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HomeMy WebLinkAboutMinutes• Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 22 Forrey: Well those buildings don't encroach in that .easement. That easement is wide enough just to get a pick up and a back hoe in there. It is just irrigation maintenance and sewer maintenance for the City. So there is adequate room there. The easement doesn't interfere with the buildings. We have worked around that. Oslund: I am looking at it, does it need to remain when you are done? Forrey: I met with Nampa Meridian again today and they tell me it needs to remain. They have got to get back to the Gruber lateral plus the City has the sewer. Oslund: If you build Penrith or Commercial you can provide them equal or better access then them having to go down through the side of your property right through you landscaping. It just seems kind of odd. Forrey: There is a piece of lateral here a big piece of the lateral here and all along the rail road tracks and that is where the City sewer is. Oslund: I see, so it is not just the one that is running parallel to the rail road track, you are providing access to other little pieces. Forrey: Yes, correct. Johnson: Any other questions of the applicant? This is a public hearing is there anyone else in the audience that would like to address the Commission at this time on the application? Any other questions before we close the public hearing? Hearing none then I will close the public hearing at this time. Shearer: Mr. Chairman, I move we have the Attorney prepare findings of fact and conclusions of law for this. MacCoy: Second Johnson: Moved and seconded that we have the City Attorney prepare findings of fact and conclusions of law on item 8, application by Wayne and Karen Forrey, all those in favor? Opposed? MOTION CARRIED: All Yea ITEM #9: PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A JOHN DEERE DEALERSHIP BY CONTRACTORS EQUIPMENT SUPPLY CO.: • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 23 Johnson: At this time I will open the public hearing and invite the applicant or his representative to address the Commission. Mark Canfield, 1100 Clearview Court, Eagle, was sworn by the City Attorney. Canfield: As I was saying we are a John Deere industrial equipment dealer located currently by the Boise City Airport. The Airport is expanding their north runway operation and has forced us into making a move. We have purchased the property formally known as the playground, the golf .driving range portion of that. The property was recently replatted. We are going to, propose building a 24,000 square foot facility on approximately 10 acres within that site. If I may Mr. Chairman I have a drawing that I would like to share with the Commission members. Johnson: As long as you realize that anything you share with us becomes our property. Canfield: (Inaudible) vacant property currently over here on this side our east boundary and on the west boundary currently this is a parking lot that was used for vehicles to park as they came and drove golf balls on the range which is this area right here. We have as I mentioned earlier a 24,000 square foot building that we propose that will service for selling parts and working on the John Deere equipment that we sell and represent. The front portion of the building is office space and we have approximately 66 parking spaces. We currently employ approximately 28 employees we anticipate with the move into this larger building that our employee base would go to approximately 30 plus people. We have selected a group of what we feel are quality companies to help us bring this development along. Those companies are Wright Brothers is going to be our building contractor. Hubble Engineering is doing the engineering work for us on this facility. And we have Jensen Belt as our landscape architect designer. As you can see we have complied with the Meridian City Ordinances as far as landscaping along the Overland Road route and on our East and West borders of the property. We have a display berm similar to what Western States and Ar° gold Machinery have further down to the west that we will display machines along I-84 in the area along the North boundary. Our hours of operation will be Monday through Friday, normally from 8 to 5, there are times that through the busier construction seasons that we may need to operate from 6 a.m. to no later than 7 p.m. in the evening. Outside of that, I do, I wrould like to at this time introduce our legal counsel to address some of the staff comments in regard to this project, Mr. John McCreedy. John McCreedy, 323 Ressigue, Boise, was sworn by the City Attorney. McCreedy: As Mark stated they have put together a real high quality development team for this particular project. They have been at their Boise facility since 1955 so I think it is Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 24 a long term proposal. It is not the kind of thing that will come today and then be gone next year. It is a very stable company, very stable business that they have been in for quite some time. They have been a John Deere dealership for quite some time and they have been CESCO for quite a while. So they are there to stay and. I think there is quite a bit of need behind the company. You are a little bit familiar or at least I know some of the Council members and some of the Planning and Zoning commission members are familiar with the property. You have probably seen it in a couple of different forms and a couple of different shapes. We are hoping that ends quite frankly: Not that there was anything wrong with what happened in the past because we think a little permanence might in order in that area and it has been fluctuating a little bit. We did have an opportunity to review the staff report that was put together by the City Engineer and City Planning and Zoning Administrator. I quickly returned the comments as requested on that and need to modify a few of the comments that I submitted to the Planning and Zoning Commission in my letter of last Friday, September 13. Just quickly go through a few of those comments and hopefully we have worked out few more things with Shari in the mean time that we might have been a little confused about when the letter was drafted. First, the Cook's lateral, the City code requires that it be tiled, we understand from ACH'D that they are going to expand