HomeMy WebLinkAbout2003 07-18 BudgetMeridian City Council Special Budget Workshop July 18, 2003
The Special Budget Workshop of the Meridian City Council was called to order at
8:03 A.M. on Friday, July 18, 2003, by Council President Tammy de Weerd.
Members Present: Cherie McCandless, Tammy de Weerd, Keith Bird, and Bill
Nary.
Members Absent: Mayor Robert D. Corrie.
Others Present: Stacy Kilchenmann, Reta Cunningham, Gary Smith, Pauline
Skeggs, and Will Berg.
Item 1. Roll-call Attendance:
X Tammy de Weerd X Bill Nary
X Cherie McCandless X Keith Bird
O Mayor Robert Corrie
De Weerd: I will to order this Special Budget Workshop Meeting to order. It’s
Friday, July 18th
at 8:03. I’ll ask the City Clerk to call roll. Mayor Corrie will soon
arrive.
Item 2. Adoption of the Agenda:
De Weerd: Okay I would accept a motion to adopt the agenda.
Bird: So moved as printed.
Nary: Second.
De Weerd: Okay it’s been moved and seconded to adopt the agenda as printed.
All those in favor say aye. All ayes motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES
Item 3. Presentation and Discussion of the City Proposed Budget:
HUMAN RESOURCES
De Weerd: The first item we have is –
Skeggs: Compensation.
Bird: Compensation.
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De Weerd: Must be out of order. We’re doing compensation first?
Skeggs: That’s what I was told. Is that correct Stacy?
Bird: No.
Kilchenmann: Yes because I did the revenue yesterday.
De Weerd: Okay works for us.
Skeggs: Well Council Members, Mayor is not here. I am aware the financial
situation that the city is facing and I have heard from some of the Council
Members that you are considering no or small increase for compensation this
year. What I had proposed that’s in your manual to account in the beginning of
May, may no longer be applicable. It was to give a five percent pool of money
towards merit increases that would give an average employee three percent.
The five percent pool would also help to bring our pay for performance back in
line with the matrix that was set up when we had implemented the program. For
the past two years, a pool of three percent had been given and therefore some of
our employees are running behind our program. An employee needs to receive
an average of three percent to stay in line with our compensation program. The
increases are based on midpoint of the salary range. Receiving a three percent,
increase would give an average employee in the salary range an opportunity to
just stay in line with our program. It takes five years for an employee to reach
the midpoint of the salary range and then six years to reach the maximum of a
range. Therefore, it should take a total of 11 years for an employee to reach the
end of the range and the employees with excels or outstanding performance
should actually be running further beyond what our program has. The proposal
for a five percent pool of money was to give a marginal employee nothing and an
employee at satisfactory level a three percent competent would be four, excels
would be five and outstanding would be six. For an example, the employees
who were rated satisfactory last year only received a one percent increase.
Therefore, they would be running behind our program since it takes a three
percent to stay in line with the program. This year if they were to receive a
satisfactory, they would get a three percent increase, which just keeps them
barely in line with our program. Last year an employee who either excelled or
had outstanding performance were the ones that stood in line with the program
where if an employee just had satisfactory they fell below what we had set up
when we initially implemented our program. Since I haven’t been given clear
direction on what the Council has considered for merit increase and knowing that
there is a significant increase to our health insurance premiums this year I would
recommend if you choose not to go with either a five percent, four percent or
three percent pool of money if compensation is given that is less than three
percent that you would consider doing it across the board for all those non-union
employees and the pay for performance program and the Police STEP Program.
Then no further compensation would be given for the remainder of the year. If
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money is put into the pool that is less than three, percent it may be a hardship for
those employees who are earning a lower salary. If they were to get satisfactory,
they wouldn’t get any increase at all and then we’re going to ask them to pay
more for their benefits. They would actually be bringing home less in their
paycheck then they are bringing home now. The Benefits Committee got
together last week and we did do a survey. We had asked employees what was
more important benefits or pay and the majority 57 employees basically chose
both. They said pay and benefits were equally important however pay was more
important than benefits to some employees it ran 42 to 33. I understand that
accounting had given you a merit scenario worksheet that went from one percent
to five percent to show you what the cost would be. Therefore, I am confident
that you will do what you feel what is best for the city. I would also ask I think
there is only one Department Head here to give you any feedback or any
recommendations on consideration to the merit program that Gary feels
passionate about because there are no other Department Heads here. Gary do
you want to add anything.
Nary: Will is here and Stacy is here.
Skeggs: And Will that’s right.
Kilchenmann: I was just going to say that she was originally scheduled for 8:30
so they may show up later. We could discuss – then the Mayor had also
mentioned doing like a three percent merit pool so I don’t know if he’s going to
be here soon. Then maybe he could discuss that.
Nary: Madam President.
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Pauline, I guess one thing I’m curious about in all the material I’ve read
and what you’ve said is, is the program that we’ve had in place you know took
nothing into consideration this cost of living raise has it went on top of –
Skeggs: No because the cost of living basically shifts the salary ranges. It’s just
keeping employees in line with the inflation. If we gave a cost of living of two
percent then the range has shifted two percent. When the employees got the
cost of living, they went back into the same place that they were in the range
before. It didn’t go towards any merit. It just kept our program moving forward.
Nary: And what are the particular dollars that increases cost to the employees
on the benefits side then.
Skeggs: Well they’re going with Option 2 on the benefits side that the committee
– well we actually went and took a survey and we just asked employees what
option do you want Option 1 or Option 2. Option 1 was basically to increase the
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deductible from 250 individual and 500 family to 500 individual and 1,000 family
and have the dual option program of the traditional or the PPO. That increase I
think from accounting was going to be like a 23 percent because it would reduce
it from 34 percent that’s what Blue Cross is asking. Option 2 was basically leave
the deductible the same at 250 and 500 family and to ask those employees in
the traditional plan that if they wanted to keep the traditional that we were only go
to pay for the PPO portion of it so they would have to pay the difference for the
traditional plan. However, in determining that that would save I think that was
like 20 it would reduce it down to like 21 percent. The committee found out that if
we don’t have 20 percent of the employees choose the traditional plan then Blue
Cross wouldn’t allow us to offer it. We would have to go totally PPO. We don’t
know those employees – there was only 28 employees that said they wanted
Option 1 which was the higher deductible and than the Traditional PPO. Since
we were changing and having the employees pay the traditional portion on
Option 2, 119 employees voted for Option 2. We’re not sure from those 119
employees how many employees would stay on the Traditional Plan. With the
number of employees on our plan right now we would need 36 employees to
stay on the Traditional Plan. Even those employees that were single where we
were paying the total amount on Option 2 if they wanted to stay on the
Traditional Plan they would have to pay $55 a month which right now the
employees on family are paying $56. I know like for an employee and spouse it
was $178 a month difference. For employee and family it was $226.
Nary: To stay on the traditional.
Skeggs: To stay on the traditional. If they went on the PPO then it was lower. I
think for – well it would be zero for an employee only. For employee and spouse
it would be I think it was $81 and for employee and family – do you remember
Gary? It was like 90 something and that was it. We’re not sure how the
employees will enroll but it may be that we’re going to end up going to a PPO
Plan only.
Nary: And on the options, if we don’t provide an option and they only move
everybody to the PPO Plan is there any conflict?
Skeggs: No, we asked Blue Cross and they said no. That was our first question
we asked Blue Cross. We were hoping for that.
McCandless: Madam President.
De Weerd: Mrs. McCandless.
McCandless: Pauline I guess I don’t understand. If a person had to go on PPO
if they use someone that was not on the preferred list, would they not get any
insurance at all?
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Skeggs: No they would they would just have to pay. Blue Cross would only pay
what’s reasonable and customary for that procedure.
McCandless: I see.
Skeggs: Then either they could go back to that doctor and ask them to write off
the difference or actually, the doctor can back bill them for the difference for that.
In actuality in Option 2, employees would be encouraged to utilize the PPO
doctors if they wanted that benefit. There are 85 percent of the PPO doctors in
Treasure Valley now participating. There were only like 60 percent two years
ago. It’s now been around in Idaho for a while so doctors are now getting
familiar with it. I know I tell employees if their doctor is not on the PPO Plan to
ask their doctor if they would be interested in enrolling and then all they have to
do is call Blue Cross to get on the program.
McCandless: Okay thanks.
Skeggs: Since the Mayor is not here I would actually like to review the Police
STEP Program also. Every year and on an ongoing basis I review and look at
positions within the city to see if they’re competitive to the market and also
internal equity. This year the Police Department, the STEP Program was
reviewed by the assistance of an outside consultant. For the most part, we felt
that the program was in line and that we were paying the individuals in line with
other agencies. However, with the exception of Seargents and Lieutenants
these two positions were lagging the market. Seargents were lagging at the
entry level of 16 percent and at the end of the STEP Program by six percent
Lieutenants were lagging 9.64 at the entry then at the end they came out okay.
They were only 1.75 percent. When we implemented the program back in 2000,
we had condensed the ranges for Seargent and Lieutenants to five percent
instead of the 10 percent difference from the other classifications police officers
and detectives. It was to save the city money and at that time, it didn’t have an
impact on any of those employees in that classification because they were above
the entry of the range. However, when Chief Worley reorganized the department
last year it would impact eight employees who are in the Seargent Lieutenants
positions. It’s six Seargent it would impact and two Lieutenants. By adjusting
the ranges to five percent, it would bring those ranges in line with other agencies.
The cost to do that for the city would be $11,796.20, which I had stated, would
impact eight employees. Chief Worley was given this information and he had
agreed that the program needed to be adjusted to make his department
competitive with other agencies. Since he’s not here right now if he wanted to
comment on that. I would ask Council Member Nary if Chief had discussed this
with you you being his liaison. I had sent you that packet too. That would be the
only impact to the Police STEP Program to bring them back and in line to be an
adjustment of that $11,000.
De Weerd: Council is there any questions?
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Bird: Madam President.
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: This STEP thing is something that we had set up, in fact, we were going to
try to set it up throughout the whole city, and hopefully we will. I hate to see us
fall behind that drastic. I realize this but we didn’t bring on the economy and if
you look out in the private world there is not a lot of raises being given out there
the five percent, three percent and all of this stuff. This is something we have to
wrangle with and stuff. I hate to see us fall behind when we get these STEP
programs going because they are the easy way to stay up and keep our pay and
stuff up where it should be. Hopefully we can figure out somehow to fund these
STEP programs and get them going. We’re just going to have to tighten our
belts and see what we can. I’m like Mr. Nary and I were talking earlier there are
a lot of things in these budgets that are I think so blown out of proportion. They
throw in $12,000 and for five years haven’t used a penny of it in the budgets and
stuff on some of these areas. Hopefully we can get some of this switched across
and get to the wages. I don’t want to lose this STEP Program that we have got
going and I don’t want to get way behind because once you get way behind then
you’re always catching up. This is something I think we need to implement
throughout the city, which Pauline was working on and is working on continually.
Skeggs: Yes the cost for that right now for this year though because you have to
give the equity adjustment and bring employees in line it would cost the city far
more. I know with the financial consideration it wouldn’t be applicable for this
year.
(Mayor returned at 8:17 A.M.)
Bird: No.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I understand that consideration Pauline but it’s hard to consider just
one class of employees to bring them in line and not all the other employees.
Skeggs: That’s why I had recommended because the only bargaining union is
the Fire Department so if you were going to consider less than a three percent
increase that you would give it across the board. Even into the Police STEP
Program where they would get like if you considered a two percent increase then
it would just be across the board for all those employees and then no further
increase for the remainder of the budget year. Whether they were on the STEP
Program or on the Pay for Performance Program as well because those
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employees on the Pay for Performance Program have been running behind the
program for the past two years where the STEP Program have been in line with
our program.
De Weerd: Now with the STEP Program they’re getting an increase anyway
aren’t they?
Skeggs: Well I think that the money was put into the budget is that correct?
Again, they’re non-union bargaining employees so that would be a consideration
for Council to take into when you make your decision on whether you wanted to
keep that in there or to utilize that money towards an increase for all employees.
De Weerd: What would be the difference there Reta?
Cunningham: It’s like $45,000. You mean in the STEP increases?
De Weerd: Yes. If instead of the STEP increases that they got what all the other
employees got.
Cunningham: If they were just to get like a two percent flat?
De Weerd: Yes.
Cunningham: I actually have in the merit because if you look at these merit
increases like the one percent, two, three, four, and five that already includes the
Police STEP increases. There STEP increases were $37,000 just in wages and
you had the taxes and benefits. If we just put the flat two percent and then I took
out the STEP increases for the police then we would pay $76,000 for general
fund. If we give a three percent we pay, $135,000 and that took out the STEP.
Do you guys want to see the – so the STEP Plan is actually $46,000 is what we
have in the budget for their STEP Plan. That gave increases only to those – we
have some that are already over the STEP Plan so we didn’t give them the
increases we were only looking at those employees that were do the next – their
increase. Does that make any sense? You can see this officer here he’s already
paid over the STEP Plan so I put in for a zero STEP increase. The same down
here. All of them that I’ve highlighted this employee is over the plan so no
increase.
Skeggs: They would be over the plan if they had exceeded seven years of
employment with the city. The STEP Program goes to seven years.
De Weerd: So Reta is that the cost difference then the numbers you’re giving us
or that would be then less what the STEP –
Cunningham: The cost difference if you mean if we don’t give the STEP
increases?
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De Weerd: Yes.
Cunningham: Yes it’s $46,000.
De Weerd: And the across the board is what?
Cunningham: It depends on what percent you’re going to give.
De Weerd: Okay let’s just say it flat.
Nary: 76 for two and 135 for three.
De Weerd: Okay. Then you would minus out the $46,000.
Cunningham: I already did.
Nary: That’s already done.
Bird: That’s already taken out.
De Weerd: Okay.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: With that flat two or three percent would that cover the increase from the
cost of the medical coverage?
Skeggs: It probably would come close of where it would even it out.
Cunningham: Except for Option 2 if they stay traditional.
Skeggs: Right if they stay traditional no they would have to pay the difference. It
would probably flatten it out if they went to the PPO Plan, which I think most
employees would because that’s what it’s encouraging them to do. Some of the
employees said well you’re forcing us and I said well we’re strongly encouraging
that.
Nary: Life doesn’t always have choices.
Skeggs: That’s true.
De Weerd: But that is a choice.
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Skeggs: Yes, if they want the traditional they pay the difference.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: So in Option 2 you’re calling it as a benefit cut. A cut in benefits but
they’re still getting the same the $250 deductible and $500 so it’s not really a cut
it’s a choice. Either if they want to keep the traditional then they have to pay
more but if they don’t they’re not really getting a cut in benefits.
Skeggs: The only reason it would be a cut is if you didn’t give any increases at
all and then they had to pay more for their benefits. They would actually be
bringing home less in their paycheck then they are today if there was no
consideration for increase and their benefits went up. The PPO is also going up
slightly too so they would be paying more for the PPO then they were paying for
the traditional right now I think it’s going up from the traditional is $56 and it’s
going up to like 90 something for a family. Where employee and spouse would
have been $40 no $36 and it’s going up to like $81.
De Weerd: But we’re covering the employee.
Skeggs: Right.
De Weerd: That’s a huge increase. What is it in the PPO?
Skeggs: The PPO Plan?
De Weerd: Yes.
Skeggs: That’s what it is in the PPO Plan. It would go up.
De Weerd: Oh, it would go up 50 to 90?
Skeggs: Yes that’s if they chose the traditional. When we did the options as to
paying, reducing it – I guess Janice brought in some calculations that she just
plugged in. I think it went from like employee and spouse from 36 to 58 so it
reduced it down.
De Weerd: For the PPO.
Skeggs: Yes but what we had done is that we’re looking at combing our short-
term disability, long-term disability, and life, which is going to save the city some
money on a monthly basis. If we use those dollars to cover the increase then it
would reduce it from the $80 like employee and spouse to like $58. Really, they
would only be paying $18 more a month by doing it that way. We would use
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those monies and transfer it over so instead of being an 80 percent that the city
pays and 20 percent it would be like an 83 percent that the city paid towards their
benefits. We would pay a little more.
Corrie: And that’s keeping the same amount of money in that pool of money?
Skeggs: Right. The Mayor was going to discuss the benefits portion with you
guys.
Corrie: We definitely don’t want to give them less but also you want to make
sure that we don’t give them less in their paycheck too. That’s going to be a
double-whammy. They’re going to really look at that. I think if we do what
Pauline is suggesting it would take care of that. We can still give them a choice
and I think the majority of them will take the PPO. There’s about 95 percent or
90 percent of the physicians are on that. You maybe have some specialties like
your anesthesiologist, neurologists some of those that aren’t on it. I looked at it
and there’s not that many physicians that are not on there.
Skeggs: Right, yes.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: But if we give it across the board like you’re suggesting to then absorb the
cost – it would essentially absorb the cost of the increase on the PPO Plan. The
employees who don’t have families or spouses actually get an increase right?
Skeggs: Yes.
Nary: So if we wanted to just absorb the cost of the medical for everyone rather
than in across the board there wouldn’t necessarily be any increase for
employees that don’t have spouses or families to include that everybody would
still get the same paycheck.
Skeggs: Right. Like if you opted to not allow the employees to pay more than
they’re paying now and you use those monies towards the benefits then say that
there won’t be a merit increase but you’re absorbing the cost for the benefits yes.
Nary: Yes.
Kilchenmann: As an employee with nobody else on the insurance I don’t find
that fair. That’s like I don’t know.
Cunningham: A family employee gets more benefit than a single employee as
far as dollars.
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Kilchenmann: Because I could put my spouse on and then I would increase the
cost to the city but really he doesn’t need it because he carries his own
insurance. I have made that choice to save the city money.
Nary: But I guess it just depends on the opposite though is if we just gave it
across the board this person who sits next to you who has a spouse really gets
no increase and you do just because you just don’t happen to have a spouse or
a family. I don’t know that that’s fair either. I mean it just depends on which side
of the coin you’re sitting on right?
Skeggs: It’s a tough decision that you guys’ have to make. I’m glad I’m not on
the other end. It was really difficult for the Benefits Committee because initially
when we did the survey we got – we didn’t get a high percentage of employees
that responded back to the survey. We went back out, solicited them one on
one, and asked them to sign off on whether they wanted Option 1, Option 2, or if
they had no opinion at all. We had them sign the form and had their name on it
and that’s when we got back 119 responded for Option 2 and 28 for Option 1.
The committee was having a rough time making that decision because if we
made the decision then the employees would complain and now we can say well
we went with Option 2 because it was the majority of the employees had voted
for this option.
Kilchenmann: Pauline can you talk about what some of the other cities are
doing?
Skeggs: As far as the increases. Well some of the other cities that I had given
you in a list when we had gathered survey information increases were ranging
anywhere from 1.5 percent to 5 percent. Those were just proposals none of
those had been approved. I think right now the City of Boise I think they – Bill
did they go with the 2.5 but that was just to absorb the benefit cost? That was
my understanding.
Nary: Yes.
De Weerd: So they didn’t see any increase in the wages but they didn’t get any
decrease because they’re maintaining the benefits.
Skeggs: Yes.
Nary: Right and for Boise we still have to pay our co-pay. We still have to pay
our portion it was just to not offset the increase. I think what we were talking
about was absorbing the entire increase right so it’s a little bit different.
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Skeggs: Well I know Nampa has a STEP Program that they had implemented
and so they are giving a two percent just to keep them in line with the STEP
Program so they don’t go behind and that’s it.
Bird: Yes I think Nampa got theirs implemented throughout the city didn’t they?
Skeggs: Right.
Bird: All but of course they’re like we are they have the union at the Fire
Department.
De Weerd: But did they get a decrease in benefits then?
Skeggs: No.
De Weerd: They were able to absorb the cost.
Skeggs: See because with benefits it depends on your experience. They may
have had good experience in Nampa where the city we have had bad experience
for the last three years. Their rate increase for health insurance could have been
15 percent where ours was 34. It depends on what their increase and what there
experience has been running for the benefits would determine what their rate
increase for health insurance would be. They had chose because they just
implemented the STEP Program to give those equity adjustments and therefore
the two percent which is covered to keep in line with their program because
some employees got equity adjustments to bring them in line with their program.
De Weerd: It’s kind of an oxymoron isn’t it when you look at your ratings and
you’re trying to encourage your employees to stay healthy and go to the doctor
then –
Bird: I helped you out this year.
De Weerd: Thank you Keith.
Corrie: (Inaudible) we didn’t want to but we did.
Bird: We did.
Skeggs: And I know ACHD at the beginning of April they just gave a flat two
percent. Ada County they are proposing a two to four percent but nothing had
been approved for that.
De Weerd: Still not?
Skeggs: Not that I’m aware of.
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De Weerd: Does anyone else want to –
Corrie: Gary oh there you are.
Smith: Good morning. I just wanted to make a comment concerning our present
pay matrix structure. I really feel a lot as though that is a I guess you could say a
modified STEP Program because it does outline over a period of 11 years salary
range increases. As Pauline mentioned those are based on, a three percent
change each year. If you have under the present structure if you have a
competent employee as far as an evaluation is concerned in our rating system, a
competent employee is a 90 to 95 percent accurate type of employee if you want
to put it in terms of a grade. That means that person is a good employee. That
type of rating garners them two percent increase so you fall behind without any
other form of or means of increasing compensation that employee falls behind.
