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HUB OF TREASURE VALLEY
MAYOR
A Good Place to Live LEGAL DEPARTMENT
Robert D. Come (208) 288-2499 • Fax 288-2501
- CITY OF MERIDIAN
CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS PUBLIC WORKS
Ron Anderson 33 EAST IDAHO
BUILDING DEPARTMENT
(208) 887-2211 • Fax 887-1297
Keith Bird MERIDIAN, IDAHO 83642
Tammy deWeerd (208) 888-4433 • Fax (208) 887-4813 PLANNING AND ZONING
Cherie McCandless City Clerk Office Fax (208) 888-4218 DEPARTMENT
(208) 884-5533 • Fax 888-6854
NOTICE OF SPECIAL JOINT MEETING /WORKSHOP
MERIDIAN CITY COUNCIL
MERIDIAN RURAL FIRE PROTECTION DISTRICT COMMISSIONERS
NOTICE IS HEREBY. GIVEN that the City Council of the City of Meridian
and the Meridian Rural Fire Protection District Commissioners will-hold a
Special Joint Meeting /Workshop at Meridian Fire Station, 540 East Franklin
Road, Meridian, Idaho, on Wednesday, January 24, 2001 at 6:30 P.M. They will
meet to discuss the following items /issues concerning the Meridian City /Rural
Fire Department:
1 -Joint Powers Agreement & Contract for Services
2 -Rural Purchase of Land for Station 2
3 -Planning for Station 3
4 -Site planning & Purchasing of Land for Station 4
5 -Replacement Schedule for Equipment & Apparatus
6 -Hiring of Investigator /Inspector
7 -Hiring of Three Additional Firefighters
8 -Competency Standards and Testing
9 -Development of Joint Strategic Plan
10 -Budget Planning for 2002
The public is welcome to attend.
DATED this 22nd day of January, 2001.
,~~,~/~ r
WILLIAM G. BERG, JR. - CI CL RK
• f
MERIDIAN RURAL FIRE PROTECTION DISTRICT
540 E. FRANKLIN R.D.
MERIDIAN IDAHO
888-1234
January 16, 2001
Here are the agenda items for the January 24 joint meeting with the Meridian
City Council.
1. Joint Powers Agreemant /Contract for Services
2. Rural purchase of land for Station 2
3. Planning for Station 3
4. Site planning & purchase of land for Station 4
5. Replacement schedule for equipment & apparatus
6. Hiring of Investigator /Inspector /
7. Hiring of 3 additional Firefighters
8. Competetancy standards & testing
9. Development of joint strategic plan.
10. Budget planning for 2002 budget
• •
MERIDIAN CITY COUNCIL SPECIAL MEETING JANUARY 24, 2001
The Special Meeting of the Meridian City Council was called to order by Mayor
Robert Corrie at 6:40 p.m. on Tuesday, January 24, 2001.
Members Present: Robert Corrie, Keith Bird, Ron Anderson, Tammy de Weerd.
Members Absent: Cherie McCandless
Others Present: Ken Bowers, Bill Nichols, Joe Silva, Will Berg
Rural Fire Commissioners: Mike Ingram, Steve Bravo, Debi Drake.
Ingram: We'll call the Special Joint Meeting of the Meridian .Rural Fire District to
order. Commissioners' Drake, Bravo and Ingram are all present.
Corrie: Now we'll open the City Council Special Meeting with the Rural Fire. All
of the Councilpersons are present except for Cherie McCandless who is sick.
Item 1 -Joint Powers Agreement & Contract for Services
Ingram: I guess since - I get the honor. The reason why we wanted a block of
time from the Mayor and City Council was it's been awhile since we've had a
good sit down chat. Our intention here is we've got some kind of things that are
on the dashboard so to speak. Some things that we just need to get resolved
and have been on the plate for awhile. We're hoping to kind of stimulate some
ideas and maybe plan something for the future Fire Department, is our hope.
With that, our first agenda item is (sic) the Joint Powers Agreement and the
Contract for Services. Basically it's an open question to the Mayor and City
Council, how's our contract going? Are (sic) things going well, are there things
we need to change, add, delete, modify, comments, criticisms?
Corrie: Well I haven't. had any problems with the administrative standpoint.
Council (inaudible) the policy and problems and questions -
Ingram: Join in here Tammy anytime.
De Weerd: I've never seen it.
Ingram: You don't have a copy of it?
Drake: Fascinating reading.
De Weerd: I'm sure it is.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Meridian City Council Special ~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 2
Ingram: From the (inaudible) perspective and everybody (inaudible) if I speak
out of term, but from our perspective everything appears to be going very well.
We want to continue with the program so we just thought we would throw that out
there. If anybody's got any comments on it or anything we need to look at,
examine, or change then we'll look into that. Do you guys have anything else?
De Weerd: Mike, I apologize again. Ron knows every (inaudible) so we do this
to him a lot.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Corrie: Yes, Mr. President, I don't have (inaudible).
Anderson: I guess the only one comment that I would have is that sometimes
that Joint Powers Agreement to me is - it can be interpreted a lot of different
ways. It appears that sometimes depending on what the issues are, if it's
contract negotiation with the Fire Fighters or something like that it's going to be
kind of a sticky mess. As personnel problems you guys tend to say, well hey,
that's all of your problem we're just paying the x amount of money. There's other
times when you actually seem like you want to get into the operational part of the
department and be involved in that. It's almost like a (inaudible) you can't play
both sides of that coin. It's like (inaudible) you don't want to have any part of the
Personnel Management, or you do want to be actively involved in that? I think
the Joint Powers Agreement can be interpreted either way. I think that
sometimes you guys tend to interpret (inaudible) every one for that particular
occasion whether you want to be involved in that (inaudible) or you don't want to.
I guess from that standpoint, some clarification would be nice so that we knew
where you were going to stand on those issues. So that we're not in negotiating
with the Fire Fighters or somebody else, saying okay this is what we are going to
do. Then later on have the Rural District come back and say, no, we don't want
to do that. We don't agree with that. Those kind of issues cause us problems.
Ingram: I understand that and sometimes from our perspective though, is there's
no communication so we don't know which side we're on until we get some
information. That's probably -- I think it's been probably one of the biggest
ongoing problems we've had. Yes, probably at times I've seen that too. As of
late anyway, where we've been asked -opinion of what we think about
something we give our thoughts on it and then you guys run with it. I think that's
been working pretty well.
Anderson: It does. There are certain issues that have come up though where
it's been -we've tried to inform you guys or keep you informed. We really don't
know until we tell you what the issue was (inaudible) whether you're going to
want to jump in and take an active roll or whether you're going to wash your
hands of it and say you guys deal with it, that's your problem, they're your
Meridian City Council Special ~g •
January 24, 2001
Pg. 3
employees. I don't know, maybe Kenny and Bill might have some thoughts on
that (inaudible). We're not really clear what the lines are.
Ingram: Sometimes we're not either.
Bowers: That's correct and there's also been little talk about if want (sic) to keep
changing the percentage as we go. There's also been little talk about maybe the
City taking more control of the Fire Department through a Joint Powers
Agreement. There have been all kinds of discussions on the Joint Powers
Agreement.
Ingram: Probably Ron, over time I think administratively, that the Joint Powers
Agreements are (inaudible) of the new document. I think we're still in the early
stages of getting, you know the interpretations and the operational aspects of
that down. Yes, there might be some gray areas and shades of gray in it I can
understand that but I think over time that - I think it becomes -clearly it's an
administrative issue of the City Administrator if you will, of our services. It is a
partnership recognizing that I think that over time, I think it will work out. I can
understand over the short term we've had some issues prop up that has been
kind of bounced back and forth. We try to please all parties because obviously
there are two parties to that. In terms of unity command we try to keep things
clear but it's easier said than done sometimes.
Anderson: I kind of get a little bit of a different perspective on it and twist some
(inaudible) because I deal with a contract that's very similar over in Nampa. The
commissioners there pretty much wash their hands of the day to day operations.
They are there to discuss capital improvements and the overall improvement of
the fire protection (inaudible) for their citizens but they don't' get involved in any
of the day to day stuff. We're talking about promotional things or operational
things, how we're going to respond to things. They really don't get involved in
that aspect, they leave that - I guess the running of the department is up to the
City and the Fire Chief. The Fire Chief just keeps them informed like you're
talking about, brief them on the half things that are going on in the department
but they don't actively take a roll in those things (Inaudible).
Ingram: I know at least from my perspective on being with another Fire
Department also. I think where I look at things of whether I take an active roll or
not has to do with a Service Delivery issue, whether it will effect that Service
Delivery to the district or not. That's where I try to find whether we should be
involved or not. Maybe in the future we can maybe clarify some of that or I don't
know, put some language in there or something of that nature.
Corrie: How do you feel, hearing this how do you feel? Where do you want to
be? Do you want to stay out of it and let the City do that. part until there's
something consecutive to work with here or what's the general feel?
Meridian City Council Special ~ng
January 24, 2001
Pg. 4
Ingram: I'll talk first, for me - overall I think the contract's working very well.
Let's start off with that. I want to try and head off any major conflicts before they
ever happen. I try to gauge whether something will bring us at odds or whether
we can see a problem. Recognize it, touchy feel it and get a resolve to it before
it ever becomes a true problem. That's where I like to be. I don't like to try and
let things boil and fester. They have at times until we get to a point where we're
back to - I don't want to do that. We're making huge strides in the Fire
Department working together and I want to continue that. My perspective is I'm
trying to head things off before they ever really happen.
De Weerd: Our Commission, you know it's a City Commission so it's quite
different. They don't get into the day to day operational things there's kind of
career lines of where areas of responsibility are and that sort of thing. What is
the moral of the Commission? Do you get involved in the day to day type of
things, do you get involved in personnel or do you look at the (inaudible) kind of
life the Council lives? The policies and procedures and the budget issues, or do
you also (inaudible) into the daily operational (inaudible)?
