HomeMy WebLinkAbout2012-04-24E IDIAl`~T =--
CITY COUNCIL REGULAR
MEETING AGENDA
Tuesday, April 24, 2012 at 7:00 PM
1. Roll-Call Attendance
X David Zaremba X Brad Hoaglun
X Charlie Rountree X Keith Bird
X Mayor Tammy de Weerd
2. Pledge of Allegiance
3. Community Invocation by Stephanie Moore with Ten Mile Christian
Church
4. Adoption of the Agenda Adopted
5. Proclamation
A. Proclamation for Parkinson's Awareness Month
6. Consent Agenda Approved
A. Approve Minutes of April 10, 2012 City Council Workshop
Meeting
B. Approval of 2012-2013 Beer, Wine and Liquor License Renewal
Applications as follows:
~EI Tenampa 906 N. Main St. BWL
Dickeys BBQ Pit 2845 E. Overland Rd. B
Schooners 499 S. Main St. BWL
Fred Meyer#198 1850 E. Fairview Ave. BW
~Louies Pizza 8~ Italian2500 E. Fairview Ave. BWL
~Smashburger 3223 E. Louise #100 BW
Legacy Feed Sz Fuel 3100 S. Meridian Rd. BW
~Gino's 3015 W. McMillan Rd. #108 BWL
Sunrise Cafe 805 Main BWL
-Don Diegos 2951 Overland #190 BW
Smoky Mtn Pizza 980 Fairview Ave. BWL
Firehouse Grill 1767 W. Franklin Rd. #180 BWL
~Whitewater Pizza 3223 E. Louise #104 BWL
MUSE 1435 N. Eagle Rd. BW
Varsity Kitchen 1441 N. Eagle Rd. #200 BWL
Meridian City Council Meeting Agenda -Tuesday, April 24, 2012 Page 1 of 6
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documen ts and/or hearing,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
-Ricks Press Room 130 E. Idaho Ave. BWL
-The Griddle 2310 E. Overland Rd. # 130 BW
Meridian Speedway 335 S. Main St. BW
Bill n Lynns Place 229 W. Franklin BWL
~Walgreens #06200 1570 E. Fairview Ave. BW
~Walgreens #10197 3150 W. Cherry Ln. BW
~Walgreens #10604 1625 S. Meridian Rd. BW
~Walgreens #11452 3263 N. Eagle Rd. BW
Corkscrews 729 N. Main St. BW
-Rudys Pub n Grill 2310 E. Overland Rd. BWL
~Walgreens #11687 4850 N. Linder Rd. BW
~Shige Teriyaki Exp. 450 S. Meridian BW
~Piua Hut 2165 675 S. Progress B
-Pizza Hut 2166 1752 Cherry Lane B
New Frontier Club 116 E. Broadway BWL
-Brewforia Beer Mkt. 3030 E. Overland Rd. #100 BW
C. Recreational Pathway Easement between Penn Station
Apartments LLC a nd the City of Meridian
D. Approval of Award of Bid and Agreement for "Pine Street
Sewer Connector" to Brown Construction, Inc. for the Not-To-
Exceed amount of $204,323.75
E. Approval of Award of Bid and Agreement for "Water Line
Replacement - W Carlton NW 11th to Washington Dr. & W
State" to Dahle Construction, LLC for the Not-To-Exceed
amount of $258,034.00
F. Approval of Award of Bid and Agreement for "Sewer Main
Replacements Sites 10A, 10B & 11" to Cascade Pipeline
Corporation, Inc. for the Not-To-Exceed Amount of $123,083.00
G. Third Addendum to the RIMI Professional Services Contract
for Performing Mechanical Plan Review and Inspection
Services
H. Resolution No. 12-849: Adopting Analysis of Impediments to
Fair Housing Choice Report and Fair Housing Action Plan
I. Second Amendment to Development Agreement for Knight
Sky MDA 11-011 Spurwing Challenge by The Club at Spurwing,
LLC Located Northwest Corner of Chinden Boulevard and N.
Linder Road Request: Amend the Recorded Development
Agreement (Inst. #106122365) for the Purpose of Excluding the
Property AND Creating a New Development Agreement to
Include a New Project Boundary and Concept Plan for the
Meridian City Council Meeting Agenda -Tuesday, April 24, 2012 Page 2 of 6
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearing,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
Proposed Spurwing Challenge Subdivision Moved to Item
8A/Approved with Conditions (Pg 20-23)
J. Development Agreement AZ 11-005 and RZ 11-006 Spurwing
Challenge by The Club at Spurwing, LLC Located Northwest
Corner of Chinden Boulevard and North Linder Road Request:
Annexation of 30 Acres of Land with an R-8 Zoning District
and Rezone of 51.61 Acres of Land from R-4 (Medium Low-
Density Residential) and TN-C (Traditional Neighborhood
Commercial) to R-8 (Medium-Density Residential) (46.97 Acres)
and C-C (Community Business) (4.64 Acres) Zoning Districts
Moved this to Item 8B/Approved with Conditions (Pg 20-23)
7. Community Items/Presentations
A. Meridian Environmental Excellence Awards Presentation
(Pg 5-7)
B. Presentation by Douglas Jones with Growers for
Biotechnology Regarding the Idaho Watershed Solutions
Grant (Pg 7-17)
8. Items Moved From Consent Agenda 61 and 6J moved to 8A and 8B
(Pg 20-23)
9. Action Items
A. Continued from April 10, 2012: Public Comment on Proposed
Outdoor Sales and Temporary Uses Code Update -Increased
Time Limits for Temporary Sales Units and Garage Sales,
Temporary Construction Site Standards (Pg 23-24)
B. Continued from April 10, 2012: Ordinance No. 12-1506: First
Reading -Outdoor Sales and Temporary Uses Code Update,
Increasing Time Limits for Temporary Sales Units and Garage
Sales, Adding Standards for Temporary Construction Sites
First Reading (Pg 25-27)
C. Public Comment on Proposed Ordinance Regarding Smoking
Product Sales and Consumption (Pg 25-27)
D. Ordinance No. 12-1509: Smoking Product Sales and
Consumption Approved (Pg 25-27)
Meridian City Council Meeting Agenda -Tuesday, April 24, 2012 Page 3 of 6
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearing,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
E. Public Hearing: TEC 12-007 Solitude Place by M2 Land, LLC
Located Southeast Corner of N. Meridian Road and E. McMillan
Road Request: Two (2) Year Time Extension on the Preliminary
Plat in Order to Obtain the City Engineer's Signature on a Final
Plat Approved (Pg 28-29)
F. Public Hearing: VAR 12-001 Meridian and Amity by Hawkins
Companies Located West Side of S. Meridian Road, Between
W. Amity Road and W. Harris Street Request: Variance to UDC
11-3H-4 Which Prohibits New Approaches from Directly
Accessing a State Highway to Allow Three (3) Access Points,
Two (2) Right-In/Right-Out Access Points at the Eighth Mile
and One (1) Right-In/Right-Out/Left-In Access Point at the
Quarter Mile to S. Meridian Road (State Highway 69) Continued
to May 8, 2012 (Pg 29-65)
10. Department Reports
A. Mayor's Office: Mayor's Youth Advisory Council (MYAC)
Update
Moved to 7C (Pg 17-20)
B. Mayor's Office: Budget Amendment for State of the City for a
Not-to-Exceed Amount of $7,870.00 Continued to May 1, 2012
(Pg 65-66)
C. Police Department: Budget Amendment for Department of
Juvenile Corrections (DJC) FFY10 Enforcement of Underage
Drinking Laws (EUDL) Awards for aNot-to-Exceed Amount of
$10,350.00 Approved (Pg 66-67)
D. Police Department: Budget Amendment for Miscellaneous
Donations for aNot-to-Exceed Amount of $3,200.00 Approved
(Pg 66-67)
E. Clerk's Office: Approval of 2012-2013 NEW LIQUOR License
Application for DKF Investments dba Harry's Hideaway Bar
and Grill located at 2032 E. Overland Rd. Suite 130. Approved
with conditions (Pg 68-69)
F. Clerk's Office: Approval of 2012-2013 NEW LIQUOR License
Application for KJ's Restaurants dba JB's Restaurant located
1565 S. Meridian Rd. Approved with conditions (Pg 68-69)
Meridian City Council Meeting Agenda -Tuesday, April 24, 2012 Page 4 of 6
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearing,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
G. Clerk's Office: Approval of 2012-2013 Beer, Wine and Liquor
License Applications as follows:
~Qdoba Mexican Grill #473 3068 Overland Rd. BW
Qdoba Mexican Grill #474 3319 N. Eagle Rd. BW
~Jakers Bar & Grill 3268 E. Pine Ave. BWL
Red Robin 1475 N. Eagle Rd. BWL
-Brew52 501 S. Main St. BWL
Items in blue were moved to consent agenda. Approved with Conditions
(Pg 68-69)
H. Fire Department: Approval of Award of Bid for "Smoke
Alarms" to Lowes Home Centers and Business Services and
Authorize the Purchasing Manager to Issue Purchase Orders
for aNot-to-Exceed Total of $98,940.50 Approved (Pg 69-70)
I. Amended onto the Agenda: Legal Department: Discussion on
ACHD Impact Deferral Agreement (Pg 70-72)
11. Ordinances
A. Ordinance No. Massage Therapist
License Ordinance Revisions
Removed from the agenda
B. Ordinance No. 12-1510: An Ordinance (AZ 11-005) for the
Annexation of a Parcel of Land Situated in a Portion of the S'/Z
of the Southeast '/4 and in a Portion of the Southwest '/4 of
Section 23, Township 4 North, Range 1 West, of Meridian
Idaho, Establishing and Determining the Land Use Zoning
Classification of Said Lands from RUT to R-8 (Medium Density
Residential) and Providing an Effective Date Approved with
Conditions (Pg 72-75)
C. Ordinance No. 12-1511: An Ordinance (RZ 11-006) for the Re-
Zone of a Parcel of Land Situated in a Portion of the South '/z
of the Southeast '/4 of Section 23, Township 4 North, Range 1
West, of Meridian Idaho, Establishing and Determining the
Land Use Zoning Classification of 4.64 Acres of Land from the
R-4 (Medium-Low Density Residential) Zoning District and TN-
C (Traditional Neighborhood Center) Zoning District to C-C
(Community Business District) Zoning District and Providing
an Effective Date Approved with Conditions (Pg 72-75)
D. Ordinance No. 12-1512: An Ordinance (RZ 11-006) for the Re-
Zone of a Parcel of Land Situated in a Portion of the South '/z
of the Southeast'/4 of Section 23, Township 4 North, Range 1
Meridian City Council Meeting Agenda -Tuesday, April 24, 2012 Page 5 of 6
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearing,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
West, of Meridian Idaho, Establishing and Determining the
Land Use Zoning Classification of 46.97 Acres of Land from
the R-4 (Medium-Low Density Residential) Zoning District and
TN-C (Traditional Neighborhood Center) Zoning District to R-8
(Medium Density Residential) Zoning District and Providing an
Effective Date Approved with Conditions (Pg 72-75)
12. Future Meeting Topics None
Adjourned at 10:36 p.m.
Meridian City Council Meeting Agenda -Tuesday, April 24, 2012 Page 6 of 6
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearing,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
Meridian City Council April 24, 2012
A meeting of the Meridian City Council was called to order at 7:00 p.m., Tuesday, April
24, 2012, by Mayor Tammy de Weerd.
Members Present: Mayor Tammy de Weerd, David Zaremba, Keith Bird, Brad Hoaglun
and Charlie Rountree.
Others Present: Bill Nary, Jaycee Holman, Pete Friedman, Bill Parsons, Warren
Stewart, Bruce Chatterton, John Overton, Mark Niemeyer, Tim Curns, Molly Mangerich
and Dean Willis.
Item 1: Roll-call Attendance:
Roll call.
X David Zaremba X Brad Hoaglun
X Charlie Rountree X Keith Bird
X Mayor Tammy de Weerd
De Weerd: Well, I would like to welcome all of you to our City Council meeting. We
appreciate having friendly faces out in the crowd. So, welcome. For the record it is
Tuesday, April 24th. It's 7:00 p.m. We will start with roll call attendance, Madam Clerk.
Item 2: Pledge of Allegiance
De Weerd: Item No. 2 is our Pledge of Allegiance. If you will all rise and join us in the
pledge to our flag.
(Pledge of Allegiance recited.)
Item 3: Community Invocation by Stephanie Moore with Ten Mile Christian
Church
De Weerd: Item No. 3 is our community invocation. Tonight we will be led by
Stephanie Moore. She is with Ten Mile Christian Church. If you will all join us in the
community invocation or take this as an opportunity for a moment of reflection. Thank
you for being here.
Moore: Let's pray. God, we thank you for this day. Little things like rain and sun that
show us that you care about the little things in our lives. God, tonight we do pray for the
items on the agenda that they would be addressed well. We thank you for the people
who are here officially or unofficially to see to that and we thank you for a community
that cares about things like the members of our community who suffer with a disease or
a disorder or even the minutia of life and so I pray that tonight it will be well attended to.
Thank you for one another in this community, in Jesus' name I pray, amen.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 2 of 75
Item 4: Adoption of the Agenda
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Item No. 4 is adoption of the agenda.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Hope everyone has their score card ready, because we have a few changes
to make and for those in the audience we do have agendas in the back if you want to
follow along, but we are going to be moving a few things around tonight. To start with
under Item 6-H, that is Resolution No. 12-849, we are going to move Items 6-I and 6-J
to Item No. 8. Then under Item 9, Action Items, 9-D is Ordinance No. 12-1509. In
Department Reports, 10-A, we are going to move that to Item 7 -- make that No. 7-C
under Community Items and Presentations. Under 10-G, the approval for beer, wine,
liquor license applications, the first three Qdoba, Qdoba and Jakers, will be moved to
Item 6-B, added to that long list of approvals, since the paperwork came in today and all
that is taken care of, we can move that to the Consent Agenda. And that just leaves
Red Robin and Brew 52 for Department Reports under Item 10-G. Under 10-I we are
going to -- we are going to add Item 10-I, Legal Department, discussion on ACRD
impact deferral agreement. So, that will be added. 11-A, massage therapist license
ordinance revisions, that is going to be removed from the agenda. And, then, under 11-
B is Ordinance No. 12-1510. 11-C is Ordinance No. 12-1511. 11-D is Ordinance No.
12-1512. So, with those few tweaks, Madam Mayor, I move adoption of the agenda as
amended.
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second to adopt the agenda as amended. All those
in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: And you did that just -- I just flew in an hour ago from the Netherlands, so if
I start fading out, it's jet lag. And if I say something wrong it's jet lag. Really it is. So,
you did that just to see if I was tracking; right?
Hoaglun: Oh, we did, Madam Mayor. It's actually April 1st, you just don't know that.
Item 5: Proclamation
A. Proclamation for Parkinson's Awareness Month
De Weerd: Okay. And Item No. 5 is a proclamation. Is there someone here that is with
the Parkinson's Awareness Month group? If you want to join me up in front. If you will
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 3 of 75
stand over here with me. I'm going to read this and, then, present it to the group and,
again, this was handed to me as I walked in the door, so bear with me. It is an
important disease to recognize this month, so this is not to be taken lightly. Whereas,
Parkinson's is the second most common neurodegenerative disease in the United
States, second only to Alzheimer's, and whereas there is inadequate comprehensive
data on the instant and prevalences of Parkinson's disease. As of 2012 it is estimated
that the disease affects between a half million to 1.5 million people in the United States
and whereas research suggests that the cause of Parkinson's disease is a combination
of genetic and environmental factors, but that the cause and progression of the disease
is still unknown and whereas there is no objective -- no objective test for Parkinson's
disease and the rate of misdiagnosis can be high, and whereas symptoms of
Parkinson's disease vary from person to person and include tremors, slowness --
slowness -- and that is jet lag -- difficulty with balance, swallowing, chewing, speaking,
rigidity, cognitive problems, dementia, mood disorder such as depression and anxiety,
constipation, skin problems and sleep disruption and whereas there is no cure, therapy,
or drug to slow or halt the progression of Parkinson's disease and whereas increased
education and research are needed to help find more effective treatments with fewer
side effects and ultimately an effective treatment or cure for Parkinson's disease,
therefore, I, Tammy de Weerd, Mayor of the City of Meridian, do hereby proclaim April
2021 to be Parkinson's Awareness Month in the City of Meridian and .call on all citizens
to increase awareness of this disease and the continued need for research, better
treatments, eventual cure, signed this day of April 2012 and it is with privilege that I
present it to this group and I'll see if you have some remarks that you would like to
make.
Bain: Thank you so much.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Bain: We appreciate Mayor de Weerd and the Meridian City Council for taking this
opportunity. Parkinson's is a huge disease here in our community. It's very
misunderstood and we are making progress every day. We don't have a cure yet, but
we will get one. Thank you very much.
Item 6: Consent Agenda
A. Approve Minutes of April 10, 2012 City Council Workshop
Meeting
B. Approval of 2012-2013 Beer, Wine and Liquor License Renewal
Applications as follows:
~EI Tenampa 906 N. Main St. BWL
Dickeys BBQ Pit 2845 E. Overland Rd. B
Schooners 499 S. Main St. BWL
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 4 of 75
Fred Meyer#198
~Louies Pizza & Italian
~Smashburger
Legacy Feed & Fuel
~Gino's
Sunrise Cafe
Don Diegos
Smoky Mtn Pizza
Firehouse Grill
~Whitewater Pizza
MUSE
Varsity Kitchen
Ricks Press Room
The Griddle
Meridian Speedway
Bill n Lynns Place
~Walgreens #06200
~Walgreens #10197
~Walgreens #10604
~Walgreens #11452
Corkscrews
~Rudys Pub n Grill
~Walgreens #11687
~Shige Teriyaki Exp.
Pizza Hut 2165
Pizza Hut 2166
New Frontier Club
~Brewforia Beer Mkt.
1850 E. Fairview Ave.
2500 E. Fairview Ave.
3223 E. Louise #100
3100 S. Meridian Rd.
3015 W. McMillan Rd. #108
805 Main
2951 Overland #190
980 Fairview Ave.
1767 W. Franklin Rd. #180
3223 E. Louise #104
1435 N. Eagle Rd.
1441 N. Eagle Rd. #200
130 E. Idaho Ave.
2310 E. Overland Rd. 130
335 S. Main St.
229 W. Franklin
1570 E. Fairview Ave.
3150 W. Cherry Ln.
1625 S. Meridian Rd.
3263 N. Eagle Rd.
729 N. Main St.
2310 E. Overland Rd.
4850 N. Linder Rd.
450 S. Meridian
675 S. Progress
1752 Cherry Lane
116 E. Broadway
3030 E. Overland Rd. #100
BW
BWL
BW
BW
BWL
BWL
BW
BWL
BWL
BWL
BW
BWL
BWL
BW
BW
BWL
BW
BW
BW
BW
BW
BWL
BW
BW
B
B
BWL
BW
C. Recreational Pathway Easement between Penn Station Apartments
LLC and the City of Meridian
D. Approval of Award of Bid and Agreement for "Pine Street Sewer
Connector" to Brown Construction, Inc. for the Not-To-Exceed
amount of $204,323.75
E. Approval of Award of Bid and Agreement for "Water Line
Replacement- W Carlton NW 11th to Washington Dr. & W State" to
Dahle Construction, LLC for the Not-To-Exceed amount of
$258,034.00
F. Approval of Award of Bid and Agreement for "Sewer Main
Replacements Sites 10A, 10B & 11" to Cascade Pipeline Corporation,
Inc. for the Not-To-Exceed Amount of $123,083.00
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 5 of 75
G. Third Addendum to the RIMI Professional Services Contract for
Performing Mechanical Plan Review and Inspection Services
De Weerd: Okay. Item No. 6 is our Consent Agenda.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Under our Consent Agenda, under Item 6-B, we added the two Qdoba
Mexican Grills Number 473 for beer, wine and liquor license application and the Jakers
Bar and Grill from 10-G, so that has been added to that list under 6-B number. 6-H is
Resolution No. 12-849. And we have removed Items 6-I and 6-J. And so with that,
Madam Mayor, I move adoption -- approval of the Consent Agenda and the Mayor to
sign and Clerk to attest.
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second to approve the Consent Agenda as amended.
Is there is any discussion from Council?
Rountree: I have none:
De Weerd: Madam Clerk, will you call roll.