We’ve got several employees in the Engineering Division I haven’t checked the
rest in Water and Wastewater but there are several in the Engineering Division
that have fallen behind that present matrix at this point. The change to PPO as
Pauline mentioned is an employee decision. They made their vote and decided
in that manner. I think it’s going to in effect it’s going to decrease the benefits to
some degree because there are as Mayor mentioned there are some doctors
that are not subscribers to the PPO particularly the specialists, anesthesiologists,
neurosurgeons I’m not sure who else but a lot of specialists are not. That means
that the bill that the employee picks up is going to be increased from what it is
now at the present coverage. I think they understand that. We tried really hard
to explain the differences between the PPO and traditional so everybody really
understood that. As Pauline mentioned, that decision in the Benefits Committee
was very, very difficult. I understand where you are because that’s the buck
stops here you might say. I just really feel as though – I understand that all the
departments are paid differently. Their salary structure is based on what they do.
I don’t have an issue with that at all. My concern is just that the employees
receive equal consideration in increase and compensation. I guess that’s my two
cents.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Gary, I think that you’ve got some unique rolls too because a lot of these
jobs that we have within the city there is no outside jobs that compare to them.
With engineers, planners and all that stuff that comes down here they’re in
demand out there let’s face the facts. They’re in very high demand out there
engineers are, civil engineers, and that kind of stuff.
Smith: Our technicians also.
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Bird: I think we need to – and I love the STEP Program don’t get me wrong I
love the STEP Program but I think there’s instances that we need to take a look
at with engineers, planners and stuff like that. I mean you just don’t go over the
board with them because they do have some outside jobs that you can compare
it to where an operator for a well or something like that I mean there’s very few
private jobs out there for that. Most of that is municipalities or United Water.
Stuff like that I think we have to take that into consideration too. I think you’ve
got a very unique situation over in your department because of your engineers
and the same as Anna has with the planners. They do have some outside
sources to go work for where a lot of the people don’t.
Smith: Thank you Keith. We really had a problem hiring an Engineering
Technician. We started in January and we finally hired him. In order to get him
to come to work we had to pay him close to mid-range of an Engineering Tech 1
position. That’s what we’re competing with.
Bird: That’s right.
Smith: And it’s fortunate or unfortunate it depends on how you look at it. I think
we’re getting a good employee but nevertheless there’s a cost to it. I think one
of the other reasons that he did come to work for us is because of our benefit
structure. He’s coming from a small firm, which I don’t know what their benefit
structure was like but I’m sure that what we offer was attractive to him.
Bird: I think Boise probably finds this with your attorneys Bill. You’ve got outside
sources there too that – and I think there are certain areas in the city that we
need to really work hard at. Like the engineers and the planners and stuff that
have outside sources that’s hard to hire. I know Gary has a hard time getting
qualified engineers.
Smith: Thank you. I appreciate the opportunity to address you this morning. I
really do as I said yesterday I understand the difficulty in this decision and it is a
tough one. Thank you.
Corrie: Thank you Gary.
Powell: Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council I just wanted to add a couple of
quick additions that that. Following up with Council Member Bird’s comment
that’s why we lost Dave. They didn’t even have to woo him with too much more
salary to – when you looked at the benefits versus salary it wasn’t even that
great of an increase but we did lose him for strictly monetary reasons there was
no other reason he left. Mainly what I wanted to say was on that survey when it
came around regarding the benefits everybody made that decision whether or
not they wanted traditional or PPO but – and they looked at their own situation
but I think they also were considering the city. They recognize that the PPO Plan
was cheaper for the city and they were willing to say yes we’ll go that way. On
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the next column over where it said where it said what’s more important pay or
benefits well a lot of them put both but a lot of them said we’re thinking okay if
I’m going to make this decision to go with the decision hen we would like to say
our pay at least increase a little bit. That’s all I wanted to say.
Corrie: I think as long as we’re as fair as we can be and we’re not going to be
fair in everybody’s eyes. I agree with Keith there that you’ve got specialists that
have to be paid – take an attorney for instance if they’re on staff they should
probably make more there’s no question about it than one at assistant level
starting at a low level. We have to think that consideration and we have to be fair
about it. I think this Council is trying to be fair within the confounds that we have
in our money. I do agree with you and the employees. They would like to have
both but when it comes down to where the rubber meets the road, they are
understanding. I just want us to be fair that’s all I really need. Thank you Anna.
Powell: I think that’s all they’re looking for also.
Corrie: Yes I think so. Stacy.
Kilchenmann: Mayor and Members of Council I have to put in my two bits as a
Department Head not as a Finance Director. I think as far as an insurance I think
it’s kind of a waive of reality that employees are going to have to bare more cost.
It’s just a nationwide crisis so to speak. I think going to the PPO plan is just
happening company after company you know government agency after
government agency. I think that even if we go to the total PPO Plan I think our
benefits are very competitive. Just if you look at the market in Treasure Valley
but I would hate to lose the merit program. I guess one thing about our merit
program is it’s applied to the midpoint of an employees range. I feel like it
benefits good long-term employees like Reta who is above her midpoint because
it’s not like two percent of her salary it’s just two percent of the midpoint. I hate
to lose the idea of a merit type program because I think that you know you say
don’t tie merit to performance but I think it does give people a little motivation to
kind of try to step a little bit beyond where they normally would. That’s just my
two cents.
Corrie: I feel that you should apply merit to performance I really do. If you have
somebody that’s doing their job and that’s it I’m sorry I don’t feel they should be
getting as much as somebody that’s going beyond the call of duty all the time
and really putting out there and think they should be paid for it. That’s the old
pop method that I grew up with pay on performance. If you didn’t perform you
didn’t get paid. Maybe that was a little different than here but whenever you’re
on a commission you perform or you don’t get paid. Those others that did
perform and did what they were supposed to do and did more then they got paid
more. Comments.
Bird: I agree wholeheartedly with you.
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Corrie: Any other discussion that we need here? I tell you I live with somebody
that’s on the other end of the insurance business. She’s seeing a lot of private
companies really backing down on insurance and going to PPO’s or cutting a lot
of it out. I don’t know anything about it. We don’t talk that much but still – I mean
about insurance. She’s noticing that the insurance – some of the private
insurance going up 45, 50 percent, and the employers just said we can’t do it.
It’s tough out there and it’s going to get tougher.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I agree wholeheartedly. Three or four companies that I’ve – private
companies that I know they were having to cut back. Our company is two years
ago the first time we had to cut back and put more on the employee. The
employee had to pick up more of the benefits pay. We went to the PPO, which I
don’t agree with. As a doctor I don’t think I want my insurance company what my
rate is because I don’t – if I’m going to be a doctor I’ll go tell you what you can
charge for your insurance. I don’t agree with it but I think it’s the coming thing
that we have to do. Any insurance I’ll guarantee you any insurance is very, very
nice people. I have learned in the last six months what insurance means to me.
It would have taken – if I hadn’t of have good insurance it would have taken wale
of a whop out of my retirement fund I’ll guarantee you that. It’s something that
we can’t let go and we need to get what’s best we feel and it’s for the employees.
Evidently, the employees have spoken and I’m for going down with that and
helping them on that part. I’m also for seeing if we can’t give them a raise.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I think we need to look long-term too. Maybe some of our ratings our
employees are not as well aware of wellness programs. We need to get a little
bit more proactive on the other side of it so we can start not only helping our
workforce but the long-term implications of some of the catastrophic claims that
we have. As we look down the road Pauline, I would hope that we start
implementing and looking at wellness programs and preventative care. I think
health wise comes out with a handbook that employees can benefit from. It’s
just how we get over this hump in trying to turn around even our cities ratings.
As Keith had mentioned and I agree, it’s hard to say that we’re going to only set
aside employees that are competitive out there to the private sector as well. It is
a reality but I think we need to look at it more in terms of competitive salaries and
going out. I know Council has mentioned maybe revisiting this in January. Doing
something that we can looks like we can afford to do now. Maybe it will be
minimal but in January to revisit it and look at how we can get some equity
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adjustments and some of the professional classifications so that we’re
competitive to the private industry so we don’t continue to. I think it’s the wrong
message right now to send to all of our city employees that these employees will
get more of an increase but you’re not competitive out to the private industry so
we’re not going to give you what they are. I think that can be handled more in
terms of how we can be competitive in those professional level categories and do
that in January. Do something across the board. I appreciate what Gary said we
just want to be fair. We want everyone to get the same thing. I think that’s what
the Council wants at this time too. We want to be fair and we don’t want to
elevate any classification above another because that’s the wrong message to
be sending right now. There are the realities that have been already talked
about and we can do that in a competitive I’m losing the word. We can do that in
a survey and maybe revisit it in January so we can remain competitive. Those
certainly in the two areas – well I think all of our city employees are over
burdened with a good workload because we are lean, mean and –
Corrie: We’re lean anyway, we’re not mean.
De Weerd: Well we’re being mean today.
Bird: No you hit it right on the nose we’re lean and mean. We’ve had to be
thank goodness.
De Weerd: I do appreciate what our Department Heads have said. I think you’re
trying to be fair, trying to keep the best interest of your employees in mind and
that’s certainly, what we’ll work hard to do as well.
Corrie: I think our constituence want the best service possible. Our employees
are the ones who are going to –
***End Of Side One***
Corrie: -- that’s a very big asset to the city is our employees. We have to keep
them happy to some extents and I think we’re doing it as best we can. Just keep
those two things in mind that they seem like opposite ends but it takes the
employee to make the customer service right. No matter what the Department
Heads want, it’s the employees that do for us. They’re the wee bees. They will
be here after we’re gone so we must take care of them in consideration in which
(inaudible).
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: You know I guess the difficulty for me is that it appears to me in the way
our structure is set up for our salaries benefits the way we’ve handled in the past
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in regards to employee increases that we are trying to compete with the private
sector and we can’t. We will – if we don’t address it this year, we’ll address this
next year. The cost of medical benefits isn’t going to go down. It will always
increase. I don’t think I’ve seen any place that doesn’t have a double-digit
increase every year. I don’t think that’s ever going to change. I think we need to
look at our pay structure and how things are done. I think there are some values
to the STEP situation but I also I guess have a concern that you know the merit
side of the equation seems to get lost a little bit sometimes. I think merit pay is
important. I think it really does matter. I don’t think marginal employees should
feel bad that they didn’t get an increase because marginal employees at
Albertson’s don’t get one either. They sometimes get fired. I don’t necessarily
think – I don’t think we need to gear our pay structure, salaries or the like for the
marginal employee we should find the ways to reward the outstanding
employees. I think sometimes with the STEP Program we get a little locked in
our mindset of trying to make sure everybody gets at that three percent level
instead of saying that employee deserves six because they are outstanding
rather that employee deserves three because they showed up. What happens
sometimes I think in some of the departments from my discussions is that we do
a really good job on the front end and you get to your 11 year mark and you’ve
been outstanding now you don’t get an increase for the rest of your life. That
doesn’t help you to keep employees. You’ve got about a 10-year window and
then you’re really lucky if you’ve got an employee after 10 years here to continue
to perform at a high level. We’re missing something there. Something’s a miss.
The other thing that we don’t do people work for the government for lots of
reasons and pay isn’t always one of them. Sometimes it is the stability that
they’re looking for that the private sector doesn’t offer. Sometimes it is the
benefits that the private sector doesn’t offer. Sometimes it is the convenience
the ease. They live in this town the sense of public service that people have that
they want to do that. That they have a skill set that really fits the public sector
better than the private sector. Sometimes it’s the alternatives that we can come
up with that creates a better work environment and a work atmosphere that at
least in the last year and a half that I’ve been here we haven’t really focuses
much on. One of the things I’ve talked with Pauline about and talked to the
Council Members about is just the small piece but for certain people in this city a
great incentive would be flex time. If you had flextime for especially, support staff
that’s a tremendous incentive. I have four secretaries that work for my team and
they have flextime. They all work – they all have a three day weekend every
other week. That’s a tremendous value to stay if you can get a three-day
weekend every other week. They’ve – all of them have said they’ve had
opportunities to look elsewhere and they cannot find that in the private sector.
Unless you own the business that doesn’t happen. That’s the one positive thing
about flextime is it’s free. It doesn’t cost anything other than the logistics of
managing but other than that it doesn’t cost anything to do that. We have talked
periodically up here about other employee incentives. Whether it’s bonuses,
whether it’s – and bonuses I know is a bad word. Some type of employee
rewards that are sometimes very small monetarily but yet have tremendous
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incentive to creating a positive work environment. We don’t do that. We don’t
give an employee a gift card for doing a great job we just wait until their merit
time comes around or wait until their anniversary date comes around. Those
things can provide tremendous incentive and give people a reason to work here
beyond just paying benefits. I think if we just stick with that mindset of paying
benefits, only year after year we will price ourselves out of the market because
we can’t afford it. We just won’t be able to keep up if that’s their only way of
compensating employees. I think we have to tackle this question I guess but we
also need to look beyond that after we set this budget. Whether we revisit this
issue later that we’re going to have to find other ways to be creative in creating a
positive environment for our employees and get the culture and mindset away
from just paying benefits. We just won’t ever be able to keep up with that with
the way the current economy is. The way the governmental structure is the way
taxes are we’re just never going to compete in that level so we have to find other
reasons. I think if you surveyed your employees and asked them to be creative,
you may get lots of feedback as to what would matter to them. Why do they
work here? Why do they continue to work here? Is it just pay and benefits? I
would have guessed for many of them it’s not. They like the environment they
like the people they want to be compensated fairly but if you found other ways to
compensate them, they would still find this to be a pretty attractive place to be. I
think we need to look beyond the box that we’re in now so that we don’t wrestle
with this every year.
McCandless: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. McCandless.
McCandless: I totally agree with what Bill has just said. Looking back over my
own work year’s loyalty paid a big part of it. If you had good departments to work
in good Department Heads that worried about the department’s environment and
their employees your loyalty would keep you there no matter what. I think we
have a very good bunch of Department Heads. I think we have a good working
environment and I think it will keep people here if they understand what we’re
doing what we’re trying to do. I don’t think money is the most important thing. I
really don’t. Our benefits have always been really good and we’ve worked hard.
Pauline has worked hard to keep them at that and I think people understand that
we have to change from time to time because of outside influences. I think the
environment we work in is extremely important too. I think you’ve all done a
really good job.
Corrie: As long as we get on a philosophical kick here Mrs. McCandless, myself,
Keith when we were growing up the longevity of an employment was the thing to
strive for. Today it’s not. They move around considerably quicker five years I
think a lot of them are moving around. We’re in a different culture now. Then
also we have to think in the background the big brother is really thinking hard
about charging taxes on benefits. If they do that then we really have our hands
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full because they have an asaciable appetite for money and that’s where they’re
looking right now from what I’m gathering from Washington D.C. We have to
keep those in mind and I think Bill is right. We have to help our employees to
want to stay but the culture is a little different than our time.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: You’re 100 percent right. It kind of takes me back because for a guy that
worked for 42 years for the same company that had the same paycheck
signature on the paycheck I never realized what it’s like to be outside of one
company atmosphere. That’s just the way our culture was raised up was to do it.
Now kids I can name you 20 year old kids who has had more jobs in their little
work lifetime then I’ll ever have. I think it’s – I agree with Councilman Nary that
there are a lot of things that we need to look at and stuff. It’s something that
we’ve got to take care of and we need to take care of it. I don’t believe it’s
always benefits and I don’t believe it’s always wages that keep people working. I
know of a couple of a young attorneys that work for the AG’s office that went out
in private, found out that having to work more than 40 hours a week they didn’t
like. The benefits were a little better the wages were a little better but they didn’t
like having to work more than 40 hours a week. Now they’re both back at the
AG’s office. I think there’s just a lot of stuff to that kind of mentality too and
there’s nothing wrong with that definitely nothing wrong. You get out in the
private world and you’re going to work 60, 70 hours a week and probably not get
compensated for it too in most jobs. There are a lot of pros and cons to it but we
just need to be fair and make sure that we aren’t – my philosophy is that we have
to be fair to everybody. There’s just not one department in this city there’s not
two departments it’s everybody. Everybody is an employee and everybody is a
very important employee.
Corrie: With that being said (inaudible) go do.
De Weerd: I know I was going to say let’s roll up our sleeves.
Corrie: Now we’ll roll up our sleeves and go to work.
MDC
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Wasn’t Steve going to be here in a few minutes to talk –
Kilchenmann: He’s here.
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Nary: Oh okay. Maybe we can cover that (inaudible) basin, take a little break,
and then get to it.
Corrie: Go ahead Steve.
Siddoway: Good morning.
Corrie: Welcome.
Siddoway: Did you want to – did you have questions for me or did you want me
to address the budget to you?
Bird: Yes well the budget I guess.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Okay Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: Yes Steve if you can just give us an overview of what the MDC’s
budget is for next year. I think the question is is do we – since you’re paying
back the $60,000 do you really need it up front and how much do you really need
up front before the tax increment financing comes in.
Siddoway: A fair question. We had requested $60,000 and as I understand it,
there was some consternation over whether we should be funding the hiring of a
director, the office space and supplies for that person, and perhaps even the
grant writing services because we are discussing becoming a member of SAGE.
All fair points because I agree that the MDC would not want to enter into any
contract with a director until they have their own funds and a continuous funding
source in place. From that perspective, I would say yes those things could drop
out from the request. However, at the last meeting of the MDC when we
amended our budget we did add in a 15,000-dollar item for a vision study. We
do see a need up front and early to dovetail the market study that we’re currently
working on with a master plan vision study of the downtown. We would like to
fund that up front and early in the next fiscal year. Therefore, I would request
that we change the line items but keep the total request at $60,000 and that
$60,000 would be repaid within the same fiscal year.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: We have this amended one Steve. It’s got completing the market study is
25,000 the downtown vision study is $15,000. The traffic parking solution study
is another $15,000.
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Siddoway: Yes.
Nary: So that’s what you’re talking about right?
Siddoway: That is.
Nary: Then the other 5,000 would be for like legal costs and that kind of thing.
Siddoway: Certainly we will have up front legal costs. The market study will be
ongoing. The vision study needs to happen right away. The traffic and parking
solutions is a current ongoing issue. That $55,000 is needed early in the fiscal
year. We do have ongoing legal costs on a monthly basis so I think the $60,000
is right in line with what we will need to keep going at our rate that we want to
anyway for the start of the fiscal year.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Stacy what was published? Which budget was published in the paper?
Kilchenmann: The one that I gave you with the yellow bars on it.
Nary: Not this revised.
Bird: Not this revised so now we have to re-publish this.
Kilchenmann: No.
De Weerd: No.
Bird: You don’t.
Corrie: I don’t think you do.
Bird: What?
Corrie: I don’t think you do.
Bird: I thought you did.
Corrie: If it’s the one that they –
Nary: This one here is what he is talking from this one that has –
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Kilchenmann: Yes.
De Weerd: Yes that’s the detail to it. You also got another one.
Corrie: The yellow one.
Siddoway: This one is correct.
Kilchenmann: So it’s more –
Bird: It’s just general yes.
Nary: Just general I got it.
Bird: But we don’t have to re-publish.
De Weerd: It just doesn’t give the detail on the studies and that sort of thing.
Siddoway: Yes it lumps the studies together under professional services.
Bird: Because I know we’re short time. We’re (inaudible).
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: For the legal costs is that a monthly flat around or is that an hourly that Mr.
Armbruster gets?
Siddoway: It’s an hourly fee.
Nary: Okay and has MDC looked at other attorneys?
Siddoway: We interviewed two when they were selected. We interviewed White
Peterson and Elam and Burke. Elam and Burke was selected.
Nary: Thanks.
Corrie: Anything else?
Siddoway: Any other questions?
Corrie: Cover it up – no, I mean not cover it up. I’m really on a roll today.
Siddoway: Thank you.
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Corrie: Thank you Steve.
De Weerd: Thank you Steve.
Corrie: Time to get a hair cut early. Okay do you want to take a little break and
then –
De Weerd: I think so.
Corrie: I think I need a donut.
(Recess at 9:08 A.M.)
(Reconvened at 9:30 A.M.)
POLICE DEPARTMENT
Corrie: Well let’s get back to the primary reason we’re here for the next 30
minutes. Shall we just like you suggested go to –
Kilchenmann: Yes we have the Police Department up there and –
Corrie: This is the new right that they’re asking?
Kilchenmann: Yes there’s the two with the grants and we’ll add that back in on
the revenue side. We’ll show the total cost because we’ll need to appropriate the
total cost and then when we get back to the general funds somebody that has
everyone will add the grants into the revenue so it will net out.
Corrie: Okay.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council Members)
Kilchenmann: Are there any changes to what they’re requesting?
Corrie: (Inaudible).
Kilchenmann: Actually the cost for FY04 for the school –
Nary: Just a second we’re not on the record yet.
Corrie: Oh we need to get on the record. Are we on the record?
Berg: Yes we’ve been going.
Nary: I’m sorry I thought it was off.
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Berg: When you said that we’d get back to the business.
Corrie: Okay thank you.
Kilchenmann: So the cost of the School Resource Officer will actually net out to
be $17,305 and the Crime Prevention will be $5,900 for 04.
De Weerd: So it doesn’t say that.
Corrie: It says 64 why doesn’t it say 59.
Cunningham: Okay the actual expense will still be there in the budget so what
we have to do is increase the revenue for the grant money. If I go to the
summary, what we did at the bottom is we added in the project safe grant
increased revenue $127,000.
Corrie: Okay thank you. That’s right we have to make the two work.
