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HomeMy WebLinkAbout96Feb12 Golf Course Committee MinsGOLF COURSE CONSTRUCTION COMMITTEE MEETING FEBRUARY 12 1996 MEMBERS PRESENT: Walt Morrow, Patsy Fedrizzi, Wally Lovan, John Ewing, Bert Myer: Morrow: The first thing would be the financial report form Patsy based on sales and anything else (inaudible). Fedrizzi: I do have a hand out, here is one for each of you. We have not had a lot of activity but we do have is we have this balance forward of $11,977.96. Our income this month is Gem State Development sent us a donation of $35 and Norman and Ann Larson sent $25, they have one more (inaudible) and they will be all done. I have $60 for this month and our expenses are Meridian Chamber of Commerce for the Newsletter. I went ahead per our discussion Walt and, we get a special deal if you put, if (inaudible) so we saved like $20 to do it, to tell them we would do it quarterly with the newsletter. So I will have an insert for the next three months and then we are out of business after that anyway. So February through May will be $180. The passes I have received today from Modern Printers and that was $182 which is a lot less than I thought it might be. Our expenses are $362. Commissions are based on the $60 that we took in which is $6 which I will collect one of these days. Then that leaves of a balance of $11,669.96. Anticipated expenses this time are, I have just Statesmen advertising and what the Statesman will do is instead of me going to Modern Printers and getting something done up the Statesman will do it for nothing as long as we are going to advertise with them. So she didn't have time to put it together quickly enough for this meeting but I ~am going to take it to her tomorrow and she is going to have it to me somewhere around Thursday or Friday. I don't think we are ready to advertise with them yet anyway. I will play off of that ad as a flyer with Meridian Chamber of Commerce too. So that will save us some printing dollars. I do have some prices from the Statesman, would you like those at this time? Just to show you an idea of what it would be if we did this two column by five inch is if we run it anywhere from 1 to 5 weeks it is $103 a week. This is in their western issue, the western Ada county which !don't get in my newspaper it is the one that you guys get. Starting in March it won't be coming on Saturday anymore it will be on Wednesday but it is still the same circulation which is (inaudible). Anyway, so these different sizes are what is available, 6 to 11 she has so much and 12 to 25 weeks. Well I can't remember exactly how many weeks we have left but we are not, we will be done in June 1st. Anyway, we will pick one of those and I will get back to you on that Walt for the dollar figure to see what you want to do. I am going to have her design and see how much we can get in this size and see how impressive we think that will be. If she can get a lot in there and make it really standout or if we need to go a little bit larger to really make the impact that we need for this newspaper. (Inaudible) I don't know what a column thing here would be but you can see what some sizes would be and we might want to get a little larger if we are going to run it just once a month. Then our whole idea was that we will kind of have some of the same each month but we will play on the only 90 days left, only 30 days left kind of thing that is what I was thinking. As far as marketing, I have talked to some individuals and they are talking to individuals because one of the things I am really suggesting that some people do and Burt if you play out there you .might be thinking along the lines of some of the Golf Course Construction Committee February 12, 1996 Page 2 friends that you play with is on the $10,000 corporate if maybe maybe four could go into together so you could maybe play together or you could gift them to someone and then it would only be $2500 per family and you would get to play 25 times during each year. As the prices go up as Wally has indicated of course that they are going to do over the years it is a saving in the long run. So those are the calls that we are making, when I say we I mean my daughter has been helping me (inaudible) ladies organizations. Morrow: Did you have any response from the (inaudible). Fedrizzi: None whatsoever and I am not sure whether Gem State Development came up with $35. I have had no calls but I chose that way because (inaudible) still have some others left. Morrow: I agree with you (inaudible). Fedrizzi: Get them going and get people going that it is still happening that was my only thing was to get it going again. Morrow: Questions for Patsy? John? Wally? Bert? Any suggestions in terms of where we are headed with this? Okay, let's move from there to, let's go with how we are doing with our specs. Starting with, I guess the first thing I want to ask about, you know John I called Charlie Woods half a dozen or more times trying to get with him about, to make sure that he received his checks from the City and to offer my apologies. I know that part of the time that he was out of town but and part of the time he was in town. I never did hear anything back with him. My question to you is, and I did check with Will and he (inaudible) have you heard any input from him at all? Ewing: No I have not, I will, if