HomeMy WebLinkAbout2011-09-13 WorkshopE IDIAN~~
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CITY COUNCIL WORKSHOP
MEETING AGENDA
Tuesday, September 13, 2011 at 3:00 PM
1. Roll-Call Attendance
X David Zaremba X Brad Hoaglun
X Charlie Rountree O Keith Bird (arrived at 3:0~ pm)
X Mayor Tammy de Weerd
2. Pledge of Allegiance (Pg. 1)
3. Adoption of the Agenda (Pg. 1-2)
4. Consent Agenda (Pg. 2-3)
A. Approve Minutes of June 28, 2011 City Council Special
Meeting
B. Approve Minutes of July 5, 2011 City Council Special Meeting
C. Rescind Lighting Contract Award to Alloway Electric in the
Amount of $29,016.94 and Deem as Non-Responsive for 8th
Street Lighting Project and Award Contract to Second Lowest
Bidder, Power Plus for aNot-to-Exceed Amount of $39,116.50
Moved to Department Reports after Item F. Item will be
brought back to City Council meeting on September 20, 2011
(Pg. 12-19)
D. Agreement for Independent Contractor Services with Titan
Technologies for the W. 8th Street Sewer Rehabilitation
Project for aNot-To-Exceed Amount of $165,000.00 Amended
Title to Read: Agreement for Independent Contractor Services
with Titan Technologies for the W. 8t" Street Sewer
Rehabilitation Project for a Not-To-Exceed Amount of
$242,573.10 That is Budgeted Over Fiscal Years 2011 & 2012
E. Agreement with TW Telecom Holdings, Inc. (TWTC) for
Telecommunication and Related Services for aNot-to-Exceed
Amount of $1,965.75
Meridian City Council Meeting Agenda -Tuesday, September 13, 2011 Page 1 of 3
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearing,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
F. Professional Services Agreement with HR Related, LLC. for
Human Resources Consulting and Training Services
G. License Agreement Between the City of Meridian and the
Nampa & Meridian Irrigation District on the Eight Mile Lateral
at the Lakeview Golf Course for Landscape Improvements
H. License and Maintenance Agreement Between the City of
Meridian, Lakeview Meridian Golf Course, and Ashford Greens
Homeowners Association for Irrigation Infrastructure and
Green-up at Property Located at Dawson Drive
I. Second Addendum to Professional Services Contract with
DMH Enterprises for Plumbing Plan Review and Inspection
Services
J. Second Addendum to Professional Services Contract with
Whitman and Associates, Inc. for Building Plan Review and
Inspection Services
K. Second Addendum to Professional Services Contract with
Jackson Code Consultants, Inc. for Fire Plan Review and
Inspection Services
5. Items Moved From Consent Agenda (Pg. 3)
6. Department Reports
A. Mayor's Office: Resolution No. 11-802: Appointment of Leslie
Mauldin to Seat 5 of the Arts Commission Approved (Pg. 3-4)
B. Mayor's Office: Resolution No. 11-803: Appointment of Ryan
Lancaster to the Traffic Safety Commission Approved (Pg. 4-5)
C. Entryway Monument Committee Report (Pg. 5-7)
D. Legal Department/Solid Waste Advisory Commission (SWAG):
Community Recycling Fund Program (Pg. 7-9)
E. Legal Department: Resolution No. 11-804: A Resolution of the
City of Meridian Adopting the Community Recycling Fund
Program Approved (Pg. 7-9)
Meridian City Council Meeting Agenda -Tuesday, September 13, 2011 Page 2 of 3
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearing,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
F. Public Works: Second Addendum to Professional Services
Contract with RIMI, Inc. for Mechanical Plan Review and
Inspection Services Approved (Pg. 9-12)
G. Planning Department: Discussion on Potential for City to
Compose and Adopt a Future Acquisitions Map (Pg. 20-24)
H. Planning Department: Application with Ada County to
Recognize City's Current Comprehensive Plan (Pg. 24-26)
I. Planning Department: Airport Road - Overland Road
Alignment Preference Motion approved to move forward with
letter to Ada County Highway District (ACHD) (Pg. 26-31)
J. Planning Department: Transportation Priorities 2011
Approved (Pg. 31-42)
K. Police Department: Mutual Aid Agreement with Elmore County
Sheriffs Office for Law Enforcement Services at Gunfighter
Skies 2011 Air Show on September 17 and 18, 2011 Approved
(Pg. 42-43)
L. Clerks Office: Discussion on Official City Seal (Pg. 43-47)
M. Legal Department: Taxicab Mobile Sales Unit Ordinance
Motion approved to go no further with an Ordinance
(Pg. 47-51)
7. Future Meeting Topics (Pg. 51)
Adjourned at 5:23 p.m.
Meridian City Council Meeting Agenda -Tuesday, September 13, 2011 Page 3 of 3
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearing,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
Meridian Citv Council Workshop September 13 2011
A meeting of the Meridian City Council was called to order at 3:00 p.m., Tuesday,
September 13, 2011, by Mayor Tammy de Weerd.
Members Present: Mayor Tammy de Weerd, Brad Hoaglun, David Zaremba, Keith Bird
and Charlie Rountree.
Others Present: Bill Nary, Jaycee Holman, Caleb Hood, Pete Friedman, Tom Barry,
Warren Stewart, Tracy Basterrechea, Mark Niemeyer, Steve Siddoway, Bruce
Freckleton, Robert Simison, and Dean Willis.
Item 1: Roll-call Attendance:
Roll call.
X David Zaremba X Brad Hoaglun
X Charlie Rountree X Keith Bird
X Mayor Tammy de Weerd
De Weerd: I will go ahead and call this meeting to order. I'd like to welcome all of you
here. It is, for the record, Tuesday, September 13th. It's 3:00 o'clock. We will start with
roll call attendance. Madam Clerk.
Item 2: Pledge of Allegiance
De Weerd: Item No. 2 is our Pledge of Allegiance. If you will all rise and join is in our
pledge to the flag.
(Pledge of Allegiance recited.)
Item 3: Adoption of the Agenda
De Weerd: Thank you. Item No. 3 is adoption of the agenda.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: A couple minor changes to our agenda that we need to go through. Under
Item 4, Consent Agenda, 4-C, that needs to be moved to Department Reports, so we
will do that. Probably put it, since it's a Public Works item, to put after 6-F. Item 4-D, it's
a different title. We need to amend the title to read: Agreement for Independent
Contractor Services with the Titan Technologies for the West 8th Street sewer rehab
project for a not to exceed amount of $242,573.10 that is budgeted over fiscal year
2011 and 2012. So, we need to make note of that. Under Item 6, Department Reports,
6-A is resolution number 11-802. 6-B is resolution number 11-803. 6-E is resolution
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September 13, 2011
Page 2 of 52
number 11-804. And as I mentioned we will be moving Item 4-C to 6-F-A. So, with that,
Madam Mayor, I move adoption of the agenda as amended.
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second to adopt the agenda as amended. All those
in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: THREE AYES. ONE ABSENT.
Item 4: Consent Agenda
A. Approve Minutes of June 28, 2011 City Council Special
Meeting
B. Approve Minutes of July 5, 2011 City Council Special Meeting
D. Agreement for Independent Contractor Services with Titan
Technologies for the W. 8th Street Sewer Rehabilitation
Project for aNot-To-Exceed Amount of $165,000.00 Amended
Title to Read: Agreement for Independent Contractor Services
with Titan Technologies for the W. Stn Street Sewer
Rehabilitation Project for aNot-To-Exceed Amount of
$242,573.10 That is Budgeted Over Fiscal Years 2011 & 2012
E. Agreement with TW Telecom Holdings, Inc. (TWTC) for
Telecommunication and Related Services for aNot-to-Exceed
Amount of $1,965.75
F. Professional Services Agreement with HR Related, LLC. for
Human Resources Consulting and Training Services
G. License Agreement Between the City of Meridian and the
Nampa & Meridian Irrigation District on the Eight Mile Lateral
at the Lakeview Golf Course for Landscape Improvements
H. License and Maintenance Agreement Between the City of
Meridian, Lakeview Meridian Golf Course, and Ashford Greens
Homeowners Association for Irrigation Infrastructure and
Green-up at Property Located at Dawson Drive
I. Second Addendum to Professional Services Contract with
DMH Enterprises for Plumbing Plan Review and Inspection
Services
J. Second Addendum to Professional Services Contract with
Whitman and Associates, Inc. for Building Plan Review and
Inspection Services
Meridian Cily Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
Page 3 of 52
K. Second Addendum to Professional Services Contract with
Jackson Code Consultants, Inc. for Fire Plan Review and
Inspection Services
De Weerd: Okay. Item No. 4 is our Consent Agenda.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: We are moving Item 4-C to Department Reports, so that is no longer on the
Consent Agenda. And 4-D, the correct title is agreement for independent contractor
services with Titan Technologies for the West 8th Street sewer rehabilitation project for
a not to exceed amount of 242,573 dollars that is budgeted over fiscal years 2011 and
2012. So, with those two changes, Madam Mayor, I move approval of the Consent
Agenda and the Mayor to sign and Clerk to attest.
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second to adopt -- or to approve the Consent
Agenda. If there is no discussion, Madam Clerk.
Roll-Call:. Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
De Weerd: All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: THREE AYES. ONE ABSENT.
Item 5: Items Moved From Consent Agenda
De Weerd: There were no items moved to this particular part of the agenda.
Item 6: Department Reports
A. Mayor's Office: Resolution No. 11-802: Appointment of Leslie
Mauldin to Seat 5 of the Arts Commission
De Weerd: So, we will move into Department Reports, Item 6, and start with the A and
B under the Mayor's office. Council, in front of you is a resolution number 11-802, for an
appointment to the Meridian Arts Commission. You should also have the resume of
individual Leslie -- the chair and I with the Meridian Arts Commission met with this
candidate and she is a very talented artist in our community. She is a pertorming artist.
She is an opera singer and she's been in various pertorming arts as well. So, we feel
comfortable in moving forward in bringing this for your approval and I would avail myself
to answer any questions.
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September 13, 2011
Page 4 of 52
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: I move approval of resolution number 11-802, appointing Leslie Mauldin to
Seat 5 of the Arts Commission.
Zaremba: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second to approve the appointment to the Arts
Commission. If there is no questions, Madam Clerk
Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
De Weerd: All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: THREE AYES. ONE ABSENT.
B. Mayor's Office: Resolution No. 11-803 : Appointment of Ryan
Lancaster to the Traffic Safety Commission
De Weerd: Item 6-B is also an appointment of Ryan Lancaster to the Traffic Safety
Commission. We also met with Mr. Lancaster, Mr. Nary and I, and -- as Mr. Nary is part
of the Traffic Safety Commission. He brings some great expertise to our traffic safety
as a Meridian resident, has great interest, wants to give to the community and we are --
and he lives in the northeast section of our town, which is the representation that we
were hoping for, so that the south, the northeast and the northwest are represented by
residents that are more familiar with some of the challenges in their particular part of
town. So, Council, that is the appointment in front of you this evening and I would
answer any questions should you have any.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Just for the record, I will state Mr. Bird has joined us and Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: That was going to be my first comment for the record, but I will move that we
approve resolution 11-803 appointing Ryan Lancaster to the Traffic Safety Commission.
Rountree: Second
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second to approve Item 8-B, which is resolution 11-
803. Any questions from Council? Madam Clerk, will you call roll.
Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
De Weerd: All ayes. Motion carried.
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
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MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
C. Entryway Monument Committee Report
De Weerd: Item 6-C is our entryway monument committee report. I will ask for
comments from Mr. Simison.
Simison: Thank you, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council. I'm here today for,
hopefully, what will be a pretty fun exercise for you, but before we get to the fun, just
want to give you a little bit of background on where we came from. As you recall, we
presented to you some entryway signs at sometime back that have the City of Meridian
flag on them. You should see those flags up in various locations of the city now and,
hopefully, they turned out to your liking. The next phase of that was to really look at
having some entryway type monuments and to the community as we grow and develop
at key corridor points. We went out to an RFP -- RFP? Was that -- RFP into the
community to try to get some ideas from the community for what an entryway
monument sign would be. The committee evaluated them and there were no
recommendations from those groups that moved forward. Through the process we
realized that we had talent on staff by the name of Brian with the Planning Department
and he put together some proposals that we were shown to the monument -- entryway
monument committee as well. They liked that --what he had and asked him to come
back with some additional proposals. He did that and from those we selected choices
that we felt were most appropriate. They went to the Arts Commission and we asked
the Arts Commission to review them and rate them. They did that. In addition to rating
them, they also came up with their own fourth idea, which was their favorite one, which
you will see. And so I'm here today really to show you the four proposals that were
reviewed to get your comments and feedback on if this is a direction you would like to
have the city go for entryway monument signs. So, with that I will see do we have --
have them up? Okay. Can you just move forward through them when we do that. This
is the -- what we originally gave them were three different options and we asked them --
they are in two sets. There is what would be a wider version and a skinnier version and
those would really be used for different places --different rights of way and we had one
created that would fit within that ACHD two feet right of way and others that would go
into, perhaps, if we worked with the local property owner, that they would incorporate
that into the design of their location. So, this was the MAC preferred Option A., their
preferred option of the ones that were presented to them. It's using this and the
locations where there is more space and, then, the accompanying vertical monument
for place where you couldn't put that other size -- other type. Moving on to the second
option that they preferred was this type, which is very similar to that other option top and
the third option that they -- such as their number three, was, again, the barrel roof
monument option, with an accompanying vertical one with the barrel roof. So, that's the
preferred order. Now, saying that, the one that they actually are recommending is the
fourth one, which was a combination of some of them, they liked this version without the
barrel roof on it. They added -- they added in the -- they took away from the straight
across and added the curvature to that monument and, then, correspondingly this
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September 13, 2011
Page 6 of 52
vertical monument. So, what we really want to present to you today is with those
options in front of you if you have a preferred option that you would like us to, basically,
put into our discussions -- we aren't asking for funding for anything at this point in time.