Cunningham: So that’s what we did. Then I’m making the changes on the police
now. See, we just have the shortfall of 46. That does not include any merit
increases. We still have that at zero. Now do you guys want to move to fire?
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess before we do that I mean I think the Number 1 thing we need to do
I think the police have been very good at trying to find these alternatives. I think
we need to make sure we – I think we acknowledge that and I think we really
need to support that. The other issue is on some of these things that both
warrant on the merits priority list are the ones that are somewhat smaller
numbers. Have we taken out the reserve police officer request then?
Cunningham: Yes.
Bird: That’s what the wanted out.
Nary: Okay. I guess the only other discussion point I think that certainly the
Number 1 priority the three officers for the full year is an absolute need. I don’t
think there’s any real doubt about that. I don’t know whether or not the three
officers for the half year it certainly saves us the first year it won’t save us next
year and we’ll have six new bodies to be paying another full year on. I don’t
know whether or not we want to have a discussion about that if everyone’s
comfortable with the half year you want to look at a quarter of a year you want to
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look at not I don’t know. A year would save us a little bit up front as well but
starting in July rather than in April.
Bird: I think they’re being very fair and asking for just a half year myself. I don’t
think –
Kilchenmann: You will in order to give any kind of merit though something’s
going to have to be cut.
Bird: Yes. Of course that resource officer deal actually wound up only costing us
something like $5,900 because of the grant and stuff that we –
Nary: 17 for the resource.
Kilchenmann: We already have that in there and you’re still 46 (inaudible).
Bird: I can’t see opening Mountain View High School without a resource officer
over there myself.
De Weerd: Yes, we have that in there.
Bird: I think those three – I think those one, two, three I think we need to really
look hard at. You know you bring it on a half year you’re going to pay overtime.
That’s the thing that’s been killing us on the fire is instead of hiring some fireman
and getting them out on the – getting them trained and out there we’ve been
paying guys $80,000 or better to come back and sit for two hours.
Kilchenmann: Our overtime on the fire station just goes up with every person
you hire.
Nary: Well the other thing and I know this is a capital expense as well. This is a
– Captain didn’t remember exactly what this mileage was for this car. These
three need to be replaced they’re all at the 90,000 mark.
Bird: All four of them need to be replaced.
Nary: Okay and that’s fine.
Bird: I’ve ridden in a couple of those and I’ve been surprised when we went over
a bump that we weren’t going down on the frame.
Nary: And I don’t have a problem with that but I think something’s going to have
to give. I think we can – if we fund all of the this we’re not going to have enough
for other things if we do that.
Bird: I think all they were asking us to fund was the first three items wasn’t it?
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Corrie: Yes crime prevention we could but if we –
Nary: Well but this was only $5,900. Remember most of this was out of the
grant so we almost have to fund that. We have to fund the $5,900.
Bird: Yes that’s true.
Nary: And we have to certainly fund that. I think this is the only real discussion
point of funding. This is basically all they went was from a 47,000-dollar request
to a cabinet so I don’t think there’s any real issue there. I think that’s fine. I think
this is the only one that we have to decide do you want to have three at a half
year. Do you want to have less than three at a half year do you want to have
none at the next year?
Corrie: Well the main point of the half-year for three patrol officers is my
understanding is that they can’t get them into the academy until after that. That’s
rather than having a full year of on they will wait until they get the academy and
come back. Either you’re going to do it now or you will next year because they’re
going to be three short.
Kilchenmann: The only thing we have to remember is that when we fund those
then next year we have a full year. Then those grants are only for two years so
when those grants run out in two years we’ll have the full cost of those people so
we’re just postponing –
De Weerd: The increase on our base.
Corrie: Yes but you do need those grants to help you on those two years ahead
of time.
Kilchenmann: Right I’m just saying that maybe we can’t afford all six officers at
this point.
Corrie: Can you afford not to have them?
Kilchenmann: I can’t.
Corrie: Well yes but I’m talking about the people out here in this community.
What do they see?
Kilchenmann: But something – we just have to put something.
Corrie: Well yes we do but we also have to think of some other things too. I’m a
little cautious about – and I realize three officers are good but next year they’re
going to come back and do the same thing and we’re going to give them three. I
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don’t know where you have to cut but they’re down to $394,000. They were at –
what was it?
Nary: 722.
Corrie: $692,000 or eight I’m sorry. Granted you don’t get everything you need
that’s for sure. Three is better than none to some degree.
Nary: I think three’s a given. It’s the other three is whether or not that’s an
affordable number right now.
Bird: The argument is the half-year guys. The three at a half-year.
De Weerd: If we brought them on in July and made them – because I think we
do need them.
Nary: Oh, I think we do.
De Weerd: And we’ll be needing them you know in years to come. If we look at
– if we could save the three months and yes it does increase your base going
into next year’s well but that’s just what we’ll have to realize. Then we’ll really
have a narrowing gap. You could split that in half to what $74,000. Then you
would have $74,000 then we’ll have $20,000 in the good.
Nary: Right.
Cunningham: Actually we can only cut the wages because they’re still going to
want the car. They’re going to need the operating for the car and uniform
allowance.
De Weerd: Oh okay so that doesn’t split it in half then?
Nary: No.
De Weerd: That’s (inaudible).
Corrie: What’s in their base budget?
Nary: It still saves $40,000.
Corrie: You’re assuming so much for base budget?
De Weerd: Is everyone okay with the base?
Corrie: Well that’s what I’m looking at if there was anything. I went through there
and looked at it.
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De Weerd: Do you feel comfortable with the base Bill?
Nary: On the police?
De Weerd: Yes.
Nary: The one expense I did see in the base for police that I was a little curious
about is there’s a professional services base of $14,000 that’s never – that’s a
new item I think?
Cunningham: That’s actually for that fine officer.
Nary: Is that what that’s for?
Cunningham: It is.
Nary: And the prosecution amount I think is too high.
Kilchenmann: Yes I think we can –
Nary: I think the prosecution amount could probably be cut about $50,000.
Bird: I was going to say that’s a lot higher than our contract.
Nary: Right but I don’t think the contract – well the contract increase if you took
the current contract and increase it three percent.
Cunningham: 160,000.
Nary: How much would that be $45,000.
Cunningham: 48.
Nary: $48,000.
Cunningham: $4,800.
Nary: $4,800 because I don’t – even if you increased it five percent for anything
over because that includes – the current contract includes an extra cost for victim
witness service I think. That’s kind of intangible to know how much it’s going to
be. I think if you took the current contract which the victim witness services are
an add on to that –
Bird: That’s where I don’t know.
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July 18, 2003
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Nary: So even if you took a 10 percent increase total that includes victim witness
you would still be looking at –
Cunningham: 176.
Nary: Yes and that’s plenty.
Kilchenmann: We took $50,000 off.
Nary: So if you took $50,000 off for that base. Now the other one I thought was
pretty curious on the base one is the 1,286 percent increase to seminars and
training.
Bird: That’s what we can’t figure out.
Nary: That seems fairly significant.
Cunningham: We talked about that this morning. If you go to the second page
because what we did is, the police actually had two separate accounts for
training and they wanted one for the admin training and one for the rest of the
officer training. Then we decided to combine them back together we didn’t like
the two separate accounts.
Nary: So when you take those two together it really is probably about the same.
Kilchenmann: Yes it is the same.
Nary: Yes and the interest expense is fixed I assume right that 500,000.
Bird: Yes.
Corrie: One of the things that the attorney talked to me about was when they
might want to court on this charting as for the assessment on the building that we
go to the bank. He said it’s probably going to cost us about $10,000 but we’ll
save $50,000. They think they can win that they really do so we must think
about that.
Nary: Right that’s on the civil side.
Corrie: Right all right.
Nary: But we still probably need to budget the property taxes in case we don’t.
Corrie: Right exactly.
Nary: We probably need to budget that anyway.
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Corrie: That’s right.
Nary: And we may have to look to increasing some on the civil side.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: On the electricity on Page 2 Idaho Power you have $36,000 budgeted in
and the most actual is $17,000. How come we doubled the budget item?
Cunningham: We actually didn’t double it we just left it the same. Because now
they’re in the building for the full summer so we’re going to find out what air
conditioning costs are really going to be.
Corrie: Oh the current is $36,000 and we’ve only used $12,000.
De Weerd: Yes but that’s a projected. Right now, the current is $9,000.
Cunningham: Yes that was as of March.
Berg: They haven’t been in there a full year.
De Weerd: That was of March.
Kilchenmann: These figures are March.
Corrie: We’re projecting 17 to $18,000.
Berg: October to March.
Cunningham: October to March six months.
De Weerd: But still the projection is close to $18,000.
Kilchenmann: All that projection does is double it.
Cunningham: Yes it just takes it and –
Kilchenmann: And their high part the high cost for them in the summer. I hate to
change their building cost because they’re always coming up with some new
expense that they didn’t plan on.
Cunningham: I think next year we’ll have a real idea of what their electricity is
going to be. Then if we have it budgeted too high we’ll bring it down.
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Corrie: Overtime wages $120,000.
Bird: And we throw $5,000 in for employee education reimbursement and we’ve
never used it.
Kilchenmann: We’re using it now because Bill Musser is going to school.
De Weerd: Okay that’s one. You know we just think that instead of – things that
have always been there that they’re justified. That they put in okay who’s going
to be using this this next year needs to put it in so we can plan it for the budget
instead of carrying forward a bunch of money that is never used then it goes into
a fund that then we can never really get a better idea of where we really are.
Kilchenmann: I know.
Cunningham: We did talk to Bill about taking that out. He assures us that
there’s going to be some going to continuing their education.
De Weerd: Okay.
Berg: Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council that is something that’s in our
personnel policy that any employee could address. At one time, you could have
all of your employees taking advantage of that. Obviously, he didn’t say pencil in
every employee with that possibility. It’s one of those things that are really tough
but see if you don’t use it hopefully, it goes back into your capital outlay for the
next year. That’s always the way it’s kind of been projected for what might be
possible but that’s stated in our personnel policy and anyone could address it. I
could have all my staff be going to college for a class and I would have to
reimburse it because of what we said in our personnel policy. I think I know what
you’re saying Tammy, but I think it’s also you have to plan something in there
even though we didn’t use it last year. Thank you we saved money but it might
not happen this year. It is stated in our personnel policy that they could do it.
Corrie: How much money do you think they’re going to have left over for this
year to date? I mean do they have it spent. Do you have any idea? That’s a
crystal ball question.
Kilchenmann: Yes because their overtime is high. Actually when Mike and I
looked at it last month and it we looked at the over accounts versus the under
accounts they all come out about (inaudible).
Corrie: Okay.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
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Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Maybe one of the things we could do too and I don’t recall do we have a
policy of what benefit if any the departments gain by saving money.
Kilchenmann: No we don’t.
Nary: So maybe one of the things we could consider as a group as a policy on
what to do with those savings. Obviously they go back to general fund but
providing those incentives to the departments that can save money that we can
basically return that money back to them a percentage of it towards again, I don’t
know whether it’s employee incentive or something else. That provides some
reason not to go spend the money in September, which I think is kind of common
in –
Kilchenmann: Government.
Nary: -- government. Everybody goes to seminars in September because we
use up the rest of the money. That might be something as a group we could
consider is some policy to provide that level of incentive that if it’s saved a
percentage will go back to that department for something else.
Kilchenmann: Correct.
Nary: Did you guys hear that.
De Weerd: No.
Nary: Did you say no?
De Weerd: Yes.
Nary: Okay.
Corrie: I was wondering if they got it (inaudible) they got it.
De Weerd: No I didn’t.
Nary: Oh I said what we may want to do as a policy is provide incentives to the
departments to save money is to provide them something that some of that
money that stays saved could be returned back to them. Whether it’s for
employee incentive or something else we could decide what that is or the
department could come forward saying we got five percent back of what we
returned back to the city this is what we want to use it for.
De Weerd: I would love to do that. I think that’s great.
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Nary: Do you want to use it for that wish list item that extra thing that they think
will enhance their employees lives and their workspace. It might be something
again to provide better incentive internally to the department as well as the
department as a whole saying if we save money we’re going to get a benefit out
of it either way.
De Weerd: You’re amazing Bill.
Nary: Well because one of the things we found in Boise, which has been very
frustrating, is what they do is they fund departments at 98 percent of what they
request. Well, it doesn’t take a brain surgeon to figure out that you really asked
for 102 percent of what you think you need so that you end up with what you
really wanted. I don’t know that that’s always the best way to do it but if you at
least provide that incentive the other way you’ll get something else.
De Weerd: Well as long as your projections are within your historical I think as
long as you don’t obviously inflate it that then there are actual savings. You are
being frugal. I have noticed in these vehicle maintenance lines do we have a lot
of really crappy cars that we anticipate a lot of vehicle maintenance issues.
Historically, these numbers that are budgeted are not really substantiated. Do
we have some really bad cars that –
Kilchenmann: Well we budget $500 a car. That’s just our policy. The thing that
happens is hopefully you have some cars. Most cars that won’t need repairs
because one care like we had to fix the air conditioner in Terry’s car and that’s
almost $500 right there. You hate to take that down because if you do have any
kind of repair –
Nary: And by sticking with our program on replacing police vehicles, we should
eventually be able to lower that cost. The problem has been is we have spent
more than $500 on a lot of patrol cars because the mileage is high. If we can
keep to that program which is where they’re asking for these replacement
vehicles then maybe eventually we’ll be a little bit more level.
McCandless: Plus they get a lot harder use than a normal car does.
Nary: Sure.
Cunningham: And on the police, we actually give $800 per vehicle on their
repairs or on their maintenance because that’s for tires. They usually go through
a set every year.
De Weerd: Well the tires yes.
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Corrie: One of the things I was looking at how come employee insurance – are
you just taking that as a some went up a lot some just a little?
Kilchenmann: We just took it at – we just used an average.
Corrie: Okay I was looking at the animal control adjustment of $6,000.
Kilchenmann: Went up –
Corrie: That takes in everything considering?
Cunningham: Actually last year what we did is we literally took every single
employee line by line and said okay do they have a family are they single? What
are their actual insurance costs? This year we took it and we actually averaged
it all out, came up with an amount, and said okay we’re going to need $7,500 per
employee on an average. We’re going to have some of those divisions like the
animal control they are actually I think two single women or they have minimal
insurance so there is extra change. You’re going to see some different changes
like that throughout the department.
Corrie: Did you take into consideration on animal control also that we’re going to
have to do our own euthanasia work and otherwise Boise is charging us $25 a
dog or a cat.
Cunningham: From what I understand the Police Department is looking at doing
those themselves.
Corrie: Okay yes I know they are so that’s what I wanted to make sure that’s in
here because they don’t – that’s a $5,000 bill to Boise if they keep going over
there. I know they were talking about it.
Cunningham: They want to do it in house.
Corrie: I just wanted to make sure that they’re covered in there somewhere.
Cunningham: Yes.
Corrie: One thing I was going to ask if we do that three police officers that fourth
of a year nine months are they going to be able to get them in the academy, back
and started at that time or will they – is it a timing problem for them?
Kilchenmann: I don’t know.
Corrie: If they get them in the academy early then they have to hire them. They
can’t have an interview. If they get out of the academy and there’s three months
that they don’t.
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July 18, 2003
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Cunningham: Are they employees while they’re in the academy?
Nary: Yes.
Corrie: Yes that’s how come they only wanted half of them over here because
they couldn’t get them all in the academy and they couldn’t train all of them at the
same time so they were cutting them up.
Cunningham: So it really means they wouldn’t actually have the officers in house
until probably the next fiscal year?
Nary: Right. Yes. I guess the question is, is if we can’t start them in April does it
even – isn’t it even worth starting them in July or would they rather just wait till
October if we couldn’t do that because –
Kilchenmann: They don’t know the timing of the academy.
Corrie: Because that academy works on a time schedule so I just thought about
that. I wouldn’t want to get them in the academy then have to wait three months
to put them on line. Somebody else is going to take them believe me at their
academy. Yes, they have to go to the academy.
Nary: They have to go – Idaho is the only state that doesn’t require you go to the
academy prior to becoming a police officer. You can actually work up to a year
before you have to go to the academy. We as a department a city have decided
which is for good reasons not to do that. To not have, people out there working
without having gone to the academy. They get hired on, they go to the academy
and then they come back out of the academy and they work. That’s a good
reason we should continue to do that but I think the Mayor has raised a good
point is the academy has reserved slots for the city. If they can’t start in April, I’m
assuming they risk taking the academy at that time was what the intent is. We’ll
have people hired so that their start date can be April 1st
then go to the fairly
immediately so they’re not getting paid to not do anything. If they can’t start until
July is that going to make a difference that it may or may not matter. Either they
have to start in April or not until October.
De Weerd: Can we have someone call and find out.
Kilchenmann: I’ll go call them.
Corrie: Okay or they may have to hire three officers that have academy training
too. That may be happening because we start them at a higher salary so we
might be able to pick up somewhere else if it’s a chess mate type thing for police.
Okay. We could hire three and at the ninth month already have academy
experience and that would be great but I don’t know whether we can or not.
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De Weerd: Reta, did you also add in the amount that rural is going to be paying
for the fire engine? I guess that’s something that we need to discuss is does that
go into general revenues or does that less money get taken out of the fire engine
fund?
Cunningham: No it actually increases our revenues so we actually need to put it
down there where we have the fire truck funds. If you’ll notice on my screen,
we’ve already changed the general fund summary.
De Weerd: Okay so you took less out of the fire truck fund.
Cunningham: Yes then added $90,000 increased the rural fire share.
De Weerd: Thank you. Because I thought yesterday you said that it was
probably, an item we should discuss.
Cunningham: When I talked with Kenny last he said that they were talking about
– rural fire was talking about actually paying a portion. Evidently, he came
yesterday and said they decided they would?
De Weerd: They are, it’s in their budget proposal.
Corrie: This is the point where rural fire has more money.
Cunningham: And they can afford it.
Corrie: Yes luckily because of the mill levy. They need to do their (inaudible).
Cunningham: Is there anything else in the police base?
Corrie: I don’t have any I think. Anybody else have anything?
De Weerd: No.
Nary: I’m sorry.
Corrie: Police budget anything else?
Nary: I guess we’ll wait until we get the answer on that patrol officer position.
Corrie: Okay. Are we going to go to fire?
Cunningham: Do you guys want to move?
Corrie: Yes.
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Pg. 38 of 108
FIRE DEPARTMENT
Cunningham: I actually wasn’t here for the fire presentation. Did they make any
changes?
De Weerd: Well we had a couple of discussion items. One is on the mobile data
terminals why those don’t come out of the Title 31 funds.
Corrie: Yes and I haven’t gotten back to them. Nobody could talk to me that had
any idea of what there is I can do that. Maybe I can give them a call to the
County Commissioners –
***End Of Side Two***
Corrie: -- yes Mr. Nary.
Nary: On the I guess the one – two things for me. The knox box although that
sounds like a very nice addition I don’t know how necessary it is at this juncture.
I guess I wasn’t totally sold that was really a need. The other one is the
inspector that contracted inspections. That to me should go with the other
inspections that’s a special services type of need and should move over there.
Again, it’s a contracted service but I think it should go over there because fees
are going to cover the cost of that. That’s what we’ve been working on anyway.
I guess to me I don’t see that that needs to be in the fire budget and I think the
knox box again I don’t – I hate having to pay for the Opticoms but I think we need
them. I hate having to pay for the MDT terminals but I think we need them. Now
if they get paid by other sources at some point that’s great. Same thing with the
thermal imaging unit I think Council Member Bird was right in thinking that we
probably get that funded but I think we need it if we can. I think it’s another one
of those things that needs to be funded at this point. If we can certainly get
donations or something else that would help off set that cost that’s great but I
think we need it anyway. The office assistant I didn’t really have a feel one-way
or the other on whether or not that was a necessity.
Corrie: Comments.
Kilchenmann: Well just going back to the police. I just talked to Bill and he said
actually there is an academy that starts July 1st
so he said they could definitely
work with that.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you Stacy. I think with the office assistant and Kenny
touched on it yesterday but with two more stations, it does kind of give them a
little bit more flexibility.
Nary: That’s true.
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Corrie: (inaudible) we need.
De Weerd: Well yes but Greta is only in Station 1 so that gives them two other
sub-stations that –
Corrie: They can move around.
Nary: Well that makes sense.
Corrie: I think that might be a good idea. I’ve gone by Station 2 and there wasn’t
a soul around. One of my suggestions to Council is that the Fire Department
look at an opportunity to at least have a phone out front because people go to
the fire station if they’re in trouble or need something and there’s nobody there
what do I do. They panic. If they have a phone at least a 911 phone on the
outside and I’ll talk to the County on that. I think they should have something
that they can contact 911 if they don’t have a cell phone or what have you they’ll
go to the fire station and they’ve actually been there when I got there. They said
what do we do and I said I can’t get in either. I called through the dispatch on my
car radio but that’s something the Council might want to direct me to find out if
we can get the county or the sheriff or somebody to put a phone in there.
They’re out – it’s not because they’re not there for any reason but they’re out
looking at different things, inspections and they’re not there. Okay again I’m
talking to you but I’m talking to the Council at the same time. Okay.