Drake: I think the contract that we have, if the contract didn't exist then the Rural
Commission is responsible for assuring that Fire Service is delivered. However,
the Commission decides to do that. I see this contract similar to the one that we
used with the contractors for building the building. You're defining the job that
you want them to do. That doesn't mean you go out there and check every now,
but you kind of keep a sense of what's happening. Maybe ask questions. Make
sure that they were following the contractor, double-checking and then
addressing issues as they come. It feels like that -again I'm relatively new but
that's sort of how it feels now that it's still trying to struggle with how much and
where. If there wasn't a contract my understanding is that the Rural
Commission's responsibility is to assure Fire Service for the rural patrons is that
correct?
Ingram: Yes.
Anderson: I think that's where the interpretation things come that you guys can
interpret that any way you want. Like you said, you're overall job is to insure that
your citizens have the best fire protection. If you want to take an active roll just
like the contractor building the building, if you want to go, in there and show him
how to hammer nails you can do that.
Drake: No and I don't think that's the roll of (inaudible):
Anderson: That's the problem that we're having. It seems like there are certain
issues that come up where you guys want to be in there showing us how to drive
the nail. Then there are other issues -
Drake: For example -- I guess I haven't seen that.
Meridian City Council Special
January 24, 2001
Pg. 5
Anderson: It's hard for me to go into specifics in an open meeting like this. I
guess some personnel (inaudible). We try to deal with them in a certain way and
you guys will come back and say no, we don't want you to do that.
Drake: You mean hiring and firing for disciplinary actions?
Anderson: Yes most of those things.
Drake: I don't recall --
Anderson: (inaudibly), we can't discuss those (inaudible).
Drake: Yes, I don't recall that.
Bird: The thing I think that the Joint Powers Agreement, and I understood it to be
this way, of course like Ron said we can all have our own interpretation
(inaudible). Personnel is going to have one management, you can't have two
different sources coming to - I thought with that Joint Agreement, that's what we
did, we basically left it up to that. I believe Ron meets with you guys on a
monthly basis, Kenny and Joe are available too. I don't think it's fair to be
employed if they've got two sets of (inaudible). That's why I like this Joint
Agreement, I thought that I'm interpreting the way I see it for (inaudible).
Drake: I guess personally I've never been approached about any personnel
problems, disciplinary actions, or contract issues. I guess I haven't seen that.
Bird: Nor should any of us. That should be taken care of between the Mayor,
Ron and those two guys.
Drake: Yes, that's what -
Bravo: I just think in my own opinion, and I've suggested this to my
Commissioners. Part of where the Joint Powers Agreement came from was
through -not according to anybody here but in the past for lack of better way to
put it, neglected the department prior to us coming on. I personally think it was in
pretty bad shape when we came on to this. I think the Joint Powers Agreement
grew out of that as a necessary document at the time but I think with what has
proceeded in these last three and a half years that it's shown that everything has
fallen into place and getting on the right track. I think for the future that the
document needs to be reviewed and simplified. I think there's been a lot more
trust between the two entities now as far as the commitment and the
performance of the department and there's not a need for a lot of things that are
in-that document. I would like to see it eventually simplified to prevent any future
-when there's a change of personnel on the Commission, if that document is still
in place -like Ron, everybody agrees it's open to interpretation. I think it needs
Meridian City Council Special ~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 6
to be seriously looked at before we change personnel on these Commissions
and on -
Drake: We missed the first one right? It's the first (inaudible).
Bravo: -- but our percentage is constantly going down. Do you need in the
future, the chance of a loose canon waving this thing in front of your face when
maybe the districts only at a 12 percent share? You don't need those
headaches. Like I told them, if I was on your side, I would be interested in that
on my (inaudible). On this side if you want to leave a document alone that's
great for us. No matter how small you get it, surely is a lot of clout. To a point
that doesn't really need to be there since - like I said I believe this things been
turned around. The commitments there are to run a professional department
versus what it was when we all came on. I just don't think it was really looked at
as a very important part of the City at the time. When I came on, it looked like it
was severe neglect so now -and the people that were coming on could look at
that and maybe not trust you guys thinking that maybe the City was doing what
should be done. Now ,you've got this agreement to assure that it's going to be
done, we've proved that it's being done so there's no need for quite a lengthy
document.
Bird: I don't know what it is Nampa runs under but that's been very successful.
I'm sure they're losing a lot more Rural District ground (inaudible) are the last two
or three years, I believe that is a modification (inaudible): We didn't agree with
(inaudible) years and years and years.
Bravo: I would just like to see us (inaudible) -
Bird: Clarify it?
Bravo: Simplify it, clarify it, and put something on the table before - I would like
to see it in place before t leave.
Bird: Well it's up September 22nd this year (inaudible).
Bravo: Yes so we either have (sic) to renew it or get on and look at some
possible changes.
Drake: (Inaudible) that you're feeling - I guess I've been naive about our
meeting when anything's discussed, maybe hiring the investigator. To me it's
just like you're asking my opinion so I give it to you and then you take eight
opinions and you guys make your decision with all of the eight opinions. Does it
not feel like that?
Anderson: That's realty because we're on sensitive ground. That's why we're
asking. We don't know a lot of times whether you want to be involved or not. It's
Meridian City Council Special ~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 7
not consistent. Either you want to be involved in everything, f guess that's just
what I'm asking for. I think the documents work, we just need to know better
what the ground rules are. Either you want to be involved in everything across
the board and then we'll keep you involved and make you part of that or what
we're doing now because we don't know is we're trying to just inform you about
everything. From what we hear from you that we kind of interpret that as, well
yes they want to be involved in this particular aspect or they don't. Just like we
have Contract Negotiations coming up, we're going to be starting here real
shortly. Do you guys want to have a member on there, do you want to be a part
of those Contract Negotiations or are you going to wash your hands of that?
Drake: For example with Contract Negotiations. If you brought to our meeting
should we have blue chairs or green chairs and we all give you our opinion of
blue chairs or green chairs. You take it and then you go to Contract Negotiations
and you decide because you have all of the opinions. It seems that what you're
asking when you bring those is we're stuck on this issue, any other perspectives.
I've never taken it as -
Anderson: I don't think it's as simple as (inaudible) a chair (inaudible). Do you
want to be involved in part of the negotiation? Do you want to have a member on
there? What we can't do is you have to -it's just like if you (inaudible)
Negotiating Committee they have to empower those people to go there and
make the decisions to negotiate for them. We can't go in and go, wait a minute
we'll have to go ask them what their opinion is to see if they want blue chairs or
green chairs. We need to have the authority of either you're going to support us
on what we negotiate, you're not, or you won't be a part of that.
Drake: I thought that was clear that when you brought ideas, problems or issues
that you were just asking opinions. Not that I was saying absolutely green chairs
and that's the only way it's going to be. I work team work a lot with committees
and if a subcommittee signed a job or a role or a test, if I'm chair at that
subcommittee and I go back to the big committee's then I'm kind of stuck on that.
Should I have blue chairs or green chairs what do you think, what's better? Then
I take all of that information and I'm still empowered to go back, I just got more
information. It feels like that's what you're asking when you come to our
meetings with information. It doesn't -I've never felt like I'm telling you exactly
what to do. I'm giving you my opinion but it's your job to carry it out because - or
not your job I guess Kenny and Joe's job.
Anderson: I have this (inaudible) issues (inaudible) you guys (inaudible)
Drake: On small issues or big?
Anderson: If you want to adjourn and go into an Executive Session I'd be glad to
spill out specifics but I can't (inaudible) on the meeting.
Meridian City Council Special ~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 8
Drake: I'm asking basic -
Anderson: I can't tell you in the meeting.
Drake: I'm not asking you what they are.
Anderson: Yes you are.
Drake: No, I'm saying like individual items or politics? What solution do you
want?
Anderson: Just you need to know what the rules are, what are we complaining
about? Do you want to be involved in (inaudible) or do you not?
Ingram: Well Ron, from my perspective as the rural, I don't know that it's that cut
and dry. I don't know that it can be. A lot of stuff -I've been very passionate
about certain issues and I admit that. I will continue to be very passionate about
some issues but I have really tried to -the City is still in power to make the final
decision. That's where some of the times in our frustration we said -we've all
agreed and said whatever you guys decided we'll live with. Just get the issue
handled. Some of the things we've beat and beat and beat until we've got all of
the information that we're ever going to get. We'll live with the results and I think,
I know a few things that have come down to that so yes maybe it appears that
we're just saying hey, okay we'll handle it. Yes, kind of we are. It's like me being
involved with the interviewing process, I'm glad to help out. These gentlemen
here are the ones that have made the final decisions not me. I've given them
my recommendation and our scores and things. Then they've said, and you and
I both we said the final decisions up to you and I'll stand behind that. We're living
with it now so I'm not here to bitch or complain about that. I'm just -it's
confusing to us too at times.
Anderson: Like you were talking about, some of those issues that you feel
passionate about we might be working on as a whole, as a City. Kenny and Joe
when you come down, you'll tell Kenny this is what I want to happen and it's
different than what we're working on as a plan on a team. It does create
confusion for us. It's like okay, if they feel that's a problem with (inaudible) then
they ought to be involved in the whole part of that. Not just come down and tell
the Chief this is how I want you to do it.
Ingram: Okay.
Drake: I guess that's something that we'll probably have (inaudible) that it
defines. Maybe weigh out the flue main pieces of you know or the (inaudible) we
identify and decide where we stand and what - I guess set up some more
guidelines. I don't know how the agreement started or how it was made or
anything but it sounds like the first draft (inaudible) time to look at.
Meridian City Council Special
January 24, 2001
Pg. 5
Anderson: We can continue, we can come to your monthly Commissioner
meeting and say okay here are the issues, here is what's happening. If you
would just give us (inaudible) yes I want to be more involved in this one or we
really don't care about that one. However you want to (inaudible) we can work
off of that.
Ingram: I think that -
Anderson: It seems like sometimes we get part way into an issue though, and
it's one that we've kind of interpreted, well they really don't care about this one or
they're not involved in it. We get three quarters of the way into the issue and
then all of a sudden we find out you do (inaudible) over passionate about that.