We only have one location down at Linder -- is it Linder and Chinden, Caleb, where we
-- in the development agreement it does state that they will -- I believe build one of
these signs for the city. So, it would be good to have a preferred design that we want to
move forward with here at some point in time, but I'm here for your feedback at this
point in time on these options. And Caleb and Brian or I will -- are available for
questions.
De Weerd: Thank you. Council, any questions? Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: I will express an opinion. I would say the option one is my favorite choice of
all of those. I'm not opposed to any of the others, but I think without the winged top
probably it's easier to build and easier to maintain and less likely to draw graffiti or some
other mayhem to it. So, I would say I -- for the monument sign -- or the big --bigger
sign, I like one. For the B choice I also like the option one. The only thing that I would
change is at the very top -- okay. If that -- if that's to scale, it looks like the top of that
would be about ten feet off the ground, so maybe it's not an issue, but it concerns me
that the swoosh or part of the star hangs out beyond the sign. I'm sensitive about sharp
points sticking out of things and -- even ten feet high that could be a target for people
throwing things trying to hang on it or climb up and hang on it and I like the design, but I
would make the design slightly smaller, so it fits entirely within that square and doesn't
hang over the side. Just an opinion.
De Weerd: Any other comments from Council? You know, I appreciate that. Robert
mentioned it was part of one of our applications and similarly in another part of town a
couple of developers, when they brought their developments in, had indicated they
would like to put something in if they had a design and that would be certainly at their
cost and we can further explore that. But as our businesses come in they want to be
identified with our community and as they come in if they would like to offer to build
these, that is an opportunity for our community.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor, just a comment. You know, I like their selection. I mean they
are all similar in style, they are all very tasteful and a nice entryway monument to our
city. So, anyone they selected I would be very pleased with. So, from a cost standpoint
not having the barrel roof would probably help, which is always a good thing and might
be a little cleaner. I don't know if people really associate that barrel roof with City Hall
yet. Hard to tell. But -- but certainly any of these I could live with and their choice is
very good.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
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September 13, 2011
Page 7 of 52
Rountree: I compliment everybody who participated. I think you did a fine job and
agree with the recommendation.
Bird: It looks great to me.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. And compliments to Brian.
Simison: Thank you.
D. Legal Department/Solid Waste Advisory Commission (SWAG):
Community Recycling Fund Program
E. Legal Department: Resolution No. 11-804: A Resolution of the
City of Meridian Adopting the Community Recycling Fund
Program
De Weerd: Okay. Item 8 -- or, I'm sorry, 6-D under our Legal Department and our
SWAG recycling fund.
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I think I'll introduce this item and, then,
Karie Glenn is our vice-chair of the Solid Waste Advisory Commission and may be able
to answer more specific detailed questions. The chair Nancy Mann wasn't able to be
here today, had a conflict with her work. So, for the public's benefit maybe I could
explain a little about what the community recycling fund is and, then, we can talk about
the specifics that SWAG is presenting to you as to how the program should function.
Up until about two to three years ago all the recycling funds that were gathered by the
city through the -- through SSG, the commodity market at that time was such that there
was a steady stream of income that the city would receive for various projects and the
Solid Waste Advisory Committee that existed at the time would evaluate those projects,
set a number of criteria to those types of projects and, then, help would fund all or a
portion of those projects and those projects varied in type. The playground equipment
that's at Storey Park was funded through that. It funded some park improvements, like
bleachers and trash cans in certain areas, benches at River Valley Elementary, they put
out picnic tables and benches for folks. The reader board sign at Sawtooth Middle
School was partially funded with the recycling funds and the criteria was always that it
has to use recycling materials in it, as well as promote recycling as a part of the -- at
least the signage that went with it or some other method that recycling would be a part
of sort of permanent part of the project. So, the -- a couple years ago the commodity
markets turned such that we were not receiving income from the recycling .program and
we were actually having to not only fund the hazardous material program out of those
funds, but we were, basically, funding them out of the funds that were collected for trash
collection and so now, again, the commodity market have changed again and the city is
realizing a surplus or a revenue stream from this type of action. Our recycling has
increased significantly in the city and the market has, again, taken the up swing, so that
there is actually revenue to be gained. So, the solid waste advisory committee has
discussed that and come up with some criteria that's in your packets for you and I can
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
Page 8 of 52
just briefly, again, for -- more for the public's benefit -- again, the idea is to promote
recycling. So, that the material -- or the project itself has to have as much as possible
or reasonably possible, depending on the size and the volume of it, promote recycling
and use recycling materials as part of it. One of the things that the Solid Waste
Advisory Commission has decided that depending on the level of the type of projects,
some of them can be fully funded by the -- by the funds and some of them will only be
partially funded up to 50 percent of the funds and the cutoff they have determined was
5,000 dollars. So, a project that's under 5,000 dollars SWAC can recommend that the
entire fund pay for the cost of it and if it's above 5,000, then, it would only be up to 50
percent of the cost of it, there would have to be matching funds, whether it be from a
service group or an organization or whatever, they would have to provide some of the
funding and some of the funding, of course, sometimes is in the -- the labor and equity
of installation or putting the material together, installing, building, whatever. Something
like that. I think those are probably the highlights of where it is. Again, it's looking for
community -- community value types of projects, things that can be used by the greatest
number of people in our community, whether that, again, be playground equipment,
whether it be educational items, whether that be promotional -- ways to promote the use
of recycling in our community, I think the slate is fairly open to what projects could come
before the Commission. There is an application process through the city's website and
through SSC to apply for these funds. They will, then, be reviewed by the Solid Waste
Advisory Commission and depending on the limit of the project, may come back to you
again for final approval or there is authority in the budget they have set for the smaller
projects that they can actually approve them at their level. I think that's the basics of it
is, and maybe Mrs. Glenn, if you have more specific questions that you want to ask, and
Councilman Rountree is an ex-officio member, he may also have more the add to it, I
think overall from my discussion with the Commissioners and the people on the
Commission, they are very excited that this -- this program is able to be reinstituted.
We found great value over about ten years for the city in getting projects funded through
the efforts of our citizens in doing the right thing and being able to recycle products and
being able to get those out of the trash and get them out of the waste stream and
actually be reused and so the opportunity for this again to turn into both a positive from
both the cost side of it, from taking it out of the waste stream, to also the plus side to the
citizens to return them back to the community is a great asset. And so that's all I have
and, again, unless Council Member Rountree or you have questions for Mrs. Glenn,
they are asking for your approval and there is a resolution after this as 6-E, that if you
find it acceptable that you can approve this program so they can move forward.
De Weerd: Thank you. Council, any questions?
Bird: I have none.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, just a comment or two. The program that is fashioned very
much like the one we had previously -- it's similar to the one we had previously. It does
provide some more accountability in terms of how the money is spent and what it's
spent on and anything that -- any project that requires any construction activity will be
reviewed by the building department and if there is a permit required there will be
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2077
Page 9 of 52
inspections, so we don't have issues with some less than desirable facilities being built.
So, that was one thing that the previous program was a little shy on. I also wanted to
point out that these funds are funds that are in excess of -- of the value obtained and
the cost of recycling that are provided to the city by SSC on a voluntary basis. This is
not money that contractually we necessarily would normally receive, it's out of their
desire to promote recycling and support city activities as well. So, they are actively
involved on the SWAC as ex-officio and they, too, like the idea of community-related
support projects that promote recycling with the use of this money. So, having said that,
I would make a motion that we approve Item 6-E, resolution 11-804.
Bird: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second. Any discussion? Madam Clerk.
Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
De Weerd: All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: Our next item is also under our Legal Department, Item 6-E, resolution
number 11-804.
Rountree: The one we just approved.
De Weerd: Sorry.
Rountree: That's okay.
Bird: Caught you.
F. Public Works: Second Addendum to Professional Services
Contract with RIMI, Inc. for Mechanical Plan Review and
Inspection Services
De Weerd: Item 6-F. Yes. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Bird. It happens on occasion.
Bird: Rare.
De Weerd: And I'm glad that I have someone to remind me. Okay. We did move Item
4-C under Item 6-F and so I guess Mr. Freckleton or Mr. Barry?
Freckleton: Sorry, Madam Mayor, I got a little lost on the --
De Weerd: I saw you jump and, then, sit down --
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September 13, 2011
Page 10 of 52
Freckleton: Yes.
De Weerd: -- and I thought okay
Freckleton: Well, you know. Good afternoon, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council.
Last time we were before you on the topic of professional services contracts we had
three of the five contracts for plan review and inspection services signed a one year
extension. Those were on your Consent Agenda today that you did approve. Since
that time we have reached an agreement for a one year extension, same terms and
conditions as original contract with RIMI, Inc., for mechanical inspection and plan review
and we wanted to put that on Department Reports just to give you the opportunity to
have any -- any questions or dialogue that you might want to have on that, so --
De Weerd: Okay. Council, any questions?
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Bruce, as long as it's the same terms that they are working under now I have no
problem with it.
Freckleton: Exactly the same terms.
De Weerd: Okay.
Zaremba: So, we voted on the three that were on the Consent Agenda. Do we need to
vote on this one?
De Weerd: Yes, you do.
Zaremba: Okay. Madam Mayor, I move that we approve the second addendum to
professional services contract with RIMI, Inc., for mechanical plan review and inspection
services.
Hoaglun: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second to approve Item 6-F, which was formerly 4-C.
If there are no questions, Madam Clerk. 6-F-A. Well, that is actually the one that I
entertained, because that's where I put it on my agenda, so -- and that's how I
introduced this discussion item, so --
Hoaglun: We were all tracking, Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: Okay.
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September 13, 2011
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Hoaglun: Yeah. 6-F is what I was voting on. Correct?
Bird: Yep.
Hoaglun: Yeah.
Zaremba: The RMI contract. RIMI contract.
De Weerd: Well, actually, no. What I opened for discussion was what we moved from
4-C.
Freckleton: Hence my stand up, sit down.
De Weerd: Which is his stand up, sit down.
Hoaglun: Yeah, Madam Mayor, I thought I had introduced --when we moved it to 6-F-
A, but, you know, that's just asemantics -- probably should change numbers completely
next time, but --
De Weerd: Yeah.
Hoaglun: -- anyway. Up to you how we proceed, I guess.
De Weerd: Well, since you have a motion under something I didn't introduce --
Zaremba: Madam Mayor, I would withdraw my motion and we will straighten out the
administrative part.
De Weerd: Because the discussion that Bruce just gave was actually on Item 4-C.
Bird: No, it wasn't.
Hoaglun: No.
Zaremba: I didn't think so.
Bird: That's on Alloway Electric.
Hoaglun: That's Alloway Electric.
De Weerd: Uh-huh.
Freckleton: No. RIMI.
Zaremba: Sounded like 6-F to me.
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
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De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Well, no --
Zaremba: We could resolve that by opening both of them.
De Weerd: Oh, I am sorry. Council, I'm looking at F on the top of my page. A human
resources thing. So, now you know exactly where my head was. Okay. I will go
ahead, Mr. Zaremba, and take that motion in a second and get over the pain that I'm
causing.
Zaremba: Well, to clarify, do we need to have that subject opened?
Bird: No.
De Weerd: No. Because the presentation was related to your motion.
Zaremba: Okay. Then I will reinstate my motion, which was that we approve the
second addendum to professional services contract with RIMI, Inc., for mechanical plan
review and inspection services.
Hoaglun: And second still agrees.
De Weerd: I'm glad. Madam Clerk.
Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
De Weerd: All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
C. Rescind Lighting Contract Award to Alloway Electric in the
Amount of $29,016.94 and Deem as Non-Responsive for 8th
Street Lighting Project and Award Contract to Second Lowest
Bidder, Power Plus for aNot-to-Exceed Amount of $39,116.50
Moved to Department Reports after Item F. Item will be
brought back to City Council meeting on September 20, 2011
Freckleton: Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Now we will go to Item 4-C and you -- you really need to rescind this
by motion?
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I think it was asked to put there to
explain why and, then -- I think, then, you will be taking that action.
De Weerd: Okay. So, that was RA and the subsequent motion.
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September 13, 2011
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Nary: Yes.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Staff: So, Madam Mayor, Ithink --
De Weerd: So Mr. Nary?