overland Road in the near future. We think it might be a waste of money to file that lateral, rip out the file and have it changed again when it is expanded. We have asked that item be deleted from a condition of approval. If that is going a little to far to go full and delete an item that is part of the Meridian City Code perhaps we could agree upon something that is a little bit in between and that is that we file it unless the City agrees otherwise. And Nampa and Meridian Irrigation District agree otherwise. Mark Canfield has spoken with John Anderson of the Nampa and Meridian Irrigation District, he seemed at least preliminarily to indicate that it would be a waste of money to file that lateral. So that might be one that when the City Attorney when he does prepare findings of fact we could take a look at that see if there is some way to (inaudible) so we don't waste money on it. Johnson: You might consider a;~plying for a variance on that, that is probably the only ti~~ng that could be done on that. McCreedy: We will do that if that is what needs to be done. We originally Johnson: On that issue before you leave that, did you meet with ACHD, is this a funded and is it on ACHD's agenda for the next two to three years or was that just a general comment? McCreedy: I believe it is in their plans but I don't know that for sure but I can get that information and put it together in the form of a variance application. If we go with a variance application we will get all the background documents and fully submit it. s ~ Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 25 Johnson: Thank you McCreedy: Item 3 in the general comments was a requirement that we determine the seasonal ground water, high ground water and subsurface soils. We originally thought that would be a little more intensive than we figured out and we are here tonight to say that we will comply with that requirement. We have actually got Strata Company which is formally Howards Consultants working on that. So never mind on my comment on item 3 we will comply. On the site specific comments I think probably the one with the most significance at least from the City Engineer's standpoint we have talked with him on occasion about this. Is the sewer service for the facility. I understand from the City Engineer that Meridian needs to bring the Five Mile Trunk extension, I guess it is the Five Mile not the Nine Mile Trunk extension to that piece of property. Also to Bill Howell's piece of property that was approved as Transport Truck and Trailer next door. I think that project is a couple of years down the road although I don't know that for sure. In the meantime and we need a place to hook up to sewer. There might be some confusion between City staff and the folks that have worked on this piece of property. There is a sewer line that ran through the first two lots, lots 2 and 3 of the Playground property. We are lot 1 of the Playground Subdivision. So there is a sewer line that we can hook up I did provide you with a copy of our easement agreement with the Playground. The facilities are there they can be engineered, we can hook up to them as part of construction of this building. I also want to say that CESCO is more than willing to participate in the Five Mile Trunk extension, more than willing to hook up to that trunk extension when it is available. More than willing to pay its fair share along with the other neighboring users in cooperation with the City. But they do need sewer within the next year is this project is approved and they are allowed to go forward. So they do need to take advantage of the existing sewer service that is there. I have drafted some language in my letter that I think might take care of that problem. Again we are more than willing to work with the City on that. Another significant item is what Johnson: Before you leave that item, though 1 would like some comment from Gary Smith our City Engineer. If t"sere is confusion, I am always amazed when Gary i~ confused because he is so seldom confused. (End of Tape) Smith: Thank you Mr. Chairman, there is a sewer that was extended through the RV overnight park. I am not sure how far east it goes from the RV park. I am told it was extended through lot 2 but we are not at least when I talked to my associate Bruce Freckleton he wasn't certain that it was actually completed. The construction was not inspected by the City apparently so we don't have any real record of that, maybe it is there. We don't know how deep it is if it is physically possible to sewer into this lot or not. The fact of the matter is when Dr. Clark sold this property he requested a letter from me i ~ Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 26 concerning sewer service to lot 1. I wrote Dr. Clark a letter at that time which was early on in 1996 stating that sewer service was availaa~»le to Lot 1 as pertains to a support facility building for the driving range. That was all. That isn't all my letter said but that is basically the contents of it. Also at the time the plat was recorded sanitary restrictions were placed on the plat concerning construction on Lot 1 by Central District Health Department. I don't know that those sanitary restrictions have been lifted off of that plat. My main concern and it has always been my concern and City Council's concern is that we start getting sewage from an adjacent drainage area into a drainage area that was not intended to accept that sewage. And the possibility of problems in the future of capacity in the sewer line from an area outside of a drainage area for a specific sewer, line. What kind of liability would the City incur by allowing connection to that line. We don't have a time table for extension of the Five Mile Creek sewer line under the Interstate. The Meridian School district has purchased some property from GL Voigt and ~ understand it is their intention to construct a high school at some point in time. I don't know when that is whether it is three years from now or five years from now. But it is a sizable expenditures to cross under the Interstate with the sewer from where it exists at this point. Construct it to Overland road, West on Overland Road to the school site and it would have to come a little farther west through the Howell site to Lot 1 of the Playground Subdivision. So that is kind of some background on what I remember has happened to this