Roll Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
De Weerd: All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 7: Community Items/Presentations
A. Meridian Environmental Excellence Awards Presentation
De Weerd: Under Item 7-A, I will ask Molly to come up and I will come down there and
join you.
Mangerich: Thank you, Madam Mayor and Council. I'm really privileged this evening to
be here with Nancy Mann, who is our chairperson of the Solid Waste Advisory
Commission, in the announcement of this year's Meridian Environmental Excellence
Award winners. This evening I'm happy to speak to each of our award winners and
proud to present them to you, Madam Mayor and Council, and so that you could provide
them with this lovely award. Special innovations, creativities, and efforts have gone on
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 6 of 75
within our community and we want to highlight those efforts to you this evening. So, if I
may begin. Our first award winner this evening is Zamzow's, one of our businesses, a
very popular business here in the City of Meridian and not only have I worked with the
Zamzow's as individuals, but also I am a fan of their stores and their employees,
because I consider them experts in the field. I know that Zamzow's is very much a part
of Meridian history and from establishing a feed manufacturing mill here in Meridian to
1953, to become a regional authority on what I -- comes to all things lawn, garden, pets
and ponds and you name it. This evening, Madam Mayor, if I could bring up the
representative Zamzow's. I would like to make special note that Zamzow's was
selected as an award winner because of the innovation and products that they
manufacture through their store. With the water quality problems that we face regionally
in the Treasure Valley some of those have much to do with phosphorus and bacteria
and pesticides and Zamzow's has certainly come to, through their own research and
innovation and drive, to develop a series of products and educational videos and
advertisements that lead us as consumers to a greener way of living and we certainly
appreciate that within our community. Madam Mayor, if you would, please, read the
inscription on the award and present it.
De Weerd: Okay. This environmental excellence award is presented to Zamzow's for
supporting the city's vision of environmental stewardship through the development of
innovative products and solutions, providing environmental and social benefit to our
community and since I, too, am a user of Zamzow's products for all of those uses and
certainly have appreciated everything that Zamzow's has done in leadership in
protecting our environment and the Idaho way of living, it is my honor to present this to
you, Jim.
Zamzow: I'd like to say something very quickly. I'll tell you something that probably
most people don't know. Right out here by our feed mill where the railroad tracks are,
when my grandfather August was 19 years old at the turn of last century he and his
brother left Minnesota and they hopped a freighter and they were coming -- coming
through Meridian on their way to California. Grandpa jump off and ran downtown
Meridian to grab a couple of sandwiches. The train started to move and on his way
back he couldn't quite make the train. In fact, the story goes he actually had ahold of
his brother Carl's hand right there at the railroad tracks here at Main Street and he
couldn't get him pulled up, so grandpa tossed him him the sandwiches, Carl went on to
Gilroy, California, and grew his family up there. Grandpa stayed here and started his
family in Meridian. So, that's a story of our family. So, thank you very very much. We
appreciate this a lot.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Mangerich: Our next environmental award I'm very happy to present to Hunter
Elementary School right here in Meridian. Hunter Elementary is the first school that we
have had the pleasure to provide an environmental excellence award to and while we
know all of our schools in Meridian do a fabulous job on educating our children, we did
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 7 of 75
want to present a special highlight to Hunter Elementary for the remarkable work that
they do within the kindergarten classrooms. I'm happy to say that I have been invited to
their classroom upon several occasions and under disguise of costume or not, have
been able to help the children learn their letters, including W for the word water and we
have had so much fun being in the classroom, talking about water quality protection, et
cetera. And also W is for the word waste. We have had a lot of fun with the volunteers
and the kids in the classroom. Staff also did some research on the part of Hunter
Elementary and we found out that they average over 2,000 pounds of recyclables
collected each month right at your school and that is a lot of waste diverted from our
landfill. So, congratulations on a vigorous recycling program. If I could have
representatives from Hunter Elementary please come up. Thank you. I'd like to
introduce our kindergarten teacher Barbara Frasier and Hunter Elementary Principal
Julie Prince. Congratulations. And, Madam Mayor, if you could read the inscription.
De Weerd: Okay. This is the 2011 environmental excellence award presented to
Hunter Elementary for superior accomplishments in promoting the city's vision of
environmental stewardship through the education of our most precious resource, our
children. Thank you for being here and thank you for participating.
Mangerich: Thank you. Our final environmental excellence award has been kept under
tight security and tight wraps, because we wanted it to be a surprise to the special
recipient. Our individual award for environmental excellence goes to the fine woman
next to me Nancy Mann, who has served this community tirelessly over the last 13 plus
years to help get us motivated, inspired, and beyond words into action. She is a
fabulous member of our community. It's not often I get to say gotcha. You are always
on top. Congratulations, Nancy, and we so thank you for your work within our
community. Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: And Nancy is also a good sport, because we just continue to prolong her
appointment and over and over again. This is the 2011 environmental excellence
award presented to Nancy Mann for her sustained efforts and significant contributions,
promoting the city's vision of environmental stewardship and I might add in helping to
craft our vision. So, thank you, Nancy. We greatly appreciate you.
Mann: Thank you.
B: Presentation by Douglas Jones with Growers for
Biotechnology Regarding the Idaho Watershed Solutions
Grant
De Weerd: Okay. Our second item, 7-B, is a presentation and I will ask Doug to come
on up.
Jones: Mayor Tammy, Council President Hoaglun, Council Members, thank you for the
opportunity you have allowed us tonight to make a little presentation to you and I'm
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 8 of 75
overwhelmed by the awards that have just been given out, because it was a great
segue into what we want to talk about with some additional environmental stewardship.
I visited with some of you individually and certainly worked a lot with Brenda Sherwood
on some projects here in the City of Meridian and as I worked with Public Works folks
and looked at where your wastewater went and my background as an old farmer, I said
there has got to be a better way to do this. That was a number of months ago. Since,
then, we have formed Idaho Watershed Solutions, a nonprofit, to try to help solve some
of the additional environmental issues within this community and particularly the lower
Boise watershed. The lower Boise Basin. And we all know some of the challenges. I
have watched the Zamzow's add on the quality of the aquifer and the river dozens of
times and I, too, buy their products and use them. So, we want to talk this evening
about some other things we think that the city can do and we can do to help with
environmental clean up as well and what I want to do -- I'm not going to actually make
the presentation, but I want to introduce some of the folks that are here with me and
part of our group and, then, eventually turn it over to Dave Tuthill to make the actual
presentation. So, I'm going to ask my colleagues, who are mostly seated in the single
row back here, to wave when I introduce them. We think we have got a pretty
distinguished group of people into this project. The gentleman who will make the
presentation Dr. Dave Tuthill, retired director of the State Department of Water
Resources. Next chair is Mark Mazerick. .Mark is recently retired from many many
years of EPA service here in Idaho. Next to him Hal Anderson. Hal was a senior staff
person for the state water resources board at the Department of Water Resources.
Also recently retired. And. Dr. Rob Titemann. Rob spent a number of years with the
Idaho Transportation Department designing wetlands and is now out on his own as well.
My background -- I'm just an old farm boy, but I did spend a few years at the Idaho
legislature working on ag and environmental issues. So, again, that's who we are and
at this point I will turn it over to Dave Tuthill, who has -- we furnished you with
notebooks. He has a PowerPoint and we will go through some discussion and, then,
we will have some Q and A where we think the city can work with us, how we can work
with you to improve the whole valley in the future, so --
De Weerd: Thank you, Doug.
Jones: Dave.
Tuthill: Thank you, Doug. Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: Welcome.
Tuthill: It really is a pleasure to be here tonight. Thank you for taking time in your busy
schedule to tell you about what we feel is a very important step in the basin water
quality. Now, we have these topics -- we want to tell you about our concept, about the
situation we face, an approach for resolution, a proposal that we have to the City of
Meridian and, by the way, we have discussed this with Mr. Barry and Mr. Stewart and
must comment that your Public Works and your water approach in the City of Meridian
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is a state leader. That's no surprise to you, but it's something you can be proud of. Our
concept is we recognize that the Boise River is a very important stream for the
community. It's listed as a water quality limited stream. Phosphorus is a nutrient of
concern. We have already heard about that tonight. No surprise. Much of phosphorus
-- in fact, it's estimated that 70 percent of the phosphorus in the river is added by
nonpoint source solution. With that the point source solution are -- point source
providers are the providers like you all, the City of Meridian, you are -- you have a point
source discharge of a water that has phosphorus into the system through your
wastewater treatment plant. A nonpoint source provider is the ag community, drains,
septic tanks and so on. So, about 70 percent of the phosphorus comes from nonpoint
sources. The EPA controls point sources like you all, but it does not control nonpoint
sources. That's the way the Clean Water Act is set up. So, we have the majority of the
problem not controlled and not getting permits. A few entities that are important do get
permits. We propose to incentivize the nonpoint source contributors to incentivize them
to reduce phosphorus and give credit to those who incentive them. That's the gist here.
There are really four ways where we propose to incentivize. One way is to automate
and, then, reuse and we did see a nice presentation by Clint at the Water Reuse
Conference last week. You all are already doing a lot of reuse. We would contend that
there is some additional that can be done. Precision agricultural, riparian activities --
what do we mean by those four, just a little. bit of further elaboration. For automation if
the irrigation system take only what they need, then, clean cold water stays in the river
and -- and water that they need is being used. Right now they take more than they
need certain seasons, the spring and fall generally. During the summertime all the
water is used, spring and fall it's not. But we need to automate the system to take only
what we need.
De Weerd: That actually looks familiar. Is that from the Netherlands?
Tuthill: Well, yeah, this is a system built by Danish Hydraulic Institute.
De Weerd: Okay.
Tuthill: It is -- this is from California and -- you know, I misspoke. The modeling is done
by Danish Hydraulic Institute. These particular instruments are by Rubicon from
Australia, but his technology is very advanced around the world and it just hasn't come
to Idaho yet. We think there is an opportunity to leave clean cold water in the river.
Reuse you are already doing a lot of that. We think there is much opportunity for reuse.
Who would get credit for the reuse? It's the entity that would make it happen. In this
case Twin Falls Canal Company has done a lot of this and this happens to be one of
their systems and reuse we -- the idea is to use nutrient laden water for irrigation, which
is helpful for irrigation, instead of taking clean cold water from the river. Precision
agriculture has lots of opportunity. Putting the phosphorus where it needs to be, only
released in a certain amount of time as an example. Apply the correct amounts and
types of nutrients in the right places. And, finally, the fourth area is riparian activities.
There is a wonderful opportunity to develop wetlands, kind of like the Dixie drain system
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that the Boise -- the city of Boise is using right now. Lots of opportunity to create
wetlands to remove nutrients and lower temperatures. Here is our main question. Will
the EPA accept this kind of an approach. So, we did ask this of Mike Bissell and he's
the -- he's the director of the Office of Water and Watersheds from EPA Region Ten.
It's his responsibility to issue the NPDES permits like what you have. So, in a meeting
in December we presented or approach and asked the question can this work and he
said it has to be measured and verified. It's not easy. Not many people are doing it, but
we are very supportive of this approach. Where has it been successful? Well, we
looked at Oregon and in a couple of national seminars that we participated in the
question was where has this been successful. The Chesapeake Bay, Ohio, and the
Willamate Partnership. So, we have been working with the Willamate Partnership for
the past year. We met several times. They have an associated nonprofit -- these are
both nonprofits, the Willamate Partnership and the Fresh Water Trust. And what they
set up was an approach where they would set up policies and measurement done by
the Willamate Partnership and they had an individual David Primavich who went out to
try to make a deal for credit trading, to get credits. He wasn't able to do it, because he
was working for the entity that provided the policies. So, he went over to work for an
associated nonprofit called the Fresh Water Trust and made a deal and that's the deal
that we look at. Around the west they lowered the temperature by making this deal. So,
how do we do this in Idaho? We have taken a look at this over the past year and
determined that it would be best to form a nonprofit, which as Doug said, we have
formed the Idaho Watershed Solutions, Inc., and our intent is to do the function in Idaho
that the fresh water trust does in Oregon and we have the team that Doug mentioned.
It's a very powerful team, half of us have just been introduced. What we see is the
Lower Boise Watershed Council, which does exist and you all have participated in,
functions as the Willamate partnership. It sets the policies. Sets the guidance. But
also we need the Idaho Watershed Solutions to do the deals, make the trading happen,
and we have added a third very important concept here -- aspect. The Idaho Water
Resources Research Institution, they bring in the universities and research that can help
make this happen. So, between the three of us we have already had many discussions
and we think that this is a good possibility. So, as we focus this on the lower Boise, we
have a need, we have an approach, but we don't have a functional credit trading
process and that's what we intend to do and we are initiating the Boise Basin Water
Quality Credit Trading Project. We have a wide variety of entities we have talked with in
your book. We have about 30 different entities as subsequent slides -- backup slides.
won't go through those in detail, but I will say that a primary participant would be the
NPDES holders, like the City of Meridian. What are we looking for as far as
participation? For many of these organizations we are saying come and participate and
use your in-kind efforts to be stakeholders. For the NPDES holders in corporations,
including Simplot, Monsanto, Idaho Power Company and the cities, we are saying come
and also assist to fund this. You all have the most to gain, because you're the ones that
need the credits for -- for your solutions. We intend to do this over the next four years.
The credits rating process has already been built, it just hasn't worked. There hasn't
been enough energy put into it. We think that we can develop another -- another
possibility in your matrix of possibilities for the City of Meridian. You have a number of
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treatment plant options, but to use credit trading we think that this process will be helpful
in making that happen. We have already applied for a major federal grant, 300,000
dollar grant. We will find out about that in July. But we need cash participants as cost
share to make this happen. So, our proposal for you all is to be primary stakeholders,
to -- we would hope that you take a look at and consider supporting this process
through memorandum of understanding that we shared with Mr. Stewart and Mr. Barry,
that you all take a leap as the NPDES holder this is the first reading of this type we have
given. We have spent a year planning this, now we are saying we are ready to sign
people up. We have -- what we are asking for is 25,000 dollars for the rest of this fiscal
year and if we are successful, if we do a good job, continuation of that at 50,000 a year
for the next three years. This would be used as cost match to do the measurement and
develop implementation of projects to make credit trading a viable option. The city can
help shape the future of the process. It's already been a leader in many ways. The
Treasure Valley Camp is winding up. That's been successful as far as bringing people
to the table. The cities and the irrigation organizations, that is winding down. That
forum won't be there anymore. The state doesn't have additional funding for that. This
is an appropriate follow on for that effort. This will provide cost effective solutions for
your matrix. It will result in improvement of the water quality of the Boise River Basin
and reduce your treatment requirements, which would be our intent. We are looking for
strategies. We have worked on development of the PMDLs. As next steps we plan to
brief the other six NPDES -- or the other three NPDES holders and three major
corporations. We have been in discussions with all of these groups. We will be
meeting with the universities on May 1st as a continual -- as a continuation of our
discussions there. Our initial stakeholder meeting will be this summer and intent to
proceed toward development of these objectives. So, thank you, Madam Mayor and
Council, for your patience in this important aspect and I would stand for questions.
De Weerd: You know, Dave, I guess as I go back to the little bit I know, the camp and
the training program right now, because a lot of those stakeholders that you talked
about are not required to be part of the solution, how do they become part of the
solution? I -- what kind of incentives do they have when they are not regulated right
now?
Tuthill: Madam Mayor, it's interesting that the TMDL process, which really hasn't been
finalized for the Lower Boise River Basin -- is now speeding up. We have gone to
briefings that this has been a -- it's a major work effort. DEQ intends to make this
happen over the next two years and the process of looking -- of developing credit
trading is just right to help inform the TMDLs and implement them. And the incentive for
the irrigators, as an example, the incentive might be to have a system that's automated.
We have talked to Paul Devoe, who is the manager of the Boise Project Board of
Control and briefed this to him and he says, well, I can keep more water in the
reservoirs and if I have enough I can lease it or make that available. If I don't have
enough I can use it in my canal. So, there really is great incentive for the irrigators, but
over time irrigators talk about acre feet, municipalities talk about million gallons per day,
there is a divide there and there are many things that are divisive. This is an
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opportunity to come together and we think we can incentivize the nonpoint source
providers.
De Weerd: And just afollow-up question as to how -- how you control that. The Dixie
drain program that the city of Boise has invested a significant amount of money in now
could be kind of put at risk by a private investor who is doing something a little bit up
river or down river -- I don't know which makes sense, but -- so, you put this investment
in, what is to protect that investment?
Tuthill: Well, Madam Mayor, the Dixie drain project is new. It's a little bit different. It's
kind of out there by itself. We are very supportive of that and think it's the right idea.
But it's one opportunity out of many up and down the river. So, we see this has been
totally compatible with making that -- with helping that project go forward. It hasn't been
fully approved by the EPA. This adds additional oomph and effort behind the Dixie
drain project. And so far projects have been successful by municipalities in terms of
water reuse. Most of the municipalities that had to go it alone, what's different here is
there is a -- we see an opportunity for a stake holder group that moves the process
forward, leveraging the efforts together and that's a much more powerful voice for EPA.
We have personally spoken with levels through the EPA all the way to Bob Rose, who is
the national coordinator for water quality credit trading and Christine Pike, the deputy
director in Seattle. So, by having an organization that makes this its business, as we
are, we can add oomph and energy and I think better secure the opportunity for Dixie
drain, rather than to endanger it.
De Weerd: Council, questions?
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes.
Rountree: Dave, could you just give us a snippet of what -- how the process would
work, what the credit would consist of, what part of our investment up front is going to
show a long term benefit, what's the annual cost to us and how is that going to be
derived. I mean some of the -- I know I'm already drilling down into details, but Ijust --
some idea. I know you guys have sat around and dealt with all of this stuff, so -- and I'm
not going to hold you to anything specifically, but I need a sense to -- to start making it
work for me.
Tuthill: Councilman Rountree, Madam Mayor, this process will add a dimension to the
possibilities of municipalities that is not there or have high risk right now. It was very
interesting to see last week the presentation by the city of Nampa. They showed five
alternatives -- five or six. By far the least cost alternative was the one where there were
offsets and offsets is another way to credit -- to look at credit trades. And most of the
options were 96 million, 96 million -- this one was 66 million. Yet it was not deemed to
be a very valid application. Why? Too much risk. If we can take the risk out of that
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lower cost option by having credits traded that are valid, then, the savings potential is
huge. Your question directly was how will you see the benefits of your dollar
investment. The response is in the matrix of options this City of Meridian will have other
options as well. Instead of -- and with all treatment plants it's easy to treat much of the
contaminants. It's difficult and expensive to -- to treat that last increment and that last
increment, if instead of treating you can buy credits that have been developed in a
credible way and measured, then, it makes a lower cost option for the City of Meridian.
So, the investment that we are looking for is 25,000 and 50,000 per year. You will have
a chance to look at that every year to make sure the investment is worthwhile. It's up to
us to make sure that it is that. If you plan to add to your investment and cost share it by
the federal government, we have been in talks there, so we think that this will add
another tool for your wastewater people and have significant cost savings in the long
term.
Jones: Let me add some comments and response to any additional questions to what
Dave has presented and the responses he has given to this point. You know, we are
asking for some money and is there any assurance -- well, nothing is a hundred percent
sure. But part of what we want at this point -- this initial money is to do some baseline
monitoring of -- to quote from the EPA gentleman in Seattle, he said it has to be
verifiable and that ,means real hard numbers. USGS did some monitoring this. past
season on Mason Creek. Mason is one of the other drains that runs through Nampa, so
it's a little bit further west. We want to follow up with some additional data, which USGS
will do, so that we have a baseline number and we can -- we can say to you, the EPA,
anybody else, as we move through this process, yeah, we have made an improvement,
because we know where we started from. That's part of the initial is to get that baseline.
