HomeMy WebLinkAbout2008 03-11Meridian City Council Special Workshop Meeting March 11 2008
A meeting of the Meridian City Council was called to order at 5:30 p.m., Tuesday, March
11, 2008, by President Charlie Rountree.
Members Present: Tammy de Weerd, David Zaremba, Keith Bird, Charlie Rountree,
and Joe Borton.
Others Present: Bill Nary, Ted Baird, Jaycee Holman, Matt Ellsworth, Tracy
Basterrechea, Steve Siddoway, Elroy HufF, Stacy Kilchenmann, Keith Watts, Mark
Neimeyer, Tom Barry and Dean Willis.
Item 1: Roll-call Attendance:
Roll call.
X David Zaremba X Jae Borton
X Charlie Rountree X Keith Bird
X Mayor Tammy de Weerd
Rountree: Well, with the chiming of the bell, I'm going to open the City Council workshop
for March 11th with a roll call vote -- or roll call attendance. Excuse me. You can vote as
well if you want.
Item 2: Adoption of the Agenda:
Rountree: Next item on the agenda is to adopt the agenda.
Bird: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I move we adopt the agenda as published on the revised 3/11/08.
Borton: Second.
Rountree: It's been moved and seconded to adopt the agenda. All those in favor?
Opposed same sign?
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 3: CONSENT AGENDA
(a) Final Agreement for Amended Bittercreek Meadows Agreement
Rountree: Next item is the Consent Agenda.
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March 11, 2008
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Nary: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Nary.
Nary: We don't have finality on that agreement, so we could pull that off and, hopefully,
we will have it next week.
Rountree: So, do we need a motion to -- just table it or --
Nary: You can just move to vacate it. We will bring it back.
Rountree: Okay. We will vacate Item 3. Next item on the agenda --
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. --
Zaremba: I move we vacate the Consent Agenda Item A from this week's calendar.
Bird: Second.
Rountree: Moved and seconded to vacate Item 3. All those in favor? Opposed same
sign?
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 4: EXECUTIVE SESSION:
ISC 67-2345 (1) (c): (to conduct deliberations concerning labor
negotiations or to acquire an interest in real property, which is not owned
by a public agency) & (f) (to consider and advise its legal representatives
in pending litigation):
Rountree: Okay. Item 4. Executive Session.
Bird: Mr. President?
Rountree: Are we ready? Okay.
Bird: I move we go into Executive Session as per Idaho State Code 67-2345(1)(c) and
(1)(f).
Borton: Second.
Rountree: It's been moved and seconded to go into Executive Session. Roll call vote.
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Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Borton, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
EXECUTIVE SESSION:
Rountree: I will bring this session back to order with a motion to come out of Executive
Session.
Bird: So moved.
Zaremba: Second.
Rountree: Moved and seconded to come out of Executive Session. All in favor?
Opposed same sign?
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Rountree: Okay. We are out of Executive Session.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: I would designate the document pertaining to 641 North Main to be
Resolution 05-601 and the document pertaining to the property at 55 East Broadway to
be Resolution No. 05-602. And with that move that we approve Resolution 05-601 and
Resolution 05-602.
Rountree: Do we need to read the title of those? No, not on a resolution?
Nary: Usually we have. Usually we have read the title, but isn't it 08?
Bird: 08. Yeah.
Rountree: O8.
Zaremba: I'm sorry. It should be 08-601 and 08-602.
Rountree: If the clerk would read those resolutions by title only.
Holman: Resolution No. 0$-601, a resolution approving an order of condemnation far
the real property located at 641 North Main Street in the City of Meridian and legally
described as Lots 16, 17, 18 and 19 of the amended plat of Block 1 of the town site of
Meridian, according to the plat filed in book two of plats at page 61, records of Ada
county, Idaho, and providing an effective date.
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Holman: Resolution 08-602. A resolution approving an order of condemnation for the
real property located at 55 East Broadway Avenue in the City of Meridian and legally
described as Lot 20 in Block 1 of amended plat of town site of Meridian, according to
the plat thereof filed in book two of plats at page 61, records of Ada county, Idaho, and
providing an effective date.
Rountree: It's been moved to approve those. I need a second.
Borton: Second.
De Weerd: It's been moved and seconded to approve the resolutions. Roll call vote.
Correct?
Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Borton, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 5: COMMUNITY ITEMS /PRESENTATIONS:
(a) Update on New City Hall Building Construction -Gene Bennett, Jon
Anderson & Adam Johnson -Petra Inc.
Rountree: Thank you. That brings us to Item 5 on our agenda. Community items. And
the first item there is the update on the New City Hall. So, Gene, if you would take it
away. Thanks far your patience.
Bennett: You're welcome. Before you you have the updated monthly report on where
things stand as far as schedule, cost, Leeds, and RFIs and ASIs. Rather than go into
that in detail, I'll let each person that handles that for me discuss that. What I would like
to report is at -- on the schedule Jon has picked up some time on the interior. Drywall
has started as per the original schedule. That's a good sign. On the last items that are
remaining to be bid for the plaza, those items will be covered in a preconstruction pre-
bid meeting this Thursday and they will bid on the 27th of this month. And so that will
finalize the last items to be bid for the City Hall project. At this time I'd like to turn the
discussion of schedule over to Jon Anderson, superintendent for Petra.
Anderson: Madam Mayor, Members of Council, progress is moving very well at
Meridian City Hall. Windows are being set. Drywall is also being installed. On the
master schedule, if you will look at -- which will be Item No. 31, which are the partition
walls -- the partition walls are slated to wrap up on 4/10 on the schedule that's directly
behind that, which is our three week schedule. We are, actually, going to finish the third
floor north partition walls, which is item 35, around 4/4. So, we are picking up a little bit
of time in framing stage, which is allowing all the rough-ins to continue as well and pick
up some time there. Currently we are framing -- I should say currently we are dry-
walling first floor south. We are framed out second floor south end. And we are
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currently finishing up this week the petition framing on the first floor north end, moving to
second floor north end next week as well. So, the interior rough-ins are moving very
well, followed by interior drywall. From there painting should start -- actually, it will start
a little ahead of where the master schedule has it on 4/4. We are actually starting in
that week -- the week after that we will actually start on ceiling grids, get those installed,
the ceiling rough-ins, and, then, cabinetry to follow. What I'd like to do next month, if
possible, prior to our meeting here, is to have a tour of the progress of the facility.
Rountree: Great.
Anderson: So you can actually see where we are at. The basement is ready for drywall.
We are proceeding with the drywall of the basement. We will use that as a fill-in with our
crew to keep the dry-wailers here and to keep the painters moving as well. So,
progress is moving rather well. The exterior of the building -- the masonry itselfi is
wrapping up an the stair towers, wrapping up on the south wing. We actually have the
stone across the south portion of the building across that lower roof section. By the end
of next week they will be through the north section of that same roof band and moving
to the north side of the entry, which will allow me to verify the last of our window sizes
and put all the windows into fabrication. By week's end as we will be able to measure
all the curtain walls -- curtain window walls, which will finish the building as far as being
in the dry. So, we are progressing very rapidly on the exterior, as well as on the interior.
On the site itself we are in the process of finishing up some miscellaneous site activities
left over from last fall with the irrigation system. We have one weir box left to set.
Finishing the prep in the parking lot. And, then, starting the seepage beds, so on and
so forth. At that point in time we also start filling in the plaza area and start construction
of the plaza. So, work itself is progressing very well. As soon as the plaza bids, we will
add the plaza into the master schedule, so you can also follow that with us as we
construct the plaza. So, that in a nutshell is where we are at with the construction so
far.
Rountree: Any questions for Mr. Anderson?
Barton: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Borton.
Borton: Just briefily, Jon. Haw much time have you picked up?
Anderson: We have picked up about two weeks. But I'm being cautious, because we
still have a long way to go. The interior of the building is moving very well with the
finishes, but with the HVAC system, that's going to take a little time to go back in and
make sure this thing is going to run, just with hooking up all the controls -- mast of the
controls are plug and play. We have a York interface system that controls half the
system and, then, a Yamis control system that controls the air handlers that supply the
air to the floors and, then, the Yamis --the York system, then, takes over from there and
it redistributes the air. So, making sure all those come together is a long process, as
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well as a Leed process with enhanced commissioning, there is a lot of verification and
duplication of verification, so we send test reports back to DC or where ever we send it
at -- all the verification has its triple checks and documentation, we write down serial
numbers, Yamis -- not Yamis -- Hobson writes down the same serial numbers for the
same unit and so does Heiry. And they go through all the start ups. Start up procedure
for this type of building is quite intense. So, the start up will actually commence about
the first of May. We will be turning the air handlers on to pressurize the building to keep
particulates out -- help keep particulates out of the building to keep the building cleaner.
Indoor air quality with the Leed is a very huge issue and very time consuming for us to
maintain that to insure the indoor air quality which is below the BOCs particles, so on
and so forth. So, that when you, as the inhabitants get in the building, it is to the
standard of 3.1, 3.2. So, 3.1 is what we deal with under construction. 3.2 is what -- how
we finish the building for your inhabitants, so --
De Weerd: Mr. Chair?
Rountree: Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: I guess so we need to have a good estimate, because every month is an
extended lease in our other facilities and we are at the point where we need to talk to
them about when we need to extend it to, because we didn't anticipate this. So, if we
can, please, talk about that at our next meeting, so we can do what we need to do on
our side, because that's extra cost there, too.
Anderson: I understand.
Bird: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Jon, I take it if we are doing all this sheetrock and stuff, we are dry in, then, I take
it? The roofs all on and --
Anderson: The roof is all on, except for the barrel truss. We are -- the last section of the
roof is being -- or should start tomorrow with the install of the barrel section. So, we do
have some minor water control anytime that it does rain. But the lower roofs are on.
The main bodies of the roofs are -- have been installed. The drywall that's being
installed is not being -- it's not wet. We are not having a mold issue. We will not have a
mold issue, so -- even all the wood that's in this building is also fire treated for the type
of building that it is. So, that type of product does not and will not contract mold, so --
De Weerd: What's been the delay in that?
Anderson: Delay in which?
De Weerd: Putting the rest of the barrel roof on.
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Anderson: The barrel truss -- the barrel trusses were finished here about -- the actual
welding on them about three weeks ago. So, finishing that activity and getting
everything underneath it and put together and, then, we have had an issue with
submittals, we have corrected those and their action, fabrication of some different
components to actually attach that roofing system- So, tomorrow they actually start
installing the perling system and installing the actual installation probably Monday,
Tuesday of next week to put that main section in the dry.
De Weerd: Okay. Sorry I asked.
Rountree: Did you understand all that?
De Weerd: I have no idea what you just said, but --
Anderson: The barrel roof is a very complicated roof to put together.
De Weerd: And how long will it be until we are tight --that everything is water tight?
Anderson: Once we measure for the windows Monday, Tuesday of next week for the
curtain walls, it will take them approximately a week and a half to two weeks to fabricate
and receive the glass. Right now we are actually receiving glass within a week, which
is, actually, pretty good. Sheldon's done a pretty good job -- our contractor at Custom
Glass. So, once they measure they will start fabrication on those windows, with
anticipation of two weeks to stub the frames and, then, glass it. So, we are still out
probably two and a half to three weeks before we are a hundred percent in the dry. But
the areas that were not in the dry, we do have temporary measures on the windows that
are not installed and we are not installing any product that can -- that is water sensitive
in the areas that can receive water at this point in time. If that makes sense to you.
Rountree: Jon, you mentioned next week a tour. Do you have a time and a day?
Anderson: Oh, at our next monthly meeting.
Rountree: Next monthly meeting.
Anderson: Yes.
Rountree: Okay. And you have sufficient time built in this so now that you're putting in
windows Councilman Bird will have an opportunity to be out there and help you.
Anderson: I believe he's already been there. He's already beaten me to that. I believe
he's already snuck out there.
Rountree: Okay. Thank you.
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Anderson: Any other questions? Okay. I'll turn it over to Adam.
Johnson: Good evening, everybody. Just want to refer you guys to tab three. Do a
Leed update, kind of touch on some of the stuff we talked about last month for those
that weren't here. We are still -- of the 36 points we are attempting, five additional
points we are shooting for are in the maybe column still and 22 that we are not going to
get. First item there is the computer modeling. We did get that back. We talked about
that last time. We are sitting at 21 percent, which gives us in that column four points for
that one credit. Next item is the carpet system. The carpet that we have chosen, the
manufacturer has actually worked with other projects, Leed projects, and actually filed
for an innovation and design credit for the POC content, the rubber they use, the -- all
the materials that go into it. Sa, it's pretty tap of the line as far as Leed goes. So, we
are going to work that in and put that into -- that goes up to our top for our additional
points for an innovation design credit. So, we are working on the paperwork on that end
now. Next item Jon touched on is the documentation of credit 3.1, the indoor air quality.
During construction he touched on the precautions and stuff we have in place, ongoing
documentation of the dust control, particulate matter. He didn't touch on his due
diligence on the taping of the access floor. We actually put blue tape down on every
grid, along with paper and tape to cover and keep any drywall dust from breaching the
floor and that's been a huge benefit for us on the keeping that floor clean. So, that's an
ongoing thing. We are getting ready to paper the next section before we start the
drywall activities. So, keeping up with the daily logs of that and the photo
documentation. Next one, big item, was the sheetrock recycling. We kind of dodged a
bullet on that one. We talked last time about having to possibly ship it even out of
country to -- up to Canada to get the recycling value up, because that's a huge factor of
the scrap coming off. Talked to the director at the Ada County Landfill and they are
currently accepting sheetrock for recycling purposes. They actually have an individual
that purchases from them that uses it for cattle bedding. He uses it within the wood
chips that he also purchases. And as long as he's accepting, they accept from us. So,
we are keeping tabs on that. Every time we have a load that goes out, we have to verify
that it's good. We do have plan B in place if he stops taking it. Ideal Demolition -- Ideal
Demolition, the contractor that actually took down the old creamery, he's brought
technologies and stuff back from the California area on recycling and waste
management and he's going to incorporate some of that in his new location in Emmett.
So, he's our plan B if Ada county just happens not to accept our loads. So, that's huge
for us. And, then, last, but not least, our dumpster update. This is current as of last
week. We have a few mare bins -- actually, a few going out tomorrow, kind of gives us a
rundown of where we are looking. If you kind of just do comparison, it's pretty amazing
how much we are diverting from the landfill through the recycling efforts. You have
seen our dumpsters out there all lined up with their nice bilingual signage, which has
really helped with getting people to get in the right spot. So, just the extra steps like that
take the provisions and get everything in place to facilitate that. So, any questions you
guys have forme on Leed?
Rountree: Questions? Thank you.
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Johnson: No problem. I'll turn it over to Tom to go over the next section.
Tom: Mayor, Council, goad evening. Under tab four is the highlights of the budget
section. The budget remains unchanged from last month, 20.4 million pending the
receipt of the bids on the plaza work that's currently out for bid. No significant changes
there. We have included a sheet for your contingency allocations. That's the next
sheet. We will review that, but let you peruse it. Billing-wise, we are billed at slightly
more than 60 percent for the current progress through February. Any questions on that
section?
Rountree: No questions. Thank you.
Tom: The other section, ASIs, RFIs, and, of course, your favorite, the photos at the end,
so --
Rountree: Gene, you want to wrap up?
Holman: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I believe that Keith Watts has --
Watts: Hey, Tom, I just wanted to clarify something on the contingency page. You do
have Ideal Demolition -- their amount on here for the change orders, is that coming out
of the 700,000 contingency?
Tom: No, the phase one --
De Weerd: I'm sorry, we need you on the public record.
Tom: The deduct for the demo in the basement items for the previous was deducted
out --
Watts: Okay.
Tom: -- as part of the building's construction cost, so it's consistent with the budget
there.
Watts: So, the balance is pending -- we have 655,000 still pending in change orders
you're saying on here?