project. When the Clark's had the project when they had the subdivision and that is the reason I wrote the letter, I was very explicit as to what kind of sewage could come back toward the Nine Mile Drainage. Johnson: And your letter didn't address lots 2 and 3 only lot 1 ? Smith: That is the only one he asked for, correct. The lot 3 I guess it is that the RV park is located on it in the Nine Mile Creek Drainage, it is on the west side of Hunter lateral which is the break point in the topography out there. I don't recall the proposed use for lot 2, it almost seems like it was a miniature golf proposal which t don't know, I think there were some restrooms that were proposed as part of that miniature golf development. Shearer: Gary, while you are here, why are we asking for determination of high water, high ground water elevation and profiling of subsurface soil conditions on this site. This is a high ground site as near as I can tell. Smith: That is all they need to tell us, we have had problems with water in crawl spaces, under foundations, and we just want to know what is down there. If we are going to get some lateral movement of surface out of the Hunter Lateral for example although it has been piped I wouldn't expect that would be a problem. But we continue to have problems with ground water or surface water in crawl spaces and the reason is because we have a clay layer. • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 27 Shearer: Do you have them up on the bench there? Up in that area,? Smith: Not that I am aware of, there hasn't been any real construction out there other than down in the Nine Mile Drain area. Shearer: Well this is the highest ground out there and any place, you know like when we did the well place there we were down a lot of feet and the (inaudible) it seems like it is a redundant. Smith: It is a standard comment that we put on all of our reviews. Shearer: Well, I don't know we keep tacking stuff on owners eventually they won't build buildings. Johnson: Well then we wouldn't need any architects and then we would have a better world. Smith: I might add Commissioner Shearer that every once in a while we run into pockets, perched water tables that can cause us grief. It is just a precaution, it doesn't, I don't think it amounts to very much as far as an expense is concerned for them to dig a hole and have somebody look at it and verify that they don't have a perched water table. Johnson: Thanks Gary. McCreedy: Regarding the ground water height and the subsurface soils after talking with Shari just briefly and then again with my client earlier. It is not a problem with us we understand what the City wants and we will get it done. I think we were wanting to try and solve the stickier problems like the sewer and perhaps the development agreement and .put our resources there. On the sewer system as far as the location of that sewer line over to Lot 1 wt,ich is the lot owned by CESCO my understanding and i haven't dug there and neither has my client but my understanding based on our negotiations and representations with the Clarke's is the sewer line may not extend all the way to Lot 1 but it is pretty close. We could not get an accurate figure from them at any one time and therefore we included in the easement agreement our right to cross their land to hook up to that system. We also included in the easement agreement one of the concerns that we had was the size and the engineering of the facilities on site not only on our lot, Lot 1 but on their lots 2 and 3. And so we included in the easement agreement CESCO's right to increase the size of that pipe if necessary to satisfy the City Engineer's standards. So I think we have hopefully anticipated those issues and covered them as well as we can. Now the capacity of the sewer system to handle that waste beyond those two lots is really something that is beyond our control for the time being. But 1 do want to reiterate that we are willing to Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 28 participate in the extension to the site from the east. We will do anything we can to engineer the facilities on site and if there are some limits that need to be placed reasonable limits on the amount of waste that can be discharged from the CESCO facility then we will do that in order to assure that capacity isn't exceeded. But I can't stress enough hour critically important it is that we have access to the existing sewer line. There is one there, it was intended for building on that lot and it is very important that we have access to that even if on a temporary basis until that new fine gets put in. Without it the project basically fails at least for the time being. We will work with the City Engineer in whatever way we can to get it done. The development agreement, there is an existing development agreement that was entered into with the Clark's quite some time ago. I kind of question where. that development agreement stands, it has been my experience with some development agreeme~rtts they are very rosy up front whether they get enforced or not, whether they get complied with or not is sometimes questionable in some instances. I did have a chance to mention with Mr. Crookston just briefly before the meeting that we will proceed in whatever way the City wants us to proceed in order to get the project approved. If the development agreement is defunct and needs to be terminated then so be it. If the City wants a modified and amended development agreement I will draft that and have it over here post haste within the next week or two for Mr Crookston to agree. Even so you can have it in advance of the next Planning and Zoning Commission meeting were you to decide to request findings of fact and conclusions of law and a recommendation. We will go whatever way the City wants to go with a development agreement. Regarding hours of operation, I want to add that having the facility open from 6 in the morning to 7:30 at night would be on a as needed basis only. The normal hours of operation would be 8 to 5. I have included some language in my letter that I hope would accomplish that. Regarding the transfer of the permit or the property to two new owners that was my mistake. I didn't read your ordinance carefully enough, I found the section that does deal with transfers and as my understanding it does require City Council approval so I would like to delete that