Nary: Yes, ma'am.
De Weerd: We just had a motion to approve this contract.
Nary: No. Madam Mayor, what was approved was the RIMI contract for services for
mechanical plan review. 4-C that was moved from the Consent Agenda is about the
Alloway Electric contract.
Bird: Go to your Consent, Tammy.
Zaremba: Which we have not discussed yet.
De Weerd: Rescind.
Nary: Correct.
De Weerd: Okay.
Nary: So, that's for Mr. Curns
De Weerd: Oh. Sorry, Tim. I need to just like remove myself. Actually, it would be -- it
would have been nice, because I wasn't really included on this change, so I'm not
tracking it very well. So, sorry. Tim, please. Take me out of my misery.
Curns: Yes. Madam Mayor and Members of the Council, real quick on this item. We
had originally placed this on the Consent Agenda as a -- to request to rescind the
contract award to Alloway Electric and deem them nonresponsive for the 8th Street
lighting project and, then, award it -- the contract to the second lowest bidder, which
was Power Plus. However, what we are actually requesting is just the first part of that
at this point, which is to rescind the lighting contract award to Alloway Electric in the
amount $29,016.94 and deem them as nonresponsive for the 8th Street lighting project
and, then, we are actually going to rebid that project, we are not going award it to the
second lowest bidder. Hopefully that made sense.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Scary enough, but it did. Mr. Bird
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Bird: Tim, what's -- what's their unresponsiveness?
Curns: Mr. Bird --
Bird: Did they call in and say they made a mistake?
Curns: In awarding this contract -- actually, after it was awarded and the contract was
signed with Alloway, it became apparent that they had not taken into account providing
certain materials in the project and that may be due to the way we had the specification
written, it had two different areas that addressed -- in the specification that addressed
that material and so we have let them -- we have let them out of that contract or
attempting to let them out of that contract and the second lowest bidder also had a
similar situation and that only leaves us with one more bidder. So, at this point it seems
that the best option would be to void the contract.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Follow up. Tim, who wrote up the specifications and who checked them before
they went out for bid?
Curns: Councilman Bird, I wrote the specifications for the project and those were
checked internally.
De Weerd: So, the third bidder who followed the specifications, Iguess -- yeah, I see
Mr. Watts coming up. Because you do have one that's followed the specifications, does
that render it that they are all kind of disqualified? Is -- since someone did follow the
specifications, should they not be awarded this? Iguess it's just a question.
Watts: Yeah. The city does reserve the right to cancel a solicitation at anytime and
reissue if anything arises that we deem it to be a complication, basically. So, we have
that authority to cancel and reissue. The specifications that Tim was talking about --
also they are not all that vague, they are fairly clear, and also we had apre-bid meeting
which it was explained in detail to them, which we actually recorded and we have a
recording of the pre-bid meeting, which everyone attended as well. We are more or
less rescinding this as a favor to the bidders, because they seem to not got it, even
though it was -- it was in the specifications, it was discussed at the pre-bid meeting and
it was recorded during -- that discussion was recorded. We can clarify those specs by
basically removing a word, I think, out of one sentence is all it would be. But we could
offer it to the third -- I would -- I would feel more comfortable by re-issuing the bid
myself.
De Weerd: Iguess the disadvantage, though, is those responding already know how
others have responded.
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Watts: That is correct.
De Weerd: And that is -- that's the discomfort with -- with me.
Watts: And my -- my personal heartburn is the bidder who was the low bidder was quite
a bit lower and we brought it up that he was largely -- probably 40 percent lower than
the second low bid. He was good with his numbers. He read the specifications, said he
was good with it, and we proceeded forward. And, then, when it came time for him to
do that work he said that he did not realize he was supposed to provide the power
poles.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: He signed the contract?
Watts: Yes, sir, and --
Bird: And we got abid -- and we got a bid bond and a performance bond?
Watts: That is correct, sir.
Bird: I'm like the Mayor, I --this is not fair to the other contractors. Unless you're going
to change everything -- I mean everybody knows what each other bid.
Watts: Yeah. That's --
Bird: I mean he's got a public works license, don't he?
Watts: He does.
Bird: I don't know. Have you talked to Ted?
Watts: Yeah. This was Ted's recommendation.
Bird: It's almost to the point that we have no business doing our bidding. We need to
find a bid service to do it for us.
Watts: Well, we followed the process and we have contracted the contractor.
Bird: Well, if they got bonds and stuff, I'd start calling in and do it.
Watts: That is definitely an option.
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Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Keith, the second lowest bidder, do they include the power poles or was there
some misunderstanding there?
Curns: Councilman Hoaglun, in speaking with the second lowest bidder they also did
not include the poles and their explanation to me was that they provided the
documentation to their supplier and their supplier told them that they didn't believe that it
was -- it was the supplier that was saying that that was not part of the bid and so that's
why they also did not include them.
De Weerd: So, their supplier didn't attend the meeting that they attended.
Watts: I can't verify that. I know that the bidders themselves did.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: The supplier isn't responsible for the bid. They got a public works license, they
say they are capable of doing it -- if they are going to play with the big boys, they better
be a big boy. We have all -- in that realm of work we have all left stuff on the table and
had to eat it. I wish every time I made a mistake, 42 years, if they would let me rebid it.
Watts: The -- what surprised me of the second low bidder, because the difference
between the low bidder and the second low is about the cost of those poles, probably.
So, that would put the second low bidder at double what the project should cost, so -- if
you follow that.
Bird: How about the third?
Watts: He's right. He's within the --
Bird: And he's got everything?
Watts: We have not gone that far. From -- from direction from counsel this was what
they recommended us doing.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: If we haven't looked at the third bid -- if there is only three and we don't know
if they have complied or not, you really can't say they are nonresponsive, but if all three
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are nonresponsive, then, obviously, you could rebid it and, essentially, everybody is
starting from scratch. But I agree with Councilman Bird, that, you know, once --once
the numbers are public and published everybody knows where everybody's bottom line
is, including additional bidders that might bid on the job.
Bird: That's right.
Watts: Yeah. I would like to clarify as well -- the direction from Ted was prior to his
knowledge of the second low bidder also claimed that he did not include the poles. So,
it would make sense -- I do believe it would make sense to go to the third bidder and get
his decision before -- before we go out for bid. And we can if you would -- if you would
like to keep that option open, we can do that prior to rescinding that agreement. You
would be doing that strictly as a favor to that bidder, because they signed that
agreement and they did provide payment performance bonds.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: What did the low bidder's bid say? Does it say we bid it as per plans and
specifications?
Watts: Correct. They took no exceptions.
Bird: Holy cow. I mean, like I said, I wished you guys -- I had bid my job to you guys.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor. I guess we were looking at rescinding the first one, awarding
-- which sounds like they would want that rescinded, but we don't know if the third one --
the third one might go, yeah, I can do the job.
Watts: That is correct.
Hoaglun: And I would feel more comfortable if we just follow the process out and award
it to them, if they do it -- bid it correctly and that's what it's going to cost then --
Watts: I'm comfortable with that.
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I hadn't discussed this with Mr. Baird or
with Keith there either, but it certainly seems to me -- I mean the options the city has is
-- we have -- we have a bidder, basically, who now claims that they are in error. They
certainly have -- they certainly -- the city has the right to enforce the bid bond against
them if you want to and then -- and I think all that's really being asked at this point is to
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September 13, 2011
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Ilow them to rescind their bid. So, the Council's direction is, instead, to allow them to
withdraw their contract, but proceed against their bid bond, I think we can do that. I
don't think that's -- I don't think we are prohibited from that. I think if -- the process I
think Mr. Watts wants to follow is the second bidder is saying they are in the same
situation. They also have a bid bond. They are not able to -- I think -- I think overall
from what I'm getting from Mr. Baird here is that I think the discussion was more of not
getting into the situation where we are upside down with a vendor who couldn't perform
for what was provided -- for what they bid and us having to manage that, which we have
done before, and we have found that to be more administration than is necessary. So, I
think taking it step by step I think we have a bidder, basically, who has now informed us
they are in error, they want to be released from their bid, they can gain relief from their
bid either with us proceeding with their bid bond or not.
Watts: And I would have to refer to our legal counsel. I wasn't sure if we could go after
a bid bond, since they actually executed an agreement and entered into an agreement.
Can we still go back --
Nary: Do they have a performance bond, then?
Watts: They do. And that's a hundred percent of the contract value.
Nary: So, we have the ability to proceed against their performance bond.
Bird: And, Madam Mayor, I don't know if Bill would have to research this, but I believe
that if we go to the third, which is --which is 10,100 dollars higher that with a -- his
performance bond can pick that up to make the difference. Did you have any estimate
of what this job was going to cost? What was it?
Curns: That estimate was actually the budgeted amend for the project, which was
roughly 40,000.
Watts: And that third bidder is, I believe, right around that number.
Bird: He's 30 -- he's 39,116. Yeah.
Nary: Madam Mayor?
Watts: The second --
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, maybe we could put on next week's to
have this discussion before -- and we will bring it back to you, because the only other
issue I guess I'm unclear on is if we have awarded the bid and signed a contract if the
bid bonds of the second and third are even still available. I don't know that they haven't
been released. So, there may not be another bidder, technically, on this project any
longer and that may be where the issue was, simply to either grant them the relief or not
and, then, to rebid the project, because, technically, the other bidders may already have
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been gone, so -- but we can clear that up if you would like and bring this back next
week.
Bird: And Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I think Bill's got a very good point there, because the simple fact is we have, on a
couple of wells, had people that after the bid before the contracts were signed or
anything, we went to a second, because the first had forgot something and brought it to
us. But, man, we have got the contract signed, we got the bid bond, the performance
bond in place -- I think you better let Mr. Nary and Ted figure that out.
Watts: Yeah. I have never had -- I have personally never had that situation happen
before. They have five days prior to award to rescind their bid and that's a statute item.
We are able to allow that.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Just to weigh in, I support the idea of exploring other alternatives before
rebidding it, in fairness to the people who did bid. I think we need to explore the third
and the other things that have been mentioned.
De Weerd: So, they didn't rescind within the five day period?
Watts: No, ma'am. They actually signed a contract with us.
Bird: We got the bid bond -- or the pertormance bond.
Nary: Performance bond.
De Weerd: So, Council, what would you like to see? That this is put back on the
agenda next week and we will get an update.
Watts: Okay.
De Weerd: Okay.
Watts: I'll move forward with speaking to the third bidder. I believe that's the direction
we have and, then, bring back the results next week.
Bird: Okay.
Watts: Okay. Thank you.
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G. Planning Department: Discussion on Potential for City to
Compose and Adopt a Future Acquisitions Map
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. 6-G is our Planning Department. I'll turn this over to
Caleb.
Hood: Thank you, Madam Mayor and Members of the Council. I am here this
afternoon to talk to you for a little bit about the potential for a future acquisitions map. I
just gave the clerk a couple of handouts that hopefully will go down your direction here.
It just has, essentially, some background information regarding future acquisitions map.
We have talked about this potential a couple of times previous. The most recent being
on April 5th when we were considering the --the new format of the Comprehensive
Plan. It wasn't the main topic of discussion, but it was kind of a sub topic this last
spring. We also talked about it during a joint workshop with the Planning and Zoning
Commissioners in December, but, again, not as a main topic, but as a sub topic within
the Comprehensive Plan. So, that's one of the things that is stapled in the three-page
handout I just gave you. The last page is the language that we currently have in our
Comprehensive Plan on a future acquisitions map. It, basically, says we are exploring
options on this -- this topic. So, that's what I'm here to do a little bit more, is to give you,
again, just a quick refresher on Idaho Code, that's the second stapled item in that little
packet. Idaho Code 76-6517 allows cities to adopt a future acquisitions map. The
maps are used to make known a city's intent to invest in parcels of land critical to the
provisions of services and infrastructure within a maximum 20 year time frame. Now,
that's my verbiage, not what's in state code, but that's, essentially, what this -- that
statute allows. We have met a few times -- we being city staff, members from Parks,
Public Works, some of the earlier meetings we included the Joint School District No. 2,
some other public service providers in our discussion. We had a meeting late last
spring. Planning Department liaison Councilman Rountree attended that meeting with
some of the key department staff as we kicked this around a little bit more. So, I'm here
to kind of summarize some of that and see if we should spend anymore time pursuing
this. We haven't drafted a map per se, we have just been playing with the pros and
cons of this and when we initially discussed this, again, we talked parks and schools
and roads. We did see some value in having some map where all those needs could be
identified on a map, but not necessarily for these purposes, for acquisition type
purposes. What this kind of sub group did -- we have -- we have decided that just the
most site specific and critical locations may warrant this map and that's what's called out
here kind of in the middle of that first page, critical and specific land needs that were
identified. Again, these are --these are parcels or projects that really can't flow to our
map. You can't -- you can't move it to another part of the city, like a park, kind of we
have -- those floating things -- those floating designations on our comp plan, it's a
specific designation where that parcel or maybe you have got an option between two
parcels -- it's pretty key to expanding what you have already invested in. So, those are
three infrastructures that we have identified as potentially being on this future
acquisitions map. So, wastewater treatment plant upgrades, so adjacent property,
potentially. Well upgrades for -- I think Public Works has about six sites that they would
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September 13, 2011
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maybe need to acquire adjacent property sometime in the future and, then, rail trail, so
even along the railroad corridor. So, again, all those are pretty specific locations. Most
of them are still TBD, but we would need to pick one location kind of around somewhere
along that corridor. So, again, I have gone through some of the benefits and concerns
or pros and cons with some of that. We don't really have a full recommendation for you
of this sub group, but just wanted to get that --that information out to you and see,
again, if you're even interested in discussing this further. I think I maybe will highlight
just a couple of the benefits. It is pretty transparent with the community. I mean if we
have this map and we say we are going to go after this parcel and that parcel, there
aren't any surprises. It does give us some notice of when potential parcels we may be
interested in do become available as they come on the market. Some of the concerns
will be we don't really know what the true benefits of that is. We can negotiate today as
something comes on the market, so having this map don't know if that really adds any
value or another tool in our tool box per se. Some of the other cons that were
discussed include -- you can't really budget for something like this. It comes up, the
property is on the market, you need to react. You have 60 or 90 days to go and
purchase that property. So, there is really no good way to plan for those things. What
happens if you have multiple of these come on the market in the same year? So, that's
just a -- kind of a brief overview of some of the things that are called out and pros and
cons and, again, I'm here to seek your feedback on if we should pursue this further. I
will -- I will point out, depending on how this direction goes, eventually I do need to
clean up and update that section in the comp plan, so whether that be with inserting a
map there or striking that section out, that's of kind where we are -- or at least the
Planning Department where we are at with this future acquisitions map. So, I'll stand for
any comments or questions you may have.