you would like Morrow: (Inaudible) Ewing: Yes, 6:00 in the morning. Would you like me to tomorrow morning to try and get a hold of him and make sure that he has been paid and ask him to give you a call? Morrow: Yes I would really appreciate that because I think that it is in my interest to make sure that this happened. I just don't want to Fedrizzi: I have some input on that only because I have this print out from Janice. She did give it to me and it is inclusive of everything which I wanted it broken out. It is, I haven't had a chance to look that over but she addressed that very issue and she said those were done and Will was out of town so they were sitting on his desk partially but they have all Golf Course Construction Committee February 12, 1996 Page 3 been mailed. She shows, do you want to see this, they are listed on here. Well I will start at the bottom on up, here it says Rock Contractors on 12-22, $9000, so $9000 is what I see here that they paid him. Morrow: I did talk with Charlie but it was before that last $2000 had sent out. Fedrizzi: So he needed over the $9000? Morrow: Yes, would you John, would you double check on that. I did talk to him and it was concerning the first nine and he did receive that. But it was prior to him receiving the second $2000 some odd dollars. I don't think (inaudible) this is out of the 2-12 she (inaudible). Lovan: Will and I double checked that (inaudible) (Discussion Inaudible) Morrow: At any rate would you check on that for me please. Ewing: I will also have him give you a call, where you can talk to him or do you not him to call you? Morrow: (Inaudible) he has received a check and everything is squared away that is fine and Ewing: And where you do want him to reach you if has a (inaudible) alright I will (inaudible). Morrow: Alright, let's move from that to the sprinkler system is the first thing we were working on in terms of specs, how are we coming with that? Lovan: Better but not complete. Morrow: Well we are making progress. Lovan: I just got this in, I talked a little bit to Silver Creek Irrigation on it but I have not (inaudible). It is going to be spendy I know. Well (inaudible) $114,000 in this particular system, $114,414. This is without a pumping station, this is a lot of stuff that doesn't mean much to anybody except (inaudible). This is a complete circle system we will use our present pump house and come out (inaudible) go to the south side and then (inaudible) fairways. We have a ten inch main line coming out at this point (inaudible) as we go down Golf Course Construction Committee February 12, 1996 Page 4 the line. (inaudible) and it will do the fairways, the (inaudible) T boxes and the greens. Each sprinkler head is electronically controlled or electrically controlled so you can raise or lower the output. (Inaudible) Myer: Electronically from some box someplace or manually? Lovan: Manually (inaudible). It is a pretty nice system. I didn't have a chance to look this all over, as I recall it was (inaudible) on the whole thing. It is designed that (inaudible) which is, that is a plus. Myers: So you have a breakage on one of them you have thirteen different place. You can use one out of the thirteen (inaudible) break. Morrow: So where we go from here now is we write the rest of the specs for this system and competitively bid this system, is that what you see? Lovan: I have two more systems that I would like to (inaudible). The one system, I don't have anything on it other than (inaudible) it was $84,000, it is a little bit different system than this one here in that it is more of a low pressure system and bigger blocks (inaudible) at a time. Myers: So that means there are more sprinkler heads. Lovan: They will come on and you can water an hour like a gentle rain (inaudible). I personally like this system, it is $84,000. Now all of these systems here are without the pumps. Morrow: We can develop that information on the pumps and (inaudible). Myers: They are all going to include the putting greens right? Lovan: They will all include the putting greens, (inaudible) Doug Campbell and e I erased a lot of it and this that and the other. The club house was in the wrong place, part of this (inaudible). The other system I have here is one by (inaudible) it is a little more spendy, it is $151,000. All of these people were doing this with the knowledge that we were (inaudible) and the other system is Evergreen Sprinkler is the one that is $84,000. Myer: Do you have a feel for which system is going to do the best for us? Lovan: This system here is really a nice system, I am not sure how it is, (inaudible) it is electrical power to it. I don't know whether that is good or bad because I am not familiar Golf Course Construction Committee February 12, 1996 Page 5 with it. I know they are going more and more to this type of system and the more complicated you get the more maintenance you have. Morrow: Is there anyway that between now and our next meeting you can talk with somebody (inaudible) and find out. Do some information gathering and determine (inaudible) Lovan: They are so complicated anymore that you can sit right in the club house and punch buttons. (Inaudible) they are paying $1.2 million for their system (inaudible). Ewing: I guess you can answer these when you come back with the information but if you don't control this electrically