request from my letter. That staff condition looks fine. We request that the Commission order the findings of fact and conclusions of law be prepared, tF•~at you recommend approval to the City Council in acc~~rdance with the Meridian zoning and development ordinance. That if it is at all possible that we get on the October 8, 1996 P & Z Commission agenda to have those findings of fact and conclusions of law reviewed. I have asked Ms. Stiles to fax them over to me a few days in advance, we will review them post haste and get our comr#s back in and do as much upfront negotiation with the city staff on all of the conditions we~ can before we come to the Commission again to hopefully reduce as many conflicts. I would also like to add I think the record supports a finding that Section 218 C of your ordir~nce has been satisfied that requires nine different findings, I won't go through them in detail. but a couple of the highlights. First is it a conditional use, I think in fact if we wanted to get strictly technical and we looked at the zoning ordinance it is a permitted use. It is heavy farm equipment sales and repair section 2-409 C in an industrial area zoned C-G. I think it is clearly the type of use that is contemplated in that • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 29 area. We are more than willing to go through the Conditional Use process to get the conditions that the City wants. It is harmonious with the general vicinity, we have Arnold and Western States dealerships very close to us. Mobile home sales and service facility in the area, Meridian Ford in the area. I think it is fairly compatible with the vicinity. There has been a problem as you may know with some of the bright lights from the. driving range in the past. Those will be removed, I repeat they will be removed. We will have low wattage lights that focus around the building sufficient for security but they will be focused on the property and nowhere else. You have ACRD comments we agree with them and we will comply with them. They seem to indicate the traffic can handle the area and the public facilities. There won't be any additional cost to the public for the facilities, traffic may even be less than what is currently there now, although I don't have those numbers in front of me but the traffic count from ACRD was 270 vehicles per day which isn't alarming and they indicated that the facilities can handle it. There aren't any natural or scenic features of any major importance that we haven't protected. I would also like to add that at least from the Staffs point of view we put a lot of time into the landscaping plan and I think that Shari might have made a comment that the landscaping exceeds City requirements and that was intentional, we would like to have as attractive of a facility as possible. Johnson: What is the distance from Overland to the building? McCreedy: (Inaudible) I believe it was somewhere close to (inaudible) from Overland to the building itself? Johnson: Yes, just to the face of the building. McCreedy: I don't have that figure off the top of my head but it looks fairly significant 80 or 90 feet. Johnson: (Inaudible) What would you say Mr. Architect? Shearer: Well the parking lot has got to be at least 65 feet across there so just the parking lot alone plus the landscaping, you would be 120 in that parking lot excuse me. Oslund: Is your scale correct there, the 1 inch equals 40 feet? You are probably in the 240 foot range. (Inaudible) Johnson: So we went from 80 to (inaudible) Is that the end of your presentation and comments, are there any questions of the applicant at this time from anybody other than Wayne Crookston? • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 30 MacCoy: I do, you have done your homeworkwell, I like the fact that you have a berm out there on Overland, it is going to be a real nice addition. Based on the fact that you have done your homework and knowing that Overland is not going to be widened. for awhile it is only a two lane road right at present. At best they are speaking of a three lane what about your trucks carrying equipment and so forth getting in and out of that place. You have run tests I am sure or at least (inaudible) McCreedy: ACRD worked with us allowing us to expand these radiuses from the traditional 15 degrees to 25 degrees to accommodate swing turns with longer semi trucks. The maximum driveways width that they would be willing to grant us was 40 feet. So our entrance is 40 feet and that is the maximum as permitted by ACHD. MacCoy: So you can make a turn and stay on the roadway without going off. McCreedy: We believe we can. MacCoy: (Inaudible) You already know from your site out there you have ditching on both sides, you put that truck in there and you just locked Overland and we have seen it happen very easily out there. So I would suggest -that you look at that very carefully. On, you have already addressed lighting, what about signage. I know you are going to have to submit signage to us for review but what do you have planned? McCreedy: We have, I thought it was in the plan somewhere, we have a low profile sign in this area right here of the driveway that would say the words John Deere on it. MacCoy: Just like your cover (inaudible) that you gave us, like this one here. I didn't know if that was an artists conception or if that was (inaudible) McCreedy: That is the style and design of sign that we intend on using on the Overland Road side of the property. MacCoy: I imagine that it will be lit. McCreedy: Florescent type tubes, low wattage type lighting. MacCoy: What about up on the freeway side or anyplace else? McCreedy: We would anticipate doing a sign similar to what Western States and Arnold Machinery have done a display sign that would meet City ordinances as far as height and lighting requirements. It would be an elevated sign in this area of the berm. Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 31 MacCoy: You wouldn't plan to do what Ford did over there and put. one up on Overland which was objectionable. McCreedy: It will be a low impact type sign, nothing flashing. Just again displaying our product name. MacCoy: And be sure to keep away from flashing, because that will get you for sure. Your ADA requirement code is required of you and (Inaudible) I would suggest that you, you probably already have worked out, although I don't see all the pieces here, on parking for handicapped, to the nth degree which means you have side pieces for your vans to get wheelchairs. out and so on. Your building on this end the south end would be two story is that office building? McCreedy: It will be single story on the office portion the parts warehouse and shop area will also be single story but approximately 20 to 24 foot high ceilings in that area. MacCoy: You don't plan to excavate and drop that section down, it is all going to be on level land? McCreedy: It will be on level land yes. MacCoy: Everything internal will be with the ADA (inaudible). McCreedy: The architect, we haven't determined who we are going to use for certain, we have interviewed with CSHQA, ADA has come and we want to be sure that we are in full compliance. MacCoy: Good because that is a very important thing with us. Your trash receptacles and so on are going to be where? McCreedy: The trash receptacles for the building will more than likely be on access wise it will probably be located behind this screened off fenced area here, so whoever the trash contractor is will have direct access. MacCoy: So you will have a screened. McCreedy: This is screened, this will be a fenced off area, the full facility will be fenced to this portion here, the back half of the building if you will and this will be screened (inaudible) that may be stored outdoors and trash receptacles etc. MacCoy: Okay you brought the next part us was will you keep any parts outside, will you Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 32 screen those because it becomes a used car lot and you don't' want that. Okay, I think that is all I have. Johnson: Anyone else including Wayne Crookston? Crookston: I do have a question, excuse me the ditch that you said that you were going to tile, what is that ditch? McCreedy: The ditch that the city is requiring us to the is Cook's lateral, it is my understanding. It traverses both the Playground property and what is now the CESCO property. I am not completely sure it has been tiled in its entirety on the Playground property. I think there was some question regarding that in the past. Crookston: Do you happen to know the size of the ditch? Canfield: I can't answer that question I have no idea, I would take a hunch that it would take some 30 inch diameter pipe to the just an educated guess. Crookston: I believe that should have been tiled by the Playground. Do you know the status of that Gary? Smith: No I don't, it is my understanding there is a ditch that goes to the north that crosses under the Interstate. That might, I am sorry that was the Howell .property. I don't know on the Cooks's lateral. Crookston: Thank you Canfield: (Inaudible) that says unless otherwise agreed by the City and Nampa and Meridian Irrigation District to not the it. Johnson: I was interested in your comment that you felt this was a permitted use and didn't require a conditional use permit. Did you look at it from that perspective Wayne, how did you arrive at that being a conditional use permit? Crookston: I believe that this is in a planned use area in which all uses are required to have a conditional use permit. Oslund: The same thing that we ran into last time with the one over on Eagle. McCreedy: The advice that I have given John Deere CESCO is to not worry about it and let's do whatever the City wants if they want a conditional use permit as a way of Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 33 amending the development agreement. Let's do that whatever it takes to satisfies City's conditions. We really don't want to debate that issue. Johnson: I understand that, I want to debate the issue because I don't want to be doing things we don't need to be doing. That is why I am asking that question. Any other questions for the applicant. This is a public hearing, anyone from the public that would like to address the Commission at this time on this application? Anyone at all here for this? Any other questions then? At this time I will close the public hearing and I would appreciate it if you would leave that diagram with us. Shearer: Mr. Chairman, I move that we have the attorney prepare findings of fact and conclusions of law on this project. MacCoy: Second Johnson: We have a motion and a second to have the, City Attorney prepare findings of fact and conclusions of law, all those in favor? Opposed? MOTION CARRIED: All Yea ITEM #10: PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A RADIO ANTENNA TOWER BY WESTERN WIRELESS: Johnson: This application has been withdrawn FIVE MINUTE RECESS ITEM #11: PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A THRIFT STORE AND FARMERS MARKET BY IDAHO YOUTH RANCH INC.: Johnson: I will now open the public hearing and invite the applicant or his representative to come forward and address the Commission. Is anyone present representing the Idaho Youth Ranch Inc.? Ms. Stiles? Stiles: Chairman Johnson and Commissioners, due to the fact that the representative of the applicant is having some health problems, we stressed him out too bad. I think it is a very straight forward project, it is the Food Town existing grocery store. They have submitted their plan that they are showing adding the parking and some landscaping that hasn't existed at the site before. Ada County Highway District has placed some restrictions on in and out because they plan to still use the existing pumps as part of their program plus probably open to the public. The smaller 8 1/2 by 11 drawing you have is for Hills • • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission October 8, 1996 Page 11 MOTION CARRIED: All Yea ITEM #7: FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT GENERAL BY WAYNE AND KAREN FORREY: Johnson: Any discussion, corrections or deletions concerning these findings of fact as prepared? Entertain a motion for approval. Borup: Mr. Chairman I move the Meridian Planning and Zoning Commission hereby adopts and approves these findings of fact and conclusions of law. Shearer: Second Johnson: Moved and seconded we approve the findings of fact as prepared, roll call vote. ROLL CALL VOTE: Borup -Yea, Oslund -Absent, Shearer -Yea, MacCoy -Absent, Johnson -Yea MOTION CARRIED: All Yea Johnson: Recommendation to the City? Borup: Mr. Chairman, I recommend the Meridian Planning and Zoning hereby recommend to the City Council of the City of Meridian that they approve the conditional