De Weerd: Thank you, Caleb. Council? Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor, thank you. When I first heard this subject -- I think you
mentioned it to me. But somebody did. My first thought was, oh, great and we should
put on that map future water tank locations and future fire stations and future possibly
one police substation in the northwest end of our city at some point and hearing your
discussion today I can understand the reasons for not putting those specifically on this
map. But that makes me think that they ought to be added to our Comprehensive Plan
map, generalized the same way the parks are. I think we need to start identifying the
general location of all of those things that I just said and I think I'm agreeing with you
that perhaps that's not actually an acquisitions map, but we to need get them onto the
Comprehensive Plan map.
Hood: Duly noted. I will just comment we internally have discussed the value of having
some map, so we all kind of know where future investments may need to happen. I
mean having some -- one consolidated map. Not quite sure that it is appropriate for this
-- for our future use map or not. We just took some layers off of that, because it got to
be too busy with all the stuff going on, but we have talked about some value of having a
document that shows if Public Works needs a well site, maybe you can co-locate
something else next to it and -- and work things out like that as we look at a CIPs and
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those types of things. So, we have improved communication in having some map that
consolidates some of those facilities and master plans does make sense. So, we are
looking into that and what the appropriate vehicle or tool or outcome of that should be,
so appreciate the comment.
De Weerd: Caleb, doesn't that make sense, even though it could be busy, that you
have the busy one and, then, you show a series of maps with different overlays, so it's
less busy, but at least comprehensive. You can say that the busy one is the compilation
of -- of these three or whatever, but you at least have some stand atones grouped in
particular related items, so that people know a little bit more.
Friedman: Madam Mayor? Excuse me, Caleb. Sorry.
De Weerd: Oh, I'm sorry. Was trying to find the voice.
Friedman: Here I am. Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, that's a very good
suggestion. I think, you know, as Caleb talked about, we have the separate chapters of
the plan that talk about public services and those relate back to some of our other plans
that -- for example, the water comprehensive plan, the sewer comprehensive plan, as
those documents become finalized it might be possible to pull some of facilities mapping
that they have in there and stick them in the appropriate chapters of the Comprehensive
Plan under services, under utilities and that sort of thing, to provide the transparency
and the information that the Mayor was suggesting, still allowing the land use map to
remain pretty much as it is with a few of the essential things, like the schools and the
fire station. That's another option we could look at.
De Weerd: Any other thoughts from Council?
Bird: I have none.
De Weerd: Okay. So, do you have enough, Caleb, in order to move forward on this?
Hood: Quite honestly, no. And if you give me the green light to pursue this doesn't
necessarily mean you're supportive of a few acquisitions map, but I would like some
direction if you would like us to actually compile a map and show that to you and, if so,
are these three critical and specific needs, the ones we should be pursuing, do you
want more, do you want less? If you want to do another work session and really get
down into the legal mechanics of how this works, if that's appropriate, we can do that,
but I just don't know -- kind of at a crossroads. I can invest more time into this and I'm
happy to do it, but if there is really no interest in this, we will just -- we will put it to bed
for now and maybe look at it in years from now, but --
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
Hood: -- need a little more direction, please
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De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: I would say I'm definitely interested in it, but the point you raise about if we
actually mark a specific property in the city, even with these critical and specific issues,
we change the nature of any negotiation that may happen with the property owner and
while I was enthusiastic about the idea at first, I kind of agree with what you have said
that I'm not sure we gain anything. If -- if we can have a map that has the layers of --
we need to have this facility in sort of this location and we can enhance that idea. I
might skip the future acquisitions map. I just -- I don't like know. Like I say, I was
enthusiastic about it when -- when the thought first came to me, but I can see reasons
not to do it.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: And I know Caleb knows where I'm coming from, but just to restate it, I think
the idea of a future facilities map is a good idea. I don't want to see it tied to the state
statute. I believe a future acquisition map is appropriate for those areas where we have
significant investment, i.e., the wastewater treatment facility. We know in the next 20
years we are going to have to expand. What we need to know, though, is how much
property that's going to take or can we do it with the existing piece of property. Once we
know that, then, we need to identify that as something that we are going to have to
acquire. To me that's transparent. But to identify a pathway that's -- or a fire station or
a park that there is flexibility, I see the tighter you get that and the closer you tie it to the
state statute, the closer we are going to get into a situation of a takings question at
some point in time and I don't want to go there. It's not been tested particularly well, as
near as I can tell, has it, Bill? But there has been discussion about it and, you know,
once you -- once you invoke that future acquisition statute there are things we have to
do and that could cause somebody to request a permit or an annexation, which, then,
puts that on hold for 60 days and an action needs to take place. That could color what
kind of zoning an annexation might have that could, then, come back to say, well, that
isn't the highest and best use for me, I want something else -- by you putting that on the
map and saying you got to have it, then, you're taking the value of the rest of my land.
So, I can see where there is an argument to be made that I don't think the city wants to
to get into. But there definitely are situations -- and I think the wastewater treatment
facility -- some of it -- the plant facilities that we have on ground now that we can
anticipate need to expand, it's -- it's the way to go, because you don't want to lose that
option.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor? Yeah, I share Councilman Rountree's concerns on the future
acquisitions map, a formal designation. You know, when I think about what the city
does at the department level and the capital improvement plans that they have, looking
forward five, ten years down the road and, you know, taking Mr. Siddoway, since he's
here, as an example, parks, knowing that we need to acquire park land in this part of
the community at a future date five years out, seven years out, and that --that's still a
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September 13, 2011
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moving target and we have shown the ability when something becomes available at a
very good price and we know we are going to move there within that time frame, the
Council has acted and acquired property to -- to make that happen, even though it's not
going to be developed right away and so we still have that flexibility to do that, but from
a planning standpoint and communication standpoint within the city, it's good that
departments are talking and you guys are working on having the idea that these things
are going to be happening in these areas at some future point and as Councilman
Rountree pointed out, you know, the sewer plan, that's there, we have to expand down
the road some day, maybe when all of us are gone, but -- well upgrades, those sites are
already there. Having Public Works work with Parks Department, hey, you have got a
potential park site over here we need, we are going to need a well in that area, maybe
we can work something out, those type of things. So, it's --move it forward, but maybe
not in the formal sense is how I see it, so --
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I agree with everything that's been said, but I would like to expand on it, that the
point is that I don't like to see anything tied down. We know we got to -- we probably
ought to purchase something around public -- the wastewater treatment plant, but we
have always been able to -- if a good buy comes up, we have looked at it, if we think it':
a park site we do it. Right now in this economy, yeah, it's good buys, but at the same
token with our revenue like they are I just as soon see this property stay to tax rolls and
not be off tax rolls. I think we are -- I think we are a little ahead of our times. See,
development is going to tell us what we have to do.
Hood: That helps. Thank you.
H. Planning Department: Application with Ada County to
Recognize City's Current Comprehensive Plan
De Weerd: Ask and you shall receive. Okay. Item H, I will just let you continue on.
Hood: Thank you, Madam Mayor. So, the next item is -- has to do with the -- I think it's
still new. It was adopted in April. So, our new Comprehensive Plan, which I referenced
in the last agenda item, recently I e-mailed a copy of that to Ada County Development
Services staff. They -- they didn't have a copy. We transmitted them copies when we
were going through the process, but I don't recall if we ever sent them the final version
of this. So, I sent them an a-mail copy. They responded with a request for acopy -- bui
request that we file the official application with the county to renegotiate through Title 9
our -- them applying our comp plan and whatnot. So, we have a meeting next week
with Ada County Development Services, just to understand that a little better. I'm well
aware that when we amend our area of impact or propose to amend our area of impact
we need to renegotiate that with the county, just need to understand a little bit better if
it's any text change for our comp plan do we have to go through this renegotiation
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process every time or can we simply apply and say, hey, we spelled that word wrong
and we want to change that wording, will you recognize our word change, or maybe it is
something more substantial, you know, it was a renegotiation process, can we just
apply and have you -- have you do that. So, we are going to try to understand that a
little bit better. Depending on how they kind of explain that process to us -- because we
would like Ada County to recognize our new comp plan, obviously, but we have some
changes coming up. So, if that process is too involved -- I mean it's going to take three
or four months to get through their process, well, staff, will have to go and testify at their
commission and board level for that application. Would the Council be comfortable with
holding off application now and just waiting until we get some of these other things
cleaned up in our -- our newer version and, then, having them adopt what we think is
going to hold us over another six months or a year anyway. I just hate to be -- we are
going to have back-to-back processes doing -- we will do an amendment and just get
through their process and we will have another amendment we will need to apply with
them. So, just kind of a heads up that I'm hopeful that we can just work with them and,
you know, keep them in the loop on changes that we have to some of our policies and
plans, but maybe we can amend Title 9 even, that they -- so, they can acknowledge
some of these minor amendments to our Comprehensive Plan in the future. So, that's
more just kind of a heads up for you. I will keep you updated as to how that goes and --
and that they are still using our previous version of the comp plan, which isn't the end of
the world, I mean we didn't do wholesale policy changes anyway. So, them using our
previous version of the comp plan, not a huge issue, but I would like to get it cleaned up
with them and we are working on it, so -- I don't -- Pete, do you have anything you
would like to add?
Friedman: Yeah, just a couple points, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council. I think
-- I think Caleb did avery -- hit it pretty accurately. Specifically when we look at the fact
that we are going to do a major future land use amendment and I think start that
process kicking off here within the next few months. So, we will definitely have to go
back to them once that process is completed. From a practical perspective, you know,
as we receive applications in Ada county we have to evaluate them for consistency with
our Comprehensive Plan. Primarily we look at the future land use map. The future land
use map hasn't changed, so the document that they currently possess, which is the one
that they have identified in our Title 9 agreement, the land use map is still accurate and
up to date. So, that really doesn't affect anything and they practically don't look at our
policies anyway. So, my thought -- and Caleb and I were discussing this today, if it's the
Council's desire and we hold off -- we can have this discussion with the county next
week, but if we hold off until we complete that south Meridian future land use map
amendment or south Meridian and the field land use map amendment and, then,
renegotiate the whole thing -- I also would be interested in pursuing with them an option
of say once a year when we know that we have had these textual changes that occur
throughout the year, just say, hey, look let's work out a way where we can just come to
you once a year with nonmap amendments and just take care of the thing wholesale.
So, to embark on what Caleb has said will be a two to three to four month process to
get them just to recognize our reformatted plan when we know we are going to follow on
the heels of that within a few months with some map amendments, I think there is really
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not a great amount of exposure or risk, in my opinion, to us not -- you know,
renegotiating at this time just with our formatted plan. But those were my thoughts on it.
De Weerd: Thank you, Pete. Any questions? Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Yeah. Two comments. I agree with the direction that I think we are going. If
Ada county says, yeah, we will make word changes without a big process, then, let's
ask them to do that. But if -- if the response is, no, you have to go through the whole
process, then, I agree let's wait until we have done the south Meridian thing and, as you
say, maybe the fields project and this maybe out of place, but let me just throw in
something for people to think about. Many cities find that when a freeway facility is put
in a part of their community gets cut off from services and I know we have some issue
with our safety services having to cross the interstate that currently exists, I-84, I have
been thinking about the impact that Highway 16 is eventually going to have on us and
what I'd like to throw into the mix, probably, for future discussion is in our area of
interest might we want to give up the area that's going to be on the other side of
Highway 16? We have a little square of something like four square miles that kind of
sticks out of our -- what would be a straight boundary up McDermott -- when Highway
16 goes in that may be a difficult area to serve, both from Public Works and from safety
services, so I just want to throw into the conversation might we want to discuss offering
that to Star or -- you know, so that that might not be a problem for us. But I don't know if
we need to discuss that now, but I would like to see that discussed at some point.
