fund going forward would be able to remain solvent for the next ten years and that
although we are close in the undesignated ending fund balance, we were able to reserve
ten million dollars as a set aside in the form of a million dollar emergency reserve and a
six month operating reserve. Those are the changes the Council agreed on in May. So,
setting aside those ten million dollars in reserve, we still are able to keep a solvent,
undesignated ending fund balance over the ten year period, including all the
enhancements that we have included in this budget and the enhancements that are
identified -- or not enhancements, but the capital projects identified over the next ten years
in the Public Works Department capital plan. I will say that in the event our estimates
come in lower than actual or there are some other unforeseen circumstances associated
with our trying -- needing to find more revenue, that some modest rate increases along the
way -- this ten year period we are talking about going forward, looks to -- appear to easily
overcome the challenges that we might have going forward. Now, the Council has asked
the Public Works Department to come back every six months and present on that
information and we are due up to speak with you in October about that, but at least at this
point in time I can say with assurance that the enhancements that have been included in
this year's budget and the capital projects identified over the next year period, which get
us to full compliance on the EPA permit requirement over the ten year period and get us,
at least at this projection, to increasing the capacity of the wastewater treatment plant
from 10.2 MGD, million gallons per day, to about 15 million gallons per day over the same
ten year period, are all included and accounted for and financed over the ten year
projection that we have been modeling. Hopefully that helps.
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Borton: It does. Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Anything from any other Council Member?
Milam: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Mrs. Milam.
Milam: Tom -- and maybe I should have contacted you before --
Barry: That's okay.
Milam: I just have -- I was going through this, reviewing again last night and I -- maybe it's
just normal and I'm fairly new at this, but it's hard for me looking at an enhancement where
-- I mean we are asking for two million dollars this year for a multi-year project and next
year we are going to need eight million dollars -- basically that means we are approving
eight million dollars for the following year, because we will be halfway through a project
that we can't really just stop.
Barry: Yes. And this seems to be coming more of an issue for the City Council. It has
not been an issue over the last six years, seven years that we have been operating this
way. So, maybe some history is in order. When I joined the department in 2008 the way
the department was budgeting capital projects is the way that it seems this Council at
least is struggling to understand how full budgeting of a project might -- might be
beneficial to the city. We use what's called -- so, let me explain how it was done, which is,
essentially, if you had a ten million dollar project -- say a digester, for example, the city,
Public Works Department, would budget the full ten million dollars in the start of the year.
It might be a three year project. And, then, we would carry forward what it didn't spend
every year thereafter. So, what that does, essentially, is it says, okay, we are setting
aside ten million dollars of the money in the Enterprise Fund and dedicating it for this
particular project -- ties up that money, encumbers it for a three year period and so,
therefore, we can't use any portion of that money for any other project. So, if I can do a
20 million dollar capital project and I have three projects let's say, one project is ten million
dollars, one project is five million dollars, and one project is another five million dollars to
equate to the 20 million dollars -- I can only work on three projects over three years,
because I set all that money aside, while we are sitting around, we are not able to work on
other projects. I believe we have 40 to 50 projects a year that we work on today using our
new method -- it's not really new, it's the method we have been using for over half a
decade now called just-in-time financing. The just-in-time financing model says, listen,
instead of taking and reserving a large chunk of money and setting it aside and just
carrying forward the unexpended amounts each year, and preventing yourself, therefore,
from working on other projects that that money, if it was freed up in that fiscal year, could
be used for, we finance the project just in time. So, essentially, if we have a ten million
dollar project -- going to use the same three projects -- we have a ten million dollar
project, but I'm only going to spend two million in the first year, I'm only going to budget
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the two million for this particular year and I'm going to free up eight million that I can use
on other projects in the same fiscal year, instead of carrying that eight million dollars on
the books just to feel good that we will have it sometime in the future. So, what we do is
we have to model all of this and make sure that we don't get in the situation where we are
overspending the revenues that we are collecting or the allocations we have set aside for
the budget for the particular projects that we are working on and we have been doing that,
like I said, for over half a decade now, very successfully. It has allowed us to improve the
number of projects or increase the number of projects we have been able to
accommodate on a fiscal year basis and also deliver these large scale projects in the
same time frame, without delay for the same general cost. Now, one of the caveats that
we have also included -- and Keith Watts mentioned this when he came up last week to
speak to the City Council, we have in the contracts that we write for these projects stop
periods. So, if the City Council does not approve the fiscal year funds for the next phase
of the project, that contract stops and you might say, well, hey, but that does make sense
that we might be a quarter of the way into a project and now we are going to stop the
project. I would say, yeah, that doesn't make sense, but I would ask why would you start
a project that you thought you were going to stop? I mean these projects that we are
doing are projects that are increasing capacity, there are increasing our regulatory
compliance capabilities, those types of things. We don't bring projects forward that are --
we have any intention of stopping. So, the stopgap that we have does allow us to stop the
project if we don't have the finances available for. Let's say we have a bad year for
revenue or the cost estimate goes way up too much and the City Council decides the
project's not worth it. There is those types of things that could happen; right? So, in those
cases the City Council could say, look, I don't want to fund this for any reason. They
could say I don't want to fund the second phase of this particular project and the contract
stops and whatever work has been done ceases. The contractor is made aware of that in
the bid documents when they bid on the project, it's written in the project and they sign
and agree that that is the way the city will finance these projects going forward over
multiple years. So, there are a lot of benefits to continue the practice that we have been
using. It's been very successful. It's allowed us to do a lot more with a lot less and also
remain fiscally conservative and protect the city in the event that, for whatever reason --
and to this date there has not been one that has caused us to stop a project under this
financing method. So, I don't know if that helps explain historically --
Milam: Yes. And I -- and I like that method. If it was broken up more evenly it would be
easier to digest. So, I guess my only concern -- and, you know, you're probably on top of
it, is that making sure that the following year we don't have -- isn't a huge year, yet we
have a whole lot of projects that are started or this is the second year, but the -- the
following there is three or four times the amount, at budget time that could really become
a problem, unless you're not planning on starting anymore projects the following year.
Barry: Right.
Milam: See what I'm saying? So, I'm just worried -- I just want to make sure that
somebody is totally up the following year and that it's not going to be way out of control.
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Barry: Yes. And they are very good points and very good questions and, yes, we are on
top of that. We do monitor that. We watch that. We present that to you in October,
November time with our five year capital plan. That's also modeled in the ten year rate
model. So, all of that's accounted for. You know, we can't -- it would probably not be
prudent to try to just take a ten million dollar project and chunk it up in three million -- 3.3
million each year. The reality is the dollar amounts that are requested are based on the
work that's going to be done in that fiscal year. So, in one fiscal year as we start a project
we might be doing design. Well, design typically is only anywhere between ten and 15
percent, maybe 20 percent of a project. So, on a ten million dollar project we might be
only asking for 1.5 to two million dollars, but once we start construction now we are in big
money, so we might be asking for five or six to seven million dollars during the
construction year and, then, of course, as we finish construction, perhaps in the third year,
or there is other ancillary or project costs, like maybe the construction of a building over
the infrastructure that we have just constructed or whatnot, the cost tends to come down
again. So, you get this sort of balloon cycle, if you will, during the project, which is just
inherent of typically the type of projects we do. Property acquisition. Deed and
acquisition, permits, design -- those are -- those tend to be, you know, pretty small costs
that are -- that can take a long time and, therefore, we don't ask for the amount above
what we think we can do in that particular fiscal year. Which is why you see in certain
phases -- oh, you know where construction is, because that's typically the largest dollar
amount being requested at that time, so -- we don't want to delay projects by saying, okay,
yeah, this project has five million dollars in construction, we just feel -- it would feel better
that we only did half the construction this year and that we waited and finished the rest of
the construction next year, because it just looks better on paper. There is a lot more cost
involved with mobilization, demobilization, site security, site stabilization, those type of
things, which don't make that a prudent model. So, hopefully, that --
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Stacy.
Kilchenmann: I would like to -- a little clarification on that funding clause. Further
research indicates that's probably -- Bill might be able to add -- or Ted, but it's not
probably -- if we want to hold once you have signed the contract -- because if you signed
a contract and somebody's going to do X amount of work and you cross fiscal years,
saying, no, we are done, we don't -- the Council didn't approve it, probably wouldn't hold
up in a challenge, so I wouldn't really rely on that as a guaranteed method. And a lot of
contractors are not going to be willing to sign a contract if they really thought that was
true. So, I think that's a conclusion for further research. Keith?
Watts: With our purchasing group, the Idaho Purchasing Association, a lot of our training
they have indicated that that has not held up in court, just that clause alone. We also
have a termination clause in our agreements, which pretty much gives Council carte
blanche to cancel a contract at anytime for any reason and that is in our construction
contract as well. The funding clause is trying to bring that to a more relevant or just clarify
up front this is how we are financing the project, but we do have indications that that alone
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would not necessarily hold up in court. I don't have any specific court cases, I just know
that our instructors in our -- that we bring in have often said that it's subject to
interpretation at the court and it has not always been held up.
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I think probably what they are talking
about at those associations -- there has been some case law in the few years -- started
back about ten years ago with the Boise case at the airport. So, most of the clauses
around the state or contracts around the state for long-term projects have what we term in
our business nonappropriation clauses. So, there are conditions that are in all contracts
that say they are always subject to Council's approval, even on multi-year agreements.
The ones that -- what Keith has talked about that courts have been a little more hesitant
about are long-term projects or leases that don't have any logical break to them. So, the
way contracts and the way the bids are designed is -- as Tom stated, where we have
some finite work that gets completed. The idea, hopefully, is to have it pretty seamless,
so that you don't have a gap between stopping phase one and starting phase two. But the
ones that have been tried in courts are things like -- like a long-term lease for a large scale
piece of equipment. The reality is if you have a third of the equipment in one year, you're
not likely to not pay for it the next year, because you already have the equipment. So,
those are the ones that courts have been a little more hesitant on -- on granting approval
of those nonappropriation clauses, because the allegation was that this isn't really
necessarily a valid lease or a valid nonappropriation, because the likelihood of your not
doing it isn't -- isn't very high. In these ones, again, we designed in both in the bid
process in the contract to break these off and the other thing that Tom didn't mention -- or
Keith, but part of it helps us in bidding process as well, because, again, if we wanted until
we completed phase one and, then, rebid phase two, you have two risks, you're going to
get a different contractor, which may be problematic, or, secondarily, you're going to pay a
higher price, because, as we all know, the longer you wait for many things the more it
costs. So, there are some -- there are some financial reasons that make sense, but the
way we have done our contracts now are ones that have been supported in other courts.
Does that mean the Supreme Court couldn’t change their mind? I'm not allowed to
comment on how the Supreme Court might do. So, I don't know that it will certainly
always be the case, but at least to this date the type that we do have been upheld and
haven't been challenged to the same degree as others. So, I still think we are on good
legal grounds the way we have been doing it and until there is a significant court case that
changes that I don't -- you know, we could always make it better. I think Council Member
Borton brought up some language last week he wasn't as comfortable with. I brought that
back to our office, to our staff, and we are going to talk with Keith and make sure, again,
that we are very clear in these contracts as to what they are bidding on, what they are
agreeing to, and what risk they have on their end to make sure it's clear and, again, I think
that's the best we could do at this juncture and I think it has been at least upheld in other
courts around the state, so --
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De Weerd: Did that answer the question?
Milam: Yes.
De Weerd: Okay.
Barry: Good questions, though.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: Tom, if the safety position you're requesting -- just requested and have been
talking about, where would it reside in your organization structure?
Barry: Structurally that would reside likely in the operational side. So, Dale Bolthouse.
So, water and wastewater would likely have that, because a majority of the safety issues
certainly are on the operations side. There would be some transcending of training and
those types of things across the department, the all likelihood is that that particular
position would be under the water or wastewater side of the operation. Particularly in this
case reporting to the deputy director of utility operations, but we are looking at -- and I
have talked with the Mayor briefly. We don't have anything concrete now -- about
modifying some of the reporting structures in the Public Works Department to streamline
some of the one off positions you might see on our organizational chart. We have like an
electrician, we have an inventory specialists, we have a couple of one off positions that we
would like to centralize and have a uniform say in operations manager or supervisor over
see. So, we are looking at that at this point in time, but in all likelihood that particular
position would be held over in the operational side, since it has the most impact and
influence on that portion of the organization.
Rountree: Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. To answer it quicker, Dale Bolthouse.
Barry: Yes.
Rountree: Got that.
De Weerd: Anything further for Tom? Thank you, Tom.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: Tom, your comments start about operating reserves and capital projects over ten
years being covered, including the expansion and the necessary emergency -- excuse me
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-- the ten million emergency reserves and I believe the operating reserves of about six
million dollars. The change that -- that we know the gist of the start and the numbers we
have seen from a cash basis, any fund balance versus an accrual basis, and the removal
of depreciation are the -- the conclusions that you're sharing with us based on the cash
basis available fund --
Barry: Uh-huh.
Borton: -- if so, appreciate -- get me comfortable with removing the need to account for
depreciation in that future expense from what's truly available for future cash reserves.
Barry: You bet. So, our modeling -- the rate models is made up based on cash position.
It's always been based on that, which is different than the accrual basis. I have mentioned
for years that we will have a depreciation problem in this city. Fortunately, the way we
have grown, it's such that the majority of our infrastructure at this current point in time is
fairly immature, meaning that it is not reached even half of its asset life cycle or life span.
So, that's good news. The bad news is that as we ballooned in our population and our
addition of assets as a community, so will that appreciation problem at some point into the
future. And I don't want to suggest that we are not currently working on depreciation
projects. The water and sewer main replacement that you see every year are part of our
investment in upgrading old infrastructure. A lot of this infrastructure gets upgraded
through that -- those particular programs. It also gets upgraded through improvements in
coordination with ACHD projects. Road widenings and those types of things will go in and
will replace our upside lines, depending upon their age or size or condition. So, we do
currently invest in upgrading our depreciating assets. There is not a ton of investment,
because there is not a ton of this infrastructure requiring this type of heavy investment.
But as we project going forward, if you assume say a 50 to a 75 year asset life cycle for
heights and infrastructure of that nature, you know, the majority of our population really
started taking off in 1990 and throughout the '90s. So, we have got -- what are we into it
now? It's 2015. So, you're 25 years into it. You're about halfway through the life cycle of
those assets added in 1990. All the assets added between 2000 and now are only 15
years -- if you go to 2000. So, the reality here is that, yes, depreciation will be the third
crisis for the Public Works Department. Fortunately for us time is on our side and we
have about 20 to 25 years before that crisis really becomes a problem. It would be
prudent for the department to begin saving as soon as it could for that -- for that crisis, but,
as you know, the current crisis that we are dealing with now are capacity of the treatment
plant and regulatory compliance. So, we feel that over the next ten years, focusing on
those two issues for the department, are the most prudent and, then, after we overcome
those two issues we will be putting our time and attention onto the assets and the
depreciating assets and schedules associated with that, which is why during this time
period we are building a very robust asset management program, because it will give us
the type of information to -- to very responsibly and conservatively go after, identify, and
repair and replace those projects needing -- needing repair and replacement. So, I don't
know if that helps or not.
Borton: It -- Madam Mayor?
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De Weerd: Uh-huh.
Borton: It does help. It might be more a question for us just to be mindful of -- you know,
at some point down the road there is that -- you flip a switch from cash to accrual, it
makes that drastic change and, quite frankly, to account for depreciation expense, which
is there, just deferred down the road. It greatly reduces or eliminates available fund
balance.