why is there wire run to the (inaudible). That is one question I have. Another question I have is real quick, with the club house in the wrong place we have all this added sprinkling is all three places bidding off of this plan with the club house there and figuring it this way. Lovan: (Inaudible) Ewing: So we are getting it apples to apples? Lovan: Yes we are getting apples to apples. In other words this here, if you take this out of here it might be (inaudible) and we might even drop some of this other off over here. When we get down into this area we (inaudible) whether there will be a fence down here, this is owned by (inaudible) special design out there that they want (inaudible). Ewing: I think the reason I ask that though is if we could have some amount, $20,000 swing in the bid and if we are going to base it on just what you want it is not an important thing if we don't have them apples to apples. But if we are going to enter into price we have to have one bid (inaudible) and the next one taking the club house (inaudible) Lovan: Every one of these people have been told there (inaudible) that they are doing it to give us what they think would be a good product (inaudible). They will all have the same plat. Does that make sense to you. Ewing: One other quick question, while you were talking about the system coming round and splitting, does the golf course have or the City have easements through here to get the split? Lovan: This right here is golf course property, this right in through here, This is parking, this is parking, this is road. (Discussion Inaudible) Golf Course Construction Committee February 12, 1996 Page 6 Myer: So where does this road go? Lovan: This road goes right (inaudible) Myer: That is as far as it goes? Lovan: No, it comes right on around here and connects up with Interlachen Way and goes out to Cherry Lane. Mirrorfield comes in this way somewhat (inaudible). Then you have Black Cat (inaudible). Myer: Will there be any entrance on Black Cat? Lovan: Oh yes, that is where the main entrance will be. It is a double road (inaudible) Morrow: While we are on the subject of Ashford Greens and I met with David Turnbull (inaudible we should be seeing that deed coming forward within a two week period with no deed stipulations on that. I have talked with Wayne Crookston about getting a prototype of the Jim Fuller deed to use as a model (inaudible) David's company to us. And then by separate agreement we will handle the issues of easements for his heavy construction to his subdivision site. So that is how we chose to handle that. The ball is in his court and we will get that deed (inaudible) that would be (inaudible). So that takes care of the properties (inaudible). Lovan: (Inaudible) Morrow: He said that we would have a road to the club house by 1996, the fall of 1996. That they were anticipating starting the residential first phases this winter. So that is as of last month. Lovan: I am still wondering (inaudible) existing club house (inaudible). Morrow: According to him, it looks to me like we will coincide with the completion of his based on what his plans are is where we are at right now. Okay any questions on where we are at with the sprinkler system specs? John? Patsy? (Inaudible). We talked about, we have a pretty good handle on the seed. I guess the next area that we were trying to put together information on would be the greens and the (inaudible) for those greens. Lovan: (Inaudible) grass seed right now is, most grass seed comes from Oregon. It is all being flooded out and the market is going through the roof. Would it be possible for us to, for you and I to get together. I still have (inaudible). I have two other bids. We can get it tied down to a certain Golf Course Construction Committee February 12, 1996 Page 7 Morrow: Wally, I think that goes without saying (inaudible) and eastern Washington are the prime suppliers of seed that means that there is (inaudible) it seems to me like what we need to do is (inaudible) John? Ewing: So what do you think grass seed is going to cost right now. I agree with you but is this is good price $.70? Lovan: I think that is probably a set fee right there. I just got (inaudible) over by Caldwell. Ewing: This is Scott, he has went up $.26 in a month? Lovan: Well that wasn't a firm bid I think (inaudible). This was the firm bid. (Discussion Inaudible) Myer: If it is pointed out, I think we really need to get moving on it. Ewing: Well it was at $1.13 it could have changed already. Lovan: The guy from over in Caldwell (inaudible) we had a bid of $.77 (inaudible) it is a little bit different blend than this. I am still trying to get the Manhattan in this thing here because that is what our other nine holes consists of it Manhattan on the Fairways it has been a pretty good grass. It is a little bit old fashioned now, they say you have others better. We are also putting in a blend of some of the new grass seeds. Morrow: So what it amounts to is in the next couple of days you will be back with me and we will make a decision as to (inaudible) price commitment and commit to that and begin the purchase. Is that agreeable with you John? Lovan: I would argue (inaudible) Ewing: It is fine with me, are we in agreement that we do have, I take it, what is that fairways and rough 50, are we talking, that is not 50 acres is it? Lovan: We will have