You have -- you need that. And, then, you can move forward from that process. I think
the question about assurance -- how do we know this is -- this will work. Well, again,
nothing is a hundred percent sure, but we think this is a creative option that will work,
certainly in this valley, recall by bringing the valley together, you and your counterparts
on the other councils around the valley, and the ag community, we certainly know that
that has not always been a comfortable relationship here and a lot of other places
across the country, but it's an opportunity to do something good for the valley and I got
into this -- one of the people I didn't mention that's part of the group, because he's not
here tonight, is Dr. Mark Ankene, who is a BSU soil scientists with the INEEL in Idaho
Falls. And Mark and I have worked together. We started on some other projects and I
got to looking at what the city was doing and this phosphate problem and said, wait a
minute, I'm an old farmer I used to -- I have paid Simplot a lot of money to buy
phosphate over years. Why can't we take some of that phosphate that you're going to
pay a lot of money to get out of the water and just put it out in the ag community. It's
agronomically insignificant for the ag community. It isn't going to do anything in terms of
raising their crop of corn or beans or onions or whatever it might be. But it certainly
solves a large problem for the municipalities and what you're going to spend for water
treatment over the coming years. And may help build some cooperation. And certainly
for the City of Meridian you guys are one of the more progressive groups in the valley
and I say that -- and for a variety of reasons and one of the other pieces that I think fits
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April 24, 2012
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together for Meridian is you have designated an area off in the northwest corner for your
FILDSs project. You want to do some ag things and I think you all know I have been
working with Brenda on that for some period of time and I think this is another piece of
that, of how we keep agriculture in this valley, keep it viable, and keep the
municipalities viable as well. Hold down my water and sewer bill as a resident of
Meridian and build stronger relationships for the whole valley, because the valley will
change. I'm like Jim Zamzow, my -- my grandfather came to Nampa in 1902 and
started to farm in this valley. We eventually ended up in the Twin Falls area, now I'm
back up here. But I want to see the valley stay green, part of why we all like living here
is the open space. So, if we can work together I think that benefits all of use. Is this
simple? Absolutely not. Is it quick? Absolutely not. Is it doable? Absolutely. And we
think we can help create that solution for not only the city of Meridian -- and we don't
intend to compete with the city of Boise, we think the Dixie drain project is a great
project and actually helped open the door for EPA to look at some new options. And
EPA needs to look at some options: As government budgets continue to shrink, yours
and theirs, if we can find ways to do things better and cheaper at the same time,
everybody comes out ahead. So, I think EPA, at least in this region, is willing to look at
some additional options than brick and mortar sewer plants and they have
demonstrated that with what they have done with the city of Boise and their Dixie drain
project to say, yeah, we may not quite. have all the numbers yet, but we are going to
issue your permit with a clause in it that says we will go back and reexamine the permit
and maybe allow you some credits for the Dixie drain project. So, we think it's very
compatible and are working with the City of Meridian as well. My background coming
out of the ag community -- my next presentation is to the Canyon County Shell
Conservation Commission next week, because we are working on that side of it as well
and -- but it's a new concept, there is some risk involved, but I think for the future of the
valley and potential savings I think it's worth it. So, I'll shut up again and maybe you
have got more questions for Dave and I after that.
De Weerd: Dave, I guess I just have a question regarding -- on the TVML and the ag
community. We are -- what is it -- eight percent municipalities are eight percent of the
problem -- of the phosphorus problem and -- and where almost one hundred percent the
solution is on our shoulders, which means that is past onto our rate payers. I mean it's
-- unless the ag community is part of that TMVL and the phosphorus limit that force
them to the table to be part of it, I don't see anything like that and that is why we really
went to our own reuse program, because as far as we can tell so far we are in this on
our own.
Jones: Mayor, I don't disagree at all. The ag community has to be part of the process.
And that's part of the EPA's challenge is -- as Dave said in his presentation, the ag
community is not regulated, they have no way to get ahold of that problem. So, how do
you incentivize them and that's what it's going to take is incentive to come to the table
and be part of the process and they have in a lot of other places. Dave had a couple of
slides of the Twin Falls Canal Company. Twin Falls Canal and Northside, which is the
Jerome system, are way ahead of the ag community here in this valley. I'm not sure I
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April 24, 2012
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can tell you why, but they have already automated their canals. The city of Twin Falls
has got joint projects with the Twin Falls Canal Company. The slide you saw -- and
more than one -- and they don't have a formal trading process, but they are using that
as an offset. The city of Twin Falls bought a few acres of land and there is a great
aerial picture and the canal company used their heavy equipment, they built the ponds
and the structures that needed to be put in place. At the end of one of their drains. The
city pays for the monitoring of the water quality in and out, but it's a joint project between
the canal company -- the canal company built it and maintains it, because they have got
the construction type equipment to do that. The city bought the land and the city pays
for the monitoring fees and everybody comes out ahead and that middle Snake stretch
of the river is much cleaner than it used to be. And there is a TMVL in place in that
section of the river and has been for a long time and the ag community is participating
voluntarily and happily in cleaning up their return flows. Twin Falls Canal has got
several of those ponds constructed -- wetlands on their system from Twin Falls clear to
below Buhl and the Northside Canal Company the same way, where they have returns
-- particularly down in the Hagerman area, they have done a constructive wetlands.
They have got some in the Eden-Hazelton area. And, again, they are a long ways
ahead, but they have seen the incentive to be both good citizens and good stewards
and it really hasn't cost them anything. I'm a stockholder in the Twin Falls Canal
Company and I can tell you that my maintenance fees haven't gone up in several. years,
even though they have been doing these projects all along and working cooperatively.
Money is an incentive and it's an incentive in the ag community. They are business
people. If you can show them water savings, improved soil savings, better application
of fertilizer and chemical products through precision ag, they will listen. They are
interested. They will make sound business decisions if they see that there is an
incentive in it for them to do it. Everybody has a need. The city needs to treat their
water and figure out where to go with it. EPA needs to figure out how to get the river
cleaned up and how to get the ag community to participate and the ag community has a
need for better cooperation, better understanding, and to automate their systems to be
more efficient in how they operate. Some of the trading pieces have not worked on an
individual farm basis. For the City of Meridian to try to go out and find a farmer to work
with -- very difficult. But collectively and working through the canal companies and the
drains, it doesn't matter who farms this piece of ground this year, whether I rent it from
Councilman Hoaglun and he rents it to Councilman Bird next year and I have moved on
to another piece, the canal company services that same acre every year. They deliver
water to it, regardless of who the farmer is. So, it becomes a way to manage the thing
through much larger entities that have control of large blocks of land that they service.
So, we think it's very doable and the collection of folks that we have put together come
with a lot of gray hair and a lot of public service experience and we have no illusions
about how complicated the process is, but we think it's doable.
De Weerd: Warren, did you have any comments?
Stewart: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, you know, we did have an
opportunity to meet with Doug and Hal and I have met with Dave and talked with Dave
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April 24, 2012
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on numerous occasions and we certainly think this is an innovative idea. It's certainly
an idea that -- on a high level has a lot of merit and we would love to see it be
successful. I guess the only caution that I would have is that, you know, certainly there
isn't a lot of -- of examples to look at to say here is how it's done, so there is a fair
amount of risk. There certainly isn't a model project that we can say here is how we can
do it here in the Treasure Valley. So, although I think on some level it's interesting, EPA
certainly has on their national level said that they support this type of innovation, this
type of idea, and we certainly are interested in it here at this -- you know, in Public
Works. You know, the old saying the proof is in the pudding and it's -- you know, there
is not a lot of examples to point at. There certainly is some risk. We are anxious to see
what can happen, but cautious at the same time.
De Weerd: Anything further from Council?
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Just as an initial reaction, I -- you have brought the issues very clearly. We
know that the restrictions on our nutrients, sediments, and temperature are going to get
tighter and tighter and we are aware that you can't solve that problem by one solution.
We cannot improve our waste treatment plant enough to solve that problem. We can
add to that another program, our reclamation and distribution, but even those two
together probably aren't enough. A trading credit system, as you're talking about, is
probably going to be a necessary addition at some time. What Boise is doing -- we are
going to have to do all of those things I think in order to get where we need to go. So, I
certainly am in favor of exploring this. I'm happy to hear that you're not in front of us
asking for 66 million dollars today.
Jones: We could ask, but I don't think you would be very receptive.
Zaremba: Yeah. I'd probably take a break. But I don't think we can eliminate any
possibility to begin with. It does take a little more exploration. I appreciate Warren's
comments. I haven't had the opportunity to discuss this myself with our Director Barry,
because he's been very ill for the last few days and home, but I suspect that he would
be willing to explore it as well. So, I guess I want to leave that on the table as saying I
appreciate the presentation and it is something that we need to think about and our
choice is not going to be one or the other, our choice is going to be all possibilities to do
-- each to do a little bit of the total need that we have to solve and I personally like what
you have presented, so I hope we continue to explore it.
De Weerd: Thank you so much for being with us and to the rest of your team as well.
Jones: Thank you for the opportunity to make a presentation and we will be more than
happy to discuss with the Council collectively or any of you individually in more detail at
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any point, so thank you.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: This is a very good topic I think for one of our workshops where we can have
some more time to contemplate this and actually sit down with these folks and our staff
and roll up our sleeves and see where the risk really is and what the potential benefits
are for us. I agree with Councilman Zaremba that it's certainly a tool kit option that we
should explore. Whether or not we jump into it I have yet to reach that conclusion. But
in finishing my comment, Rob, it's good to see you. I'm glad you're still around and your
gray hair is getting grayer, as is mine.
De Weerd: And I'm sure our staff will continue to work with them and bring back a
recommendation to Council as well. Okay. Thank you.
C. Mayor's Office: ,Mayor's Youth Advisory Council (MYAC)
Update
De Weerd: We did move an item to 7-C from 10-A and so we have the Mayor's Youth
Advisory Council report. Oh, see, you were hiding behind the Boy Scouts. I didn't know
who we had tonight.
Byers: Good evening, Council. My name is Josh Byers and I am the Meridian High
representative on MYAC. I'm also an HB representative at Meridian High School.
Baird: My name is Mackenzie Baird and I am the secretary of MYAC and I'm also next
year's HB representative for Meridian High School.
Byers: If you will excuse me, I'm a little bit under the weather tonight, so -- we want to
thank you guys for the opportunity of speaking and reporting to you guys and I'd like to
start off by saying that MYAC is ending the year with a big bang and we have an
average of 40 members all time high for this time of the year, so we have lots of really
involved students and we are looking forward to finishing the year really really well with
a big bang, so --
Baird: Just recently MYAC has hosted a dinner auction that was a great success. We
are very excited to provide a check to the Meridian Valley Humane Society and MYAC
has remained very busy this spring. We are proud to see an anti-texting law signed by
the governor and Mayor's Youth Advisory Council members partnered with SWAC to
pass out reusable grocery bags on Earth Day this weekend.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 18 of 75
Byers: Friday at Wahooz Family Fun Center we have our tech event which we are
throwing kind of a fun end of the year thing at Wahooz, kind of kids getting together and
having fun and, you know, keep them out of trouble and all that stuff, so, yeah, we just
wanted to kind of celebrate the end of the year and have that activity to get everybody
together, so, yeah, that's this Friday.
De Weerd: That's the Teen Activities Center.
Byers: Yeah. Teen Activities Council. Yeah. Yeah.
De Weerd: Or Council. Yeah.
Baird: Tomorrow Mayor's Youth Advisory Council will be hosting a candidate forum,
which is tomorrow and next Wednesday, where youth members will get the opportunity
to learn more about their candidates and prepare their decision for who they want to
vote for in the future. Also the Treasure Valley Youth Summit is an event hosted by the
Mayor's Youth Advisory Council and it is scheduled for May 11th. This is where youth
will get the opportunity to learn more about -- to learn more about drug prevention and --
De Weerd: Bullying and texting.
Baird: Bullying, texting --
De Weerd: Or distractive driving. Yes.
Byers: Last night was our last official MYAC meeting and Superintendent Luna came
as our guest speaker. It was really neat to have Luna there. We -- we asked him a lot
of questions, a lot of good ones, and it was really good to kind of see -- have him
explain a lot of what was going on and kind of see what he had to say about it and it
was really interesting to listen to. It's nice to know kind of what was going on. So, you
know, this has been one of our -- he was a great speaker, but we have had lots of great
guest speakers this year, so it was -- we have really enjoyed all the guest speakers, so
-- yeah. Elections were held also for next year's leadership for MYAC -- Mayor's Youth
Advisory Council, excuse me, and it was the best one ever and they are all looking
really forward to it and I'm sure the Mayor is and it's looking really great and I'm .sure
they are going to be better than ever, so --
Baird: MYAC end of the year party is scheduled for Monday, May 14th, and the council
is very excited and all Council Members are invited to attend.
Byers: Thank you. Any questions?
De Weerd: Council, if you mark that down on your pieces of paper, May 14th. 6:00
o'clock?
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 19 of 75
Byers: Yes. Yes. 6:00 o'clock.
De Weerd: Okay. Here in the conference room A and B. Right? Where are you doing
it?
Byers: I think it is in conference room A and B, yes.
De Weerd: Okay. I thought I had better ask, instead of assume.
Byers: And if it isn't we definitely will update you guys on that, so --
De Weerd: Okay.
Rountree: Sounds good.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Question. The candidate forum tomorrow tonight that's at 6:30 here at City
Hall?
Bird: 6:00.
Hoaglun: 6:00? Somewhere I saw 6:30. Okay. And that is for 14 and 20 this week?
Byers: Yeah. Fourteen and twenty.
Hoaglun: Fourteen and twenty. Okay. And it's open to everybody in the community,
not just MYAC members; correct?
Byers: Of course.
Hoaglun: Okay. Good. That would be great. Glad you guys are doing that.
De Weerd: Yeah. They had great success with the candidate forum they did last fall
and so they wanted to continue that forward to the primaries.
Bird: They did the greatest candidate forum that I have seen done. Period. Last fall.
Rountree: They did.
Bird: Yeah. It was the greatest show that I have seen. I hope they do it every election.
De Weerd: Any other questions or comments from Council?
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 20 of 75
Rountree: Are either of you graduating this year?
Byers: Yes.
De Weerd: Josh is.
Byers: I will be graduating, yes.
Rountree: Well, congratulations and I wish you the best.
Byers: Thank you. I appreciate it.
De Weerd: And I'm sure you're glad to have senior project done.
Byers: Yes. I'm all for that.
De Weerd: Well, thank you, Mackenzie and Josh
appreciated your report.
Byers: Thank you once again and --
De Weerd: Thank you.
Bird: Thank you.
It was nice having you here and we
Item 8: Items Moved From Consent Agenda 61 and 6J moved to 8A and 8B
H. Resolution No. 12-849: Adopting Analysis of Impediments to
Fair Housing Choice Report and Fair Housing Action Plan
Second Amendment to Development Agreement for Knight
Sky MDA 11-011 Spurwing Challenge by The Club at Spurwing,
LLC Located Northwest Corner of Chinden Boulevard and N.
Linder Road Request: Amend the Recorded Development
Agreement (Inst. #106122365) for the Purpose of Excluding the
Property AND Creating a New Development Agreement to
Include a New Project Boundary and Concept Plan for the
Proposed Spurwing Challenge Subdivision
I. Development Agreement AZ 11-005 and RZ 11-006 Spurwing
Challenge by The Club at Spurwing, LLC Located Northwest
Corner of Chinden Boulevard and North Linder Road Request:
Annexation of 30 Acres of Land with an R-8 Zoning District
and Rezone of 51.61 Acres of Land from R-4 (Medium Low-
Density Residential) and TN-C (Traditional Neighborhood
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 21 of 75
Commercial) to R-8 (Medium-Density Residential) (46.97 Acres)
and C-C (Community Business) (4.64 Acres) Zoning Districts
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. There were two items moved from the Consent Agenda.
Item I and J and so I understand that legal will be providing an update.
Nary: Yes. Thank you, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council. We asked to move
these two items. Normally when we get development agreements we get a signed
agreement and, then, the ordinance gets on the agenda with the agreement and, then,
we pass them through. We have kept these two agreements together, because there is
a relationship between the Spurwing and the Knight Sky agreements and so the
Spurwing one's been signed, the Knight Sky one we got an electronic signed copy
today, but we don't have the signed -- the actual handwritten signed copy, but Spurwing
is very anxious to get their project moving along, because they have got to get some
grass growing and they have got to get some construction done and I didn't want to
delay another week, unless that was your desire. I anticipate having the other signed
copy of the Knight Sky tomorrow and so I was going to ask if you would be willing to
approve it like you have done on occasions with liquor licenses that -- if we can get
these signed copies before next week the Mayor can, then, sign it, we can move it
forward. If you want to do that we can pass the ordinances tonight. If we don't get the
signed agreement we won't publish the ordinance until we do. So, you won't be passing
the ordinance out of -- out of whack with the agreements, we will still make sure we get
them, but I didn't want to delay it another whole week if we didn't have to. I think they'd
like to get moving along on the Spurwing projects.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: You have got the electronic signed copy you said so --
Nary: Yes.
Bird: -- I have no problem with that. I --
Rountree: I'm okay with that.
Bird: Yeah. We got ordinances coming up, don't we?
Nary: Right. You can pass the ordinances tonight. They wouldn't be published until
next Monday.
Bird: Yeah.
Nary: If for some reason they don't bring us a signed copy of the Knight Sky agreement
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 22 of 75
before Friday, we won't publish the ordinances for the rezone, they will have to wait.
So, again, it's -- I anticipate they will be here tomorrow. The attorney contacted me
today and sent the electronic copy. They thought they would get it here by the end of
business, but he didn't. But I anticipate it should be here tomorrow, so --
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Bill -- so, items 11-B and Care -- and D are the three ordinances that are
impacted by this tonight?
Nary: Yes.
Hoaglun: So -- so when we get to that if we pass those with -- with conditions of receipt
of the actual signed copy, as opposed to electronically signed.
Nary: Yes.
Hoaglun: Okay.
De Weerd: Okay. So, Council, do you have a motion to approve these development
agreements? We do need to approve I and J, contingent on -- my signature would
follow the receipt of the original signature. Is that correct, Mr. Nary?
Nary: Yes, ma'am.
De Weerd: Okay.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: I would move that we approve the development agreements for Knight Sky,
MDA 11-001 and development agreement for AZ 11-005 and RZ 11-006, Spurwing
Challenge, contingent upon receipt of all signed development agreements and Mayor to
sign and Clerk to attest once those are received if prior to next week.
Bird: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second on these two development agreements. Any
discussion? Madam Clerk.
Roll Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 23 of 75
De Weerd: All ayes.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 9: Action Items
A. Continued from April 10, 2012: Public Comment on Proposed
Outdoor Sales and Temporary Uses Code Update -Increased
Time Limits for Temporary Sales Units and Garage Sales,
Temporary Construction Site Standards
De Weerd: Under 9-A we have continued from April 10th, a public comment on the
proposed outdoor sales. I will turn this over to Mr. Nary.
Nary: Thank you, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council. If you recall our earlier
discussion on this temporary -- temporary sales changes, most of them were things that
were not problematic. We were looking to expand the time period for temporary sales
from 60 to up to 90 days. We were looking to change the current standard for garage
sales from four garage sales within a 365 day period to simply at every calendar year.
We were looking for -- making sure there was proof of permission for people to stack
building materials in a roadway or on the right of way, as long as they had those
permissions -- and all of those were fine. The one that was controversial was the
limitation on the number of signs for outdoor markets. At the time we had
recommended four, which was the maximum amount of signage that's allowed for any
types of temporary sales units of any sort and the only -- the only sign regulation that we
allow greater is for a valley wide event, the Parade of Homes, and that's because we
consider each of those particular locations to be its own individual location. So, that's
the only event that's allowed. Twenty signs of no more than six square feet were
allowed for outdoor markets and up to four 32 square foot signs. We recommended
four. The Meridian Market's proprietor was concerned about that. We decided to go
back, sit down with him, and the Meridian Urban Market proprietor to see whether or not
there was a different compromise that we could reach. The Urban Market person
couldn't meet with us, but we corresponded through e-mails and, then, Mr. Egner from
the Meridian Farmers Market was able to meet with us and, of course, he was very
supportive of the 20 and, of course, part of the reason they are on a very large location.
They have a lot of frontage along Eagle Road. Their market is, basically, along Eagle
Road between approximately where Goodwood is at Presidential and it covers a portion
of the parking lot there in front of Babies R Us and the Craft Warehouse and such and
they use that entire frontage along Fairview -- or, excuse me, along Eagle Road and I
think maybe part of Fairview to advertise their market and he'd like the ability to do that.