(Inaudible) our background (inaudible) a new year.
Drake: It sounds like communication's right in front.
Ingram: That would work.
Bowers: Mike, I would like to stump Mr. Bravo he's pretty dead set that there's
some (inaudible) there's some problems with our Joint Powers Agreement.
Possibly with somebody coming on our board in the future. I would like to see
Steve maybe bring some of those ideas to you guys maybe, and we can give
them to our Attorney Bill, let him look them over or get them from Fitzgerald.
Bravo: I just was playing more than a devil advocate and like I said, the
document was much needed in the beginning but I think it's so hard. Right now
we're fortunate enough to have two very knowledgeable people about the Fire
Service at this time helping to make these decisions. What's going to happen if
you get two people that aren't so knowledgeable that think they're knowledgeable
or just people like me that don't have a clue? It can just open up a can of worms
and I just hate to see this four years of effort, because of a document that's not
kept up on, have problems. I think it needs to be reviewed and in my view of the
world, simplified because I'm not qualified to help out on decisions that Ron and
Mike talk about. I just sit there and twiddle my thumbs when they're talking
(inaudible) because I don't have .any clue. I don't have any input and I wouldn't
want to be part of holding something up just because I think I know what I'm
talking about but I don't. Yet the contract allows the person like that to do that. I
think it's in the department's best interest to review that from both sides. Rural
has a stake in having some say in things but I don't think we need everything
that's in there anymore. I think it should be something to work towards, a goal to
work towards. Towards refining this before we have it in place or at least working
to be in place when there's new people coming on the (inaudible) boards.
Ingram: Sounds like you have an assignment.
Meridian City Council Special !~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 10
Drake: All in favor?
Bravo: Okay but it will be about three sentences long.
Ingram:. All one sentence.
Corrie: If I may, I think it would be a good idea for you three to get together, take
a look at the Joint Powers, see where he would like to see some changes and
what you're talking about. The Council could do the same on this and could get
together again and see where we're going, if we're going the right direction. As
you say we were fortunate to have two people on .both sides that have
knowledge to help guide the administration in the Fire Department. It's very
difficult to serve two masters. If you can get it together by that Joint Powers then
we ought to read this. Meridian is assuming all of those responsibilities but yet
you want to be part of that and I think that's where we can go. If you could do
that and we can do that. We can have another meeting, set out and say okay,
this is what we would like to see. That's what you would tike to see and then
we'll get together and we'll (inaudible)
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Bowers: Mike, also because of possible time restraints like Ron was saying we
might bring you an issue? Because of time restraints we might not be able to get
you that issue before the next meeting. We might have to handle it before. We
probably ought to get something worked out on how we could either notify you
that we're trying to do something, work something out or just wait till the
Commissioners' meeting.
Ingram: I guess I'm seeing more like -probably in the last six months or so
Kenny, you've been doing a really good job. You call me, or whatever and say
what do you think about this? That seems to be working fairly well I mean for the
communication line. I don't know what the 100 percent solution is.
Bowers: We could just continue with that practice then keeping -Vice Chairman,
just keep him informed and then his obligations (inaudible).
Ingram: I usually call these two and say hey what's going on what do you guys
think? If it's -sometimes -
Drake: (inaudible) colored (inaudible).
Bravo: Well a good example would be like a Change Order on a building. It has
to happen it can't stop. You guys have to run with it, it gets reported to us. If you
had two people -all it takes is two people that had a grudge or were just
complete -wanted to cause trouble. They could throw that thing up (inaudible)
Meridian City Council Special f~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 11
L
but we're not going to pay for that, it wasn't approved by us, we didn't do it.
These are the kind of things that I see that's in there.
Ingram: That's a good example because that happened and it's like okay and
you handled it, and we're -
Bravo: Well it's already done
Ingram: (inaudible).
Bravo: I just don't like leaving stuff open like that.
Bird: The agreement is that you guys will pay a certain percent of the deal.
(Inaudible) you're going to pay the opposite of staff is (inaudible). This Change
Order states all within the budget..
Ingram: That's what we're saying Keith, it hasn't been a problem. It hasn't been
an issue for us. They did the appropriate thing and handled it, and as a matter of
fact they actually negotiated it down a little bit.
Bird: I've got a real problem (inaudible) of personnel. I don't think he can
manage by Committee, I think sometimes that's a problem in places. As it is they
want to manage by Committee and then as something gets in the hot seat the
Committee leaves you. Personnel's got to have one boss for (inaudible) you
can't have City Council coming down here and telling the employees (inaudible)
and then the Rural Commissioners come in and telling them something else. I
agree with Steve and the Mayor, we really need to look this over and get back
together. Get that Joint Powers deal into both associations. (Inaudible.)
Ingram: Anything else? (Inaudible) any time. We'll work on that some and I
guess we will kick it around and see if we can come up with some
recommendations and hopefully we'll get back with you again. Like you said,
part of the reason now we're a little bit preempted maybe, on our meeting here
for time wise. Last year we didn't get to meet before the budget time. We asked
Ron when is a good month and he said, well there isn't but if there is a good
month it's going to be January so here we are.
Corrie: I think we're right. We'll have a little better handle on the (inaudible) this
coming year trying to get the Financial Director on this (inaudible) we can. They
will - he, she or whoever it is will be -- first thing I'm going to have to do is to start
on a budgeting process. They'll be working with you and us as well as what
money's available, and where it's going to go. It's going to be a little easier than
trying to situp here and make all of these decisions about how we are coming.
Meridian City Council Special ~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 12
:7
Ingram: It seems to us like the process broke down a little bit last year. There
wasn't -the communication that was there was kind of late on both sides. It was
kind of hard to make some of the decisions we had to make but we got through it.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Ingram: Okay, anybody else got anything more on that?
Item 2 -Rural Purchase of Land for Station 2
Ingram: Item No. 2 is the Rural Purchase of the Land for Station 2. Here within
the last month or so I guess it has been, Kenny had called me and said that he
had talked to you, the Mayor, and indicated that you (inaudible) to give it to us or
whatever. I said, in our meeting we had discussed with (inaudible) on that. The
rural is willing to either purchase our share, or however we need to get that but
we would like our percentage of the entire package and not just the building.
That's just to keep it simple for accounting purposes and down the road for
people when I'm not here anymore. What's you guys' pleasure on that I guess is
the question?
Corrie: Well, sorry to the Council I forgot to - Bitl I think we talked about it a little
bit. The land was given to us, how we can convey that I don't know. That was
my (inaudible) what we were given something why (inaudible) should charge for
it so Bill if you could kind of help us a little.
Nichols: Members of the Commission, Mayor, members of the Council. The
statue allows the City to convey interest in rural property to (inaudible). As I
understand it you don't have to do the same thing when all you're putting up
(inaudible) property in a museum. The question that was put to me was is it
appropriate to convey an interest in this property to the Rural District without
consideration to change (inaudible) or should it be the other (inaudible)? I think
the answer is it can be (inaudible) Council can decide that. It was a donated
piece of land that the Rural District can be a partial beneficiary of that donation
and they'll have percentage interest. On the other hand it's also to be looked at
that it was a donation to the City, for City purposes but there will be nothing
inappropriate about selling that percentage (inaudible) district. It's just the same
as you buying this private property by this building that's being constructed. You
can do it either way, either way you'll be legal. (Inaudible) from a business
stand-point and (inaudible) City stand-point if you've got a piece of property that's
worth (inaudible) thousand dollars and their lowest percentage inquired
(inaudible) percentage providing to your development. (Inaudible) any way's
legal.
Anderson: Was the appraisal done on that?
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Meridian City Council Special ~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 13
Anderson: How much was that?
Bowers: About 1500 dollars, 100 dollars an hour, the same gentlemen that did
the old Fire Station.
Corrie: He did a percentage of it (inaudible).
Bowers: I don't know.
Corrie: $260,000 for the property charge is 2600 hours. Is that what he did?
Bird: I did it on a 10 percent basis, (inaudible) aone-percent basis.
Bowers: (Inaudible) I don't know what (inaudible) but anyhow he said 100 dollars
an hour (inaudible) charge.
Bird: Let me ask you a question. When this land donated, is that not donated at
the time of the annexation and zoning change for that area? Was it already in
the City when it was donated?
Bowers: It was donated at the (inaudible) the subdivision after the annexation
(inaudible).
Bird: That's what I'm saying so as much as I would like to take their money that
basically was donated to both, as far as I'm concerned, rural and City because it
was an agreement for us to take (inaudible) City that they donated it. Up until
that point that was actually Rural District ground. I'm like - I'm .agreeing with
Mike with the extra money but I don't know what something like that (inaudible)
be appraised for. I don't have the slightest idea.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Anderson: My thoughts on it were it really doesn't matter to me one way or
another. I do think that the City's not a bottomless pit and we do have a lot of
financial obligations that are hitting the City in the next few years to just give
away any money. Whether it's $10,000 or what it is, is probably not fiscally
responsible of us. I do know that with the old station when we first got into this
agreement when we were getting ready to move here, there were thoughts there
about, I think somebody had done all of the research and figured out who paid
what when that original Fire Station was built and things like that. It always - I
think somebody got it for like a dollar or something like that. The Rural District
got it?
Ingram: I think it was. It was before my time.
Meridian City council Special ~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 14
Anderson: There's always (inaudible) when it happens years later there's always
this bitterness like well we're paying you to - I think the appraisal when we got
was 180, we're paying you $90,000 for something that you got for a dollar. There
is a certain amount of bitterness that goes along with that. If they had paid an
equal share for that property when they originally got into it, no one would have
even thought twice about, well that's what the property value had appreciated to
and so they're entitled to 50 percent of that. I think right now that it's small
peanuts. My personal feeling is you ought to get the appraisal, they ought to
make their percentage you're paying to that Fire Station. Then there's no
question years from now, they own x percentage of that building however much
the building and the property appreciates that's what your percentage is.
Nobody's going to be sitting around a table like this 20-30 years from now where
they're thinking about relocating this Fire Station or liquidating it and they're
trying to say well, I don't think that's fair because you didn't pay anything for the
land. It clears up all of those kinds of issues. I would go ahead and sell it to
them.