Bird: I agree with you Mayor I think it’s a very, very good idea and we do need
something like that. I’m the same as you I’ve been there and nobody has been
there. I have no idea how to get in or – and if I was looking for an emergency I
would be in trouble. I think it’s something we definitely need to look at. I have to
agree with Councilman Nary I think we need thermal imaging units. If we can get
them donated that’s just $12,000 they can put back in something else. We have
to have the Opticoms who pays for them and we can argue that out. That
electric knox box for engine I think that’s $5,500 that we can do without. The
contractor inspection should be over in the inspection contractor division not at
the Fire Department to start with. The mobile data terminals are another one we
have to have and who pays for them we can argue. The part time assistant I’m
like him I think that now that you have one more deal on and you have another
one coming on you need a part time secretary for them to move around.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: On the base budget at least in my look through on the base budget the
only one that I guess if is any notice to me was seminars and training for fire as
well. I am not against seminars and training I think it’s a very good thing but if
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July 18, 2003
Pg. 40 of 108
you look at the factual of 2002 was $15,000 the projected this year and I
recognize it is just double of what happens from March to October but that’s
$8,000. Thirty-four seems huge and I think you could move that base down to
about 20 and still cover what they’ve done at least historically and have some
money available that can be used. That’s the only one that jumped off the page
at me unless there is something that’s planned that’s just not – if it’s just because
of the potential that seems like a lot of money.
De Weerd: Yes.
Kilchenmann: Do you want me to call them?
Nary: Sure if you wouldn’t mind.
De Weerd: Yes call Bill and see if there’s anything specific.
Nary: Otherwise I think if you put it down to about 20 that should cover at least
what they’ve historically done and if there’s increased costs I know all of those
trainings – any training in any field anywhere costs more than you ever
remembered. Any training anybody has ever been to.
Corrie: One of the things is the fireman are demanding that they get paid to go
to training.
Bird: Yes they get their salary.
Corrie: And I can’t get that in my thought. If they’re on duty why should we pay
them extra but that’s a union that’s something that’s (inaudible) I guess.
Cunningham: I think what Kenny’s done is he’s actually put in $1,000 per
employee it’s just kind of his standard. You’re right I haven’t seen him spend it.
Corrie: And it’s there in case they use it.
De Weerd: And I think training continues to be an issue and a concern. Their
focus and in their strategic plan training has been an item that’s been a high
priority. Certainly one that has come up in discussions with the Firefighters so
they may have specific plans I just don’t know specifically what they are to
answer you on that.
Nary: Everything else in the base looked really pretty reasonable in line with
either historically or what’s being spent in this budget year. That was the only
one that sort of jumped out.
Corrie: And they use the money that’s in the fire truck fund to pay for the new
engine plus the money that the rural is giving right?
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De Weerd: Yes.
Corrie: Okay.
De Weerd: And that’s for the fire engine as well as it’s fully equipped. It’s
equipped as well.
Cunningham: So does everybody agree on the contractor inspector we go
ahead and put that to billing?
De Weerd: Yes.
Nary: Move it over.
Corrie: And I think I’m like Mr. Nary in that lock knox box when they were saying
(inaudible) think of a Captain that’s getting paid enough that he can be
responsible for that.
Cunningham: So eliminate the –
Corrie: It’s nice to have. It’s great but I think a Captain should be responsible for
that there’s one in every truck. He’s the guy and if he can’t control that I think I
would be re-look at the requirements for Captain. I’ve got to be careful what I
say –
Nary: No you don’t.
Corrie: Up to a point. I don’t want to embarrass anybody or add but I think it’s
necessary.
Nary: Yes people do need to think a little more before they just say things off the
top of their head.
De Weerd: You know Jonathan is on he’s leaving town so he doesn’t really care
on the Mayor said.
Corrie: Jonathan would you like another donut?
De Weerd: Remember he could have short timers attitude.
Corrie: Jonathan doesn’t have a short timers attitude though.
Cunningham: Then the other item you guys were discussing was the thermal
imaging unit.
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July 18, 2003
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Corrie: Yes I would like to take that on. My tinier here is and kind of
spearheaded that because I think we can get it.
Bird: I think we can too but I think we need to leave it in there Mayor.
Corrie: Well yes I agree with you but I think we can get the money and they don’t
have that much more money. I don’t mean to take it out but I thought about it but
I haven’t ever (inaudible) now but I think we should get that.
Nary: Yes I think we need to leave it in in case we can’t.
Corrie: In case they don’t yes.
Nary: Because I think we need it.
Cunningham: They could contact the girl scouts because that one-year we
raised like $5,000 towards that unit.
De Weerd: And the K-kids.
Cunningham: Yes I know.
Nary: If you take $14,000 out of this base you can pay for it too.
Corrie: I can always float down the river again and call people to give money to
get me out of the river.
Cunningham: There you go.
Corrie: They’ll probably give the money to stay in the river.
De Weerd: Let’s move on. Are we done with fire?
Corrie: I think so unless you have something that you need to –
De Weerd: Not yet.
PARKS DEPARTMENT
Corrie: Okay parks.
De Weerd: How did you plan that one?
Nary: His ears were burning.
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Bird: He trimmed this pretty good to start with guys. I tell you they worked hard
on this Parks and Rec. Doug and Elroy worked very, very hard on it.
Nary: I think that must be based on a (inaudible).
Corrie: It could be yes. That may be yes.
Cunningham: I had a question about the 8th
Street footbridge. Was that actually
funded out of impact fees or general funds?
Corrie: No, general fund.
Cunningham: General fund okay.
De Weerd: Well we –
Bird: It’s eliminated.
Cunningham: It’s eliminated.
Corrie: Yes I think Doug said –
Cunningham: Take it out.
Corrie: -- caport yes. I had bleachers and tennis courts.
Nary: The tennis court issue I mean I guess I’m not sure why that wouldn’t be
impact fees. We’re still developing that park but –
De Weerd: They did have it as impact fees.
Nary: Oh, it is an impact fee? Not on this –
Corrie: Tennis courts, is that an impact fee?
De Weerd: It’s in italic.
Cunningham: I don’t have it listed as impact fees but you’re right it could be.
Corrie: Could it be?
Cunningham: Yes Bear Creek –
Corrie: Okay.
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Nary: Certainly, if the developer wants to step up and pay for part of it. Those
are the ones we want to encourage.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: When we talked about this park and the tennis courts were put in
there kind of depending on what the high school did. The high school is putting
in a number of tennis courts. I know I’ll get an argument from our City Clerk but if
the Mayor doesn’t recognize him, he doesn’t have an argument.
Corrie: Are you telling me how to do my job?
Nary: We would never do that.
De Weerd: But I think when this was originally discussed at the Commission it
was put in there as just a last option depending on what the high school did. The
high school is putting in a number of tennis courts, which will add to any deficit
that’s over here. Right now, I just think we need to be careful with how much we
spend in our impact fees because it still does need to be matched until the
change is made. We can’t get too lop-sided. I just want to proceed with caution
and things that we absolutely have to have.
Corrie: Good point. That’s a good point.
Nary: Well and if I guess Mr. Mayor I’m sorry.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Even if it is impact fees and we don’t opt to fund that at this juncture again
I don’t think we’re spending all the impact fees it will still be there. If that is
something that we feel there is a need to and Mr. Strong feels there is, a need to
we would certainly revisit that at a later time.
Corrie: Maybe use that $20,000 somewhere else that’s true that’s more
important than the convenience.
Nary: Well and I think the one thing with tennis courts is there is some ongoing
maintenance that’s probably the one issue that maybe we need a little bit more
understanding of because I think there is some cost to that. I don’t know how
significant it is. Ball fields generally have a different kind of ongoing maintenance
that may not be quite as expensive.
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Corrie: What about that seasonal groundskeepers Doug. You talked about a
little bit of it yesterday. Do you really need that one? I know you need the
groundskeeper.
Strong: (Inaudible).
Corrie: Did everybody hear that they have him full time then part time at the end
of it?
De Weerd: We want it on the record though.
Corrie: That was our discussion between the Department Heads.
Strong: We’re going to have full time groundskeeper than part time. We had to
eliminate one of the two positions we’d rather see the part time go.
Corrie: Okay.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess my thoughts on that I don’t have – looking at the numbers and the
number of people that we have and the volume of the ground that has to be
cared for I guess I don’t have a real heartburn with one more full time
groundskeeper. I think Mr. Strong did hear yesterday at least my thought is we
really need to look at contracting for some of the service of maintenance whether
it’s for the minimal maintenance that the undeveloped parks require or whether
it’s simply the more the maintenance that really can be carried out like cutting the
grass and the like. I think some of the things like maintaining the equipment
should be done by our employees. I think there’s some responsibility and
accountability when things that could injure somebody have to be maintained but
really, anybody can cut the grass. I think for the future and looking at
maintenance you probably want to at least explore that option out there in the
community. If there is a cheaper way of doing that for some of that maintenance
then you could focus your groundskeeper on the things that really have the high
profile the high necessity in need of maintenance for the city’s needs. The ones
that are less so can be done another way.
Strong: We can certainly look at that. We do some contract maintenance now
since you mentioned it like the undeveloped property because we do hire local
farmers to disk that property and maintain it throughout the summer season for
weed control and (inaudible) efforts so you don’t have a good stalk of really dry
stuff that burns. We do have to put a contract with (inaudible) and then the full
time person you have an investment in their training so that they can do the kind
of work that we need done in parks at a reasonable level of independence.
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Seasonal workers require more supervision more direction as we add space
we’re going to need more full time people that can go out, work independently on
park sites, and do the things that we need to do.
Nary: One thing I noticed though in the groundskeeper you don’t have a vehicle.
You have adequate vehicles?
Strong: We have adequate vehicles for the groundskeeper.
Nary: Okay great.
Corrie: I think the one ton service truck is working too because that will cause
your cost to go down a lot of your employee administration and maintenance as
well. They will be able to be out on the job and not have to go back and forth.
Strong: It’s saving a lot of money (inaudible).
Corrie: And you were getting a new truck so you’re not a hand me down baby
anymore on that one.
Strong: Well the reason we have enough trucks for the full time groundskeeper
is because we do take hand me down trucks.
Corrie: Right okay.
Strong: But we don’t go very far with them and we can keep them running for a
long time and do what we need to do.
Nary: So does the group want to eliminate the Number 2 the seasonal
groundskeeper?
Corrie: Yes. I think we (inaudible).
De Weerd: Yes.
Bird: Go ahead.
Corrie: Okay.
Cunningham: Did you guys want to increase any of the contract labor?
Nary: Well that’s what we may want to look at. I don’t know does anybody else
have feelings about the truck?
Bird: About the what?
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Nary: About the one-ton truck?
Bird: No.
De Weerd: I do. I think in the past I don’t know do you need a brand new truck.
There are used one-ton trucks and I don’t know anything about trucks. I would
be the first to admit I do not know about trucks. I also do know when people see
brand new things sitting around in a tough budget year it becomes the first thing
that comes out of their mouth on why are we not getting a raise and buying a
brand new truck. It’s just one of those perception things. I understand your need
but you know is there a less expensive way of doing it or is there another way we
can just bite the bullet on it and do it next year? I don’t know those are just
questions that perhaps you can help answer.
Strong: Well I guess in response to that I think we have been biting the bullet
kind of getting a long. When we looked at buying new versus used like I said for
our parks maintenance workers we could get by with hand me down trucks and
do the job with them. We’re willing to do that. This is kind of a special use
vehicle. It’s going to be specifically equipped to respond to situations in the park
where it’s fully equipped to do just about anything that we need to do on site.
Most of the trucks that are equipped this way that are available to use are used
up. We looked around at what would be a possibility unless we could buy a used
truck and frame only somewhere that had not been set up with a utility box and
the other things that we’re looking at here. The challenge for us was if we’re
looking at anything used, the availability of this particular type of used vehicle is
not common. It doesn’t mean it’s impossible it’s just not common. The most
expedient way for us to go was to certainly buy off a fleet (inaudible) this type of
truck through the state contract. That’s how we’ve looked at it and priced it is
what’s available currently on state contract this type of vehicle. It would need the
utility box put on.
De Weerd: And how often would this truck be in use?
Strong: It would be used daily. It also has the capacity of pulling a trailer to the
larger pieces of equipment we have which I believe Elroy explained in some
detail yesterday.
De Weerd: But I thought that’s why we purchased a flat bed that one time was to
haul around the larger pieces of equipment. I’m just depending on memory on
that one. That’s – I think when we purchased the flat bed it was said at that time
we need it because the other pickups won’t transport the larger pieces of
equipment.
Strong: It is used that way if Brad would be primarily using his truck as a
maintenance technician’s out of site and needs the backhoe (inaudible) that he
takes both the trailer and the backhoe and then he has all the other equipment
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as the loader, air compressor, full compliment tools and such all together. The
flat bed is used but doesn’t have a toolbox on it it’s just a flat bed truck that’s
what it’s missing.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: The one thing to me I can see the use I guess I’m still not totally sold that
there’s a need. I could probably be okay with the truck but I guess I’m thinking
the 500 pound gorilla we have to wrestle with here when we get done with some
of these is what do we do about employee compensation. That $42,000 goes a
long way towards employee compensation. What I’m hearing at least from you
Doug and what I’ve heard from Elroy is this will make our life a lot easier in our
maintenance and those things. Not that I don’t want to do that but I guess I don’t
know that I want to do that yet until we at least figure out what our employee
compensation is going to be and whether or not that is a need or just a positive
enhancement to what they’re doing now. That’s my only hang up is $42,000 is a
lot of money for a vehicle. I think we can use it and I’m not totally sure you need
it and I would really like to at least wait until you get the discussion about
compensation before we say let’s just go ahead and (inaudible).
Strong: I guess going back to your original question certainly understanding the
decision that you’re grappling with. Can we get by certainly we can get by we’re
getting by now it’s just a matter of how long. In this next year as we’ve had more
park space than we need for this type of vehicle becomes even more of an issue.
We would certainly come back next year if not funded this year with the same
kind of request. We may have other equipment that we need by next year that
we had to request. That’s the challenge as you start to kind of backlog
equipment needs. It’s delayed this year but then next year with more park space
we have to make a decision when do we add another mower or when do we add
equipment to maintain pathways because we don’t have any special use
equipment for pathways. Those are things to look at down the road.
De Weerd: I think Doug that’s kind of what we’re seeing with every department
is we’re not asking for it this year but next year we’re going to need it. I think
we’ve even heard that last year. It’s – we understand that and we don’t want to
compound any problems that’s why we have to ask you can you really – can you
do without it until next year because we are grappling with the merit increases,
and the benefits. It’s one of those things of give us what you absolutely need
because we want to make sure that we actually also take care of the employees
that are going to sit in that truck.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
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Bird: You know it’s something that I’ve been pounding on for years is instead of
mileage we need hour meters. I think we’ve got equipment the big thing and if
you go back and look at the records of the last five years in the Parks
Department I have been against buying the backhoes and all that kind of stuff
because I think we can rent it and do that a lot cheaper. I realize it’s nice to have
them sitting in your yard but I think they set for 75 percent of the time and used
for 25 percent of the time. Getting hour meters on them is what we need to do.
Anytime we can rent a piece of equipment we are much better off then going and
purchasing it because we not only have the paying for it we have the insurance
on it and all that kind of stuff. A truck like this no you can’t go rent something like
this. How much we need it they seem like they think they need it pretty hard.
They are getting more stuff to take care of and doing more stuff. I think in all
purchasing I think that we with computers if a person wants to change a color of
their computer. They don’t worry about it being broken down or if they want a flat
screen, they go get a flat screen. I think this is stuff that – I realize that is the big
item but you start adding up $1,500 worth of computers that isn’t necessary to do
all the time it adds up. I think we just need to look at how we are purchasing and
stuff on all our departments. What do we really need to purchase and what can
we rent as we need it?
De Weerd: So do you think we need to keep it?
Bird: Do I think we need this pickup? Yes and no. I think you’re going to need it
either by this year – I think $42,000 is very, very high.
Corrie: Mr. Bird would you think about possibly taking this out and then taking a
look at where the cost of the added incentive of the employees and then if we got
enough money we can come back to that one.
Bird: That’s mine – my concern right now is to get down where we can
compensate the employees. I’m kind of like Mr. Nary that’s my priority right now
as what kind of a deal – I probably won’t agree with what some of you guys think
we need to compensate them because I don’t see the five and (inaudible)
compensations out on the private world. I don’t see the three percent
compensations out there and I know you guys don’t either. We’ve got – I think
that’s our priority and I think it’s all being held up by one thing myself.
Nary: Mr. Mayor too.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I was just going to add one thing. Council Member de Weerd I think
raised the point is I can’t imagine anything more frustrating for an employee to
not get a raise or get a very minimal raise if any and we buy a $40,000 truck
that’s sitting out there in the yard.
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Bird: That’s true.
Nary: I think at least at this juncture we should at least take it out for the time
being. We’ll come back to some of these things but I think we really as we go
through these really need to look very tightly at need. I think the police did that
and I think we’ve done that with fire. I don’t see this as a need immediately until
we at least can address that other issue.
Bird: I think fire has got to address their overtime. Their overtime is out of hand.
It’s way out of hand and how they do it we don’t know.
Nary: What about the Bear Creek tennis courts? Do we want to leave that in the
impact fee I think Council Member de Weerd’s thought was take that out at the
moment. I have no objection of taking that out. I think the other things are things
we really need to step up with. That one is probably the one –
Bird: We’ve got to watch our impact fees because (inaudible). Yes, I think we
need to take it out.
Corrie: Take them both out right now and come back when we can.
Cunningham: Okay so are we going to take the one-ton out?
Corrie: Yes that too.
Nary: And take out the Bear Creek tennis courts out –
Corrie: I’m sorry Doug we’ll come back and revisit it but we need to look at the
employees first. I’m anxious to see what that committees coming back.
Cunningham: We’re taking out the $20,000 on Bear Creek?
Bird: Yes.
Corrie: Okay. I’m sorry I can’t –
Cunningham: And were there any issues with the base?
Corrie: With the what?
Cunningham: With the budget base for parks.
Nary: There are a couple of things I noticed in the base Mr. Mayor. I looked at
the adult sports expenses I think that’s the recreation adult recreation program.
It appeared a couple of years ago we had $11,000 that was use. Now we budget
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$15,000 for this last year and we’ve used $3,500 or projected use $3,500
throughout the year. I don’t know if that’s a better actual amount but $15,000
seems like a fairly large disparity than what we’ve been using and what’s
budgeted. The contract labor I don’t know whether or not – it looks like 17
historically was fine. If we’re going to look at some other contracted labor for
maintenance that maybe a good amount to leave it out I don’t know. I did notice
one other one that was just the large number of the increase. The furniture and
equipment was increase 125 percent to $1,800. I don’t know if that was for a
specific thing or not but it seemed like the historical one two years ago was $539
projected this year $640 and we’ve upped it $1,000 more than what was
projected. That seemed like although it’s only $1,000, $1,000 here $1,000 there
it turns into real money eventually. There’s contracted labor line item on
personnel as well as the contracted labor in recreation as well as park
(inaudible). I didn’t know if those were two different kinds of things I assume they
were.
Kilchenmann: One of those is for the recreation (inaudible).
Nary: Oh, I see.
Kilchenmann: And for parks, it’s for the seasonal –
Cunningham: They actually use it for like planting flowers (inaudible).
Nary: The spring and fertilizing amount looks like historically was significantly
than $20,000. They’ve got $22,000 requested. In 2002, it was $5,300.
Projected this year was $1,500 and again I know that was prior to the summer
season so it may be more realistic but that’s a fairly large gap between actual or
even projected actual and what’s being requested. That certainly could be
evaluated. This $12,000 in base for fuel I know as we get larger there’s probably
some necessity because we have to go from Lochsa Falls to Kiwanis Park so
there’s a lot more fuel cost but it looks again like a fairly small amount and that
some of that might be a little extra. There is $10,000 for tree maintenance in the
downtown area and there hasn’t been any – and I know again that was March so
I don’t know. It looks like last year it was $3,700 and now we have $10,000.
Strong: Actually the reason for that is that many of the downtown street tree
containers need to be replaced.
Nary: Okay.
Strong: They are fairly expensive each because they weren’t put in. They
weren’t large enough when they were put in. They need to be replaced because
the trees aren’t going to fit as it grows.
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De Weerd: And they’re trying to do – they’re not trying to do them all at the same
time, they’re doing a few every year.
Nary: Isn’t that something eventually maybe MDC might be assisting the partial
cost? Maybe not this next year but in the future.
De Weerd: They could possibly.
Corrie: What was that furniture and equipment Doug? What was that $1,800
that was normally eight 125 percent increase?
Cunningham: Yes we actually put in an extra $1,000 for Doug’s office because
even then you’re looking at changing out some of his furniture. He’s just trying to
figure out exactly how to get it arranged in there and what to do with the
previous. As far as the recreation you know that $1,500 for the adults sports
(inaudible). Actually right now and as of the end of June they’ve spent $4,500. It
looks like we got (inaudible) considering what they’re doing.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess in the recreation program it looks like our adult sports are
really going strong. I appreciate Doug’s background because you have a strong
recreation background. I hope that we start seeing more out of our recreation
program but it seems like some of the momentum that we’ve built over the prior
couple of years has very much diminished. Adult recreation seems to be
keeping us afloat but I guess I’m concerned that our expenses in recreation are
going up and the number of offerings seems to be going down. I don’t know if
we’re going in the right direction but we’re paying more money out to a program
that’s offering less to our community. It’s hard to justify that.