Barry: Well, keep in mind that the expenses that we are putting our money to right now
are focused on capacity and they are focused on regulation. When we achieve the
capacity goal over this ten year period of 15 million gallons per day and we achieve the
regulatory compliance goal over the next ten year period, the money that we have been
generating for those costs will be, essentially, freed up, because we won't have those
costs, at least to the degree that we have them today and that money can be diverted,
then, to the depreciation challenge. So, keep in mind that the cost component of our
operation over the next ten years will shift and as we achieve the goal for capacity and
regulatory compliance, we will be able to shift those costs over toward depreciation and
the revenue should still be there for us to be addressing the issue. Now, all of that gets
modeled as we move forward and you're looking 20 years into the future. So, we haven't
gotten that far in our modeling at this point.
Borton: Okay. Thank you.
Barry: Good questions, though.
De Weerd: Thank you, Tom.
Barry: You bet.
De Weerd: Okay. Council, you have got a packet of information from Finance that
summarize some of the budget changes since June 17th. Budget changes after you
received your binders. We can go through some of those. I will say that as we entered
into these budget workshops there were a couple of discussions that we had hoped to
have regarding either services or serviceability to respond to service-related needs. So,
part of that conversation was on benefits and reclassification and I think that Patty will --
will be talking about the benefits line item. I don't know if you had planned to, but I think it
would be helpful -- in just a second. I know that our city clerk had a question regarding --
on the position that's being requested on passports, if we continue to provide that service
and the staffing needs in that department. We had questions regarding the second fire
truck that we hope to have a conversation on. One of the things that we had anticipated
having a conversation on was personnel versus overtime in our fire department, but
because of some of the testing opportunities available, that conversation has been
delayed, but will be had at a later time, just not during the budget workshop timing. I think
they will be bringing that back. Additional things that we said that we would be bringing
back that were probably not -- not something that was needed during the budget
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workshop was the policy for the economic development incentive, computer replacement
that will come up this coming fall. We will have a streetlight program report and I think
that is it. I have been keeping ongoing notes regarding things that will make -- make your
decision making easier next year that I have been trying to capture as we go. So, I guess
I will ask Stacy how best she wants to talk about some of the changes and have Patty talk
about the benefits.
Kilchenmann: I will have Todd -- Todd accumulated the changes in his sheet, so he can
go through each of those and, then, we can have Miss Patty come up and talk about
benefits again.
De Weerd: Yeah. I would like each of the departments, if they had a change since the
budget workshop -- the first budget workshop to -- to discuss those. I guess if we go off
the list that Todd gave us we would start with Patty anyway.
Perkins: Good morning, Council and Madam Mayor. There were a couple of different
changes -- and I can talk about -- may just cover changes in the HR budget specifically
first. I did add an additional 3,500 dollar enhancement to do a compliance line, sort of an
ethics hotline. This had been under discussion last year. We decided to table it for a
period of time and thought it was pretty -- to bring it back at this time, so that is in there. It
is a partnership with our current employee assistance program and think it will be
something that would be very -- very beneficial to the city. The other enhancement
change that I made was we did increase our employee reimbursement total. Increased it
by 6,000 dollars annually and what that is -- it's a tuition reimbursement program. We
were a bit on the low side. The IRS allows us to reimburse at a much higher rate. We are
still quite below the maximum per person per year that the IRS will allow, but it does
enhance that budget a bit to hopefully encourage folks to go for higher education and
certifications and things that will benefit the city. The Mayor asked me to talk a little bit
about benefits and I think we -- I -- I don't want to be totally doom and gloom about
benefits, but it is certainly a topic of conversation for every employer and I think at the last
budget workshop we did not have our final renew numbers from Blue Cross, which is
without question the largest piece of our benefit budget and we had kind of a placeholder
in there at ten percent, which I thought was a very reasonable amount of money. Blue
Cross actually came in at 10.7 percent after many weeks of going back and forth and back
and forth they relented a whole half a percent. So, we, then, went back to the drawing
board and we -- we were trying to go this next year without any plan design changes.
However, we think that that is not going to be reasonable because of that level of increase
and so we have made a proposal to do two things. We have made some changes in the
prescription drug program whereby we keep the generic at the same co-pay. We increase
the next two tiers and we add a fourth tier for the very high special -- high cost specialty
drugs. There are 14 planned participants on that that will be impacted by this change and
it's a larger co-pay for those specialty drugs. They are available, they are still at a major
significant discount to what the actual cost is, but that change in that plan will allow -- give
us another percent at 1.3 to 1.5 percent, so that helps us significantly. In addition, we are
recommending that we contribute 75 percent of the cost of benefits to dependant on -- as
opposed to the current 80 percent and that helps us stay within the budget amount that
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we had. So, those are the changes I believe that you have in the materials that you have
before you. It's never easy to make changes to employee benefits. We were hoping that
we didn't have to do that and, quite frankly, we are lucky, because the average Blue Cross
increase in Idaho has been 25 percent and that had been widely reported a few weeks
ago. So, I'm sure they came down a little from each of those. But they are just not -- they
are not negotiating like they have in the past. So, I think for next year we will look at some
-- a number of different things to do that will I think be hopefully beneficial to the
employees and a little bit easier costwise to the city. So, those are the changes I believe
that you have. Oh, reclassifications. When I submitted the reclassification number last
time I had baked in there -- and it was indicated in the enhancement, but there was an
estimated three percent merit increase for each of those positions to kind of show the total
impact. What actually happened, though, is that was double dip, because Todd already
accounted for that merit portion, so I removed the merit portion from the reclassification,
so in most cases that went down and you still have some money built in there for any
potential salary increases that I would anticipate based on the grade movements. So,
that's why that number has changed and in most cases should be overall a little lower.
So, any further questions?
De Weerd: Any questions for Patty?
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Patty, I don't see the changes in the -- the drugs anyplace in --
Perkins: It doesn't show up -- it shows up in the percentage and so it should be --
Bird: I don't see it in any of our budget items, unless --
Perkins: Okay. Well, then, I'm not --
Bird: We need to get it in there, so that it is --
Perkins: Yeah. Because it would give us -- instead of a ten percent increase or the
original was 10.7, it would give an 8.2 increase.
Bird: Okay.
Perkins: So, it's still not a lot of reduction, but it is a little and it does keep us within the
five million dollar range.
Lavoie: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Todd.
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Lavoie: Councilman Bird, the financial figures for the fiscal 2016 -- the budget numbers
for the employee benefits for the Blue Cross, they have not been adjusted since the last
time we have met.
Bird: Okay.
Lavoie: We still believe that the number that we presented to you, the five millionish
number, still should hold, you know, pretty -- pretty close to where we want it to be. So,
we did not readjust the employee Blue Cross benefit number in the data that you have at
your fingertips right now.
Bird: Okay. It will be less than what we have got in the budget now? It's got to be before
-- before we go to public hearing.
Perkins: But I'm hearing --
Bird: Patty, that's what I'm hearing.
Perkins: Correct me if I'm wrong, Todd, is that the number that was plugged in there was
kind of the final budget number and, actually, what Blue Cross came in at was higher and
would have put it up higher and so the reductions that we have made keep it current with
the number you have.
Bird: That's what I'm --
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, Council, we didn't increase it ten percent to start with, so
we are just saying this is the number -- the plan will fit within the numbers, so it -- it
shouldn't -- it's not going to change from what you initially saw, but from '15 to '16 it was --
how much as it changed, Todd? Rita says six percent.
De Weerd: But it still falls within the budget line item that was calculated into the overall
budget.
Bird: Well, you're getting more revenue in, too, because we are getting an extra five
percent out of it.
De Weerd: Dean will want you to --
Bird: Madam Mayor, we are getting an extra five percent in savings and revenue,
because of the -- from 75 to 80 percent to the spouses.
Perkins: That keeps us -- making that -- that change keeps us within that budget.
Bird: That's what I mean.
Perkins: Yes.
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Bird: I just want to make sure that when we come to the public hearing that -- that we
can't add -- we can take out, but we can't add.
Perkins: Correct.
Bird: And so I want to make sure we are covered here today with what we got.
Perkins: If we don't make that change then we are over budget.
De Weerd: Any other questions for Patty?
Cavener: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Cavener.
Cavener: Just one real briefly. On the tuition reimbursement, this was new, this isn't
something I had expected to see and just a couple of clarifications for myself.
Patty: Uh-huh.
Cavener: When an -- one of our employees takes advantage of that, do they have an
obligation to stay on with the city for a predetermined amount of time or is there --
obviously, the city invests dollars in -- for the training and education and I'm curious if the
city gets a guaranteed return on investment on those.
Perkins: We have opted not to put any restrictions on that. Some employers do. They
say, you know, if you leave within a year of receiving this money you have to pay it back
or pay back a portion and the -- we discussed this at our directors team and we felt like
that was not something that we wanted to ask employees for at this time. Quite frankly,
we want to encourage some people to take advantage of it. We have certainly not felt like
we had employees that had taken advantage and, then, taken that -- and, then, left right
away, so at this point we think that that may be a solution to a problem we don't have at
this time, but it -- you know, that's certainly open for future discussion.
Cavener: Okay. Thank you.
De Weerd: And I will put that on for a future agenda topic is what our education
reimbursement policy is and maybe we can talk about who has taken an opportunity to
utilize that and that sort of thing.
Perkins: Okay.
De Weerd: So, we will come back with that. Okay. Any --
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
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De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: I have a question and I don't know if this is the right place to put it, but I
remember having a discussion about a new FTE that would be an internal auditor. I now
see this is as an enhancement under Council.
Bird: Yes.
Zaremba: Does that mean that when that person is hired they would report directly to the
Council or what's the reporting structure going to be?
Perkins: I'm going to defer to somebody else, because I do not have the answers.
Zaremba: Okay.
De Weerd: Probably wasn't involved in this enhancement --
Zaremba: Okay.
De Weerd: -- nor was I, so I -- I would ask our Council president.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, you all have that information in the package you received and it
would report to the Council.
Zaremba: That was my question. Thank you.
De Weerd: So, that's a great segue into this enhancement request.
Zaremba: Okay.
De Weerd: So, Councilman Rountree, do you want to -- to talk about that?
Rountree: Well, I'm going to let Stacy start.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, I'm not sure exactly where to start. What I did was I just
took Boise's internal audit description and plugged it in here. So, there are a wide variety
of functions this person could do, which probably isn't my choice of what they would do,
because if it was my choice they would do accounting work, but -- so, it's really up to you
-- well, it's up to the elected officials what they want it to do. In Boise they work -- they do
some actual accounting functions, like they review purchasing card payments, which are
credit cards, and they will do policy review for projects suggested by the directors, the
Mayor and the Council. I know -- I believe Robert called and talk to them a little bit about
that, so he might have more information than I do. They do things like look at the travel
policy, et cetera. I can see a million things we could have somebody do from where ever
they are located from internal control functions, to the strategic plan, to coordinating
City of Meridian Special Meeting Budget Workshop
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performance measurement reporting, to coordinating our policies, et cetera, et cetera, but
it's really not my position, so --
De Weerd: If it was yours it would be a budget analyst.
Kilchenmann: Correct.
De Weerd: So, maybe we would -- I don't know. I'm not really sure how to deal with this
-- go through the general process, so maybe we can talk about what problem we are
trying to solve.
Rountree: Madam Mayor. This position has been talked about a couple times in sessions
with the Council. The feeling is that there needs to be some support that deals directly
with the Council with respect to budgetary items. With respect to ongoing issues within
the city it might be issues to and including whistle blowing situations. We have a current
person looking at procedure and whatnot within one of our particular departments. This
position could do that sort of thing as it relates to budget issues or accounting issues that
may or may not be standard procedures. In anticipation of -- and I'm not saying we are
Boise, but we have grown up. We are no longer a little city. There isn't a person on this
Council that has the time to delve into the budgets and the operations of their specific
liaison departments to uncover issues or identify issues. This person would be the go
between to be in the department, to be looking at budgets, to be looking at expenditures
to make sure that there aren't things going on that shouldn't be that we are not aware of,
so we don't get into a situation where we have ourselves and backsides not protected
and/or the embarrassment of the city. So, I think it's time that we had this. It's not flushed
out in terms of the job description. The best description we have was what Boise had, but
it's going to be something along the lines of what you see in your packet, but I think that
there will be other elements added. I don't think it's -- it's not a CPA position, but it's
somebody who is financially astute and is able to do research and investigation into
matters related to the relationship between the Council and the operations of the City of
Meridian. Whether there is agreement or disagreement about the administration, the
bottom line is the dollars and cents of the city are our responsibility as a Council and we
need somebody in there that reports directly to us and brings to our attention issues that
we may need to know about. But occasionally I think there is a feeling on the part of the
Council that we are not getting sufficient communication or may not get sufficient
communication on issues that we are dealing with after the fact. So, that's -- that's the
history behind it. It has a fair amount of work yet to become a reality. It is here so we do
that. It's here so you can do that. As you investigate it and you find that there isn't any, it
will be easier to take it out of the budget than trying to add it in the budget in the next year.
So, there you go.
De Weerd: The devil is in the detail.
Rountree: The devil is in the details.
De Weerd: Okay. So, any questions about this FTE request? Or comments?
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Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Just know that you would set the example of how to fill out an enhancement
form.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I agree wholeheartedly. We have discussed this for a couple three years and I
thought everybody was in on knowing what it is. I think it's something that it's time that we
have not only to do as Councilman Rountree stated, but also to look at policies and stuff
like that and make sure we stay up on top of our policies and they are done right to protect
the employees and the citizens and everybody concerned. So, I'm wholeheartedly in
favor of it. I think it's probably a year or two -- we should have done it a year or two
sooner.
De Weerd: I guess I look forward to the discussion on what it really is. I will tell you that
in talking with Boise that because employees -- Council cannot act as a single person,
they have to act as a body. They have oversight from an audit committee and I don't
know who comprises of this audit committee to decide the work. Robert did talk to the
mayor's office and it sounds like this position works well for Jade Riley in the mayor's
office. So, like I said, the devil is in the details and I appreciate Councilman Rountree's
statement that if we talk about it, if it seems like there can be maybe a shift of resources
that we currently have, that it wouldn't be needed, but I do know as the department moves
towards the priority base budgeting, that with the strategic plan and the key
measurements there are going to have to be -- there is going to have to be help in
assimilating the implementation of the priority based budgeting and doing the analysis that
is required on that type of budgeting process and looking at -- looking at key performance
measurements and we are kind of seeing how on earth we are going to have resources to
look at that. So, those will be, hopefully, topics that are part of the discussion about a
position that can look at policies, performance, efficiencies and those kind of things. Mr.
Zaremba.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor. I guess this would be part of the discussion. As we talked
about it before, I have been in favor of having this. I guess I wasn't connecting that the
City Council would now have an employee. So, I guess that still -- my question still is
what's the reporting structure going to be? How is that going to work?
De Weerd: And I think that that's a struggle that other cities -- because council is not
supposed to have staffing authority. I don't know. Mr. Nary, do you want to answer that?
Nary: Under the Idaho Code the separation between the powers of the legislative body of
the city and the executive body of the city -- one of those lines is employees. So, the
Idaho Code -- in my opinion and other city attorney opinions say all employees work for
City of Meridian Special Meeting Budget Workshop
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the Mayor, if they are just employees. If they are appointed they can, then, be
accountable and reportable to both the Mayor and Council, like all the department
directors of the city or you can contract for employment. So, you have -- as Council
Member Rountree mentioned, you have a current contract with a company that's doing
some financial accounting and some review of some financial information for you. So, you
can -- council can contract with a group -- with someone. The council could have
someone appointed and, then, is reportable both to the Mayor and the Council, but if they
are employees under the Idaho Code, then, they would work directly for the Mayor. I
mean ultimately in the reporting structure they would work for the Mayor, because the
Mayor is the operational head of the city. So, that's part of the discussion I think the
Mayor is talking about is trying to figure out how to make the desire the Council's wanting
of a position to fit into the structure of what the code allows, because as the Mayor also
stated, the Council doesn't have authority to act individually, it's always collectively.