De Weerd: Probably not. And that was -- that was contemplated a long time ago when
we looked at the Comprehensive Plan and they looked at their sewer design and all of
that. Meridian was taking that area and so they designed accordingly. So, it's kind of a
late hour to be discussing --
Zaremba: Okay.
De Weerd: -- that piece of it. A little scary, too. So, any further comments?
Bird: No. You answered for me.
Rountree: Good process.
De Weerd: Okay. One thing I think we do have an opportunity is looking at how to
keep that connection through land use and transition and those kind of things. It
presents a great opportunity.
Planning Department: Airport Road -Overland Road
Alignment Preference
De Weerd: Okay. Item 6-I is also Caleb and I see he's got hand outs. Thank you
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Hood: Thank you, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council. The next item on the
agenda is on this agenda at the request of Ada County Highway District. What I just
handed out is a -- it's not the whole plan, I do have a copy here if someone's interested
in the whole plan, but, essentially, we have been through most of the first four chapters
of the plan, it talks about public involvement and alternatives and process and needs for
this study. What you haven't seen is Chapter 5 and 6, which is the preferred alternative
and the implementation section. So, I thought I would give that to you. We certainly
aren't going to go through it now, it's still pretty lengthy, but I wanted you at least to have
a copy of it. I tried to figure out another way to get it to you, sorry I didn't get it into your
box earlier for you to look at, but I have CDs, I can run you a hard copy if you want the
whole corridor plan, but I thought it would be good anyways just to have it --just to get
you those sections in your possession anyways for now. So, let me know if you'd like
the -- the whole corridor door plan or want to talk more about it. I do want to let you
know that this was the -- Parametrics finished this draft sometime in July. No agency
has yet adopted it, so city of Nampa, Nampa Highway District, ACHD, or the city of
Meridian, or ITD for that matter. But ACHD is looking to. So, before they look to they'd
like to see if we have a -- any input or a preferred alternative that we would be willing to
let them know about. So, Jeff Lowe from ACHD is here this afternoon and will ask your
-- ask you if you're willing to state a preferred alignment at this time. I will also let you
know that the technical advisory team for this group was going to meet earlier last week
I believe it was, but it got cancelled, so we were going to get together and just kind of go
through this one last time, figure out where everybody is at, what they -- the game plan
is for adoption implement type things. So, I think with that intro -- oh, Jeffs already up.
I'll let Jeff speak to you on their request.
De Weerd: Thank you, Caleb. Welcome, Jeff
Lowe: Thank you, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council. I'm Jeff Lowe, one of the
planners at ACHD, and as Caleb stated, as staff we were looking to take this to the
commission for their adoption. Of course, with you being the land use agency we are
looking for your guidance. We feel that, you know, let's keep going with the momentum
that's been generated with the planning so far and also this plan would help give the
district a better understanding of how you feel about the area, help us make better
decisions in that regard. So, we are -- we are asking you to consider correspondence
on a preferred alternative. I understand you will be planning for the area still.
De Weerd: Thank you. Jeff, what is the --where are the commissioners in this process
in moving forward?
Lowe: Madam Mayor, the commission has been updated periodically through this
process and we were hoping to take this to them, you know, approximately a month
ago, but with delays -- or still working through things we have held off. I would think that
once they have a better understanding of how you feel, whether it's no preference right
now or a preference, they would make a decision at that time. I don't want to guess
what they would -- what they would say, but they might -- at least once we know how
you feel that helps us know how to feel as well, I guess.
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De Weerd: So, in essence, you're saying we really want to know what you guys think,
so we can move forward.
Lowe: Yes.
De Weerd: Right?
Hoaglun: So, Madam Mayor. Jeff, your question really is 2B or not 2B, that is the
question; right? It was just sitting out there so big, had to go with that. And that
alternative, I guess, what we had been waiting on for awhile --and it sounds like it's
worked out, that gravel pit alternative for 2B was something that we -- I know I was
interested in and Council discussions were interested in seeing if that would work and it
looks like, in my brief cursory review, that that is an alternative -- 2B alternative, that that
option is available. Is that right; Caleb?
Lowe: Madam Mayor, Councilman Hoaglun, yes, that is correct. It -- obviously the -- a
lot of work, but it can be done.
Hood: And maybe just to follow up. Yeah, we did -- it was some site tweaking from one
of the -- the previous alignments that you saw to have the least impact in what we
thought was the best alignment, but it was a slight tweaking of that 2B. So, it wasn't
exactly the same, but it was altered slightly, so we thought that it could be
accommodated through future development.
Hoaglun: Thank you.
De Weerd: So, that kind of ruins your 2B or not 2B, because it's the alternative 2B
Hoaglun: Right. Well, we always have to modernize the --
De Weerd: Or the alternative.
Hoaglun: You know, we have just got to keep updating. Life goes on.
Bird: Alternative B.
Hood: Madam Mayor, can I maybe just add one thing? I want to just bring it -- the
reason Jeff is presenting this to you and not myself has a little bit of history. Although
there have been two public involvement meetings on this topic, the city of Meridian has
not had a -- an opportunity, a forum for the general public to come and speak and do
the noticing and whatnot on this study and I mentioned at a previous meeting here that
if I get one shot at that, I want to do that as part of the comp plan, because eventually
we would like to roll and reference this project into our Comprehensive Plan, whatever
the plan looks like. Or maybe we don't like B, maybe it's something else and that's what
we want to put in our plan. But I'm a little sensitive and Idon't -- I don't mind if you -- if
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you do have a preference and certainly that's what's documented is 2B, but I did just
want to restate if we are going to -- we really haven't reached out to the public in
Meridian to comment on this. So, that's my only kind of background history on that.
De Weerd: Well, I do think, though, Caleb, the land owners in this area were invited to
a public meeting type of forum and we did hear from a number of the people out in that
area. So, it is the rest of our city, but those that are the most impacted by whatever
alignment is selected, certainly their opinion has been sought and we greatly appreciate
the sensitivity to that and I think in looking at how 2B has been altered, I think a lot of
that public comment was taken into account and people were listened to. So, that was
greatly appreciated.
Hood: Madam Mayor, if I could -- that's a great point and I do want to point out we had
a really good turn out, too, at both of the public involvement meetings, a lot of very very
high number of those directly affected did attend. So, I think that's a great point that you
make that we have been involved with those most directly affected.
De Weerd: Well -- and I think that was in a joint --there were a number of public
elected officials in that, so it was -- I appreciated all of the different staffs from the
agency and the effort that was put into making sure that key stake holders were in
attendance and that we had the opportunity to hear that dialogue.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: I would chime in seconding what -- what has been said. I did attend the
public meetings and tended to gather the Meridian residents around me. There were
certainly plenty of people there to talk to them, but I -- I felt that as I was discussing
these things, the people that talked to me pointed out which property was theirs and I
think I talked to just about everybody that would be affected by the portion that we are
looking at here and I would say the vast majority of them would have favored crossing
the gravel pit and part of the reason that I was withholding an opinion was to get
ACHD's assessment or Parametric's assessment is that doable costwise. So, I think
the answer that we are seeing in front of us certainly answers what I believe I heard
from the residents in the area and what I'm sure they made in their comments, which
ACHD has considered. So, I would be comfortable if -- as it looks like ACHD has
decided that crossing the gravel pit is doable, I would be comfortable supporting what
I'm looking at.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: A question. What's ACHD's next step, provided we give them some input?
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Lowe: Madam Mayor, Councilman Rountree, the next step would be taking this to the
commission and if they adopted it, we -- Caleb and I worked on the implementation part
of it, the plan itself, and those goals would start to be realized. You know, there is -- if
development were to occur we would have a good foundation to base decisions. It
continues the planning in the area, cooperating with -- with the agencies involved, those
types of things.
Rountree: Follow up. Is that done through a public hearing or is that just an action on
the part of the commission?
Lowe: Councilman Rountree, that would be a public meeting before the commission.
I'm not sure -- I can't answer for sure if it would be a public hearing per se, but I could
find out for you.
Rountree: Okay.
De Weerd: And I think certainly as Caleb brought up, we would want to make this, then,
part of that comprehensive planning effort in south Meridian, so at least people know
what options that, you know, they are commenting on, dealing with, looking at the
appropriate land uses surrounding it. So, I think it allows both the highway district to
move forward with the appropriate planning on their terms and -- or on their plans in
terms of what they will need, as well as on ours as we map out the south area of our
community.
Rountree: Madam Mayor? What's the timing with respect to approval if ACHD
approves this alignment? Do they, then, go into preliminary engineering?
Lowe: Madam Mayor, Councilman Rountree, this plan is based solely on development
-- as development occurs.
Rountree: Okay. Madam Mayor, I don't have a problem letting ACHD know that
Meridian has a preference and if this alternative is our preference, that they could move
it forward and we would move it forward through a public hearing process that would
result in the eventual adoption on the part of the city within our Comprehensive Plan.
That doesn't necessarily mean that that's what will end up in our Comprehensive Plan,
unfortunately, so we have kind of got a disconnect between where you're thinking
ACHD's adoption might go and what we may have to adopt in our Comprehensive Plan.
We can't just adopt this by a letter to ACHD, but we can express a preference. The
other thing I would state is I would recommend that the city express a preference for the
alignment, that the design detail at this point is premature, it's conceptual, and probably
need to clarify that as well, that we are just -- if we do show a preference here is that it's
the alignment of this corridor.
Hood: And, Madam Mayor, I'm willing to draft that letter for your signature, if that's the
motion that you all make this afternoon.
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De Weerd: Okay.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I agree. I think this is a very well thought out concept and I'm for it a hundred
percent.
De Weerd: Okay. Well, do I have a motion and --
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I would move that we move forward with a letter to ACHD,
have staff prepare such letter recommending option 2B for the Airport Road, with
indications of the comments that I previously made in the letter about preference for an
alignment, not design detail, and the actions that the city would ultimately have to take
through a public hearing process.
Zaremba: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second. Just clarity on -- this is the alternate 26.
Rountree: Alternate 2B.
De Weerd: Okay.
Rountree: Or not 2B.
De Weerd: Any comments besides that? Madam Clerk, roll call, please.
Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
De Weerd: All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: Thank you, Jeff, for being here.
Lowe: Thank you, Madam Mayor and Council. Thank you.
J. Planning Department: Transportation Priorities 2011
De Weerd: Okay. Our last transportation item, Item 6-J. Caleb.
Hood: This one I think is pretty fun. This is --this is one where we get to put our wish
list out there to all the transportation agencies. So, I hope that you all have had a
chance to review the -- the four roadway highway intersection and pedestrian
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improvement priority project list that the Transportation Task Force put together for your
consideration. We met on August 4th and did so and the task force is now asking the
Council to endorse the project list, so they can be sent to COMPASS, ACHD, and ITD.
Just a high level summary. Most of the changes to the priority order for this year
reflects some new data that we received from ACHD. They have some new level of
service maps and we used those a little bit more this year than we have in previous
years. They really show where some of the needs are. It's pretty interesting to look at
the priority lists. What we thought were lists -- or priorities before we had the data to
back those up, are pretty much where the needs are. So, what -- the perception and
the numbers are jiving pretty well, so this group is pretty in tune to what the needs are in
the community. Some of the other changes, just to note, generally anything that's in
construction in FY-12 has been either pushed to the bottom of the list or moved down at
least on the priority list, because the budgets have been set. So, there is no sense in
having that project be one of your top few priorities, because you, essentially, are giving
away points, because it's already programmed, it's planned, budgeted for construction.
So, those are --those are pretty much the main changes from this year, aside from
some of the new projects that are on the list and I will go through those real quickly
when we get to those. So, I'm going to start with community programs, unless there is
any initial comments or questions you have before I kind of get into the main nuts and
bolts of the priority list.
De Weerd: Go ahead.
Hood: Okay. So, community programs. I have got a letter here that I can share with
you. Sorry for all the handouts today. Typically I would put these in a packet, but I
didn't think you needed to review this stuff really beforehand. But what I have is a letter
addressed to the Mayor from ACHD asking -- it's a calls for projects list and, basically, it
says, you know, here is everything we want you to do and we want to have the list late
this year over to ACHD for consideration. So, I have got that list, as well as some of the
criteria they use for projects. So, I'll give that to you and you can peruse it later. But the
TTF we used some of the technical criteria and we noted six new priority requests for
this year for our community programs projects. Like in previous years, the TTF
considered the list that the parks commission has, as well as Joint School District No. 2.