Strong: Actually I agree with that in just looking at what little history I can absorb
so far. There’s – our current recreation superintendent position has been filled
for just a year. It was transitioned certainly that may have affected some of what
we saw and the actual results. Unfortunately, we’re faced with replacing that
position again as of August 1st
Lisa’s last day will be August 1st
. This weekend’s
paper there will be an announcement to refill that position so there will be yet
another transition. Anytime you do that I think programs are certainly affected. I
would like to see those program numbers back up and that’s going to be the
effort as we look for a new person and look into the next year. Now whether we
can cut back some dollars to help with that transition come back next year and
look at some history and see whether we’re back up to where we were that might
be a practical way to look at it.
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De Weerd: I appreciate that Doug. You know it just was concerning to see for
the first year in the history of our program we haven’t had a summer camp for
kids. I know that the Boys and Girls Club has filled that void to a certain extent
but I was really unfortunate that we didn’t have it this year. I again, appreciate
your background and assumed that the numbers would start turning around
because I know what your focus is and that’s great.
Strong: Some of this is going to be a benefit from a relationship with the school
district that’s improved from where it is now. Part of the problem with the
summer supervised play program understanding is location having a site to do it.
That’s what I’ve been told. I think that can be resolved. I think that probably
could have been resolved this summer but it wasn’t. We need to fix those things.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess when I look at that number there Doug, I mean I’m not again trying
to cut them off when there’s some opportunities there but I look at it and think
you know some of that has to be also supplemented by the fees for the program.
Not all of it but some of it has to be supplemented and I guess I just think
$15,000 seems like a fairly large number. I don’t know what you would change it
to. I think it needs to be at 10. I think it needs to be 10 I just think that I mean all
of $5,000 I guess I would rather move it down to 10 and look at what kind of
programs. What kind of fee structure you can do so that it can be as – I don’t
know if it were completely self sustaining but certainly it would be closer to more
self sustaining than the other way.
Strong: I have a disagreement with that. I think it’s an area of what we do that
can be somewhat performance based and should be performance based to
some degree. That you see results and then you justify increases. Some of it
can be offset when it’s an area of the department that we do generate revenue.
You don’t generate revenue by mowing grass so there is a difference there.
Nary: Speaking of mowing grass on the spring and fertilizer on the $22,000 in
base for that that just seems incredible high from what the experience has been.
Even though we have added more park property I don’t know how much has that
been to the end of June and I recognize you still have a couple of more months
of –
Kilchenmann: We have quizzed Elroy closely on this for the last two years
because it hasn’t been spent. He says it’s an issue of I need the money, I
actually need more money I just don’t have time to do it. I was almost as we
talked about contract labor wondering if that was maybe – we could use that
money to contract maybe some of those expenses. We have had two or three
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different landscaping companies approach us and ask for information so I think
they might be interested in doing that.
Nary: But do we really need a $22,000 base to begin with? I mean it seems to
me like we may have needed some of it in contract labor for maintenance but it
just seems like such a large number that isn’t getting done but didn’t we also buy
a sprayer. Don’t we have a sprayer?
Corrie: Yes we have a sprayer. I believe I’ve been –
Bird: Very expensive I’ll tell you.
Nary: Yes so it seems silly to buy a sprayer then we don’t use it and then we
contract somebody else to spray. It just seems like a large number that we don’t
really need and haven’t experienced using so I’m not sure we need to maintain it
that level.
Kilchenmann: (inaudible).
Nary: I guess I would be more in favor of moving it to $10,000.
Bird: I would agree with you.
De Weerd: I wouldn’t do it. Is that fine? I wouldn’t cut it that drastically.
Bird: That’s only counting 12.
De Weerd: That’s more than – yes.
Nary: Half would be 11.
De Weerd: I said that’s more than half.
Nary: We can make it 11 but I don’t – I mean I don’t know how much more
spraying is remaining throughout this budget year.
Strong: I know it’s Elroy’s intent to have a better handle on fertilizing and
spraying and certainly staffing will help that too.
De Weerd: Yes with the full time person.
Strong: Yes we have additional staff for that. That makes more staff time
available, which would be one of Elroy’s concerns, is he just doesn’t have time to
get it done.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council Members)
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De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: Doug would it seem reasonable if we did put that at $10,000 and
then transfer $5,000 into the contract labor? I know that Councilman Nary said
in Boise, some of the neighborhood parks are contracted out because it just
costs so much for the personnel to load up the mowers, go over to those smaller
parks and maintain them. Maybe some of that contracted labor could be used
for some of the things that Elroy can’t get to and you don’t have a full time
groundskeeper specifically in charge of them. Most of their time is for the larger
parks. Would that seem something –
Strong: I think in the future that might be an option. We don’t have very many
neighborhood parks right now that wouldn’t probably help us much. I remember
when we discussed this Elroy was concerned having enough to buy fertilizer and
actually get it on.
De Weerd: So $15,000 in that account.
Strong: (Inaudible) it looks like what’s being proposed there is higher than what’s
currently – in my current practice it might make sense some adjustment to it. I
don’t have anything that I can grab at right now.
De Weerd: There’s no magic number?
Strong: Not in my head. Elroy would probably respond differently.
Corrie: (Inaudible) cut out too much we get telephone calls about why it’s
(inaudible). It’s because we don’t have fertilizer and then they’re going to say
come on Council get the fertilizer. Would you like to put that at 15 and that would
give you another 12.
Strong: That would give us something to work with.
Corrie: $7,000 excuse me. Put it at 15 yes and –
De Weerd: Do we want to put some to contracts?
Corrie: We had $20,000 for that.
Nary: It’s $2,000 on the bottom.
Cunningham: Actually in the maintenance it’s only $2,000.
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Corrie: I was looking at contract labor.
De Weerd: Yes.
Nary: It seems to me I mean I guess to me what we could do is we could move I
think $15,000 based on the size of what we’re talking about. You can move the
spraying and fertilizer under the departments’ budget to 11, take four of that, and
put that in the contract labor. That puts you at $15,000. If there’s a need to
transfer that later because there’s – they can come and ask for that. It just
seems like $15,000 that just seems like plenty. Whether or not we take 11 into
the one that’s the departments doing it, take the portion of the other four, and put
it into the contract one that should cover what we’re trying to accomplish.
De Weerd: (Inaudible).
Cunningham: Okay so that puts out a $10,000 reduction and then you take 11
from the spraying and four in contract labor.
Nary: Do you think that would work Doug?
Strong: What’s going through my mind is when we have contract labor what’s a
part of the contract. They actually do the spraying and fertilizing but do they also
provide fertilizer. A lot of what this costs is the actual purchase of the spray and
fertilizer. We can always contract people to apply it but I would think in most
cases we would have to supply the fertilizer for the sprayer. Again, what’s not
clear in my head (inaudible) the cost of the product not the application of the
product.
Nary: But our experience level is at $7,000 to this year. We can leave the
$15,000 in your departments line but I mean it seems like that’s almost double
what you’ve experienced at this point and I know there’s still more of the summer
to go.
Strong: Well with my limited history of the department my projection of what
happened last year since Elroy spent much of the last year with additional
responsibility in the department didn’t leave time to do some of these kind of
things that now he can focus on.
De Weerd: So that number is not really reflective of what the actual need is.
Strong: I think we’ve added acres as well in the last year. It’s going to require
more fertilizer next spring particularly new park land until you have established
grass. It needs more fertilizer it needs more weed (inaudible) as well. I’m a little
reluctant I guess in just my projection of that cutting back too far on the ability to
buy the product on this new grass.
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Kilchenmann: Elroy’s actually (inaudible).
Strong: I guess the best answer is that next year when we come back and look
at this again if we don’t produce then you were right. That’s not a very good
answer but unfortunately, I don’t have a year’s history to know exactly either.
Nary: I guess I’m still more on moving it down at the end if that’s fine.
Bird: And I agree with Councilman Nary. The actual used in 2002 was $5,302 I
just –
***End Of Side Three***
Bird: -- and we’re going to have the time to do it.
Corrie: Does anybody else want to – the two that’s left put it in 15? The two
ladies so far haven’t said.
McCandless: I think I would put it at 15 for this year.
Corrie: Move it to 15 then that’s three.
De Weerd: I already said.
Corrie: Okay that’s right I’m sorry.
Nary: Okay move it to 15.
Cunningham: Then the contract labor I’ll leave alone.
Nary: Yes.
De Weerd: Unless you want to add to it.
Cunningham: Is there anything else?
Corrie: That’s pretty good for right now we may have to come back. (Inaudible).
I can’t hear you.
ADMINISTRATIVE
Kilchenmann: The Laserfiche (inaudible).
Nary: Mr. Mayor I for one can’t see how we can’t upgrade the system that we
already have. I can’t see how we can’t do that. I didn’t see – that didn’t seem
like a luxury to me.
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Corrie: Yes that’s fine.
Nary: I think I heard Mr. Bird in supporting technology.
Bird: 100 percent.
De Weerd: I know.
Bird: 100 percent I think it’s something that we as a city has – we don’t have
enough choice. It’s a benefit that just helps the whole city. It’s something we’ve
got to do.
De Weerd: As we also went into this one we talked about the appropriate place
for street lighting. I don’t know if anyone has been able to get any kind of
information on that.
Berg: (Inaudible) so I have to give them a call.
De Weerd: Well geez Will can’t you do two places at one time.
Nary: Maybe it was closed at five.
De Weerd: Oh, you’re not a mom so you don’t know.
McCandless: I (inaudible) a mom.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: On those, other three I guess in that I think it was very helpful to have
(inaudible) for MDC. I can see the need for the up front costs. I guess we’re all
hoping that it should be reimbursed in the next fiscal year so it should be
ultimately a wash. I can understand the need of the up front money and $60,000
is within line of what they’re trying to do initially so I don’t have a real big concern
with that. Again, I think the Mayor was right on the money with the Senior
Center. I don’t have a problem with the amount I think we just need to be real
specific as to what it’s for so that’s real clear to the seniors as well as anyone
else what we’re helping fund. SAGE you know we have wrestled with SAGE for
more than we probably should for the last five months.
Bird: For the amount of money.
Nary: For the amount of money we’re talking about. I look at it this way and I
have no problem next year in saying these again. This is a one-time shot. We
asked the two most affected parties for SAGE to come and tell us that they could
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use it. MDC and the seniors said they could that would help us. MDC you know
in looking at what their proposed budget was that $3,000 that they were looking
at for a contract grant writer my assumption is, is that’s the market for that type of
thing. If we pay the membership for SAGE and those two main entities have the
ability to use them and gain some advantage or gain some opportunity because
of our participation in that great. Next year, we spend four months arguing over it
and we can’t really identify that it really has benefited those things we won’t join
them again. I think it’s a one-time shot. It’s still again, marketable for what it
appears it would cost to hire a grant writer. We would actually get more bank for
our buck with SAGE than just hiring a grant writer for one project that MDC is
hoping to do they would have the opportunity to use them for multiple projects.
Again, it’s a one time shot for me. I have no particular other affections for SAGE
other than I think they might benefit our folks so we’ll give it a shot.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I would agree with those sediments. Actually, we identified one more
project that SAGE could help and that’s the pathway or the bridge for the parks.
I would hope that all of these entities do take advantage of it and understand that
this is a one shot thing and they have to utilize their services because that’s what
we’re doing it for.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I would agree with joining them for a one-time shot. I think the biggest
thing I had against them was when they billed us for expecting us to join it then
before we even knew anything about it. It’s just a one-time shot and it might be
very successful. I understand why Caldwell and Garden City have very good
success with it. They happen to have the type of housing and stuff that falls into
SAGE’s category real easy and we don’t. Hopefully not to be sounding big or
anything like that but hopefully we don’t have to in Meridian. If the Senior Center
can use it then like Tammy said, the parks now we can use that on the pathway,
the bridge, and MDC can use it. For $2,500 I say let’s, give it a shot.
Corrie: Okay we’ll give it a shot.
McCandless: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. McCandless.
McCandless: I have been very opposed to SAGE membership but listening to – I
think the thing that convinced me that we ought to at least try them was the fact
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that MDC had $3,000 in there for grant writing alone. I’m willing to go and try it
this year. By golly, if they don’t come through I’m going to be totally against it
next year.
Bird: Well and I think you’ll have all of us.
Nary: Mr. Mayor if I could just add one more thing. I think the other thing is that
if it is successful that may be a portion of the contributions at the Senior Center
next year. Then maybe a portion of the MDC contributions as for that
membership and it won’t be (inaudible). It will be incorporated in their
contributions if it is successful. If it isn’t I don’t think we’ll have any question that
everybody else would feel the same way.
Kilchenmann: Mayor and Members of the Council an answer to the street
lighting. It’s kind of what I thought it would be no you cannot move that to an
enterprise fund. It’s considered a fund of general government. When we switch
– so we can move it to Planning and Zoning / Building that we currently call
special services. Actually, under Gasby 34 those special services although
we’ve tagged it and called it special services fund they’ll actually be combined
with the general fund and they’ll be just expenses of general government.
Corrie: Okay.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Stacy you were going to call Deputy Chief Johnson about the frame the
fire engine.
Kilchenmann: He’s out of town. Kenny doesn’t answer his cell phone but this is
the information I got from Greta. She said there will be if we go right to date,
they’ve spent $9,000. She said the nine Firefighters are going to go to training in
August the nine new Firefighters. They will start their training in August. She
was adamantly for not decreasing it. She said we have a 30 percent increase in
staff because of the new nine Firefighters. She did not know the cost for the
training the nine are going to go to. I think it’s like for basic training.
Nary: Mr. Mayor but that’s in this budget year so this is next budget year why
would they need another $34,000 next year.
Kilchenmann: I don’t know. I just could not get a hold of any of them.
Nary: That’s going to get phased out of this one so now we have continuing
budgets. Being their history (inaudible).
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De Weerd: I do know it is a higher priority. It is identified in the strategic plan. I
do know it has come up in our discussions that a higher priority needs to be
placed on training. It certainly can be one of those negotiable points too that we
can say to the table that this is our commitment to training. Training is an issue.
You know I guess even when we discussed this earlier the additional nine
employees do add a significant increase. I would propose leaving it there and
revisiting it next year when we can know what the playing field is.
Kilchenmann: Yes she’s trying to page Kenny but she said there’s a structure
fire somewhere.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess since we’re in general administration and maybe this is
something that we can come back and address after we’ve looked at some of the
benefits and merit issues. We have the City Hall issue. We have paving of a
parking lot over by the Centennial Park and we have the citywide appreciation
type of function. I guess that does get into an employee merit or benefit is how
we do our appreciation and is Christmas the time to do it when each department
seems to already be doing their own thing. The question is do we continue to do
the Christmas Party and I think you’ve had some discussions already Mayor with
some of the employees about that. Also, I would like a specific line item for the
volunteer barbeque. I know we just happened to do that out of the City Clerk’s
budget wherever he could fit it or wherever we could fit that. I think our
volunteers are extremely important to our city and having a specific recognition of
a line item would be an appropriate thing. I would also like to propose, maybe
during this time of a budget year it’s not the appropriate time, and since I will not
be City Council President next year, I have no personal gain for this. The City
Council President does have an increase amount of time commitment and
anyone stepping into it that you may want to think of some form of
compensation. I know it’s been done in the past where they get a little bit more
than the other Council Members. I would like to just put that on table for
discussion as well. I know I just added a whole list for your consideration or
discussion but those are items that have been pending. We’ve talked about
many of them, I’ve talked independently with the other Council Members on the
Council President position, and I think there’s a feeling that that’s worth
discussion.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Yes you’ve brought up a bunch of different issues. On the City Hall one,
first I guess we do need to keep our eye on how we do that. I think whether it’s a
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study whether it’s something if we don’t set money aside for that it’s never going
to happen. I think there are probably some people who doesn’t think it’s ever
going to happen anyway but I think we need to have – we need to fund that. We
need to have that money and then not just turn around and reallocate it
somewhere else. On the employee incentives and the like again, I’m really
(inaudible) I think if anything could transition from a winter activity to a summer
activity it might take a little bit of a push to do that. I think as I’ve stated before I
think it’s a good opportunity to support our local business and look at the cost of
holding an event at Roaring Springs. A lot of employees could bring their
families to something like that. The winter function is nice but it’s fairly a small
attendance and a fairly limited attendance is the people that can come. For that
kind of activity, you have to get a sitter and you have a lot of other needs. One of
the things that we’ve done with Boise that we haven’t really talked about here but
if having some of these employee things like a summer picnic at Roaring Springs
or something like that we could certainly invite the volunteers to participate in that
activity as well. At least for Boise, we’ve always had employees contribute a
portion to the cost a fairly minimal amount two to five dollars per person. Most of
the reason that the cost was passed on was to just assure people to attend it. If
they paid, two or three dollars to come you’re going to come. If you make it,
three you’ll have no idea how many people are going to show up until they get
there. It’s a way to get a head count essentially up front and a fairly minimal cost
to offset a little bit of the cost of food or something else. I think we do need to
have something like that. I think that it would be better attended and a better
opportunity. Again, it changes a little bit of how we do things. I don’t necessarily
think you want to do that for the rest of your life but if in a couple of years you
want to do something different again I think it provides some variety of activities
for the employees. On the issue of the Council President, I agree with Council
Member de Weerd. I think it’s warranted because I think there are
responsibilities for the Council President that take up a little extra time, take a
little more time. I don’t think you can good faith do that though until we address
the employee compensation. I think we have to address that first showing no
way any of us could sit up here and say we’re going to give the Council President
another $150 a month or $100 a month or whatever it is and everybody else
gets (inaudible) you can’t do that. You can’t do that but I think once we’ve
addressed the employee compensation I don’t think it’s unreasonable to
compensate the Council President given the additional time that’s taken and all
the multiple needs (inaudible).
De Weerd: City Hall.
Nary: Oh yes I said that works.
De Weerd: And saving for that parking lot.
Nary: Oh and that’s another one I think there maybe some up front costs and
hopefully that’s another thing either a lot more maintenance could be done by the
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end of the MDC. Whether we do the up front paying on then the ongoing
maintenance is eventually done through their program.
De Weerd: I think that’s –
Nary: (Inaudible). Right we have to do it now but –
De Weerd: We have to do the up front with the MDC could maintain it after this
first year.
Corrie: I’m going to call ZGA and find out what an update on our feasibility study
what we need for the City Hall. Find out how much it’s going to cost.
Bird: We’ve got money every year. I think we got one even now for City Hall for
the update. We’ve had a couple of free updates on it but I think you’re right
Mayor we need to get another update.
Corrie: Do we have money in the budget right now for updates on City Hall?
Kilchenmann: I would have to go through and look at everything now that we
have two members. I think we will not need to hold back as much as we
originally planned on but I need to look at June.
Cunningham: Another thing we have is the actual (inaudible).
Kilchenmann: Oh okay that’s right we’ve already moved them.
De Weerd: We had the part time employee for parks for –
Kilchenmann: We’re talking about – we went back to the current year. That’s
right. You would still have about almost $30,000.
Corrie: So we can get that update –
De Weerd: Yes, it would be good to get it in this budget year. Then what if Mr.
Mayor when we talk to my – after we get this study update what would be the
next step and if that has cost associated with it?
Kilchenmann: You know the other thing you could do is you could budget some
out of the capital improvement fund because that’s what that’s for. The Building
Department – we keep putting a good amount of money into that every year.
Corrie: I don’t think this feasibility update is going to be a lot. I think it would be
good to know (inaudible).
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De Weerd: Yes whatever cost associated with City Hall could be taken out of it
for next year. Let’s do what we can to absorb the cost this year if at all possible.
Corrie: I would like to see the MDC get involved with this because they can
really borrow the money and help us out because it’s always a process concern.
I’ll find out what the cost of the update is for this year.
Cunningham: What do you guys think about moving the (inaudible).
De Weerd: Personally, I think that would be an appropriate move.
McCandless: I do too.
De Weerd: I still would like the supervision of it from Will since he has
traditionally done that. He oversees a lot of the functions in Planning and Zoning
anyway so it still would be an appropriate fit. That’s just my personal opinion.
Corrie: We can still do it.
Kilchenmann: Yes, where it’s funded it’s different –
Corrie: Different funding but they still have the accountability.
De Weerd: Do the other people want to do it that way.
McCandless: I agree.
Bird: I agree with that.
Corrie: It would still be under (inaudible) scrutiny there.
De Weerd: Okay so what’s the damage?
Cunningham: (Inaudible).
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council Members)
De Weerd: I guess we could add that police officers back in to the original
request.
Nary: You still have the employee compensation that’s –
Bird: Yes I was going to say you still have the employee compensation.
Corrie: You’ve got 73 percent averaged.
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De Weerd: Averaged out.
Cunningham: Are you guys ready to talk about compensation?
Corrie: Because I think they are okay with that police starting three months later
so that’s all right.
Kilchenmann: But it’s kind of six months (inaudible).
Cunningham: At first we came up with the merit increase you know the percent,
which actually gave the police their STEP plan, is already budgeted in. Then the
merit is actually just on the other employees based on midpoint. I have 135
percent including – actually including 10 percent. Then we had a flat two percent
that Pauline started talking about so she said she was going to recommend a
two percent increase just on the actual gross wages. That included police and
fire and taking out the STEP plan. Then also the Mayor mentioned three percent
so I did a three percent scenario on the general fund only. Three percent would
cost us $135,000 no STEP increases for police.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: Okay I’m sorry I’m going to have to work through my mind process.
The two percent there –
Cunningham: The merit.