Trying to be a collective entity over one individual is somewhat problematic, you know, on
very simple things it could be very problematic. So, those are the things I'm thinking the
Mayor is talking about and trying to flush that out as we move forward and making that
clear, so we don't have a circumstance where we are not really matched up with what the
code really allows, but, again, we can work those out in the details.
Zaremba: Thank you.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: Two questions on that for Legal or maybe Councilman Rountree. Is the
enhancement request for the dollar line item, the manner in which it would be
characterized for future discussion, whether it's a contract or an employee or does the
enhancement request designate that now?
Kilchenmann: It -- Councilman Borton, if any personnel now -- if it were a contract we
would move it to operating, but I think when we -- when you approve the budget you're not
going to approve, you know, personnel operating, so as long as you don't increase it --
Borton: We are okay.
Kilchenmann: -- it's okay, we will just leave it. Reallocate it.
Borton: Okay. Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: A second question. As this gets developed is -- I anticipate some extensive
resources from Finance, one way or the other, that we are all aware of will probably be in
addition to the expense that's identified here. We can anticipate seeing something,
whatever that might be.
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Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, Councilman Borton, yes, audit takes a lot of Finance time,
so we --
De Weerd: And IT.
Kilchenmann: Yeah. It can take a lot of IT resources, too. So, hopefully, the person will
learn how to pull documents and refile documents and read the accounting system,
because we have -- our external auditor probably goes from December through February
and the audit we just had -- we had a conference room full of documents. So, it does -- in
speaking to Boise it does -- they do rely on -- on, you know, the accounting staff, but they
have got like 1,500 employees, so they are definitely much larger than we are. Maybe
they could just finish auditing -- they could audit us and be done in a month, I don't know,
but good question.
De Weerd: Well -- and I think those details again -- those are generally vetted out as we
look at the position creation, the description, what support resources it's going to need.
So, that will all fall out as this is further defined.
Borton: Great. Thanks.
De Weerd: The last one under enhancements added was under the Community
Development. That is a discussion that Council had at the first budget hearing the first
day on the PPS lighter, quicker, cheaper aspect that we are looking at responding to the
report that PPS gave, looking for a match from MDC to do some of these lighter, quicker,
cheaper items. Do you need anything further from Bruce on that? Okay. Council, why
don't we take a 15 minute break and, then, when we reconvene we will start going through
department by department. Okay.
(Recess: 9:57 a.m. to 10:19 a.m.)
De Weerd: Okay. We will reconvene this budget workshop. We are going to do the
Enterprise Fund first and walk through it as we have done in the past. If Todd will bring up
that budget. And I guess any questions -- we will look through the replacements, if there
is none there, we will go into the -- the enhancements.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: May I ask an overall question? With -- sorry. May I ask an overall question?
With the added enhancements and changed enhancements are we beginning with a
balanced budget? Is it balanced the way it is?
De Weerd: In -- in Public Works and Enterprise?
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Zaremba: No. I mean the whole city.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, Councilman Zaremba, each fund is different and unique.
So, the Enterprise Fund -- if you mean by a balanced budget does revenue -- new
revenue minus new expenses equal zero, then, no. But if you mean have we -- if you
mean new revenue, plus fund balance, minus expenses equals zero, then, yes. So, both
funds are in compliance with state statute. Both do use fund balance to get there, which
is not unplanned. It is planned I should say. Does that answer your question?
Zaremba: That was a better way to put it than I even asked. Yes. Thank you. That's
what I was looking for.
De Weerd: Thank you, Mr. Zaremba. And thank you, Stacy.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: I have a question about some information we just got. Jaycee, what software
do we use to open those files? It's directing me to a quiz question here that I don't have
an answer for.
Holman: Madam Mayor, Council Member Rountree, are you using laserfiche to open it?
For documents where you normally go during a City Council meeting I drug them over into
the --
Rountree: Yes.
Holman: -- and it won't open it?
Rountree: No.
Holman: Again, I don't know. I'm --
Rountree: I just wanted to be able to play with it here.
Holman: David's working on it right now.
Rountree: Okay. I will wait. Thank you, David. Go ahead.
De Weerd: Okay. Any questions regarding the replacements? If not, let's scroll down.
Okay. Council, anything under Public Works?
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
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Rountree: Not a question, but we have the addition request on the enhancements for the
safety manager -- or safety coordinator.
Bird: It's in here.
Rountree: I understand it's in there. The question is is that where we want it to go?
There has been considerable debate, so I just bring it up.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: And I have been the biggest debater. I want -- I was going to ask Tom to come
back with a plan of what they are going to -- how they are going to do this with their
employee and if it's a full 40 hour week job and what they are going to do. I felt at this
point I'd leave it in and, then, when we had the public hearing if I'm not satisfied, then, I
will argue at that point about it, because we can't -- we can't add, but we can take out at
the public hearing.
De Weerd: Okay. Additional discussion in the Public Works enhancements? Okay. I will
move to Water. So, is everyone comfortable moving from Water to the resource recovery
something or other.
Bird: Wastewater treatment plant.
De Weerd: I almost got it.
Zaremba: Water resource recovery plant.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Tom, remind me what the heavy equipment was out there. I forgot.
Barry: Councilman Bird, that heavy equipment includes a lift for moving large chemical
palates, for example, in and out of workshop areas and to the appropriate locations. I
think -- Laurelei, is there another piece of equipment? That was the largest one.
De Weerd: We need that on the record.
Barry: Yeah.
De Weerd: Sorry.
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Barry: While she is coming up, let me introduce to you our newest wastewater
superintendant Laurelei --
De Weerd: Wastewater?
Barry: Yes. It's the wastewater division. The facility is called the wastewater resource
recovery facility. So --
De Weerd: Okay. I'm going to call it the WWTP.
Barry: Right. Okay. You keep it WWTP in the books, that doesn't matter, we are trying to
give a name to the plant that will be more fitting and understandable to the community.
But the division is wastewater. Our superintendant Laurelei McVey has stepped in to the
position.
De Weerd: Welcome --
McVey: Thank you.
De Weerd: -- to your first official budget hearing. Exciting, uh?
McVey: So, Councilman Bird, the two pieces of equipment that we will be getting, one is a
larger lift to pull large pumps and motors. The second would be a smaller type lift that
would allow us to access booths and lighting throughout the plant.
Bird: Okay. I couldn't remember. I remember Tracy stated that day, but I couldn't
remember what it was. Okay. Thank you.
De Weerd: And, Laurelei, can you explain why we need to have the equipment on site,
rather than renting or --
McVey: Madam Mayor, the reason that we would like the equipment on site would be
allow us to complete more in-house repairs and also respond to downed equipment faster.
Right now we have to call out rental companies to rent cranes and lift to move that
equipment. So, this would allow us to do that with our own internal staff and be able to
repair most of that equipment in our new maintenance facility.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: And you do have gentlemen that are qualified and trained and will be trained on
these --
McVey: Absolutely, Councilman Bird. We have a really good maintenance staff.
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Bird: Thank you. Yeah, you do. You have a good staff, period, out there.
De Weerd Anything else?
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: To that question, remind me what the -- the rental offset is -- save the
expenditures on renting that equipment if you go forward with this purchase.
McVey: Councilman Borton, we did not necessarily calculate that exactly. It's really
dependent on how often equipment breaks down or is serviced, so most of that equipment
needs to be removed at least once a year just for routine maintenance, but it really
depends on if equipment breaks and a not planned environment.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: So, if it was -- and maybe someone -- maybe tommy up the number, I mean if it's
5,000 dollars a year, for example, to rent equipment to accommodate that, it might not be
as worthy an expenditure as 70 or 80 thousand a year, so -- that number might be
important.
McVey: Councilman Borton, it runs up approximately 1,500 to 3,000 each time we have
to rent a crane, depending on the type and size of crane that we have to rent.
Borton: Okay.
Barry: I think, Councilman Borton, if I may --
De Weerd: How about the availability? With the construction right now, do you have
problem with availability when you need them?
McVey: We -- Madam Mayor. We do at times. We are totally reliant on -- if those cranes
are available and sometimes, like you mentioned, they are out on other job sites and we
have to wait several days, up to a week. We also have to coordinate when that
equipment has been taken out of service and taken to the shop, we have to coordinate the
rental of the crane again to put it back in, so this heavy equipment would allow us to
reduce that down, because we would have the equipment on site to be able to put it right
back into service as soon as we can get it finished.
Barry: I think maybe as an addition to that point, the concern is making sure that the
treatment plant, which is a 24 hour, seven day a week operation, can't shut down, that we
have available the resources we need in order to make -- make sure that the plant is
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continuously operating and if we are held hostage by the availability that really is the
biggest concern that we are trying to overcome at this point in time. The cost is not going
to come out favorable for purchase of our own equipment and we know that intuitively.
We haven't done the numbers. We didn't bother to do the numbers. What we did is we
based this request on the likelihood for failure and the issues associated with failure and
the trouble that we have had with availability of the resource in order to get the equipment
back on site and removed -- essentially maintained or fixed and, then, put back into
service as quickly as we can. So, this is really the insurance means for us, as well as also
moving around the large chemical totes and other sorts of things, which operationally has
been difficult with the little lift that we have out there right now. So, we want to replace the
lift that we have currently with the smaller lift that Laurelei was just talking about and, then,
have the larger one for bigger jobs, essentially, that we have had to rent out recently for,
so hopefully that helps.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Tom, what's the tonnage on the biggest lift you're getting or the crane?
Barry: We have to go back to the enhancement, I believe, is it -- I don't even want to
guess. Let me grab these enhancements, if you don't mind. So, one of them was 5,000
pounds. Anything around the facility -- I think that's the smaller one. And I can't
remember the tonnage on the larger one.
McVey: Councilman Bird, what we would do before we purchased this equipment is have
our maintenance supervisor go through the list of equipment and find, you know, what is
the largest --
Bird: Make sure you have got the heaviest.
McVey: Yeah.
Bird: And 5,000 pounds, that isn't --
Barry: No. That's --
Bird: That's not very -- that's a pretty --
Barry: Right.
Bird: -- that's pretty small.
Barry: That's just what -- the smaller totes that we were just talking about that we move
around.
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Bird: Move around.
Barry: That's what those are. The other point to mention is that Star Crane, which is one
of the vendors that we rely heavily on for the removal and moving of large infrastructure at
the treatment plant is wanting to discontinue the service, so that's another reason for us
wanting to move towards, essentially, acquiring the equipment that will allow us to have
access the availability and the resources need at the time the issues occur at the
treatment plant.
Bird: Okay. While I agree with Councilman Borton, you got to look real hard to see if
renting it isn't the best way or -- you know. But I'm -- I have no problem if you guys will
come back before the public and let -- a public hearing and let us know what kind of
tonnage you're looking at in the big crane, because when you -- if you get a big crane or
something you got a lot of liability and stuff there that -- that is maybe best to hire those
outside and let somebody else have the liability and let us know what tonnage you need
on the crane.
Barry: We will do that. Thank you.
Milam: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes.
Milam: Just wondering in discussing cranes. So, did you say that the company you're
renting from is going to discontinue service? Does that mean they are going to
discontinue renting or --
McVey: Councilman Milam, what Tom was referring to -- they have one crane that is -- it
actually refers to that tertiary filter building crane enhancement. They have one crane that
is able to reach inside the door and pull it. That crane is not I guess road worthy, so they
have to bring it in on a truck and they are actually looking to get rid of that crane and it's
the only crane in the valley that can remove that pump, so the -- the other enhancement
that actually put cranes inside the building is the one that would address that issue.
Milam: Could we buy theirs? Less expensive.
Barry: Well, actually, yeah, what Laurelei is just referring to is the other lift that we have,
the overhead lift that runs and is mounted inside the tertiary filter building, is the one that
would replace the need to hire or have any kind of mobile crane that would reach inside,
which is actually more dangerous in trying to maneuver large pieces of equipment, we
have one that is designed to be extended from the roof, which is much, much better for
safety, reliability, accessibility and all those --
De Weerd: And that's a tertiary filter building crane.
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Barry: Correct. That's the crane lift for that one. That's not the heavy equipment that we
were just referring to.
De Weerd: No. On the heavy equipment -- I assume these are pictures of them?
Barry: That's very similar to the stuff we take --
Bird: That isn't a heavy -- that isn't a heavy equipment -- that isn't a crane.
Barry: No. It's a lift.
Bird: I mean -- what do you lift with that?
McVey: So, with that we would be able to pull some of the pumps and motors. The really
large one, like the mixers on top of the digesters, that would, obviously, not extend high
enough.
Bird: Plus you can also move pallets around.
McVey: Yes. Yeah.
Bird: Okay. You don't have to -- you don't have to find the tonnage. I -- I should have
had my memory cap on.
Barry: Thank you, Mr. Bird.
De Weerd: Yeah. What's going on?
Bird: Losing my memory. I'm getting old.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: At or before the public hearing. That's a great explanation of it. Can you share
the frequency and duration of the rental of that equipment that's being solved by this over
the last maybe two or three years? Understanding it's not going to, obviously, exceed the
cost of the equipment, but it would be important to see and I don't know if that's a Finance
question or a question to you.
Barry: Yeah. We can definitely help.
Borton: Thanks.
De Weerd: Well, I think it's not only cost, but it's frequency.
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Borton: Frequency and duration.
Bird: This isn't going to lift anything.
De Weerd: Sorry I had to show him the picture.
Barry: Picture is worth a thousand words.
Bird: Be lucky to get me up that high without tipping over.
De Weerd: Come on.
Barry: Sounds good. Any other questions on that enhancement or any others for
wastewater?
De Weerd: Okay. Council, are you ready to move to Community Development?
Bird: Community Development. Yeah.
De Weerd: Any questions about the enhancements?
Rountree: Roll the slide down. There you go.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Are we replacing everybody's computer? We got 15.5 employees and we got 14
computers.
Chatterton: Madam Mayor, Council Member Bird, if you remember, if we have a core of
contractors and inspectors --
Bird: Uh?
Chatterton: We have -- we have a big core of contractors and inspectors.
Bird: Oh, this is for the building department.
Chatterton: Yes. Yes. And a number of these are those --
De Weerd: We merged them together.
Bird: I know that. I know that. I know that. But I -- okay.
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Chatterton: A number of them -- of those computers are the motion tablets, which have
currently not worked out that well and most of those are being replaced.
Bird: Okay. So, most of them are for your inspectors and stuff?
Chatterton: Yes.
Bird: They didn't -- you say the motion ones didn't work?
Chatterton: Well, the --
Bird: And we are getting new ones?
Chatterton: The old ones were -- were not working that well and it's also due to be
replaced, so it's sort of a combination of inspectors and IT as well dealing some hardware
which wasn't working that well. Now we will be in much better shape.
Bird: Okay, Bruce.
De Weerd: And we want them to use our computers, because of security, compatibility
and all of that.
Chatterton: Yes. And, Madam Mayor, as well we require them to heavily use Accella in
the field and in the office and so we really need to provide the computing system for that.
Bird: That's no problem at all.
De Weerd: Okay. Any other questions about the replacements? Any discussions on the
enhancements?
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: It is -- one question on the fields district development plan. Give me some --
maybe some more clarity on this particular plan. When I look back at the content of the
fields district study and some of the -- I think there were those five recommended projects
or focus areas, are we by funding a plan like this going down a path where we -- the city
has made a commitment to certain -- take certain action on these five areas? Ag based
tourism development. Ag innovation center. I didn't have my head around from those
studies what that might entail, so I'm not really clear on funding this particular
development portion of the study. I don't really have my head around -- is the city
committed to any sort of development to an ag innovation center or ag tourism?
Chatterton: Madam Mayor, Council Member Borton, no, this study did not commit us to
at. I think we realized that in order for any of these projects in the fields district to be in
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place we need to acquire partners. And we have been talking to Nampa. We will be
talking to Canyon county as well.