Bird: It's fine with me, I don't care one way or another.
Ingram: Our consensus was, is we just would like our percentage of the entire
project so how do we get that where (sic) there's not going to be any hard
feelings or anything else. We just would like to get our 26 percent of the land
and the building. Like you said then there's no - we graciously accept the gift but
we're prepared to pay for our share of it too. It's back in your court.
Anderson: They (inaudible) just graciously give us their 90,000 on their other
building.
Bird: No, that's very true but (inaudible) the City probably didn't -was hardly
anything after rural (inaudible). I think we're probably the biggest part of it
(inaudible). Anyway, I don't care one way or the other. If you want to get
(inaudible) to pay 1500 dollars, what's your percent this year 26?
Ingram: 26. So do you guys need to take that back to Council and give a
decision to us?
Corrie: We'll have to do it with the Council Public meeting (inaudible).
Ingram:, Do we need to get the appraisal done before that can happen?
Corrie: Yes we should, (inaudible).
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Drake: No, I didn't put workshop, I put Joint Meeting.
Meridian City Council Special
January 24, 2001
Pg. 15
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Drake: If you're looking at this one, this one's just Mike's (inaudible) to me so I
knew what to put on the agenda.
Ingram: The only thing that I would ask for -- the consideration of during the
appraisal was as a year or two ago Ron (inaudible) when Ten Mile was about to
be re-paved?
Anderson: Yes.
Ingram: There was a need for a very quick - we went ahead and plugged in the
sewer, water, phone, and utilities, basically were all plumbed into that at the time.
We paid our share of that. I would ask basically that we go back to a point where
the property was unimproved at fair market value today if that makes sense. Did
I say that right?
Bird: That's the way they'll do it.
Ingram: Minus the improvements but at current market value. Did I say that
right?
Bird: You only brought us (inaudible) corner (inaudible) line.
Anderson: I think maybe, I don't know, Kenny could explain that to the appraiser
and say, don't appraise the land with the sewer stuff. All we want to know is
what the value of the property is.
Bowers: I have discussed that with him already (inaudible) thoughts were.
Ingram: Okay that would be the only consideration I would ask.
Corrie: You will pay for that appraisal is that what -
Ingram: I believe we all agreed to that already.
Corrie: Since we are in a meeting I guess I'll entertain a motion to -- how you
want to -the Council wants to -
Anderson: Mr. Mayor, I would make a motion that we have an appraisal done on
the property for the Fire Station on Ten Mile. The Rural District has agreed to
pay for that appraisal. Once the appraisal is back that they would pay their 26
percent of the cost for the value of the land and that the City sell them the 26
percent share of that piece of property.
Bird: Second.
AAeridian City Council Special~ng
January 24, 2001
Pg. 16
L
Corrie: Motion been made and seconded to have the appraisal done. The rural
(inaudible) will pay for the, appraisal and the rural will pay 26 percent of the value
and City could get you your deed (inaudible) that land. Any further discussion?
Hearing none, all in favor say aye.
MOTION CARRIED: 3 AYES, ONE ABSENT
Ingram: Thank you gentlemen and ladies.
Item 3 -Planning for Station 3
Ingram: Thank the Mayor and City Council for that. We'll put that in process
then, and I guess we'll take care of that. No. 3 was basically the planning for
station No. 3. Here again, I guess the City has been deeded a piece of land for
station 3. We've had some internal discussion as to physically where station 3
would be - if it would be out at the Victory and Eagle site or if we would be
looking more over towards the north first. I guess our question here is, are we
still on track for doing that? Has there been any discussion amongst the City
Council as to when? I drew up a proposal for the rural site of things which I think
it was 2002-2003 budget. Is that right? No, 2003-2004 budget to build the
station, but this one here is just a projection. This was a wish list type of thing at
the time. I guess ask the question, what are the City's thoughts, views, pleasure
on that? Do we want to build it sooner, build it later, or build it at all?
Bird: I think it's up to you guys and Ron. I was under the assumption that station
3 was going to go out to the south of the (inaudible) but as I'm being told now
station 3 should probably be going to the northeast. Especially once (inaudible)
sewer (inaudible) sewer probably gets into stuff like that. I, like Steve, I don't
know anything about it but (inaudible) experts tell us where our next station
should be and I believe that if I think in that assessment they had (inaudible) I
guess we can cover this (inaudible).
Ingram: For awhile.
De Weerd: Mike, I guess my (inaudible) when we get to (inaudible) that
structure. A lot of (inaudible) have to establish format for the budget. I would like
to start seeing some budget forecasting and that's when we see that this kind of
overlay that you've done so that we know what departments are needing to do
what so we can figure out where for them to (inaudible) budget year. Just like
what you've done. We need to do that with our whole City and (inaudible) capital
expenditures.
Ingram: Right and I think I read through the (inaudible) once and I think that was
one of the (inaudible) too was to do that. I think that's in process, like I said
some of the stuff is kind of - I'm a little ahead of myself but here again it's like
Meridian City Council Special •ng
January 24, 2001
Pg. 17
when do we need the City Council thing. I'm just throwing some of this stuff out
here for discussion. and if we need to revisit here in the future after we have
some information then super. With our revenues from the rural, for us I think we
could possibly move that up a year for us without too many problems. To me it's
more, what's the word I'm looking for? It's a wish thing for us. I'm pretty ecstatic
now that No. 2's going us. I'm seeing a roof on it and things that's pretty cool.
As a Fire Fighter I see the need that we're still behind and we have to play catch
up and the sooner we do that the better we're going to be.
Bowers: If I could have a minute and do some (inaudible) drawing on the board
I'll give you a little bit of my thoughts about three and four.
Ingram: Are these drawing or drawrings?
Bowers: They're like those hieroglyphic things.
Ingram: They call them fireroglyphics actually.
Bowers: That second page I handed out to you guys was -Joe, myself and Ron
sitting down one day and just kind of sketched out some years and our inventory.
That's what that second page was.
Anderson: This is an interstate if you haven't recognized (inaudible).
Ingram: Yes, I would recognize that anywhere Ron.
Anderson: You look at our town and it kind of goes like this and that's kind of the
shape of it right now with Eagle Road being in here and this -being Black Cat out
in this area. With the stations that we currently have, station 1 being about in this
area, 2 is going to be out in this area. We already own the piece of land that's
out in this area and I'm hesitant to call this piece of land station 3 or station 4. I
just call it it's a piece of land that's designated for a Fire Station because we don't
know (inaudible). Like he says, whether with all of our growth we have some real
problems with -our sewer plant sets out in this area of town here so we have
some real difFcult issues with sewering anything down here. This down here is
reaching ,almost to the point of (inaudible) for the sewer capacity of this area of
town. Really we are concentrating our sewer right now because we are being
threatened by the big City of Boise. Up here in this corner is that we're
concentrating most of our efforts at getting new sewer lines coming out of the
plant here and one in here and then one on up by Chinden Road and then
servicing the rest of this area here. I really think most of our growth in the next
few years is going to be going in this northern area because that's where we're
building the sewer. Our question is going to be do we build this station or do we
build one up in here? If everybody doesn't know the Rural District, Kenny and
we have been talking to a real estate person. We (sic) asked them to find a
Meridian City Council $pecial~ng
January 24, 2001
Pg. 18
piece of land, told them the kind of criteria. We were looking somewhere around
an acre of ground and we want it somewhere up in this northwest, northeast -
Ingram: Northeast.
Anderson: -- corner of the City. I think they found a piece of property on Locust
Grove. It's about an acre or a little bit more and somewhere around 90-95,000
dollars -
Ingram: Something like that, I think it was 95 as I recall.
Anderson: -- is the price. If we were to purchase that piece of land it actually
would set somewhere up in this area. From the time that I came on the Council
and Mike came on the Commission, Meridian has really needed because of the
shape of our area. We've really needed four fire stations right from the get go. I
think from that point, once we get the stations and we can build them in any order
here but let's assume that we built them in this order right here. Once we get to
that point then we're pretty well set other than work road paves us. We've
caught up on fire protections and then it would depend on what area's grown. If
all this develops then there might have to be a (inaudible) up in here somewhere
or something like that or if this takes off then we can sewer this area then five
might go down there. That's quite a ways into the future so if I look at my crystal
ball and I guess what I envision is build the entire station. Hiring people, buying
the trucks and training everybody doesn't just happen over night. If we've been
on a very aggressive schedule to build this station, hire people, and build station
2, if we did that a lot, we could catch up and the Rural District. Then will make -
they pass their additional levy so that they can raise their portion. I think that
growth is going to taper, it's going to have to, it's going to have to slow down a
little bit. We're running into issues right now, even with opening station 2 about
having to promote people into positions. We would like to see them spend more
time in some other positions before we get to that point and things like that. I
envision that station 3 and 4 should maybe be on about a three year spacing
from the time this one gets built. Then what you can do is - if we can get the
land secured then you can start. One year you might put in the money for the
architect, engineering fee and the purchasing of the truck for that station.
Knowing that it takes them about a year to build fire trucks. You save that so that
the money that you're spending on the building one-year, then that's the money
that pays for the manpower when you've finally opened that station. That three
year growth period then will give you enough time to -the people that you hire
are going to start to getting a little bit of seniority to fill those positions as
(inaudible). I see Meridian building into about a four station department within
about six years. Each one of those stations is going to take about another nine
guys to staff that. The other thing that we'll have to look at -
Ingram: Would that be nine personnel?
Meridian City Council Special~ng
January 24, 2001
Pg. 19
Anderson: --Yes. The other thing that we're going to have to look at is that this
station here at some point probably adding a Truck Company to this station here.
It was designed to accommodate the personnel of the Truck Company but I really
think this station is a (inaudible) and probably one more of these before we really
look at a Truck Company. The Truck Company will be easy to handle the
commercial growth and -
Bird: Ron, (inaudible) that southwest (inaudible) is starting. We're getting some
very expensive homes out in the Ten Mile, Victory area. I realize that right now it
is the City's, well it is City obligation because of Joint Power but it's truly the rural.