De Weerd: The $74,000 that would include the STEP increases for the police
but not give them a merit as well.
Cunningham: No police they actually their STEP is their –
De Weerd: They would get their STEP and then across the rest there would be a
two percent average merit.
Cunningham: It would be a two percent pool right on their actual midpoint.
De Weerd: Okay.
Cunningham: So on the two percent too then if you go with merit that also
means the employee wouldn’t get their raise until their anniversary date. It
wouldn’t come into effect October 1st
.
Kilchenmann: So a two percent would be the upper end of that so most people
wouldn’t get anything.
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Cunningham: I know Pauline didn’t want a two percent merit.
De Weerd: You know I am like Councilman Nary. I like the merit because you
recognize employees that are performing.
Kilchenmann: The only thing is the way we do it is it’s on your midpoint so she
has this matrix of two percent is like for the highest achieving employee and we
usually only have like this year we only had two people that got that. The
confident employees get zero percent. Maybe I should get her in here so she
can –
Nary: No that’s fine.
Cunningham: I did a scenario too on wages. I took some various positions with
some different types of insurance options so we looked at a Well Tech he’s a
BCT, which is a traditional family. I looked at his pay for September 30th
he’s at
$1,809 net. Then if we went with Option 1 the insurance plan his nets going to
go down to $1,798 and Option 2 it will go down to $1,687. If we give him a two
percent merit increase then his pay would go up on the net if we don’t change his
insurance or if we go to Option 1, he’s going to get less of an increase. If he
goes to Option 2, he’ll actually net out less than what he did in September. Then
we have to remember too these insurance changes don’t happen until January.
Anybody that was on a PPO so the BCP’s you’ll see the PPO’s at a two percent
they still get an increase even if their on Option 2. If you come down to anybody
on traditional, the two percent won’t cover their insurance increase. Then it
depended –
De Weerd: Which is still a choice. That’s still their choice.
Cunningham: It is a choice right. Then if you look at say that Department
Specialist if you give them – in January is actually when they’re going to see the
insurance increase but they would not see a merit increase until April. It means
they would have four months where their pay would actually decrease before the
two percent would come in if they actually received a high enough evaluation to
get a raise.
De Weerd: Can you show a scenario Reta, where their out of pocket remains
the same as it is now with the Option 2.
Cunningham: Well it would mean that the city is going to have to absorb the
cost.
De Weerd: And how much would that cost the city.
Cunningham: It’s going to cost an extra $50,000.
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De Weerd: Okay because I would like to at least protect their out of pocket
expenses for their benefits. If we go to Option 2 at least that way they have a
choice but we’re protecting their out of pocket expenses. Then we can look at
their merit. At least we’re starting at where they are today and then looking
forward.
Cunningham: Okay for general fund it will cost well it’s an extra $48,000.
De Weerd: An extra $48,000.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Cunningham: Because what we did is we have budgeted for general fund
insurance $915,000 but if we’re going to take – we’re going to have an increase
of 34 percent and if we don’t want to increase the employees’ contribution we’ll
need 963. That difference is $48,000.
De Weerd: And we still want to show that as an increase like Boise did. They
said you know the Boise employees got a 2.5 increase because they’re covering
that out of pocket expense. I do want that to be aware. Everyone knows well
Boise got a two and a half percent increase well not in their wages but yes, they
did overall because now it’s not coming out of their pocket. I think that’s an
important factor to communicate.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess to me really realistically as difficult as it is I think the only thing that
we really can’t afford to do at the moment is to assure the employees that they’re
not going to lose pay. The merit – I don’t want to get behind the curve on the
merit stuff but I don’t think we really have the dollars at this juncture to give it. I
think we’ll have to revisit the merit side of the equation. I think the only thing that
we can really do is just make sure they’re not going to cost them more money
come October 1st
.
Bird: Out of pocket.
Nary: Out of pocket. Whether that’s done through a flat across the board that
sounded like that was the only real way to accomplish that at this juncture was a
flat across the board rate that they have for everybody so they don’t have – I
know there is some loss of incentive when you don’t have merit. We’ve in Boise
we’ve experienced that a couple of times in the last five years but something’s
got to give and that’s at least the assurance the employee can have is that
they’re not going to lose money. Then we’ll have to readdress the merit issue
later.
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De Weerd: So are you suggesting that we do the extra needed to no increase to
the employee on the benefits the $48,000 and then a flat two percent.
Nary: No, I thought the flat two percent covered that $48,000. I guess I thought
– that’s what I thought Pauline said earlier was that either the two or two and a
half if we wanted to kind of split the difference there. If we had just two and half
across the board for everybody that would cover, their increased medical cost
and then that’s about it. For some people it would probably be a – it would
actually be a little bit more money for – it wouldn’t be any less money for
anybody.
Corrie: Would that be about an 82 percent 82 plus – and 13 on the other end.
We talked about that before rather than 80, 20 it would be 8317 is that what it
would figure at?
Cunningham: Right.
Corrie: Okay so they’re getting a benefit and not having any more money taken
out of their paycheck. Yet, they’re still saving that money as far as the benefits
are concerned in giving them the same thing. Is that long-term care included in
that budget?
Cunningham: No.
Corrie: It wasn’t okay.
Nary: And then I think on the other side is that like I said earlier if we’re going to
do that then we need to take a portion of the money that’s remaining and pool
that. Then between finance and HR coming back in at their meeting discuss it
with Department Heads what other things we can do for employee incentive.
Whether it’s flextime, which is a no cost but a management issue versus a
summer activity. Whether it’s bonus, money or things of that nature don’t use
that word bonus Jonathan. Something like that to provide employee incentive
but I think we need to take a portion of that money and set it aside so the
employees know we’re still committed to employee moral and employee
incentives we just don’t know what it is yet. We’re going to set money aside so
we know it’s there so that when they finish that staff work to decide what would
work the best for the different departments and how to accomplish it and
administer it then the money will be available. We’re not just totally just cutting
their benefits off or pay off but we’re saying we’re going to put it in a different
way.
Corrie: Like that working with the time off.
Nary: Right.
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Kilchenmann: We also like you had said we could look at it in January so we can
see if interest rates improved or (inaudible). If our income (inaudible).
Bird: Yes.
Corrie: I think it will but that’s just a crystal ball guesstimate. I hope I’m right in
more ways than one.
De Weerd: Well and we just need to make a real commitment at this point at this
juncture to revisit it in January and make sure the employees know that we will.
That we appreciate them we just don’t know the financial picture at this point.
Nary: Then like I said the staff work just going to get done between now and
then between finance, HR, and the Department Heads is coming up with those
alternatives. I think that again, shows our commitment to doing it is we have the
money available and we’ve asked for that type of work to be done ahead of time.
De Weerd: So the recommendation is a flat two percent.
Nary: Two or two and a half. I don’t know –
Corrie: Whichever one –
Nary: -- so that we can make sure to cover it the best. You had a two and a
three so I was just trying to make it more complicated by –
Cunningham: The two percent would cover everything traditional.
Bird: Everything but what?
Cunningham: Except for those employees that wish to stay with traditional.
Bird: Well that’s there choice I guess.
Nary: I think that’s their choice too.
Corrie: I think you’ll see a lot of change real quick.
Bird: Just make sure that we don’t get – we’re not costing them money out of
their pocket. That’s my main concern.
Corrie: We are but that’s there choice.
Bird: On that part but I mean if you go to the PPO and it’s not going to cost –
De Weerd: Do you want to address that issue with the STEP?
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Nary: Does that include the STEP Program or is that – the two percent is for
everybody.
Bird: The two percent was for everybody.
Nary: So there’s not a STEP Program.
Cunningham: Well wait (inaudible).
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council Members)
Nary: I didn’t think it included the STEP I thought that was for everybody.
Corrie: Everybody but?
Nary: Well I thought the two percent included everybody. Police, fire everybody
there’s no merit there’s no nothing there’s just two percent to cover everybody’s
increase medical expense.
Bird: Then we will take a look at the merit stuff.
Cunningham: We also have that discussion about the Seargent adjustment in
the Police Department.
Nary: Seargents and Lieutenants wasn’t it?
Cunningham: And Lieutenants. We need $12,000. We don’t need to discuss it
you need to discuss it.
Corrie: Will did you have something?
Berg: Yes Mr. Mayor I was just going to emphasize something that the Benefit
Committee has done for the last couple of years is tried to make a little bit more
of a concern to the employees that they will have to pay for some of these
increases in our insurance. Last year we went to a 20 percent, 80 percent type
of thing so we’re trying to make it more important that the cost of insurance it has
to be somewhat accepted by the employees to pay their share or a share and
they can control sometimes the increased premiums. I think the Benefit
Committee has tried to somewhat make a plan to do that. Not to do it all at once
but to make those little steps that they have to realize insurance is not an easy
thing anymore. It’s not just a flat rate from year to year it’s an experience rating
for us. Differences in benefits may have to happen. We may not have as good
of luxury to have all the benefits that we have in the past or make it more
optional for them to pick and choose. Hopefully, they’ve kind of gathered that
over the last couple of years.
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Corrie: So what is the bottom line that we’re looking at right now?
Cunningham: Actually I typed in a wrong percent so it’s $221,567 excess.
Nary: That’s with the two percent.
Cunningham: With the two percent.
Corrie: With the two percent we’re that much ahead so we can put that into
incentives that Bill was talking about.
Nary: Not all of it necessarily. That would be nice. A part of that incentive I think
also in the work from HR and Finance is that department incentive of saving their
savings being going back to their employees also went to incentives.
Kilchenmann: We can also look at giving a merit with that.
Nary: I have one more thing on the Seargents and Lieutenants you know I
guess I don’t look at that the same as a raise in my mind. I think that is trying to
keep them status quo with the market for them. To me it isn’t the same thing. I
think we needed to do that adjustment just to keep them in line and again it puts
them in really the same boat, as everyone else is all it is. I don’t have a big
heartburn with that $11,000, $12,000 whatever the number was to keep them
just in STEP. Then they’re still looking at the two percent as the same across the
board for all of us.
Corrie: I will talk to the Department Heads too about this incentive of having
maybe a three-day Friday, Saturday, and Sunday for some at one time. They
move it to – well it’s going to be a little bit of work for the Department Heads and
the people there but maybe the employees would also look at it as a benefit that
they would possibly one week out of the month they have a three day holiday.
We can work on that with them and I think that is a pretty good deal without
costing us any money technically. Pauline do you have something?
Skeggs: Well I was just going to add to Council Member Nary’s comment as far
as the police. That’s just going to put them back in alignment with their program.
At the time that we implemented the program, there was a difference between
STEP’s from police officer to detective to Seargent where it was 10 percent. We
condensed those from Seargent to Lieutenant to five percent because we had
those individuals were already above their range so it wouldn’t be an impact.
Since Chief Worley reorganized his department and he’s promoted some
employees up to Seargent’s and restructured the Lieutenants position it now
does impact. It only impacts eight employees.
Bird: Yes this has got to be taken care of.
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De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess my reluctance to not just making sure there’s no out of
pocket expenses and absorbing it into the benefits and maybe giving a slight flat
increase of one percent or something is that that’s taxed money. The benefits of
maintaining – I just don’t know if you figure in if they’re really breaking even when
you consider they’re paying taxes on the flat two percent increase. As a tax
preparer I always kind of look at tax implications and those things you know you
still are affecting the out of pocket and the bottom line.
Skeggs: Well Councilwoman de Weerd if they’re doing the pre-tax for their
benefits for their health insurance and flex plan that’s pre-taxed so it’s coming
out on a pre-tax basis.
De Weerd: But how many people do you have doing that?
Skeggs: A majority of the employees are doing the pre-tax. We have a few
employees that this year we’re going to encourage them to do the pre-tax as well
because they actually get an increase in their paycheck. They’re giving
themselves a pay raise by doing that. We had the employees that were left last
year when the other employees had converted who hadn’t done it the previous
year because you can only do it during open enrollment came and asked us I
want to do that. I didn’t realize I would get more money in our paycheck. We
said unfortunately we only have open enrollment once a year so this year when it
comes up again we’ll remind you. We have several employees that didn’t do it
that want to do it this year because they can actually give themselves a pay
increase because it’s on a pre-tax basis.
Kilchenmann: So it’s a choice.
De Weerd: As far as I knew the participation and that was a couple of years ago,
it wasn’t very high.
Corrie: It’s increased.
De Weerd: It looks like it caught on?
Skeggs: Right the first year it’s always new people are apprehensive then the
next year it catches on and more people enroll. Last year we talked to every
single person that didn’t do the pre-tax and explained it and we had several
employees switch over. Then those employees that were still apprehensive once
their fellow co-workers switched over then they were telling them wow, she’s right
I did get more in my paycheck we got a lot of calls.
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Nary: And it’s free money.
Skeggs: It is it’s free money.
Nary: It’s really free money and the plus side too for the employees is the fixed
cost ones are easy. It’s the guesstimate of how much you’re going to use at the
doctor and how much you’re going to have. The fixed amount to pay your
premium that’s easy. That’s an easy one so you can figure that exactly. It’s like
free money to you.
(Inaudible discussion among Council Members)
Kilchenmann: Could you guys take a five minute break while she fixes the –
Corrie: Yes I was going to say you’re moving figures around there faster than I
can see them. I’m getting confused. Let’s take a five-minute break.
(Return at 11:44 A.M.)
Corrie: Okay we’re coming back from recess.
De Weerd: What was that?
Nary: This sound system just doesn’t work very well. Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: The bottom line up there looks a whole lot better at the moment. You had
mentioned I think Stacy about setting aside some of the capital improvement
project fund towards the city hall thing. I don’t think we’ve done that yet or were
we –
Kilchenmann: We haven’t done that yet.
Nary: Is that my – I mean that certainly makes sense to me.
Bird: I think we ought to throw $50,000 at least at it.
De Weerd: Throw what of what?
Bird: $50,000 for the city hall.
Nary: The city hall issue.
De Weerd: City hall.
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Corrie: You’re awful loose for that throw.
Nary: Does that come out of that 301 or is that –
De Weerd: How about dedicate. I think we need to dedicate it.
Nary: That doesn’t come out of the 301.
Kilchenmann: If you did it out of the capital improvement fund it wouldn’t come
out of the 301.
Bird: What?
Nary: It wouldn’t come out of that 301 if we did it out of the capital improvement
plan.
Bird: No but it would affect the bottom line on that 301.
Cunningham: No.
Kilchenmann: No it wouldn’t.
Bird: Oh it wouldn’t?
Nary: Different fund.
Bird: (Inaudible) you’re going out of capital.
Nary: Right but that makes sense because that’s what it’s for.
Bird: You can go out of capital.
Nary: Do you think $50,000 is adequate?
Bird: I think $50,000 to start yes because if you – regardless you’re going to
have to finance it and that’s all the money you’re going to have anyway from the
city that you can use out of the city. You could use $50,000 out of the city and
then your financing would take care of everything else.
Nary: Sure.
Cunningham: I’m just going to make note down here so $50,000?
Nary: I think that’s fine.
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Cunningham: Then also we were discussing whether there was going to be a
three percent merit or three percent flat?
Nary: Well I thought we had said two percent flat.
Corrie: Two percent flat but we just wanted to look at what a three percent flat
would look like. What the bottom line comes out at.
Cunningham: Because a three percent flat will be another 23, $24,000.
Nary: So move that other one down to $276.
Bird: That should be fine.
Cunningham: Also another point is if we do the merit those employees that have
their salaries frozen or above the STEP, they actually won’t get any kind of an
increase. Then they would have the change in the benefits so their net pay
would go down.
Nary: But if we did the flat wouldn’t that be for – that would mean everybody.
Cunningham: A flat means everybody regardless of where they are in the –
Bird: In the STEP and everything.
De Weerd: Yes we need to.
Corrie: So if you went to three then that bottom line would be $277,000?
Cunningham: Yes.
Corrie: I guess I just wanted to know what your bottom line – what you ended up
with.
Nary: At least from what I had heard initially and for looking at this very lean the
two percent from what we’ve been talking about a lot the two percent would
cover everybody’s extra cost not including those that chose the traditional plan.
To me, that makes the most sense. We’re trying to figure out what’s the leanest
way to do this without hurting people’s pocket book. The two percent does that.
That gives us a larger bottom line at the moment. I don’t think we had a lot of
things left to discuss other than the truck I think for the Park’s Department. We
said we would at least talk about it once we got past compensation.
Corrie: And the paving maintenance.
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Nary: And the paving. Then it would give us a fairly large number or at least an
adequate number to set aside for both the merit –
***End Of Side Four***
Nary: -- all the money so we could have some of the money allocated for some
future things some reserve. I guess I don’t have a problem with the two percent.
I think it holds in line with what we’ve been talking about of making sure there
isn’t a bottom line hit to the employees then we’ll have some money available to
be able to revisit it.
Bird: I can go along with that. On the park truck, I don’t know. That’s – I just
see so much stuff bought down there that’s not used 100 percent of the time and
it just – that has been my bugaboo and on that whole department ever since day
one. They run out and buy something they think they need and they use it for
one week then it gets parked for 51 weeks do you know what I mean?
Nary: Right.
Bird: If we’re not going to put the hours on them then I don’t think we need it.
McCandless: I think we can get along without that truck this year.
Bird: I have to agree with you. I’m glad I wasn’t originally but the more I think
about it the more I think of the waste of equipment. It’s just like that sprayer I
don’t know how much we’ve got in that sprayer down there but – and we budget
it every year and it’s not being used right. I don’t think they’re the only
department. We’ve got – I think the water and Wastewater needs to be – all of
their equipment needs to be looked at. You have two mules out at the
Wastewater Plant because two guys don’t like sharing one.
Nary: Well Mr. Mayor I wasn’t advocated for it we just said we would come back
to it once we got done with the conversation. I’m with you. I don’t really see the
need. There may be a better identifiable need next year and I just I think right
now it still would be more out of line of what we have been talking about of really
trying to be very need based. I don’t see that as a need yet.
McCandless: And I think by next year the interest rates will have gone up again.
They’re starting up again now so we’re going to have a little –
Bird: Well I think that there are just a lot of things that we need in our purchasing
and stuff. Like I said earlier, everything including computers and everything else
we need to be more approval on when we’re purchasing it. There needs to be a
need for it. A real need not just a want.
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De Weerd: Well and I think our IT person is really keeping an eye on that. If one
person doesn’t need the computer he or needs an upgrade like an engineering
that other computer can be dedicated to another department that – if you have
one person kind of overseeing that you have at least someone coordinating that
effort. I would like to ask for an increase in fire of the clothing expense to
$27,000 up from the 23.
Corrie: Clothing what?
Bird: Clothing expense?
De Weerd: The clothing expense.
Bird: Why do they need more in their clothing? Why?
De Weerd: I’ll give you a print out if you would like me to.
Bird: I want to see some proof. I tell you –
McCandless: You wanted to increase it to what Tammy?
De Weerd: To $27,000. That doesn’t mean it’s going to be used.
Corrie: Yes it will.
Bird: It will be used.
Corrie: You put it down whether it’s going to be used or not because they will
come back and use it. They really will.
De Weerd: We have nine Firefighters that we’re adding on.
Bird: How much are we allowing per person per year?
Cunningham: $650 for firemen.
Bird: $650 is that what the contract says.
Cunningham: Yes police are $600.
Nary: So Mr. Mayor is the $23,000 reflecting the new nine Firefighters?
Cunningham: Yes.
Nary: So why do we need that again?
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Corrie: That’s actually at $2300 isn’t it?
Nary: $23,000.
Corrie: I have it at $23,100.
Nary: Yes $23,100. If that includes the contracted amount for all the employees
including the new additions, why would we need to increase it more?
De Weerd: Just a buffer.
Nary: Was I unclear?
De Weerd: No.
Skeggs: Councilman Nary from what I know during the negotiations that in the
fire rules and regulation book that just got approved that Kenny has requested
that the Firefighters do not work – they have to have Meridian logos on their
workout clothes. They have to have collared shirts and the Meridian logo when
they’re there just at the fire station whether they don’t go on calls. These are
additional expenses for them for clothing allowance above and beyond the
regular fire uniform. I don’t know the specifics of that. Kenny would be one to
probably better answer that. Because of that that’s why they’re asking for more.
Like if they were working out and they got called to a car fire or something and
they rush out to help them or an EMT call and they may be wearing these T-
shirts with not so good language or stuff on them. He wants them to wear work
out clothes that has the Meridian logo on it. Also, when they’re there in the fire
station to have collared shirts. They put it in the rules and regulation book as
that’s what was explained to us right Tammy when we were in the negotiations
last time. That’s about all I know and that’s why they were asking for more
because if they’re going to have to spend money on that that’s going to take
away from their standard fire uniform as well and replacements for those.
De Weerd: How about $25,000.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary. I’m confused here.
Nary: I don’t get it yes I don’t get that. Do they show up at fires dressed in T-
shirts and shorts?
Skeggs: I’m not sure how that works.
Nary: I don’t get that. They already have T-shirts that they buy and the already
have pants that they buy.
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Skeggs: I’m not sure how that works Kenny didn’t explain it.
Bird: They do have shirts and shorts and they have the logo on it and
everything. Yes, that’s what they usually put on underneath and then they put
their turnouts on top of them. It’s nothing unstandard. As a rule in a policy, if
they’re wearing what I understand is they’re wearing T-shirts that has crappy
sayings on them. I had that problem too at work but you know what I did? If
they come in with them, they went home and didn’t get paid. If you can’t respect
yourself and wear something decent if you have to have these stupid sayings on
these T-shirts then you have no business being there or being an employee.