De Weerd: Canyon county?
Chatterton: Well, I meant Canyon county from the standpoint of coordination --
De Weerd: As well.
Chatterton: The idea being that had we still left on the table the idea of a co-location of
fairgrounds, you know, is there still something more or the relocation of the Ada county
fairgrounds. A fairground -- a new fairground properly built, actually, would be a sort of ag
experience facility in and of itself on the things that can happen year around there. The
idea is to develop the project more -- the idea -- and it's not really spelled out in the
enhancement, Council Member, is also to look at innovative ways to preserve agriculture
within our area of impact. We just started to talk to some of our partners about that idea
of -- we had some issues now out in northwest Meridian where we have an Intermountain
Gas facility that perhaps will be expanding. That facility is going to need a buffer zone, a
safety buffer zone around it and perhaps we could -- agriculture almost certainly would be
-- would be a piece of that. So, we are beginning to talk with Nampa and with both
counties about how to -- to best plan that area and develop it. So, it wouldn't -- this
enhancement wouldn't necessarily be to develop those particular projects, but the idea of
what will northwest Meridian be, what will south Meridian be, and are there ways in which
we can put existing agriculture and keep it -- keep it in production into the future.
De Weerd: I think there is a lot of moving parts to this to take the economic audit that we
received this last year and start working with our regional partners to flush out both the
economic development piece to it, the project potential, agri preservation, but also I think
he is going to be working with our -- our neighboring communities to insure that
transitional and land uses are considered. Some of the concerns from industry, as we
were talking to them -- and certainly you have seen this in Canyon county, is there is a
conflict between residential and the ag industry and so it's looking at that part of our
community and how you would protect business investment and transition the kind of
industry clusters that our economic audit considered and the residential. So, how that
would look.
Chatterton: And at the end of the day, Council Members, this may be as much an
exercise in good land use policy, more than it would be developing any of these particular
projects. I think we would need to have interest from a partner or partners to advance say
the ag experience or the ag innovation projects. W e would need to get some real traction
on those before we would be able to -- to really proceed with developing those projects.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
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Borton: To accomplish that goal using fire as an example and the collaborative approach
of that plan, to have some of the stakeholders participate -- not only financially in the study
portion of it, but it also allows the solution to be presented in a more regional fashion. If --
or Canyon county, for example, is part of the solution, does it make sense not only to
invite them to help fund a study such as this, but also make sure that the results that come
from it aren't limited to solutions within Meridian if, in fact, the regional solution -- perhaps
it's not. Perhaps it's -- you know, in Canyon county adjacent to Meridian. The study
would determine where that ag solution and the breadth of the land use solutions -- you
know, if it's not just Meridian focus, have they been approached or are we precluded from
approaching them to participate financially and allow the study scope to be broader?
De Weerd: You know, I guess at this point this placeholder contemplates part of a larger
project or doing it on our own. Certainly if you look at the economic audit it was
considered in order for it to work it really needs to be regional in scope. We have talked to
Ada county. Ada county has an interest in certainly -- from both the commissioner and the
planning staff that Bruce and I are organizing a meeting on. Once we get on the same
page it's talking with Canyon county, have talked to Nampa, they wanted to finish up their
land use comprehensive plan piece and so there is still a lot of moving parts here, but
because this has been deemed a priority we wanted to make sure that we had resources
identified that we can do something on our end. We are hoping it's part of a larger
regional project, but if it's not we would still have to flush out the items that were brought
out in the economic audit and look at transitional land use, working with the landowners
out in that area to really determine highest and best use and how we can preserve open
space and ag in that area, as has been communicated as a priority.
Borton: Thanks. That helps.
Chatterton: Well said.
De Weerd: Okay. Additional questions? Okay. Thank you, Bruce. Okay. Anything
further on this -- on Community Development? Okay. I will move to the General Fund.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, there is one change on here we didn't mention. On the
motorcycle officer, Jeff's plan was to only do that if they received the grant. I believe they
won't know about the grant -- October?
De Weerd: I believe the Council said put it in there.
Kilchenmann: Yeah. We decided that it was important enough that we would do it
regardless of the grant, so we have taken the grant funding out. So, this doesn't reflect
the grant funding. So, there is still the possibility that there will be revenue to offset the
first three years, I believe.
De Weerd: Okay.
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Kilchenmann: So, that would change the numbers, since the Council last saw the end of
this -- this summary.
De Weerd: So, I guess that could add to the discussion if the grant was received, that
money that's budgeted could shift into the fund balance.
Kilchenmann: Correct.
De Weerd: Okay. Or the public safety fund.
Kilchenmann: Probably that would be a good place for it and just to -- because I think I
will have a question on this. So, Councilman Borton noticed that last year we had about
500,000 something left at this point and we said we are going to put it into the CIP fund.
We never literally actually appropriated it to go in the CIP fund, which is something we can
do. If you want something to go into fund balance we can literally appropriate it and
transfer it. So, we are -- the CIP fund is looking more healthy. It's -- you know, because
we are getting this building revenue in and we are not really spending it. The public safety
fund is looking not so very healthy. We -- I mean it serves a purpose. We did use it for
part of the training center, but now we should probably turn our attention to increasing it
and there is a couple different ways to do it. One way is we can let this year roll through,
so let '15 end and, then, if there is -- we discover that we have left over funds we can start
October by doing an appropriation -- a dreaded budget amendment, but this one will be
just to transfer money into the -- into that public safety fund. So, that's one mechanism.
Can do it in this budget, which means probably reducing something in this budget, but
that's just kind of where we are fund balance wise or ideas to think about, so I -- I probably
-- you know. Well, it's up to you. If you want to reduce this budget or if you want to fund
the public safety fund through end of year.
De Weerd: Okay. I guess in the General Fund we can start with the replacements and
open this up for any questions.
Bird: We can't get rid of the Grand Marquis.
De Weerd: Oh, yes, we can.
Bird: Bill likes driving that.
De Weerd: No. That's Ken. And he has to carry around a battery kick starter. You can
pile a lot of MYACers into it, though, right, Luke?
Cavener: Lots.
Bird: I'd say something, but I better not.
De Weerd: Under replacements I think one of the questions that came up during day one
of the budget and certainly one that I put out there was -- there were two fire engines that
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were requested to replace. The budget that was presented to you only had one of the two
recommended and if you wanted to have discussion on the second engine.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: I don't know how detailed of a discussion on that topic we would get into at this
meeting, but in light of Stacy's comment and some of the options that we have more
holistically with this budget process, the idea of -- if not including a second engine within
this budget, to insure that we do allocate funds, at least from my perspective, whether it's
into the public safety fund generally or, quite frankly, into a specific -- the fire truck
replacement fund, which has been done before, we know that these expenditures, which
have been in the capital improvement plan for a number of years, they are there and if
that helps lessen the -- the sting of a large expense of a fire truck -- the one included
today, obviously, doesn't solve the problem that we have known of for years in the natural
process of replacing these. So, one of the aspects of this budget that I think will be
important is to make a specific allocation and designate some funds for future fire truck
acquisition and, again, how -- if that's placed in a broader public safety fund, had been
done most recently or into a specific designation for a fire truck. One of those two is I
believe important and prudent to do.
De Weerd: I think it probably needs to be specifically to a fire truck line item.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: We used to have that and, then, it kind of was overshadowed when we did the
public safety fund. It was kind of blended together and if -- these are big ticket items and I
think it's important to make sure that we have those investments. Mr. Bird.
Bird: I agree. I think that we put it in a truck fund like we used to and -- I don't know. We
-- I can't remember what the recommendation on the trucks are, 15 or 20 years. Uh?
Ten? So, you know, if we put 75,000 a year every ten years we could -- you know, for ten
years we would have -- I know for another one or so you're going to have to probably --
have to bite the bullet, but right now this year I would have no problem putting 35 into a
truck fund -- starting up a truck fund and buying the one we got.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, if I -- if I could -- so, this fund that we are calling the public
safety fund that we used to call the truck fund, it's literally cash investment, it's a fund with
a fund checking account. Opening another one of those is not very cost effective,
because, then, we got the fees from investing, we -- if we -- you know. So, we can
designate it and call it for a fire truck, we can definitely do that. Put the designation on it.
We can change the name of the fund, but I wouldn't want to actually literally open a new
fund when we already have one. I think the only thing we have used it for police is for the
-- is for the training center. So, police generally -- well, I shouldn't say that. I won't say
that, but they wouldn't have use -- but we can definitely designate where the money goes
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that we put into it. This budget -- if you put money into it you have to take something out
of the budget.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Yeah. I don't care what you call the fund, you can put it in the General Fund as long
as you designate each year. It's the same thing we did with the parks for the playground
out at Settlers. So, I -- yeah, you can call the fund anything you want, as long as we know
that there is X amount of dollars that's been set aside for a fire truck.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: That sounds like a sensible and reasonable idea to me, but I contrast that with
the idea of just-in-time financing. We would be tying this money up. We know these
expenses are coming and I agree with planning for them, but we seem to be going a
different direction than the just-in-time financing conversation we had earlier. I'm not sure
how to handle that.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, Councilman Zaremba, just-in-time financing is a particular
Tom method. We don't do that in the General Fund, because if you look at our fund
balance we have a finite fund balance. So, we have really no way to raise funds to
change the course of that and we can't raise fees if we -- if it looks like something is going
to cost more, we can't raise fees to meet it. So, we have to be very careful with how we
budget our General Fund balance. So, we literally save for our projects and, then, do
them. If we were just to take the approach -- well, because that approach we'd buy the
fire truck right now -- we would buy two fire trucks, we would buy three fire trucks and,
then, we would worry about one next year or the next year. So, we are just like working
with ten million dollars here that's free and clear. So, we need -- before we make a half a
million dollar investment, we need to save up for it or we need to cut another 500,000 out
of this budget. So, it's like -- how do you explain it?
De Weerd: Just-in-time financing is because in Public Works and many of our other
departments, you are judging your performance based on what you're able to do that year.
The fire truck fund is a savings that is specifically targeted, just like we do in a number of
our capital improvement plan projects. It's a savings. But just-in-time financing -- or
budgeting is so you can judge -- you can judge your performance based on what you
anticipated spending in that year. So, it's -- it helps better track that you are anticipating
those -- those performance measure per se. So, two different things.
Zaremba: I think I'm getting that, in which case I'm in favor of socking money away for a
fire truck.
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De Weerd: Socking. That's a -- that's a budget term. Yes.
Rountree: A mattress.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: To that point of socking away money, which I support as well. Really, what that
does as I see it -- and use the fire truck as an example. We have got a capital
improvement plan that the city adopts and, you know, within it it forecasts those types of
expenditures and the objective matrix for replacing a fire truck -- both fire trucks, quite
frankly they seem to exist today and one of the challenges that not socking away money
creates is you have no expenditure and, then, you have got a million one to try to replace
two of them. Whether that was within a capital improvement plan or not, that plan doesn't
fund, so you get to a budget session such as this --
De Weerd: Not constrained.
Borton: -- and the problem is we, then, might take pause to fund a million for two trucks,
when, quite frankly, that might have been consistent within the plan and funding it should
have been that natural course of what we do. If socking away funds in lieu of something
else, it's an absolutely must. I don't think it -- I don't think it's a discretionary choice at all.
We know it's coming. It's coming a lot quicker than ten years and there will be maybe a
discussion at some point from the chief before the public hearing, maybe at that hearing,
to get us comfortable with what that figure is. I think it's a lot more than 75,000 dollars.
We have planned for those expenditures to come quicker, too. So, that makes it more
difficult to balance this particular budget and there is other factors to that as well. But as
long as we are mindful of funding that, knowing what's coming down the road.
De Weerd: Well, Mr. Borton, I guess you raise a good point. As Stacy mentioned, the
discussion for this current budget year was to put money in the capital improvement plan
and this -- this Council could determine that what we have in savings at the end of 2015
could be designated for a fire truck fund if -- if that is -- if that would be your desire. So --
and, I don't know, maybe -- Stacy just gave me the Eagle eye -- or evil eye. I'm not sure
which.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, this is an if we have savings at the end of the year. In '15 --
Rita, help me out. I don't -- or '14 we did not.
Bird: There has been savings every year.
De Weerd: Yeah, we did.
Bird: We have had savings every year.
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Kilchenmann: Okay. They don't have it memorized.
De Weerd: Wow.
Kilchenmann: So, yes, we definitely can do that. I do remember in the personnel, which
was where we have got the bulk of our funding before, we have just taken what was -- like
here is budget, here is personnel, there is funds left over. We moved that into that fund
that we are now calling the fire truck fund and I -- last year there wasn't savings of
personnel. We had 500,000 last year in income from the General Fund. There. That's
the answer.
De Weerd: There is a fire truck.
Kilchenmann: If -- but that's in '14, so --
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: On your -- on the fire -- on the fire truck fund, you probably -- you're probably going
to not save 550,000 before you need one, but if you save 100,000, that's only 450 you
have to budget that year for. It's just something that -- we never did save for a complete
fire truck, but we -- we didn't have to budget -- we didn't have to take 550,000 out of one
budget for a fire truck, because we had been saving for five or six years. That's all I'm
saying and I think that's -- that to me is just being smart.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Well -- Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor, I agree with all that and if the source of the funds is a way to
sweep unused funds -- if -- we have collected more than we budgeted for and we can
sweep those unused funds into a fire truck, I'm in favor of that with one caveat, I would like
-- if we do have a surplus at the end of any year, I would like a portion of that reserved for
the parks department as well. So, I'm -- I'm in favor of the idea, but I probably wouldn't put
it a hundred percent on the fire truck. Something needs to be going to the parks
department as well.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, I think we can make that discussion at the end of the year
when you knew how much money you were dealing with, because you could have zero,
you could have 500,000 or you could have -- you know, this fall we will, as a group, be
working on a capital improvement plan again and so, then, we are going to have a good
idea where we need to be and how far away we are from getting there. I think right now if
we strip the city down to what we have to do, what we are mandated to do, which is public
safety, we know that we are going to have to open a fire station and building the fire
station isn't a challenge, because we can build that out of impact fees and buy the first
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truck we can do it out of impact fees. It's replacing the truck. So, I don't know how many
trucks are out there now, but there needs -- for replacement, according to the fire
department, there is a lot more than two trucks. So, I think it's hard to say now that we are
going to say this goes to parks, this goes to fire, this goes the police, but that's probably a
decision among the list of decisions that -- attack was planning -- well, attention of their
capital improvement fund -- I mean, yeah, plan. But I think right now the need is fire.
And, again, this budget won't -- if you just look at this budget it's zero.
Milam: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mrs. Milam and, then, Mr. Rountree.
Milam: From my memory we had his almost identical conversation last year and so I don't
know what happened. We should already have a fund that we started based on the
conversation that we had during budget. But at the end of this I would like a specific
number set up to go to towards a fire truck fund for an engine or just that fund, because
it's -- obviously it's necessary and we don't have, you know, 500,000 dollars every year to
buy an engine. So, I think we -- it's very important to have something very specific set up
at the conclusion of this discussion.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, there is one more thing. You can also buy a fire truck out
of the capital improve fund. We can do that. And it's got about what? It's got about 3.9
million at the end of the year.
De Weerd: Okay. Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, the idea of this reactive financing is not the way to go. If, in
fact, we want to establish funding categories or a public safety fund, we need to fund it in
budget, not rely on the fact that funds aren't going to get spent. If, in fact, that's what you
want to do, there is some things in here we ought not to be doing. What those are, it's up
to us. The idea that we are sitting here talking about funding public safety and any other
function of the city based on what we will save is ludicrous. We should be budgeting what
we want to do to accomplish the mission that we have established. Now, there are some
things that some people think are mission critical, but maybe the idea of buying a fire truck
next year or two years from now is a little more critical than some other component. So,
it's a matter of setting our priorities and making the hard decisions about things that
people don't really necessarily want us to do in terms of the staff and department heads --
in some case even ourselves, but the reality is we have got to do it. If we are going to do
it, let's not sit here and fool ourselves as to how we are going to do this, because we are
going to save a lot of money. Well, if we are going to save a lot of money, let's save it
right here. Let's save it in this budget. Put aside -- maybe give ourselves an incentive.