Tom: That's balance remaining. The balance pending for -- the estimated balance
pending for what you have issued to date is probably in the neighborhood of 261,000.
Watts' Okay. Got you. Thanks.
Tom: Okay.
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Bennett: As a wrap up, then, we will finalize the completion date for Council at our next
construction meeting in two weeks, if that's timely enough. Any other questions?
Rountre®: Anybody? Thanks, Gene.
De Weerd: Mr. Chair. I guess I notice you were putting the stone on.
Bird: Yes, they are.
De Weerd: Looking good.
Bird: It does, Gene. It looks very good. That stone's going to set it off. I don't know who
picked that out, but I'm sure it wasn't the architect.
Rountree: They had to give you some credit, Steve.
Bird: No. It looks -- it's really going to set it off. It really looks nice.
De Weerd: Did we want to talk signs?
Bird: No.
De Weerd: No?
Bird: These other people don't -- just you and I have.
Rountree: We haven't seen it.
De Weerd: Didn't we get an a-mail to you?
Bird: Just you and I.
Rountree: If it was e-mailed to me, it was this afternoon.
De Weerd: No. Okay. Forget it.
Rountree: Okay. Forget that item. Item B.
De Weerd: Mr. President?
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: I guess we did need same clarity on -- Keith needed some clarity as far as --
we need to get moving on parking and I know we took one step, but we do have some
current calculations that Mr. Watts has.
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Watts: I did put some numbers today -- put same numbers together today with the
information that I last received from our planning director. Her requirement was one
parking space per 500 square feet. I have taken the actual square footage from the
plans from the LCA, from the first, second and third floors, which totals 79,870.
Removed the square footage for the chambers, the historical society and the multi-
purpose room, which came to 75,786 square feet. That leaves us a total of 151 parking
spaces for that area. She also wanted us to add one additional for the office in the
basement for the maintenance facilities supervisor. Currently we have 58 stalls
available in our plan on the premises of the New City Hall. We have 41 available here.
So, as you can see that leaves us short a few.
De Weerd: So, we will be bringing some proposals back in the next week or two to firm
that up, because we want to make sure we get occupancy when we are able to move in.
Watts: Yes. That leaves us 53 short at this time with the two properties.
Rountree: Okay. Thank you. Hopefully we have remedied -- will be remedying that
shortly.
De Weerd: We have been inventorying.
Watts: Yes. I do believe with my calculations we are going to end up about nine short,
which we will need to remedy.
De Weerd: Keith, that didn't include availability at the old police station; correct?
Watts: It did not. That is without that.
Rountree: Any questions? Okay. Is that all he had, Mayor?
(b) Audit Report with Kevin Smith Eide Bailly -Kevin Smith / Stacy
Kilchenmann
Rountree: Okay. Next item. Audit report. Stacy, do you want to introduce this?
Kilchenmann: I'd like to introduce Kevin Smith from Eide Bailly. He's going to do the
audit presentation. He is our partner in charge -- our partner obtained, we might call
him. Actually, Kevin and his staff were very, very patient with us as we struggled -- and I
mean struggled to get through under the standard. So, with that I'll turn it over to Kevin.
Smith: Thank you. Good evening, Madam Mayor and Members of the Council. The
paint that Stacy did make, I will emphasize that a bit tonight. The report that you have
in front of you is the financial statement was prepared in its entirety by -- by staff of the
City of Meridian and that's the first time that has happened. So, I commend them for --
for preparing that statement. It's not an easy feat and the only thing that is ours in that
that we prepared is the first two pages, page one and two where we render an opinion.
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Everything else is prepared by -- by management and staff. And with that I will draw
attention to page one of the financial statement and in the third paragraph of the opinion
letter, on page one, it states: In our opinion the financial statements referred to
represent fairly in all material respects. And that -- and that is what we call an
unqualified or clean opinion on the financial statement and we are happy to report that
once again this year that we did issue a clean opinion. A couple items that I'd like to
point out in the financial statements themselves. First of all, on pages -- pages three
through 15 are what's called the management discussion analysis and in there that is
presented by -- and written by -- by management and in that discussion it gives the --
some of the changes, some of the highlights, some pictures, some graphs that you can
look at to compare, you know, what happened, you know, from last year to this year and
gives a -- you know, a goad picture of what occurred. On the -- on page 16 is the
statement of net assets or in the business world would be called a balance sheet. And
this is a complete picture on page 16 and 17 of the City of Meridian's assets, liabilities,
and what's remaining in net assets at September 30th, 2Q07. And with that, you know,
you can see, as far as the balance sheet in total, your total assets and this is full
accrual, everything accrued at this point, a little over 275 million. And as you look on
page 17, total liabilities are approximately 25 million dollars. And so the remaining
balance, then, is net assets. And, of course, a lot of that is tied up in your capital
assets. Page 18 is a governmental form of an income statement and this -- this income
statement is, again, full accrual, so it follows the balance sheet. And this gives you -- it's
broken down by program, so it has the expenses and, then, the revenues by program
and everything else, like property taxes, which don't fit into a specific program are listed
below. And the -- it comes to the net asset balance again of 249 million dollars. Page
19 is the general fund or all the governmental type funds, the general fund and the
capital projects fund together I reported. And this, again, is a kind of back to
governmental accounting, so it's not full accrual, so it doesn't have the -- the fixed
assets included in it. And this, again, gives a -- gives a picture at a specific point in time,
September 30th, 2007. And as you can see, the total assets in the general fund of
about 44 million dollars and the liabilities of about 17 and a half million dollars. So, with
that a very healthy balance sheet is what it shows and a large amount in net assets and
some of those net assets have been reserved for specific purposes on the bottom of
page 19 and, then, there is about 23 million that's unreserved or available for spending
in the -- in the city. Page 21 is the statement of revenues and expenses and the
changes in the fund balance for the governmental type funds. And in that you can see
the expenditures for -- in the capital products and that five and a half million -- 5.6
million is related to the construction of the New City Hall. And at the bottom you can
see in the general fund the change in fund balance of about three and a half million
dollars. So, you know, again, a -- you know, a real good year. Page 23 is the statement
of net assets or a balance sheet for the water and sewer funds combined and with that
you can see at the top cash and investments of about 38 million dollars and, you know,
however, that -- you know, mcst of that is for replacement of water and sewer and, you
know, things that will -- expansion that will come up in the future. Page 24 is the income
statement, statement of revenues and expenses related to water and sewer funds
again. And I did note on the water revenues and the sewer revenues combined about
13 percent increase from -- from the prior year. And, you know, one thing that did go
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March 11, 2008
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down in non-operating revenues is you look at connection assessment fees, went down
significantly, about 50 percent decline, which was expected, you knew, based vn the
number of building permits that we saw, you know, from last year to this year, you know,
it was expected that that would decrease significantly.
De Weerd: Mr. President?
Rountree: Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: I guess I have a question. On page 23 when you look at liabilities and your
net assets, do we put commitments on there, too, if -- like for Black Cat or -- so when --
when we have commitments that that's nat reflected on this?
Smith: Right. Commitments -- we have disclosed the commitments in the footnotes and
so everything that is planned is listed there. But it's not accrued in the balance. In any
balance as a liability at this point.
De Weerd: Yeah. I guess I don't understand why.
Rountree: Because there is no contracts.
Bird: Non-current assets, Kevin. Construction in progress. Buildings improved, other
than -- isn't that carried forward?
Smith: Construction in progress?
Bird: Yeah.
Smith: The construction in progress is a -- you know, it is the asset that -- it is under
construction and so that portion of the liabilities have either been paid ar it's been
accrued. Because it's been constructed, so the event has taken place.
De Weerd: Yeah. But the commitment is not captured.
Smith: Correct.
De Weerd: Only in a footnote.
Smith: That's correct.
Bird: Yes.
De Weerd: Even though you have a contract.
Smith: Right. You have a contract, but the event to incur that hasn't taken place and that
means that the work has to be completed.
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De Weerd: Okay. Because this is the year end. Okay. We will ignore that you just
talked, because it's not on the public record. Sorry, Mr. President.
Rountree: Go ahead, Kevin.
Smith: And, then, the next few pages are page 27 through about page 40 is our footnote
disclosure and this is a -- most of it's required information. Most of it supports the
amounts that are recorded in the balance sheet, fixed assets, debt, and those would be
the -- see the detail of what that is and like in debt what the payment plan is over the
next five years. So, just support far -- for the financial statements. Page 42 is the
budget -- is budget to actual comparison and in that we can see that total revenues --
the -- you can see the variance column on the far right-hand side. In total revenues, the
actual came out a little bit better than what was budgeted by about 680,000 dollars, but
the thing that I -- that kind of caught my eye was the expenditures, was -- the final
budget was about 29 and a half million and the actual spent was 23 million. So, a
significant, you know, savings on -- on budget. Any questions related to the -- to the
amounts that have been -- have been reported? I know it's a lot of information. With
that -- and the one other item I would like to just spend a moment on is the management
letter. And I'll glue you just a -- kind of a brief description so you can understand, you
know, what the management letter is and why we -- why we issue a management letter.
A manage letter is -- are things that we find that as we are doing the audit that we feel is
necessary to report to management and to Council and there are different degrees of
findings that we have that we report on and the most severe that we report on is called
a material weakness and that, basically, means that controls are so bad that there could
be material misstatements in the financial statements, so there is no controls in place --
maybe to -- if the bank reconciliation wasn't completed all year, then, that would be a
material weakness, because when you're coming in you'd have no idea what cash was.
It could be off, you know, several million dollars. The next -- and we happy to report
that we had no material weaknesses. The next one is called a significant deficiency and
that ,one -- with some of the new auditing standards that have came out, that's one that
we are seeing more and more of, because of -- like preparing the financial statement by
management, if management didn't prepare the financial statement, we would be
required to report a significant deficiency. If we had a lot of adjustments to the financial
information to prepare the financial statements, if we had to make a lot of journal entries
to the trial balance, changing amounts, we would report either a significant deficiency or
if they were large in dollars, then, we would report a material weakness, because the
internal control system would not be in place to -- to Identify those things in a timely
manner. And, then, that would mean during the year that the financial information that
you were receiving would not be accurate. So, we are happy to report that we did not
have any of those types of findings. However, we did note a couple items that we refer
to as other conditions and these are just items that -- that we want to bring to your
attention and sometimes as we look at these, we lank at the cost, you know, whether it
makes sense to -- you know, to put these in place or not. One of the items we have
reported on in the past is -- is the -- part of the challenge with management or with
accounting department to identify all of the fixed asset donations and I think there has
Meridian City Council Special Meeting /Workshop
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been a lot of progress, but especially on the values and a few years ago there was no
values assigned to them and so they were scrambling trying to find out, you know, what
value to even record that at. So, that's been corrected. But as far as the different
departments, it still feels like it's a little bit decentralized and, you know, as one
department will receive a piece of land, but it's not reported to the accounting staff, so
they can properly record it in the financial statements. So, we pointed that out again
and management has responded to that finding. Another item -- and this -- there was a
bank account that was opened and, you know, again, not abig -- a big deal in my
opinion, however, it's probably something, you know, looking forward, just another
reminder that, you know, if bank accounts are opened, that that should be approved by
the Council, so you're aware of what's going on. In this situation it was just a -- let's
see. Oh. It was part of the checking account, just so they could float the money back
and forth. So, it wasn't a big issue, but, you know, if there was a significant account
open, then, you would definitely want to be aware of that. On the last one is kind of the
same -- on the -- related to the -- as -- as the bank accounts and there was disaster
recovery plan -- and there is one in place, but just a reminder that that needs to be
consistently kept up on a continual basis and, you know, part of the reason we bring
that up is, as you know, with the Middleton High School, that brought it all to -- all to light
with the importance of having that recovery plan in place and so that operations can
continue if a disaster were to occur.
Rountree: Good point.
Smith: But other than that, I think it was a great year -- another great year for the city
and we appreciate, you know, this opportunity and we appreciate working with -- with
the accounting staff, they do a tremendous job. They are very timely. They get us the
information that we request on a -- in a timely manner and, you know, over the years
that's been improved over and over and over. So, we do appreciate the efforts that they
make. Any other questions?
Rountree: Question for Kevin? Thank you for your time and report.
Smith: Thank you.
Rountree: And, Stacy, thank you. I know it was a struggle having to take on that
responsibility this year to make that change. And Todd and Rita and everybody else.
(c) ACRD Update on the Fairview Corridor Study -Matt Ellsworth -
Planning.
Rountree: Next item. Matt, are you going to handle both C and D? ACRD update on
Fairview and ACRD agenda for our next meeting?
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Members of the Council, Madam Mayor that was the plan.
Unfortunately, both Pete Friedman and Anna Canning are out sick today, so they
passed the torch over to me to carry those two items forward.
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De Weerd: Congratulations.
Rountree: Very good. We know you can handle it.
Ellsworth: Okay. So, the first item -- over the course of the past several months ACRD
has been laying the foundation to prepare a concept design for Fairview Avenue and
the various roadway segments for Fairview are programmed for construction over the
course of the next five to ten years. The geographic area of this concept design runs
from Linder Road in Meridian aver to Orchard in Boise and the project team that has
been working over the -- over the past few months consists of representatives of
ACHD's various departments and also representatives of both the City of Meridian and
the city of Boise and what we have been doing is just sort of focusing -- focusing
attention to certain issues that will require additional analysis and basically weeding
through options, identifying certain things that may not be the most appropriate to move
forward in these analyses and other things that will require additional attention as this
process moves forward. So, here with us this evening is Kendall Kemmer, who is the
project manager for the concept design, and he is -- he's with us this evening to provide
an update about the process so far.
Kemmer: Thank you. Thank you, Matt.
Rountree: Thank you.
Kemmer: Thank you, Council, and thank you, Matt. Yeah. Matt did same of my work
already, so I guess that will make my presentation shorter. The first thing I have is
want to, one, make sure everybody has a copy of the memo that was provided. If not, I
have additional copies.
Rountree: If you would pass those out we'd appreciate it.
Kemmer: Oh, yes. Sure. Okay. Thank you, again, for the opportunity to discuss the
Fairview Avenue concept design. As Matt mentioned, this goes from Linder Road in
Meridian to Orchard Street in Boise. We have completed the first phase and I'm here
tonight to give you an update on phase one, a description on where we are going with
phase two, and to hear your comments and ideas. Phase one included a stakeholder
interview, two public open houses, one was held in Boise, one in Meridian. A project
survey that was mass mailed and also available online. And as Matt mentioned, the
project team included members from the city of Boise and City of Meridian and we
appreciate their help in this process. Fairview Avenue is a mobility corridor which
supports current and planned commercial mixed use land uses and both Meridian and
Boise city staff agreed with that characterization and we do recognize the recent
request from the City of Meridian to have the portion of Cherry Lane west of Meridian
Road for the typologies as a commercial arterial and to take away that mobility corridor
designation, sa we do recognize that recent request from the city. Phase one includes
the development of assumptions and a screening analysis of options for the corridor,
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which I will address later on. One of the other big things, too, was access management
is -- plan is required for the corridor. That was one thing the team had decided. The
development of the access management plan will start immediately in the second phase
and will include early involvement with businesses and properties along the corridor.
Once adopted, the access management plan will be used in the development approval
process and will also be incorporated into future AGHD projects in the corridor. It is
anticipated the majority of the plan will be implemented through the redevelopment or
the development process. Per the concept design, one thing we propose and you will
see it in the memo there is to expend the dollars in the most cost effective way. We
have separated the corridor into separate levels. We want to do a more -- I guess the
concept level design for those sections that are higher in the five year work program
from both a priority standpoint and based on its scheduling. And the remaining sections
will be developed to a scoping level with the additional traffic analysis to determine the
future cross-sections and this will provide us with a concept footprint for those sections.
One thing you will note in there is the Maple Grove to Cole section was not included in
the five year work program, but we did recommend it for the concept analysis detail due
to its high priority ranking. We also discussed transit along this corridor. The team was
asked to consider future light rail, bus, rapid transit, or street cars for Fairview Avenue.