So, we listened to that and we looked at that and felt that four probably was a little too
small, because it really is so event specific and location specific. You know, if you look
at, for example, from that Farmers Market to the Urban Market, the Urban Market was
using just Idaho Street along Main, it's frontage, 20 signs would be an abundance of
clutter in that short of space, so -- so, anyway, the committee -- we looked at it and,
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 24 of 75
basically, made a recommendation of ten in trying to figure out a compromise between
the 20 that's been allowed, which our notes didn't indicate there was any particular
mathematical reason for that, to the four that that's the max that's allowed for virtually
any other type of event, the -- the desire and direction of the group was to limit the time
periods that the signs could be up, which didn't seem problematic. I think Mr. Egner
said a majority of the time they are putting up their signs between 8:30 and 9:00 o'clock
when they open at 9:00. They close at 1:00 and the first thing they do is take their signs
down. So, we figured right now the max that is allowed is 24 hours. We think if they
limit the amount of time periods that the signs are up, then, we felt also that ten signs
was adequate for virtually most locations and that would still a compromise from what
everyone else, whether it's a -- a temporary sales of a Christmas tree stand, a fireworks
stand, whatever -- all the rest of those are only allowed up to four most of the time. So,
this has allowed four 32 square foot and recommended now is ten of the six square foot
signs. And I did correspond with Mr. Egner. I did tell him we would be talking about it
tonight. He didn't seem to agree with that, I welcomed him to come and share that with
you or to send it in writing and he wasn't able to do either I guess, so --
De Weerd: Thank you, Bill. Any public want to provide testimony on this item? Any
questions from Council?
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I'd just make a comment, in addition to what Bill said. We
have had a sign committee meeting to look at some of the sign ordinances and although
this is not in the sign ordinance portion of the Unified Development Code, they did talk
about it and they were in general agreement with trying to limit the number and the size
and I think the compromise that was reached was something that would have been
acceptable to that committee as well.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Well, there is no public wanting to comment. Any
further -- any comments from planning? Okay.
Friedman: No, Madam Mayor. Thank you.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. What's your preference, Council?
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: First thing we better do is I move we close the public comment on proposed
outdoor sales and temporary use code update.
Zaremba: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. Motion and a second to close the public comment on Item 9-A. All
those in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carries.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 25 of 75
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
B. Continued from April 10, 2012: Ordinance No. 12-1506: First
Reading -Outdoor Sales and Temporary Uses Code Update,
Increasing Time Limits for Temporary Sales Units and Garage
Sales, Adding Standards for Temporary Construction Sites
C. Public Comment on Proposed Ordinance Regarding Smoking
Product Sales and Consumption
D. Ordinance No. 12-1509: Smoking Product Sales and
Consumption
De Weerd: Item 9-B is ordinance 12-1506. This is the first reading on the outdoor sales
and temporary uses. Council, what is your preference on this item? We will go for first
reading.
Nary: Madam Mayor? Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, if we could just do the
first reading. I noticed in the one that was submitted it doesn't have the limitation on the
hours and so we want to make sure we put the limitation on the hours to like a six hour
time period, rather than a 24 hour time period, so we can add that to next week and,
then, bring it forward for second and third reading and approval if you would like.
De Weerd: Okay. Madam Clerk, will you, please, read this ordinance by title only.
Holman: Thank you, Madam Mayor. First reading of City of Meridian Ordinance No.
12-1406. An ordinance of the City of Meridian amending Meridian City Code Section 3-
4-3C5C relating to time limitations for temporary sales units, amending Meridian City
Code Section 3-4-3C7E relating to number of signs for outdoor markets. Amending
Meridian City Code 3-4-3CHB1 relating to frequency of garage sales. Amending
Meridian City Code Section 3-4-3C9 relating to litter at construction sites and providing
an effective date.
De Weerd: You have heard this ordinance read by title only. Is there anyone who
would like to hear it read in its entirety?
De Weerd: Okay. We will move onto Item 9-C, which is public comment on a proposed
ordinance regarding smoking and product sales and consumption.
Bird: Do we need to act on that ordinance?
De Weerd: No. We just had the first reading. We will bring it back for second and third.
Bird: Oh, that's right. Yeah. Okay.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 26 of 75
De Weerd: See, I have the jet lag and you're the one who is --
Bird: I have got the age.
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary. Yes.
Nary: Thank you. Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, this is the ordinance
regarding the smoking rooms that we had previously discussed with you. We have
discussed with the one local proprietor that has a smoke shop business and this didn't
have any impact on him. We did send him a reminder we were discussing it tonight if
he wanted to come, but I don't know that he has any other feedback. I'm not sure if --
don't think Lieutenant Overton has spoken with him. I think Mrs. Kane from my office
has and he didn't have any real qualms with this. He felt this was reasonable and,
again, it really is just impacting smoking on premises where they sell tobacco products
and we don't want to have minors in areas like that. We don't want minors in smoking
areas. They aren't allowed to serve food in smoking areas, so we are trying to make
sure we separate bars and that environment from retail establishments.
Hoaglun: Is there any questions, Council?
Bird: I have none.
Hoaglun: Is there anybody in the public who wishes to comment on this item? Okay.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Zaremba.
Zaremba: I move we close the public comment on the proposed ordinance regarding
smoking and product sales and consumption.
Rountree: Second.
Hoaglun: Have a motion and a second to close the public comment. All those in favor
say aye. All ayes.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Hoaglun: Item D, proposed ordinance 12-1509 is before us. And, Mr. Nary, is this one
good to go as is right now?
Nary: It is.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 27 of 75
Hoaglun: Okay.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Zaremba.
Zaremba: I'm not clear on whether we can move approval or whether we need to have
a first reading.
Nary: You can move to waive the readings and approve it tonight if you wish.
Hoaglun: We will have the first reading and, then, I guess it's up to us to determine if
we want to move forward or not, so --
Zaremba: I will wait.
Hoaglun: Yes. So, City Clerk, would you, please, read the ordinance by title only,
unless the Mayor wants it read in full.
De Weerd: Yes. Madam Clerk, will you, please, read this ordinance by title only.
Holman: Thank you, Madam Mayor. City of Meridian Ordinance No. 12-1509, an
ordinance of the City of Meridian adding a new section to Title 6, Chapter 4, Meridian
City Code, Section 6-5-8 regarding smoking product sale and consumption and
providing an effective date.
De Weerd: Okay. Council?
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: I move we adopt ordinance 12-1509 with suspension of rules.
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second on Item 10 -- 9-D. Any discussion from
Council? Madam Clerk, will you call roll.
Roll Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
De Weerd: All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 28 of 75
E. Public Hearing: TEC 12-007 Solitude Place by M2 Land, LLC
Located Southeast Corner of N. Meridian Road and E. McMillan
Road Request: Two (2) Year Time Extension on the Preliminary
Plat in Order to Obtain the City Engineer's Signature on a Final
Plat
De Weerd: 9-E is a public hearing on TEC 12-007. I will ask for staff comment as I
open this public hearing.
Parsons: Thank you, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council. The application before
you this evening is a preliminary plat time extension. The subject property is located on
the southeast corner of Meridian Road and McMillan Road. The remaining acreage to
be platted is in the red dashed line on the right -- on the exhibit on the right and the
remaining acreage is 17.9 acres. All of the area is currently zoned R-8. Previous time
extension. The applicant -- was approved by Council .in 2008. They have since
commenced with number two. This would be the third final plat and the second time
extension before you this evening. The applicant is requesting two years to sign that
agreement. In 2009 the staff did process a development agreement modification that
tied open space calcs and some building elevations to the site. So, we have addressed
that as well. Since that previous time extension the UDC has been amended to adopt
the new surety requirements, the one for performance surety, which required 125
percent bonding amount and also a three year 20 percent warranty surety. Staff is
recommending those two new conditions be added to the staff report. The applicant
has -- received public testimony from the applicant. We are in agreement with the new
conditions. To staff's knowledge there are no outstanding issues before you this
evening and with that I would be happy to answer any questions you have.
De Weerd: Thank you, Bill. Council, any questions?
Bird: I have none.
Rountree: I have none.
De Weerd: Okay. Does the applicant want to have -- have any comments? Okay. Is
there any member of the public who would like to provide testimony on this item? Okay.
Council, seeing none --
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: I move that we close the public hearing for TEC 12-007.
Zaremba: Second.
Meridian City Council
gpril 24, 2012
Page 29 of 75
to close the public hearing on Item 9-E. All
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second
those in favor say aye.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree. e a rove the request or TEC 12-007, subject
I'd move that w pp
Rountree: Madam Mayor,
to and inclusion of staff comments.
Bird: Second. rove Item 9-E. If there is no
eerd: I have a motion andlease, cond to app
De W
discussion, Madam Clerk, roll call, p ea. Hoaglun, yea.
Roll Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, y
De Weerd: All ayes.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES. q Hawkins
lic Hearing: VAR 12-001 Me od S N1ertldAan'Road, Betwee®C
F, Pub
Companies Located West Side nest: Variance to
Road and W. Harris Street Req
W. Amity roaches from ®irectly
3 Access Points,
11-3H-4 Which Prohibih~ Y t AAllow Three l) hth Mile
Accessing a State Hig
Ri ht-InlRight-®ut Access P n AccesshPo nt at the
Two (2) g ht-OutlLef hway 69)
and One (1) Right°InlRig State Hig
Quarter Mile to S. Meridian Road ( ill o en this public
g_F is a public hearing on VAR 12-001. I w p
De Weerd: Okay. Item
hearing with staff comment. lication before
Members of the Council. The aphway 69 The
Parsons: Thank you, Madam Mayor, nest an access to State Hig
vening is for a variance to req a rove the annexation d, nhor
you this e ent agreement has not been sig
ro erty consists of 73 acres. developm id act -- p nt does have until
subject p p but the applica
prope1~y back in 2010, I belannexedeinto the city~eVelopment agreement. The biggest
is the prope~Y currently of the
se the access that we -- that we will be discussing
September 7, 2013, to initiate the signing residents. And
in signing that DA is, of cour ~ developed with single famih the county and
hiccup Right now the site is currently licant went throug
this evening. I believe last year the app
office building. is this building here that fro the revionuds valiance
also an ro ert ,which
rezoned the Mussel) p p y
en short platted, so since they acted on -- since
It has also be
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 30 of 75
application this site has, again, gone through that rezone and there is also now multiple
property owners involved in the annexation request as well. Or at least the variance
application, too. Here is the concept plan that was presented to you with the annexation
of the property. This exhibit shows what the applicant is wanting to do. Again, three
access points. There is one at the eighth mile along the north just south of Harris
Street. That is proposed to be a right-in, right-out only access. At the quarter mile the
applicant is proposing aright-in, right-out and left-in access point, so three-quarter
access and, then, a quarter mile north of Amity Road the applicant is proposing another
right-in, right-out to State Highway 69. The other issue that is -- the other item that has
changed is ITD has granted the permit for the construction of his access points. If you
recall the previous application ITD did not support any access to Meridian Road and
that led to numerous continuances and ultimately a withdrawal of the application. Staff
also had some other -- city staff that could act on the application as well and so what we
did is we routed the final CIS study to our Public Works Department, particularly Mr.
Stewart and Mr. Tim Curns, who is our transportation coordinator, and they provided
some testimony for you and, basically, went through the CIS and before you this
evening I have this exhibit that kind of depicts what their findings were of that traffic
study and, basically, their recommendation to Council is that the site could be
adequately served with aright-in only access point to Meridian Road. I'd also point out
to Council that staff engaged ACHD once again on this application and they did
communicate to staff that they support their finding from the previous traffic study. They
do not support access to Meridian Road and they believe the site could function without
any additional access points to Meridian Road. So, basically, as you -- as Council is
aware, we do have some UDC standards that the applicant has to comply with in
developing or intensifying the use of the property and I will go through those very
quickly just to kind of get you familiarized with how staff made the findings for denial on
this project. As I showed you earlier, the site is pretty much agricultural and so under
the UDC once you intensify that use access -- existing access approaches shall cease
and no new accesses should be approved with that intensification. Again, on the
concept plan, if I could go back here, the applicant is going to be required to construct a
backage road here and also will have additional access points from Harris Street at the
half mile and also Amity Road at the mile point, which is also consistent with the UDC.
Also, I'd like to point out again that ACHD did provide comments on this and they were,
again, in favor of no access to Meridian Road and thought that the commercial
development or mixed use development could function without access to Meridian
Road. And, lastly, I'd like to point out to Council, again, Mr. Stewart and our Public
Works Department commenting on the traffic study that says aright-in -- or right-out
only would be adequate to serve the -- so, basically, staff feels that these -- the
intensification of the use -- other agencies commenting on no access and, of course,
our other staff members kind of supporting that theory, staff did not need the
recommendations under the ordinance providing -- trying the variance. So, basically,
staff is in approval that granting a variance would -- would grant a special privilege or
right that others don't have. It does not -- there is no undue hardship due to site
characteristics. The applicant is willing to build that backage road and provide
additional access to Harris Street and Amity and, then, also with cars that -- there is a
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 31 of 75
potential -- potential for increased accident as cars exit the site onto a 55 mile an hour
freeway, so staff has concerns that there is definitely a public safety concern and I
believe Mr. Warren and Tim -- Mr. Curns supported that in their memo to you as well.
So, with that staff is recommending denial of the application and I would be happy to
answer any questions you may have.
De Weerd: Thank you, Bill. Council, any questions?
Bird: I have none.
Rountree: I have none right now.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Oh, I'm sorry. Bill, clarify for me -- Harris Street -- did you say that's on the
half mile?
Parsons: Councilman Zaremba, that is correct.
Zaremba: And does that align with what I saw in our previous map of what I think is
Rumple or Rimple -- Rumple it looks like across the street?
Parsons: Councilman Zaremba, yes, that is correct.
Zaremba: And that's likely to be signalized at some point, since it's on the half mile?
Parsons: In the permits that were granted by ITD, one of the mitigation factors was the
applicant was to construct that intersection and provide signalization for that intersection
at the half mile.
Zaremba: Okay. Thank you.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes.
Hoaglun: Question for Bill, if we could go back one slide. I was just curious on Harris
and for Amity as you're -- as you're headed south are they going to have a right turn
only lane at Harris and Amity or is it just going to be two lane as you head south and,
then, that would -- the right lane would function as a through lane and a right turn lane?
Parsons: Councilman Hoaglun, if I hear you correctly, I think you're asking will there be
a deceleration lane.
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Hoaglun: Yes.
Parsons: That would be correct. ITD has conditioned them to provide that. I'm not sure
if it goes to the -- Mr. Splett is here from ITD and he's more familiar with ITD has
granted them, so maybe I'll defer that to him and let him kind of take the reins on that for
you.
Hoaglun: Okay. Good idea. Thanks, Bill.
De Weerd: Okay. Would the applicant like to make comment at this time? Good
evening. If you will, please, state your name and address for the record.
Whailon: Madam Mayor, Council Members for the City of Meridian, my name is
Brandon Whailon. My address is 855 Broad Street, Suite 300, and that's in Boise,
Idaho. 83702.
De Weerd: Brandon, you want to pull that mike up a little bit? Thanks.
Whailon: Thank you. We are pleased to be before you here tonight. This has been a
very detailed application. There have been many applications made before this city, as
Bill stated. We had a -- we started with a comprehensive plan land use amendment.
We also had annexation and rezone hearings both before the Planning Commission
and the City Council and, then, we got caught on the development agreement
stipulation that no access would be granted to State Highway 69 or South Meridian
Road. So, then, we were involved in a process of challenging that decision. And, then,
we did reach an agreement with ITD and we pulled that challenge from the court system
and we are now before you here tonight to seek variance from your standards to allow
access from our property onto the state highway system. We believe that the merits of
our application do warrant the consideration to vary from your codes. We believe that
the -- the design that we have put forth stand on its own. We understand that when you
allow more access, there is the potential for more conflict. But we think that the design
that we have put before you, coupled with the -- the other improvements that are
scheduled -- there was a question earlier asked about a dedicated right-hand turn on
Harris and Amity and we do believe that those are scheduled. Dedicated southbound
right-hand turn lanes will be provided. There will be -- that's part of the channelization.
But there will be improvements made to the signalization both on Amity and a new
signal on Harris, which will help -- help the mobility, as well as providing the access to
our site. Our design also has dedicated deceleration -- deceleration lanes, so when
somebody wants to access one of these three access points that we are proposing,
they can get off of the state highway system, decel, and, then, make the turn onto our
property, will not inhibit those that are more concerned with mobility to continue south
on South Meridian Road. So, at this point in time we are asking you to approve our
variance request, allowing three access points to our mixed use development on South
Meridian Road. We feel that our application, based upon its own merits, meets the
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requirements identified by the Meridian UDC, by the criteria listed within for a variance.
The first one states that shall not grant a special privilege that is not otherwise allowed
in the district. And we have noticed that there are 11 full access points and two right-in,
right-outs -- two right-in access points from I-84 to our site and so we feel that this is --
access to the state highway system has been allowed in the past. A portion of our
decision to buy the property was that there were seven deeded access points conveyed
to the property. We are only asking to exact three of those access points. So, we are
hoping that the access points that were deeded to our property owners -- we are only
asking that -- three of those to be used. Item No. 2 states that the variance relieves an
undue hardship because of characterization of the site. Again, our site is a half mile
long in length along South Meridian Road, with a residential street to the north, Harris,
and, then, we have an arterial to the south, which is -- which is Amity. And the
comments -- our site design we felt that allowing multiple access points to our site would
alleviate congestion in any one -- one center and we feel that if access was only
provided to our site on Harris and Amity, that it would overload those systems and
create congestion problems in the vicinity. So, not allowing the access would create
undue hardship within the vicinity. And those comments were actually solidified by
ACHD in their comments that they submitted in 2008. They do state that Amity Road
would have congestion problems if that was the only access to their site, but they were
willing to accept that degradation. But they recognized there would be degradation to
their facilities if no access on South Meridian Road were allowed. And, thirdly, the
variance shall not be detrimental to the public health and safety and welfare of the
general public. And as I stated earlier, we feel that our design stands on its own merits.
We feel that plan improvements to signalization to Harris and Amity, the right-hand turn
lanes -- the dedicated right-hand turn lanes for southbound traffic, both on Harris and
Amity, coupled with our site properly spaced -- our properly spaced access points,
improved with deceleration lanes and a median restricting left-hand movements out on
South Meridian Road, will create a situation where mobility is preserved, access is
provided, without sacrificing safety. At this point in time I would stand for any questions,
but I would also let you know that we do have our consultants from Kittelson and
Associates, if you have any questions about the detailed designs or about the details of
our designs, he would be able to speak to that in a more educated manner, but I would
be free to answer any questions that you may have.
De Weerd: Thank you. Council, any questions for the applicant at this time?
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I'd like to see the specifics of the design. I would like to see
somebody stand up and say that the safety of Meridian Road will not be compromised
by these accesses, either a representative from Kittelson or ITD or both. I have read
the memo, I see what you're saying, but I don't have the specific design details. If they
are the standard designs that have been used, for instance, on Eagle Road, they don't
work and they are not acceptable. So, I would want to see those specifically before I
could make any kind of a determination for whether or not there is any compromise or
not to the public safety, which is our number one issue.
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Whailon: Absolutely.
Rountree: My number one issue.
Whailon: Both of those people would be willing to speak.
De Weerd: Please state your name and address for the record.
Daleiden: Andy Daleiden with Kittelson and Associates. Address 101 South Capital
Boulevard, Suite 301, Boise, Idaho. 83702.
De Weerd: Thank you, Andy.
Daleiden: Thank you, Madam Mayor and Members of the Council. I'm a senior
engineer with Kittelson and Associates. I have been working on this project since 2008
when we developed the traffic impact study. Tonight I'd like to go through a couple
elements associated with the access points as part of the overall access proposal for
State Highway 69. A couple elements just for background. I know staff and the
applicant have talked about this, but first the three access points are part of the
proposal. There are two right-in, right-out, driveways, which are shown in the green
circles and, then, one right-in, right-out, left-in driveway shown in red. This access
proposal, as noted, was approved by ITD in March 2012. A couple things associated
with the design of the access proposal. First, these -- the driveways themselves that are
proposed, the deceleration lanes, that is the southbound right turn lane associated with
the -- the driveways at each location, meet ITD and AASHTO's design standards.