Which station in that deal there would be sufficient to service those people out
there? You've got some very nice homes and subdivisions out there and I
believe we can go all the way to the Black Cat can't (sic) we.
Ingram: No, McDermott.
Bird: McDermott, we can go all the way to McDermott. I think you're going to
have to have a fifth station somewhere down in that area. I realize it's longer
down but we don't want to forget completely about that area when we're doing
our long-range plat.
Anderson: You won't build one here until the population and the density is
sufficient enough that it would warrant the (inaudible) out there. That's
something that as the systems get better into Record Management within the
department, we should be able to plot. We should be able to produce maps and
we should be able to show you on acomputer-generated map where the majority
of the runs are. The runs are going to be where your population iS. You'll have
dots out in here where you have (inaudible) but it won't be near (inaudible).
Corrie: Actually you have one, four, and finro to get there (inaudible).
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Anderson: These would be your responding stations. Once they're built they all
respond there, but this one would either follow up here or just cover those other
areas.
De Weerd: Ron, on calls are (inaudible) where are they calling, under (inaudible)
three or four?
Anderson: These ones right now are about a toss up. That's where the dilemma
is I mean if you were to build that station right now today if you had the money,
you would flip a coin and it could go either way. What I'm saying is by the time
this is built and we're three years down the road, I think because of the sewer
that's going to be where that's formed.
Meridian City Council Speciall~ng
January 24, 2001
Pg. 20
•
Bird: Plus you've got a very busy corner there at Eagle and Ustick (inaudible).
Anderson: Eagle and Ustick's going to develop a lot and once we can sewer that
I think the other side of Fairview's going to take off too commercially.
De Weerd: It's really going to be important with the update of our Comp. Plan.
An idea of where we want this needs to be in there so that as developments
come in the planning staff knows where we want those to -it's just like a well
site, hey you know (inaudible) well site you need to put that in your development.
Anderson: You're right because we're almost too late in this area right here.
Ideally it would be Ustick Road and Locust Grove but that whole corner's almost
built out. We have (sic) to now look at a little bit north on Locust Grove. Had we
done that five or ten years ago like we talked about that we (inaudible) piece of
land there -
Bird: We could have had (inaudible) give us some.
Anderson: - we could have hid somebody donate that property but now, the
way we are now that wouldn't apply.
Bird: How far up is this piece of ground, between Ustick and (inaudible)?
Ingram: That's part of our dilemma too now, is I don't want to get left out in the
cold like what happened here where it's a good location --
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
De Weerd: Now is that going to be an issue where station 4 is supposed to go
because that was donated land too?
Anderson: It would probably be just like what we are here (inaudible). We'll
probably want to sell it. The thing about this one, I mean ideally that would have
been back here in the middle of this a little bit but we had to take what we could
get (inaudible) piece of land.
De Weerd: Yes that kind of goes back to the (inaudible). Those lots are
(inaudible).
Ingram: My concern as a rural is even out there in the neighborhood I live in
there's still building going on out there. Anything that stays within the City and
we move those stations out there still benefits us. I don't want to see that whole
area get infield, which it's going to do and I'm seeing that too. When the sewer
hits it's going to infield quick. I would like to have blessing of all parties concern
as we go purchase a hunk of land now. We're on track --
Meridian City Council Special~ng
January 24, 2001
Pg. 21
Anderson: Keith knows, Tammy knows, (inaudible) knows they're buying that
land up to the sewer. Their henchmen were sitting there at our sewer planning
meeting as soon as they saw that master plan and the sewer lines coming out
there they were already gone the next day.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Bird: You've got enough commercial on the northwest corner planned right now
up Ustick and Eagle if you want a Fire Station.
Ingram: That's what I'm concerned about is -that's why I want to discuss that.
Bird: I always thought we would go down here but after talking to Ron and
seeing the peoples involvement, the developers involvement to the north there I
wander if that's where our next two sewers are going. I think -
Ingram: That's like - I guess there's one of (inaudible) we .need to be involved in
kind of your Comp. Planning as far as the Fire Station placement goes so that we
can help in the purchase and secure this now. That way (sic) we're not leaving
the tail hanging out in the wind here when it comes time, when we -City and the
rural, we really need a station there and then we're scrambling trying to find a
hunk of land paying $300,000 for it.
De Weerd: You know, I've been (inaudible) but -
Ingram: I've been looking.
De Weerd: -- identify it because we do need the Comp. Plan.
Ingram: The problem with the hunk of land that we found out there, and I think
it's kind of odd shaped and I'm not sure if it's going to be deep enough to do what
we need to do.
Bowers: It's a little longer but it's not deep.
Bird: The one on the corner of Ustick and Locust Grove. (Inaudible)?
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Bird: Dr. Johnson, he's got pasture to the west and to the north.
Ingram: The southeast corner is still open too, that little farmhouse is. It's been
vacant for sometime now. I don't know if the owners' died or -
Bird: (inaudible) does he?
Meridian City Council Special~ng
January 24, 2001
Pg. 22
Bravo: I don't know what all he owns anymore.
Bird: I don't know either. .
Ingram: Part of one of the problems was is I think it was a recommendation of
somewhere I read or somebody told us that it's not - we don't' want to buy a
corner, you want them just removed from a corner.
Bravo: Because of traffic (inaudible).
Ingram: They documented they have more traffic accidents as the trucks are
leaving. I don't want to cause that. A corner lot itself is not preferable.
Bravo: (Inaudible) my question in my mind is - I think we do but does the City
have a latitude if we find something can we jump on it (inaudible) it up if
something shows up pretty quick? Or is something we're going to do get into
next year's budget and hope that it's still available. That's a question in my mind.
Anderson: I think we're okay because the bid on station 2 actually came in lower
than what we budgeted for.
Bravo: If the opportunity shows (inaudible) we have the ability to -
Anderson: We wold have to look at what the price of it was. I know we were
talking about looking at the traffic light. If land came up then we could buy the
land and we might put the traffic light off.
Bravo: You have another way of -
Anderson: Yes, there would be the opportunity to look at it (inaudible).
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Corrie: Like Ron said we're getting stretched now (inaudible) to obligations that
we're looking at. We have to be careful (inaudible).
Ingram: We established some funds so as far as purchasing our share at the
time, we're available to do that too. I would like to see us peruse that pretty
aggressively.
De Weerd: (Inaudible) land is not going to be (inaudible).
Ingram: No, it hasn't yet.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Meridian City Council Special~ng
January 24, 2001
Pg. 23
Bird: If it goes down I don't think we'll have to worry about another Fire Station.
Ingram: Okay.
Bravo: Tammy to answer your question, No. 2 is our biggest area. That's where
we go with most of our response times is in two and then three right now. That
was two years ago.
Bird: That's right, you're talking about the three that Ron just marked? The
north, because I was quite shocked when they got how many calls they got up
there.
Bravo: Now three and four or wherever we've got three and four is these three
(inaudible). No. 2 is our biggest area.
Ingram: Okay. You guys have anything else to add? You're awful quiet; you're
scaring me.
Item 4 -Site planning & purchasing of Land for Station 4
Ingram: Okay well we've kind of already covered this one. Site planning and
purchasing of Land for Station 4 which is the three or slash four. I kind of
combined those together so unless we got anything else on that we'll just kind of
move on by.
Anderson: Before we move off of that, you said you've looked at that piece of
land that the realtor had and you're not sure that it would very well?
Ingram: I can't tell where the, it's not in the most upscale neighborhood. I can't
tell where the property lines are, I don't know for sure. I need to get out a plat
and find out exactly - if what I'm seeing, what I think is there I don't think it's
going to be deep enough. It's plenty wide enough but I don't think it's going to be
deep enough.
Anderson: I bet if we had Keith, do you know the doctor (inaudible)?
Bird: I don't know him.
Anderson: (Inaudible) we had Keith talk to him and see if he would sell us an
acre off of the corner. It would be right next to that LDS church.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Ingram: Could you -
Bird: I would be glad to talk to him.
Meridian City Council Special~ng
January 24, 2001
Pg, 24
•
Bravo: Power lines are on both sides of the roads, we wouldn't get away from
them they would be on either side.
Ingram: Yes, which they're not supposed to but they did. Could you Keith -
could you talk to him and see what we can find out?
Bird: I`II talk to him, he just comes through -- he just would sit there -
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Anderson: I will get with Will and make a copy of that area so we kind of look at
that lot. The one behind that you don't go (inaudible) see what we can
(inaudible).
Bird: How far are you about middle up on Locust? Are you across from Star
Lane in that area?
Ingram: No, it's further south.
Bird: Further south is it on which side?
Ingram: On the west side.
Bird: Okay so there's just (inaudible) LDS church then, the new LDS church?
Bravo: On the other side.
Ingram: South of it.
Bird: North of it because the Dr. Johnson (inaudible).
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Bravo: I believe that we've had a fire there before in that barn back there - it was
the people that won the lottery were the people that lived there. Then they
moved up --
Corrie: Gibbons? I think that's the name.
Bird: I think you're right, you're right on top there over the area.
Ingram: If you could look into that for us that would be great.
Bird: Okay I'll talk to Dr. Johnson (inaudible).
Meridian City Council Special~ing
January 24, 2001
Pg. 25
Bravo: We would like to buy that property because it would sure give us a lot of
training.
Anderson: You're not getting the whole property.
Bravo: No, this one acre that we're looking at. It's got elk buildings, iYs got trailer
houses and it's got junk.
Ingram: It's got cars that don't move.
Bravo: Cars, we would have a good time burning that (inaudible).
Ingram: (Inaudible) own little training center.
De Weerd: I bet they would move the boulders.
Ingram: No, some of the stuff hasn't moved in a long time. That would be great,
see if we can look into that secure out the land.
Item 5 -Replacement Schedule for Equipment & Apparatus
Ingram: I guess No. 5 kind of goes along with three and four somewhat is the
Replacement Schedule for Equipment and Apparatus. Some of this is being
taken care of too. I would kind of like to get on something joint with the City.