use permit requested by the applicant for the property described in the application with the conditions set forth in the findings of fact and conclusions of law. Shearer: Second Johnson: Moved and seconded we pass the recommendation onto the City as stated, all those in favor? Opposed? MOTION CARRIED: All Yea Johnson: This should be a good project for the City of Meridian Mr. Forrey. (Inaudible) ITEM #8: FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A JOHN DEERE DEALERSHIP BY CONTRACTORS EQUIPMENT SUPPLY • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission October 8, 1996 Page 12 CO.: Johnson: Any discussion regarding the CESCO findings of fact and conclusions of law? Borup: I have none, I think they covered things pretty good. on the concerns before (inaudible) sewer and water and it sounded like there are a lot of conditions that need, a lot of things need to happen. I have nothing else. Shearer: Mr. Chairman, I move the Meridian Planning and Zoning hereby adopt and approve these findings of fact and conclusions. Borup: Second Johnson: Moved and seconded we approve these findings of fact and conclusions of law, roll call vote. -ROLL CALL VOTE: Borup -Yea, Oslund -Absent, Shearer -Yea, MacCoy -Absent, Johnson -Yea MOTION CARRIED: All Yea Shearer: Mr. Chairman, I move the Meridian Planning and Zoning Commission hereby recommend to the City Council that they approve the conditional use permit requested by the applicant for the property described in the application with the conditions set forth in the findings of fact and conclusions of law. Specifically resolving the sufficient sewer and water service for all of the applicant's land included in this application. Borup: Second Johnson: Motion and second to pass the recommendation onto the City as read, all those in favor? Opposed? MOTION CARRIED: All Yea ITEM #9: FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR CONDITIONAL US PERMIT FOR A THRIFT STORE AND FARMERS MARKET BY IDAHO YOUTH RANCH INC.: Johnson: Any comments gentlemen? Borup: Nothing specific on the findings and I think it probably can be handled, the same • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 22 " Forrey: Well those buildings don'f encroach in that easement. That easement is wide enough just to get a pick up and a back hoe in there. It is just irrigation maintenance and sewer maintenance for the City. So there is adequate room there. The easement doesn't interfere with the buildings. We have worked around that. Oslund: I am looking at it, does it need to remain when you are done? Forrey: I met with Nampa Meridian again today and they tell me it needs to remain. They have got to get back to the Gruber lateral plus the City has the sewer. Oslund: If you build Penrith or Commercial you can provide them .equal or better access then them having to go down through the side of your property right through you landscaping. It just seems kind of odd. Forrey: There is a piece of lateral here a big piece of the lateral here and all along the rail road tracks and that is where the City sewer is. Oslund: I see, so it is not just the one that is running parallel to the rail road track, you are providing access to other little pieces. Forrey: Yes, correct. Johnson: Any other questions of the applicant? This is a public hearing is there anyone else in the audience that would like to address the Commission at this time on the application? Any other questions before we close the public hearing? Hearing none then I will close the public hearing at this time. Shearer: Mr. Chairman, I move we have the Attorney prepare findings of fact and conclusions of law for this. MacCoy: Second Johnson: Moved and seconded that we have the City Attomey prepare findings of fact and conclusions of law on item 8, application by Wayne and Karen Forrey, all those in favor? Opposed? MOTION CARRIED: All Yea ITEM #9: PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A JOHN DEERE DEALERSHIP BY CONTRACTORS EQUIPMENT SUPPLY CO.: • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 23 Johnson: At this time I will open the public hearing and invite the applicant or his representative to address the Commission. Mark Canfield, 1100 Clearview Court, Eagle, was sworn by the City Attorney. Canfield: As I was saying we are a John Deere industrial equipment dealer located currently by the Boise City Airport. The Airport is expanding their north runway operation and has forced us into making a move. We have purchased the property formally known as the playground, the golf driving range portion of that. The property was recently replatted. We are going to, propose building a 24,000 square foot facility on approximately 10 acres within that site. If I may Mr. Chairman I have a drawing that l would like to share with the Commission members. Johnson: As long as you realize that anything you share with us becomes our property. Canfield: (Inaudible) vacant property currently over here on this side our east boundary and on the west boundary currently this is a parking lot that was used for vehicles to park as they came and drove golf balls on the range which is this area right here. We have as I mentioned earlier a 24,000 square foot building that we propose that will service for selling parts and working on the John Deere equipment that we sell and represent. The front portion of the building is office space and we have approximately 66 parking spaces. We currently employ approximately 28 employees we anticipate with the move into this larger building that our employee base would go to approximately 30 plus people. WP have selected a group of what we feel are quality companies to help us bring this development along. Those companies are Wright Brothers is going to be our building contractor. Hubble Engineering is doing the engineering work for us on this facility. And we have Jensen Belt as our landscape architect designer. As you can see we have complied with the Meridian City Ordinances as far as landscaping along the Overland Road route and on our East and West borders of the property. We have a display berm similar to what Western Stat s and Arnold Machinery have further down to the wee is that we will display machines along I-84 in the area along the North boundary. Our hours of operation will be Monday through Friday, normally from 8 to 5, there are times that through the busier construction seasons that we