The team evaluated these options and does not recommend advancing those with our
concept design. These options are not consistent with Communities in Motion and are
not compatible with Valley Regional Transit's plan. The project team's recommendation
was presented to the Compass regional technical advisory committee on February 27th
and they concurred with our recommendation and the recommendation will be
forwarded to the Compass board for their meeting on March 17th to discuss this item.
We do -- we will incorporate the future bus plans, though, for this corridor. The Valley
Ride has -- or Valley Regional Transit has set out. One thing that's going to be
important for this corridor is the intersections and with the concept design we are going
to evaluate all the major intersections and this will include ones that have recently been
improved as well. One reason for that is we want to identify those intersections that are
projected to have a level of service F in the year 2030 -- roughly 2035 as well, too. We
want to do that, because there are some intersections that have been recently
improved, but they may not -- they may not have capacity in that future year and we
want to identify those. We also want to look at various options for those, because there
may be some circumstances where some additional corridor preservation may be
warranted or needed and also the selecting of the preferred configurations for the
intersections, we are looking for adoption by bath ACRD and the city for the
intersections. The screening options -- the third -- or I guess the fourth page of your
handout there has a sheet that we put together, the project team did, we have got a
number of assumptions that we have for the corridor and we also list roadway options
and intersection options that were analyzed and I don't want to go through it and read all
those, but if the Council and the Mayor has specific questions I'll address those. I think
the biggest thing we wanted to get out of this is for the majority of the corridor, the three
options we are looking at pursuing are -- and this in your map that I handed out also.
To analyze the seven lane section for the entire corridor except the portion from Curtis
to Orchard in Boise and I think that's one thing for the Council here and the Mayor
tonight, too, is with the designation of Cherry Lane west of Meridian as a mobility
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Page 18 of 67
corridor, the one thing that I think will be important or helpful to me is if the Council sees
that the highway district should not include a seven lane configuration for that portion of
the road. One thing we were looking at the right of way that we currently own right
there, it's only about an 80 foot section far that whole stretch, so going to something
beyond a five would require additional right of way and that may not be a desire of the
city. So, that's one thing I'm kind of looking forward tonight if you have a
recommendation on that. The other options were, then, to analyze the whole corridor
as a five lane section. The traffic numbers that we are looking at from the very high
level don't look too favorable for the majority for keeping the five lane section, because
the traffic numbers are much higher than what a five lane section can handle, but we do
want to -- we do want to look at that as one of the options we carry forward. There may
be some benefits to -- we anticipate some benefits in looking at that option as well.
And, then, we also had one to the seven lane BAT section, which is Business Access
and Transit lands. That's an option we want to take forward that could provide some
additional capacity in those through lanes, that it would provide access -- better access
for businesses there and also for the transit to function in those outside lanes. So, that's
something we want to pursue. And I think I already mentioned, too, on the
intersections, too, those intersections we want to look at just kind of the conventional
approaches that we normally have, but we -- our assumption, though, too, is there are
some intersections that may not -- may not be able to have adequate capacity with just
the conventional capacity with just the conventional layout and we know that Compass
has just gone through an exercise looking at some high volume intersections for this
region. Both the Fairview and Eagle and the Fairview -Curtis intersections and within
the limits of this project that were analyzed by Compass_ One thing we want to do with
some of those intersections that are showing that there is capacity constraints, we do
want to look at some -- the high volume intersection options, too, as potential options. I
guess that's all I have. So, I'm open for comments and questions that the Mayor and
the Council may have.
Rountree: Comments? Questions?
De Weerd: Mr. President?
Rountree: Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: I just can't be quiet. I just can't support a seven lane freeway through the
middle of town and, you know, I guess my question is have you modeled connectivity on
Ustick, McMillan, Franklin, Overland, and Victory as transportation corridors moving
traffic both east and west to help distribute the traffic demands in that? Right now we
have Fairview and I-84 that function as an east-west connected corridor. Even Franklin
isn't even connected five lanes. So, haw do you model that when you don't have any
functional east-west corridors?
Kemmer: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, one thing we did during the first phase, we did
ask Compass to do a model run where if Fairview was constrained to a five lane section
what would that do to the other roads. It wasn't favorable to say Ustick and Franklin.
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And another thing, too, that we -- that's going to be a consideration we have to look at is
Fairview getting the designation of a mobility corridor, the anticipation is that it will
handle additional traffic, higher than say the Franklin and Ustick. But its use is a little bit
different and I guess another thing, too, is there is just a lot of cars that are projected for
this corridor and they need to go somewhere. It's one of the trade-offs we are looking at
if we don't -- if Fairview isn't widened, it will have impacts on other corridors, sa that's
some of the trade-offs that will have to be looked at when we go through our analysis of
some of these options. The one thing, too, that we can look at is there may be an
opportunity -- and I can't promise anything, but in looking at the intersections, if the
intersections are built out to such a point, what does that do to the capacity on Fairview.
So, that's one thing we want to look at is are there some sections that may be able to
haridle a five lane section with intersection improvements. So, I think right now that's --
part of our thing is to analyze that to have that information presented, so we can look at
same of those trade-offs and the -- what are some of the realizations of just where does
all that traffic go. One thing we have also heard, though, from a lot of the constituents
that we have dealt with, they don't want the traffic on Ustick. We have heard that loud
and clear. Don't put it on Ustick. They want it on Fairview. So, I think there is a
recognition from the public and from the stakeholders that we have heard that they want
the traffic to be on Fairview. So, I guess in the first phase we did do that, look to kind of
see what does it do if we constrain Fairview to a five lane section. And it does push
traffic onto the other corridors that may or may not be able to handle -- to handle that
additional traffic.
De Weerd: Well, the planning staff can correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't remember
anywhere in a comp plan that contemplated a seven lane road an Fairview and certainly
if you do that, we will have asphalt, then, a curb, and, then, asphalt in parking. That
certainly hasn't been the vision of our community and certainly is a major concern in that
area. Especially the area probably west of that Fairview-Eagle Road intersection. So,
don't -- I know what ACHD's vision for that was, but when we updated our
Comprehensive Plan in 2002 it wasn't my impression anyone was stating that was going
to be a seven lane road.
Kemmer: Okay. Mr. President, Madam Mayor, one thing to also consider, though, is the
capital improvements plan that ACRD does have, it has Fairview as a seven lane road
for the past I don't know how many years. All new developments that have been
coming in, they have been preserving a seven lane footprint. I did mention that it's
about an 80 foot right of way when you get west of Meridian Road, but when you started
heading east from there, we already currently own in the range of 110, 115, 120 feet of
right of way already. So, it has been planned from a development or a corridor
preservation standpoint that they are getting a seven lane section. Every new
development that comes in -- that has come in is coming now and will come in before
this concept design is done. They are acquiring the footprint for a seven lane section.
So, when I hear you mention that it may not have been the vision, that's been the
highway district -- in their capital improvement plan that is what's laid out for this
corridor. But one of the things about doing this concept design is to take a deeper look
Meridian City COUncil Special Meeting /Workshop
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at that and figure out what's appropriate. But I just did want to mention that is what has
-- being preserved far that corridor currently.
De Weerd: And can you tell me -- Mr. President?
Rountree: Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: Can you tell me what the reasoning of not considering public transportation
down the center in a fixed route, mare the street car concept, along Fairview?
Kemmer: It goes back to what I mentioned before, the recommendation of -- in our
working with Compass and also with Valley Ride. Valley Ride doesn't have it in their
plans far a system like that and they also are pointing out that it's not consistent with
what Communities in Motion has indicated where they see the rail corridor handling a lot
of that function. They saw Fairview Avenue being for the increased bus service, with a
15 minute headway and --
De Weerd: So, in your modeling was the rail corridor considered as another route to
move a large number of people?
Kemmer: Was the rail corridor considered?
De Weerd: Uh-huh.
Kemmer: From the context of that's what Communities in Motion has adapted, the
recommended -- where that type of service -- transit service should be. So, we did --
you know, from a high level analysis we are looking at does -- does it make sense for
Fairview and the project teams' recommendation, which it doesn't based on Compass,
based on Valley Ride's plan, based on just how well it fits in with the other things that
are currently in the pipeline.
De Weerd: I guess I need to restate that question, Mr. President.
Rountree: Go right ahead.
De Weerd: So, if the rail corridor was functional, thafi would not take demand off of
Fairview to reduce the need for seven lanes?
Kemmer: The -- in the modeling by Compass, it does have those -- that use in their
already when they are modeling. If they have gat the rail corridor in there, there is an
assumption that will take so many trips off of, you know, the surrounding roadways. But
we didn't do a very high -- we didn't do a very detailed analysis of what would -- you
know, if did BRT ar same other things on Fairview. This is from a very high level of
analysis. And that was the whole point of this first phase was to go through and analyze
options for this corridor to see what made sense to carry forward and we are not
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March 11, 2008
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recommending those options being carried forward for the BRT, the light rail, or a street
car on Fairview.
Rountree: Any other questions?
Bird: Mr. President. I guess -- I think you answered my question. You said excluding
from Meridian Road to Linder that owned --from Orchard to Meridian Road enough right
of way for the seven lanes?
Kemmer: Mr. President, Councilmember Bird, it's primarily on the portion within
Meridian where -- as was mentioned, we have got 110, 108, 115. I was mostly focusing
on the portion that's in the -- within the City of Meridian. As we move into Boise, we are
much better when you get between where the city limits are for Meridian and say about
Milwaukee, through redevelopment much of that has come in. Not all of it, but to a
greater extent than when you continue heading further east between Milwaukee and
Curtis it is a lot tighter, a lot more constrained. So, I was referring primarily to the
section within Meridian.
Bird: Okay. I misunderstood you, then.
Kemmer: Okay.
Bird: Fallow up, please.
Rountree: Mr. Bird.
Bird: And you made a statement about Ustick. I disagree. I think that Ustick should be
one of the major east-west corridors, because it goes the farthest. What you're doing
on Fairview -- if you come down with a five lane, once you get to Black Cat, you're
cutting -- we are doing the same thing that we are trying to salve right out here on I-84.
You're coming from a five lane to a two lane. So, when you get to Black Cat, you lose
your mass deal. I think we are -- and I know why you're getting -- where you're getting
your complaints on Ustick. It's about one mile in Boise.
Rountree: That's one of our suburbs.
Bird: It's one of our suburbs, so -- you said that first. But Ireally -- and there -- there is
so many accesses on Fairview Avenue, having driven that for 42 years in business back
and forth, I mean in 1962 it was dangerous because of all the accesses. I mean every -
- every retail outlet has an access to Fairview Avenue. So, I don't know, I -- while I like
the improvement on Fairview, I really got some concerns of how much traffic you want
to really push down it.
De Weerd: Mr. President?
Rountree: Madam Mayor.
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De Weerd: I guess, you know, what I'd like to see is, one, the other corridors built before
this -- a dollar is spent on engineering and design on this. I also would like to see if at
some point we can get an existing right of way map, so we know where you do have the
right of way and where you don't and what that means in landscape setbacks and are
we going to just have pavement, curbing, sidewalk, pavement or what we are creating in
that area and a little bit more -- and how you're going to integrate the concepts that
you're developing to the TLIP and how that can apply to -- to use in this area. And
update -- I'd like to see the modeling numbers. If they use the rail corridor in their
numbers, I guess I'm a little bit perplexed as why there is still such a huge demand on
Fairview, especially if these other corridors are functioning like they are supposed to.
And Mr. Bird is correct; I mean Ustick is the only one that goes clear down to Marsing.
So, I'm concerned about a seven lane road.
Rountree: Comments? Questions?
Borton: Mr. President?
Rountree: Joe.
Borton: Briefly, Kendall, this is great. Iwon't -- I won't beat you up as much. I agree with
lots of the comments, with the exception of Councilman Bird's comments about Fairview
in '62. Don't have any comment on what Fairview was like.
Bird: You weren't even born.
Borton: I don't know what it was like in '72 either.
Rountree: It was there.
Borton: One of the questions when you talk about some of the engineering work that
you're doing, it seems to all presuppose that TLIP and ACFO that is I presume intended
to follow is a sure thing and if that's not the case, then, this analysis sort of goes aut the
door. Is that fair to say?
Kemmer: I'm not sure if it -- when you say it goes out the door -- I think what we have
been trying to do -- well, this has been part of the hard part I think of doing these type of
concept designs is for the past however many months or a little aver a year, TLIP has
been evolving. The one thing we have tried to do in the first phase -- you know, it's --
we have worked with your staff trying to make sure that we have got a clear picture of
what the land use goals and aspirations for the City of Meridian. We have done the
same thing with Boise, too. We have also tried -- we have done checking ins with our
team members at ACRD who are more involved in the TLIP and we periodically check
in and say here is where we are at, are we within what TLIP is working towards, are we
outside of the bounds -- so, we have been trying to stay touch in with them and making
sure that we are in line with where things are going. But it has been very difficult in
Meridian City Council Special Meeting !Workshop
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Page 23 of 67
some extent with same of these things that are not quite finalized yet. Even the
recommendation of, you know, the mobility corridor, the designation of the typologies
west of Meridian, you know, that's evolving while this process is going on. It's kind of
funny that -- you know, working with the city, that came after my first memo to our
Council -- or our commission and, then, we met with Boise and, then, we met with you.
So, things have evolved even after I put this first memo together. So, what we are
trying to do is trying to get some transportation to match the best we can.
De Weerd: Stop the moving target.
Kemmer: And that's been somewhat difficult. I think what we are hoping for is we are
pleased with the progress that TLIP is making, we look forward to getting resolution on
that, because I think once we have that in place, it will surely help define some of the
limitations, the limits of what we looking at, because, you know, we have been talking
about these pedestrian zones, what ACHD pays for, what the city pays far, landscaping
issues, those kind of things, we know that's something that we will work through and
towards in the second phase. The sooner it gets done the better I think we are all, so --
and Idon't know if -- I think you said something that if the ACFO goes away -- I think
what we are trying to do is just trying to come up with a plan that fits this corridor best
regardless of what happens with the ACFO, because we can't -- we can't control what
happens -- what the final product looks like, how that all evolves. The one thing I know,
my task -- move this project forward, you know, try to come up with the best thing that
we can. So, some of that we are just trying to do the best we can in the situation that
we are at right now with same of the uncertainties that are going on, so -- but we will be
constantly checking in with our staff, the city staff, just making sure we are -- we are
kind of where everybody thinks we should be from the TLIP standpoint.
De Weerd: Well, I'm trying to remain consistent.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Ijust -- I want to commend the work that you're doing and appreciate that you
are working very carefully with the staff of both Meridian and Boise. That being said,
there are some constraints that we need to continue to be aware of. You are looking
out 20 years, not concerning either full build out of Meridian and Boise and your
consideration stops at the county line. Unfortunately, that's all ACRD is responsible for.
The capacity needed in Meridian has to consider what Nampa and Caldwell are doing
and I don't know how you can step across the county line and figure some of that out.
Maybe asking Compass, I guess, but we are vastly unprepared if we don't look longer
than 20 years and farther than just the county and I realize that's beyond your
responsibility, but it scares me.
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('age 24 of 67
Kemmer; Councilmember Zaremba, yeah, I appreciate your comments and I know I
have been at other meetings where I have heard you express some of the things and
do appreciate that. I think you have expressed --
Zaremba: I do keep saying it over and over.
Kemmer: I forget where the meeting was, but I know you'd like to see going out 40
years, something a little bit longer than that, and I know there are discussions going on
with Compass with same of those -- looking out longer. You know, the one thing, too,
there are limitations to the model, but, fortunately, that we -- the Compass model that
we have is bath Ada and Canyon, so hopefully we can incorporate or they can capture
some of those trips that are doing the cross-county, but there are limitations, obviously,
so -- and some of that, like you said, too, is kind of outside of our purview, but I think we
try to do what we can within the limitations of what's before us.
Zaremba: Thank you.