AASHTO -- American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials. They
have a manual that provides geometric design standards for all types of roadway
facilities that as engineers we utilize in the design. The key elements that I'm going to
touch on here are, one, the right turn lanes and, then, also the raised median, which
both provide an -- provide the access plan on State Highway 16 to provide accessible
traffic operations and mitigate the safety concerns that have been raised. The proposed
right turn lane design at the three access -- so, the first is for the southbound right turn
lane that there is a full width lane associated with that right turn. There is the
associated taper length that would be provided for that to meet ITD and AASHTO
design standards fora 55 mile per hour facility. The safety enhancements here
associated with the right turn lane, there is really two elements. One is the deceleration
lane provides the opportunity for vehicles traveling southbound, who are making that
right turn, to separate away from vehicles that are traveling south as through traffic. So,
they are able to diverge or separate, which reduces the potential conflict that would be
there if you were providing that deceleration lane. The second part is the right turn
vehicles, as I say, are able to utilize that lane, they are able to slow down and begin to
slow down to a point where they are able to make that turn into the driveway at an
appropriate turning speed. The other part to this -- and in this case what's shown is
there is a channelized island. That channelized island is there as striping. It's
pavement marking that's there for the -- into the right turn to direct -- provide positive
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guidance for the southbound right turn into the driveway. The reason it's -- it's not
shown as a raised median there for that location is because we have araised -- as part
of the proposal is a raised center median, which is shown in the black. And I will get
into a little more discussion on that. On the next slide the proposed raised median on
State Highway 69, which is proposed to extend from Harris Street down to Amity Road,
it would be a full raised median to provide a -- a physical barrier between several of the
movements. One, it addresses the concerns for through traffic on State Highway 69,
providing a raised median, provides the positive the positive guidance in terms of
traveling north and south. It also reduces the conflict associated with the potential head
on type crash for that segment of State Highway 69. The second part is the raised
median provides the element of reducing vehicle conflicts out of the site. So, many of
the access points that were referred to on Eagle Road have -- are a full access or they
might even be developed as a right-in, right-out, but because there isn't a physical
barrier along that -- that highway, it doesn't prevent vehicles from turning out of the site
and so in this proposal the raised median provides that physical barrier and provides the
guidance for vehicles to travel out of the site as a right turn and not be able to make that
left turn out. The last part associated with the raised median is the buffer that it
provides for through vehicles and turning vehicles. This access that's shown right now,
this is the middle access, which is the right-in -- proposed right-in, right-out, left-in and
the raised median provides the separation between the opposing through traffic to
provide a physical barrier between the northbound left turn into the site and the
southbound through traffic. And just a couple of closing statements and, then, I will
open it up to any questions you may have. Where we see this as -- this access
proposal as a good plan for this development, one is it restricts left turns out for safety.
That, typically, is the most critical -- the critical movement out of a -- out of a driveway is
that left turn out, both from a traffic operation and safety perspective and so this
proposal restricts all left turns out in terms of providing it through the right-in, right-out
channelization, as well as through the raised median on State Highway 69. The second
part is it provides the best operational performance in terms of achieving the level of
service at Harris Street, at Amity Road, State Highway 69, as well as at the other
access points that are part of this development. It provides the most balanced
distribution of traffic entering and exiting without compromising the safety aspects
through going to full access. If you had full access on State Highway 69 between Harris
and Amity, that would distribute traffic the best, but that's been restricted to address the
safety conflicts and provide a reasonable proposal on State Highway 69 in this half mile
segment and so -- and the resultant is out of the access scenarios that were looked at,
this provides the best operational performance. The lastly -- the last point is that looking
State Highway 69 as an entire corridor, this opportunity to provide a raised median to
look at a half mile segment and providing driveways that are right-in, right-outs with
deceleration lanes as part of development proposal at the start allows the opportunity
for a corridor to be developed with reasonable access while balancing both traffic
operations and safety on the corridor.
De Weerd: Thank you, Andy. Does that answer your question?
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April 24, 2012
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Rountree: Madam Mayor, you show -- you pointed out two intersections or two points of
access. I believe the third point of access would be the same with raised median
access -- or raised median -- center median.
Daleiden: Yes. Yes, Councilman Rountree, Madam Mayor, the -- all three access
points provide the southbound right turn deceleration lanes as shown and, then,
second, the raised median is part of that and that raised median extends from Harris
Street down to Amity Road.
Rountree: Where you have the three-quarter access would U-turns be prohibited?
Daleiden: That -- the U-turn question -- we haven't -- that hasn't come up in terms of
discussion. Right now we would -- it probably would be restricted, but if that was
something that -- from an agency perspective that would be looked at, then, that would
be explored further.
Rountree: And, finally, you identify yourself as a senior engineer. Do you go by the title
of a traffic engineer as well?
Daleiden: No. I'm a registered civil engineer. For 12 years I have been practicing as a
transportation engineer and have developed over 100 traffic impact studies, as well as
corridor plans for public agencies.
Rountree: Okay. Thank you.
De Weerd: Any other questions? Mr. Hoaglun?
Hoaglun: Yes, Madam Mayor. Thank you. Andy, just aquestion -- since I'm not a
traffic engineer. There is no acceleration lanes for those right -- right-in, right-outs on
that -- is that -- is there a reason why we don't use those -- those aren't utilized?
Daleiden: Council Hoaglun and Madam Mayor, the acceleration lanes at -- at the
driveways -- the element that comes up is, one, when you're looking at this design,
providing the acceleration lane would start to have an impact on the deceleration lane
areas as you go down along that corridor. So, providing that would end up turning --
would end up being a resultant for the acceleration lane is actually more of what's called
an auxiliary lane and so you really don't have any designation in that segment between
a southbound right turn turning into the site and asouthbound -- and a right turn leaving
the site to accelerate. They end up becoming part of -- really part of their own system
and from a safety standpoint we will look at the right turn out in terms of are there -- is
there the ability for that vehicle to turn out and find a gap in the traffic stream and given
that there are signals along this corridor that is a -- that supports that element in terms
of the metering effect that would occur from -- from traffic signals and being able to find
gaps within the traffic stream, even in those heavy -- heavy peak flows.
Meridian City Council
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Hoaglun: Okay. So, from what I understand, then, you want that traffic, when they
make that right turn, to get out into that lane and go forward and, then, other traffic that
might be decelerating that can veer off and go into a decel lane and do that. And did I
read somewhere -- I think it was these are approximately -- approximately 660 feet
apart from each -- each drive?
Daleiden: Yes. Approximately.
Hoaglun: Okay. Thank you.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Extremely uncomfortable. Just -- to me it's proposing to repeat errors that
we have discovered don't work on Eagle Road. Highway 69 is going to be a major
corridor. I understand the statements and opinions that you have given. I don't see any
statistics to support them necessarily. But help me -- help me understand what kind of
traffic volumes you considered for Meridian Road. Are you guaranteeing that this is
safe at full build out, of Kuna and Meridian, which means about four times the current
traffic? What statistics are you using?
Daleiden: Councilman Zaremba, Madam Mayor, the traffic volumes that were used to
analyze this corridor, they were collected in 2008 to start at the beginning of when we
were developing the traffic impact study. The State Highway 69 corridor along the site
frontage there, daily traffic volumes at that time was 24,000 vehicles per day. The
projections were looked out to -- at that time five years to 2013, but looking out five
years you could use a similar assessment here at this stage and projections on this
roadway were at 35,000 vehicles per day and that includes the traffic associated with
background growth from -- from the region, based on the land use -- the approved land
use projections at that time associated with a complex regional demand model. And,
then, second it also includes the development associated with -- with this -- with this
development. Currently right now looking at Ada County Highway District traffic count
on State Highway 69 in this location right along the site frontage current volumes are
around 21,500 vehicles per day and so we have actually seen -- right now from a
standpoint seen a decline in traffic volumes, but our proposal is looking out into the
future to accommodate the regional growth in the area and the traffic conditions that
would be there and found that traffic operationally -- it provides acceptable operations
with the driveways and with the design elements associated with the right turn
deceleration lanes and --
Zaremba: Until 2013 you said.
Daleiden: We looked out into 2013 initially and, then, also looked out to 2030 as part of
the planning year horizon.
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April 24, 2012
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Zaremba: Okay. I didn't hear that part.
De Weerd: Any other questions from Council? Did you have comments over there?
Niemeyer: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, from the fire department
perspective as I look at this layout, we do have concerns over this, especially with what
you're seeing on the screen currently. This is a recreation of Eagle Road in front of St.
Luke's. I have traveled this Highway 69 several times responding out to the southern
portion of our district. I can tell you I have used the middle lane many times. As traffic
gets clogged and backed up even more, that open middle lane is going to be a
necessity. If you look at how this lays out currently, if you have those -- those middle
obstructions and that southern -- those southern lanes are blocked, it's going to force us
into oncoming traffic or significantly delay a response. I have seen this on Eagle Road
in front of St. Luke's where we have had to either get up on the curb and try and ride it,
as opposed to Eagle Road between Franklin and Fairview that has a middle lane that's
open. Some people would say why don't you just wait until the lane opens up, but if I
can get to the left side of a vehicle, they can clearly see me, then, they don't -- they
don't pull out in front of me and I still have an open lane of traffic. So, personal
experience southbound on this road in the area that's behind discussed, we have had to
use that middle lane that's currently open.
De Weerd: Okay. Any other questions or comments? Lieutenant Overton.
Overton: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I don't have any questions in relation
to his presentation, but I have comments afterwards on the project.
De Weerd: Okay.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: This is sideways subject, not the subject of what we are doing tonight, but as
long as the fire chief is here, I would ask acomment -- there was some discussion
about how close one of the buildings is to the Williams pipeline and I know we have had
people studying that and discussing it --
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba, I think we will just keep it to the access points tonight.
Zaremba: I can't ask that question. I'm sorry. I said it was sideway.
De Weerd: It -- it is, even in my mind tonight. Anything further on -- for Andy?
Hoaglun: Yes, Madam Mayor. One question, Andy. On the right-in, right-out islands
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April 24, 2012
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that are there, on Eagle Road there are some that -- they really don't work. I mean
people turn left and they are not a barrier to making that left-hand turn. How are these
different than what we have seen on Eagle Road currently?
Daleiden: Council Member Hoaglun, Madam Mayor, the right-in, right-outs here and the
point about the difference between this proposal and Eagle Road and the ability for a
right turn vehicle leaving the driveway and turning -- and resulting in it being able to
make a left turn out onto the facility, that's the reason why we have the raised median.
Hoaglun: Okay.
Daleiden: The raised median provides that that restriction and provides that positive
guidance for directing folks through the -- there is a channelization that's striped at the
right-in, right-out driveway -- let me go to the closeup.
Hoaglun: Andy, (might -- I'm sorry. I wasn't real clear. I was thinking of the police chief
-- or fire chief's comments there about the median issue and Eagle Road does not have
median in that -- in those particular areas at Lowe's and whatnot and so these -- these
aren't any -- if we have to do something with the median, we will have to do something
with that curbing to make it hard for people to -- to go left, either coming in or coming
out. So, these are the same as what currently is in Eagle? Because of the median in
the middle right now they don't have to be bigger, so they are fairly basic.
De Weerd: In front of St. Luke's?
Hoaglun: In front -- well, I was thinking over by Lowe's. In front of Lowe's and Famous
Dave's and down over there. Those are right-in, right-outs, but people pull in and go left
into the development without any -- hardly any hindrance. They just have to do a little
bit of a -- a loop on it, but not much.
De Weerd: Those designs are horrible.
Hoaglun: And, then, what I want to find out, Andy, are those -- and I know you have the
median here, so I'm trying to think, okay, is it the same design that we are looking at
right now?
Daleiden: Council Member Hoaglun, Madam Mayor, this design is -- is much different
than what you see on Eagle Road. The element of having a raised median for a half
mile segment with having right turn deceleration lanes at the driveways, is considerably
different than that corridor. This -- this design is a very common approach to access
management throughout the country in more of a recent time period than what was --
what has been done over the history of projects and so in this case the -- the raised
median, that component, there is a lot of ways that that can be designed in terms of how
it looks, the width of it, the size of it, there is a lot of elements that could be done to that,
but the proposal is that there would be some sort of raised median on -- on this segment
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
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of corridor to prohibit that left turn out that you're referring to.
Hoaglun: Okay. And I just have one last question to ask you that I will probably ask
ITD and ACHD and that is if we were to do something like this, as you're proposing, and
we were setting up -- we would set a precedent and, then, if that were to occur on every
mile stretch for a half mile from Meridian city limits to the city of Kuna, they adopt the
same thing, from your opinion are we still allowing efficient traffic flow or do we have a
problem, based on your experience?
Daleiden: Council Member Hoaglun, Madam Mayor, the -- the mobility on the corridor
when you're looking at -- at these segments --
Hoaglun: Yes.
Daleiden: -- an access point, anytime you're at an access, it does have the potential for
affecting -- having the effect on the flow of traffic. The design elements that we start
with and that goes to -- if you start with a full access that's going to have significantly
more impact on the flow of the traffic there from an operations standpoint, but also of
safety. And as we are looking at this proposal we are starting to restrict turn
movements to get. to a point where you're able to mitigate the impacts on the traffic flow
to a minimum. Can I say that it's going to reduce it to -- and have no effect? I can't --
can't make that statement, but I can say that we are mitigating the effects of the -- the
right turn traffic that is -- that would be decelerating by providing that right turn
deceleration lane. There may still be inherent reduction in traffic mobility on a corridor,
significant by no means -- I don't think it would be. But there will be some.
Hoaglun: Okay. Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Any further questions?
Zaremba: Madam Mayor, just a short one.
De Weerd: But I will say your answer has to be ten words or less.
Zaremba: Just review for me the accesses that have been proposed on Amity if you
would. It looked to me like there is one road, backage road, and, then, two driveways?
Am I seeing that correctly? There was a larger representation in -- somewhere we had
a larger picture of that.
Daleiden: Yeah. Maybe we can bring up the other one, Bill. Thanks. Essentially on
Amity -- on Amity Road there are three access points proposed. The first access point
where the arrow is, that's aright-in, right-out and the mid -- middle access point that's a
full access as proposed and, then, the backage road is a full access. And the intent
here is to -- is to provide a full distribution of the site to be able to both access Amity
Road, Harris Street, as well as State Highway 69 in a balanced manner.
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April 24, 2012
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Zaremba: Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Anything else from Council?
Rountree: Just semantics here, but, Andy, you indicated with Mr. Hoaglun's question
that any point of access has the possibility of affecting the traffic continuity or -- can you,
in your infinite wisdom give me an example where that wouldn't be the case?
Daleiden: So, Councilman Rountree, Madam Mayor, if we were to provide an access
point with a deceleration lane, you know, that extended all the way back to -- you know,
for an extended distance, you know, that has the potential maybe not to have -- see that
impact. If you were to do a formal research study you'd probably come away with there
is still a firm reduction. The numbers that I can, you know, cite in terms of conflicts, in
terms of adding access, you know, .25 miles per hour affects -- you know, per access.
And, you know, over -- as you increase and that access element in that statement
needs to be couched with an element of that's based on looking at -- you know, most
likely, you know, full access elements. But to restrict that, that affect may be less on the
traffic flow. So, the research that's out there, it's not looking at just the right-in, right-out
-- the right-in, right-out, left-ins, and full access, it's combining that all into a pot .and so
that reduction that I'm referring to -- that's based on, you know, having an access and it
could be a full access type element, the affects are .25 miles per hour.
Rountree: Of the overall overage?
Daleiden: Overall average.
Rountree: Okay.
De Weerd: Okay.
Rountree: Thank you.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Daleiden: Thanks.
De Weerd: Okay. Dave?
Splett: I don't suppose I can pass on this one?
Rountree: You might wish you could.
Splett: My name is Dave Splett. I supervise the access management group for ITD
District Three. Our address is 8150 West Chinden, beautiful Garden City. I have a very
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April 24, 2012
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short -- sorry?
De Weerd: And he did sign up as neutral.
Splett: Yes, ma'am.
De Weerd: I just wanted to point that out.
Splett: All right. Which is really going out on a limb; right? Okay. I have a very short
thing to say. I suspect you may have a question or two forme at the end. ITD did grant
the three accesses that you have seen in the many graphics. All three as shown have
some level of left turn controls. The final design of each access is conceptual at this
stage, because none of us know what the exact land use plan is going to be. We tied
their final design plans into the land use plan that your city approves. But the graphics
that they showed you are accessible to the district based on the land use plan that's
shown -- that was shown to the district also. All three of those access permits are -- are
contingent upon the city accepting them. ITD's actions do not require the city to do
anything. That's the end of my brief presentation and I suspect there might be a
question or two.
De Weerd: Thank you, Dave.
Splett: Thank you, ma'am.
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, thank you. Dave, the information we got from ITD -- your
letter with the attachment identifying what was going to occur based on the conceptual
plan was mute really and truly on the point of safety. Our concern is -- is the safety in
this corridor going to be compromised. And by that is it going to be a significant impact
or is this something individually or in combination with other similar events on Highway
69 going to create another Eagle Road? We live with that every day, as do you. We
don't need another one.
Splett: Mayor and Council, you're right. In fact, I have to live with this more, because I
live in Kuna, so I get to pass it every day. ITD's focus and our mission statement has
evolved over time. In the past all we wanted to do was move cars. The current
administration and our legislature have shown us the light and encouraged us to place
greater emphasis on economic development. The recommended plan and the
approved permits are considered by ITD to be a balance of traffic operation safety and
support of economic development. Anytime you add an access -- as Andy explained,
anytime you add an access or a car or a truck or a bike or horse, you -- I stretched the
truth on the horse part. But you always decease safety. The district's position, though,
is that the site has mitigated it's impacts as well as can be and the approved plan
balances the district's mission statement.
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April 24, 2012
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Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes.
Rountree: If I might. And I have read that. My question to you is how do you do that
balancing act? I don't see an analysis. I don't know that the department has an
economic modeling tool. Actually, I do know they have one, but I'm pretty sure they
don't know how to use it yet. So, is this just based on the idea that there might be some
businesses out there and that's a good thing or do you have a way of balancing that,
other than subjectively?
Splett: Madam Mayor and Council, that's an extremely difficult question.
Rountree: But it's an important one to have an answer.
Splett: Yes. And I have an answer, I just have to make sure I say it clear and
concisely. But I don't really want to. No, I'm just kidding. This is a difficult thing and
because it's so difficult this project and the decisions were made at a level higher than
mine. I don't know the exact wording and how all the balances were made. I know the
decision was made and I know I'm applying it. And I wish I knew more, but I -- it was
just -- it was made outside of my office.
Rountree: Madam Mayor. I can appreciate that, Dave, but I -- I think somewhere, some
place that decision needs to be documented on how it was derived, because that is --
that's the -- that's the tipping point here --
Splett: Yes.
Rountree: -- in my opinion and I know in your -- in your previous life and other
employment you have gone by the title of traffic engineer and I'm going to put you on
the spot and I don't mean to, but as a traffic engineer and not an ITD employee, can you
stamp these plans as a professional engineer?
De Weerd: You don't have to answer that.
Splett: That's what I was going to say. I don't have the authority to do anything.
Rountree: Thank you.
Splett: The decision was made elsewhere.
Rountree: Thank you.
Splett: But you -- but you folks are -- are right, it is a balancing act.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 44 of 75
Rountree: Yeah.
Splett: And you have to balance what is important to you. ITD has already decided
what's important to them. Our actions do not force you to take an action.
Rountree: We understand that. Thank you, Dave. I didn't mean to put you on the spot.
Splett: It's happened once or twice before, so --
Rountree: I'm sure it has.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: If I might try something here and the same question I asked Andy. Because
the dorms is this: I mean businesses need access, they want access, they look at the
traffic volumes and future traffic volumes, hey, that's a great number with a good
customer base going by our stores. This is a good place to locate. So, we provide
them the access and, you know, ITD is saying, hey, that's economic development, we
want that, so, okay, that's fine. But when I -- when I -- and I'm not a traffic engineer, so,
then, I try to look out and say, okay, if we replicate this on every mile and whether it
takes ten years, 20 years, 30 years, if we do this same thing I don't want to cause a
situation where it's bad for businesses to be located there, because we have created a
gridlock situation. So, that's the balance I try to find is, okay, how does this work? So,
if I can kind of have you extrapolate -- if you look down with your experience, you have
something like this on every section and it's on the east side and it's on the west side,
different and alternates and we go with something like this and these traffic counts are
doubled, as we saw the growth on Eagle Road, it just exploded and we are dealing with
those type of things, are we getting close to gridlock that it becomes bad for business
and bad for economic development.