If we budget some money we are going to take some money out of the capital
improvement fund to match it to get something done that we need to get done. But
annually to -- and I'm as guilty as the rest of us have been is that it's -- you know there is
things that aren't going to be purchased, you know there is things that are in this budget
that we really don't need and it does -- and people are not going to be filling positions that
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are empty and all of that money accrues to a carry over. Well, that ought to be our rainy
day fund. That ought to go into our rainy day fund, any carryover. We out to be budgeting
for what we think we need and if we -- if we really need something, we ought not to be
crossing our fingers and hoping that there is going to be that money saved to do it and
that's my lecture for the day.
De Weerd: Well -- and I would just point out, as Stacy mentioned, there is money in the
capital improvement plan and fire engines are in the capital improvement plan. So, it's not
like it's not anticipated to be funded, it's -- it's in the plan. But as Councilman Borton
mentioned, the capital improvement plan is -- is not fiscally constrained and that's going to
be a project that you will need to tackle this year is to make sure it is. So, anyway, that's
-- that's my little lecture, too. And if you -- I heard Councilman Borton say something
about the public hearing that the chief would have some comments. If he has comments I
think you need to hear them now.
Niemeyer: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, yes, I do have comments. I have
been listening and I do first and foremost appreciate the discussion of trying to plan better
for the future and I understand the focus right now is on fire trucks. They are a great cost.
But as we discussed with Councilman Borton when we met with him yesterday as a staff,
this is a big citywide issue as well. You have police cars that are capital over long term.
When you bought a fire department you invested in a commercial fleet is what we have.
We are not talking about cars and pickups, we are talking about commercial vehicles and
they cost a lot of money. Moving forward, I can tell you what our current crisis is right now
today. We have four engines that are being -- have been deemed critical for replacement.
That's based on a scoring evaluation matrix that we sat down yesterday with Councilman
Borton to discuss. Those four vehicles are well over a hundred thousand miles. One of
them is pushing 170,000 miles. That is our current crisis. So, delaying one just adds to
the next year and that's the challenge that we have is that buying one this year I
understand the money is what it is, but rest assured next year I will be coming back with
two simply based on the crisis that we are in. I would love to get to a point, as President
Rountree indicated, of not being reactionary, but having a well thought out plan moving
forward to fund those capital replacements, because this doesn't end. The challenge --
and this was eye opening to me is this year's fire truck that we are replacing is the first fire
truck this department has every had to replace in our history, the one that is being built
right now. We are now in that cycle that we have never had to be in before. As we move
forward that cycling to continue now and Stacy alluded to as we build a station that's one
more vehicle to put into this commercial fleet management program. So, I do appreciate
the discussion on how do we move forward into the future with a good plan to fund these
things and not just -- not just for the fire department, but for the city as a whole with these
large capital items that are going to continue to need replacing and whereas that land is
priority over doing something new or doing something different, it is a challenge and one
that we are very well aware of. We have put together -- and we will have a copy for each
one of you, a very comprehensive fleet management book just for the fire department as
we looked at our apparatus and how we evaluate the need to replace it is not based on a
whim. It incorporates several different factors that we have identified as best practice in
fleet management. Not just mileage, but hours on the engine, hours on the pump,
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condition of the apparatus and so on and so forth and we shared that with Councilman
Borton yesterday. It's as well thought out and comprehensive as I feel we can get in
managing a commercial fleet. I don't know that I helped, but -- but I do appreciate the
conversation and discussion and I do need to make sure that I'm articulating where we are
at right now.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: While we do need the fire engines -- 83 percent of our calls are medical and we
don't need an engine out there and a year ago we were going to get some facts back
about switching to -- to some squads or something to respond on those and I haven't
heard a thing on it. Maybe Councilman Borton has. But I think that's -- that’s a feasible
thing for us to definitely look into --
Niemeyer: Absolutely.
Bird: -- and we don't have to have it in every station, but two or three stations or two out
of the five stations would be fantastic.
Niemeyer: And, Councilman Bird, to your point, I did hear that loud and clear at our first
budget presentation. We are collecting research right now. In October we have a three
day retreat where we are going to go and that's all we are going to be discussing is with
the ARV program I think we do need to be cautious in how we approach it and that is what
are we trying to solve. I have heard that already said once today, to make sure that we
identify what are we trying to solve and I think there is several things there that we have
an idea of what we are trying to solve, one of them being wear and tear on the engines as
we are in our current environment. I think there is some other things that we are also
going to be discussing and bringing back to you a very comprehensive analysis and
program with regards to any kind of alternative response vehicle. But we did hear you
loud and clear and we are moving forward on that.
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Since you're here, refresh my memory if you would. About six, maybe seven
years ago we refurbished a truck that we had and I know there is an expense to that that's
nearly half of buying a new one and the discussion at the time was this is not a forever
solution, but off the top of your head give me a comparison of refurbishing and buying new
again and --
Niemeyer: Sure.
Zaremba: -- what's your recommendation?
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Niemeyer: The refurbishment process was something that was going on right about the
time I was named the chief. It had already been set in motion. I was not familiar with it at
the time, so we went through that. We refurbished two engines, one is Engine 39, one is
Engine 32. Having gone through the process -- the anticipated goal that was stated was
that we extend the life of that engine for five years at as a reserve engine by doing this
refurbishment. The refurbishment goes and it paints the vehicle, it creates some new
cabinets, it does an inspection, but it doesn't change your engine, doesn't change your
transmission, doesn't change the guts of the engine. As I look at Engine 39, we bought
that in 1993 for 187,000 dollars. We spent 242,000 on the refurbishment of that engine.
We did get the five years out of it, but it didn't prolong the life so we could say that was a
good return on investment. So, in my opinion the refurbishments -- because you're not
changing that transmission, that engine, that's really what the problems are, within the
pump housing, those parts that have got 187,000 -- or 150,000 miles on them, whatever
the mileage is. I don't think you get your return on investment through a refurbishment.
De Weerd: I thought the refurbishing was supposed to be to the mechanical piece of it.
Esthetically?
Niemeyer: It was cabinetry. It was updating it to the current safety standards. We didn't
change the motor on that engine or the transmission.
Zaremba: Thank you.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Refurbish to me would have been the engine and the transmission, not the
pretty stuff.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Bird.
Bird: Chief, I do want to say one thing here. When we get the new ones in on
replacements, the ones that we are replacing, I do not want them donated again. Let's --
let's sell them. There is people out there that will buy them and we -- it's nice to be big
hearted and everything, but our taxpayers are tired of being big hearted.
Niemeyer: And that's part of the document we have put together. We have taken a look
at what could the resale value be in our current state. In fact, Chief Lavey leaned back
there a while ago and asked so what -- with the age that we have on some of these what
can you get out of them and the market value right now on most of them is about 30,000
dollars, which if you consider that initial investment it's not a lot. There is a very fine line in
proper fleet management that says if you hit this point this is your best resale value after
you have reached a certain maintenance to depreciation -- or maintenance to acquisition
ratio. Many fleet managers use that as a time to get rid of apparatus. Ours costs a little
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bit more than most, but that is a tool to use. But, absolutely, there is still some value in
these -- in these apparatus, so resale is a possibility.
De Weerd: Thirty thousand is thirty thousand. That's a lot of money.
Bird: That's right. It would buy one of your command vehicles.
De Weerd: Okay. Any other questions for chief pertaining to the budget?
Niemeyer: Thanks.
De Weerd: Okay. So, any other questions on replacements? If not we will launch into
the enhancement section.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: I wait until you make the transition and, then, I bring up a question. It might be
related to replacements. It's related to this discussion and it's -- it may be a solution of
one way to address it, so there is some consistent funding applied to this particular
problem in the capital improvement plan. If I'm reading the figures provided to us correctly
and the anticipated revenue, I would throw out an idea that I have not discussed with the
chief or anybody in particular, but trying to allocate a percentage within our budget each
year towards a public safety fund. For example. If there is 35 million dollars in anticipated
revenue for this next fiscal year, which is the figure in front of us, to allocate one percent a
year as we build the budget each year off the top -- sort of like we do with replacements
each year -- peel that off, you peel off a one percent annual figure, about 350,000 dollars,
to earmark and designate into a public safety fund, which on a particular year we might
speak to it being intended for fire, it might be intended for something else, but -- so, we
start this process each year shaving that allocation off, which we know we have to make,
and kind of bypass some of this discussion that we have all accepted, either expenditures
that we need and the fire truck replacement schedule over the next ten years, whether it's
one truck or four trucks, it's -- they are big numbers. Councilman Rountree is a hundred
percent correct that somehow I think that type of solution works versus trying to rely on --
on unknown savings. Let's put it in there. If we put it in there this year we would add a
line item of 350,000 dollars for funding, so to speak, the public safety fund. If that creates
an additional area where we may need to cut or if it's the Council's prerogative to apply
even more of the unrestricted fund balance towards that designation, we could do either. I
mean the balance -- the budget right now -- we are already spending two million dollars --
or potentially two million dollars more that we are bringing. And which is normal -- you
know, can occur in the normal course of events over the years. But that's what I feel most
comfortable with. Again, funding it with a set amount. That percentage seems to be
within the wheelhouse of being able to cover those expenses and kind of soften the edges
of -- of when they come up that we have -- we have got funds available to do it.
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Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, Councilman Borton, the only thing when you do a policy I
would be cautious about walking into it, like saying every single year we are going to do X,
just because you might get to a point where you don't need that much money yet, so there
would be some evaluation process in there.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Well -- and I think, too, that Council might have a public safety expenditure
that they could say instead of the one percent going into that, it would be dedicated
towards this -- this enhancement. So, there would be some flexibility.
Kilchenmann: There are other things, too, we could spend it on, like police cars or
equipment.
De Weerd: But there is around 400,000 in police cars.
Kilchenmann: Yes.
Borton: Madam Mayor, just to that point, the intent at least in initiating something like that
is that it's not flexible. I mean it always is; right? Technically. Right? The Council can
change the policy and we will all be gone and there will be new council and mayor and
somebody that can change or we can change. But the intent is it's truly a commitment at
least for the foreseeable future that we would try and build a budget knowing good and
well that expenditure is there and not set something like that up this year with the idea
that, well, we can probably change it and get rid of it next year. While that technically
might be true, the hope is that we remain consistent with it and as it gets built up those
funds will be expended on those public safety expenditures that we have all planned for
years prior.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, Councilman Borton, when I think about it, you're right, we
will never run out of things to spend it on.
Bird: No, we will find things to spend it on.
Kilchenmann: Uh-huh.
Bird: Guaranteed.
Borton: Madam Mayor? To that point the way I characterized how that concept could be
done, I don't know if that was accurate or not in how it would be displayed and what's in
front of us on the screen, is it the addition of a line item under -- under what? Just so we
can see the impact on trying to make this thing balance.
Kilchenmann: Oh, you mean right now?
Borton: Correct.
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Kilchenmann: Todd will just flip out his magic fingers and make it happen.
Borton: We are seeing Finance at work.
Rountree: So much for magic fingers.
Lavoie: It takes a little longer, uh.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: While the math is going on, I would like to repeat my thought of what the public
safety fund is. Automatically everybody thinks Police and Fire. I have always considered
parks, both the open space and the recreation activities to be part of our public safety as
well and people have heard me say my experience of living other places, I felt that cities
that didn't put enough into parks and creation weren't saving money, because they ended
up putting more into police and jails. So, there is correlation there and I would just like to
put into the general psyche that when we talk about a public safety fund that Parks has
access to this as well.
De Weerd: I would hate to disagree with you, but I do believe build parks, not prisons, but
I think this -- the history of this city has always had the safety aspect first, because if you
are not a safe city you're not going to have safe parks or safe neighborhood or an
attractive business community. That doesn't mean that it takes away from parks as an
investment, but it is public safety first.
Kilchenmann: And, Madam Mayor, for Parks we also have the capital improvement plan
-- planning, that fund, and we have impact fees. So, impact fees really help them develop
parks, then, we got to go back and pick up the operating as is the devil in everything else,
but --
De Weerd: But, Stacy, I guess that brings up a question. Why wouldn't park design --
750,000 dollars for designing the 77 acre park, why isn't that impact fee eligible?
Kilchenmann: Believe it is -- it is impact fees.
De Weerd: Is it?
Kilchenmann: Is it not, Todd?
Rountree: Madam Mayor -- and I'm just going to throw this out to implement the words
that if we are going to do this we are going to have to cut what we have. So, I'm going to
offer up the first 215,000 dollars to implement funding that. Now, everybody is going to
hurt a little bit, nothing is necessarily entirely mission critical and I'm going to say -- but it's
City of Meridian Special Meeting Budget Workshop
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going to offend some of you, but I'm just throwing it out that this is the kind of stuff we
have to do. So, sitting here with -- and I have a totally different screen than what you all
are looking at. I have Todd's --
De Weerd: No, we are looking at it now.
Rountree: Well, yeah, okay. All right. But I can move mine up and down and you can't.
De Weerd: Okay.
Rountree: So, anyway --
De Weerd: I agree.
Rountree: So, here you go. And this is from folks that haven't even been up before us
yet. Out of Parks, 125,000 dollars to replace the lighting on Cox's field. Now, I know it's
bad, but it's still there. Although the program's growing, it will continue to grow, it can
happen, it can happen in the next year, maybe it can happen within the next year or it can
happen with some volunteers, whatever. Fifty-five thousand dollars for an assistant city
clerk that runs the passport program. Now, I know that's a great service to our
constituents, but it's also a great service to Ada county and I'm not sure that all of the city
taxpayers need to support that program for all of Ada county and Canyon county, by the
way. And out of Fire, don't implement half the AED program. Cut that 35,000 dollars,
plus or minus a few thousand. That's 215,000 dollars. Whether anybody is going to be --
their mission is going to be critically impacted -- granted, the softball program is going to
be slighted a little bit, some of the AED sites are not going to be fulfilled, but we don't have
to do everything at once and we haven't done that program all at once anyway. And the
passport -- that really and truly is of benefit to our citizens, but it's not necessarily that the
City of Meridian has to take on that expense, because that program is not paying for itself.
So, that's the kind of things we got to talk about. I don't know if we want to do that or not.
I'm not asking you to do it. Just as an example. We got to do it if we are going to walk the
talk.
De Weerd: Thank you, Mr. Rountree. I do think that with the passport program one of the
things that kind of fell off that discussion is if we want to discontinue the passport program
city clerks still needs a person and, then, that person is not funded. So, if you remove the
passports, then, you need to add -- add a cost, because the revenue is offset, now you
will change revenue coming in and expense will go up. So, you're not going to save
anything there. I just want to make sure you -- you know that. That will more add to the
cost than save it. That's what I understand. Is that correct?
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I'm not suggesting that, I'm playing with the numbers I got
before me.
De Weerd: I know and -- and I know that and it doesn't say that in the number, but I just
wanted to remind -- and maybe Jaycee can --
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Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, while Jaycee responds I will look up and see how much I
actually budgeted for it in revenue. It wasn't very much.
Holman: Madam Mayor, Council Member Rountree, yes, exactly. That was my only point
is we would lose that offsetting revenue also, but we would reallocate that position to fill
the needs that we need for the natural growth of our other areas and also to note Ada
county does not do passports anymore. So, the other option here -- if we stop doing it
here, the other option is down at Boise State or out in Canyon county and I think there
might be one somewhere out in Emmett or someplace like that. So, I just wanted to make
sure you knew that there is not an option in Ada county.