Kemmer: Yes. Thank you.
Rountree: I have a couple comments. I'm looking at your screening process and I think
you have done a good job. I'm particularly interested in your parallel connectivity or
access control options, particularly raised median. I think a lot of these things will
squeeze a lot more capacity out of this facility. It may very well be at some point in time
when you start looking at frontage and back-age roads, we are not looking at seven
lanes, but we might be looking at same combination of lanes and capacities in that
corridor. One thing that concerns me in the things that you have thrown out is the grade
separation, particularly when you talk about high volume intersections. I know they are
expensive, I have built a few. But when you start talking about real estate, the
businesses that are potentially impacted, it may, in fact, be an option that you want to
fall back on. So, I wouldn't rule that out entirely. I wouldn't put a big red no there. I
might put a big purple maybe. I think it's something that you need to value engineer,
particularly when you're looking at 20, 30 year volumes. And you asked specifically
about comments on Meridian to Linder. My comment is that Meridian, Main, and
Fairview is a tough nut to fix and in 30 years it's going to be even more difficult. I really
and truly have thought about that a lot and I haven't figured out a solution yet that's not
fiscally constrained.
Kemmer: Are you referring to the stretch of Fairview between Main and Meridian? I
want to make sure I'm --
Rountree: That stretch in there.
Kemmer: Okay.
Rountree: From Meridian to Linder I think, depending on what you do with the rest of
Fairview, that certainly needs to be a transition zone, but I would like to see it more in
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the five lane and with a median, a fixed continuous median. The other thing I'd like to
see the county step up to -- or ACRD step up to is community identify. We are talking
about Boise and Meridian on Fairview, we are talking about Fairview coming into the
heart of our downtown. Our downtown plan anyway is for a great place to come and
visit. It's not there yet, but we are working on it, and we got plans, ACHD has those
plans, and I would like to see whatever is done here, even if it's a mobility corridor,
whether it's Boise or Meridian, that that community identity needs to be a prominent
feature in this roadway and I know the feeling of ACHD about landscaping and who is
going to pay for it and who is going to maintain it -- and I have some strong feelings
there as well, but I think we cross that when we get there, but I think it's something that
needs to be taken account of in the concepts.
Kemmer: I appreciate your comments, Mr. President. The one thing that I was going to
say -- one thing nice for me on the stretch of Fairview between Main and Meridian, that
is being handled through the split corridor phase two, which is on a faster track than
what we are on and I think that's good in some ways. So, they are trying to wrestle with
those issues with that very tight, very short stretch between, you know, two signalized
intersections and I know they are evaluating those options and I do check in with the
project manager on that just to see where they are at, because what happens there is
going to impact our work, then, too. And I appreciate your comments, too, on the
landscaping. I can convey your comments and feelings. I think for staff it's kind of nice
somewhat -- not that I'm totally neutral, but our job as project managers, bring those
ideas forward, bring those out there, let's get them out and let's see if we can get some
resolution figured out something that works for all agencies.
Rountree: It's stuff for future dialogue. I mean we need to talk about it.
Kemmer: Yes, sir.
Rountree: We can't just put our heads in the sand.
De Weerd: Mr. President?
Rountree: Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: I guess in light of that, how you can tie that -- that Eagle -Fairview
intersection with some of the designs they have on the Eagle corridor and that is one of
the identity things with -- ITD really worked with us and how you can have a sense of
whatever municipality you're in and we did that through identification with the street
lights and so that might be something that you can do along that -- that entry and exit
from Boise into Meridian is -- is use that through street-lighting or a boulevard treatment
or something. But if you can include some of that into that design. That intersection will
be a challenge however you do it.
Kemmer: Yeah. And, Mr. President, Madam Mayor, the one thing that -- you know,
obviously, as we are going through the concept design, we are not doing final design on
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any of these stretches there, but identifying those issues and concerns, because things
like that are very important at this stage, because we will need to know and be aware of
those as these individual sections move into final design, to at least have a better idea
of what the city's vision is, so we can work with your staff to try to make those things
happen, so I appreciate that.
De Weerd: Well, that message was for staff, then, t00.
Rountree: Got any other comments, questions for Kendall? Thank you for putting up
with us.
Kemmer: Oh. Well, you're welcome. I appreciate the opportunity and we appreciate
working with your staff as well, too.
De Weerd: Like I said, Mr. President, I'm trying to be consistent in my comments I gave
you in our interview, too.
Kemmer: Yes, ma'am. Thank you.
Rountree: Thank you. Matt, the agenda.
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Members of the Council --
De Weerd: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mayor overrules. Mayor.
(e) Update on Heritage Ball Fields -Steve Siddoway.
De Weerd: Matt, if you don't mind, we do have members from the school district, if we
can kind of swap this one and theirs, so that our guests don't have to sit through another
agenda item. I know we are very exciting, but I'm sure they would appreciate it. If we
can just swap those two items.
Rountree: I don't have a problem with that. If that's the will of the Council we can do
that.
Bird: I have no problem with that.
Rountree: Okay.
Zaremba: I agree.
Rountree: Take a break, Matt. Thank you.
Ellsworth: Thank you.
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Siddoway: Ready?
Rountree: Uh-huh,
Siddoway: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, you should have with
you a packet that includes a copy of the current draft agreement for the Heritage Middle
School ball fields. This is something that's been worked on for some time and in the
couple months since it reached my desk I have been working with the school district, we
have worked out several issues regarding field scheduling and things like that and have
agreement vn the vast majority of the agreement. There are two outstanding issues
that we here are tonight to seek your direction on. Those two issues are, one, the
reimbursement amount and, two, the term of the agreement, the number of years. In the
packet that you have -- let's see, I'll take those in order. First I'll address the
reimbursement amount. The -- Exhibit B, towards the back of the agreement, has a list
of -- a summary of costs that the school district has documented to the tune of just
under 280,000 dollars that they have requested reimbursement for. As I have been
researching the approved budgets to date, I have a couple of handouts. So, the first
item -- the reimbursement amount is addressed in the agreement on page two of 15
and, then, the documentation of the school district cost is in Exhibit B towards the back.
And, then, as I have looked through our awn budgeting process, what I have found --
there was 200,000 dollars -- an even 200,000 dollars that was approved in 2006 as part
of the '07 budget for lighting of the Heritage Middle School ball fields and I think that's
the number that has stuck in most everyone's mind is does the amount, at least in terms
of the city's commitment towards this -- in '07 in the budget enhancement with the few
lines highlighted on there, what I found that last year there was -- there was discussion
and budget approved far an emergency access road. Originally, 37,000 dollars had
been requested, 30,000 of that was removed and 7,000 total of that was approved. The
middle item that's highlighted is for bleachers and dugout benches and the school
district has already put in the dugout benches, but not the bleachers, so approximately
3,000 dollars of that 15,000 dollars had been intended to go toward dugout benches
and they are currently installed. So, as I look at this approved budget, I find that there is
200,000 dollars for the lights, 7,000 dollars approved for an emergency access road,
and 3,000 dollars that were approved to go toward dugout benches that could very
easily be agreed to, based on currently approved budgets, to reimburse the school
district for work that's already been done. They have had other expenses and there are
representatives here from the school district tonight, both Scott Stewart and Wendell
Bigham here to address Council regarding those expenses and to get your feelings as
to, you know, whether some of these costs could be reimbursed or not. So, setting that
one aside for just a moment, the second issue that Iwant -- that we want to get your
input on is the term of the agreement and it is Section M on page eight of the draft
agreement. In short, the school district would like to have the term of the agreement be
ten years. We would prefer to have the term of the agreement be 20 years. What I am
proposing as a proposed solution that I'd like your feedback on is what's currently
written is that the -- our investment in that property be amortized over -- over ten years.
50, if the -- if the contract were ever terminated in less than ten years, there would be a
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reimbursement to the city of our funds and that amount that would be reimbursed
decreases by ten percent every year for up to ten years. Iwould -- right now I would say
that that stay as written, but that we write the term of agreement as a 20 year
agreement to show our intention to have this -- have this agreement extend beyond that
and to -- to continue this forward. So, I would propose that the term of the agreement
be written in as 20 years. Item N, Section 3, addresses the ten percent per year and
that's already written in the way. So, I would seek your direction an those two issues.
First, the reimbursement amount. We clearly have an intent for 200,000. I have found
through approved budgets 210,000, and the school district would like to address
Council on potentially more. And, then, the second item, then, the term of the
agreement, ten years versus 2Q years, or the compromise I discussed. So, with that I
' will either stand for any questions or invite the school district up. Thank you.
Stewart: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, and Members of the Council, my name is Scott
Stewart and I am the district activities and athletic director and so I'd like to just speak to
some of the -- the table that you're looking at there and provide you some more
information that our offices have gathered far you. And a couple of those will be some
site plans to describe a little bit about -- that first table you're looking at -- and I'm not
sure -- it's the one that has the broken dawn casts and I don't know if you're able to see
that. I'm not sure what you're looking at. Do you have that? But it's also in this packet.
But the first initial discussion I'd like to start with is that initial grading, irrigation, and
fencing changes and that was -- as you will see in the site plan, the change from the
original design of the Heritage Middle School, when we went through that concept of
changing the design to include the softball complex with five -- five softball fields and
you will see the changes there. And that was -- that was after a point where I know
working with the park and rec department, as well as our district, we were facing same
discussion out there with -- so, getting back to that table there, that's the initial redesign.
As I was speaking through -- at the same time the district was having same issues of
possible inquiry into discrimination based upon the gender of the participation of softball
and baseball comparability within our district and facilities, the parks and rec were also
dealing with the same issues. And so that's sort of where our -- the discussion started
with the redesign and that explains the redesign casts, the change from -- you see the
large site map where you have a baseball field and I believe there is three softball fields
in the corners of the facility, that was the original design and, then, there was the
changes to that design that shows this cost where we made the cloverleaf pattern of the
softball fields, as well as the additional fifth field. So, that explains those costs there of
changing the site plan. Speaking to the emergency access road, you know, that was
just something that came up once the design was changed of the requirements in order
to have that emergency access and the expense of that.. So, that really touches the
base of those costs that were incurred in creating this facility. And I also wanted to
speak to the purpose of the -- of the -- the use agreement and coming into this position
found that when working with the city and the school district on shared, you know,
facility use of our school district properties, we weren't very clearly defined of
expectations on both sides. This priority usage and use agreement will allow us to do
that and it will also allow us to have an agreement that gives us some backbone in the
district for priority use. The programs that are being ran through the recreation
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department are within our facilities and I'm getting so many more requests from upstart
programs that want to come in and have priority and jump right over top. Starting with
this softball complex and developing an agreement for the joint use of our facilities, it's
going to allow us to have some backbone to identify that the recreation programs do
have priority in facilities and, then, there is an order of priority. And so that is the start of
our priority use within -- with the parks and rec department with the recreation programs
that are going to be ran within our facilities. I'll answer any questions if there are any
out there.
Bird: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Scatty, I'm talking as a taxpayer, not a councilman. What -- and Wendell might
have to answer this. What kind of acreage is this compared to Sawtooth? Because
they are, basically, the same square footage.
Stewart: I believe the acreage is both 40 acre --
Bird: Both 40 acres? Okay. How many middle school softball teams do you guys
have?
Stewart: Councilman Bird, there are no middle school softball teams or programs within
our district. One of the questions -- or your prior question about the size of the facilities,
that has been revisited about what is necessary for a middle school acreage and, then,
that has been shrunk down because of the -- the programs we do have on an outdoor
facility.
Bird: Yeah. At a hundred thousand an acre, yeah, I'm sure you don't get anymore acres
than you want -- than you need. As everybody probably knows in this room, I have a
problem as a taxpayer when we in the City of Meridian have at least four or five softball
fields that aren't being used fully and are not lighted, the only lighted fields we got in
Meridian has been done by outside sources -- has not done it. I -- did we come to you
guys --did the city come to the school district asking them to put this in?
Stewart: Mr. President --
Bird: Do you know?
Stewart: -- Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I don't know that -- that answer.
Bird: Okay, Scott.
De Weerd: Mr. President, I know that answer and it's, no, we didn't.
Bird: Okay. I hoped that's what it was. Anyway --
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Zaremba: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: This may be a small issue, but you mentioned third-party requests to use
these fields. If they are using the lighting and electricity, are they paying anything to
recover that?
Stewart: Mr. President, Mayor, and Members of the Council, within the agreement --
once we have the use of the facilities during the school day, we virtually are turning over
the facilities to the city to run recreation programs or to schedule groups out of, where I
believe it's in there, fees will be able to be charged for those clerical responsibilities or
even utilities, I believe. I mean that's something that's left up in the agreement there -- it
can be discussed at a later point, but once we turnover the responsibility, it's the city's
fields to operate and run.
Zaremba: Separate question, Mr. President.
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Do you have a -- would you have heartburn with this being a 20 year
agreement?
Stewart: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, and Members of the Council, me personally I
don't see an end date on this agreement. Now, I know the employee of a -- who I
represent, they want to have dates, but this is going to be something that I don't ever
want to see an end to the agreement and that's something that, hopefully, 20 years
may be the only one there and can uphold that agreement and so my plan is that 20
years -- that was something we can take back, you know, to our superintendent and
members of our school board, but I have no problems with that.
Zaremba: Thank yau.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
Rountree: Mr. Borton.
Borton: Sorry, Mr. President.
Rountree: That's okay.
Borton: I might have adifferent -- a different tact on this. I'm not necessarily inclined to
go back and try and second guess, you know, what we did or why we did it. I agree
with the Mayar as to where this started, but I remember a discussion about -- with
regards to efficient use of taxpayer dollars is this is a rare -- hopefully a first opportunity
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to really leverage the district's and the city's need and desires and assets in a
partnership like this. Basically, what the city's provided -- I remember this discussion
earlier for 200,000 or 280,000 -- even at 280,000 dollars is a four field lighted softball
complex with priority use to provide some new recreational opportunities, which we
don't already provide. We kind of went through that when we thought the 200,000
dollars was a good idea. You couldn't build this -- you couldn't buy the dirt and develop
and build this type of facility anywhere close to that. So, I understand the concerns
about -- about use, the district's taking a big risk in trying to partner with us. If it's a
simple -- again, I don't like to negotiate these things on the -- on the record, but if it's as
simple as splitting the baby, that's fine with me, I can tell you I don't have heartburn with
at 280 and I know that's probably just me, just because I know what the city's getting.
do agree that 20 years would be much better if we went that route. Whether it's 240
and 15 years -- again, I don't necessarily like to try and do this sitting here on the public
record, but those are at least my thoughts. I think it's a huge benefit to the city and I
don't -- and a good sign of what can happen as we go forward with future facilities-
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: You have given it 280,000 dollars if we ended up agreeing to 20 years, we
are talking about a cost to the city, even though it would be paid up front, the overall
cost is 14,000 dollars a year for exactly what Councilman Borton has said is worth a
whole lot mare than that to the city.
Rountree: Further comments?
Bird: Mr. President, I'll make one comment. I know it's important we have play facilities,
but we don't seem -- we don't fill up the existing softball fields we got, so I don't -- you
know, so let's don't get me --don't come down the road that way.
Rountree: I guess my comments are more pragmatic. Not what we are getting or what's
getting done to us, but it seems to me this was a business arrangement and our
business arrangement said this is what we were going to do. I don't recall anybody ever
coming to the city and saying we need mare. The only discussion I heard along this --
with this project is that we had some issues with an access road. Our budget reflected
some additional monies for an access road. The access road was due primarily to the
city ordinance requirement and fire safety. I just, from a practical standpoint, don't like
and don't go along with all of a sudden it costs us more in -- we are here to pick up the
difference. That's just my personal opinion. If there would have been a dialogue along
with this a year ago or a year and a half ago, saying, hey, we have got some additional
costs and do you folks want to weigh that in your budgeting process, then, to me that's
fair. But to came at the end of the deal -- and from what I heard, kind of coming on a
little strong, that the city owed more money and I don't think we do. I think we made a
good faith deal. We budget the money and that's what's on the books. That's my
position. I don't disagree with what Joe and David say, it's a good deal for the folks, but
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-- I don't disagree with Mr. Bird either. We have some of our own facilities that we could
have spent the money on and made them better and more playable as well. So, I guess
I'm at the spot now if we take a vote on this you know where I'm coming from, that I
don't support an increase.