Splett: Madam Mayor and Council, what -- what you're saying is are the roads going to
get so congested nobody drives there anymore, is that kind of --
Hoaglun: If we -- if we adopt this type of access or are there other ways of handling this
that are better.
Splett: If you want to move cars you have no access and no signals and a flat straight
road. If you want economic growth you have driveways every 12 feet. If you want to
balance them you put accesses at the 1/8th mile. And I can't tell you what you choose
to do with your city. I can tell you that from our standpoint, although there is a decrease
in -- sorry there will be a decrease in safety, it's mitigated by the site impacts and
balancing that with the district's mission statement our administration decided this was
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 45 of 75
the proper solution.
Hoaglun: I understand that and I appreciate that. And the other balance for us is the
safety aspect transportationwise, economic development, and, then, we enter in the fire
department and the police department equation of that, of their safety response, and
how do we -- how do we make that all work and it's -- it's not easy.
De Weerd: I guess that goes back to Councilman Rountree's question, if you took that
corridor and had an access every 8th of a mile is that going to be a safe corridor?
Splett: The interstate has no accesses, except at two mile intervals and we have an
accident rate of about 1.4 accidents per million vehicle miles. Fairview has about three
or four times that accident rate. Okay. But there is no businesses on the interstate.
So, it's up to you folks to figure out whether you want businesses or not. If you look at
the interstate all you have is subdivisions and mini storage and industrial parks and
Caterpillar tractor places that back -- that back up to it and nobody has any access. But
you go down Eagle Road, you get Rosaur's and G.I. Joe's -- I guess that's gone now.
Lowe's and you get Albertson's and those kinds of things. And the city has to make the
trade off of what you think is -- is best. If you can stay to our 8th of a mile access, then,
it's acceptable to us. If you go past that it's not acceptable to us. If you want to go less,
that's your business. I'm sorry. If it helps you, having done this for a couple of years
now, you can -- you could graph -- and everyone has -- graph the change in accident
rates with the increase in number of access points. Okay? And there is a general
increase. I can't point to this, but you know what I mean. But the increase only goes up
once you get past about ten accesses per mile. So, you can stay two, four, or six, like
that, you will have a higher accident rate than the interstate, but it's not much more.
Once you get past that is where you have issues. Eagle Road is still safer than
Fairview is and Eagle Road carries more cars at a higher speed. So, someplace we
and you have been able to balance access and mobility and that's where you fall -- you
come -- where your group comes in to figure out where you want to be. And if you stay
less than the 8th mile access ITD is happy.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes.
Rountree: Dave, thank you. That's exactly the kind of things I wanted to hear. Some
substance. I appreciate that.
Splett: Well, I'm trying to help you. You know what, f'm constrained, because -- I mean
there is lots of -- like having 87 wives and they are all over on State Street.
Rountree: Be careful.
Splett: Well --
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
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De Weerd: There is not very many women in the room, but --
Splett: People tell me what to do and we are trying to balance everything out. I think
we came out with agood -- with a good plan. Your client -- the landowner seems
happy. Your staff isn't as happy. ITD accepts it. I think you're in a pretty good spot
but --
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: One request, if it's possible. Would it be possible to get the rational of the
balancing that was done at whatever level from ITD? I know it didn't come out of your
shop, but somewhere.
Splett: You're asking me if I can make someone else do something.
Rountree: No. I'm asking if the City of Meridian requests from the Idaho Transportation
Department, can you provide us the rational -- the balancing rational, so we have some
rational to -- to equate with the balancing we are going to have to do to do this variance,
because this, in fact, is a precedenting set -- a precedent setting endeavor for both of
us.
De Weerd: Is there a weighed model or a matrix that they use to evaluate the economic
value to allow greater access? Is that what you're asking?
Splett: Madam Mayor --
Rountree: Something -- whether it's a mode or --
Splett: Madam -- your group is really clever. There is an answer and I will make one for
-- for you. I will consider this a formal request. That's what our group does.
De Weerd: Okay.
Splett: And since we cover ten counties it comes up a lot. In fact, the last time was last
night. I will try -- I will assemble something. I'm not sure it would apply specifically to
this case, because as I said, I wasn't intimately involved in this decision and I will make
every effort to give you something. Is that acceptable?
De Weerd: That is perfect.
Rountree: That would be terrific if you could do that
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 47 of 75
Splett: And you want it by 10:00, 10:30 tomorrow, is that --
De Weerd: Well, we will give you ten minutes.
Splett: Ma'am, I'll make every effort. It takes actions by more than me and so I can't
promise it, but I will make every effort to give you what you need. I will work with your
staff, is that the best way to --
Rountree: Yes.
Splett: -- do it?
De Weerd: Yes .
Splett: They are good guys, by the way. And ladies.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Thank you, Dave.
Rountree: Thanks, Dave.
Splett: Thank you. I will be here if something else comes up.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. Justin. We will try not to do the same to you.
Lucas: No. I enjoy it, Madam. Mayor, so have at it. For the record, Justin Lucas. I
represent the Ada County Highway District. Business address is 3775 Adams Street in
Garden City.
De Weerd: I guess you would both have to enjoy it somehow.
Lucas: Exactly. There is lots of reasons why you get into public service. Being berated
by public official is probably one of them. So --
Rountree: We are just curious.
Lucas: What was that?
Rountree: We are just curious.
Lucas: Yeah. I think it's been a good discussion tonight. ACHD's interest in this
application -- obviously, these access points are not on an ACRD roadway, so I need to
make that very clear. But we do have an interest, because we do operate a regional
system. Although we have no jurisdiction over ITD roadways, they are part of that
regional system. Both Harris Street and Amity Road are under ACRD jurisdiction and
the -- one of the access points on Amity Road has been used as justification for the
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 48 of 75
access points on the state highway. So, that being stated, ACHD fully supports
Meridian's access management standards. We think they follow best practices from an
access management standpoint. We support them. We have tried to model some of
our access management policies after those standards. Access management is not just
a traffic engineering issue, it's not just about serving a site, it's broader than that and it
really in some ways is a policy issue. Some of the justification tonight to allow the
accesses was they want balanced distribution for the site. The point of access
management is to not have balanced distribution. That's one of the ideas behind it. We
are trying to force people that want to access the site to do it in a place that may not be
as convenient as directly off of a state highway. The reason for that is because the
state highway operates at a higher speed, it has more volume, and by allowing access
points on and off of that you create conflict. Anytime you have access you have conflict.
We can go into the statistics and all these things, but anytime you add access you add
conflict, you add potential, you have -- as everyone stated tonight, there is going to be
some degradation to the mobility of the corridor and there is going to be some increase
in accidents, because accidents happen at intersections. Most of them do. That being
stated, looking at this site .ACHD would prefer, even though it has a negative effect on
Amity Road, taking away these access points does place Amity Road somewhat in peril.
But after reviewing this we thought -- and made the decision it's better to sacrifice some
of the capacity on Amity than to sacrifice the capacity and safety on a 55 mile per hour
state highway. So, that was our justification. We recognize that. And so after -- after
looking at the -- at the application that was our position is we will work with the applicant
on Amity Road and do everything we can to make that work, whether that be a signal at
the quarter mile -- which is a good policy, but maybe better than having access points
on State Highway 69. So, that was kind of our justification as we looked at it as we
reviewed the traffic study, those are some of the things that we looked at. I'm not going
to go on more than that, really. I would just like to state that ACRD supports access
management and we think it's important. We have all seen what happens when you --
when we don't do it and we really -- at least from a staff level -- and I think your staff --
we support your staff's recommendation tonight. And from a staff level and just from a
planning perspective and as a professional planner I always advocate and try to
advocate for the long view. Let's look at this for the long -- the long haul and make
decisions that are best -- for economic development of the valley, you know, and for all
of the different competing interests and certain it is a balancing act and I don't envy your
position. But I just want to make that clear that, basically, what I stated is in a letter
form that was submitted to the city. ACHD has stated that by allowing these access
points on Highway 69 we are not as amenable to working with the applicant for access
on Amity, because we want to try and preserve access somewhere and if it's not going
to be on the state highway, we are going to try to get it on Amity Road as much as we
can, so that -- so that we are not allowing all these accesses. It's a total of seven
access point into the site. There is three on Amity, three on the south -- three on Amity
-- I'm sorry. Three on Amity Road, three on Eagle Road, and one on Harris, which is
the collector. So, seven access points. And we feel like that's a lot. And we feel like
they are not all necessary from a traffic engineering perspective and that's the findings
of our -- of our traffic engineers that reviewed the traffic study and I can certainly close
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 49 of 75
with that and don't want to take anymore of your time and I can stand for any questions
De Weerd: Okay. Any questions?
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Thank you. I appreciate that. And, again, I know Highway 69 is not an
ACHD road, but my assumption is that at full build out of Kuna and Meridian and the
areas around us, the traffic count on Eagle Road is going to be nearing a hundred
thousand and my question to you is would you argue with that or agree with that or
what's your sense?
Rountree: Meridian Road.
Lucas: No, I don't have the numbers, Madam Mayor, Councilman Zaremba. I don't
have the numbers in front of me. We could look at current projections and modeling.
Yeah, three highways -- these are major corridors. You know, Kuna and the area south
there, I don't know if you have seen their comprehensive plan, it's vast. They have
grand visions. And --
De Weerd: They have a new planning director.
Lucas: Yeah. Looking just at 2035 is probably not even an adequate look, because
there is a lot of growth available down there and the 2035 plan does not -- is not
comprehensive, it does not include the full build out of the city of Kuna, it doesn't include
the full build out of the City of Meridian. 2035 plan is constraining by a certain
population number. So, by saying we are taking a long view, that doesn't mean we are
looking at build out, that's not build out. And so I think the longer view is to really even
look larger. And, you know, I can't predict, you know, 50 years down the road, who
knows, we might all be flying around in cars. I don't know. But I think the demand for,
you know, personal vehicles doesn't seem to be waning anytime soon.
De Weerd: Well, no. Okay. Thank you.
Lucas: Thank you.
De Weerd: Any other questions?
Bird: I have none.
De Weerd: This is a public hearing. Is there anyone else who like to provide testimony
Okay. Would the applicant like to summarize? I think you kind of have the gist and I
know it's not new news -- is we don't want to continue to define insanity is continuing to
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 50 of 75
do the same thing, but expecting different results. We have an opportunity in a
transportation corridor to do it right and what is right and how do you define what is right
and I think that's a lot of the struggle in balancing safety, mobility and economic
development. It's one of those things in how do you define what it right.
Huffaker: Madam Mayor and Council, Brian Huffaker with Hawkins Companies. 855
Broad Street, Suite 300, Boise, Idaho. Excuse me. You know, I do appreciate what Mr.
Splett has shared with you as far as their mission, their philosophy, that they really do --
and Ithink they always have, but maybe it hasn't been a balanced evaluation between
mobility, safety, and economic development and I think recently under the new directors
you have really tried and successfully tried to get those three aspects to be balanced
with each other. And I appreciate his statements and their efforts to do that. I don't
think I can answer Councilman Rountree's question as far as the economic evaluation
to his satisfaction, but certainly we do look at the economics or a project when we come
into make a proposal. My -- my only -- maybe point to add from -- from our view of the
economic proposal here is we had Walmart under contract, we did not get the
accesses, they went away. There is an economic benefit to -- to developer, to the city,
to the community when we can have that safe, but efficient access for those businesses
to operate. So, of course, a change in the use is going to generate additional trips and
that's what we are talking about. This all results from more cars being put on the
roadways, because of a use or something that you're developing. If that was the only
basis for an evaluation, then, you would never approve anything, because any trip --
any additional car potentially creates additional conflicts or degrades safety to even the
minutest little -- little bit. For your decision -- or we are asking that you evaluate the
merits of our mitigation measures. That balance -- the increased trips with maintaining
that safety. We are proposing mitigations that are different than Eagle. I can't say that
it's a new fandangled mitigation and no one every thought of this, but we have looked
specifically at how we can channel those trips -- those vehicles in and out of the site
safely. And, Council Member Hoaglun, I hope your question got answered as far as the
medians. Ithink what you were talking about was we call them a pork chop where it
goes right around the side and people can just go around them. That's not what we are
proposing here, so -- we have always felt that ITD has the responsibility to take the first
action on this item. We appreciate that they did. They granted those permits. The
decision is now in front of you. You might think that seven accesses is a lot, but this is a
pretty big size piece of property and instead of taking a small piece of property on the
corner and kind of piecemealing the access as it comes along, this is one of those few
times that you have a half mile stretch of property in which you can evaluate that and
make that decision. We -- we understand your difficulty in your decision tonight. We
hope that you will see that we do meet the three standards for a variance, that there
have been -- even on Highway 69 other accesses approved and so we are not asking
for something that has not already been granted. We do believe that there is a hardship
being created on Amity and even ACRD acknowledges that that would be to the
detriment of their road and that we believe that through our mitigations that we are
mitigating any of that increase -- potential increase of safety through these appropriate
mitigation measures on -- with the improvements. With that we do ask that -- your
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 51 of 75
approval for our variance
discussion that we have ha
your time and the great
ou -- you understood the number
De Weerd: You know, I just wanted to make sure y
ouncil is concerned about not increasinge d fference~so creasing
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use safety is economic development.ecausenof the congest on, that
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businesses I talked to on Eagle Road that got to a p had customers say
of moving their business, because they to find
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didn't want to travel that road any
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De Weerd: Council, any questions?
Bird: I have none.
Rountree: I have none.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun. ou know. You
n: Brian, I'm just trying to find that sweee e down thearoad when there is a lot of
Hoaglu
need those accesses, but there is that point w d eo le say I avoid that
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businesses and there isou don t want to seeathat ou g s look at access number
road. As a business Y but I was just curious. Did you guy
in favor of this or anything,
two as being a full intersection with a light on it at --
?
Huffaker: On State Highway 69 __ wouldn't even consider that?
Hoaglun: On 69. Or did ITD at that time just say but I don't know that we
Huffaker: No, I think we -- I assume we had considered it,
pursued it.
request tonight and appreciate
d. So, thank you very much.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 52 of 75
Hoaglun: I'm not an engineer, I didn't know what the pros and cons of that are versus
just the two right-in, right-outs versus having four, you know, type of accesses. So,
yeah, I was just kind of curious to see -- again, searching for that sweet spot or what is
that fit that works, not only here, but for the whole corridor to have that perfect blend of
access, plus safety and traffic flow, so --
Huffaker: Madam Mayor, Councilman Hoaglun, we certainly looked at different options
and felt that what we -- we requested was a reasonable compromise with the access we
felt we might be able to get through -- through our access deeds, but felt that this was a
safe determination or for access to determine that safety. Absolutely.
De Weerd: Now, will access number two be constricted when traffic counts hit a certain
-- a certain number? Will they take out the right-in -- or left-in?
Huffaker: You know, I don't know that -- Madam Mayor, I don't know that there has
been any specific discussions to that point. So, there certainly hasn't been a target trip
generation that says at this point it will definitely be closed. That's probably something
that's always available to ITD to come in and say because of these standards, whether
it's number of cars or accidents, whatever they may evaluate that with, they could
probably come in and at some point make a decision such as that. And I might also
add, this is a difficult decision to make that will determine other accesses, not just our
property, of course. And Simplot across the street -- we control two of the corners here
at Amity and Meridian, but we have talked to those other two property owners for their
input and letting them know what the process is that we are going through and where
we stand. Neither of them have any set plan for development, so they can't really say,
yeah, that's what we want or don't want, but at this point they have -- they have been
supportive of what we were proposing on our -- for our project.
De Weerd: I know you have put a lot of time and effort into this.
Huffaker: And so has everyone. We appreciate everyone's efforts here.
De Weerd: Any further questions from Council? Thank you.
Huffaker: Thank you.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor, I did have a question for Warren on this deal. On your memo
here it did talk about -- by adding a single right-out only to Highway 69 it kind of took
care of the problem on Amity for -- is that kind of the near term? How far out were you
extrapolating that or timewise? What -- I guess the time view that you're looking at by
trying to determine what will work -- what was the thinking of that?
Stewart: Well, Councilman Hoaglun, Madam Mayor, other Members of the Council, you
know, Tim and I took a long look at this. I, actually, have to give Tim credit, he spent a
lot more time sort of digging into the details of this situation or this development than I
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 53 of 75
have, but certainly he and I have talked about this and a lot of it -- of the -- what you see
on the little memo that we put together has to do with the fact that we looked at the
engineers traffic study and based on that information it looked like there was -- if you --
if you add a single access onto Highway 69 there was some improvement to some of
the other accesses on -- on Amity and the other road to the -- to the north. However, at
some point, especially as you started adding the second and third access, there didn't
appear to be a lot of improvement in the convenience factor or benefit for those
additional accesses onto Highway 69 and certainly that was using the information that
they provided. So, the timelines that are associated with that would be the ones that
are -- you know, you heard the traffic engineer speak to when he was up at the podium.
Certainly they were looking at the existing traffic loading and, then, they looked out for
five years and, then, he commented that they looked out for, you know, the distance of
'30, but that's sort of what we were doing. We were kind of analyzing the information
that they had provided and sort of when we looked at that it looked like there was
marginal benefit with the additional accesses. Certainly there was some improvement
on Amity and the other road with one, but it was hard to -- it was hard to see where
there was a significant amount of benefit that would justify the additional accesses on
Highway 69. And, again, I would be happy to -- you know, Tim, like I said, he delved
more into the nuances of that and maybe there is -- I don't know if there is anything
you'd like to add.
Hoaglun: Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Council, if there is no further questions for staff, I would entertain a
motion to close the public hearing, unless you still seek further information.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor, if I might ask Dave about -- I just -- again, I want to look at all
options. So, if ITD -- if we were to look at access number two right in the middle, which
has the right-in, right-out and left only and we come up and we say, you know what, we
think that -- no access but Amity, Harris, and you need a light right there. Is that a good
option or is that a bad option from your perspective?
Splett: We -- this is Dave Splett, for the record. ITD again.
De Weerd: Thank you, Dave.
Splett: We eliminated that as an option, because we couldn't maintain signal
progression and keep the speed up.
Hoaglun: Okay.
Splett: You could -- if we were on a slower -- slower speed road like Fairview or State
Street --
Hoaglun: Or like they do on Milwaukee at the Home Depot and Barnes and Nobles.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 54 of 75
Splett: Exactly.
Hoaglun: Okay.
Splett: Once we get less than half a mile we can keep the signal progression up, so it
actually make it harder for the through traffic.
Hoaglun: Okay. Great. That's what I was looking for. Thank you very much, Dave.
Splett: That was an easy one.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, can I just throw another one out? Dave, if that same
configuration were to stay in place without the other two access points, as it's designed
now would that work? Not signalized.
Splett: I'm not sure what you're asking me. Could you say it again to make sure I --
Rountree: Access point number three is a three quarter and it's got medians --
Splett: Yeah.
Rountree: -- turn bay and the other two accesses go away.
Splett: I would probably still -- that would be a question for this client's traffic engineer.
We didn't analyze that option. Based on the traffic study I don't think it would hurt the
site. Does that make sense?
Rountree: Yeah.
Splett: Because I think the traffic study -- the person who should answer that is
Kittelson. Okay? But my reading is the same as your staff's -- is they don't need three
accesses. But, as I say, that's a question for Kittelson. I'm not sure I'm the best source
for that one.
De Weerd: That certainly is a question for the intensity of use, too.
Splett: See, we have the option to close off that middle one, as we are doing with the
rest with Eagle Road and the applicant knows we can always use police powers. About
70, 72 percent, something like that, percent of the accidents at driveways are left turns
in or left turns out. So, we can get -- eliminate -- and they have already eliminated all
the left turns out and all but one of the in's and we can take the in away if it gets to be
an accident issue. So, that by itself makes the road significantly safer. The other way
to look at it is if you have three accesses and the traffic's spread out over three points,
as opposed to congested -- more congested at one. And I -- I don't think we analyzed
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
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that. Our traffic engineering division does that and it wasn't me, so I'm just giving you
general rules. I don't know the specifics in the case. That would be another question
for Kittelson. Sorry. I think I know it all, but I don't.
De Weerd: Well, that might be another thing that we ask you to bring -- get information
on. You're measurement tool for the economic development, but also what is that --
that tipping point on when you would close that off. Use your police powers to remove
the left-in. I know you have a similar agreement on Eagle Road and what is the
threshold on that?