Milam: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mrs. Milam.
Milam: Councilman Rountree, I'm not in favor of cutting the passport position to find
something else to cut.
Rountree: I didn't suggest that. I said this is the kind of thing we have to do.
De Weerd: No one was taking it serious.
Rountree: That's the seriousness of doing this, though. Whatever we do is going to
create some kind push back. The bottom line is we got to do it, but we need to have the
conversation and I -- and I don't disagree with you. It's a great resource for people who
travel. Even going to Canada. I mean --
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: So, I guess my point is is it's not just about this position --
Rountree: No.
De Weerd: If you did away with the passports we have a position that's in place that,
then, would fill in for the needs of the clerk and now you need to fund it, because currently
it's offset. So, that was only my point.
Holman: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes.
Holman: Stacy just let me know that she budgeted 50,000 dollars in revenue against that
position for next year.
Kilchenmann: Fifty thousand in for your whole department.
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Holman: So, you would only be --
Kilchenmann: I didn't offset the whole position with revenue, I just budgeted 50,000
passport revenue.
Rountree: So, there is a savings there.
Borton: Madam Mayor? Oh.
De Weerd: I think, though, you're still not considering that 50,000 pays for a current
position and we have this new position request. Right? Okay.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: We can save a couple hundred thousand if we go back and if -- Bill, am I not right is
the fire contract not a two percent raise this year?
Nary: Yes.
Bird: And the reason I'm saying this is because we have always treated one employee
the same as the other employee. So, if you back a two percent raise throughout the city
you save over 200,000 right there.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, Councilman Bird, then, you need to go back to the
Enterprise Fund and reduce them, too.
Bird: That's true. We can do that.
Kilchenmann: I don't know if -- Patty, do you want to speak to what the -- what happens to
the way our matrix is if there is two percent, because the Fire is two percent across the
board and that means everyone in fire gets two percent. The merit pool is very different.
So, it means some people will get zero percent -- so, as long as that's clear, that there is a
big difference between the way that --
Bird: You're talking to somebody that don't believe in the merit thing, so you're not --
you're getting deaf ears here.
Kilchenmann: Okay. Well, what you're, in essence, doing is the Fire will all get two
percent and the people that are not in the STEP plan or the Fire plan will not get -- some
of them will get zero percent, some of them will get one percent.
Bird: Some of them will get four and five.
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Perkins: Stacy is correct. If we plug a two percent into the matrix for merit, that some will
get -- and that's the way it works now with the three percent. It is -- two percent is very
tough to differentiate a superior performer from a satisfactory performer on, but there is a
couple of ways that we could work with that. We could either do a flat increase to
everybody at two percent and that way you have exactly what your two percent is and that
really is, essentially, a COLA, a cost of living increase, or we could plug it into the matrix
and we work with varying levels of percent, hopefully to average out at two percent. So, it
depends on how we -- how we work with that.
De Weerd: Well, do we want to go through enhancement by enhancement and, then,
have these overall discussions? So -- or do you want to --
Rountree: Let's go through this, but we got to roll up our sleeves at some point after this.
De Weerd: You do.
Rountree: Yeah.
De Weerd: I know that Todd has ordered lunch. We thought we would do a working
lunch. So, whenever it gets here we will take a quick -- oh. Want to take a quick break,
grab a plat and, then, come back and roll up your sleeves and get to work. Okay. Okay.
We will break, then, for 20 minutes to get your feed on and, then, we will -- you can eat
and work at the same time.
(Recess: 11:46 a.m. to 12:04 p.m.)
De Weerd: Okay. I will go ahead and start our workshop and ask Steve if he would kick
us off with comments about his budget, some of the changes that have -- have happened
since we last met.
Siddoway: I come bearing potential solutions. Hopefully some good news and some
proposed cuts that will help save some money, so -- and help to cover the -- part of the
discussion that's been going on. So, the first one is related to our Five Mile Pathway
connections project enhancement and the good news there is a portion of this project -- in
fact, can we bring up the dot cam? So, this was the slide that was presented at the last
budget meeting and it lays out the different sections that we are planning to do with this
enhancement. Now, one of those is what was called Segment H and that's really the
extension of the piece that we have recently done from Pine down to Badley that we want
to get connected from Badley to Fairview. City Council in the last month has approved
some CDBG funding for that specific segment, so there is about 80,000 dollars of this
enhancement that I would propose that we cut, because it will be covered through the
CDBG budget that will come to us in next calendar year. So, there is a proposed 80,000
dollar reduction from that enhancement.
De Weerd: Well, Steve, while you're talking about that, I would just mention to Council
that -- Charlie and I talked -- Councilman Rountree and I talked about it on Friday is right
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now the Ada County Highway District commission is working at -- in follow up to questions
we have asked during our last meeting with them, as well as dusted off an old plan from
the Urban Land Institute that recommended that the commission consider a percentage or
some designated amount from your transportation dollars be allocated to the cities to
prioritize where those dollars should go. Our city has communicated an interest in
streetlighting, connected sidewalks, and pathways, which most cities use transportation
dollars for and so they are looking at a designated amount. Right now they are seeking
feedback to a proposal that Commissioner Woods is putting together, so I'm hoping that at
some point we are not looking at General Fund dollars to do some highly desired
improvements in our community from our citizens in terms of alternative forms of our
transportation that those transportation dollars should really be used for and -- rather than
our General Fund.
Siddoway: Sure.
De Weerd: So, I just wanted to note you that those conversations are going on and,
hopefully, we will have some -- some say in how our transportation dollars are used in our
community.
Siddoway: Madam Mayor, along those lines, it's probably worth noting that the majority of
our pathways in the city are still built through the development process by developers and
not even hitting our -- our budgets and that's one of the reasons why we have been
cognizant and thoughtful about the idea that, you know, the pathways are not currently
impact fee eligible, because we get new development to pay for new pathways. We are
only using city budget to build connections within existing parts of town. To charge impact
fees and, then, to also require them through the development process would be double
dipping. So, I think we get a better bang for our buck for pathway development with the
process we have going by having development construct those new pathways as we grow
and using the city's General Fund to -- and CDBG funds where ever we can and those
things to build the pathways in the existing parts of town and making those connections.
So, what's the next proposed cut? Item 3-B is the field house operations. Now, there is
an A and a B. There is a -- the balance of the -- the four million dollars we have been
talking about for years for a -- the field house funding. We still would like to get the capital
approved in this fiscal year. However, we cannot currently envision a scenario where we
would need to make tenant improvements or do operational expenses in FY-16. So, the
operational enhancement of 283,210, which is this one that was -- oh. Well, he got it up.
It's okay, you can leave it up here. The 283,210 we would propose could be cut from the
FY-16 budget, as long as we -- and we would propose to just keep the capital portion of
the field house. So, between those two, 283 and, then, another 80, that's 360,000 dollars
that we are cutting right there. It could fully fund the 350 that was just talked about or I
guess I would hope, maybe, that a portion of that could go towards the capital
improvement fund, if there is to be any donation to that that could be used in future park
projects. But there is -- there is some cuts.
De Weerd: Steve, can you also talk about the -- the lights?
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Siddoway: That's where I'm going next.
De Weerd: Okay.
Siddoway: So, the next one I want to talk about is the Cox field lighting. That one was not
a big surprise that it would come up. It was brought up during the last month's
discussions when we were challenged to go and look at what some options were. So, let
me just talk a little bit about the -- the basics, again, of the problem we are trying to solve
and, then, different options. So, if you can pull the -- this back up again. There we go.
Okay. So, the sports lighting at Harold Cox Field in Storey Park, there was some
discussion last time about when was it built. I want to tell you we did go out in the field
and looked at stickers on the actual poles for the year they were installed which was 1998.
So, that's the year that they were -- they were put in. Seventeen years ago. So,
replacement cost that we have in the budget today is 125,000. So, what are the options --
or, first of all, what are we trying to solve. So, this is maybe -- well, those numbers are too
small to read, but the numbers on there represent foot candle readings a different parts in
a baseball field. This is a typical that would meet the American -- the Amateur Softball
Association standards of 50 foot candles on the infield and 30 average on the outfield.
What -- we have done a look at what we have and, again, I know the numbers are kind of
small, so I will just tell you we have an average in our infield of about 22, as opposed to
the 50, and, then, the outfield we have got about 12 and a half, as opposed to the 30 and
in this area right here there is a lot of single digit numbers you can see that are six,
sevens, you know, foot candles that are very low. So, we are getting complaints that the
lighting conditions are low and poor and we would like to improve that. The full meal deal
option, which we thought was too much to even propose, was raising the poles and
putting them in the currently proper location based on design standards and that option
was about 275,000 dollars. We didn't even want to go there, because we knew how well
that would fly. But we decided to look at -- the option that's before you at 125 is let's keep
the existing poles at the existing height in the existing locations and replace the banks of
lights out with new and more efficient LED lights. One option could be less than that. If
we -- if we stick with the metal halide lights, the difference between the metal halide and
the LED is about 30,000. So, we can go from 125 down to 95, still replace all the banks of
lights and get new fixtures that are up and get a good quality system. I think that at
95,000 we could do that. That's a savings of 30,000 over even what was proposed. We
looked also -- you know, what if we keep the existing that are out there and only replace
the ballasts and the bulbs. You know, we could do that somewhere in the 30 to 40
thousand dollar range. The problem is we don't -- we don't think we are going to get that
big of a bump. They can't guarantee lighting levels for us with just a replacement of
ballasts and bulbs. So, don't -- I'm not feeling confident in that solution that it's going to
give us enough of a bump to know that we have made a significant improvement. Now, if
we -- if we are comfortable with a -- you know, a slight improvement, knowing that we will
have a slight improvement over what's there over -- you know, at least the next years,
then, the 30 to 40 thousand dollars could get us there. Ninety thousand dollars could get
us new banks of lights of the type that are out there, but the newer models and have the
cost savings over the LED type lighting. So -- and there is the do nothing alternative, I
guess, which we feel that something needs to be done, because we are just seeing those
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July 21, 2015
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low light levels as a -- as a problem. But I guess for discussion there are some different
alternatives to talk about.
De Weerd: Thank you, Steve. Council, any questions? Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor, if I understand it correctly, one of the advantages of going to
LED lights is not only better lighting, but cheaper electric costs -- cheaper operating costs
down the line. I know we could save something by not putting LEDs in, but do we cancel
a savings that we would get following up?
Siddoway: That's a great question. That is why, you know, we were interested in LEDs. I
may invite Garrett up, but he's talked with the lighting reps -- with one field of lights we
don't think the return on investment -- we are not going to get 30,000 dollars worth of
savings on electrical bills over ten years, so -- I don't think we would even get remotely
close to that. So, there is not -- there is not a matching return on investment from going
from metal halide to LED, though there is a savings. They use less electricity, which is
why we were initially drawn to them.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Steve, you say for 90,000 we put new fixtures and new ballasts and new lighting?
Siddoway: Yes.
Bird: New bulbs. Well, what's the difference of doing just the existing fixtures -- putting
new lights in? Is the fixtures -- is the fixtures part of the problem of the reason you're not
getting the light out there?
Siddoway: That it is my understanding. It's the lighting. It's the design. Garrett, maybe
invite you up and maybe address that question.
White: Madam Mayor and Councilman Bird, so the existing lights we have up there have
the big -- let's say cones --
Bird: Yes.
White: -- type lights. Well, those lights go up, down, sideway, all over.
Bird: It's not focused.
White: Not focused in. Exactly right. So, we are losing a lot of light everywhere else.
The new upgraded type of fixtures that I would like to put in there with the budget we have
would be the ones that are -- I would say more advanced, for lack of better words. They
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have different reflecting shields to focus light more in certain areas and control the light
better. If that makes sense.
Bird: Okay. It makes sense to me. Yes. Understand.
Cavener: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Cavener.
Cavener: Garrett, we appreciate your creative approach to this for -- I guess talk to me
about what improvements really we make if we cut this down. I mean if we -- if we go to a
different type of bulb, if we go to a different type of fixture, what type of improvement on
this lighting grid are we really going to see and where is that point where spending money
makes the most sense I guess is ultimately what I'm trying to get at.
White: Sure. Councilman Cavener, to answer that question I think what we are trying to
do is get more closer to the light levels that are kind of a national standard. Right now we
are getting about 35 to 40 percent of the light that we currently have. Like Steve
mentioned before in the infield we are supposed to have approximately or an average of
50 foot candles. We are right now at just below 22. So, in getting new fixtures in bringing
those light levels up to where when you're playing -- I mean it's just -- it's just -- it allows
the player to see the ball a lot better. It just improves the lighting situation for different
things. I hope that answers your question.
Cavener: Maybe a follow up if I can, Madam Mayor. So, Steve proposed a -- you know, a
smaller version, right around the 90,000 dollar mark. Where does that get us then -- how
close does that get us to that 50 foot candle --
White: Sure. And according to the light -- because I talked with them. They said they can
get extremely close to the 50 foot candle with that. Because the light height -- the height
right now they are currently about 45 feet tall, all of six of them that are there. Four of the
six are supposed to be at 60 feet. Two of the six are supposed to be at 70 feet. So, that's
how short they are and how low they are. So, the light manufacturer I just happened to
talk to was Musgrove Lighting and I spoke to them about have you done fields similar to
this with the same pole height and things like that and they said they have and they came
extremely close to the 50 foot candles in the front and in the infield. Same as -- and 30
foot in the outfield.
Cavener: Madam Mayor, one more follow up. Garrett, did you talk to any other lighting
folks or did you just speak to Musgrove directly?
White: I have talked with Musgrove directly and I also spoke with a local group Bright
Ideas here in town, talked with them, and he feels the same way with these lights, they
can get extremely close with that, so to answer your question, yes, I have talked to two
different lighting groups.
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Milam: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mrs. Milam.
Milam: So, based on what you have been telling us about the lighting and that we don't
have enough and they are not lit right, this has been a problem since they were installed,
this isn't because of the age of them; right?
White: Council Woman Milam, I believe it is the age of them. Right now they were put in
in '98. They are about 17 years old. So, they are getting towards the end of the life span
to keep adequate lights needed for the game of softball today.
Milam: Okay. But the -- sorry. But I was under the impression we just didn't have -- they
weren't the right height or we didn't have the right quantity, which has nothing to do with
the age of them.
White: So, it's kind of a mixture of everything. There is -- the light pole should be taller.
They should be.
Rountree: Excuse me. Excuse me. Get you off the hot seat there. I'm going to give you
a little history. And this goes back -- way back in time. But the lighting on that field was
donated Harold Cox, previous city clerk, and it was installed by his contractor and it was
installed and put in based on the standards at the time. It wasn't -- it wasn't an initiative
on the part of the city. So, we inherited that by virtue of a donation. Supposedly, then, it
met standards and I understand that it's worn out. But that's the history. It wasn't
something the city did and did inappropriately, it was done appropriately at the time, but
by someone else.
Milam: Okay. Thank you.
Rountree: Sometimes history helps. I don't know.
Milam: Yes. Definitely. Thank you.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Well, I mean in the history of that and the donation, it's met its lifespan, too.
Milam: Right.
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Steve, I think this is an awful nice offer back. It's 390 some thousand dollars. Let's
see if these other departments can come in and give us back some money, too. But I
appreciate this. I think -- I think the 90,000, while it won't be first class, it will be very
sufficient.
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White: It will be good.
Bird: And it will be so much better than it is tonight -- or now that they will think they are
playing in the light -- you know, they think they are playing in the daylight.
Siddoway: Any other questions for us right now?