We have staff and members from Joint School District No. 2 on the task force, so we
can merge the priority lists with a known list and -- from the rest of the citizens and other
staff here at the city and what you see, then, is the 2011 community programs priority
list. So, I'm going to just jump to some of the new items. So, on page four of the packet
that you had for this meeting, project 15, 16 and 17 were all projects that Joint School
District No. 2 had on their priority list that we did not currently or previously have on our
priority list. So, we are proposing to add those so we can track them together, but there
is no need for the city to actually apply to ACHD for those projects, because they
already know about them. Joint School District No. 2 applied for them. So, that's 15,
16, and 17. Jumping down that same page to priority project number 24, 25 and, then,
it will continue on on the next page, are the new projects for this year. So, I didn't bring
any fancy maps or anything to show you where they are, I thought a lot of these are
pretty -- we know in town where we are. The first one on 4th, Tim Curns noted there is
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a power pole in the middle of the road. There is no sidewalk. It's really a hazard type
situation. I will point out it's not a safe routes to school designated route, so you won't
get all the points at ACHD when they apply for this project, but there certainly is a need
there. And, then, same with State and 4th. That was I actually talked to that property
owner, he has -- I think it's four feet wide detached -- there is no curb and gutter on that
section of State Street. He has sidewalk, but he's mid block. No -- he's got two or three
property owners on either side, so there is this landlocked piece of sidewalk and he
asked if we would request that the entire section from 3rd and 4th -- from the north side
of State Street be fixed with -- with sidewalk. Priority number 26, another new project
that we are proposing to apply to ACHD for -- Duane Drive, Ustick to Red Feather. So, I
do want to specifically call this one to your attention, because this is -- you have had
previous meetings on this roadway in particular and it not being up to current city
standards, it's a rural 22 to 24 foot asphalt public street, was previously gated, the gate
-- I think it's still there, but it's open -- off of Ustick just east of Eagle Road and Red
Feather Subdivision is to the south. So, one of the ideas that we thought would help
that neighborhood -- because we hear a lot of complaints about people going -- one, it's
straight, there is not a lot you can do about it being so straight. But If you can extend
some asphalt and add a sidewalk for pedestrians and maybe even bicycles to use, so
you're not sharing the 22 to 24 feet of asphalt, that may be -- may help out there for
those residents. I know a lot of them feel like they are rural, they have livestock,
whatnot. But this was just an option that we came up with that thought it may improve
the situation on quality of life, if, in fact, Duane Drive is going to remain open for general
public use. Twenty-seven is the rails to trails. So, in that one we are not going to ask
ACHD to buy a pathway network along the railroad corridor, but we do want to start the
discussion about crossing, particularly at arterial intersections, because that's going to
be key to making this network happen is some day eventually when we get a trail along
the rail corridor we need to cross all the arterials as far as it goes. So, we need to work
with them and coordinate them -- with them on location, design, those types of things.
So, this one really is more of a way to get the discussion started. I don't see them
funding anything right away. We certainly aren't ready to build anything. So, that one is
just to get on the list, it's towards the end of our priority list. As we get closer to having a
real project I could see this one moving up the priority list, but --but that is new this year
and we would propose to apply to ACHD this year. One change I would propose for
Council consideration today, from what the TTF recommended, is number 28. I would
propose to flip flop that one with priority number 14. Just an oversight on my part. The
motion from the TTF -- number 14 is Victory -Observation Point -- that one is a
construction year in '12 and as I have stated previously, we'd like to move those
towards the back. Twenty-eight is a safe route to school project and typically we like to
have those towards the beginning. So, if you flip flopped 28 and 24, I think that's
consistent with some of the other changes that we made, so --and, then, 29 is our last
new project, Eagle, Victory to -- or Falcon to Victory, that is another property owner that
requested that directly to ACHD, but they are within the Meridian area of impact, so I
proposed to add it to the list, so, again, we can track it through the process and support
that property owner in getting some pedestrian improvements in front of their property.
So, I think that's a -- maybe just one -- sorry. One more thing to highlight. There are
three things at the very end of the list on page six that are highlighted as not prioritized.
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Those are three projects that were on the parks commission's list of priorities, but aren't
very -- they won't score well at ACHD. They are really internal -- not right of way
projects. So, they are on the list, so we can track them as pathway projects, but for
ACHD community program projects, quite honestly, they will never get funded through
that -- that program, so -- but they are on the list, so we can track them. So, I think with
that I would ask that you endorse the list that's before you today with the one change to
the Victory -Observation Point and Project 28. And I will stand for any questions at this
point.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: Caleb, on Project 30, the Ustick, Ponderosa Elementary to Linder, that
school access is off of Ustick and it's relatively shallow off of Ustick. It is through the
neighborhood. But on rainy days and days when there is a lot of parental dropping off
of students and buses, that intersection with Ustick becomes a real hazard with people
turning -- making right and left turns in there, people queued up out into Ustick, trying to
get in and through the school and get their kids dropped off and people driving Ustick at
40, 45 miles an hour, it -- it can get really dicey some mornings right there. I don't know
if that's something ACHD is aware of or something that they might want to look at, but I
have been in -- in that area several times when you're almost at gridlock because of the
queues from the school all the way down -- I think it's Naomi or something --the street
is -- is something like that and backed up on Ustick. The other thing that happened is
people coming out of there don't stop, they come shooting out of that side side street
and going full bore right-hand turn onto Ustick when that happens and I don't know if
there has been any accidents there, but it's an accident waiting happen on those
mornings when that occurs.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I'd second that. And also at pick up time when I have to pick my grandchildren up
it's just as bad as it is in the morning.
De Weerd: Unfortunately, I think you can say the same for almost every elementary
school --
Bird: Yeah. You're right.
De Weerd: -- region in our community, you know -- and I don't know how you get
parents to be more cognizant and cautious as they are going in and out of these areas
off of the busy arterials. You know, it is -- it is frightening off of Locust Grove. You have
that on mid McMillan, you -- it's -- it's kind of indicative to the elementary schools and
having down the street from Linder Elementary and seeing how parents drove as they
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were trying to hurry their kids to school as little kids are walking down the street. It's --
it's -- it's a problem everywhere.
Rountree: But it's when you're dealing with a major arterial, like Ustick Road, it's -- it's
even more of a problem when you have people stopped on that facility in an unexpected
situation and for no apparent reason, just because of the lack of storage on the part of
getting into that school, because it's so close to the road. That was some of those other
situations you're stopped and backed up on some collectors and some local streets --
De Weerd: Hunter was the same
Rountree: But this one was particularly bad because of Ustick. And Ustick is getting
more and more traffic with Ten Mile in that particular section, so --
Hood: Madam Mayor, I propose we will take that and I will work with Mr. Nary, maybe
Mr. Curns, and get this on a -- it seems appropriate for the Traffic Safety Commission to
address -- not necessarily for the community programs, but duly noted and --
Rountree: It just brought that to my mind --
Hood: Yeah.
Rountree: -- that's something I don't know that we spoke about before, but it's
Hood: And there is traffic staff on our Traffic Safety Commission from ACHD, so we can
-- I have got it noted and we will --and others. I mean as these are known if you would
let me know, then, we can vet them through the process, ask for the engineers to look
into it more and see if there are solutions out there, so --
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yeah. I think when Pine was extended and connected the middle school
out there, Lewis Clark became something similar as well.
Rountree: I'm sure.
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Nary.
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, Caleb is right and it's very timely. Our
meeting next week for traffic safety, one of our topics is schools and the challenges of
traffic and we intentionally set it to -- you know, a month into the school year to address
what types of needs there are and so this is very timely and we will certainly have that
discussion on our agenda next week.
De Weerd: It's a nice welcome to Mr. Lancaster, too, as a new commissioner on the
Traffic Safety Commission.
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Nary: Absolutely.
De Weerd: Yeah.
Hood: Okay. I'm going to move on to roadway projects, unless there is anymore -- any
comments on the -- on the community programs, sidewalk -- okay. So, roadways and
intersections, again, we received a letter addressed to the Mayor from COMPASS, call
for projects for the TIP and they would like to have our endorsed transportation priority
list by October 5th. So, we are well within the time line for their projects and, again, the
task force discussed roadway and intersection projects on August 4th. I'll highlight a
couple of the prospects for you, what was 2010 ranked number two for roadways is still
priority ranked number for the task force and ask you to concur, but I do want to point
out that Franklin, Ten Mile to Linder, has slipped two years at ACHD from 2012 to 2014.
I know the Mayor is aware of this, but just some of the -- the revenues that ACHD
anticipated aren't coming to fruition, so a couple of projects from '12 had to be pushed
back and there was a little bit of a domino effect with some of those, too, so -- but I just
want to call that to your attention. And, then, project number three, Ten Mile, Cherry to
Ustick, that one slipped one year from 14 to 15. So, there is some of that domino you're
seeing, so that Franklin, Ten Mile, Linder, moved into 14 and this one had to slip to 15.
So, just point those out. They are still high priorities for the city, but just to point those
out. I'm going to jump down to --
De Weerd: And, Caleb, I guess I would just add that ACHD has recognized that in
particular number two, because of the Ten Mile interchange, is important and they will
do what they can if they can have cost savings and -- and be able to get that in a
different year, they are certainly focused on that.
Hood: Thank you, Madam Mayor. Yeah. It wasn't good news, they have been willing
to work with me and I think others to do what they can to see if we can't get it back in a
time line, but right now as far as the books go, it's -- to balance the books it's in '14, so
-- probably ranked number nine -- this is one of the ones that I'll call to yourattention,
because it was 26th last year, Linder, Cherry to Ustick. But when you look at the level
of service if fails in the p.m. peak. So, the task force moved this one up from kind of the
middle of the road or bottom third of our project list up to the top third. So, I'll just
highlight that one that really the -- the volumes and level of service, the VC ratios, some
of the safety, shows that there is a need down Linder from Cherry to Ustick a little bit
more than what the task force had recommended in the past. That's probably the
biggest change to the list. Most of the other ones just kind of fell in line, so I think with
that I will stand for any questions you may have on roadway project priorities for this
year.
De Weerd: Thank you. Council, any questions?
Bird: I have none, Mayor.
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Rountree: No.
Hood: Moving on to intersections, then. Similar story this year. So, I'm on page ten of
the memo for your packet. The two that really advanced after looking at some of the --
the volumes, level of service stuff, for Projects 11 with 12 on this year's
recommendations, which are 24 and 25. So, the Cherry-Linder intersection and the
Fairview-Locust Grove intersection show that there was a need. Now, it's not level of
service F, but certainly when you look at some the other projects it's more congested
than level of service A, like is at Amity-Eagle. I will also note Projects 14, 15, 16, 17 and
18 all moved down. That was last year's one, two, three, five, and eight projects and
the reason they are moving down is ACHD's constructing them. The last three, Ten
Mile, Victory to Locust Grove, Victory, and Black Cat, Cherry, are all temporary
intersections and in the first two, Ten Mile, Ustick and Pine, Linder, all this year as
ultimate intersections. So, that's good. Five of our top ten are being addressed this
next fiscal year. So, they move down on our priority list, because they are being
constructed, so --and, then I'll also note and request something else -- a potential
intersection came up after August 4th, I was made aware of a little bit of an issue with --
we have been working with ACHD on trying to get -- as do the Pine-Linder intersection
to also do an upgraded crossing of the railroad tracks. They contacted ITD, this wasn't
able to happen with that project, so, essentially, your -- that southern leg of the
intersection will still have a stop controlled -- you have to stop at the railroad, even
though -- or even northbound, you would have to stop, come to a signalized
intersection. So, we are hoping to get an automated arm or an improvement there of
the railroad crossing, so you wouldn't have a stop controlled right next to a signal. Just
didn't work out. So, I thought maybe it would be appropriate for the Council to add that
intersection -- it's not an arterial-arterial intersection, as are the other ones on the list,
but to put that on the list and if you do think that's a good project to put on this list, to
maybe give it a priority or order -- I'm not quite sure where that should fit -- I would
recommend that we add it to the list. Certainly there is a need there. I think once that
project -- it's unfortunate it can't happen with the project. We were moving down that
road, but the funding scope changes, budget things I mentioned previously to ACHD, it
just didn't align, so --
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes.
Hoaglun: Yeah. That's one there is a need. There is definitely a need for that, so -- I
would like to see it added to the list.
Rountree: And it didn't qualify for state rail safety crossing?
Hood: We contacted --
Rountree: It's not high enough on the list, probably, because there hasn't been an
accident or a death.
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September 13, 2011
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Hood: Right. But I did contact -- I'm forgetting his name now. At ITD. Because they
were looking -- they were doing a call for projects, too, for crossings. We talked to them
about split corridor and this crossing here and Pine-Linder. I want to say Wayne, but
that's not it. Anyways -- yeah. It just -- it didn't qualify for the funds. They were --this is
somewhat hearsay, but ITD was a little bit less willing to give the money for --through
that program, because ACHD --they thought ACHD probably should have thought
about that with their intersection project. So, they -- I'm paraphrasing and that's kind of
how it went down was they were like, well, that's like your project, you should -- you
should pay for it, then, because it your project is really causing this need kind of thing,
so -- and Ihaven't -- I don't know all the details there, but that's some of the push back,
at least that I have heard from ITD on why that wasn't able to be funded through that
program. So, do we have an appropriate location -- I didn't make a recommendation on
where it should go. I mean top ten I would think, maybe. But Idon't -- I don't know what
-- what you all think, so --
Rountree: Well, let's -- in my opinion it's a high priority, because it's -- again, it's one of
those accidents looking for a place to happen with the school traffic there and increased
rail crossings, I think their volume's picking up. It's too bad they couldn't have relocated
the flashing lights that were on Ten Mile to that location or to Black Cat. I'm sure the
equipment is still operable. But that's a -- that's a piece that needs total reconstruction
just because the approaches are so out of whack, out of alignment.