Like I said, my proposal that I kind of typed up, I would like to at least be involved
with that part of the planning part so the rural knows how much and when to
budget the money. We've covered this somewhat. You guys have any
thoughts?
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Ingram: We have for our end, anything different?
Anderson: Didn't Joel Herron do a replacement in his study? Does this match
this or is it different?
Ingram: I don't know, I don't have a copy of the study.
Bravo: (Inaudible) but it wasn't efficient so we haven't got an official copy.
Bird: You don't have an official copy?
Bravo: At the time we didn't know it was (inaudible) out.
Ingram: We reviewed it and we didn't hang onto it.
Meridian City Council Special~ng
January 24, 2001
Pg. 26
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Ingram: Just so the City does know, we got the new one here, you guys have
seen that. Our tender, the only Kenworth 320 and 324 those are both rural
owned. The big tender, which is the Kenworth tender, will be going away within
the next two months. It will be gone. I just got word today from the people whom
- we just ordered a new one, it will be here the first week in March. Right now
we're making arrangements to do away with that piece of apparatus. We jointly,
Kenny, Joe, Ron and myself talked about the need for the little tender, 324.
Probably what's going to happen is after the new one's online, after a period of
time that one's going to go away also and we'll just run with one tender because
the call volume's so low. The need for it's pretty low. It's diminishing over time.
Anderson: The new one's not on here, 303?
Ingram: No and it's here.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Ingram: Two weeks, very shortly.
Bird: On these ones that we are getting rid of like I know I think you said you
were going to get rid of 305. Are we trying to sell them or you know there's some
little departments like (inaudible) Lowman and stuff like that that don't have any
money hat could sure use something like that. What would you get out of
something like that?
Anderson: Not much more if it doesn't use (inaudible). Caldwell had a truck
similar to that that they tried to sell. How long did they have that there Joe?
Silva: Quite awhile, it sat there for a long time.
Anderson: Basically they used it on some wild flame fires and I think they made
more in the summer usually than the wild flames did (inaudible).
Silva: Yes and then I think it was Indian Valley that finally purchased it, I mean
just a really small part. We didn't get much but a couple thousand on it.
Anderson: You're probably talking -for that engine I would guess around $8,000
in equipment.
Silva: We had it appraised by Hugh's Fire Equipment, they do -apparently deal
with the (inaudible). He said I will give you this figure and he gave us a figure of
$8,000 or $8,500. He said there's virtually no market for it. It's always subject to
- who's going to buy it at that figure. He's giving us a guestimate but there's -
Meridian City Council Specia~ng
January 24, 2001
Pg. 27
•
Bird: They just feel that we can help some of these other little communities out
by giving them an awful good deal on these trucks to withstand the load of the
junkyard or something. You're not going to see Nampa, Caldwell or Boise come
over here and bid on this thing unless they want to put it in an antique show or
something.
Anderson: There's a -- I think Lowman is starting a Fire Department, Atlanta is
starting one, Centerville, there's one up by Kamiah that I know of. There's
several that we could donate it to.
Bird: I'm with you Ron, I would like to see it donated, if the rural agreed with us,
the rest of the City and the mayor (inaudible).
Ingram: 305 belongs to the City, we have no interest in that one.
Bird: I was talking about your tenders too, because some of these like that
Kenworth tender -
Ingram: It's in the process of being donated as we speak.
Bird: Oh good, okay. Small communities could definitely use that because of the
water capacity it's got if we can help them out. We had a lot of help within the
Meridian rural, Meridian City in the early years. We had a lot of help, individuals,
and the community.
Ingram: Skip's car finally sold at the auction I heard after three weeks.
Bird: What?
Ingram: Skip's old car, they sold it down at the auction down in Eagle
Bird: I figured we would have to pay them to (inaudible).
Ingram: It didn't sell for three weeks.
Bravo: We almost did, (inaudible) 75 dollars.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Ingram: Just so everybody knows we have kind of come up with something.
This is more of a joint buy in thing on the replacement schedule. I would just like
to make sure everybody's -we're all on the same schedule because that helps
things a lot.
Bird: I, as a Councilperson thought we were going to try to (inaudible) the
recommendation of the assessment. Try to get in line with that, I think that's not
Meridian City Council Special l~Ig •
January 24, 2001
Pg. 28
the way we're going to be -it's going to be feasible but build the stations and get
on a schedule where that's going to be (inaudible).
Ingram: Like I said Keith is some of this is - I'm a little ahead of schedule, but I
appreciate your time here coming, sitting down and t~fking to us because we
didn't much a chance to talk last year. Some of this is late and some of this way
early.
Bird: (Inaudible) things you need to keep up on (inaudible).
Ingram: We're working on that so - at feast we're trying. You guys have
anything else?
Item 6 -Hiring of Investigator /Inspector
Ingram: No. 6 is Hiring of an Investigator/Inspector. I'll throw this one out just as
a thought. With what's kind of become evident over me when Skip retired was
the workloads still there. I won't get into job performance or anything else. I've
asked Joe, since he's been doing it and we've hired Rich Greene to do this stuff
in the interim until we get somebody hired. If there is enough workload to at least
do feasibility into hiring an inspector type person. So we have the Deputy Chief
of Prevention is that what we are calling him? Then an inspector so we have one
doing plans reviews, the building pre-fire plan, things of that nature. Then one
person kind of what Nampa's doing, basically going out and doing a lot of
inspections, sprinkler tests and things like that if there was enough work load to
keep two people busy and he's indicated to me yes. That's kind of a budget item
to throw out if the City Council would entertain something like that if that's a two
year, five year, ten year thing.
Bird: My idea coming from the construction field is the plan checker. I would like
to see it like Boise, plan checkers down there in the Building Department.
(Inaudible) you want to inspect the (inaudible) City Marshall? Your City Marshall
(inaudible) plan checker (inaudible)?
Ingram: I can't answer that because I honestly don't know.
Bird: It's all done in (inaudible). Ron and I have met the two gentlemen doing it
in Boise. They are (inaudible) people. They work (inaudible). I think this point is
the time - I personally, now I realize (inaudible) Marshall to do the inspections
when you go inspecting buildings and stuff. Existing (inaudible) or are you
talking about that?
Ingram: Probably a little bit of everything, but mainly the new -the occupancies.
Bird: That's to give you (inaudible).
Meridian City council Special l~
January 24, 2001
Pg. 29
Anderson: Boise does kind of two-step though you're right. They have a Fire
Inspector, Plans Reviewer that works in the Building Department. That's what
they do when someone brings in a new set of blue prints and submits them for
building they make sure that it meets all of the uniform fire code, and life safety
code issues at the time when it's being built. They go out and do inspections to
make sure that as the building's being constructed that all of the systems are
operational. Then at that point once the building is built, then that's handed off to
the Fire Department and then they have other inspectors in the Fire Department
for Prevention Bureau that makes sure that those systems get maintained and
are kept up like the code. I think in Meridian's case, I think with Skip's retirement
we're seeing that there are not a lot of people out there that do this. It's kind of
specialty work. We've been advertising employee applications.
Bowers: We hadn't had any until -- did you check with Pauline this weekend?
We haven't had any yet last week.
Anderson: What's the closing?
Bowers: February 2"~.
Anderson: February, so we've been advertising now for several weeks and we
haven't even got an applicant. There are not a lot of people knocking down your
door to do this kind of work. I think we're going to have difficulty recruiting the
finding of a good person to do that but if we do luck out and find somebody to do
that that would be a big plus. My personal feelings and what I do in my
department I think Boise does some too, correct me if I'm wrong Mike.
Ingram: I honestly don't know.
Anderson: I like to have the on duty crew, the engine company does a lot of day
to day company inspection type of stuff. Not necessarily new construction but
maintaing the existing facilities. Checking the (inaudible) and the house keeping
and those types of things because it gets the crews out and gets them familiar
with the businesses that are in their district. It's also a great PR tool. Keith's told
me numerous times how much he appreciated when north Ada County used to
come down and visit his business.
Ingram: I visited his business once too though.
Bird: Yes, you came into a fire. I resolved him.
Anderson: I personally prefer that method over hiring Fire Inspectors and I don't
think we have a good enough record keeping system at this point to justify -
Ingram: Some of this is not necessarily immediate Ron, I'm just talking in the
future one of the observations I've made with the staff that we have here it's been
Meridian Cry Council Special A~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 30
•
a huge manpower drain just to put this engine in service. We have three or four
guys working on this every shift trying to get it -it's one of those things, it's on
my wish list. I would like to see us progress into that and that's why I'm asking a
question. Do we honestly need that or is there something else we can do? The
call volume's here, these guys are busy, just the day to day stuff trying to keep
up with maintenance and putting a new truck in service. That takes a lot of
manpower and then a million of other things that happen. You know as well as I
do.
Anderson: I agree with what you're saying. The problem is we don't have
enough data at this point. We're already starting to see a little bit of slowing in
the economy. Everybody's starting to report that the number of bid permits is
down. We need to get this fire prevention person on board and see whether he's
able to keep up with the workload. If he can keep up along with the engine
companies doing part of those inspections - I do agree that when a department
is growing like Meridian is we have one station, are opening up a second station,
putting new trucks in service and hiring new people. That takes away from a lot
of the time that you can use doing those company inspections. In Boise you have
13 stations and we're going to station on line. It doesn't effect all of those other
guys you've got your own maintenance (inaudible) new truck (inaudible).
Ingram: Right, we don't have that luxury. These guys have to fill in all of those
functions. I see it as a - I don't disagree with the thought of having them do - I
do a lot of walkthroughs myself just for familiarization type purposes. It takes
time and these guys don't' have the time. Like I said its growing pains so I'm just
throwing this out there just as a thought to entertain in the future. I'm not saying it
has to happen tomorrow or anything.
Anderson: I think at some point we will have to hire additional inspectors. I'm
just not sure we're at that point now.
Ingram: That's all I'm asking, just some thoughts. You're awful quiet Tammy
you're scaring me. A lot of these I'm just asking questions just kind of thought
provoking.