around (inaudible) 52 acres and I said 55. Ewing: The total is for 50. I guess what I am saying is we should really before we go out and buy, we should firm up I believe how much we need. We have 66,000 square feet of green, would that be right, we really haven't come up with anything. Lovan: That is what we have in our existing course. The bid here is $5.80 on the Golf Course Construction Committee February 12, 1996 Page 8 (inaudible) Ewing: $5.90 Lovan: Okay, I got a quote from this Caldwell outfit for $6.30. Morrow: Okay, well let's get those quotes brought together then as soon as we can and have that information and then we will go ahead and commit to grass seed. Ewing: I suppose that stuff does not go bad. (Inaudible) Morrow: Okay, Lovan: And part of it may not take too, we may have some to re-seed. Morrow: You have down fall and seed cross. Let's move on to the putting greens. Lovan: Since I got back from my vacation I have been doing taxes so I have been on a rush job for this. Morrow: Well if you were like Charlie and I you wouldn't have to worry about taxes because we don't have any income. Lovan: The only way I could (inaudible) Morrow: Well in our case you have to have an income before you pay taxes (inaudible). Lovan: Well John and I and you have a contracting business of one sort or another (inaudible). Page number 1 is really nothing more (inaudible). Number 2 there is a cross section of a green, I modified this particular one here that came out of a book. I modified it to fit what we have out there now. With this particular one here the only difference was instead of the sand they used a mixture of what John was talking about last time just two inches of very course sand over the gravel. Here we are using sand, two inches of gravel right on top of (inaudible). This is the way the other greens were done and it has been adequate the greens are nice. They are noted for being nice around the valley and I can see no reason to change it. Morrow: That also has to do with the play consistency correct? Golf Course Construction Committee February 12, 1996 Page 9 Lovan: Right, some of these other things here on top of the sand, I also recommend, and it was done in the beginning, a type of bark of some type or another. Then this (inaudible) so and there is just a matter of (inaudible) as John pointed out last time. If this sand is, we will need some type of (inaudible) relatively clean and is large enough grains why this (inaudible). Morrow: And that should be a very simple issue (inaudible). Somebody will have (inaudible). Lovan: Some places (inaudible) that is what they use on the golf course. Morrow: I will tell you this (inaudible) a matter of a few miles down the road from the golf course and it is right over (inaudible) bulk of our mortar sand comes from. Lovan: Last time I tried to buy from them (inaudible). Ewing: (Inaudible) but I don't know that for positive but I am sure we are. Lovan: I would rather buy at home than go away. Morrow: I guess the deal is, the guys buy it, I see it come and be delivered and the last time I saw a truck that I can remember it was a G and B truck. Ewing: That is the way with me. Morrow: But now I better ask, we will ask. Lovan: Now I use this mortar sand in the sand traps out there and when we (inaudible) Idaho Golfing Association we have some of the nicest sand traps, the USGA (inaudible). Myer: You have these banks that are a foot and a half high to try and get over. Lovan: I showed you how to get over it. Morrow: The last page talks about the drainage system. Lovan: The last talks about the drainage system, this one here is one that came out of the book and it is recognized by the USGA and Idaho Golfing Association. This particular one they are also draining the bunkers and I know we talked about bunkers. We don't know (inaudible) and, but we do need a drainage system. This one here talks about draining it to (inaudible). We talked about putting in the weep drain, weep hole, 6 foot 6 hole or Golf Course Construction Committee February 12, 1996 Page 10 something with enough space and area to take care of the drainage and it should go down to rock. I done a little thing here and I haven't had a chance to check it. I really didn't make any copies because sometimes I can be dumb. But I did get the thing all worked out over the weekend and I was up at the cabin and I had everything in my mind and my mind is not very good (inaudible). Fedrizzi: Would you like me to go make copies for everybody, would you like copies? Morrow: If it is just a real rough draft, let's just review what you have got there. (Inaudible). Lovan: In the weep well I figured about 6 yards of drain rock (inaudible) Drain pipe system I figured 450 feet for the green of pipe which would be 4050 linear feet of drain pipe, about 40 feet of regular pipe to convey it. (Inaudible) I think that we do want to do this on the new putting green out there also. The first (inaudible) we would just go ahead and use it buy the bark and mix it in with a couple of 3 inches of sand and mix it all up on top and (inaudible) but I am not so sure that we shouldn't do it this way too. The new putting green would go down (inaudible) Cherry Lane built that and we just built that on top (inaudible) for 18 years. Something is wrong here, 9 greens, (inaudible) does that sound right? Well let me go through