Bird: I don't either.
Rountree: So, I don't know if that's what Scott's asking for, but I can appreciate that. I
can give him credit for coming up here and asking.
Stewart: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, and Members of the Council, the request I'm --
the sheet I have with the table is dated March 9th, 2007, and I'm not sure if you have
correspondence -- there was a letter that previously states -- is it dated as well? When
that -- where it was corresponded?
De Weerd: July 20th.
Stewart: July. So, there was some previous fire correspondence and Iknow -- I have
been working on the agreement a lot longer than I ever anticipated it would ever take.
Started out really nice and, then, ended up in attorneys' hands -- nothing wrong with
that, but --
Rountree: You don't have to apologize.
Nary: Careful.
Bird: There is three of them in here.
Stewart: You know, I did work with Mr. Strong at the time -- I believe about a year and a
half ago starting this process and having some discussion as these things came
forward, but I understand and just thank you for the opportunity to be here and present.
De Weerd: Mr. President?
Rountree: Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: You know, when we got the letter in July of --July 20th, I did respond saying
was only authorized by Council to spend the 200,000 as was requested during our
budget process the year previous by Superintendent Clark. And so when I responded
at that period was the only amount we had authorized spending. Mr. Strong did bring a
budget request through our typical budget process that does reflect probably some of
the discussions that you had and, again, Igo back to when the discussion was
inadequate facilities on gender related type of things, Meridian didn't have a gender
related issue. We wanted to be a partner and that was this women's softball -- fast pitch
softball was going to do a lot of the stuff that is in this budget request. We were going to
do the lights and the school district was going to do the field stuff. The discussion that
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we had about that emergency access road, our fire department said probably 7,000 of
that is related to the ball fields. The rest of it is related to the football field and the need
to have our large equipment closer to the football field to respond to that and that is
where the City Council came up with the 7,000, instead of 37,000. And we can pull the
minutes that reflect that discussion, but those -- those kind of were the areas that -- that
this Council made commitments and anything outside of what happens here, you know,
I don't know what your discussions were, but that is what was authorized to staff and
our parks director has inherited this as probably have you, so --
Bird: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Scotty, can I ask you one more question? Or Scott.
Rountree: It's tough having grown up in the city.
Bird: Well, he was my neighbor kid and I have known him since the day he was born.
De Weerd: Probably played football for him, too; right?
Bird: No, he didn't play for me, but he was good. Now you made forget what Iwas -- oh.
At the new Rocky Mountain and Meridian school and Mountain View, how many softball
fields -- lighted softball fields do you have there?
Stewart: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, and Members of the Board -- or Council, we
currently have lit softball fields at Mountain View High School and Meridian High School.
And those are the only fields that are lit, other than the -- and the new Rocky Mountain
High School will be the third.
Bird: Those are the three schools that are in our -- in the City of Meridian's jurisdiction?
Stewart: Right.
Bird: Now, what do they -- who plays on them in the summer?
Stewart: Currently they do have club teams that will come over and play and we take
requests and we will have club teams that will play and practice on those, but no
organized leagues. Currently at Meridian, the new facility at Rocky Mountain hasn't
been developed and I do believe Colin Moss has had an organized softball league over
at Mountain View the last year or two.
Bird: Okay. And -- okay. Thank you.
Rountree: Further comments, questions? Steve, are you asking -- are you requesting
an action on this? Is this for information, a future action? What was your desire?
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Siddoway: The actual agreement will come back before you, but I'm seeking your
direction as to what numbers we should plug in for what we bring back to you and,
specifically, if I could ask you, Mr. President, if you would prefer not to see an increase,
is that based on the 200 even or the 210 -- I'd just like to clarify that.
Bird: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I believe we authorized 271.
Rountree: Well, if you look at our budget notes, it's actually -- there was another 3,000
for seats.
Bird: Two hundred ten.
Rountree: Or bleachers.
Siddoway: Yeah. Three thousand for dugout benches.
Rountree: So, that would be 210.
Siddoway: I have found up to 210 of currently approved dollars for the items that have
been done out there to date.
Rountree: And you also needed direction on the time --
Siddoway: The term of the agreement.
Rountree: -- the term of the agreement.
Siddoway: Yes.
Rountree: So, do I have a motion that addresses those?
De Weerd: Mr. President, I guess just clarity. Two hundred and ten has been spent, but
was the dugouts part of the budget approved by Council?
Siddoway: Yes.
De Weerd: But it hasn't -- they haven't been put in.
Siddoway: The dugout benches have been put in. The bleachers have not. So, the line
item says 15,000 for bleachers and benches, but only 3,000 of that 15 was for the
benches.
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De Weerd: So, you would want the amount reflected in the agreement, not just the
amount spent. The amount --
Siddoway: Right. We -- I think it's -- it's kind of independent from what's been spent. It's
just for that item of benches, we had -- we had budgeted about 3,000 dollars -- we had
budgeted 3,000 dollars for that and since they are already installed, we could reimburse
the school district for that installation based on the existing approved budget of 3,000.
De Weerd: But you had also budgeted bleachers.
Siddoway: They did spend more than that. Which we still will be putting out there.
De Weerd: Okay. So -- but in the agreement, which -- what do you want in the
agreement, the 210 or the 200 and whatever that would be?
Rountree: Madam Mayor, let me -- let me interrupt. If I understand Steve correctly, he's
looking at the remainder of that budget item be spent by the city for bleachers.
Siddoway: Yes. The remainder of that item would be spent by the city for bleachers.
That's correct.
De Weerd: Not reimbursed.
Siddoway: Not reimbursed. We will spend it ourselves. Yes.
Rountree: Okay. Motion?
Borton: And Madam Mayor, I'll make one. I don't know what kind of --
Rountree: Mr. Borton. That's all right. You will be right -- you will be right on next week.
Borton: Mr. President, I would move to approve continuing with this contract on those
two issues and these two amounts and I will tell you why. For reimbursement and
expenditure up to 240,000 and a term for 15 years. For the reasons previously stated,
I'm particularly interested in the good will and the relationship of the district in this
project on this one and going forward with future opportunities like this. So, that's sort of
a split the baby analysis. It's not the most scientific, but it's one I'm comfortable with.
Zaremba: I'll second it.
Rountree: It's been moved and seconded.
Rountree: For discussion. I have some --
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
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Zaremba: -- Mr. President. This wasn't mentioned earlier, but I think I would like to see
added to that maybe some consecutive periods of mutual agreement extension. I don't
know how to put that, but as an option.
Rountree: A renewal option.
Zaremba: Mutual option to renew or -- if that's possible. In five year increments or
something. Forever.
Siddoway: The language in the agreement states that upon expiration of this treatment
the parties to this agreement shall make every effort to mutually extend the term of the
partnership established by this agreement and neither party shall unreasonably withhold
its consent to such extension.
Zaremba: Covers what I asked.
Siddoway: If you have -- we can work -- we can work on that, but that is our intent to
have the type of language that you expressed.
Zaremba: Thank you.
Rountree: Further discussion? Does this require a roll call vote?
Nary: Mr. President, Members of the Council, you're not approving the agreement,
you're giving direction. You can do it by voice vote is fine, because you're not approving
anything, other than directing staff -- a direction to bring it back to you. If they can't
reach agreement, Mr. Siddoway is going to come back and tell you the money or the
term is not acceptable to the other party.
Rountree: Okay. We have a motion to approve 240,000 thousand dollars for the
contract, with a 15 year term. All those in favor?
Zaremba: Aye.
Borton: Aye.
Rountree: Opposed same sign.
Bird: Aye.
Rountree: Aye. We have a tie. So, Mayor breaks it.
Nary: Mayor can break the tie.
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De Weerd: I -- I would -- I would be in opposition and if I can explain it, I think it's
probably been already discussed by both Councilman Bird and Rountree, but these are
discussions we typically have before the expenditures happen, rather than after, and it
puts Council and whatever program the parks department has upside down, you know,
planning after the fact. And so at this point, again, until Council tells me differently, I
have -- we have an approved budget amount and -- and I don't know where the 30,000
extra would came from, unless it just comes from maybe the 12,000 that you haven't
spent yet, but that's what I would be -- I think that's what we have authorized to spend
on this. I can't authorize an amount that hadn't been anticipated.
Rountree: So, we --
De Weerd: And I appreciate the goad will of the school district. I do.
Rountree: With that vote the motion fails.
MOTION FAILED: TWO AYES. TWO NAYS. MAYOR NAY.
Rountree: I need another -- without a motion we have no direction, so --
Bird: I'll throw one out just strictly for a motion, because everybody knows my feelings
and I hate doing this, because I think that we need to do stuff, but I think they can do
like a lot of us have had to do is go find somebody to put it in for you. Anyway, I move
that we direct staff to go towards this agreement with the school district with the two
stipulations: Twenty year contract with option for another 20. Also, a budgeted amount
of 210,000 dollars, as of 3/11/2008.
Siddoway: Mr. President?
Barton: Second.
Rountree: I have a motion, I have a second. Discussion? Mr. Siddoway.
Siddoway: Mr. President, I just wanted to clarify one point on the term of agreement,
that a 20 year agreement and are you still okay with the amortization aver ten years as
currently written ar are you asking me to make the amortization over the 20 year
period?
Bird: I don't care how you make the amortization.
Siddoway: Okay.
Rountree: Discussion? Okay. We have a motion for 20 years; I don't care about
amortization, and 210,000 dollars. All those in favor say aye.
Bird: Aye.
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Rountree: Aye. Opposed?
Borton: No.
Zaremba: No.
Rountree: Tie again.
De Weerd: Aye.
Rountree: Okay. Motion passes. So, you got your direction.
MOTION CARRIED: TWO AYES. TWO NAYS. MAYOR AYE.
(d) ACHD Agenda Topics for next Jt. Meeting on April 7, 2008 -Matt
Ellsworth -Planning.
Rountree: Thank you. Matt, thank you for your patience. That took a lot longer than
know you antlclpated.
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Members of the Council, the next agenda item is discussion of
agenda items far the upcoming joint meeting with Ada County Highway District
Commission and what city staff has been working toward, along with ACHD staff in
preparation for these meetings, is to establish the agenda further out in advance, so that
staff can coordinate with one another to provide necessary supporting materials to both
City Council and to the commission in order to better focus the discussions and just to
lend clarity to both bodies about the intent of each item, get everybody on the same
page. So, to that end, in a memo dated March 7th, 2009, Pete Friedman outlines
several suggested -- staff suggested items for the upcoming April 7th, 2008, quarterly
joint meeting between ACHD commission and Meridian City Council, which I'll run
through briefly with you and seek your input both on these suggested agenda items, as
well as any additional items that you feel would be appropriate for that discussion on
April 7th. So, the first one that Pete mentions here is an update on 3rd Street alignment
study. That's one the city staff, along with MDC staff have been moving forward with
stakeholder interviews, coordinating closely with Ada County Highway District on that.
In general, just that the intent of this item is the progress to date, what we have learned
so far, and the next steps moving forward and so forth. The second item that Pete
mentions is a status report on the split corridor phase two, which I anticipate would be a
fairly brief discussion. It may shake out to be more of a scheduling update by ACRD
staff as to how things will unfold from here, how it's being coordinated with things like
the Fairview corridor study, as well as the 3rd Street alignment study. They have
somewhat recently kicked off a design for phase two of the split corridor, so there isn't
all that much to report back on yet, other than the schedule at this time.
Meridian City Council Special Meeting /Workshop
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Rountree: Matt, on that particular item, I -- if they have got any -- even napkin level
concepts for Main and Meridian Road, I'd like to see that and if they don't have any
illustrations, if they could just verbalize some thoughts about how we solve that issue
down there, I would appreciate just getting some of their initial thinking. If they have got
it. And they may not. But it's a tough one.
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Members of the -- Members of the Council, Madam Mayor, I
know what they do have so far in the analysis that they conducted is traffic volume
estimates, based on scenarios X, Y and Z, which I can certainly express interest in
getting on the table for that discussion on the 7th.
Rountree: Okay. Thank you.
De Weerd: Mr. President?
Rountree: Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: And I apologize before I say this, but I didn't hear what the first item was.
With that noted, was that phase one of the split corridor?
Rountree: Phase two.
De Weerd: No. Phase two was number two.
Bird: Yeah.
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Members of the Council, Madam Mayor, the first item on
Pete's memo was an update on the East 3rd Street extension and alignment study.
De Weerd: Okay. I guess, Matt, what I'd like is if we could also get an update on phase
one, because I understand that that was delayed from what we hear from Shaun Wardle
is phase one -- it was supposed to be going out to bid and that's been delayed until next
fall I think. So, I just would like to know the implications of that.
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Members of the Council, Madam Mayor, that's something I'll
touch base with both Shaun and ACHD stafF about and we can certainly get that
included on the agenda for the 7th.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Ellsworth: Thank you. The next item on Pete's memo is an update from the city to
ACHD, really bringing them up to speed on recent adoption of the south Meridian comp
plan amendment. As you recall the city and ACRD were working together to move
forward both the land use plan on the city side and a transportation study on ACHD's
side. What the city adopted deviates somewhat from the most recent model runs that
were prepared for that south Meridian transportation study, so we were just going to call
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attention to that and figure out how to merge the two together looking forward. Also in
light of TLIP and some of the other things that ACHD's been working on. And, finally,
the last suggested agenda item on Pete's memo here is the ACHD growth alliance
relating back to the ULI review of regionalism. So, that will be a good update for
everybody in the room, to tell you the truth. That's not one that I'm all that up to speed
on, so I don't have too much to report relating to it at this time.
De Weerd: Shoot, I had a bunch of questions for you, Matt.
Rountree: Matt, Pete and I talked about another item and I'm not sure where it fell, but
that's the effort between our staffs to get together and work out some protocols and
some opportunities to communicate better together and they have been working hard at
that effort and they have got some agreements with ACHD staff on who is going to do
what for whom and who are going to be our contract people and I would like to hear that
from both staffs and I think the ACRD board would -- and commissioners would like to
hear that as well. So, I think it's a good effort.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: I would also ask to add an item and that would be an update from ACRD staff
subsequent to the bid they received on East Park Center being, as advertised, lower
than they expected it to be, coupling that with their cutting several high priority projects
out of Meridian due to budget constraints, since they did get a better bid on the East
Park Center bridge than they had in their budget, what Meridian projects are they
putting back?
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba, that's old news, but Matt can probably tell you what they did,
because they have taken action on that already.
Zaremba: Okay. I didn't know that.
Rountree: Yeah.
Zaremba: Are we happy with what action they have taken? I guess that's what I want to
discuss. One of the things that I heard is --
Rountree: How happy can you be when you didn't get what you wanted.
Zaremba: The discussion that I have heard is that because they only benefited by four
million dollars, they weren't going to do the six million project and still going to do some
priority 20 and 40 projects that would have made up that difference. So, I kind of
wanted to have that discussion.
Rountree: Go ahead, Matt, and --
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Ellsworth: Mr. President --
Zaremba: Not in a confrontational manner, but just why does that keep happening.
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I think that's a fair
question. A couple of -- well, first, we can go in a little bit more detail as to the action
that was taken on the five year work plan, if that's the direction the Council would like to
go in right now. As far as the purposes of the March 7th discussion, Mr. President,
Members of the Council, Councilman Zaremba, if it's okay with you I can craft some
language to propose for that agenda item and bounce it back and forth, just to make
sure that it gets to the point that you're trying to make.
Zaremba: That would be fine. Unless I'm the only one that wants that to be discussed
publicly.
Rountree: Oh, that's fine for discussion, but they have already made their decision.