Item 7 -Hiring of Three Additional Firefighters
Ingram: My other thought was -which kind of leads me to No. 7 was the hiring
of three additional firefighters and my thought there is it's going to be planned
along with the opening of station 3 no matter -wherever that is. Do you think the
City Council would be receptive to another program like what we've done here?
Where we've hired the three firefighters get them some experience again before
trying to avoid some of our pitfalls that we're headed for if we end up hiring nine
all at once?
Meridian City Council Special l~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 31
Anderson: I know I'm a reasonable guy, I can't speak for the rest of the City
Council. We can explain to them what some of those problems are. Why that is
creating problems with us basically hiring six new people right now -we're going to
have to call people up and get positions really faster than what we normally feel
comfortable with. We did hire three additional ones last year and that gave us at
least an opportunity to have them on board for a year before we opened that
station. The other thing that it assists you with is that you have one per shift
above minimum management cuts down on some of your overtime costs that are
involved with additional staff (inaudible).
Ingram: Plus I know one of the big benefits right now for us has been that we've
been able to send people from time to time to some training classes which has
been a really good thing.
Bird: Ron will vouch for this, I've been after - I don't know why we haven't hired
the one's we purchased for already. We have enough overtime to pay for six full
time fireman. Look at your pay outs, your overtime is horrendous and if we -like
Ron said and if we -we've had firefighters that's made more on overtime in a
month than they did on their regular salary. If these guys would get these regular
guys on who are training them. If we have five guys on shift here for a year
before they opened that other station, at least two of them are going out there
prepared. I have no problem with it if we work (inaudible). I have no problem at
all.
Ingram: As far as like the three that we have now, that was agreed mutually
between all of us at the time as to how that would happen so I have no problems
there. I'm just kind of throwing this out as a thought again because I think it's
worked pretty well to get them some experience.
Bird: I have no problem with it at all.
Ingram: Prior to -it's one of those balancing things. It's an expense and we can
look at surveys and studies to death. I think Ron's looked at the same one's I
have fully and we need some more staff. I recognize that but it's the almighty
dollar too.
Bird: For three firefighters it's at least $175,000 a year for three firefighters.
Corrie: What was explained to me from Kenny and Joe, I don't object to that type
of thing. Even if you hired three a year, it's eleven each year to bring them on
that way than to (inaudible) nine of them because you have to training them all.
You're going to have that expense anyway as we grow. If you bring the three on
and you bring three more we always have a group to (inaudible). We don't
(inaudible) captain, driver problem's that we (inaudible). I have no objection in
doing it.
Meridian City Council Special A ig
January 24, 2001 `
Pg. 32
Ingram: Some of this is as though it - I don't know if Ron's going to run again,
and I'm not sure at this point in time if I'm going to run again. I'm just kind of
throwing some of this stuff out here to educate those of us who haven't been
here for the last three and a half years. So when you're hit with this you're not
surprised and you don't go, well why do we need three people, we're not opening
a station for two more years. All of the sudden it gets off the budget and we need
the staff.
Bird: I think the Mayor's right, I think he (inaudible) the head. It's better to have
these guys trained going on and -
Ingram: No arguance here.
Bird: -- I would have no problem if we had five guys pulling the shift here until we
get that there. I voiced my opinion, I told Ron and so I have no problem with it.
Then we've got guys (inaudible).
Corrie: (Inaudible) three a year you don't have - is that on?
Ingram: Yes, move on.
Corrie: Okay, (inaudible) works better let's put it that way.
Anderson: Part of the problem is we've established in the contract, a step
process. You come on at firefighter one, then two, three and then
driver/operator. You have to spend a year's time in each of those. Now with the
opening of station 2 coming so rapidly we have to take people that are at that
firefighter one level, move them down to driver and take people well beyond the
training steps that we have established. It's going to be difficult. We can do it
but it's going to be a difficult process. If you could bring on the three a year and
then you space the building of those stations about every three (inaudible) it will
be just about right.
Bird: If you have four guys on shift on station 2 for awhile what's wrong with that
(inaudible)?
Ingram: As far as the three people that I'm going to -
Bird: (Inaudible) a vacation or if you've got a guy on vacation you have to pull
somebody in. You're covered (inaudible) six (inaudible) pull somebody in.
Ingram: Right, is that going to bonus to us?
Silva: Yes, what you haven't been aware of is the training you've been able to
accomplish with no overtime cost because that person will go to an eight hour
class or a (inaudible) two night thing it's an overnight thing and we're able to
Meridian Cfty Council Special Me~
January 24, 2001
Pg. 34
•
Bird: By having more people, we can cover the station without paying overtime.
I'm telling you last year we could have paid with your overtime, we could have
paid for three firefighters easy.
Silva: Again we're calling in overtime for each and every call times 2,000 or
2,100 calls. That gets expensive over the course of the year. Then there were
(sic) some other events in there. Every time a physical agility or whatever other
special events we had that we dealt with through the course, of the year. We had
to cover the station -
Bird: Now my philosophy with (inaudible) hired three new guys and pay them
their regular salary then have to pay all of this overtime because I'm getting three
new guys ready to go online.
De Weerd: Okay we've heard it. I do appreciate though starting to discuss this.
Bird: (Inaudible) sit by Joe.
De Weerd: It's getting really old. These are (inaudible) she said we have to
(inaudible) like our finance (inaudible) and forecasting. If this is the way we want
to go we want to make sure it's on paper and it's in those forecasts because
(inaudible) operationally (inaudible) it happened. Bringing this up now Mike, this
is very helpful. It's going to be very helpful when the departments sit down on
the finance (inaudible) and start some of that forecasting so that - we know what
direction they're going to go and what future expendage it's going to be in. If our
(inaudible).
Ingram: That's all I have on that one.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Ingram: That's okay, I think we're all in the same direction anyway so that's
good.
Item 8 -Competency Standards and Testing
Ingram: No. 8, there's been some recent things going on within the department.
We've had some discussion amongst ourselves regarding some Competency
Standards and testing. Basically as it relates back to service delivery issues for
us and if it's okay with everybody there I think a better forum for that would be to
move it into a discussion if we talk about our JPA. If that's okay with everybody,
kind of leave that one alone for right now. We'll just table it for right now. Say
yes Tammy.
De Weerd: JPA, what?
Meridian City Council Special M~
January 24, 2001 _
Pg. 35
Ingram: Joint Powers Agreement, sorry.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
De Weerd: I wasn't going to sit here and go huh, I wander which one's
(inaudible).
Ingram: I talk in a lot of acronyms so you have to say whoa.
De Weerd: I did.
Ingram: Okay.
Item 9 -Development of Joint Strategic Plan
Ingram:. We've probably been leading up to No. 9. Basically it's the (sic)
development of a Joint Strategic Plan. We would like to be involved with that
process to keep moving the department forward. Our luxury in the rural is I only
have on department and one budget to worry about which is a neat thing for me.
I don't worry about parks, I don't worry about sewer or water and I don't worry
about other things. I only worry about the Fire Department, which is very near
and dear to my heart. That is an issue that I'm pretty passionate about is keep
moving ahead. We've made huge strides - sometimes I ramble a little bit and
Steve say's yeah, but look where we were three and a half years ago and look
where we are today. We've made huge strides so I want to keep doing that. We
would like to meet with you again Iguess - I don't know when the timing is for
that to help start or participate in that process. I don't now when studies are
coming out or anything else.
Anderson: (Inaudible) question I saw deals in my boxes I read that was a
proposal to do a strategic (inaudible) for the City. We really haven't discussed it
or taken any action on that. Is that something that we're not going to do or we
are going to do?
Corrie: We can do it we're just trying to get some (inaudible)
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Ingram: We're a little pre-emptive on that one again but just kind of that -we're
in agreement that we would like to participate in that process at least regarding
the fire.
Anderson: I just wandered if we could take -- when we hire that consultant to do
that I'm not sure where his format's going to be. If he's going to just kind of go
department by department then maybe when we do the Fire Department then we
could (inaudible) right then into that process.
Meridian City council Special M~,
January 24, 2001
Pg. 36
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Bird: On the Strategic Planning for the fire and for the police, I think we've
already -myself (inaudible) penny for a brief assessment on the fire.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
De Weerd: It's not an assessment.
Bird: Well it's a Strategic Plan -- well if you go right down this guys deal you
have got your Strategic Plan. He tells you where you put your billings, how many
firemen you should have and how many things you're doing. The police are
going to get the same thing.
Ingram: Just as kind of a slant on that though Keith, is I haven't digested that. I
don't know what his plan is but the rural - I don't know because I don't have the
information. I don't know - we may be holding you up in some areas as far as if I
don't budget stuff now we maybe the third leg out there holding you guys up.
According to his process he may say in year four we need to do - we need to
build a station and buy a truck. I'm not sure we can do that. 1 don't' know yet.
Bird: Each year you're going down. Your income is going down but your
responsibility -
Ingram: Actually our income's been going up.
Bird: That's what you're going to start losing.
Bravo: If you guys really start adding (inaudible).
Bird: Every time we annex you lose.
Ingram: Not so far.
Bravo: There's a (inaudible) area.
Ingram: Yes we have.
Bravo: There's aformula -we're pretty stable for a long time. The way the code
is set up it's kind of ridiculous. If you guys annex a lot it will go to a point where,
me, if I stay outside of the City limits with my property, I can potentially see my
fire bill constantly climbing till it reaches acertain -
Ingram: 0024 levy rate.
Meridian City Council Special M~
January 24, 2001 ~.
Pg. 39
•
and that's going to be one of main questions to the potential director. How much
experience and then how can you help us? Do you have the expertise to do it? I
want him to come on board running up, not crawling.
Ingram: Not OGT?
Corrie: Yes, and that's my incentive.
Ingram: When does the City have to certify your budget and do your hearing
stuff.
Anderson: (Inaudible) September -
Corrie: It has to be certified -
Bird: Certified.
Berg: Oh, the second Monday in September we have (inaudible) don't you or do
we count them?
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Ingram: We have to have ours in by the end of August correct?