Hood: Schwindamin is his name. I just remembered. Sorry.
Rountree: It can't be all bad, then.
Hood: So, five, six -- I need a number. I don't know what --sorry. I mean they are all
high priorities, I'm not quite sure --
Rountree: Isn't Chinden and McDermott going to be a state project anyway?
Hood: Yes. With 16.
Rountree: So, I would think it could easily go into the ten slot.
Hood: And, then, my final point on -- on this whole roadways and intersections is -- and
what feeds into the system are project narratives. Last year was the first year where the
CICAC adopted a new scoring and ranking process where cities can get up to 30 points
out of a 200 point system to bump up a project. If there is economic development. If
this is other infrastructure. You got sewer and water going in, or whatever the case may
be, you can make a case, basically, for why you should get these bonus points. They
don't want you writing a letter for every single project on their list. A handful. So, last
year we submitted five and this year I propose to submit for three of -- of those same
five. Split corridor is one. Ten Mile, Ustick to McMillan, was the other. And Linder
Road overpass was a third out of those five. Black Cat-Cherry and Locust Grove-
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Victory are constructed in -- in this next year -- or will be constructed, hopefully, this next
year and so those -- I wouldn't write narratives for. But are there any other projects that
you would like staff to submit narratives for and I listed three in the packet, but up to a
couple more, if you wanted to. Maybe the Pine railroad intersection would be another
candidate that I didn't list in the packet. But if there are any others that you would like
me to apply for to potentially get these bonus points, quite honestly, I mean I think the
most we saw any project jump after it was CIC ranked it was two spots and there is 157
projects. So, it's not going to make or break your project, typically, but it does help.
They are points nonetheless, so --
De Weerd: Well -- and I think the narrative helps, Caleb, in just building that
understanding, so that whether they move forward they don't fall backwards. It's just
part of that communicating the importance and some of the reasoning. So, I think it's --
it helps dramatically.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, if Caleb's looking for something to request the bonus points
for, I would say the project we just talked about with Pine-Linder makes good sense if
you're going to be down there doing that intersection, that you're mobilized and got a
construction crew there and you're going to have the road torn up and traffic diverted,
get in there, get it done, and don't come back for another 20, 30 years. And it's
expensive, I know, but it's -- it's an add on to that project that isn't outrageous.
Hood: If I may -- I don't want to set expectations, though. That project is set for this
next year 2012 and my understanding is --
Rountree: They don't want bonuses added to those?
Hood: Well, the problem that I understand is that you have to use the railroad
contractors for that work and they are out two to three years. So, even if you had the
funds, you have to hire their contractors to do the work in their right of way. So, there is
--essentially, I've heard it's impossible to get them to come out -- even if we wrote them
a check it's impossible to get them to come out there to do that project this next year,
because you have to use -- I don't know how many contractors they have, but you have
to pick their contractor to do the work to make the crossing happen itself. So, again, I
don't get into that level that much, but I have heard from others that that's really the
issue here, they have got to come back anyways and do that, just because they are --
again, what I have heard, two to three to four years out.
De Weerd: Wow
Hood: So --
Rountree: But the roadway work could be done.
Hood: Yeah.
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Rountree: There is some significant grading that needs to be done to make that work --
those approaches work.
Hood: Uh-huh. So, I have got one -- I have got a slot for a -- they said a handful, so we
can do five, if there is another one. If not, we can go forward with our solid projects and
I can write narratives for those.
Bird: Go with the four.
Hood: Okay. And, then, I would like an official motion, if you don't mind, on those
priority lists. Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't talk about ITD's --and this one should be pretty
quick. It's, essentially, the same five priorities, on page 12 of the packet, as last year
and that's what Iwould -- I would propose that the Mayor sign a letter to send over to
COMPASS and the ITD board on our priority projects this year. I guess one thing to
point out there, the TTF did discuss potentially calling out specific intersections along
Chinden. We just have widen 20-26. Well, that's a big bite to take. So, they thought
maybe -- it doesn't have to be this year, but maybe breaking out specific projects within
that as priorities may be appropriate for maybe next year and if you felt to do that this
year, we could certainly amend it at this point, too. So, I did -- we did have a good
discussion that way. We didn't get to the point of saying this intersection is more
important than that one and, then, you could widen this stretch, but I didn't want to call
that out and -- and with that, Madam Mayor --
De Weerd: I think every one of those five are big projects.
Hood: Oh, yeah.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor and Caleb, aren't some of those going to be development
driven as well? I mean we could make a recommendation, but if development is going
in here and there is requirements for that to be widened, I mean it's kind of --
Hood: Madam Mayor, Councilman Hoaglun, the best that we can do, taking 20-26 or
even Linder Road overpass, is we can require right of way preservation. The actual
construction of any of those improvements, no, we can't require exact or get any of
them. Some of the Eagle Road corridor improvements we do require some
landscaping, lighting, those types of things, but --but not really.
Hoaglun: Okay. Thanks.
Rountree: Madam Mayor. On 20-26 we could suggest that they develop a phasing
plan off of the corridor study that supposedly they are finishing or is finished and waiting
for approval and indicate our preference that they start at Eagle Road and move west
and -- with the new intersection improvement that they are doing now at -- it's Linder;
correct?
De Weerd: Uh-huh.
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September 13, 2011
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Rountree: The first phase be from Linder to Eagle, not only as right of way
preservation, but doing the preliminary engineering so they can widen that. The only
way we are going to get it done is in small increments and that's --that's not a small
increment for their budget, but it's a doable project and it goes from logical termini from
a completed intersection to a completed intersection.
Hood: If there is concurrence on that, I think I'll write the letter, then, for the Mayor to
sign that will highlight both the Meridian Road interchange and request that they come
up with a phasing plan, Eagle Road to the west and, then, probably stay pretty silent on
the other ones. They are still on our priority list, but really do some highlighting of those
top two projects anyways in requesting those, if everyone is okay with that. Okay.
De Weerd: Caleb, while we are on the transportation lists and -- what are the next
steps that are happening on Eagle Road with the median project?
Hood: Madam Mayor, I have not heard anything for six weeks or so. I know a letter
was sent. I have not heard any response back. I think ITD is still moving forward with
their pavement rehab project, which includes center medians on Eagle Road. I do not
believe that they are studying any further the actual design of those medians. I don't
know if Robert has seen the letter back from them or not, but I have not heard anything
back from them that they are looking specifically at any of the downstream or upstream
impacts that their project may have. So, they are, as far as I know, still on schedule for
construction this next year, so --
De Weerd: And -- because it seems like I talked to a small business owner at Meridian
Business Day that had mentioned some kind of a public hearing on Eagle Road corridor
and I hadn't seen nor heard about that.
Hood: Yeah. There was one late spring up on -- at the church there, the Nazarene
church I believe it is, up on -- between Ustick -- or north of Ustick. But I -- yeah, I think
they are done pretty much with their public involvement process and -- so that's news to
me. I haven't heard anything.
De Weerd: Okay. Okay. Anything else from Council? Thank you. I know this is a
mammoth thing to stay on top of and certainly your diligence to -- and your detail to
keep us informed and give the appropriate feedback to our transportation partners is
greatly appreciated.
Hood: Well, thank you for your time. I know sometimes I get a little wordy and I
appreciate your patience and -- if you don't mind, could I -- can I get an official
endorsement just in case this ever comes back that -- with the action -- or some action
anyways.
De Weerd: And, actually, I think that is necessary by COMPASS on a transportation list
and priorities, so that we can get it to them as well.
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
Page 42 of 52
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: I move that we approve the transportation list of priorities that have been
presented and discussed here this afternoon.
Hoaglun: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second. Any discussion? Madam Clerk, will you call
roll.
Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
De Weerd: All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Hood: Thank you.
K. Police Department: Mutual Aid Agreement with Elmore County
Sheriff s Office for Law Enforcement Services at Gunfighter
Skies 2011 Air Show on September 17 and 18, 2011
De Weerd: Thank you. 6-K is our Police Department and discussion on the mutual aid
agreement with Elmore county. Hello.
Basterrechea: Hello. Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, we are just asking for
you to endorse a mutual aid agreement with Elmore county for our police department to
assist them at the Gun Fighter Skies air show. We have done this every year for --
since as long as I have been here and we just basically -- we help them with traffic
control issues and things like that and we are just formalizing that agreement now.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. Council, any questions?
Bird: I have none.
Rountree: No.
De Weerd: Okay.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Hoaglun.
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
Page 43 of 52
Hoaglun: 1 move we approve the mutual aid agreement with Elmore County Sheriff's
Office for law enforcement services with the Meridian Police Department at the Gun
Fighter Skies 2011 air show on September 17th and 18th, 2011.
Zaremba: Second.
De Weerd: I have a motion and a second. Any discussion? Everything has been
cleared through legal?
Basterrechea: Legal. Yes.
De Weerd: Okay. Okay. Madam Clerk, will you call roll.
Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Hoaglun, yea.
De Weerd: All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: Thank you, Tracy.
Basterrechea: Thank you.
L. Clerks Office: Discussion on Official City Seal
De Weerd: Okay. Next item is under our Clerk's Department.
Holman: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, this will be very very brief. Well, I
guess depending on how long your discussion might be. I assured Mr. Friedman that I
had as many options as Caleb had on his first for a city seal, so -- what you see in front
you is just a copy of what our official city seal is currently. I believe it was adopted in
1952, according to our code. We were looking at getting some new seals printed up or
created in the clerk's office, because they are getting kind of old and worn down and it's
actually, in our city code and so I talked to Madam Mayor about possibly updating our
city seal to make it more consistent with our city logo, these entryway signs, all of the
different things that our city has moved to now, kind of with the swoosh and the star and
-- but since this is actually in our city code it needs to be approved by Council whether --
Iguess I'm looking for direction on whether you would like to change it and, if so, I have
two options for changing the city seal. So, it also says in the city code that the city clerk
is the official holder of the city seal and it is -- I like to remind Luke Cavener that it's my
power. That's the only little bit of power that I have. He's not allowed to touch it. So,
anyhow, this is the seal right now that we have. We came up with a couple of different
options. This one's the first option and it looked a little busy to me. I tried to keep a lot
of the stuff on it that we had, kind of like the seal that's out in the plaza and the coins
that we did when we moved into the new City Hall. It had the established in 1893 and
the incorporated in 1903. I didn't -- that's the first option if we want to keep both of
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
Page 44 of 52
those things on the seal. The second option looks a little cleaner, a little nicer. This is
what gets stamped every time I attest the Mayor's signature I emboss one of those gold
seals that goes on a proclamation or anything else we might hand out. So, I'm just
looking for direction, seeing if you're open to this idea of updating our seal or just would
like to stay with the old original seal from the 1950s.
De Weerd: Any comments from Council?
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba:
Zaremba: I like the idea of upgrading it to begin with and thank you for exploring that.
The option two is probably my favorite. I would ask one question. The original one that
we are currently using has the word seal in the middle of it and I believe that's pretty
common on most seals that that word may need to be there. And, then, also while we
are looking at the original one, I like the pie crust border. That's pretty common on
seals as well to make it stand out on a page as an official seal. So, I would like some
version of option two, but stick in the word seal and change the border to the pie crust
thing. Personal opinion. But I like the idea of upgrading it. Ithink that's a great idea.
Holman: Okay.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I would go along wholeheartedly with Councilman Zaremba. Ithink it's time we do
change. But Ithink -- I don't know if it's -- you legally have to put seal in it and I
definitely like the pie crust edge. Ithink it looks better.
Holman: Madam Mayor and Councilmen Zaremba and Bird, it is actually listed in our
city code that this represents our official corporate seal, so I would probably have to do
a little bit of research regarding corporate seals, because there is not a lot of definition
in the actual city code. So, I don't know if Mr. Nary knows anything about this, but I can
definitely look into it further and we could add that.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor? Jaycee, can you flip to that option two again, please.
Holman: So, Madam Mayor, Councilman Bird, my question would be if you wanted to
add the word seal or if we need to have that on there as our official corporate seal,
where would it make sense to put it in the upgraded design?
Bird: That's what I was just looking at. I don't know
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September 13, 2011
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Holman: Well, we could -- it's my thought, pardon me, would be possibly putting official
seal of City of Meridian, incorporating it into possibly some of that wording as an option.
Bird: That could be worked out on the top there. And I'm trying to remember if private
corporations, if -- I think ours had -- always said seal on it, but I'm not sure.
Hoaglun: Yeah. Madam Mayor, what I was thinking is if you needed the word seal you
could put it either top or bottom. Probably bottom right in the middle there that it just
says seal. So, it's City of Meridian Idaho seal. That makes sense logically to go that
way and -- and it looks pretty clean. I like option two personally. It's a nice clean look to
it.