Zaremba: We need to influence their future decisions, is my opinion.
Rountree: It depends on how you approach them how well you influence them.
Zaremba: I know. Carefully.
Rountree: But we did get a project back in the program -- moved forward. Two, as I
recall.
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, of the high priority
projects that were already in the five year work plan, the city's number one request for
both intersections and roadways remained on track from last year's adopted five year
work plan. That was the split corridor, both phases one and two. One is programmed
to begin construction unless there is something that's unfolded in the last couple of
days, to begin in 2009, phase two in 2012. The city's number one requested
intersection project is the intersection of Ustick and Linder, which is still on track at this
point to begin construction in 2009. As far as some of the projects that did delay, this is
based on decisions made during the budgeting process from last year. The segment of
Ten Mile Road from Franklin to Cherry, again, fell back as it was adopted in the
previous version of the five year work plan in 2008. It's now scheduled in 2010, again,
with the assurances that that project will be complete before the interchange opens.
Looking over to Eagle from Victory to Ridenbaugh, they delayed it, it was previously --
and Idon't have notes in front of me, so this is subject to future follow up, but from what
recall it was initially programmed for construction in 2007, it then fell back to 2008,
and, then, in the most recent adopted five year work plan that they just adopted a
couple of weeks back, it fell back to split construction, the first portion of construction
occurring in 2010 and finishing construction in 2011. And I don't know, Mr. President,
Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, if there are other specific projects that you
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were looking for for discussion of at that time. I know the intersection of Ten Mile and
Ustick fell back to 2013 in order to coordinate that with the roadway project that is
planned on the same stretch of Ten Mile and the intersection of Pine and I-finder was
delayed and I'd have to follow back up with you about the exact years delayed to and
included in the adopted five year work plan.
De Weerd: 2010?
Zaremba: Mr. President.
Ellsworth: I believe it was 2010, but I'm not one hundred percent sure.
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Let me ask Matt this. Would you rather not poke this hornet's nest?
Rountree: He already got up there and poked it. I'll speak for him.
Zaremba: Okay. All right.
Rountree: At their hearing on this.
Zaremba: I think the consensus is not to add it to the budget, but add it to the
amendment -- agenda. I'll get the ward right. I discuss with them regularly myself, so --
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, then, if I'm hearing
correctly, in addition to the four items that Pete outlines in the memo from March 7th,
2008, which were an update on East 3rd Street study, status report on the split corridor
phase two, an update on the south Meridian CPA, and an update on the growth
alliance, the additional items that Council would like for me to bring forward at this time
are also an update on phase one of the split corridor and an update on efforts to better
coordinate between the staffs of the two jurisdictions.
Rountree: Correct. And one bright point with the action on the part of ACHD is that they
did open up the community's programs and, Matt, I don't know -- and if you're not ready,
just tell me, but we need to put together some possibility for some projects in that
program --they added another two million dollars into that program, so --
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, Members of the --
Rountree: Or they brought the program up to two million dollars. Excuse me.
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, if I may, that decision
was made and I'm trying to get a read from ACRD staff as to whether the direction they
are taking right now is to simply reprioritize the two million dollars worth of projects that
were already in that final draft for adoption or if they are going to consider additional
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Page A3 of 67
new projects at this time. Since I haven't been able to connect directly with staff on that,
my plan right now is to present that exact issue to the transportation task force coming
up on Thursday to get their read and, then, to bring their recommendations far you at a
future --future meeting time in order to feedback into ACHD's process.
Rountree: If I remember the motion made by their commission, it was to work with the
communities on that program with the additional funding, so, apparently, we haven't
heard what that means. But there is an opportunity to get some other projects in --
sidewalktype projects.
De Weerd: Mr. President?
Rountree: Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: I guess, Matt, do we have an update on when the 8th Street sidewalk is
planned? Because we did have matching money for that.
Ellsworth: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I know in previous
years that project ended up being delayed, not as a result of anything that was under
ACHD's control, it was an 5TP enhancement program and with ITD's funding situation
that ended up slipping back, as did all other projects that were programmed in that year.
An update on that project is that ACRD is continuing with negotiations with adjacent
land owners on the east side of 8th Street. It sounds like one or two of those properties
may have changed ownership between when that application was originally made and
now. They are doing what they can to keep things moving forward in that vein. As far
as the city's matching share, as it was conveyed to me by -- by Steve Siddoway and the
city's finance department, those funds were approved in the year that the application
was made and they are, essentially, sitting off to the side right now. It's not a situation
where -- where staffs going to have to approach Council about a budget update or a
budget amendment or anything along those lines. The money is there when ACHD is
ready to receive the match.
De Weerd: We just don't know when that is.
Ellsworth: Correct.
De Weerd: Okay.
Rountree: Thank you, Matt. Appreciate that. And I hope we didn't confuse you too
much on what we want to talk about next time we meet with our friends at ACHD.
Item 6; CITY POLICY REVIEW:
(a) Amended Travel Policy from February 12, 2Q08 Meeting -Bill Nary
- Legal Department
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Rountree: But, anyway, let's move on to the next item. I believe it's Mr. Nary talking
about the travel policy.
Nary: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, the travel policy was on
your workshop agenda again. We had discussed it at the last workshop last month, the
time was -- or it was set back on the agenda for any other information, questions,
issues, concerns that you have. One of the things we have been waiting on was a
format that would be comfortable and usable for the departments. Mrs. Kilchenmann's
staff, with our IT staff, have come up with a form that we think can work, be usable,
could be easily adopted by the departments. We think it's, basically, ready to go
forward, if you're comfortable with the travel policy, if you have questions, we can
certainly do that. Mrs. Kilchenmann actually stayed up passed her bedtime to stay with
us tonight in case you had any other concerns or questions and I appreciate her
staying. I think we have a policy that after a lot of wrangling I think most people are very
comfortable with that and I think it's going to be a better tool than what we have had in
the past and I think this probably can be applied more consistently and I think that was
the object we were looking for.
Rountree: Okay.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: I apologize for being out of town when this was discussed a month ago, so I
may have missed some parts. One, I appreciate the work that has been done. I think
this is the right thing to do and the right direction to go, but I have had a couple
questions raised to me that if they have been answered before I apologize, but I'm going
to ask them anyhow.
Nary: That's fine.
Rountree: That's why we are here.
Zaremba: And one of them is in regards to how travel costs are covered. The
departments have some credits cards and I think we have had a discussion before
leading to either all or most of the credit cards have a 3,000 dollar limit. That -- I was
fine with that, because I was assuming that individuals had the cards. But I have
learned since the departments have the cards and if there are several different people
going out of town far training, the card could very well reach its limit on the first person
or two and the third person that needs to use that card out of town has no wiggle room.
Nary: I'm glad Mrs. Kilchenmann stayed to answer that question.
Zaremba: I'm sorry. Go ahead.
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Nary: She -- I mean I think -- I think Stacy can answer that question, that -- I think we
have resolved that issue. Some of the intent of the policy and the format is to take care
of many of the pre-travel costs before the people leave, to get them paid for, whether
they are paid on the credit card or in some other format, so that we don't run into those
-- those types of limit issues. But Ithink -- I think finance has worked through that, but
I'll let Stacy take that.
Zaremba: Well, the big items, of course, would be the airplane and the hotel.
Nary: Correct.
Zaremba: If those can be handled some other way than the card -- I'm sorry, I'll let
you --
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, Councilman, we do have several credit cards -- not every
person has a credit card and they have varying limits. In fact, we have pretty
consistently been increasing the limits. Some are over 10,000, some of them are 6,000.
And a real advantage we think of travel policy is just as Mr. Nary explained, we will be
able to do a lot of those costs up front, because there is a cost to processing and
controlling credit cards and we were kind of at a spot where we even issued everyone,
like a purchase order card or their own credit card, and we have some kind of corporate
credit card, because a lot of these credit cards aren't in anyone's name, they are just in
the City of Meridian's name and, then, the intern control is extremely poor. It's hard to
go back, you know, if there is a mischarge. So, hopefully, with this, because we can
book through Global through a travel agency if they need to. We have given the
secretaries cards with high limits, so they can do the airlines up front and we can get it
paid and, then, we will be giving people advances for their meals and so forth. So, does
that answer your question?
Zaremba: The first part of it answered my question and that very last sentence was
going to be my next question. We go to the system where a person just gets a set per
diem and depending, I guess, on what city they go to or what they are doing, but are we
able to give that to them in advance or do they need to came back and get it --
Kilchenmann: No. They can have the option -- I mean they can't come in like five
minutes before they leave and --
Zaremba: Well, I know that.
Kilchenmann: But they will be able to get it in advance, if they prefer to do that, or they
can come back in and get it as a reimbursement, if they prefer to do that.
Zaremba: Okay. And they don't need to show receipts and stuff --
Kilchenmann: No.
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Zaremba: -- so, it's going to simplify everybody's process.
Kilchenmann: Yes.
Zaremba: All right. Thank you if I'm re-asking questions if it's already discussed.
Nary: No. That's -- that's fine. Additionally, Councilmember Zaremba, I mean the intent
really was that -- to limit how many things, if anything, that people would even need to
have the credit card with them on travel. There is cerkain types of expenses and we
incorporated that into the language, that you sometimes need to have the actual credit
card when you go to the hotel. They might be billing us for it, but they sometimes want
to see it. Rental cars almost always will require a credit card there with them. So, even
though we may book them ahead or reserve them, we normally have to have it, but the
other piece that I think we were really trying to accomplish with directors and finance,
was to get finance in the loop earlier in the process. Many times -- part of the
disconnect was that the departments could book all their travel and make all the
arrangements and do all the advances or reimbursements or whatever they wanted and
usually what happened is that finance would, then, be getting the bills subsequently,
have no real knowledge of where the person went, what it was for, trying to match up
receipts to bills, to -- it just was a system that didn't function well where we are today
and trying to get finance involved earlier, so that we could take care of a lot of those
expenses that could be handled up front I think is a better system.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Another idea bounces around in this empty space up here. Who is -- if an
item is in -- if a department has a budget item for travel for training or whatever the
travel is for, who is responsible for sticking within that budget? Is it --
Rountree: The director.
Zaremba: -- Stacy's responsibility to make sure they don't or is the department directors
-- or is it a combined effort?
Kilchenmann: Madam Mayor, Councilman, it's the -- it's the -- the department director's
responsibility to -- to stay within their budget.
Zaremba: Yeah.
Kilchenmann: Our responsibility, however, is -- there are IRS rules on accountable
travel plans and there is audit exceptions for unsupported, you know, expenditures. So,
our responsibility is more on the technical side with the department director being on the
side of the budget -- overall budgetary spending side.
Meridian City Council Special Meeting /Workshop
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Zaremba: Okay. Thank you. Thank you for doing that.
Rountree: Any further comments? I have a few, unfortunately. I have got some
editorial ones that I'll just give you, Stacy, because some of it doesn't read well.
Kilchenmann: That would be Mr. Nary.
Rountree: Or Mr. Nary.
Kilchenmann: And ten of us all typing into it, actually.
Rountree: But on the second page -- and it's not -- there is page numbers, but it would
be the -- the third paragraph dawn, talking about excess amounts, failure to remit the
overpayment to the city within 12Q days, you had to the city the overpayment -- and I
would add the overpayment of the employees reported -- the overpayment to employee
wilt be reported on the W-4 and be deducted from their next paycheck. I think we need
to put that kind of stuff in there.
Kilchenmann: Can we do that?
Nary: Mr. President, Members of the Council, what the purpose of that section is -- and
maybe we can make it clearer -- that is the requirements of the IRS. If the travel -- if the
employee doesn't follow the rules, the entire cost of travel is added to the employee as
income, which means all of the cost, the travel, the airplane, the car, the hotel, all of that
is given to the employee as taxable income to them. That's the intent of that section.
It's just to advise them that that's what the rules are from the IRS, not what we are going
to do, not whether we are going to discipline them for it --
Rountree: No. No. And I don't -- it's just not clear to me -- first it wasn't clear who you
pay the overpayment back to and if you don't, the taxes will be deducted from your next
paycheck. Well, I think that personalizes the palicy, it's going to be -- taxes will be
deducted from the employee's next paycheck. So, I'm just taking your out and saying
the employee.
Nary: Okay.
Rountree: I'm not changing the policy; I'm just trying to put it in terms of employee. I'll
give you this.
Nary: Okay.
Rountree: The last paragraph above the three bullet points, it says department no less
than ten business days prior to traveling -- travel occurs -- that's when you have to get
the authorization form. Policies are policies and you need some flexibility. I know there
are emergencies, I know there are conferences, I know there are places people need to
Meridian City Council Special Meeting /Workshop
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Page 48 of fi7
be on a two or three day notice, so I think you can just throw in there that, you know,
unless there is an urgency or an emergency --
Nary: Okay.
Rountree: -- existing. And, then, there is the ability for the director to approve travel
based on that.
Nary: Okay.
Rountree: The next page I would add a seventh item and the item would be if an
employee chooses to travel with their personal vehicle, they shall indicate their insurer
an their travel form. And I haven't had a chance to review your travel authorization
form, but it's certainly pretty.
Kilchenmann: I learned from Robert that we stretched the logo. We are not supposed to
do that, sa we have to --
Rountree: Well, that's between you and the Mayor. Again, down in the expense report,
under the -- where it's bolded that you got to do it within ten days, again, with the
exception of an emergency situation. Then, the per diem -- the per diem monies -- it
talks about what you're going to get for per diem, but it doesn't talk about what's the
situation when your meals are provided in your registration fee. I couldn't find that
anywhere in here.
Nary: Mr. President, we -- because it is very difficult to track that, we made a decision
not to include that.
Rountree: Typically that's on your agenda or itinerary far a conference, but if it's -- I
know it's difficult, but a lot of times you get them all.
Nary: We -- just so you understand, maybe the -- Mr. President, Members of the
Council, some of the dialogue -- what we were trying to avoid was, one, being the meal
police and trying to track who had meals and who didn't. We also didn't want to track
people who couldn't eat the meal that was provided far whatever reason or didn't want
to eat the meal for whatever reason. We felt that we were trying to create a simpler
system and all we might be doing is creating amore --
Rountree: That's fine.
Nary: Fixing one and making another, so --
Rountree: I have no problem with that.
Nary: So, we did discuss that.
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Rountree: I agree with the simplification. On the next page, the per diem rate for travel,
an the first day and the last day at 75 percent of the total per diem, I got to tell you, if
you're going someplace and you're leaving Boise to go out of town, you're leaving at oh
dark thirty in the morning, if you're lucky you get breakfast at the airport. I think if you
leave on an early flight or if you leave early in your car, you ought to get a full day's
meals, personally. If you have got to figure out some way to deal that, if you leave by a
certain time of the day you get them all. If it's later than that, you deduct breakfast. If
you get back after a certain time of the day you get all your meals, if it's before
dinnertime, you don't get dinner. But just 75 percent of the time doesn't work for me,
because mast travel you're -- you're leaving before 8:00 -- actually, usually leaving
before -- if you meet the TSA requirements, if you're at the airport two hours before any
flight, most flights out of the Boise airport are 6:30, so you're there at 4:30 or like me --
Kilchenmann: I think that one is another tracking issue.
Rountree: -- 6:15, but --
Nary: Mr. President, Members of the Council -- yeah. It was discussed. It is -- it is a
federal guideline, because the federal actually creates on their website -- you can get
the full day reimbursement and what the 75 percent amount is. So, it is something --
and it was -- again, it's sort of the trade ofF on trying to track that, because there are
occasions the employee can choose when they leave, you know, not matter what we
do, if we make it noon, if you drive out of town at 11:30 you get the whole day, if you
drive out of town at 12:30 you get half a day. We just felt it was one of those that --
again, the compromise between we are not going to track our meals if you get it, but 75
on the travel, it does give you flexibility if the travel takes longer, because occasionally --
we were trying to think of the circumstance, for example, where the fire department
travels to Ohio to pick up a vehicle, the travel itself is pretty much the entire trip. So,
that is, obviously, an aberration to the normal policy, the policy sort of tries to capture
that. But we did discuss it, we just felt it was another tracking tool that we didn't want to
create more complex -- complicated issues.