Bravo: No, September.
Ingram: Is it September?
Bravo: Yes, I think it was September 17th this year I believe.
Berg: It changes because it's according to -
Ingram: We usually have the hearing in August.
Bravo: Yes, we have our hearing in August.
Ingram: That's our snafu is actually we tend to be, I think a little bit ahead of you
guys. That's where we thing we ran into -
Bird: (Inaudible) this year.
Anderson: There are certain dates that the statue spells out when you need to
notify for your Public Hearings and (inaudible) of stuff.
Ingram: We've been doing that. I had to handle that this last year.
~`~ ,-~.
Meridian City Council Special M 3
January 24, 2001
Pg. 40
Anderson: I guess I'm just not as optimistic about this Budget Director as the
Mayor and Tammy. I guess because I've worked for three of them now at
Nampa, but I realize that it does take some time to get on board. It takes them to
figure out what financial accounting systems the City uses. Most people when
they first come into that, then all of a sudden just start making big waves and try
to get oriented first. That budget forecasting and planning and that kind of stuff
usually comes in a year or two if they ever do it after they're in the position. First
they've got to figure out where they're at, and what the City's doing. I've been in
Nampa a lot of years and the Budget Director still doesn't do that unless the City
Council and the Mayor actually made that happen. I'm still waiting for the budget
forecasting to occur and it doesn't occur. We're going to have to try to ride
(inaudible) on that and make sure those things happen. I'm not overly optimistic
that we hire someone in the next 30 or 60 days that it's going to cause our
budget problems to go away this year. I think we're still going to struggle (sic) a
lot (inaudible) position this year.
Bird: We did have, but Ron you - I think that we did have a system implemented
last year that we (inaudible) budget correctable fatigue. You know make it a little
better that will help the budget system. Each year that 1've been here, the
budgets been a little better. The first year was an absolute joke in my opinion,
and 1 haven't (inaudible) it's new to me to. The next year was a little better, and
last year was a lot better. I think - we got a system set now we just have to
make sure. That's what the Budget Director makes sure all of the department
heads uses the same system.
Ingram: Yes, we ran into some problems kind of back and forth with us too
Bird: I think it would be much better.
De Weerd: (Inaudible) the one with communication (inaudible)
Anderson: Also, I think the key is going to be starting early and that's part of the
reason why I want to start early with negotiations with these guys. I would like to
get that out of the way so we know what kind of numbers you're looking at for
salaries and those types of things. If there's a budgeting process early, get all of
the bookwork done so you're not cramming at your last minute.
Ingram: We were talking to our other Commissioners here and we were talking
about - we just got through the budget and it's kind of like phew, another year
were running again, we're up and running. I came in our last meeting here a
week ago and I said bad news folks we got budget starting again in four months.
We're not too early and that's what I'm trying to do is to get some dialog going
between everybody and hopefully streamline this process a little better.
Silva: Is it possible that perhaps we could just work through some -make the
formats the same, so that at least Ron, when you're looking at the overall picture
AAeridian City Council Special
January 24, 2001
Pg. 43
Ingram: Comments, questions?
Bravo: One comment. We're still on to hire six people April 1St is that correct?
Ingram: As far as I know.
Bravo: April 1St that's what our budget was.
Anderson: Better get the budget numbers and .confirm them.
Bravo: That's what I was going to say. I've heard some want to get them on
before and some want to get them on later but that's when we start budgeting is
April 1St
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Ingram: What was the meeting that we discussed that, where's your notes for
last year? We were all in agreement as April as the hire date?
Bravo: That was the last word we got down. It was bounced around.
Ingram: April 1St was the last (inaudible) we got and that's what we budgeted for.
Bravo: Then we got word that it might have gone (sic) to March after we already
approved our budget so we didn't know.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Silva: Six to eight weeks and actually with a revised construction completion
date that we've just been, not revised but just updated on and it still looks right
around May 1St, May 5th and through there. That actually puts it pretty good
because if you think about the time it needs to have - we need to go in there and
set stuff up whether it's furniture, office equipment, what happens if the phones
functional, get the paging system functional. I think that's probably a pretty good
timeline I think. There are probably some other considerations we may want to
revise that day with consideration to (inaudible) if we back off of our point where
we want to put the recruits online. What could bring them from a 40-hour
workweek that the firefighters scheduled, there's some tweak in there and we
wouldn't want to be responsible for any unintended overtime. Then there might
be some adjustment there I (inaudible). We would want to talk to Ron but we
would want to make sure we don't violate any FSOA (inaudible). The timelines
(inaudible) still look pretty good.
Bird: So you're opening then May 15th, June 1St
Meridian City Council Special M~
January 24, 2001
Pg. 44
Silva: I would think the 15~', depending on -sure as heck as we're saying this
right now we're here now, we're getting some kind of unusual weather pattern
coming in (inaudible) some critical part of the project.
Bird: They're pretty out of weather for you right now?
Silva: They're really well, they've been right on.
Bird: They're close, their grounds prepped for asphalt and everything. They're
pretty well out of the -
Anderson: If they (inaudible) Mayor says here Keith is kind of what we did here.
If we got the station on May 1St, we're still looking at a couple of weeks to get in
all of the furniture and that so we'll be looking at mid May (inaudible).
Bird: If we bring it on April 1St the recruits going to be ready to go on (inaudible).
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Bird: See you're taking -your last recruits you took eight and now all of a
sudden you dropped to six. Time isn't a real factor. You can hire two weeks
earlier getting started (inaudible).
Silva: An eight-week academy would be a good solid academy, which would
enable those folks that come aboard to be well prepared.
Bird: (Inaudible) should (inaudible) my opinion.
Ingram: The opening of the station here we were kind of rushed. I would like to
make sure we've got furniture, phones, everything's -punch list is done or at
least as much as we can. That's anever-ending process. I think with the April
1 St, I think we're right on the timeframes for doing that.
Bird: Not if they're going to open May 15th, it's only six weeks.
Ingram: No, I'm talking about with an eight-week academy about June 1St. In
reality I think that's where we're going to be. Based on past (inaudible) I mean
who knows maybe these guys get it done -we've still got some other staffing
options to do for a two week period of time so I think we're okay.
Bird: I think when you said your standards, I felt which was standard is eight
weeks -last recruits. It's like having a Police Academy. One group doesn't go
through in six weeks; the next week goes through in eight weeks. It's athirteen-
week course I think for every recruit that goes through.
Meridian City Council Special ~ •
January 24, 2001
Pg. 45
Ingram: The last time too we had the luxury of putting our firefighters through
with Nampa's academy. We don't have that luxury this time.
Bravo: Boise or Nampa does not - we have to -
Ingram: We have to do our own this time.
Bravo: Joe will be doing it by himself asking Ron to come over and help.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Anderson: He'll be doing it by himself you better give him 16.
Bird: Mike I think you've set a standard on it. I hate to see it be jumping around
(inaudible) recruit last year (inaudible). That's my predicament.
Ingram: The last conversation I had (inaudible) that's what we were leaning
towards anyway.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Anderson: That's really the thing when you have x amount of materials to cover
it (inaudible) audience kind of -this is a smaller group this time so (inaudible).
Ingram: You had eight last time, no you had six.
Bowers: Six, three and three.
Corrie: You're going to do it here this time?
Bowers: Well we'll still have to get help from Boise and Nampa because we just
don't have the training towers or we don't have the facilities here so we'll have to
work something out. Maybe go both ways on some of the hands on.
Silva: We're going to do as much of it in town as possible but there's some props
and some other things we need to do that we don't have the ability to do
(inaudible).
Ingram: Boise I know borrowed one of our people and Joe came over and help
taught so I think there's a good enough working relationship I don't think it's
going to be (inaudible).
Bowers: We've got right now, we've got Scott Kiesig, and we're trading him out.
He's working in Boise on an academy there; he's helping out so that's been
working out.
Meridian City Council Special 11~g
January 24, 2001
Pg. 46
Bird: (inaudible) fire fighters (inaudible).
Silva: What we've been able to do is put a kind of a few shackles in the pot if you
will (inaudible) and we were actually kind of trading out some training that they
give us last year on Rapid Intervention Training.
Ingram: Five years ago the battery used to be pretty well defined and if you look
out here it's not so well defined anymore and where Boise and Meridian are just -
- that never hurts.
Bird: We need to chill in Boise's department, especially when Goul's on. Now
you have another Goul.
Bravo: Now we have another Goul.
Ingram: We have another one on here too.
Bird: Ron volunteered (inaudible) on there.
Ingram: I don't know I went through the academy with his son.
Bird: Okay.
Ingram: You guys have anything else?
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council members)
Ingram: Thank you very much for your time.
Corrie: (Inaudible) a motion to (sic) adjourn (inaudible) Joint meeting of the
(inaudible).
Bird: So moved.
Corrie: Motion made and seconded to adjourn the Joint meeting, all those in
favor say aye.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES
Ingram: Is there any more business to come up with rural? Motion to adjourn?
Drake: Second
Ingram: Move to second the discussion on the motion. Hearing none, all those
in favor of the (inaudible) say aye.
Meridian City council Special
January 24, 2001 -
Pg. 47
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES
Ingram: Motion carries at 9:52 p.m.
Drake: Try again.
Ingram: No, excuse me, 8:52 p.m.
•
Corrie: We re-veined the City Council meeting with (inaudible) going into
Executive Session. Do I hear a motion to do that?
Bird: Mr. Mayor, I move that we go into an Executive Session according to code
67-2345 section b.
Corrie: Do I hear a second?
Anderson: Second.
Corrie: Second made, all in favor say aye.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES
Corrie: We are coming out of Executive Session at 9:10 p.m. No decisions of
nature were made. I entertain a motion to close the Executive Session.
Anderson: So moved.
Corrie: Motion made and seconded all those in favor say aye.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES
Corrie: I entertain a motion to adjourn the meeting.
Bird: So moved
Corrie: All those in favor say aye.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 9:10 P.M.
(TAPE ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
Meridian City Council Special
January 24, 2001
Pg. 48
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