Splett: I don't want to --
De Weerd: Or is there a standard that you use?
Splett: When the -- the standard that I recommended was that if we get to the point
where the signal warrant is met. When you have enough traffic to justify a signal and
you don't want one, that's the point that you turn it off. And, actually, I have a really
good publication I did back around 2000 I actually got an award for -- of how you
balance that, how you can start with eight accesses per mile and, then, go down to six
and, then, four and, then, two, so that you can start economic growth by giving access
and, then, cut off the left turns as the traffic increases. But ITD has not embraced my
wonderful concept yet, but -- in specifics, but we are on the same path. Okay? So, the
-- the answer is we don't have a hard and fast rule, it's whenever the traffic engineering
group decides that there is a safety benefit to do that and we did not put that into our
permit, because that's normal police powers.
De Weerd: Well, yeah, but that's why you have that fine line of an arbitrary
determination.
Splett: Yeah. Arbitrary. You know, Imean -- I sympathize with you and your -- you
folks are asking us -- you're asking us --
De Weerd: You're professionals.
Splett: I know. -- for a number. We can't give you a number. We can give you an idea.
Sorry. I'm glad I'm on this side of the table this time, instead of that one, but --
Bird: That's what you get paid the big bucks for.
Splett: Yeah. Okay.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you, Dave.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, maybe we could have Andy come up and answer those
questions.
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De Weerd: Okay. If you will just state your name one more time for the record
Daleiden: Andy Daleiden with Kittelson and Associates. Madam Mayor, Members of
the Council, the question related to the -- if you limit it to access number two as shown
on the presentation, just limit it to just that access and closed access one and access
three -- our traffic analysis when we -- when we looked at the different scenarios we
looked at a no access scenario up to a three access scenario. All those scenarios work
from a traffic operation and a safety standpoint, there is just differences in terms of
improvements needed either on Amity Road or at Amity and State Highway 69 in terms
of turn lanes or under the situation as you get to no access you start looking at the
requirement for needing a signalized intersection on Amity Road, because as Dave
mentioned, you're -- you're distributing more of your traffic or loading it to -- to the points
on Amity or onto Harris and in this case a lot more traffic is based on just the layout of
the plan and where some of the commercial areas are shown, this should be down to
Amity Road and requiring that, so --
Rountree: I guess the question is if it was limited to one and it was access two -- Mr.
Hoaglun asked about signalizing it and David indicated that was looked at and was
dismissed because -- but if it was not signalized does it work?
Daleiden: Signalized or unsignalized -- as an engineer we can make most things, you
know, work, it just costs and so there is not an element to it for -- a signalized
intersection would work there. The impacts, as David said, you know, may be some
elements to mobility on State Highway 69, could you do some things of -- with
technology to -- you know, to improve or try to maintain the mobility on there with a
signal, you know, you could probably do some things, but it would probably still have an
effect on the mobility of State Highway 69 with a signal there, because anytime you add
a signal that does have an effect on the mobility.
Hoaglun: Councilman Bird, do you have --
Bird: Andy, I know it would take a little redesign of the plat and I don't know how much,
you know, you guys are sitting with this plat -- preliminary plat, but what about -- I got
some real concerns how close they are and I got some concerns -- if we want to keep
the traffic flow going of not having acceleration lanes, you come out in your right lane
and I understand as you are right now you don't dare do that, because you would be
having more rear-end collisions than you can shake a stick at. Have you thought about
having two right-in, right-out only in that, instead of having three of them and what that --
what does that do to the three we got along Amity?
Daleiden: Council Member Bird, Council Members, one of our scenarios was a two
access scenario and so that had two right-in, right-outs on State Highway 69 and, then,
the accesses on Amity Road and that would put you at that threshold of needing a
signal, you know, on Amity Road. It kind of plays that same border and I think that
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would be -- the element would be -- the element would be, you know, looking at that in
more refined detail, you know, in terms of the analysis. But it is something we looked as
part of a traffic impact study in terms of comparing scenarios.
Hoaglun: So, Andy, to follow up on that, what Councilman Bird asked -- so, if you have
the two right-in, right-outs, at one and three, that Amity Road would need to be
signalized right away as part of that; is that what your scenario came to the conclusion?
Daleiden: The distribution it starts putting on -- the traffic that you're loading on -- for the
southbound left-out, there is -- there is that point where you're getting to looking at a
signal there. I'd have to -- I can pull it up specifically of the specific number if that put it
over the threshold. I think where we have been, you know, looking at it as more of a
comparison between, you know, no access and three access -- three access scenario
on Amity Road in terms of the comparison and the reason we got to three accesses is
because of the deeded access -- accesses started with the property of seven and, then,
looking at a balanced approach to there to go to three, with still maintaining a level of --
being able to meet engineering standards, you know, within this corridor. So, that's
where -- from a starting point where we started looking at access configuration on this
corridor it started going -- there is seven deeds, seven full accesses on this section,
that's. going to be a challenge, okay, what's a reasonable access scenario. That backed
us -- that brought us down to, you know, three access scenarios working within the
engineering standards.
Hoaglun: The seven access points were residential, farming -- I mean that's a little
different than -- than the traffic that will be generated here and I can understand your
dilemma. How do you make it work. Can I ask you on -- from your backage road if
someone were to come out to Amity Road heading east and, then, was going to go left
to head north on Meridian Road, are there -- is it a double left turn lane that will be on
Amity?
Daleiden: Yes. It will be dual eastbound left turns at Amity Road.
Hoaglun: Okay. Because this -- what it reminded me of is Eagle Road and Ustick
where Kohl's is where you have the right-in, right-out, then, at the Kohl's entrance there
is a full access, but it's difficult for people when that light changes they are going to be
there for awhile and, then, you have the backage road that has a light, which I'm
noticing is getting more usage, just because it's earlier -- people realize they can make it
out -- at least there is a way out, so -- I just wanted to be sure it was a double left lane
there, because eventually that will be -- will be utilized to the full extent. So, that's
probably a good plan. Other questions, Council Members, while Andy is up? Any other
scenarios to be looked at?
Bird: I have none.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
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April 24, 2012
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Hoaglun: Councilman Zaremba.
Zaremba: Since I have not commented on some of the recent conversations, along with
what our own in-house experts have suggested, we have in past years in developments
along Highway 20-26 pretty much stuck to a principle of allowing signalized full access
at the mile and a half mile and right-in, right-out only at the quarter mile. I personally
cannot be convinced that access one and access three would be okay in any format,
but we do have precedent for considering access two to be right-in, right-out and I could
say temporarily aright-in, right-out, left-in, with the understanding that ITD at anytime
can take the left-in away, that's something I would be able to consider.
Hoaglun: Thank you, Councilman Zaremba. Andy, question on that access, if you have
the right-in, right-out and left-in at access two as planned, did you guys discuss a
number -- is there anumber -- Dave had mentioned, you know, it's kind of based on
situations, as opposed to there is not a hard, fixed number. Is there a traffic scenario
where you go, you know what, that left turn has to be closed?
Daleiden: Council Member Hoaglun and Members of the Council, we looked at in terms
of that right-in, right-out, left-in at access number two, one discussion was did we look at
it as a signalized intersection and we looked at that, we didn't carry that forward based
on just the need to be able to monitor that left turn in. Really, what was -- was driving
that left turn was looking at trying to balance improvement at Amity -- Amity and State
Highway 69 and distributing the left turn volume into the site. So, between that
intersection -- between access number two and, then, at Harris Street is where the
intent of having that left-in at access number two and providing that distribution of traffic
on the corridor. The -- in terms of a hard, fast number, it would be more of a monitoring
and looking at, you know, the traffic in terms of, you know, whether there is gaps within
the traffic stream, you know, to be able to make a safe left maneuver, given that Harris
Street is proposed as a signal, you have signals to the north of Harris Street today.
There are platoons up for them that are, basically, metered because of those signalized
intersections and some are evaluation and analysis that the northbound left turn, you
know, functioned -- was projected to function -- say operate acceptable in a safe
manner.
Hoaglun: Okay. Thank you. And, Andy, one last question on -- on that left turn. At
Amity Road headed north are there double left turn lanes going west on Amity coming
from Kuna, is it double left eventually?
Daleiden: As proposed it's a single left turn --
Hoaglun: Okay.
Daleiden: -- with this proposal.
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Hoaglun: Okay. Thank you. Any other questions from Andy while he's here? I guess
not. Thank you.
Daleiden: Thank you.
Overton: President Hoaglun?
Hoaglun: Yes.
Overton: President Hoaglun, Members of the Council, I held off making comments
earlier.
Hoaglun: Yes. Lieutenant Overton, go ahead.
Overton: I know this has just been a really quick hearing, but as the police are definitely
outnumbered by traffic engineers tonight, I wanted to make a few comments on the
record concerning what staff has said. I was on the comments earlier when~we had the
first development applications on this site and we concurred at that time that we wanted
no access points on Highway 69. The city hasn't gotten smaller since then and we take
the ,viewpoint in the police department, because we get a substantial amount of
accidents because we are the center of the valley, there is a city on the east, west,
north and south, and they all come through our city, whether they are just trying to get to
the interstate or not, especially on Highway 69 with access to I-84. When I look at all
the engineers and listen to what they are saying, I can't help but remember that we get
trained by a group called the Northwest University Traffic Safety Institute. Now, it's
changed names over the years, but these folks teach us three important rules, they are
called the three E's when we look at how something is developed or how you cure a
problem. The three E's are engineering, education, and enforcement. Education and
enforcement being the least of the two effective means of curing a problem.
Engineering being the most effective way to cure a problem when it comes to roadway
when it comes to roadway changes or traffic safety. And when I listen to everyone, if
we had to have alert-in I think that's a great design. I can't disagree with it if we had to
have aleft-in. I don't take a balanced approach, because I look at it -- and our
department looks at it just from a traffic safety approach. And I have to put this out,
because I think it's important. I look at it from a traffic safety approach and I look at the
fact that if we had more than just the one right-in, which an engineering study has
shown, that we increase the risk and it's predictable, then, it's preventable and police
would definitely agree with the staff report on not allowing any more than just one, if we
did, right-in, right-out, or just aright-out at the quarter mile mark.
Hoaglun: Thank you.
Bird: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Bird.
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April 24, 2012
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Bird: Lieutenant Overton -- and I know you probably don't have the deals, but we have
got some situations on Eagle Road like this and I realize right now Eagle Road is a lot
more traveled, but is that where the majority of the wrecks on Eagle Road is
happening? Is it happening between -- which some of it isn't in our area, but between
McMillan and Ustick or is it between McMillan and Chinden?
Overton: A majority of our accidents -- I mean a majority are at Eagle Road period.
Now, we break it down by intersections and intersection related and we get an awful lot
of them between Fairview and Ustick and fire I know he's shaking his head over here,
because we see the same thing. There is no medians, but it's not always median
related. But when you're talking left-in, left-outs, absolutely, that's the crash we want to
prevent the most, if we have the ability to do so, because that's usually the crash that's
going to be the injury crash, not just someone rear-ending someone else.
Bird: And I -- excuse me. Go ahead.
Overton: Yes, Eagle Road -- as I listen to you discuss you don't want to have another
Eagle Road, I would clap back here, because that's what we want to see as well. We
don't want another Eagle Road, we don't want a road that has this much traffic and this
many access points. As Councilman Zaremba was stating on 20-26 with signals at the
half mile and possibly aright-in, right-out at the quarter mile, that seems to give traffic
enough time to react and we don't see the accident rates when you can develop
something with that type of access built in, but when you see all the access points on
Eagle Road it just increases the probability of places where we are going to have those
accidents, where drivers have to be aware all the time that there is all sorts of different
access points spread out on that road.
Bird: I do agree, but I -- I'm greedy, too. I want the economic development, so I'm
happy to have Eagle Road. But you're talking about an area that probably got the less
amount of store fronts along it than any of it. I mean between Fairview and until you get
to River Valley you have nothing now. You're going to have, but you have nothing first
half mile and, then, from there on in. And I think we have got one right-in, right-out --
two right-in, right-outs from River Valley Road to Ustick on the right-hand side is it?
And, then, we got a couple more coming. Okay. Thank you.
Overton: Councilman Bird, you're correct. In fact, Councilman Zaremba brought up --
think it was Councilman Zaremba brought up the relationship to Kohl's where we talked
about Kohl's had the roadway that's been used more and more. We are noticing it
being used more and more, because they put a signal behind it, which, actually, this
looked a lot like it when I saw it where there is the half mile signal, plus the backage
road, and that seems to be a very good plan, because the signalized intersections are
costing us the least amount of problems.
Hoaglun: Thank you, lieutenant. You said something very important that I agree with
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April 24, 2012
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and that was limiting the left-hand turns
driver's side where the driver is exposed
that eliminated that, so that was good
applicant, engineers, lawyers?
that avoid those T-bones, especially on that
and there is some good things about this plan
to see. Council, other questions for staff,
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Yes, Councilman Zaremba.
Zaremba: I don't know if this adds anything, but Ijust -- I view this as an opportunity --
this area along Highway 69 is about where Eagle Road was 1999, 2000, just after it
became five lanes, instead of two lanes. There has been a lot more development along
Eagle Road since that happened. This facility already is a five lane, but development is
coming and -- and I think the opportunity both for safety and for economic development
is not to allow what we are seeing as mistakes along Eagle Road to happen down here
and I -- I guess where I'm going as I -- particularly with the support that I feel from our
police department and our fire department will repeat my comfortable level would be a
signal at Harris, a signal at Amity, and aright-in, right-out at access two.
Hoaglun: Okay. And I suppose before we ,get into the heavy duty discussion on this,
shall we close the public hearing and what's the desire of the Council on this?
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Zaremba.
Zaremba: I guess the question I might ask -- that would change their concept plan and I
would propose to continue the public hearing and ask them to bring us a concept plan
with just the right-in, right-out at the quarter mile.
Hoaglun: That is a possibility.
Zaremba: Is that a legitimate suggestion?
Hoaglun: And there might be other ideas that -- that would be -- it would give us some
time for the ITD to come back with their information backing up --
Zaremba: How they make the assessment balancing economic and safety.
Hoaglun: Yes.
Zaremba: That would be nice to know as well.
Hoaglun: But --
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April 24, 2012
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Zaremba: I realize this has been a long process and I -- I hesitate to say let's draw it out
even longer. I'm sure we have been talking about this for something like two years,
maybe longer. But I do think we need to get it right and if continuing it for a short period
of time helps us see the site with different concepts, I would go that direction.
Rountree: Is that a motion?
Zaremba: It can be if that sounds acceptable. Any thought of whether we are talking
about two weeks or four weeks or -- anybody have an opinion? Pete?
Friedman: Thank you. Councilman Zaremba, Council President Hoaglun, Members of
the Council, if I remember correctly, a week probably is two short a period of time to
kind of pull all this together. Obviously, a concept plan could be put together in a week,
but what Dave will probably need to garner through his organization may take a little bit
longer than that, so -- and, then, two weeks from tonight is a Council work session, so
would say the minimum we would probably want to continue it out at least three weeks
for consideration --
Zaremba: Well -- and, Mr. President, the first question we would need to ask is whether
the applicant is even willing to offer a concept plan like that.
Hoaglun: Brian -- who wants to -- Brandon, who wants to --
Rountree: Be Brian.
Hoaglun: Could you just state your name for the record again
Huffaker: Brian Huffaker with Hawkins Companies. So, is your question about timing?
To, essentially, delay it to another date, bring it back --
Hoaglun: Yeah. Timing is the first question, so --
Huffaker: Obviously, we would like to address this as soon as we can. I will tell you
one of the things that would be helpful for us is May 20th or something like that is the
largest retail convention of the year, of which we hope to be able to go to that
convention with a determination of what our access is, because right now as we have
tried to attract tenants they say, well, what access do I have and we say we don't know
and they say come talk to us later. So, I think that's about a month out. We could be
back as soon as you need us to. Whatever, you know, Dave Splett needs for his -- his
timing. We would certainly be glad to come back and look at a specific alternative or
one alternative we would still want to look at is -- is that left-turn in. We still think that
that's a critical movement to get customers into the shopping center. So, we are
available one week, two weeks, three weeks.
Hoaglun: One possibility is the 15th -- May 15th would -- oh, I'm sorry. That would be
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 63 of 75
the 16th, because is the primary, so we delay our meeting to the 16th, so -- and that
would be a Wednesday before the 20th, but never a guarantee that we can make a final
decision, but --
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Zaremba.
Zaremba: I would add that staff probably wants about ten days to analyze anything
new, so we would be talking about presenting it to the staff like on the 7th or 8th and,
then, to the Council on the 16th? Am I --
Friedman: Council President Hoaglun, Council, Council Member Zaremba, yeah, I
mean from a staff perspective, you know, Ithink -- and I'll speak for Warren and Tim --
you know, if they can assume aright-in, right-out at that location or even aright-in, left-
in, right-out at that location, I don't think that that's, you know, something that's going to
take a long detailed analysis. Again, I think it's allowing Dave to work through his
command structure, if you will, to get the information that the Council has asked for and,
then, pulling that all together for a meeting on the 16th might suit the applicant's
timelines also, so I --
Zaremba: Mr. President --
Friedman: Correct me if I'm wrong, but --
Hoaglun: Yes, Councilman Zaremba.
Zaremba: I guess my -- my discussion is are you willing to show us a concept plan that
eliminates access one and access three. I'm comfortable continuing the discussion
about whether access two would be right-in, right-out, or right-in, right-out, left-in,
knowing that the left-in may be temporary and whether that's ten years or 20 years
temporary is something we would continue to discuss. But I would assume it would
change the configuration of your concept plan some not to have access one and three
and what I'm saying is I'm willing to discuss an access at two and whether it's aright-in,
right-out or athree-quarters intersection I'm still willing to discuss that if -- so, I guess
my question to you is are you willing to present a concept like that and --
Huffaker: Well, President Hoaglun, Council Member Zaremba, it is the political season,
is it not? We would be glad to discuss whatever you would want to look at, so we can
vet that out and see what might be the best scenario. So, we will do that. It's not
difficult for us to make those changes to at least display it and talk about it. As I talked
with our business partners during the next couple weeks I guess we will come back and
show that, but, then, I can certainly convey -- it's a yea or nay from the business
standpoint, but we would be happy to do that.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
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Zaremba: Okay.
Huffaker: And having Andy do whatever analysis he needs to do -- I mean we would
come prepared to talk about those things.
Hoaglun: Councilman Bird.
Bird: Council, we -- and, staff, we need to -- these guys are going to a show the 20th to
try to sell this project to some people. We have got to have it ready and can't be holding
them up, so if we are going to do it the 16th let's be planning on the final, so these guys
can go do something.
Hoaglun: And it crossed my mind and no reflection on Dave, that it doesn't matter what
date we set, ITD may not be responding by that date, so -- whatever it is, so just one of
those things, so --
Rountree: Given that, I would suggest that we do -- we see it no later than the 8th, even
though it is a workshop.
Bird: I agree a hundred percent, Charlie.
Rountree: I have got four motions written down here. I'm going to have to change one
of them I think and we could --
Zaremba: Mr. President, I would say I -- just on a general basis I'm interested in
learning the answer to what we are asking ITD, just so we know for the future. I'm not
sure I would hold this project up for that answer. I would like to know at some time what
the thinking is.
Hoaglun: Because we will have more of these before us in the future, definitely, so --
Zaremba: Yeah. And I wouldn't hold this up to get that answer. I would like to still
know it at some time.
Hoaglun: Brian, I might ask -- and looking at this preliminary schedule, we could do this
on the 8th. That is an afternoon meeting. It starts at 3:00 o'clock, typically, so does that
work for you?
Huffaker: That would be fine with us.
Hoaglun: Okay. I did want to follow up. You mentioned the left -- right-in, right-out, left-
in. That left-in is a critical component to you, is it not?
Huffaker: Correct. Yes, it is.
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April 24, 2012
Page 65 of 75
Hoaglun: So, if we said, well, you know, no left-in, but we will go with two right-in, right-
outs, that's more of a deal -- that would be a deal breaker, as opposed to right-in, right-
out, left-in; right?
Huffaker: Yes. That would be my gut reaction, yes.
Hoaglun: Okay. Again, it's trying to find that sweet spot that makes it work.
Huffaker: I agree.
Rountree: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman.