Kilchenmann: Yeah. And another -- part of it is part of the guidelines for an IRS
accountable plan, which we are trying to follow, having just gone through an IRS audit.
And, then, we also thought that the per diem allowance is pretty -- at least to me it's
generous, having worked at the state, as you know, with your 25 dollars a day. So, we
felt --
Rountree: Oh, it's mare than that now.
Kilchenmann: Thirty?
Rountree: It depends on your city.
Nary: You just have to use your per diem to pay for your Blue Cross, I think.
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Kilchenmann: But we felt that it was -- you know, it was pretty generous that -- if
somebody needed to --
Bird: It is for -- if two guys go together and go to a town like Portland or someplace like
that, but you go to Sun Valley, Idaho, or Park City, Utah, you might be stretching it.
Kilchenmann: They have McDonald's there.
Rountree: Okay. The last -- the last comment on the text item is on the last page of the
annotated, it talks about airline. Employees must travel by coach or economy class. I
would change that employees to choose to upgrade from coach or economy class do so
at their own expense. Because if they got air miles and want to go first class, more
power to them.
Nary: Sure.
Rountree: The last comment I'll make about this is I want to get rid of credit cards, plain
and simple. There is too much room for stuff going on with them, they are hard to
account for, they are inconvenient at times, even for the employees when they are
maxed out or you got the wrong card or whatever. So, I think we have done a great jab
of moving towards being able to get rid of credit cards with this policy, so thank you for
your effort.
Bird: And, Stacy, you know I feel the same way> even a little stronger than Charlie does
on credit cards.
Kilchenmann: Just a tiny bit -- a tiny bit stronger.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: Despite my earlier question, I actually support the idea of figuring out how not
to have credit cards out there as well. As we move into being a bigger and bigger city,
we should be able to have open accounts with some of our suppliers. I mean --
Kilchenmann: We do.
Zaremba: If a department's using their credit card at Office Depot, they ought to be able
to use a city account there or something and --
Bird: That's right.
Zaremba: If we move that direction more and more, I would certainly support not having
credit cards out there. We trust all of our employees, we love all of our employees, but
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there is just toa much room for abuse. Boise's run into it and other places where you
wouldn't expect to have run into it, so --
Bird: Mr, President?
Zaremba: -- I agree with that.
Rountree: Mr. Bird.
Bird: On the credit cards, it's -- it's not -- it's the problem. We have got a little gal over
there that has to pay credit card bills at a certain time and don't get receipts in. We are
sticking her neck out first -- first, we are sticking four people's necks out right here.
That's fine, we are elected, we should get them stuck out if we are allowing it. But that's
my biggest thing. If they want to use a credit card, use their own personal and I'll
guarantee the day they get back at 8:00 o'clock the next morning they will be in getting
reimbursed. That's -- I'm like Councilman Rountree, I'd like to see credit cards go.
Rountree: And the new policy I think can get us there. Thank you. Any other
comments?
Nary: Thank you for staying.
Rountree: So, we will see this not next week, but maybe the 25th --
Nary: Yes.
Rountree: -- for consideration? Okay. The next one we have is --
Bird: Mr. President, before you go on --
Rountree: Mr. Bird.
Bird: -- can I -- could we get a hard copy with what it's going to look like in policy farm
before this happens?
Nary: That's what you have got.
Rountree: You have got it.
Bird: Iknow --
Kilchenmann: Oh, you want it printed out. You want it printed. Sure.
Bird: Printed, please. After these changes and everything, Bill.
Nary: Okay.
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Bird: My eyes don't read as good anymore.
Rountree: Any other comments?
Item 7: CITY ORDINANCE REVIEW:
(a) Outdoor Sales and Temporary Events Ordinance from February 12,
2008 -Emily Kane -Attorney.
Rountree: Next one is the outdoor sales and temporary events ordinance. Emily -- Bill?
Emily? Take it away.
Kane: Thank you. That doesn't look good.
Rountree: That's not good.
Kane: Well, I would like to -- let's see. Thanks. Thank you. Mr. President, Madam
Mayor, and Council Members -- thanks, Tom. Well done.
Nary: Three master's degrees, he can turn the projector on. Great.
Rountree: Can you change a light bulb?
Kane: If it's okay, I'd like to make same preparatory remarks to hit same of the high
points of what is a pretty long proposed ordinance to start with, what we have is kind of
a catch as catch can array of different ordinances that do what this is intended to do.
We have Title 3, Chapter 4, regarding vendors, peddlers, and solicitors. We have run
into a few gaps and different problems with enforcement in that, so this new ordinance
is intended to address that. We have the UDC, which has provisions that address
specific uses that -- it requires temporary CFCs, it addresses temporary signs. We have
a citizen's use permit custom. It's not codified, but we da ask for people to get citizen's
use permits -- I believe it started as an ACHD animal and we kind of adopted it as a
tradition, but it's not really enforceable given that there is no ordinance creating it and
that we have building code and fire code provisions that would still apply, but this new
ordinance would remind people to look there for the applicable provisions. So, what we
need and what this ordinance is intended to address is some clarity in the mobile
vendor's code. As I mentioned, we need a comprehensive regular scheme that would
address events -- special events such as farmer's markets. I guess those are two
separate things, but where people want to put on something like that, there is no one
place for them to go to figure out haw to do that. And, likewise, the city staff has no
place to go to figure out haw to administer that or enforce provisions related to that. We
need specific provisions for some uses, such as permanent businesses promotional
sales, like sidewalk sales or tent sales, rather than when it comes up we kind of figure
out a way to cram them into an existing ordinance or code section, rather. And, finally,
we need a streamlined process for looking at and permitting temporary uses and
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addressing the health and safety issues related to temporary uses. So, to hit the high
points of the proposed ordinance, Section 3-4-2 rEgards mobile sales units and this is
door-to-door salesmen, we ran into an issue where we interpreted the code to
encompass ice cream trucks and did require them to be -- or rather get mobile vendor
licenses. This would make that more clear. Any seller making a cold call or going door
to door would be covered by this ordinance. This ordinance -- proposed ordinance
clarifies grounds for denial of a license to mobile sales units -- or rather to a mobile
sales unit. For example, if you're a sex offender, you can't get a mobile sales unit
license in the City of Meridian under this proposed ordinance. It allows the city to set
some time, place, and manner parameters on the license for door-to-door salesmen and
mobile sales units and it also allows for revocation if the license is abused, if they go
outside the parameters set by the city, if they commit a crime, or if something untoward
happens, they don't necessarily have a vested right in that license. In the section
regarding temporary uses, this proposed ordinance establishes a comprehensive
permitting process for all temporary uses. While it's comprehensive, I think it is
streamlined in that everything is kind of under one umbrella. To the best of our ability
we tried to write it that way. It sets general and specific standards for temporary uses,
so there are general applicable standards to all temporary uses and, then, as to specific
and their specific needs and issues, we set specific standards or at least try to address
them. And, finally, it contains enforcement innovations that would make violations an
infraction and would be a fine -- a set fine and allow our officers to issue citations for
violations. What we found is where -- where a violation is a misdemeanor and it takes
quite awhile for it to work its way up to the court system, it's a little less urgent nine
months later to prosecute a fruit stand that hasn't been there for six months or more and
the judge says, well, what harm is there now, they are gone. So, it's to address the
situation where the temporary use is long gone by the time it gets to the court system
and makes enforcement a little easier. The citizen's use permit section, as I mentioned,
codifies and existing procedure that we are already doing. It's intended to provide notice
to the fire department, the police department, to the Mayor"s office, ACHD, ITD, and the
sheriffs office where ever there is going to be an increased demand on city services or
traffic congestion. And that's the end of my highlights.
Rountree: So, we have the opening far question and comments. Any questions,
comments?
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: First, a lot of good work. I think that's great. A couple of questions -- and I
don't know whether this would be solved in the application process or -- not having seen
what the application is going to look like, but the question comes to me of scope or size,
an event that's going to be in a location or even a moving event, like a parade or a
march or something like that. If it gets to a certain size or a certain number of hours a
day, I would think we should have some requirements for restrooms and water and first
aid, which I did not notice. And maybe that would be part of the application process
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where we would say, okay, if you're a certain size and a certain intensity you have to
provide these things and what is your plan for it. But somehow I think that needs to be
addressed. And I would add to that if it is going to be a good group, how are they
providing crowd control and along with that, no matter what it is, what is their clean-up
plan, either for just normal waste or if there is any hazardous materials. And, again, that
would apply to probably all events, but more intensely the larger events or longer
events. Then, I would add one more thing. And this is something that we discussed
when we were writing the Unified Development Code portion of temporary signs, the
code enforcement officers go around town and they see these temporary signs out and
they go into the business and say you need a permit for that sign and somebody in the
business says, well, we got a permit far it. Well, where is it? Well, I don't know. And so
I believe we wrote into the Unified Development Cade that when you got a permit for
your temporary sign, it actually had to be affixed to the sign, so that the code
enforcement officer could sign it. So, my suggestion would be for events that there be
some language that says that the permit must be posted in some place that the
inspection officer can find it easily during their event hours. And, for instance, if we are
talking about a real estate sales office, it could be inside the office. When they are
closed he doesn't need to see the permit, but when they are open he should be able to
see it pretty easily. I mean that's just one example. And it would certainly make the
code enforcement officer's job easier than having somebody say, yeah, we gat a permit,
but I don't know where it is. And that was a difficult thing, so -- since I got the
microphone, we are going to have some discussion, I'm sure, about the non-dust raising
surfaces and I would just throw in my thought that I think that's necessary far vehicle
areas, but not necessary for pedestrian areas. An example given of a pumpkin field, I
don't have any problem with people walking through a pumpkin field, but if cars are
going to be parked next to it, I think that should be a dustless area. That's a personal
comment. And, then, I don't know whether we can get this -- get into this area or not,
but on the subject of First Amendment activity, anybody can call anything First
Amendment activity, including graffiti and burning flags, and I wonder whether we might
want some language in here that defines what we don't consider to be First Amendment
activity. My thinking goes towards something like this definition does not authorize
activity which damages property, threatens harm to an individual, or infringes on the
rights of others. We don't give up our other laws -- free speech is fine, but there is some
activity that's not and I don't know whether we need to open that can of warms or not,
but I -- I would like to add it. I'm done.
Kane: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, Councilman Zaremba, I absolutely will incorporate
your suggestions -- suggestions with regard to restroams and crowd control and clean-
up plan. To some extent we addressed clean up in that we require it, but certainly no
plan and I didn't even think about hazardous material. So, we can address that. With
regard to affixing the permit to the sign, we can address that as well. I know there has
been a lot of discussion about doing that and I think that was in the context of how to
administer the permits themselves, but I think that's a great idea to have that as a
requirement.
Zaremba: To have it posted somewhere where it can be found.
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Kane: Yes. And with regard to the dustless surfaces, I don't know if Council will have
further discussion on that, but whatever the direction is we can do that as well. Finally,
with regard to your comments on the First Amendment activity, I did lift this definition
from a city who had been tested in court, but I think that what you're suggesting would
not -- would comport with what is written in this draft, because it is -- it has been test in
the courts to say that First Amendment activity does not encompass behavior,
necessarily, that hurts people or is otherwise criminal in nature. Sa, I think I can
definitely write some language that would make that more clear.
Zaremba: First aid and water and restroom plan or -- and, again, that"s probably part of
the application process. I don't know if it needs to be, but we probably need to say what
the application has to include.
Kane: I think that's a good idea.
Zaremba: Qkay. Thank you.
Rountree: Anybody else? I have a couple questions for you, Emily. And I didn't know
where to ask this question in all of this. It's so thorough it just kind Game to my mind
when I was driving down the road and said, ah-hah, there is something I couldn't find in
here that is not permitted or isn't permitted, and that's the -- we are seeing more and
more local newspaper dispensers just out in neighbors on sidewalks and a good many
of them are blacking the sidewalks and I couldn't find where we are regulating those in
any way, shape, or form or do we want to. And is there something we can do here.
Kane: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council that happens to be
something that I did research at one point. It's a kind of thorny area of the law, which
surprised me when I got into it. I think that the licensing on the sidewalks is an ACHD
issue. They would address the concern regarding safety on the sidewalks. But is --
there are some pretty heavy first amendment attachments to the ability to place those
boxes in a public place and there are laws that say where -- for example, the Statesman
can put up a box, every real estate magazine or ad or special interest publication can
also put up a box there and the result is kind of the string of boxes ar proliferation of
boxes that you see around town. I have run across one way that that can be addressed
by a municipality and that was in Honolulu they built boxes and had kind of a lottery for
who could put their stuff in those specified boxes. So, it would require some building of
infrastructure on the part of the city in order to do that.
Rountree: I believe that would require a field trip.
Kane: I agree.
Nary: I'm happy to go do that.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
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March 11, 2008
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Rountree: I appreciate that and I wasn't getting to we need to, it's just it seems that we
ought to be working with ACRD on that, because we do, in several locations, have them
blocking the sidewalk significantly on some major corridors in town. I don't have a
problem with selling the newspapers, but it seems to me if they are in the right of way
maybe they could be placed on the landscaped area, as opposed to on the surFaced
walkway. Mr. Zaremba, I'll let you have a question here as soon as I'm done.
Zaremba: But it was on that subject, sir.
Rountree: What more are you going to add.
Zaremba: My comment would be that there is an Americans With Disability Act
provision that there must be usable sidewalk in a certain width and the proliferation of
those boxes, while I don't particularly care what the newspaper is or isn't, if they are
blocking the sidewalk that's a violation of the ADA.
Kane: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, and Councilman Zaremba, I believe it's a four foot
passage and my understanding is that ACHD will measure as an enforcement activity,
but if it's not infringing on that four foot passage, then, there is -- I don't know if there is
anything they can do or if that's their policy not to do anything.
Zaremba: Thank you.
Rountree: On page two, it has garage sale and, then, it has a whole litany of things that
you're talking about from tag sales to rummage sales. There are such things as estate
sales that are not the estate sales that you define in your ordinance, which are nothing
more than a one time garage sale, if you will, or residence sale. I don't know if they
have a name, but it seems to me we kind of prohibit that by the way we define estate
sale, but it's -- to me they are different critters. I don't know if we have another name for
that or is somebody guilty by association because they said they had an estate sale.
Kane: Mr. President Madam Mayor, and Members of the Council, I think if I can find a
name for that I can add that in there. But this provision -- I guess the definition and,
then, later section -- well, on page 28 it talks about the regulations and, really, it just
limits you to four a year.
Rountree: Right.
Kane: So, they are not necessarily prohibited unless you surpass that limit.
Rountree: Okay. On page three, item D, number 1-A, talks about the mobile sales unit
and it does -- it does not occupy a certain number of space and it talks about more than
two hours -- consecutive hours within a 24 hour period. Does that preclude parking that
mobile sales unit on a -- in a public area on the side the road for an out of service
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period? Does that cause some issues with the folks that own those? I'm assuming we
are talking about Schwann's trucks and taco stands and those sorts of things.
Kane: Mr. President, the mobile sales unit would address the Schwann's truck where
they are making cold calls to residences in kind of traveling sales capacity or a door-to-
door sales capacity. The taco truck is --
Rountree: Temporary.
Kane: It is not a mobile sales unit. It is a temporary sales unit.
Rountree: Temporary. Okay.
Kane: So, there is -- we found so many uses that we had to pars them into -- I think a
reasonable number of categories, but, nonetheless, it does require same serious
interpretation when it comes down to categorizing particular uses. And, Mr. President,
to answer your question regarding fleet vehicles, that -- I guess the definition just tells
you what you are and the standards, then, say what you can do. So, if someone were
supposed to get a mobile sales unit license based on their activity and did not, that
would be a violation.