Rountree: No. Madam Mayor, just a comment that it's kind of neat that just bringing up a
topic can result in that kind of budget savings and, again, I don't think anything you're
attempting to do is going to be compromised and I do appreciate you coming forward with
-- with the remainder of that information. It certainly helps not only to put some money
back into the capital improvement fund, but to get some money into that fund for public
safety and I think that's all of our goals and I appreciate that, Steve and Garrett. And I
didn't mean to bring up your lights to -- but it just was dangling there.
Siddoway: Yeah. All right. Thank you.
De Weerd: And I will tell that you Steve had come ready with that -- that he would have
offered it whether you said anything or not. So, appreciate that. Anything from any of our
other directors? Is there --
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes.
Kilchenmann: Luke had an idea.
De Weerd: He did?
Kilchenmann: He did.
De Weerd: Good job.
Cavener: She didn't say it was a good idea.
Kilchenmann: We have all these counter top do hickeys in here, so we actually -- we
decided not to do the emergency lighting. We still have that money in the City Hall capital
-- budget capital, so we would have to move it to operating, but it's -- the remediation --
that better not be --
Bird: You just made the papers.
Kilchenmann: But from the remediation budget that we could use and it won't save a ton
of money, but we could take those little odds and ends out for that. Does that make
sense?
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Rountree: Be more specific.
Kilchenmann: So, you know how we have all these -- there up on the screen we have all
the table tops -- table tops -- counter top modifications, so we have money in -- now in
City Hall capital improvements left over from the remediation -- what we call remediation.
Bird: Oh. Okay.
Kilchenmann: And we have -- you were going to do the generator -- the emergency
generator and you decided not to do it, so we could take these -- these counter top things
out and do them out of the existing budget.
Bird: That's, what, 15,000?
Kilchenmann: He will add them up.
Bird: Oh. I see. Okay.
Kilchenmann: Forty thousand.
Cavener: Madam Mayor, question for Stacy. I know it's not here on the City Hall, but I
know PD has got a counter top as well. Can that be covered as well or does that have to
-- because it's on City Hall --
Kilchenmann: Councilman Cavener, I think we already did that, so they said they were
going to have some money left over in their capital budget, so we took out -- Jeff might
need to help me out here.
Lavey: Madam Mayor, Councilman Cavener, completely different counter tops. This is a
stainless steel counter top for evidence processing, so it's completely different. But it's
already covered under the existing contract, so it's a mute point. It's already paid for.
De Weerd: Oh, that was your contribution, uh? We thought you were going to get up like
Steve did and say, Council, I have all these different ideas of savings.
Lavey: Madam Mayor, that was 115,000 dollars. That's only one part of it that we are
discussing right now.
Bird: What's Fire donating?
Kilchenmann: Look at Fire and you will see there is not a lot to donate.
De Weerd: You're going to start getting like the kids when they come with ten requests
and one kid comes with ten requests and they withdraw two and the other one comes with
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July 21, 2015
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two and you expect him to withdraw one. I think, you know, when -- so, I don't need to
say anymore.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: To the point Stacy made as to Luke's suggestion, that makes perfect sense to
me. I don't see a reason why you wouldn't do that.
Bird: Take it out.
De Weerd: Okay.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: I had a question for Steve on the full-time fabricator and design specialist
position. For Steve. Maybe for Finance as well. The enhancement request makes
reference to cost savings, taking it part time to full time in expenditures for outsourcing
that type of work. Is that a forecast of what those savings would be or are there actually
expenditures that we are incurring now to supplement our part time fabricator that we are
no longer going to be spending?
Siddoway: So, what you're asking is where does the projected savings come from?
Borton: Yes. Is it actual savings meaning we are doing the work of full time now?
Siddoway: Can you put this back up for me, please?
Borton: I believe it was enhancement number -- priority number five.
Siddoway: Yeah.
Borton: The numbers are there. I just didn't know if it was actual or forecasted.
Siddoway: So, it's based on -- we went back to a year's worth of projects and they are
listed here and we tried to input a dollar value to them with both shop materials for what it
costs us and, then, what the cost would be if we were to -- to contract that out. So, what
we are anticipating is that with the typical number of projects that we do in a year with that
shop that there would be a slight savings doing it in house ourselves with our own
equipment on our own terms than -- even if a fully loaded scenario. And just so you know,
we did -- the first time we calculated that we just put the -- the enhancement number in
that, which was just half the salary, but we did go -- the enhancement that you have has
the -- should be based on the full salary, not just the additional half. So -- am I
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complicating it? Basically, we looked at the -- the salary versus the -- the types of projects
we would be doing and compared that to contracting them out.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Uh-huh.
Borton: So, there is -- there would be a reduction somewhere reflected in the
expenditures of contracted fabricating that if this position is approved -- does that make
sense? Right? So, for example, we would -- if this isn't approved we are going to spend
next year 50,000 dollars on outsourced fabricating and if it is approved we are not going to
spend that.
Siddoway: And I'm going to call Roger up for some help, but the answer is no. We are
not -- there is not a budget we have been using to contract those out. We have been
pulling in other staff to make up the difference when our part-time fabricator has not been
available.
Borton: Okay. That answers it. Thank you.
Siddoway: Any other questions? Thank you.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Shall we go -- do you want to start at the top, Todd, with
the enhancements and -- so, you're able to take the counter -- the counter work out;
correct?
Cavener: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Cavener.
Cavener: Are we still talking replacements?
De Weerd: Oh. Sure.
Cavener: Chief, can you -- sorry.
De Weerd: Which chief?
Cavener: Yeah. Sorry. I realize they are both sitting over there. Jeff, can you talk to me
a little bit about the gym of -- the fitness training equipment that you said you are replacing
that's 13 years old. Is that something else that's also part of the training facility?
Lavey: Madam Mayor, Councilman Cavener, no, it's not. That is the original equipment
that was replaced in the -- it was purchased in the building in 2001 and, then, when we did
the remodel we actually had eliminated the fitness room and expanded into that area and
so in return we got rid of the equipment that was no longer serviceable, so we currently do
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not have -- we only have half of what had before and so that enhancement is to get us
back to the original that we had under our 2001 standards. So, it will be placed in a
different portion of the building.
Milam: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mrs. Milam.
Milam: So, Stacy, on the Fire Department, can their cubicle modification be included in
that as well?
Kilchenmann: Oh, yes.
Milam: Thank you.
Kilchenmann: Forgot about them -- and, then, I'm going to add a suite, we didn't include
them.
De Weerd: Can't take her anywhere. Okay. If we are done with replacements, what's --
are we? What -- we will start with the enhancements. Anything for Clerk or City Hall now
that as Todd begins to back all of that out? He did.
Borton: Madam Mayor, is line 149 also an item to back out?
Lavoie: Madam Mayor, Councilman Borton, that is a computer, so the question is we do
have some computers and we need to apply for the countertops I think.
Kilchenmann: Yeah. We usually don't --
Lavoie: So, I think it's best -- I think it's in the best interest we keep that in there as a
computer acquisition cost separate of the computer -- or the infrastructure development.
De Weerd: I guess you have moved from Clerk, City Hall. There is nothing in Finance.
HR. Any questions in that regard? Did you want to have conversation at this point -- I
know it's not an enhancement, but on the merit? Need any additional information from
Patty? I know -- I could have Mr. Nary talk to you about the difference between the three
percent that's -- that's being proposed as part of the -- or as part of this budget versus the
contract negotiations with the firefighters and why they are at the two percent. They have
different benefits than our regular employees and that cost difference was contemplated in
that increased difference. Any questions about that? Okay. In IT -- any questions in I T?
You have the Mayor's Office. And Other Government.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Rountree.
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Rountree: Was that first item funded or is that anticipated funding?
De Weerd: The first item? The public art?
Rountree: Public art.
De Weerd: It is funded.
Rountree: Okay. That's what I thought.
De Weerd: But I think they believe that the expenditure would not be until October.
Rountree: October. Okay.
De Weerd: I think they have already done the transfer?
Kilchenmann: No.
De Weerd: It seems like we sent a budget amendment on the 40,000 excepting the
money from the Urban Renewal District.
Kilchenmann: We did a budget amendment for the spending authority, but we haven't
gotten any money from them.
De Weerd: So, do we need it in this or --
Kilchenmann: No. We have it offset by revenue in here. Put zero zero. It's a zero.
De Weerd: I just wanted to --
Kilchenmann: Oh, I see what you mean. Why do we have --
De Weerd: Why is it in this year --
Kilchenmann: Right.
De Weerd: Next year's budget.
Kilchenmann: Because if we didn't have it in here we would probably just carry it forward,
so this way we have the revenue in here. I'm not sure why they did the -- why they did the
amendment. I'm not the art person. I could get the art person.
Milam: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mrs. Milam.
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Milam: I will try to help a little bit on this. I'm pretty sure the -- so, they are working on
getting the art installed and MDC isn't going to pay until the installation is complete, yet we
had to do a budget amendment for spending authority, so they could -- I guess have the
money when they needed it to pay the artist or if they had to pay a down payment up front
and that part I'm a little unclear.
De Weerd: Well, will the project be done by the end of this budget year?
Milam: I don't remember.
De Weerd: I know the open public comment period was through the end of July and --
Milam: It seems like they are hoping to have it -- we have to have it done before October.
Bird: I thought it was --
Rountree: We haven't seen anything on the selection, so --
De Weerd: The comment period is open until next week.
Rountree: Next week.
Kilchenmann: We will get Hillary to provide detail. But effect on the budget now is zero,
because --
De Weerd: And I understand that, but if it doesn't need to be at least even referenced --
Kilchenmann: We don't need it in there twice.
De Weerd: Okay. Any other questions under Other Government? Streetlights. Okay.
Rountree: The only question I have on that is not budget and maybe it's not appropriate
to ask Tom, but have we heard from ACHD on our letter?
Barry: We have.
Rountree: Okay. That's good.
De Weerd: No, we haven't.
Rountree: Okay.
De Weerd: Okay. We will move to Fire then. Chief, I know part of the -- the opening up
of discussion was looking at the AED program and seeing if we could fund half this year
and, then, come back and the next budget year to conclude the program or would this
conclude the program? This is -- what is the long term plan here?
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Niemeyer: Yes. Madam Mayor and Council, when we first brought this program there
was 64 AEDs needed to complete the entire program and that included putting all the
AEDs on the patrol cars. When we originally presented that we cut the AEDs in half and
were asked to bring that back the following year, which is this conversation. So, the 32
AEDs currently in this cost is to finish the project with the patrol cars. That being said, if
we are trying to find funding to put in the capital replacement and long term plan, we can
spread that out over the next two years if needed. If we look at priorities of replacing
critical infrastructure and apparatus at the cost of a new program, we understand that as
well. Still a very successful program. It's the right thing to do for our community, but if we
need to cut this request in half we can do that as well, if that means taking those funds
and putting them into a savings account or what we are trying to accomplish here.
Lavey: Madam Mayor, Council, I would like to add to that. We don't -- the Police
Department is really supportive of the AED program. We think it's a great thing and we
would like to see it funded. We don't see it as mission critical as to some of the other
things and in less than one year's time we went from zero to 12 AEDs in a patrol car. We
don't need to jump up to 24 in the next year, We are willing to forego adding those 12 in
the patrol cars, because we have 12 out there in the field at this time. So, I don't know
what those figured out to, but it's a little over 15,000 dollars or something, so -- I mean we
are supportive, we would like to see them there, but if you ask me is it mission critical, no.
Is it something that we as a city are trying to achieve as to make our city healthier and
safer, then, it definitely does that.
De Weerd: So, chief, they are portable. Do they have to be assigned to one car or can't
they just be in any of the cars?
Lavey: Madam Mayor, Council, they are now. We actually transfer them from car to car.
We actually -- they are assigned to a particular car, but if we need one you just grab one
out now. So, that's exactly how we would do it.
De Weerd: So, how many cars do you have out at any one time?
Lavey: It depends on the shift schedule. Anywheres from six to 20.
De Weerd: So, you have 12 now. What would eight cost, Chief Niemeyer?
Niemeyer: Roughly -- I'm going to take a stab. About 9,500 dollars. I believe they are
about 1,200 dollars apiece.
De Weerd: And what is the remaining of the program? Were all the AEDs that you were
requesting to go into patrol cars?
Niemeyer: Also to finish out a few of the parks -- the parks needs as well.
De Weerd: And how many would complete that?
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Niemeyer: I would have to come back with that number.
De Weerd: Okay. Come back with that number.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Mark, on your salary adjustments with the division chiefs, would you explain that to
me? Is it changing job description or what?
Niemeyer: Councilman Bird, this was -- this was a part of a market adjustment. Three
years ago the -- or two years ago the city started undertaking a project to look at market
adjustments. The Fire Department the last two years did not participate in that. The first
year was the city employees. Last year was the police department. We have been
working with HR for the last two years on evaluating market value for those specific ranks.
So, that is what this request represents.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: Your questions on the AED program in light of what we have heard, if reducing
that figure to 33,000, cutting it in half, still allows the acquisition of enough devices to
insure that every patrol car on duty, up to 20 perhaps, will have them in their units, that
seems like that is a feasible way to split that expenditure? Am I saying that -- an accurate
break of the figure?
Niemeyer: Councilman Borton, yes. And to follow up -- the beauty of technology and text
messaging. Parks needs five AEDs to finish out the parks program. This request also did
include, as you recall, two of those pedestals that would make the AEDs in the parks --
and are looking at Kleiner Park and I believe Settlers, Steve? To make those readily
accessible to the public 24/7. That is a cost if we are not ready to move on that, that is
something to consider as well. Currently right now at the parks those AEDs are within the
-- help me out -- concession stands, so they are only available when an event is going on.
So, the request for the AEDs did include two of those pedestals that are 24/7 accessible.
De Weerd: And those pedestals also include an anti-theft type of --
Niemeyer: They do. It's an anti-theft. It has a direct connection to 911, so when the
button is pushed the VAD cabinet unlocks, you can get the AED and, then, you have
direct access to a 911 operator.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
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De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Bird.
Bird: Okay. For this 57 -- how many -- how many of the units is that, Mark, total then?
Niemeyer: I believe -- I'd have to go back to the request. I believe it was 32 to finish out
the entire program. There was 64 originally planned based on all of the city needs. That's
Water, Wastewater, Parks, Fire Department, Police Department.
De Weerd: So, that's 25 to the Police Department and five to the Parks Department. And,
then, the two notification towers. It would be in addition to that.
Bird: I -- let's see if we can't get 60, 70 thousand out somewhere else. I think this is a
very important program in my -- in my eyes, especially to have them in the parks. Patrol
cars I guess are taken care of. We could take care of them and I would like to see them in
our wastewater and water facilities if possible.
De Weerd: And they are. Chief, if you could cost out the -- the parks, the towers, and
eight more for the police department, so they have a total of 20, can you bring back the
cost to that?
Niemeyer: I can.
De Weerd: Okay.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, we have determined -- the art department over here
determined we do need to leave that -- that enhancement in there. We haven't done an
amendment for it, so it's anticipated not to be spent until FY-2016.
De Weerd: Thank you to the art department under the cloak of Finance. Okay. Okay.
We are in Parks. We have had considerable conversation about Parks. If you would like
to go through it and have additional discussion.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: It appears that Parks number three -- Parks number three needs to be removed.
De Weerd: Three -- no. The other three.
Borton: The other three. Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: Parks number eight, reduces by 80,000 dollars, I believe.
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De Weerd: Yeah. They have it offset by 11.
Borton: Over there. Okay.
De Weerd: Yeah. Okay. Anything further in Parks? Okay. Let's look at Police.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, just a fun question for the chief. Do we get any kind of
royalties for the use of your vehicles and your staff in advertising?
Lavey: I'm not sure I know what you're getting at, so --
Rountree: Well, it was just an ad I saw -- an ad I saw on TV last night for our water park.
Lavey: Oh. No. That was an off-duty thing, so there is no royalties there.