may need to operate from 6 a.m. to no later than 7 p.m. in the evening. Outside of that, I do, I would like to at this time introduce our legal counsel to address some of the staff comments in regard to this project, Mr. John McCreedy. . John McCreedy, 323 Ressigue, Boise, was sworn by the City Attom~y. McCreedy: As Mark stated they have put together a real high quality development team for this particular project. They have been at their Boise facility since 1955 so I think it is • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16,,1996. Page 24 along term proposal. It is not the kind of thing that will- come today and then be gone next year. It is a very stable company, very stable business that they. have been in for quite some time. they have been a John Deere dealership for quite some time and they have been CESCO for quite a while. So they are there to stay and. f think there is quite a bit of need behind the company. You are a little bit familiar or at least I know some of the Council members and some of the Planning and Zoning commission members are familiar with the property. You have probably seen it in a couple of different forms and a couple of different shapes. We are hoping that ends quite frankly. Not that there was anything wrong with what happened in the past because we think a little permanence might in order in that area and it has been fluctuating a little bit. We did have an opportunity to review the staff report that was put together by the City Engineer and City Planning and Zoning Administrator. I quickly returned the comments as requested on that and need to modify a few of the comments that I submitted to the Planning and Zoning Commission in my letter of last Friday, September 13. Just quickly go through a few of those comments and hopefully we have worked out few more things with Shari in the mean time that we might have been a little confused about when the letter was drafted. First, the Cook's lateral, the City code requires that it be tiled, we understand from ACRD that they are going to expand overland Road in the near future. We think it might be a waste of money to the that lateral, rip out the the and have it changed again when it is expanded. We have asked that item be deleted from a condition of approval. If that is going a little to far to go full and delete an item that is part of the Meridian City Code perhaps we could agree upon something that is a little bit in between and that is that we the it unless the City agrees otherwise. And Nampa 2nd Meridian Irrigation District agree otherwise. Mark Canfield has spoken with John Anderson of the Nampa and Meridian Irrigation District, he seemed at least preliminarily to indicate that it would be a .waste of money to the that lateral. So that might be one that when the City Attorney when he does prepare findings of fact we could take a look at that see if there is some way to (inaudible) so we don't waste money on it. Johnson: You might consider applying for a variance on that, that is probably t~ re only thing that could be done on that. McCreedy: We will do that if that is what-needs to be done. We originally Johnson: On that issue before you leave that, did you meet with ACHD, is this a funded and is it on ACHD's agenda for the next two to three years or was that just a general comment? McCreedy: I believe it is in their plans but I don't know that for sure but I can get that information and put it together in the form of a variance application. If we go with a variance application we will get all the background documents and fully submit it. • • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16,.1996. Page 25 Johnson: Thank you McCreedy: Item 3 in the general comments was a requirement that we determine the seasonal ground water, high ground water and subsurface soils. We. originally thought that would be a little more intensive than we figured out and we are here tonight to say that we will comply with that requirement. We have actually got Strata Company which is formally Howards Consultants working on that. So never mind on my comment on item 3 we will comply. On the site specific comments I think probably the one with the most significance at least from the City Engineer's standpoint we have talked with him on occasion about this. Is the sewer service for the facility. I understand from the City Engineer that Meridian needs to bring the Five Mile Trunk extension, I guess it is the Five Mile not the Nine Mile Trunk extension to that piece of property. Also to Bill Howell's piece of property that was approved as Transport Truck and Trailer next door. I think that project is a couple of years down the road although I don't know that for sure. In the meantime and we need a place to hook up to sewer. There might be some confusion between City staff and the folks that have worked on this piece of property. There is a sewer line that ran through the first two lots, lots 2 and 3 of the Playground property. We are lot 1 of the Playground Subdivision. So there is a sewer line that we can hook up I did provide you with a copy of our easement agreement with the Playground. The facilities are there they can be engineered, we can hook up to them as part of construction of this building. I also want to say that CESCO is more than willing to participate in the Five Mile Trunk extension, more than willing to hook up to that trunk extension when it is available. More than willing to pay its fair share along with the other neighboring users in cooperation with the City. But they do need sewer within the next year is this project is approved and they are allowed to go forward. So they do need to take advantage of the existing sewer service that is there. I have drafted some language in my letter that I think might take care of that problem. Again we are more than willing to work with the City on that. Another significant item is what Johnson: Before you leave that item, though I would like some comment from Gary Smith our City Engineer. If there is confusion, I am always amazed ~r;nen Gary is confused because he is so seldom confused. (End of Tape) Smith: Thank you Mr. Chairman, there is a sewer that was extended through the RV overnight park. I am not sure how far east it goes from the RV park. I am told it was extended through lot 2 but we are not at least when I talked to my associate Bruce Freckleton he wasn't certain that it