De Weerd: But Keith that wasn’t a decision – that was a decision that the
department made.
Bird: That’s fine that’s a rule. That’s a rule Tammy and we don’t have to replace
their uniforms. They get their standard uniform, which is what it should be. If
they want to work out in a decent blue gym suit or something like that, they can
work out in a decent gym suit. Now if they want to wear those crappy things that
have all these great sayings across them then they don’t need to be at our
station in our city.
De Weerd: Okay well do you want to negotiate?
Bird: No you don’t want me to.
De Weerd: What’s your counter offer?
Nary: I guess their bottom line is is they –
Bird: We’re not having it anymore.
Nary: And the bottom line is they have a clothing allowance and that’s what they
contract for. That’s what they have to deal with. If they want more then they
have to negotiate for more but I don’t see a reason to fund it just so they cannot
have to wear shirts that have inappropriate logos on them. They already have
money to buy shirts with and they need to set a policy that says this is what you
wear when you come to work.
McCandless: Yes I agree.
Corrie: They want to have boots every year and it’s not needed.
Bird: That’s right Bob. Those boots last two and three years. How often do you
have to buy a dress uniform?
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Corrie: Most of them have them anyway.
De Weerd: It depends on whom you’re asking.
Bird: Well yes me too. I kind of shouldn’t say anything.
Corrie: You have to keep your old stuff in case you get back.
Nary: If they want more money then let’s make the seminars and training a little
less. Otherwise, I think just leave it the way it is.
Corrie: Yes you can move that back and forth. If they want more, for one thing
they have to take it from another.
De Weerd: Okay well let’s take two out of that and move it to clothing. $2,000
out of training and move it to clothing.
Corrie: Let’s see what we have for training.
Nary: That was the one where we discussed on the seminars and training and
all that Greta indicated was that there are nine additional Firefighters that are
going to training in August. That’s this budget year. As Council Member de
Weerd pointed out with nine additional Firefighters, there may be an increase
cost we just don’t know what it is. I don’t care if we want to take $2,000 out of
that base –
De Weerd: Let’s rob Peter to pay Paul.
Nary: -- and put it into the clothing.
Bird: Let me tell me what you’re doing you’re just cutting your hands off at
negotiations. You’re already giving them $2,000 more for uniforms they know
they’ve got that because you budgeted it.
Nary: Right.
Bird: So you have no negotiations. I wouldn’t put another penny in there in fact I
would take some out and then let them negotiate. Then we can trade off some.
If they want an extra $50 or they want an extra, this then they can give us
something back.
Nary: I think that makes perfect sense.
McCandless: Yes me too.
De Weerd: Okay you guys go walk in that door.
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July 18, 2003
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Corrie: I will.
Bird: That’s what you get the money for.
De Weerd: The same money you get.
Kilchenmann: For our purposes right now we really don’t need to do the line
items that are already within the budget.
Corrie: I think they have enough as it is.
Nary: But I think the bottom line is I think Council Member Bird is right. I think if
we fund it they’ll know it’s there, we won’t be able to stop them now we’re not
going to do it – he already funded anyway. We can move it around if we need to.
Bird: We have Tammy over the barrel she can’t do a thing. They’ve already
funded it an extra $2,000.
De Weerd: That’s a pretty site.
Bird: Don’t kid yourself Tammy they’ll do it to you. They’ll get you in the back if
you add that in the funding.
De Weerd: Okay did you put in something for paving that parking lot?
Cunningham: No how much do you guys want in there?
Bird: Well I don’t know we have to figure out how much we need. Do you
remember what the other one was Will or Bob? Do either one of you guys
remember?
De Weerd: The one on Pine Street the actual cost not the cost of the land was
around $36,000. Now Broadway was more but I think they had some issues with
that one.
Bird: Oh Broadway they had a problem down here.
De Weerd: The one on Pine was $36,000.
Bird: And how many years ago was that Tammy?
De Weerd: That was in ’98.
Bird: I would put at least $40,000 in that.
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McCandless: I was going to say today it would run $40,000.
De Weerd: $40,000 then.
Corrie: If you get a good bid yes.
Bird: Yes we’ll have to go out and see if we can’t get some better bids.
Corrie: See how hungry they are. Probably $40,000 at least put it in there.
De Weerd: $45,000.
Bird: Probably yes.
Nary: Yes, because you’re going to have some design costs too aren’t you?
Bird: Definitely yes.
Corrie: I can design it for nothing.
Nary: You get what you pay for.
De Weerd: What Will and I were thinking was that we could use at least some of
the same information that we have from the Pine Street. They will have to go out
and do the surveying and that sort of thing.
Bird: And you’ll still have to have drawn up plans.
De Weerd: But let’s just do $45,000 it doesn’t mean we have to spend it.
Nary: And if it costs a lot more than that we may have to wait a little bit or –
Bird: We might have to come back and revisit it.
De Weerd: Or we can take it to Council and you can figure it out then. Okay so
$45,000.
Cunningham: Also we were talking about the flat increase versus the merit then
we brought up another point. If you actually do the increase say October 1st
then
all the employees are going to see a raise. Then we do the benefit change
January 1st
then they’re going to see a decrease. You may want to look at
making the raises effective in January.
McCandless: Yes I agree with that.
Corrie: It makes sense. It won’t affect anybody up here.
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July 18, 2003
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De Weerd: Yes, you’ll get less. If you get insurance you’ll get less out of your
paycheck.
Corrie: Well I’m going to go to PPO so it won’t make any difference.
Cunningham: Even the PPO there will be a change.
Corrie: What?
Cunningham: The employee contribution will change for everybody.
Nary: Well that makes sense.
Kilchenmann: I’m not – we’re lost a little bit on what we’re doing. Have we not
decided what we’re doing with the compensation? We’re sort of lost on what’s
happening with the compensation. Are you still in the process of deciding that?
Corrie: Not really we’re just there. We just wanted to bring to Council where
they want to put it if they have the same amount in the compensation and what
we’re doing it will stay there. We have that two percent – I’m sorry the only thing
we didn’t include was the long-term care. We didn’t need to.
Kilchenmann: So the decision has been made to do a flat two percent start
January 1st
? Is that –
Bird: Well I don’t know whether we –
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I would like – I know we’ve kind of talked at two and three. I would
like to see two and a half and effective in January.
Corrie: Would that make a difference?
De Weerd: There benefits are not affected until January and they may see just a
little slight increase.
Corrie: The only effect in the insurance will be the long-term short term and it
starts in August. That’s okay that’s the reason for the cost of savings too.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
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July 18, 2003
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Bird: Our fiscal year starts October 1st
and I know it will be a little bit for payroll to
move back around. They will see an increase and they will see a decrease in
their take home but I think that that can be explained pretty easily. I just assume
we start the pay raises October 1st
like we always have and I’m like
Councilwoman de Weerd I think the two and a half percent I think if we can give
two we can give two and a half percent hopefully and see what the bottom line
left over is. That way we do give them a tad little bit of an increase.
Corrie: If I’m not mistaken Tammy said two and a half starting in January and you
say two and a half starting in October.
Bird: In October yes.
Corrie: How much difference is that going to make if we do it in October or if we
do it in January.
Cunningham: I don’t know I have them calculated by partial year. For a full year,
you’re going to need for two and a half I think about another $31,000.
Bird: Yes and that’s – is that going to take too much out of the bottom guys?
Corrie: It’s going to take out a –
Nary: It’s going to take out a big chunk.
Bird: Whether you start in January or whether you start in October you’re going
to be – you’re affecting a full – you’re not going to affect that fiscal year. You’re
going to be three months short on that but you’re going to add three months to
the next fiscal year unless you just go for nine months.
Kilchenmann: So you’re at $289 with the 2.5 in October.
Nary: Well and this will go to an employees base so it won’t – in the next fiscal
year it will roll over anyway so it’s not going to impact differently. They’re not
going to lose it but October will roll forward.
Bird: You’re not going to lose it but it’s going to be there. Actually, can you get
that back up there again?
Cunningham: Yes the $289.
Bird: You’re $289,171 still and that’s still got the $50,000 and it’s got the $45,000
for the parking lot right?
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Nary: That’s for two and a half starting January or two and a half staring
October?
Kilchenmann: October.
Cunningham: You can do it either way but it funds it for as of October.
Bird: I don’t know I just think that if we start screwing around with our fiscal year
with these people and you’re expecting or at least you know.
Corrie: You’re going to have to explain to them what we’re doing though
because come January it’s going to change.
Bird: And as I understand, they’re pretty well up on board with the benefits. Am
I not right from what Will and you guys are telling me?
Kilchenmann: That’s correct I think the Benefits Committee has really worked at
communicating to all employees and Pauline’s done surveys to individual
employees. I think the education process is going on and the communication is
there.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess I would be in favor of the October change only because it will give
the employees the opportunities to budget themselves to figure out what they
need come January. It’s not a significant increase for three months but it will give
them that cushion to whether or not they need to readjust their financial situation
and their dollars. It’s just three months and since the bottom line isn’t going to
change a huge number, I think that’s fine.
Bird: And you’ve also got a Christmas coming through there.
Nary: Right. Like you said, they have to readjust a lot financially to figure out
how to make it work the best for their needs. Three months isn’t going to kill us.
Corrie: We’re going to see a loss and that’s what they’ll remember.
Nary: I don’t think we’re going to get a lot of thanks for doing a great job card
either way.
Kilchenmann: I actually think that they will appreciate it because there has been
talk of having no increase at all. I think that two and a half percent starting in
October will be appreciated. I appreciate it.
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Corrie: I hope they would.
Nary: One other thing we haven’t talked about on whether or not there is some
money needed. I read some article in the paper the other day about this mill levy
election.
De Weerd: Yes I read that too.
Nary: Somebody wrote some article about that. I don’t know if – we haven’t
certainly made any decision about that but I don’t know whether or not we need
to increase – we shouldn’t increase election costs. My assumption would be if
we were going to do that since we would be running an election anyway. I just
wanted to make sure if there was any necessity for increased money to advertise
and promote that if that’s what the decision is to do.
De Weerd: We can’t advertise and promote on the city dollar anyway.
Nary: That’s true you’re right.
Bird: It has to come from private.
Nary: But to inform you can advertise and inform. You can’t promote it. You can
certainly inform people as to what you’re doing. I don’t know whether or not you
need some money at least budgeted or a line item for that. Again, we’ll know
within the next couple of months if we’re going to need it. I just wouldn’t want to
end up getting to September and we make that decision, we decide to do it and
then we don’t have any way to promote it well we’re pretty much shooting
ourselves in the foot to do it if we do it that way.
Kilchenmann: We did put an extra $1,000 in the election line item on Will’s
advice.
Berg: And Mr. Mayor Members of the Council that’s because it’s going to cost us
more for the punch card and for the Ada County to count ballots.
Corrie: We are going to that though.
Berg: That was your instructions that I need to do that. They can’t tell me
exactly all the costs yet but it is a lot more expensive for the punch cards then
they have to program their computers and use their machines. There is more of
a cost. I’m just hoping to try to keep it down like you know what we’ve done in
the past in trying to keep our costs down as much as we can. Obviously if you
have another election you have to do other separate notices. It shouldn’t impact
as far as the staffing and that type of thing the polling places.
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Nary: Well for informational stuff I don’t know that we need a lot of money in a
line item for that or whether or not we have something in the Council or the
Mayor’s budget for that type of public noticing. I don’t think we need more than
$1,000.
Corrie: I think we’ve got enough.
Nary: That may already be absorbable into the budget as it is. I just like I said if
we decide to do something we certainly aren’t going to bother doing it if we don’t
have any money to at least give people notices to what it means. If it can be
absorbed in what we’ve got that’s fine.
Berg: I’ll make it work.
Corrie: I think he can.
Nary: How much of that $289,000 do we want to set aside for this reserve of
dealing with employee merit, employee compensation, employee –
Bird: Merit deal? I think we need to set a pretty good chunk aside myself
truthfully.
Nary: I do too.
De Weerd: Do you want to throw another amount at it?
Bird: Yes.
Nary: I think $200,000 –
Bird: I would go with $200,000.
Corrie: That would be less than (inaudible) look at that bottom line there and say
you’ve got money we want it. I’ve been through the negotiations last year and I
know what they’re going to say. I’m not trying to tell you how to do your job but
it’s going to come out that way.
Nary: Either two or $250,000.
Bird: I would have no –
Corrie: I agree I think so too.
Bird: I would have no problem with $250,000.
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Corrie: Because we’re still in the plus. It makes your place any stronger than
your negotiating team. If they see a lot of money in there they’re going to go
after it.
Nary: And if we put it in that for employee compensation we’re talking about all
employees not just any one particular group of employees but all employees. I
don’t have a problem in putting $250,000 and we’re still in the plus.
Bird: Reta put $250,000 in employee benefits. That could mean part of that
picnic.
Nary: Employee incentives.
Bird: Incentives whatever you want to call it. Merit and incentives maybe.
Corrie: One thing I was going to ask too is do you not – what about the
Christmas dinner compared to the summer picnic. Do you want to use it next
year, this year or not have a Christmas and have a summer next year? If we
have a summer this year, we have to think of it pretty quick.
Nary: Yes I don’t think we have time for a summer this year but I guess what I
would suggest is that we not have a Christmas party this year. I still think the
turkeys are something we should do. I think that’s a nice tradition that people
like. I don’t recall what the cost of that is or whether that’s already built in.
Corrie: It’s already in there.
Nary: That’s already built in. The turkeys and whether or not we want to
transition to a summer activity to whether or not to provide a very small amount
to the departments to be able to help offset a little of their employee costs for a
potluck, lunch or a dinner or something like that.
Bird: We can buy a ham or something for that.
Nary: Yes $100 for each department so they have something to purchase food
for their people with. Then again some more of a transition to next summer.
That’s just a thought.
Corrie: That’s good. We need to set how much the limit is and then they can go
from my office and tell them what they want to do. It’s up to them and the
Council will give them $100 or $150.
Bird: Each one of them is doing their little Christmas parties anyway and I think
that we’ve kind of outgrown our Christmas party myself personally. I would like
to try the picnics for a couple of years. I’m like Bill I think we don’t have to be a
die in the wool every year deal.
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Nary: Try it for a couple and see how it works.
Bird: We can try it for a couple of years and see how it goes. If it’s successful
we can do it a couple of more years or if we want to move back have a
Christmas party once every five years or every 10 years something like that they
can do that.
Corrie: We don’t have a regular place to have it (inaudible).
Nary: Would that be then a – what do you think on the idea of having something
for each of the departments to be able to use $100 or something like that?
Bird: Well isn’t this something we can do in this $250,000?
Nary: Sure.
Bird: This can be employee benefit.
Nary: We could also again, we could –
Bird: Or we could fine it in our own thing.
Nary: Right we could basically create a line item for the Mayor’s Office or the
Council for that holiday incentive whatever.
Bird: But we (inaudible) each throw in $1,000 for us for our liaisons. There’s
nothing wrong with $100 of that going back in we never use it.
Nary: Right. Maybe we don’t need a separate item for that it’s just something
we need to –
Corrie: Talk about.
Nary: Yes. I just want to make sure the departments know that we want –
Corrie: As long as you know about it that’s what I’m concerned about. I don’t
want no surprises of somebody from Council doesn’t know about it. The Mayor
said go ahead and vote (inaudible).
Nary: Well $100 goes for other (inaudible). Mr. Mayor Will just brought up a
good point. Some of the departments are quite a bit larger so $100 for his
department goes a lot further than $100 for the police. If we did have a –
whether it’s a line item or something else that we did so that the department if
they want to use it all they have to do is come and ask. Say we would like to do
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this could you folks fund this much and we’ll do this much something like that. I
don’t know if we need a line for it or not.
Bird: (Inaudible) $1000 or so to help them with their little potlucks.
De Weerd: To pay for meat or whatever.
Bird: Then we’ll transition next year into a picnic.
De Weerd: Yes, you’re a two-person department you can ask quite the balance.
Corrie: The guys are sharper than I am. That $100 goes a long way in that
department.
Nary: So that other $39,000?
Bird: That’s just extra.
Nary: Just set that aside for right now.
De Weerd: Well who knows what interest is going to do. It’s bottoming out. We
already are experiencing a shortfall this year. We were conservative in our
revenue estimates then so it – and I think we even went into it with a little bit of a
buffer.
Bird: We did.
De Weerd: I think it’s more than appropriate to have that for that shortfall.
Nary: Well and the other thing too is we talked about them we didn’t really
readdress is the potential cost of civil litigation issues like with the taxing on the
police station. We may need it even for those unanticipated costs. It’s probably
good to just –
Bird: It’s nice to have a little buffer there.
Berg: Well and (inaudible)
De Weerd: Can we have it in something – revenue shortfall.
Nary: We could just have it as a reserve account.
Bird: I’ll tell you what, Tammy you just hit a point $39,000 isn’t nothing to lose in
revenue.
Nary: Exactly.
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Bird: All it takes is one bad month in the sales tax, we don’t get our share, and
then we’ve lost it. Do you know what I mean?
Corrie: The Board of (inaudible) takes it away.
Bird: So you’re 100 percent right there. I’ll tell you I don’t know if you guys – you
could go out and buy something that extra one percent adds up.
Nary: Do we allocate that $39,000 to some line so –
Corrie: That it comes out at zero.
Nary: -- so that it comes out at zero.
Corrie: It might not be a bad idea.
Cunningham: Yes we just – what we can do on the $39,000 – what we’ve done
in the past is we just show that as a contribution to the capital improvement fund.
Corrie: Okay or you can put in the Mayor’s Office anyway.
Nary: Can we transfer it back if we needed it then?
Cunningham: Yes.
Corrie: Yes we can do that.
Nary: That’s fine. That makes sense.
Bird: Well I have no problem taking this before the public.
Corrie: Well if we can come out this good it’s going to be a little difficult to get an
improvement.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I just want to express my appreciation to you and the Department
Heads. I know they came forward very conservatively this year and to the
Accounting Department, a lot of time and effort was put into really tightening the
belts. I think this was a good reflection of that. We need to keep in mind of
commitments that we’ve made for future progress. We really need to get a fourth
station on the south side of the freeway and if we don’t start setting money aside,
we’re going to be in the same situation. Also, the last couple of fire engines that
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we have bought have been taken out of the fire fund and nothing has been put in
for that same period of time. As we look at Station 4, we’re going to be looking
at a possible shortfall even in our fire truck fund that we won’t have anything in.
We may have $39,000 left over this year but it certainly isn’t a true indicator of
what we’re going to be facing in the future years. I do appreciate the ease that
Mayor you and the Department Heads and the accounting staff have provided us
this year in making it as a more seamless process but we will have challenges in
the years to come.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Yes I think so. Mr. Bird.
Bird: I echo those words and I think that this has been – this is my sixth budget
year. This has been the easiest one to get through. I think it’s been very plain
and I think it’s because just what Councilwoman de Weerd just said that through
your help and the Department Heads being conservative which we knew we had
to be makes a big difference. I certainly appreciate it. I am very happy that our
Department Heads bought in with you and through your leadership that we got
this thing taken care of. There was nothing here that was way out of bounds like
I’ve had in the past. There was nothing asked for that couldn’t have been used
let’s put it that way even though we had to cut some stuff. Nothing was
outrageous that we asked for. I think that’s a very good tell of how you managed
to run it with the Department Heads.
Corrie: I want to say thank you. I really want to really give the credit mostly to
the Department Heads because they really sat down and they went down to cut
as much as they could I think. They did a good job there. I think we have two
girls sitting over there that’s really helped us. I remember like Keith we sat up
here, we cut and sliced, and then we ended up with a figure. All of a sudden
somebody comes up oh I remember this. I really appreciate the comments from
the Council. We do have a lot to thank to the Finance Department too they really
helped us out an awful lot. A lot of the work was done ahead of time and they
got it done for us. I do echo the fact that the Department Heads have been
really, really good on this this year. I think every year it’s going to be maybe a
little easier. I agree with Councilwoman de Weerd that we will have to look at
that new fire station and things like that. We have one entity that has more
money. We may be – we have some too but get those two together that’s the
thing we have to work out.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Great comments and I’m not going to add anything more other than I
know at some point when we discussed the fire station off the freeway at some
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point we’re going to also have to decide on whether or not a truck company is
necessary for our community. Those trucks cost a lot more than the engines we
buy. That’s another very large expense that we may have to look at some time in
the future.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Getting on that truck fund expanding on it. I believe this truck thing has
been probably a 15, 20-year project that we started that you guys started years
ago even before your time Mayor. I think it’s something that we can’t live – if we
can just you know put in 40 or $50,000 a year it all adds up and we’ve always
had that money there to buy our truck fund so we haven’t had to take out or buy
our trucks and stuff. If we loose it, it’s just so hard to get back and gain it again.
These guys had a foresight to see ahead and do this. I just don’t want to be part
of the people that lose it. Hopefully, if our economy turns around and stuff
maybe we’ll have enough that we can throw a little bit of money back into it next
year or even this fiscal year if we come up ahead. It’s something that we can’t
lose that’s my personal opinion.