Rountree: I figured --
De Weerd: Off duty in full uniform.
Lavey: That was a community service thing.
Rountree: That was a great -- it was a great ad. I enjoyed it.
De Weerd: I think he enjoyed doing it.
Rountree: He looked like he was enjoying it.
Lavey: He was selected for that purpose. He was probably the only one that has that
charisma to do that.
Milam: Who did it?
De Weerd: Stoy.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: It moves perhaps in another direction, but for what it's worth, the evidence
presented on the -- not evidence. Explanation.
Rountree: Sounds like a lawyer.
Borton: God. On the evidence vault shelving, that appeared to be an enhancement which
seemed worthy perhaps of reconsideration. I don't know if we can add it back in, but I
thought that explanation, in light of the need, was compelling.
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De Weerd: Is it funded.
Lavey: It's included.
De Weerd: It's funded.
Lavey: So, Madam Mayor, Council, just to -- I will probably forget which ones they are,
but just so you're aware, the -- the evidence counter top -- the evidence shelving, some
replacement perimeter cameras, which -- there is two other items that they are withdrawn
on here, because they are -- because of the cost savings in the construction we were
approximately 350,000 dollars in the black and we are using some of those construction
monies to cover those expenses, instead of forwarding an enhancement for FY-16. So,
they look like they are being cut and they are being cut out of the FY-16, but they are
being funded other ways.
Borton: Madam Mayor. That sounded like I was extremely persuasive when I asked for
that and -- and it's done.
Lavey: It's magic. That's the power you have. You got it just like that.
Borton: Sorry I missed that.
De Weerd: Okay. Anything further on that? Todd, do you want to show us where we are
at? Slower, please.
Bird: Are you going to give us some back again?
Siddoway: Yeah. I got another 10,000 for you. Thanks to -- if you go up to the
replacements, I think for the lights you only reduced them to 105. You can take another
ten off. Thanks.
De Weerd: We have always appreciated your integrity there, Steve.
Lavoie: So, Madam Mayor, as you can see as it stands right now you're in the positive
534,611. I know the last item that we had discussed was the Fire Department AEDs, but
you're in a positive at the moment without the AED consideration at the moment.
De Weerd: Well, we do want the AED consideration, so it will get better then.
Borton: Madam Mayor? Where is the -- the one percent? Did it move up to the top? I
saw it at the bottom earlier.
Kilchenmann: Okay. We will put it in there.
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Lavoie: I will go ahead and add it in there, Council Member Borton. It's going to be
350,000 dollars more the positive -- or the reduction, because it's going to be an automatic
expense transfer, so taking it off 350, I will go ahead and a work on it right now.
Borton: Wasn't it in there? You did all the --
Lavoie: It wasn't -- there was a misunderstanding over here in the arts department.
Borton: Okay.
Lavoie: We can get it in there. It's a 350,000 dollars --
Bird: Less.
Lavoie: -- number. I will work on it for you.
De Weerd: So --- which should make it to about 200,000 in the positive.
Bird: A hundred and --
De Weerd: Well, after --
Bird: After you dig 350,000 out of that.
Borton: Madam Mayor, as Todd is doing that -- and maybe to answer -- or at least
comment on Stacy's question as far as us being in the positive or not in the positive, one
of the considerations in looking at the budget as a whole -- turning back to Stacy's
comment at the very start of today was -- you know, we did a balanced budget and there
is different ways to look at that and it's one where the expenditures exceed the revenues
that are brought in and it's a use of fund balance again, which happens in the normal
course, but what's reflected to us on the bottom also shows the ending fund balance and
in order to balance this budget, the percentage of the existing fund balance, which is
utilized to make that occur and the percentages are going to change now, because we
may be utilizing a little bit less. The 2.1 from fund balance looks like it's going to go to
about 1.8 million, so another way to look at it is we are -- we are dipping into our savings
beyond our available revenue to meet these needs, so --
De Weerd: But, Mr. Borton, I guess -- we have put together a capital improvement plan
to, number one, work on setting our impact fees. Number two, show our community the --
the needs and how we were going about funding it.
Borton: Right.
De Weerd: The impact fees substantiate that, but we have always said we save and,
then, we spend on those needs. You have to save somewhere and -- and that's why you
put the capital improvement plan together. So, it is a portion of General Fund and a
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portion of impact fees as prescribed by state law. So, I think if -- if we -- Council has --
has found a significant savings in the past and said we have to invest in our capital
improvement plan. We -- and look for what those expenditures are in the future and I
think that's really what you're doing.
Borton: Madam Mayor? I don't disagree. I'm not saying that it should or shouldn't
happen, all I'm making reference to when I looked at it is the burn rate of reserves and do
we at some point, in light of what Finance has brought up, the near future expenditures
from a fire station operation to rec center operations potential, to things like that that -- it
may be just a cautionary awareness at least for me that utilizing 30 percent of the ending
fund balance is not a sustainable burn rate and it fluctuates year to year. There was a
graph that we have been provided, which -- that Finance sent around that talked about,
you know, from year to year, how that ending fund reserve fluctuates, but the -- the tough
decisions that we make here and Councilman Rountree brought up that we have to
discuss, that -- you know, that figure on the bottom really illustrates the importance of
making those -- these difficult decisions and choices.
De Weerd: Agreed. And I appreciate you bringing that up. I think moving forward -- and
I'm thrilled to have IT sitting in this room, because I think you have heard it referenced a
couple of times today -- priority based budgeting. That's going to give a better tool to
Council in knowing not only department performance, but program performance and how
it fits within the budget priorities. Next step is also -- so, priority based budgeting project is
-- it's high priority. I know IT is thrilled to hear that. The second piece to that is really
looking at the capital improvement plan and making it fiscally constrained and that's going
to be another important aspect over this coming year is making sure that there is
accountability, so when you look at using fund balance you know exactly where you're
going and why you're doing it and it makes complete sense. So, those are two things that
we look forward to moving towards over this next year and continuing to make in a more
deliberate conversation and discussion. Do you have numbers?
Niemeyer: Madam Mayor, I do. Again, technology is great. So, going with the
discussion, police need eight AEDs for their patrol cars. The new training center was
slated for two and based on the numbers of people that are going to be going through that
type of work, we would like to continue that and, then, the five for parks is 15 AEDs, plus
the two pedestals that were discussed that were asked to stay in, so that new amount
would be 45,455, so a reduction of 22,132 if we go that route.
De Weerd: So, just about 200,000, uh?
Kilchenmann: The Arts Department missed exactly what he said, but -- oh, wait. Not the
whole arts.
De Weerd: I think we need to get Finance back.
Niemeyer: You want that number, Todd?
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Lavoie: I believe we are good.
Borton: Madam Mayor? Is it worth the discussion, maybe a question for the chief on the
-- back to the fleet coordinator position. Is that position so specific to police or in light of
the number of vehicles and the variety we have citywide is it potential for a position like
that to coordinate the fleet for all city vehicles?
Lavey: Madam Mayor and Councilman Borton, that discussion has occurred numerous
times over the -- the many many years in regards to servicing our own vehicles,
outsourcing our own vehicles, in-house fleet coordinators, outsource fleet coordinators
and so I'm not sure I can answer that specific question. I can just tell you that we
currently have a sworn administrative sergeant that covers the patrol cars and the building
needs. That's all he does. And we have increased our cars in our department many,
many, many times and we are to the point where we have 77 cars assigned to the police
department. This one person only does patrol cars right now. We are looking at a civilian
position at a much cheaper rate that would coordinate all cars within the Police
Department, but as far as this one person being able to do the entire city, I don't think
that's possible. We are also not -- you know, if you're going to get into a fleet coordinator
position we also look at software, fleet maintenance software, and do we have it ourselves
or do we outsource it. We currently use an outsourcing facility that keeps track of all of
our vehicle maintenance needs for that. So, this person is going to be in charge of
procuring new vehicles, building new vehicles, and maintaining those new vehicles. I'm
not sure one person is going to be able to handle that just for our needs, let alone the
entire city. So, that concept is welcomed, we have discussed it many, many times. We
are going to be in the position in the city that has to make that decision some day. I don't
know when that time will be, but based upon our calculations work in Public Works, in
Finance and some of the other departments, you know, looking at your return on
investment, we are just not to that point yet.
Borton: Okay.
De Weerd: Are we missing something, Council?
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: Is it -- it seems to be the time also where we circle back and make the discussion
on the recommendations concerning Council and Mayor compensation.
De Weerd: Oh, yeah.
Borton: Is that for now?
De Weerd: I think so.
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Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: My recommendation is to keep the Council's pay as is and I have no problem with
giving the Mayor the raise as recommended. Let the others jump in.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: I agree with what Council Bird said. I would support keeping the Council pay
the same, giving the Mayor the suggested raise or raises, but I would also like to add the
additional for the president.
Milam: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mrs. Milam.
Milam: I wasn't present for the original discussion, but I did watch the YouTube video, so I
think I'm pretty well caught up. So, I mean, obviously, like was said, none of us are in this
for the money, because, otherwise, we wouldn’t be here. So, that being said, to have a
committee put in as much time and energy as they do and, then, not accept the
recommendation that they give, is -- it's kind of like a slap in the face to some extent, so --
to them. And I -- you know, I don't know how they would feel about that or how that is, but
there is a lot of people putting in a lot of time and energy and research and, then, we say,
okay, well, thank you for that. Sorry, but we are not going to take it is kind of rude.
Cavener: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Cavener.
Cavener: I appreciate Council Woman Milam's comments. However, I think that that's
what that group is tasked to do is to give us a recommendation and, then, it is our job to
make that final decision. I think all six of us now with Councilman Milam voicing her
appreciation for that group, I was very appreciative for their feedback and their insight and
what has been of value is that we, as a body, have taken that input to heart and our
upcoming with our own recommendation which we think is best. So, if I were on that
group I would not take it as an insult. I have been very appreciative of their feedback.
That said, I tend to agree with Councilman Zaremba in a no increase for Council
Members, an increase for the Mayor and increase for Council President. I would be -- I
think that's the right decision both for us as a Council and for our community.
Bird: Let's hear from that side.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
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De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: I agree. With regard to the recommendation for the Mayor's compensation and
acknowledging the role of Council President. But I wouldn't change anything else. I don't
think that's necessary.
Rountree: And I said before, I'm not going to be a beneficiary of this action, but I will -- I
will support the statement put forward by the Council Members that are going to proceed
me, so I can -- I can support the recommendation that Luke and Joe and Councilman
Milam have presented.
Bird: Mayor, let's put it in.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, we don't know what it is.
Bird: What?
Kilchenmann: We don't know what the amount is that we --
Rountree: It's not going to break the budget, I know that.
Kilchenmann: No, I'm sure it's not quite --
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I have the amendment in front of me and
there is only going to be a slight change, if I understand what the Council's discussion is.
The increase recommended was for the Mayor's salary to increase to 86,625 in 2016 and
90,956 in 2017. The Council Members amount was -- it's going to remain fixed. The
recommendation from the committee was to increase the Council President by ten percent
above what the Council makes. So, I think the Council is currently 10,000 per year, so it
would be 11,000 for the next two years for the Council President position. So, it's slightly
different than the memo. I just wanted to put that on the record. If that's the Council's
direction I will prepare an ordinance. An ordinance has to be approved by you by August
11th. If that's your direction I can bring you an ordinance next week.
Bird: I would suggest that.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor, that works for me.
De Weerd: Okay. Any other business?
Bird: We got to get Tom, don't we?
City of Meridian Special Meeting Budget Workshop
July 21, 2015
Page 74 of 76
De Weerd: Oh, yeah. You don't have an innocent look even if you try. Did you see him?
Anything?
Cavener: Thanks to the arts department for their help today.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Can I project one thing? Let's -- we will leave the three percent in, but everybody
give it a thought of what -- what's transpired here on the deal and -- and I kind of -- for this
year think about what Patty said that we give everybody a two percent COLA raise and I
would also like to ask Patty if she could, before our public hearing, come back and kind of
go over the last couple of years and what percent -- what we went from on the merit, like
zero to five or ten percent, what we did, because I -- do you have any way of knowing
that, Patty? Good. If you could let us know some of that I would appreciate it. I want to
know how many got five or six or ten and how many got zero percent on the merit raise.
De Weerd: Good luck following this conversation, Dean.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: A couple of things. If we are done, which I think we are, for today, at least for me,
splitting this process into two days allowed us, I think, to get a little more into the detail to
be able to make even more educated difficult decisions. So, as clumsy as it might have
been, it might continue to improve. So, a big thank you to Finance and to all of the
directors who had to kind of wait in the fog a little bit as we split this into two days. I
thought it was very helpful. One thing in particular. I thought it was helpful to focus the
discussion that Councilman Rountree brought up and at least from what I have seen and
we are talking about burn rates and unrestricted fund balance, the city, looking back over
the years, has been blessed with extremely conservative fiscal management, starting with
Finance in its forecasting and to this Council. Councilman Rountree has been a big part
of that over many, many, many years and it's not surprising, quite frankly, that he starts
the discussion this afternoon to kind of focus our efforts on difficult decisions. So, the city
is, as I say, has lots of blessings. This process has shown that. Hats off to Councilman
Rountree over many years of service and kind of shepherding this process and helping us
even today make tough decisions.
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor, I second all that. That was -- that was excellent. I would also
add I would appreciate -- I appreciated the fact that the two days were not back to back.
City of Meridian Special Meeting Budget Workshop
July 21, 2015
Page 75 of 76
Having the time between them to munge it over in the head and have other people looking
at variations as well I think was excellent and appreciated that.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: Just my thanks to staff, the directors, the Mayor for pulling the budget together.
The Council for putting up with my lectures. I think we continue to improve the way we go
about our charge. I hope that it will continue to get refined and that there is no offense
taken by some of the things that we ask and/or request. We are simply trying to do our
job and I think it's a job that all of you take as well in being part of our community and
appreciate the time and effort that the Council has put in on this. I can heat my house for
a couple days with the budget book when I go home.
De Weerd: Oh, no.
Rountree: But, yeah, thank you so much for the help and the direction, really and truly.
De Weerd: And I hope our directors go back and share with our staff Council's
appreciation. I know they and you have all been at work on this since January. It's a
great way to start the new year with reminders from Finance, from base budget line item
discussions, to enhancements, compensation, all of that. There is a lot of work that goes
into it and it is all appreciated. So, we will have some continued conversations upcoming
for fall after we get this wrapped up and we start bringing those discussions back to you
on your workshop agendas and we appreciated your -- your insight and your direction and
we look forward to continuing the discussion.
Rountree: See you all at 6:00.
De Weerd: Okay. Do I have a motion to adjourn?
Bird: So moved.
Milam: Second.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Oh, Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Do we need to make a motion to have this published before the hearing?
Rountree: No.
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, Councilman Zaremba, Todd will have to make this be more
than it is now, so you will do that next week, in other words.
City of Meridian Special Meeting Budget Workshop
July 21, 2015
Page 76 of 76
Zaremba: Okay. It doesn't require a motion from us?
Rountree: You're going to see it again.
De Weerd: Yes. You're going to see it a couple more times. Okay. So, I have a motion
and a second to adjourn. All those in favor say aye. All ayes.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 1:20 P.M.
(AUDIO RECORDING ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
MAYOR TAMMY De WEERD DATE APPROVED
r 0
ATTEST:
JAYCEE HOL , &1T-Y—CL_ RSC
Meridian City Council Meeting
DATE: July 21, 2015 ITEM NUMBER:
PROJECT NUMBER:
ITEM TITLE: Budget Meeting Presentation
MEETING NOTES
Community Item/Presentations Presenter Contact Info./Notes
CLERKS OFFICE FINAL ACTION
DATE:
E-MAILED TO
STAFF
SENT TO
AGENCY
SENT TO
APPLICANT
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