Rountree: On page 21, a real estate sales office, and we have had this before us on a
couple occasions about the size of those offices and subdivisions and I think we have
debated and gone around and done variances on the 700 square foot to allow them
bigger and allow them smaller and allow them longer and to me that just causes grief for
enforcement and it causes grief for staff and it causes an unnecessary variance on the
part of the city. If it's a subdivision sales office and it's incorporated in the plan of the
subdivision, I don't care if it's a thousand square foot modular unit, the thing I care about
is that it's removed at same point in time and doesn't remain as a residence. So, as
opposed to specifying the square footage, just specify that it's a temporary structure of
sufficient size for them to market their -- their property. Gosh, if they want to bring in
something with a spa and whatever for marketing their property, why not? Just a
concern. Because we have seen it. But we don't want it permanent. We want fio be
able to have it moved out of there. And page 26 on standards for garage and yards
sales, there really isn't anything -- there is, but how do we deal with perpetual yard
sales?
Kane: Mr. President, this section was actually I think vetted within the last year and
moved in because of perpetual yard sales. So, this seems to be working. It's been on
the ground I think for almost a year now and it is intended to say that you can have four
a year and it limits them three days.
Rountree: Okay. Two more. Sorry about that. Page 29, item D-2, I think that submit
courtesy copies of these applications should be to Ada County, it should also be to Ada
County Highway District, and it should be to Idaho Transportation Department, nat
Department of Transportation. And my last comment, Iguess -- well, two more. I'm
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March 11, 2008
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sorry. On the little graphic you provide -- and if you're going to put that in the ordinance,
eliminate the skull and cross bones or whatever that symbol appears to be where it's
prohibited.
Kane: Oh.
Rountree; And, lastly, I'm -- you have done a great amount of work and I think it's
wonderful to consolidate all this stuff, but I'm concerned about enforcement and I think
of the guys out there that are making a living driving say aSnap-On tool truck and they
probably don't live in Meridian and they are making cold calls. It seems to me that they
are regulated by this ordinance. They are not going to knew that. Schwann's that are
out of the community -- there is a lot of those kinds of things that are out there. I guess I
just struggle with the enforcement on that. How do we enforce it? How do we do it in
such a way that it's not punitive? Anyway just a philosophical question. You had some
comments.
Backman: Mr. President, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, it's been a long day
for me. I was -- 24 hours ago I was at the -- on the lake in Coeur d'Alene and so I'm a
little fuzzy tonight.
Bird: I don't feel sorry for you.
Rountree: Yeah. It's your problem.
Zaremba: Welcome back.
Backman: I'm hoping you all got a copy of the --
Nary: Yeah, they do. It's in their packet. Teri, would you identify yourself for the record.
Backman: I'm sorry. Yes. Teri Backman, Meridian Chamber of Commerce. I had the
pleasure of working with the city staff on this ordinance and there is a lot stuff in here,
so I'm going to try to limit my comments to just a couple things that we have -- that we
still have questions or concerns about. I will note that I just got the latest copy with the
sign -- temporary sign part in it on Friday and I was not able to get that out to a lot of
people who I think really should look at it before -- you know, as Charlie says, you know,
haw are we going to enforce all this. We have got to get the information out to all the
businesses. So, at the outset I'd like to make that comment. There are no realtors
here. I think they would probably have some concerns, as maybe Charlie does, about
the real estate office, same of those sorts of things. So, perhaps we might have a little
more time where people can view this. I do want to mention -- and I'm hoping we have
the same copies, because when Mr. President was referring to some pages they
weren't the same ones I had, so -- I believe in my letter I actually addressed the vacant
lot or unpaved lots. Obviously, when we get to special events -- we were even talking
about the speedway doing anything ar the dairy board doing anything on the dairy board
property. That's unpaved. You know, our overflow parking behind the speedway, which
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March 11, 2008
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is used or any events at the speedway, lots of events at the park, it's unpaved. So, I
understand the concern about dust and that sort of thing, but there are some realities
out there as to what we have available in the areas that we have been used to doing
them and so -- and I don't know if anybody has heard from the dairy board on this, but
know that at our last dairy board -- Dairy Days meeting they were concerned about that
provision as well. So, that's probably our primary one. There were a couple things on
special events specifically that I wanted to talk about. And (believe -- you know, you
asked same really good questions about sanitation and all those things. When we, for
example, do Dairy Days, the parks permit, we use the park. The parks permit actually
has all of that stuff in it, so that might be a place that city staff could start with getting all
of those sanitation, security, all of those sorts of things that you want addressed. So, let
me just find my other note here. I was wondering if I could address a question to Emily.
Rountree: Sure.
Backman: Okay. Emily, in a previous version of this you had mentioned for any -- there
was a phrase that if there -- if a special event is happening in a park that a temporary
use or citizen's use permit may not be -- they may -- may not have to get that, you
would work with the parks permit. I didn't see that in this latest version. Did I miss it?
Kane: I don't remember, I'm sorry, Teri. The intent is to at one point have a separate
parks ordinance for special events in parks, because those issues are so much
different, since that is all city property and has more sensitive maintenance
requirements and parking and things that would be specific to the parks- So, I guess I
don't know why it's not in there, if it's not. I guess the -- I guess I don't know.
Backman: Okay. Well, (guess -- that was one of my concerns, you know. What we are
wondering is do we need a parks permit, a citizen's use permit, and a temporary use
permit to do something in a park where we -- originally we talked you would just need a
parks permit, so --
Kane: And that's still the -- that's still the plan. The Planning Department has no intent
to enforce the temporary use permit for events that occur in parks
Backman: Okay.
Kane: They would like to leave that to the parks department.
Backman: Okay. All right. Now, I'm going to refer -- and I hope that you have the same
pages as I do. Page 27 where it actually talks about temporary signs and special
events. Up at the top its E-1. That's the latest version I have. Am I in the right spot?
Kane: Councilman Rountree, I think you have the version from February.
Rountree: I have a February 12th version.
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March 11, 2008
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Backman: Which doesn't include the new temporary sign information. And I just had
some clarifications there. Perhaps if we are going to address temporary signs for all of
this whole ordinance later, we can just leave that until later and I can work with Emily on
some of the verbiage. You know, that's just a suggestion. You know, we are basing a
lot of things on what we have always done in the past and what we have always allowed
to do. So, when the new ordinance is significantly different than what we have done
before, we do want to kind of work with the staff on some of those things for the big
events like Dairy Days. Although I really do appreciate that they put in that we could
have 200 temporary signs, because that means we can put up little cows all over town,
so --
Kane: With permits.
Backman: Well, they wouldn't each have a permit on them; right? The permit would be
in the chamber ofFice.
Kane: They would each have a permit.
Backman: Oh. Okay.
Borton: Mr. President?
De Weerd: Each cow?
Borton: So, if I'm going to put a cow for my business for Dairy Days --
Bird: You got to get a permit.
Borton: Really?
Backman: That is -- that's still a question we have. We have little signs that just say
Dairy Days and the date on them that are put up at businesses all over town. They are
put out in front of City Hall. That's what we consider to be a temporary sign, but Cow
Wow Art contest, which is what you're talking about, I'm not sure we really came to a
decision that those were signs or if those were something else.
Kane: Caws aren't signs. They are art.
Backman: Okay. So, just our cow signs.
Rountree: Public art.
Backman: Exactly.
Bird: It's public art, uh?
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Backman: I do -- so, if we can address same of the sign issues later, that would be
great, because that does have a lot of things in it that I think we still need to address.
Outdoor markets, however, which is -- an my page 28C -- and this is, actually, the
standards for outdoor markets, outdoor markets ,are defined as things like arts and
crafts shows, farmers markets, that sort of thing, and it says that they will be allowed in
any nonresidential district on one day per week. In meetings I have been in, even with
the downtown business association or the arts commission, they are talking about doing
arts and craft shows or an art show or outdoor markets and they are not talking one
day, I mean they are talking like on a weekend or something. So, I think we need to --
that might be something we might want to talk about whether one day is really realistic
for some of the things that we might want to have, especially in the downtown area. And
I believe page 33, which is talking about the citizen's use permit, number G -- or letter
G, we have: All application materials must be received by the city clerk at least 14 days
prior to the activity and the clerk shall issue or deny a permit within 14 days. If you
really have someone who brings something in late, you know, they are not going to find
out until the day they think they are starting their event whether they are denied or not
and my suggestion is that maybe we move out that the application materials need to be
in sooner. When we do an event, you know, they are going to get all our stuff in
January for Dairy Days, because that's when we start planning. But I think you will have
people who think that they can just come do an event and find out, oh, no, you know,
City Clerk has 14 days to decide and it might make a big difference whether that event
ever happens or not, so that's the exception. And I believe those are all my questians. I
do think that the question of unpaid surfaces is a considerable one far us right now and,
then, we can address the signs later, so -- and if anybody has any questions far me I'd
be happy to answer them.
Zaremba: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Zaremba.
Zaremba: On unpaved surfaces, again, I'm trying to remember our conversations while
-- big committee writing the Unified Development Code a couple of years ago and I don't
think we wrote into the UDC that surfaces had to be paved. There are other ways to
achieve dustless that some -- that are even temporary. You know, spray a light coating
of oil on it that probably lasts two or three days, but it's -- and gums up the streets. Or,
you know, put grass seed on it. I don't remember all the list that some of the developers
told us were ways it could be done. I'm not so stuck that it be paved, but I do think we
need to address the dust.
Rountree: Comments? Questions? Teri, thank you for taking the time.
De Weerd: For sticking around.
Backman: You're welcome. Thank you.
Kane: Thank you, Teri.
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March 11, 2008
Page 62 of 67
Rountree: Emily, thank you --
Kane: Thank you.
Rountree: -- far a great job on pulling all this stuff together. I think we still got some
bugs to work out of it, but we are way further along than we have been in the past.
Thank you.
Kane: You're welcome.
Bird: Mr. President, can I -- Teri, is the Meridian Dairy Board aware of this? Have you --
I'm amember of the board, but I have stayed out of anything city involved.
Backman: Sure. President, Madam Mayor, and Council Members, I did give a previous
copy of the ordinance -- not the latest one -- to Hans Bruin, the president of the dairy
board, so he -- whether or not he's had a chance to read it, but he is aware of some of
those things in there that would specifically affect their property and some of their
events, but as I stated, since there is some new stuff in here I really do want to get this
out to some other people and perhaps we can get them to come talk to you.
Bird I'll get a -- I'll get a set to Jack Riddlemoser, the attorney for both the speedway and
the -- and let him look at it.
De Weerd: Mr. President?
Rountree: Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: I would imagine the speedway would be a grandfathered use, so wouldn't --
you know, I don't know why this would apply to the speedway when they are in
operation. These are normal things within what they have done. So, would this affect
them?
Kane: Madam Mayor, (believe -- is the speedway in the county?
Bird: No. It's city.
Rountree: City.
Bird: We pay taxes, very much of it, very, very large taxes.
De Weerd: Well, thank you. We appreciate that.
Kane: In that case I don't know the answer to that question.
Zaremba: Madam Mayor?
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March 11, 2008
Page 63 of 67
Kane: It would nat be exempt from the ordinance, but specifically how it would affect
them, I don't know.
De Weerd: When they are apreexisting -- when it's an existing use --
Kane: It would not be grandfathered, because it would be a use, rather than a --
Nary: It's a permit. It's a permit. So, permits are different than grandfathered uses. So,
we are not talking about land use like a UDC code, we are talking about uses in a
permitting process, so it would apply.
Bird: But what do you consider permits, Bill, because to run the race track you don't
have a permit. That's a business. That's the same as running a law office or Rick's
Press Room or anything like that.
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, Councilmember Bird, yeah, I don't think
we are talking about the general operation of the speedway, we are talking about --
Rountree: Dairy Days.
Nary: Right.
Bird: Dairy Days.
Nary: A taco truck on the speedway property or having a hotdog stand on the speedway
property. You still have the same requirements in the city -- not their operation, but
other uses on that property.
Bird: I agree with that.
Zaremba: Or if they lease it out to a separate event.
Nary: Right.
Kane: Thank you.
Item 8: STRATEGIC MEETING DATE DISCUSSION -MAYOR.
Rountree: Next item on the agenda -- and I'm sure everybody is excited about this --
Bird: Yeah.
Rountree: Oh. Excuse me. We are. Strategic meeting dates from the Mayor. Have we
decided that?
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March 11, 2008
Page 64 of 67
De Weerd: I believe that Peggy had gotten some out. What?
Rountree: April 2nd?
Bird: April 2nd.
Zaremba: April 2nd works fior me.
De Weerd: Robert, you want to come to the microphone. Can't read your lips. I don't
have my glasses on.
Simison: Council President, Madam Mayor, Council, April 2nd is the preferred day right
now if it works for your schedules, the Council's schedules, up to four hours
commitment where you all can be there at the same time.
Bird: 8:00 o'clock?
Simison: We can start at 8:00 a.m.
Zaremba: Works for me.
Rountree: 8:00 to 12:00?
Bird: 8:00 to 12:00. I'm for that.
Rountree: Okay.
Zaremba: On the 2nd?
Bird: Are you okay, Joe?
Borton: Yes, sir.
De Weerd: Sounds like everyone's goad.
Simison: Thank you.
Rountree: I'm not.
De Weerd: You're not good?
Rountree: No.
Bird: Not on April 2nd?
Rountree: No.
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March 11, 2008
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Bird: Okay. What day are yvu good?
Rountree: Sometime after the 6th.
Simison: Other two dates that were proposed were the 11th or the 14th.
De Weerd: And the 14th.
Rountree: I'm in Panama.
Bird: Oh, you're going to be in Panama.
De Weerd: Oh, that's right.
Zaremba: David would be okay the 11th and not the 14th. Second Monday I have two
or three standing meetings.
Rountree: The 14th works for Joe?
Bird: What date?
Rountree: 14th.
Barton: 14th is okay. It's a Monday morning.
Bird: You know, I'm really -- I'm really not tied down to a job, so I'll make it work.
Rountree: Check your calendar and get back to Robert.
Zaremba: Well, I know I have a meeting that starts at noon and I have one that starts at
3:30.
Bird: Well, good, if we go from 8:00 to 12:00 you can run right aver there.
Zaremba: Well, I'd have to leave like 11:30, but --
Rountree: We will be done by then.
Simison: Okay. So, the 11th, 5:00 a.m?
Zaremba: I thought it was the 14th.
Rountree: The 14th.
Simison: 14th.
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March 11, 2008
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Rountree: 14th.
Zaremba: 14th at 8:00 and I can leave by 11:30.
Simison: That works.
De Weerd: Maybe we start at 7:30.
Bird: We can start at 7:00. Is it going to take four hours, Tamara?
De Weerd: Well, try after our directors' meeting.
Rountree: Well, we can -- we could start a little early.
Bird: Yeah. We could start a little earlier. We can start at 7:00.
De Weerd: We'll let you know.
Item 9: EXECUTIVE SESSION: ISC 67-2345(1 )(fl (to consider and advise its
legal representatives in pending litigation):
Rountree: Okay. Next item is Executive Session.
Bird: Mr. President?
Rountree: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I move we go into Executive Session as per Idaho State Code 67-2345(1)(f).
Borton: Second.
Rountree: Moved and seconded to go into Executive Session. Roll call vote.
Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Zaremba, yea; Borton, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: AL.L AYES.
EXECUTIVE SESSION:
Rountree: I will reconvene the workshop and take a motion to come out of Executive
Session.
Bird: So moved.
Borton: Second.
Meridian City Council Special Meeting /Workshop
March 11, 2008
Page 67 of 67
Rountree: It has been moved and seconded to come out of Executive Session. All
those in favor.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Rountree: I would entertain a motion to adjourn.
Bird: So moved.
Borton: Second.
Rountree: All those in flavor.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 11:25 P.M.
(TAPE ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
TAMMY D EERD, MAYOR
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DATE APPROVED
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