Corrie: Very true, very true.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess with the employee incentive merit pool that we put money
into we’re asking Stacy, you’re office and the Department Heads or HR to come
up with some formulas or some recommendations for us. What kind of
timeframe are we looking at? Are we looking at something in January that that’s
when it would be implemented so at least the employees kind of know what our
timeframe is on further compensation or at least merit type of programs. Also, I
know this has no budget impact but we do need to have further discussion on in
town mills and flowers. I think that that was kind of – it’s now been budgeted for
now we just need to make sure that we have clear guidelines on how those
things happen. I would assume that our volunteer appreciation is going to be
partnered in with any citywide function as well so we don’t need – I would have
preferred a specific line item for that just to let them know there is appreciation
there for volunteers and there is something there to go to, to thank them.
However, the Department Heads and the Mayor’s Office come back with a
recommendation is fine. As long as that’s part of that consideration.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
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Nary: Are we done with the general fund for the moment?
Kilchenmann: I believe we are and ready to move onto the next fund.
Nary: It’s 12:30 do we want to just work through it? Do we want to eat
something I don’t care?
De Weerd: Oh yes we have the enterprise fund.
Nary: And then special services. We’re not done.
De Weerd: Why don’t we take a break or maybe just have pizza delivered and
we can work through it.
Kilchenmann: If we could do that Reta actually has a trip planned for this
afternoon. If we could work through it it would be great.
Nary: That’s fine.
Bird: That’s fine with me I want to get out of here.
Kilchenmann: I think the next two funds will be easier.
Corrie: Okay Will if you want to order some pizza for us.
Berg: Sure can.
De Weerd: Pizza and beer.
Nary: No, I don’t think we’ll have any beer since Mr. Brundt is here.
Kilchenmann: If he wasn’t here.
De Weerd: We have no alcohol in city hall. I was just kidding. You guys take
everything so serious.
Corrie: If you want to do that Will if you want to take a two-minute break. Two
minutes turns into five.
(Return at 12:49 P.M.)
Kilchenmann: Is everybody ready for enterprise fund?
Corrie: Shoot.
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Kilchenmann: We added their 2.5 percent and their merit / incentive. We need
to take that counter off of there too.
De Weerd: We probably need to have the discussion on the building contractor
too the Building Inspector.
Nary: Right. Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Is this the section that we would be also looking at that Fire Inspector too?
Kilchenmann: No that will be the last one. Special -- Planning and Zoning.
Nary: Planning and Zoning thanks.
De Weerd: I got ahead of myself. We’ll start with Public Works.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: At least for me I don’t really see anything in this particular list that gives
me any real pause any that I’m personally am always a little concerned when it
says miscellaneous office. It’s really pretty vague but I don’t see it as a frivolous
item I just always prefer a little more detail when you budget money. Other than
that, I don’t really have a concern about what they’re asking for or whether there
is a necessity for those things.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I agree with Councilman Nary. I hate anything that says miscellaneous.
Kilchenmann: Let’s look a little bit and see what it is.
Bird: What?
Kilchenmann: I’ll look and see –
De Weerd: It’s in the description.
Kilchenmann: One part of it is pretty miscellaneous it says furniture,
bookshelves, plan racks, file cabinets, and tables. Then the capital outlay part is
four pick up shelves.
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Nary: That was to secure the water equipment and stuff.
Bird: That’s right.
Corrie: What did they have down there? I noticed –
De Weerd: And I wasn’t really sure why bookshelves, plan racks, file cabinets,
and tables were all considered capital because they’re all under $1,000.
Kilchenmann: Those are in operating we don’t have them in capital.
De Weerd: Oh okay.
Corrie: What did we say the miscellaneous expense was $1500 the last there
the second page?
Nary: On the base?
Corrie: Yes. What did they use that for before? It’s gone down $600 but –
Cunningham: Oh you’re talking about their miscellaneous in their budget base?
Corrie: Yes.
Cunningham: That is for like the Christmas party, the turkeys, or flowers.
Corrie: That’s what I was thinking that we already have a lot of that in there
already in the base. Whatever the Council wants to do with them, they can do it?
Cunningham: Yes.
Corrie: All right.
Nary: In looking at the base as well I mean there’s a couple of ones that again I
guess it’s – the experience level hasn’t been there but I understand that there
are even ones here like vehicle repair. They have $3,000 their experience level
is significantly less than that but they have lowered it I guess to address that. I
know we use a formula for that number.
Kilchenmann: Actually that vehicle repair was a one-time item that they were
going to get a major repair down. I asked them what because it was – what was
it they were going to – oh okay she said she took it out.
Cunningham: Do you see how I’ve got a minus $2500?
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Nary: And again, it’s the same question on the travel meeting seminars training.
I think we do need to have that. Their experience hasn’t been anywhere near
that. They’ve got $6500 in seminars and training and two years ago, it was only
$4,000. That’s a fairly large number gap on those two things but I don’t know if
we want to adjust those or not.
McCandless: What about dues, scriptions, and memberships at $25,000 good
grief.
De Weerd: Well that has COMPASS –
Corrie: Professional engineering and stuff like that.
De Weerd: And it has COMPASS in that.
McCandless: It has COMPASS.
Nary: COMPASS is part of that yes.
Corrie: Well I don’t see anything myself.
Kilchenmann: The next one would be MUBS. If you remember the front counter
remodel, they had put the extra money in. Now that we’ve made some changes
we would like to see if we could get that done this year. I think we need to get
the person up at the front and the locking cash drawers. We’re going to see if we
can get it done with the remaining, money left over that we have. This year I
think we had $7,000 left and take this out. I’m not –
***End Of Side Five***
Kilchenmann: -- can get it done for $7,000.
Bird: Well sure try.
Kilchenmann: We’ll try.
Corrie: Give it a go.
Kilchenmann: We’ll give it the old college try.
Corrie: Okay that’s good. We need to get that taken care of and done.
Bird: We need to get that done.
Kilchenmann: We need to get that done right away yes.
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Corrie: Yes I agree with Mr. Bird on that.
De Weerd: Just remember that with that remodel I think Will is our building
person that he’s included in the planning part of it. Aren’t you our building guy?
Kilchenmann: We already have a plan. We already paid for the plan.
Corrie: Yes that kind of got me but okay. I can draw the plans a lot easier.
Bird: Yes Steve Trout has already got the plan started.
Corrie: Okay we’re set there then. Any other questions.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Yes I guess the only question I had in the base budget is the write offs. Is
budgeting the write offs so we’re increasing it 150 percent. I guess I wasn’t clear
why we need to do that.
De Weerd: Yes.
Kilchenmann: Well what we decided to do – normally what you do is each year
you expense a uniform amount to a balance sheet account for uncollected
amounts. Then when you actually expense them you do it to the balance sheet
amount but they have never done that in the past. It’s like we would build up the
balance sheet account for uncollected accounts and write off against that. If we
get to the point where the write offs slow down then we wouldn’t have to keep
expensing it. This would be one percent of our accounts receivable which is a
pretty low amount to expense every year.
Nary: I certainly can’t see anything up there on the board to eliminate really.
Basically, a half time service coordinator for a full time position and one other
person doesn’t appear to me to be frivolous.
De Weerd: And that’s to get 24 hour coverage I think is what’s –
Nary: Exactly. That capital outlay of existing wells would that go from a different
account or is that – since that is a capital expense is that different?
Kilchenmann: No, actually when we get to the summary – enterprise summary
they will be going into their fund balance.
Nary: I see.
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Corrie: One thing that we were – I guess water is involved here. We were
talking about in staff and also to the Water Department the possibility of the city
and this is something the Council is going to have to talk about later. The city
takes over that backflow device checking. I get a lot of calls that people don’t
mind putting in the backflow device on their house but they hate to pay that $33
or more every year to get it tested. In just a bugaboo on them and I’m going to
ask the Council to possibly look at thinking about a dollar or 70 cents on the
water bill everybody and then we take it over and do the inspecting. If something
goes wrong we fix it and then that way the people are not so –
Kilchenmann: Irritated.
Corrie: -- irritated that somebody has to do it and others don’t have to do it. That
way everybody does it. It’s right on their bill and they don’t’ see it again after it’s
done. I’m going to bring that to the Council’s attention here. Garden City does
that, some of the others do, and it’s working very nicely. I’ve talked to some
people about it and they said yes I’ll do that and I don’t have to worry about it
after it’s on there. They’ll be happy and I would. They put mine up crooked and
they wanted to do it again and they said yes it’s $700 more. I was very Christian
about it but it’s still crooked by the way. I just assume Council will know I’m
going to bring that to them and have them look at it too. That’s just something I’d
inhere.
De Weerd: I think with the requirement to have irrigation water and not use city
water the majority or we’re starting to have more residents who don’t have
backflow devices to check.
Corrie: But you still have those like me that don’t have use of irrigation water and
they use the city water to irrigate their lawns then they have to have it.
Bird: Me too.
Corrie: It’s mandatory and those that don’t have that and some of the older
sections don’t have it then that’s the one gripe they have. If they’ve got a new
subdivision, they have it all medically taken care of them for them so they don’t
hear from them. I’m sorry to take up your time on that I’m waiting for lunch.
De Weerd: Okay well I don’t see anything in water.
Bird: I don’t see anything in water.
Corrie: They are pretty good there yes.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Yes Mr. Nary.
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Nary: I did notice in the water that there’s another contract labor one that’s
$20,000 and their actual in ’02 was $7800 and their actual this year is zero. I
guess I was a little curious as to what kind of contract labor do they use that they
need to fund such a large amount in that particular line item. It just seemed like
a pretty big disparity.
Cunningham: It is when they have to go out and repair lines out in the street
connections. That’s what they’ve had that in there for. You’re right so far this
year it has zero.
Nary: That would probably be a winner expense. Okay well that’s fine that
makes sense.
De Weerd: And the thing is in this if they don’t spend it, it just stays in the
enterprise fund.
Nary: Right exactly.
De Weerd: Now in Wastewater Treatment they did add an enhancement Reta
do you have that?
Cunningham: We do we added it on.
De Weerd: Okay.
Nary: Where did Number 8 go? Why is there a 7 then 9?
Kilchenmann: When you looked at Public Works they had the warranty TV
inspections. Brad presented it in Public Works but he actually asked for it in – he
presented it in Wastewater but he actually asked for it in Public Works. There it
is.
Corrie: Was this one that we were adding to the 1.2 –
Kilchenmann: Yes that North Slough Sewer Trunk.
Corrie: Okay thank you.
Nary: Well Mr. Mayor this is another one I don’t – as usual I think with Public
Works I think they’ve really identified really where the needs are and how to
accomplish them. I don’t really see really any type of excess here. I think it’s
always the issue of can you get it all done. They certainly have done an
admirably job every year but I don’t see you know the two biggest items there
are the Black Cat Trunk Sewer and Lift Station and the North Slough Sewer
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Trunk. I think we pretty much decided we need them. We’re going to need
those.
Bird: We have to have them.
Nary: We have to have them so I think we really need to proceed on them.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I agree with that. I feel in some of our budget discussions over the
last four years they’ve had projects there that they thought they would get to but
never did. You see this list is more realistic and I appreciate that. I think they
really have been starting to really not bite off more than they can chew and
included in their budget. This is a nice change.
Kilchenmann: If you look not now but in the capital improvement, request or the
CIP Plans that are in the budget book I compared their capital improvement plan
with what they’ve actually done side-by-side so you can kind of see that.
De Weerd: Yes that is nice.
Kilchenmann: That’s what they look like in total. They will go I think 9.9 million
dollars into the fund balance. I think some of these projects will be long term
they certainly won’t be completed next year.
Bird: You won’t see it this year. Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Getting back to the impractical. I think experience has helped them as
much as anything on these projects because we went in blind. We never – the
White Sewer Trunk was the first sewer I think we ever put in. There is this crew
here that we’ve got now and I think they’ve learned a lot. I think that shows a lot
of – it’s like Stacy said we might be nine million into the fund balance but I will tell
you there’s a lot of that project that isn’t going to be done in one fiscal year it’s
not possible to do in one fiscal year. I don’t have the slightest idea what that lift
station for the Black Cat takes but I know you don’t go build that in one month.
It’s probably a six to eight month design a lone. I think they’ve got an aggressive
deal here and I think it’s stuff that we really do need if we’re going to have a
controlled development we’re going to have to have these sewer lines in place
and we control them.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
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July 18, 2003
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Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: The other thing I guess too is the positive is that this is really going to
address I don’t know all but certainly a large portion of the city north of the
freeway the north area and the area around the Ten Mile area. I assume at
some point in the future we’re going to see requests for things dealing with the
south side of the freeway but this is really going to address the north side needs
as much as we can and that’s great.
Corrie: That’s a definite.
De Weerd: We all and really prepare an interchange.
Bird: You’re right Tammy.
Corrie: Just hope the federal government doesn’t throw us a backlash on our
stink of it.
Bird: That scares me again.
Corrie: That’s scary. That’s scary but that’s not here now. Any other questions
or discussion?
Bird: I don’t.
Nary: Would this be the area of the fire inspector issue?
Corrie: Yes I think so.
Cunningham: Yes. I actually already put that up in the budget base.
Corrie: That’s what I was thinking you did yes.
Cunningham: So I increased the budget base for the Building Department
$20,000 for the fire inspector and $153,500 for the streetlights power and
maintenance. That still leaves and then we have in there I just put in the merit
increase and it still leaves in the $332,000 that will go back to the capital
improvement fund.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: So Reta is that employee merit amount this is based on the number of
employees in relation to the other 250 is that what it was?
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Cunningham: Yes.
Nary: I guess I’ll start off on this building official inspector. I don’t – I think it is
time. I really do think that it has been an admirable job by Mr. Whitman. I think
we’ve heard lots of lots of positive things as to how that’s been accomplished. It
is a financial a fiscal difference that has really got to the point that I think it makes
more sense to have a person that’s accountable and works for the city in doing
that. I don’t know whether or not that’s going to grow. I don’t know how that’s
going to be impacted but I think the numbers are just supportive of the idea of
bringing it as an in house position.
Bird: I’m with you 100 percent Bill. I can see pros and cons both ways. If we’re
slow we’re carrying an official but what the heck there’s plenty of work they can
be doing and getting ready for when we do get busy again. We’ve got it in place
over there. I feel that it’s time that we need to definitely do that. I think our
survey showed that too. That’s probably the biggest and I think we might as well
bite the bullet and go do it.
De Weerd: Well it looks like there’s a tremendous savings too.
Bird: Yes Tammy.
Nary: That’s $100,000.
Corrie: I’ve been around a long time I’m glad to hear you talk that way believe
me. (Inaudible) four wasn’t there.
Nary: She already put the fire inspection in the base and the streetlights in the
base.
De Weerd: Now we’re adding one building inspector. We have two that kind of –
that work out of there right now. We still will need money under contracted –
Nary: That’s two.
Kilchenmann: There are two.
Nary: A building official and then one inspector. It’s two people. Further, on the
column it’s two.
De Weerd: I can’t see.
Bird: You’ll have one that’s in charge and one that’s –
De Weerd: I hate to admit that.
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Pg. 104 of 108
Kilchenmann: There just is one thing that we’ve kind of been talking to Gary
about with the building inspectors. We’re switching from contract to employees
for these two but we still have the plumbing the other mechanical and electrical.
We just have to be really careful that we make a clear distinction between how
we treat the employees versus how we treat these other contractors so that we
don’t come back with IRS issues that the others are employees, we should be
paying their benefits, and they should have vacation and retirement and so forth.
That’s something we really we’ve talked a lot about we’ll have to be careful with
hat. He eventually does want to switch all of them to employees he just didn’t
want to take on five employees at once.
Bird: Well I think the plan in the long run is to probably switch.
De Weerd: Over time.
Bird: But we have a contract with them and the Mayor signs a yearly contract for
those sub-contractors. They’re sub-contracted we have nothing to do with their
IRS or benefits.
Kilchenmann: Actually the city – because the city did go through a big –
Corrie: IRS deal.
Kilchenmann: -- yes and I know that happened to us at the Department of
Correction and we lost.
Corrie: Yes we have to be careful.
Nary: Defining the duties that they perform and how they perform it will depend
on whether (inaudible).
Kilchenmann: Reta just said it was $187,000 –
Bird: If we control where we’re sending that stuff then they are basically like
employees. We had the same thing because we had contracted glaciers that
worked for Atkinson’s. We had the same thing if we controlled where they went
then we had to take care of them.
Corrie: IRS (inaudible) different.
Nary: I didn’t see anything in the base budgets that were. There are some
services, contracted labor and legal services but I think those are pretty decent
numbers. Some of those things are really hard to estimate up front.
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July 18, 2003
Pg. 105 of 108
De Weerd: Yes and in particular with P&Z we want to – still with the new director
coming in. She is trying to focus on some training. Give her a year and then be
critical.
Bird: I don’t think you will have to be.
Corrie: Are we going to put that fire inspector (inaudible)? I need glasses too.
De Weerd: Okay.
Kilchenmann: We’re done?
Corrie: We have to put the figure in for street lighting.
Cunningham: Actually I have it up in the budget base. It’s not like new money
and that’s just enough to me.
Corrie: Okay.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: The only note I had left that we hadn’t talked about or we were going to
come back to is the Council President pay. I don’t care if we want to take that up
at another time but that was the only note I had left that we said we would wait
and see where else we were and everything else.
Bird: I just assume take it up another time.
Nary: That’s fine. I think we want to make clear on the record too that that
money that’s budgeted and set aside right now for employee merit and incentive
is for the Council’s administration of that so it’s clear on the record that was what
we intended. Other than that, I think that was it. Those are all the notes I had
anyway. Mr. Mayor I know that this isn’t part of our meeting but obviously, we’ve
got this little addendum from ACHD. Do we want to put that on our Pre-Council
Agenda to talk about how we did that? Maybe invite Mr. Lyttle to come to our
Pre-Council Meeting.
Bird: On the right of way.
Nary: Yes.
Bird: Terry doesn’t have anything –
Nary: Okay.
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Bird: Gary will be here. Gary Smith from our – I think Gary approved all of these
didn’t he?
Kilchenmann: He actually – we paid the first one and then Gary got involved and
said he didn’t think we should be paying some of those. That’s why Number 4 is
unpaid. Now he approves them so the last two on the bottom ort the ones that
were paid in July, Gary approved paying those then he’s holding one then the
$179,000 we haven’t paid. If we don’t agree with the first two we paid, we’re
going to take money out of the $179,000.
Bird: Well I think Gary and the Mayor need to both approve these.
Kilchenmann: Gary is really up on these.
Bird: Yes but I also think the Mayor ought to be involved in this too. He knows
what the agreement was made and it looks to me they got us in places that we
didn’t’ agree to help.
Nary: We would at least like to talk about it next Tuesday you think.
Bird: I would like to Bill.
Nary: then make sure maybe Gary knows to be here.
Corrie: Pre-Council.
Nary: Pre-Council I think.
Corrie: Yes on the 22nd
Pre-Council to talk about ACHD right of way.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council Members)
Corrie: Start at 6:00 and have Gary first. I would like to discuss this.
Nary: Yes this ACHD right of way Agreement.
Corrie: (inaudible).
De Weerd: Yes, I guess so. I didn’t.
Corrie: I didn’t see it.
Cunningham: Excuse me Mayor and Council. I just wanted to bring to your
attention. I was just looking at the general fund and I had added in the extra
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July 18, 2003
Pg. 107 of 108
needed for the extra half a percent the $31,000. I hadn’t brought over the total
so now it changed your bottom number to only $7,668 left. Sorry.
Bird: That’s okay.
Nary: It’s still a plus.
Bird: Yes that’s all we care.
Berg: So what was it $7,000.
Nary: That was the remainder.
Cunningham: Okay.
Kilchenmann: I have a question. When we do the Public Hearing how long
should I make it. How long should I –
Bird: As short as possible. I’m serious.
Corrie: There won’t be probably a lot of people here but you never know.
Bird: There won’t be a lot of people.
Corrie: Maybe one or two.
De Weerd: We probably won’t even have Jonathan he’s going to be gone.
Kilchenmann: Oh he’s coming back for it.
Bird: Is he coming back for it?
Nary: When is that is it August?
Bird: Yes it’s August 26th
.
Nary: I guess you might be able to gauge between now and August if you here a
lot of feedback and response that may need longer. I would think 30 minutes
would be plenty. I don’t think we’ll even use that but I mean if you hear a lot of
response or Mr. Berg does or certainly the Mayor would hear the most then could
also adjust that.
Berg: Just for the scheduling of this Public Hearing on the 26th
, we’re going to
notice it in the paper the 18th
and the 11th
and we’ll need to approve the tentative
budget before the August 8th
newspaper deadline. August 5th
Regular City
Council Meeting we’ll have a line item or an item on the agenda to approve the
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July 18, 2003
Pg. 108 of 108
tentative budget. That way the Finance Department will have everything all put
together.
Bird: Can we do that on Consent Will?
Berg: It would probably be best just to have it as a line item. It’s not going to
take much but a motion to approve the tentative budget. Then we’ll just publish it
from there if that’s okay with you and the timeframe.
Corrie: I think the attorney would ask us to bring it down anyways.
Bird: Yes they probably would.
Berg: That would make sure everything is double-checked and if anything needs
to be changed, we can discuss it too if that were the case on the 5th
.
Corrie: Anything else?
De Weerd: Yes I move we adjourn.
Bird: Second.
Corrie: All in favor say aye. Meeting is adjourned
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 1:19 P.M.
(TAPE ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
APPROVED:
/ /
ROBERT D. CORRIE, MAYOR DATE
ATTESTED:
WILLIAM G. BERG, JR., CITY CLERK