Rountree: To move this along, I move that we continue this public hearing until May
8th, in anticipation of receiving information from ITD on the balancing reasoning that
they did and request of the applicant to bring at that point a concept that would provide
for either aright-in, right-out, or right-in, right-out, left turn at what has been identified at
access point two. That would include the design concepts acceptable to ITD. That's it.
Bird: Second.
Hoaglun: We have a motion and a second to continue this until May 8th. All those in
favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carries. We will continue this until May 8th. Thank
you, everybody.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Zaremba: Mr. President. And a reminder, that's a 3:00 o'clock meeting. 3:00 p.m.
Hoaglun: 3:00 o'clock, so --
Zaremba: You said it, but I'm repeating it.
Hoaglun: We don't like doing those 3:00 a.m. ones.
Rountree: No comp time for you next time.
Zaremba: Thank you all.
B. Mayor's Office: Budget Amendment for State of the City for a
Not-to-Exceed Amount of $7,870.00
Hoaglun: Well, moving on, we still have a bit more on the agenda to go through. 10-A
was moved and heard as 7-C, so that is out of the way. The Mayor has asked that Item
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April 24, 2012
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10-B be continued to next week, so --
Bird: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Bird.
Bird: I move that 10-B be moved to May 1st, 2012.
Zaremba: Second.
Hoaglun: Motion and second to move Item 10-B to May 1st. All those in favor say aye.
All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
C. Police Department: Budget Amendment for Department of Juvenile
Corrections (DJC) FFY10 Enforcement of Underage Drinking Laws
(EUDL) Awards for aNot-to-Exceed Amount of $10,350.00
D. Police Department: Budget Amendment for Miscellaneous
Donations for aNot-to-Exceed Amount of $3,200.00
Hoaglun: 10-C, Police Department.
Rountree: Mr. President, I would ask that you open both 10-C and 10-D to hear both of
those.
Hoaglun: Lieutenant Overton, 10-C and 10-D. Go ahead.
Overton: President Hoaglun, Members of Council, I can talk faster that way. Before
you you have two budget amendments. Both of these are for funds we have already
received either in check form, donations, or as in grants we have already received
funding approval for. The first one is for a total of 10,350 dollars. It is made up of 3,000
dollars, which was given to us through EUDL, the underage drinking enforcement group
out of Washington D.C., 3,000 dollars for a campaign we are running in May in
conjunction with another 3,000 dollar grant that was achieved by Drug Free Idaho. We
have combined our monies and efforts, there will be billboards, posters, fliers in hotels.
We started this campaign two weeks ago and that's what that money is going for. The
second we received is 7,350 is our one year grant we are getting again which is to
subsidize our alcohol enforcement team. This is the money we use to pay officers and
civilians that we put in under cover to do compliance checks and shoulder tap
operations on different alcohol beverage dispensers in shops within our city. So, that's
the first budget enhancement. I'll stand for any questions.
Hoaglun: Any questions?
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April 24, 2012
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Rountree: None.
Bird: I have none.
Hoaglun: None? Okay.
Overton: Moving right along quickly, the second one is for 3,200 dollars made up of
three parts. The first part was a 200 dollar check from the Department of Health and
Welfare for two IDA-FY start-up groups at Meridian High School and Mountain View
High School. IDA-FY is Idaho's drug free youth programs. We successfully got two
groups started and this is, basically, 100 dollars each. They are paying for meals for
meetings to get together. The second part is 500 dollars. It is from SAMSA, also out of
Washington D.C. It was a 500 dollar donation for a town hall meeting. We are using
that money on May 11th. We are helping to pay for the MYAC town hall meeting youth
summit at Wahooz on that date with that money. The third one is 2,500 dollars. That is
our Walmart foundation money, which we use every year for crime prevention education
and also we put a lot of that money towards our National Night Out expenses that we do
in August. So, with that I would stand for any questions on those as well.
Hoaglun: Okay. Thank you. Any questions?
Rountree: I have none.
Bird: I have none.
Hoaglun: Okay.
Rountree: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Rountree.
Rountree: I move we approve budget amendments 10-C and 10-D. 10-C in the amount
of 10,350 dollars and 10-D in the amount of 3,200 dollars.
Zaremba: Second.
Hoaglun: I have a motion and a second to approve 10-C and 10-D. Madam Clerk, will
you, please, call the role.
Roll Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
Hoaglun: All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 68 of 75
E. Clerk's Office: Approval of 2012-2013 NEW LIQUOR License
Application for DKF Investments dba Harry's Hideaway Bar and Grill
located at 2032 E. Overland Rd. Suite 130. Approved with conditions
F. Clerk's Office: Approval of 2012-2013 NEW LIQUOR License
Application for KJ's Restaurants dba JB's Restaurant located 1565 S.
Meridian Rd. Approved with conditions
G. Clerk's Office: Approval of 2012-2013 Beer, Wine and Liquor License
Applications as follows:
~Qdoba Mexican Grill #473 3068 Overland Rd. BW
Qdoba Mexican Grill #474 3319 N. Eagle Rd. BW
~Jakers Bar & Grill 3268 E. Pine Ave. BWL
Red Robin N. Eagle Rd. BWL
~Brew52 501 S. Main St. BWL
Hoaglun: Moving onto Item 10-E, Clerk's Office. New liquor license applications.
Holman: President Hoaglun, Members of the Council, Items E, F and the remaining two
licenses, Red Robin and Brew 52 that are on G --
Hoaglun: Yes, we will speak to all of them.
Holman: All of them. Okay. So, all of those we are just waiting for proof of the Ada
County approval, which I believe is probably happening tonight. So, they are already to
go, we are just asking for the conditional approval for the Mayor to sign and the Clerk to
hold signature until we receive all the documentation.
Hoaglun: Okay. Any questions?
Bird: I have none.
Hoaglun: Hearing none --
Bird: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Bird.
Bird: I move we approve the new liquor license for DKF and KJ's, Red Robin, and Brew
52, with the condition of once they receive them from Ada County that the Mayor will
sign and the Clerk will attest.
Rountree: Second.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 69 of 75
Hoaglun: I have a motion and a second to approve those items and to hold signature
until approvals are received. Madam Clerk, will you, please, call roll.
Roll Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
Hoaglun: All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
H. Fire Department: Approval of Award of Bid for "Smoke
Alarms" to Lowes Home Centers and Business Services and
Authorize the Purchasing Manager to Issue Purchase Orders
for aNot-to-Exceed Total of $98,940.50
Hoaglun: Item 10-H. Fire Department.
Niemeyer: Mr. President, Members of Council, I will, too, make this brief, but I did want
to have this on a department report to update you on this project and to request the
approval of award of bid for smoke alarms through Lowe's in the amount not to exceed
$98,940.50. This is part of our FEMA fire prevention grant that Pam Orr has been
heading up. This is called project SAFE, Smoke Alarms For Everyone. We have a
target audience of homes without smoke alarms, senior housing, the deaf, hearing
impaired, and homes over ten years old. The funds here are going to go to purchase
the smoke detectors and, then, the project will kick off and we will get those smoke
detectors installed. The other aspect of this project and this grant -- and it's the first of
it's kind in Idaho is for bed shakers. We really had to go through some funny looks as
we said bed shakers. Some folks thought that was literally a fireman sitting next to the
bed shaking the bed and we said, no, it's technology for the hearing impaired that
actually will shake the bed in the event that smoke is detected in the building. I can tell
you the center for the deaf and the hearing impaired are very excited about this and I
hope this will spearhead many other projects throughout not only Idaho, but the
northwest. So, we are asking for the approval of the bid awards. Certainly stand for
any questions. We do have a project deadline of June 30th. Pam is ready to go. She's
got tons of volunteers and organizations that are going to go out and put the T-shirts on
and go help install right along side of our firefighters and our staff. So, I will certainly
stand for any questions.
Hoaglun: Great, chief. Thank you. And I'm glad it wasn't -- you weren't referring to the
police department when they sneak in when the firefighters are sleeping, so --
Niemeyer: No. We have special detectors for when the police officers enter the --
Hoaglun: Okay.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 70 of 75
Bird: Leave a doughnut on the --
Hoaglun: We have a request for the approval of the award.
Bird: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Bird.
Bird: I move we approve awarding the bid to Lowe's Home Centers and business
services for the purchase order of not to exceed $98,940.50.
Zaremba: Second.
Hoaglun: We have a motion and a second to approve 10-H. Madam Clerk, please, call
roll.
Roll Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
Hoaglun: All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
I. Amended onto the Agenda: Legal Department: Discussion on
ACHD Impact Deferral Agreement
Hoaglun: We have an Item 10-I, Legal Department, discussion on ACRD impact
deferral agreement.
Nary: Thank you, Mr. President, Members of the Council. I had to add something to
your agenda. Sorry about that. ACRD has contacted the city and has sent us a draft of
deferral agreement for impact fees. We have had a discussion about this in the past
with ACRD and we never could really find a resolution that was workable, but their
proposed draft -- it hasn't been approved by their commission yet. I did let Bruce Mills
know we would at least bring it to your attention tonight, but it's not for any action. But,
basically, the deferral process would defer the impact fees until the point of certificate of
occupancy, which is what we had requested in the past. The city isn't required to
guarantee payment, which is one of the sticking points we had previously. The city is
just going to, essentially, agree not to issue the certificate of occupancy and that the city
may terminate the utility services if they were to either occupy without the C of O or
some glitch or error were to be caused if the C of O got issued, but the impact fee still
hadn't been paid. There is a couple of -- I think there is three -- what I think are fairly
minor edits to the document that I sent back to Mr. Mills and Mr. Price today. They were
going to be taken just to their commission for their feedback, but it was very, again,
hopeful, we have been trying to do this for some businesses, they have -- Mr. Mills had
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 71 of 75
indicated they hadn't established any criteria yet, this is a single project only that they
have created this agreement, but they would probably -- if the commission is agreeable,
then, come up with criteria as to which types of projects may be -- may warrant this type
of result. Again, it seems very positive and, again, since the risk to the city really is only
in issuing the C of O, and the potential of terminating services if something were to
occur, it seems to be a fairly minimal risk to the city and ACRD can still get what they
want and it seems that the -- most of the business community contacts that we have
had and the building industry have asked for this type of movement. So, I just wanted
to make you aware of it. You may have an agreement in front of you next week or in
two weeks, depending on how fast -- there is a project that's really been pushing for this
particular agreement and I don't know how fast things are going to happen, but I wanted
to make you aware of it before it just showed up on your agenda.
Bird: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Bird.
Bird: Bill, I have got one question. Can we -- if -- if the homeowners move in without a
certificate of occupation and the -- the license and stuff are not under them, can we
legally turn off their utilities?
Nary: Well, contractually, yes. Because the property owner still is the one that's
contractually bound --
Bird: Okay.
Nary: -- to the city. But I think that's part of the discussion point that it would be
problematic afterwards if you had a business, for example, like a large scale office
building with multiple tenants. So, even if you legally could turn if off it would certainly
be problematic if you had a number of people that got their utilities shut off. This
particular business is a single point, single owner, so it's not really an issue for them, but
I think that would be part of the -- the discussion with ACHD for -- if for future ones if
that's what we were forced to do. Again, we don't have it happen very much anymore
of people moving in without the C of O's. We didn't request that they also do
temporaries as well, because that sometimes can be problematic and I discussed it with
community development today and they felt through Accela system we could track
these, so it's not something that would be very complicated for us to keep track of them,
so --
Hoaglun: Okay. Thank you.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Zaremba.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 72 of 75
Zaremba: I would just comment for future discussion, I appreciate that ACRD is
considering this and I know from talking to people in the development community, the
ability to put this money out a little bit later in their process is -- is a very big thing for
them and -- but we do sometimes have the issue of people occupying their buildings
before they get the certificate and some of the people in the development community
that I have been talking to would even be happy if the relief were that we collected half
at the building permit and half at the certificate of occupancy, which -- and the same
thing with the ACHD fee, which means we all know that they we were well aware that
there is a fee due, because they paid half of it already and they know there is another
half due and they know about the certificate of occupancy and that gives us a little more
legal hammer if they slip through occupancy without coming in to finish it off. But on the
single ones you're talking about now it's a good pilot project, but I just wanted to throw
in that it could be a subject for future discussion, but instead of deferring all of it we
defer like half of it.
Hoaglun: Thank you, Councilman Zaremba and, Justin, you're taking mental notes;
right? Okay. Great. Anything else on this item?
Item 11: Ordinances
B. Ordinance No. 12-1510: An Ordinance (AZ 11-005) for the
Annexation of a Parcel of Land Situated in a Portion of the S'/z
of the Southeast '/4 and in a Portion of the Southwest '/4 of
Section 23, Township 4 North, Range 1 West, of Meridian
Idaho, Establishing and Determining the Land Use Zoning
Classification of Said Lands from RUT to R-8 (Medium Density
Residential) and Providing an Effective Date
C. Ordinance No. 12-1511: An Ordinance (RZ 11-006) for the Re-
zone of a Parcel of Land Situated in a Portion of the South ~/2
of the Southeast '/4 of Section 23, Township 4 North, Range 1
West, of Meridian Idaho, Establishing and Determining the
Land Use Zoning Classification of 4.64 Acres of Land from the
R-4 (Medium-Low Density Residential) Zoning District and TN-
C (Traditional Neighborhood Center) Zoning District to C-C
(Community Business District) Zoning District and Providing
an Effective Date
D. Ordinance No. 12-1512: An Ordinance (RZ 11-006) for the Re-
zone of a Parcel of Land Situated in a Portion of the South ~/2
of the Southeast'/4 of Section 23, Township 4 North, Range 1
West, of Meridian Idaho, Establishing and Determining the
Land Use Zoning Classification of 46.97 Acres of Land from
the R-4 (Medium-Low Density Residential) Zoning District and
TN-C (Traditional Neighborhood Center) Zoning District to R-8
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 73 of 75
(Medium Density Residential) Zoning District and Providing an
Effective Date
Hoaglun: All right. Moving forward. Item 11-A was removed from the agenda. 11-B, C
and D are ordinances and, Bill, all three -- those are the ones that need signatures to be
delivered in conjunction with the paperwork you received and electronic signatures
already, but need the hard copies?
Nary: What your motion should include is the publication of these ordinances need to
be done after we receive the signed development agreement.
Hoaglun: Okay. Great. Thank you. Madam Clerk, 11-B, Ordinance No. 12-1510. Can
you read that by title only.
Holman: City of Meridian Ordinance No. 12-1510, an ordinance AZ 11-005, Spurwing
Challenge, for annexation of a parcel being a portion of Lot 78, Block 1, of Spurwing
Subdivision, recorded in Book 69 of Plats at pages 7104 through 7108, an impression of
Lot 1, Block -- Block of Brandt Subdivision, recorded in Book 59 of Plats at page 5785
and 5786 and Lot 53, Block 1, of Spurwing Subdivision, recorded in the office of the Ada
County recorder as Instrument No. 95045793, all of which is situated in a portion of the
south one half of the southeast one quarter and in a portion of the southwest one
quarter of Section 23, Township 4 North, Range 1 West, Boise meridian, Ada County,
Idaho, as described in Attachment A and annexing certain lands and territories situation
in Ada County, Idaho, and adjacent and contiguous to the corporate limits of the City of
Meridian, as requested by the City of Meridian, establishing and determining the land
use zoning classification of said land from RUT to R-8, Medium Density Residential
District, in the Meridian City Code, providing that copies of this ordinance shall be filed
with the Ada County assessor, the Ada County recorder and the Idaho State Tax
Commission as required by law and providing for a summary of the ordinance and
providing for a waiver of the reading rules and providing an effective date.
Hoaglun: Ordinance No. 12-1510 was read by title only. Is there anyone that wishes to
hear it read in its entirety? Seeing no one out there --
Bird: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Bird.
Bird: I move we approve Ordinance No. 12-1510 with the stipulation that it not be
published, nor the Mayor to sign or the Clerk to attest until we have the hard copies in
our hand and also to pass it with suspension of rules. Is that right, Bill?
Nary: Yes.
Bird: I believe it --
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 74 of 75
Rountree: Second.
Hoaglun: We have a motion and a second to approve Ordinance 12-1510 with
conditions. Madam Clerk, will you, please, call the roll.
Roll Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
Hoaglun: All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Hoaglun: Ordinance No. 12-1511. Madam Clerk, would you read that one by title only.
Holman: City of Meridian Ordinance No. 12-1511, an ordinance RZ 11-006, Spurwing
Challenge, for rezone of a parcel being a portion of Lot 1, Block 1, of Brandt
Subdivision, recorded in Book 59 of Plats at pages 5785 and 5786, situated in a portion
of the south one half of the southeast one quarter of Section 23, Township 4 North,
Range 1 West, situated in Ada County, Idaho, and adjacent and contiguous to the
corporate limits of the City of Meridian, as requested by the City of Meridian,
establishing and determining the land use zoning classification of 4.64 acres of land
from the R-4, Medium Low Density Residential Zoning District and TN-C, Traditional
Neighborhood Center Zoning District to C-C, Community Business District, in the
Meridian City Code, providing that copies of this ordinance shall be filed with the Ada
County assessor, the Ada County recorder and the Idaho State Tax Commission as
required by law and providing for a summary of the ordinance and providing for a waiver
of the reading rules and providing an effective date.
Hoaglun: Ordinance No. 12-1511 has been read by title only. Is there -- seeing no one
who wishes to have it read in its entirety -- since we only have staff here -- it is before
us. Councilman Bird.
Bird: Mr. President, I move we approve Ordinance No. 12-15111 -- or not 111 -- 1511,
with stipulation that it not be published until we have a hard copy -- signed hard copy,
for the Mayor to sign and the Clerk to attest at that time and I do it with suspension of
rules.
Rountree: Second.
Hoaglun: I have a motion and a second to approve Ordinance No. 12-1511 with
stipulations. Madam Clerk, would you, please, call the roll.
Roll Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
Hoaglun: All ayes. Motion carries.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 75 of 75
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Hoaglun: Now to Ordinance No. 12-1512. Madam Clerk, would you, please, read this
by title only.
Holman: City of Meridian Ordinance No. 12-1512, an ordinance RZ 11-006, Spurwing
Challenge, for the rezone of a parcel being a portion of Lot 1, Block 1, of Brandt
Subdivision, recorded in Book 59 of Plats at pages 5785 and 5786, situation in a portion
of the south one half of the southeast one quarter of Section 23, Township 4 North,
Range 1 West, situated in Ada County, Idaho, and adjacent and contiguous to the
corporate limits of the City of Meridian, as requested by the City of Meridian,
establishing and determining the land use zoning classification of 46.97 acres of land
from the R-4, Medium Low Density Residential Zoning District and TN-C, Traditional
Neighborhood Center Zoning District to R-8, Medium Density Residential Zoning
District, in the Meridian City Code, providing that copies of this ordinance shall be filed
with the Ada County assessor, the Ada County recorder and the Idaho State Tax
Commission as required by law and providing for a summary of the ordinance and
providing for a waiver of the reading rules and providing an effective date.
Hoaglun: Ordinance 12-1512 has been read by title only. Anybody wish to hear it -- to
have it read in full? Seeing no one, Council?
Bird: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Bird.
Bird: I move we approve Ordinance No. 12-1512, with stipulations of the Mayor to sign
and the Clerk to attest not until they -- we receive the hard signed copy and with
suspension of rules.
Rountree: Second.
Hoaglun: I have a motion and a second to approve Item 11-D. Madam Clerk, will you,
please, call roll.
Roll Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
Hoaglun: All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 12: Future Meeting Topics
Hoaglun: We are to Item 12, Future Meeting Topics.
Meridian City Council
April 24, 2012
Page 76 of 75
Bird: I have none.
Rountree: Mr. President?
Hoaglun: Councilman Rountree.
Rountree: At some point in time we need to talk about this Idaho Watershed Solutions
as a potential tool and whether or not we need a nonprofit to do this, et cetera, so --
Hoaglun: Okay. Warren, if you will make a note of that and --
Rountree: And I want it appropriate, but maybe with staff first and then --
Hoaglun: Okay. Have staff take a look at that first. We have a discussion with you first
and go from there. So -- okay. Great. That's all we have on tonight's agenda.
Rountree: Move to adjourn.
Bird: Second.
Hoaglun: Motion and second to adjourn. All those in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion
carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Hoaglun: We are adjourned.
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 10:36 P.M
(AUDIO RECORDING ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
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