this. Ewing: (Inaudible) in fact if I remember right, you corrected me because I was off last time. Morrow: How deep is the sand? Lovan: Ten inches. (Discussion Inaudible) Morrow: It is 32 yards per 1000 square feet and you have 66,000 square feet, so that is 66 times 32 is 2012 yards for all of them or for 66,000 square feet. Lovan: So if we do 4500 square feet (inaudible) Myer: So that is 2012 yards of sand. Lovan: Yes, we probably should figure the high amount Myer: Does that 66,000 include the putting green? Lovan: The 66,000 (inaudible) Golf Course Construction Committee February 12, 1996 Page 11 Morrow: I am trying to move this along because we have a 5:00 meeting that we are going to bump up against here. The School Board is in here right after the 5:00 I think they are here at 5:30. So, let me summarize where we are at with the green spec there is a little more work to be done to define what it is we need so we can right it up and get is (inaudible) are you comfortable with that John? Ewing: That there needs to be a little more work done? Morrow: Yes in terms of quantity? Lovan: How much more work do you think needs to be done other than getting things rounded up together? Morrow: Well in terms of the bid stuff we can put it into a format of numbers and yards per green. We need to, what we need to do is figure out quantities of each for materials and then what we need to right up as a bid spec is the labor and materials per green. It has to be something like the green shall be 5000 square foot plus or minus, and it will consist of X number of yards of sand, X number of yards of gravel and so many linear feet of pipe, the drain pit is to be dug to a depth of whatever. The depth on the dry (inaudible) is to be approximately and then develop what would be a typical green. And then have the bid based on that. I think what we ought to do probably is that we ought to have some token quantities involved here also for safety sake. Meaning that if our numbers figure out 2000 hard of sand we ought to have, based on the nine greens we ought to be bidding 2100 yards to give ourselves the extra hard yard cushion or something like that. Myer: You can always use that sand. Morrow: Well even if you don't the issue is you have monies (inaudible) (Discussion Inaudible) Myer: Well I think you have the stuff ready to go to put the green specs together. Morrow: Well most of the stuff. Lovan: Most of the stuff you will find there. Myer: It sounds to me like you got. it. Ewing: Do you want to bid it (inaudible) or do you want to bid it with a and still give an amount of sand given the square footage that we are going to have of greens if it is 5000 Golf Course Construction Committee February 12; 1996 Page 12 square feet of greens times ten and give them a spec on the cut of so many inches of sand, so many inches of peat gravel, so many, we want it to drain so many square feet of the green needs to be drained where they can go do their own calculations and not us getting into the estimation. I guess I am kind of thinking, one of the things I think will make it a difference too if I am thinking right is when this green gets carved out it could make a big difference on the quality of person we have carve it out as to what has to go back (inaudible). If the sub grade is uneven it could take more material. If we make them do their own figuring we are not sitting there having an overrun of 5000 yards and I don't know if that is a reasonable (inaudible) coming back and say you told us to do it by the yard, you told us how many yards, and we told we would do it by $15.00 and now we have overrun. And us siting here in a meeting saying where did we go wrong. Myer: You have a good point John, you are probably right, that may be the way to bid that is to have them sit down with the spec (inaudible). Morrow: We do a cross section, the other thing though Wally, I don't disagree with that at all, I think maybe pursue it from that standpoint. Let's generate our own numbers as a means of checking those bids. Ewing: Oh I think definitely we have to come back to a budget generally I don't know if the spec, what I brought up in the last meeting and what I want to bring up again, I am saying my part right now is Wally coming up with these specs and I am going to be the one that reads them and says yes this is a good spec, we can go out to everybody it is very clear or this is not clear to me and these are the reasons. I am not even saying that my thought process is necessarily right but I am going to bring it up. I am going to be the negative side of the specs trying to beat them to pieces where we don't get hooked. I don't mean that as a personal thing, I am just saying that is the part I am going to play. Fedrizzi: Well that is the question they are going to have. Ewing: Yes that is the question they are going to have. Lovan: Well now we have another problem here, (inaudible) the idea that they would be (inaudible) 100 foot long by 150 foot wide which gives us (inaudible). Also the elevation (inaudible) run down to zero (inaudible) so that they are all pretty much the same. I am sure that there will have to be a little more work done on them. We will have to go in there and (inaudible) and then go in and (inaudible) green here that we done was taken from the book of the USGA. It also gives you some elevations there. (End of Tape)