Holman: Okay.
Bird: Pie.
Hoaglun: Pie -- it's okay. I don't mind
De Weerd: I think the verbiage kind of helps delineate it and so it -- the pie is not
necessarily -- it's making me hungry. But, yeah, I don't know if the pie is necessary with
the lettering, but --
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor and Jaycee, that's a question I have is -- is that also for
embossed seals? That's why it's a --
Holman: Madam Mayor, Councilman Hoaglun, yes, I have two different ways that I seal
things. The embossed -- the embossing seal, which I use anytime we use the gold
seals for anything and, then, just the stamps that myself and the deputy city clerk use
when we attest the Mayor's signature.
Hoaglun: Yeah. I -- I'd probably prefer the full circle, as opposed to pie, but that's just
my preference. I can live with either. It's not --Charlie gets to be the tie breaking vote
on that.
De Weerd: I think he will make the tie.
Hoaglun: Oh, that's right, he will.
Rountree: I'm not particularly -- either way. Whatever makes Jaycee happy that is fine
with me.
Holman: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, if I could just add my thoughts. This
is big right here, but when it gets smaller the actual official size of this seal that I'm
putting on documents, I think it might be a little bit confusing to have the hashmarks all
the way around the outside with all these little tiny letters. I don't know how clear it
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September 13, 2011
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would be on a smaller stamp. I could certainly -- there would be some costs to having
them make up two of them and --
Nary: Madam Mayor?
Holman: -- what it looks like.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
Nary: Oh. Go ahead.
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I have -- I have no problem with doing
like the pie, but it's -- whatever you like and
detract from the words. I'm for that.
whatever. I'm like Councilman Rountree. I
as you shrink it down it might -- it might
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I have just been looking at the Idaho
Code while you have been discussing it and as you can imagine there is nothing in the
code specifically about what the seals are supposed to look like. They have a common
theme and you have to remember, of course, most of these corporate seals existed
when there was only an embossed seals and my belief is -- and we will certainly do the
research before we get a final one for you, but the word seal was to make sure it was
recognized that was the purpose of that stamp. Secondarily, my belief is that that pie
edge around that was to make sure you had an edge to this -- to this seal, so that you
would know what it was. Otherwise, you would have floating -- you know, you would
have floating words on a page. Rarely anymore do official documents have an
embossed seal because it doesn't photocopy and it doesn't -- it doesn't -- it doesn't go
through micro filming or anything very easily. They ended up having to ink them -- you
probably recall that. They would ink those so that you could actually see them. Now
most corporate seals of any sort are done in a stamp, so it has an edge to it anyway.
So, I don't believe that other than because of the uniformity of the look it's required that
there be that type of scalloped sort of edge to it or anything. So, I will verify that with the
code. I have not seen anything in the code that has any specifics for cities or corporate
seals in general as what's required, but my guess is the seal was just to make sure that
it was clear that was the purpose of that stamp and that it had some authority for it. So,
having the word seal or official seal probably may be appropriate. The edging probably
is not. So, as long as it's clear there is an edge to that -- to the seal itself it's probably
clear enough as to what the purpose is. But we will verify that before we get a final one
in front of you.
De Weerd: Okay. Any other comments?
Rountree: Go for it.
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Page 47 of 52
De Weerd: So, in summary, it's just to add the official seal of above the city of; is that
correct?
Holman: Madam Mayor, putting it at the top, not the bottom? Just center it in the top
there? If everyone is fine with that, then, what I will do is have them come up with one
more kind of prototype and would you like me to bring this back before you for an official
vote in a future meeting?
Zaremba: Madam Mayor? Actually, I was visualizing it below, the word seal.
Hoaglun: As was I.
Zaremba: I think the space is better.
Hoaglun: Now if you need official seal, then, you could split the words. Official City of
Meridian Idaho --
De Weerd: Oh, no.
Hoaglun: -- seal, see, and it all flows again.
Bird: That is a good idea.
Hoaglun: You know. Official City of Meridian Idaho seal.
Holman: Let me start my presentation over.
Hoaglun: Don't want us involved in design work.
Holman: With that direction --
De Weerd: I think you can work with it, see what works visually and has balance and --
Holman: Thank you.
De Weerd: And I guess you do need to bring it back, because you do need an official
vote.
Bird: Yeah.
M. Legal Department: Taxicab Mobile Sales Unit Ordinance
De Weerd: Okay. Item 6-M under our Legal Department. I will turn this over to Mr.
Nary.
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
Page 48 of 52
Nary: Thank you, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council. I was reviewing the minutes
from our meeting in August. We had a discussion about the taxi cab project that we
had been working on at the Council's direction. What the purpose of that was we had
had some inquiries about taxi cab licensing in the city and we were discussing whether
or not that would be something we wished to do. We had an internal committee that
discussed the licensing of taxi cabs and we ended up, basically, with three issues on
the table, besides just the overall issue of do we wish to do that. The purpose initially
from the Council was to address an issue that we had become aware of in other cities
where taxi cabs or other types of dispatch services were being operated in a
neighborhood environment or a residential environment and we were concerned about
the impact on neighborhoods by not regulating or clarifying in our zoning codes what is
allowed in a residential area. So, that piece has been taken care of. Our UDC has
been amended. Those types of operations are not allowed in residential zones, so that
portion of the concern I think has been addressed. The other is there was a concern
been raised as to whether or not regulation would be appropriate in regard to both
safety of passengers, as well as safety of the general public in regards to the vehicles
themselves. So, the internal committee looked at a variety of different issues and we
have a current setup in our clerk's office in licensing mobile vendors. This is like the ice
cream truck or other types of mobile vendors that travel from door to door or travel
about our streets in vehicles and whether that would be a method that we could use to
base this on and we looked at other cities, both Boise, as well as Nampa and Caldwell,
Kuna, and some other local jurisdictions and what the committee ended up coming up
with was a draft ordinance that would, basically, create a taxi cab license. It would be
separate from mobile vendors, but it's a similar scheme. But the things that --they
didn't have finally on and we are seeking direction was if we went this route there is a
couple things that we needed clarity on. One was inspections of vehicles. We don't
currently have a method in which to inspect vehicles, so we don't have a means in the
city to do that. We would have to either contract for that service or authorize that type of
service and require that inspections be done on some schedule, whether it's once a
year, whether it's four times a year, depending on whatever the Council's preference is.
The other concerns were the backgrounds of the drivers. So, we would have to have a
background check done on every driver to get a city license and, then, lastly, was the
rate. The committee's recommendation was simply that if we were going to do this that
the requirement would be that they post the rate, so that the -- the consumer would
know what rates were prior to accepting the ride. We didn't feel the necessity to
regulate the rates by meters and verifying meters or creating zones or creating flat rates
and things like that. Again, creating a lot more bureaucracy than what exits today. So,
we met with a couple of different company owners to discuss these potentials and got a
lot of feedback from both of them as to what would work or doesn't work for their
business model and the -- I guess the ultimate concern we have, too, and -- is currently
today the size of our city, this would be a significant impact to our Clerk's Office or any --
whether it's the police or the Clerk's Office that would regulate this activity, this would be
a significant addition. There is a number of cabs, both companies with a number of
drivers or independent cab drivers that may be required to acquire a license to operate.
Currently we don't regulate any of it. So, the -- a driver that may or may not be licensed
here or anywhere can operate a cab for hire in our city. We haven't had a number of
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
Page 49 of 52
complaints of that type. We haven't had any issues from police or the clerks receiving
complaints of this type. My guess is is that if we were to regulate this activity we would,
then, become the repository of these concerns or complaints from the general public or
other companies and so we'd have to address that, too. So, we are looking at the
potential of an impact to our staff and being able to administer this type of program and
so I think the direction you -- we had at the last meeting was to contact Valley Regional
Transit, because one of the problems in trying to address these types of issues is that
the logical way that this is addressed in other places that Idaho doesn't have a set up for
is it's managed by an authority, an authority that has a broader scope of authority than
just a city or even at the county level. Idaho doesn't grant counties the authority to
regulate this type of activity within the confines of the city, so that's not an avenue
without a legislative change. The only authority that has transportation power is Valley
Regional Transit. And so I contacted the director of Valley Regional Transit and asked
them if they had considered or would consider taking on this responsibility and what she
indicated to me was they had evaluated taxi cab service and they had done that,
basically, as an enhancement to existing service and her belief is that, essentially, with
a transit system that taxi cabs can be a good enhancement to that, because you're
going to have either fixed routes or a semi-fixed route for these transits, whether it's rail
or buses or whatever and, then, taxi cabs fill the void to get people from the fixed
system there to their destinations, because you're not going to necessarily have transit
that's going to be curb to curb or door to door for everyone. As all of you know from
working with Valley Regional Transit, they don't have that yet. So, for them to, then,
take on this -- because they recognize the same issue, that in the state of Idaho we
don't have any regional or transportation or, essentially, sub government authority to
create these types of oversight, it's, then, left again to the cities and it didn't make sense
she said for Valley Regional Transit, one, without a transit system in place to, then, take
on the additional responsibility of regulating this type of activity and, then, secondarily,
without a change in the structure of the state code it didn't make a lot of sense to try to
regulate it from Valley Regional when every individual city could adopt their own
requirements and so now they are at odds with different cities trying to regulate an
activity. So, it -- basically at this point her direction to me was not at this time --made
much sense for Valley Regional. Certainly at their board level they could have this
discussion and to see whether or not there is a window of opportunity or time where this
would make sense, but right now it just isn't really on their radar screen. There is a lot
of other higher priorities of their regional transit that they are trying to address and this is
just not one of them. And so I didn't contact the city of Boise subsequently, because
didn't feel that if -- certainly if Valley Regional didn't want to take this on, the city of
Boise doesn't have any reason to change the way their system works, because it
appears to be working adequately for them. So, I think we are kind of -- now with the --
a decision point of how much more do you want us to -- to go further with this project. I
mean we have a bare bones of an ordinance for you to look at. Again, we have some --
some gaps that we want some direction on, if that's the direction you'd like us to go. I
don't know if Deputy Chief Basterrechea has any additional information from police. We
have had police as part of our -- our task force, as well as the clerk's office and if I have
missed anything or haven't summarized it adequately, certainly they can -- they can
participate, but I think we have taken this as far internally as we think we can and
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
Page 50 of 52
without, again, additional direction and desire of the Council that that's where you would
like to go, so --
De Weerd: Thank you. Council, any questions? Comments?
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Just to express a personal opinion, I'm satisfied that the changes that we
made to Unified Development Code cover the major issues that I was concerned about.
From having experienced taxi authorities in a lot of other cities that I have worked in,
they really do need to be more regional than just a one city kind of thing and I think
some day it's going to be appropriate for the Treasure Valley, but I don't see Meridian
needing to lead -- well, okay, Boise has led it for themselves. I don't see Meridian
needing to do it for ourselves. So, I -- my personal opinion would be to thank the
committee for all the work they have put into it and to say stop, we are satisfied with the
changes to the UDC.
Rountree: Is that a motion?
Zaremba: If there is other opinions I'd make that into a motion.
Hoaglun: Madam Mayor, Ijust -- I just had one question, Bill, and how does the city of
Boise do inspections? Do they contract that out or -- I was just kind of curious.
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, Council Member Hoaglun, what they do
is they require one inspection a year be done by their mechanics. They have their own
mechanic shop that maintains their vehicles and so one a year is required by them and
the other -- I believe it's three additional ones a year, so quarterly they have to do it.
The other ones are provided by the vendors that they, basically, authorize to do that
inspectors for them.
Hoaglun: Thank you.
Bird: Is that -- Madam Mayor? If that's a motion I second it.
Zaremba: If that's satisfactory as a motion that we thank the committee and say go no
further, that would be the motion.
Bird: I second.
De Weerd: Okay. Well, any comments?
Rountree: I have none.
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
Page 51 of 52
De Weerd: Okay. I think this is a voice vote or --all those in favor say aye. All ayes.
Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 7: Future Meeting Topics
De Weerd: Okay. Any items for future meeting topics?
Zaremba: Madam Mayor, not really a discussion, but I like to know ahead of time if we
are going to have Executive Sessions and I would suggest that we probably will have a
pre-Council Executive Session next week.
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, that pre-Council may be fairly lengthy,
so potentially it will be at 5:30, not at 6:00. I know another reason -- I know you like to
have some advance notice of that, so --
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: If it's going to be lengthy I'd just as soon start at 5:00, if Brad can make it at 5:00.
Hoaglun: Yeah. I --
Bird: I mean we got a -- he 's got a real job that we need to worry about.
Hoaglun: Yeah. Madam Mayor -- thank you, Councilman Bird, but, yes, if we need to
start at 5:00 I'm able to do that.
Bird: I'd sooner instead of pushing us up to the --
De Weerd: Okay. Anything further? I would entertain a motion to adjourn.
Rountree: So moved.
Bird: Second.
De Weerd: All those in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Meridian City Council Workshop
September 13, 2011
Page 52 of 52
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