was actually completed. The construction was not inspected by the City apparently so we don't have any real record of that, maybe it is there. We don't know how deep it is if it is physically possible to sewer into this lot or not. The fact of the matter is when Dr. Clark sold this property he requested a letter from me • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16,..1996. Page 26 concerning sewer service to lot 1. I wrote Dr. Clark a letter at that time which was early on in 1996 stating that sewer service was available to Lot 1 as pertains to a support facility building for the driving range. That was all. That isn't all my letter said but that is basically the contents of it. Also at the time the plat was recorded sanitary restrictions were placed on the plat concerning construction on Lot 1 by Central District Health Department. I don't know that those sanitary restrictions have been lifted off of that plat. My main- concern and it has always been my concern and City Council's concern is that we start getting sewage from an adjacent drainage area into a drainage area that was not intended to accept that sewage. And the possibility of problems in the future of capacity in the sewer line from an area outside of a drainage area for a specific sewer line. What kind of liability would the City incur by allowing connection to that line. We don't have a time table for extension of the Five Mile Creek sewer line under the Interstate. The Meridian School district has purchased some property from GL Voigt and I understand it is their intention to construct a-high school at some point in time. I don't know when that is whether it is three years from now or five years from now. But it is a sizable expenditures to cross under the Interstate with the sewer from where it exists at this point. Construct it to Overland road, West on Overland Road to the school site and it would have to come a little farther west through the Howell site to Lot 1 of the Playground Subdivision. So that is kind of some background on what I remember has happened to this project. When the Clark's had the project when they had the subdivision and that is the reason I wrote the letter, I was very explicit~as to what kind of sewage could come back toward the Nine Mile Drainage. Johnson: And your letter didn't address lots 2 and 3 only lot 1? Smith: That is the only one he asked for, correct. The lot 3 I guess it is that the RV park is located on it in the Nine Mile Creek Drainage, it is on the west side of Hunter lateral which is the break point in the topography out there. I don't recall the proposed use..-for lot 2, it almost seems like it was a miniature golf proposal which I don't know, I think there were some restrooms that were proposed as part of that miniature golf development.: Shearer: Gary, while you are here, why are we asking for determination of high water, high ground water elevation and profiling of subsurface soil conditions on this site. This is a high ground site as near as I can tell. ~- Smith: That is all they need to fiell us, we have had problems with water in crawl spaces, under foundations, and we just want to know what is down there. If we are going to get some lateral movement of surface out of the Hunter Lateral for example although it .has been piped I wouldn't expect that would be a problem. But we continue to have problems with ground water or surface water in crawl spaces and the reason is because we have a clay layer. • . Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 27 - Shearer: Do you have them up on the bench there? Up in that area? Smith: Not that I am aware of, there hasn't been any real construction out there other than down in the Nine Mile Drain area. Shearer: Well this is the highest ground out there and any place, you know like when we did the well place there we were down a lot of feet and the (inaudible) it seems like it is a redundant. Smith: It is a standard comment that we put on all of our reviews. Shearer: Well, I don't know we keep tacking stuff on owners eventually they won't build buildings. Johnson: Well then we wouldn't need any architects and then we would have a better world. Smith: I might add Commissioner Shearer that every once in a while we run into pockets, perched water tables that can cause us grief. It is just a precaution, it doesn't, I don't think it amounts to very much as far as an expense is concerned for them to dig a hole and have somebody look at it and verify that they don't have a perched water table. Johnson: Thanks Gary. McCreedy: Regarding the ground water height and the subsurface soils after talking with Shari just briefly and then again with my client earlier. It is not a problem with us we understand what the City wants and we will get it done. I think we were wanting to try and solve the stickier problems like the sewer and perhaps the development agreement and put our resources there. On the sewer system as far as the. location of that sewer line over to Lot 1 which is the lot owned by CESCO my understanding and I haven't dug t; sere and neither has my client but my understanding based on our negotiations and representations with the Clarke's is the sewer line may not extend all the way to Lot 1 but it is pretty close. We could not get an accurate figure from them at any one time and therefore we included in the easement agreement our right to cross their land to hookup to that system. We also included in the easement agreement one of the concerns that we had was the size and the engineering of the facilities on site not only on our lot, Lot 1 but on their lots 2 and 3. And so we included in the easement agreement CESCO's right to increase the size of that pipe if necessary to satisfy the City Engineer's standards. So I think we have hopefully anticipated those issues and covered them as well as we can. Now the capacity of the sewer system to handle that waste beyond those two lots is really something that is beyond our control for the time being. But I do want to reiterate that we are willing to • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 28 participate in the extension to the site from the east. We will do anything we can to engineer the facilities on site and if there are some limits that need to be placed reasonable limits on the amount of waste that can be discharged from the CESCO facility then we will do that in order to assure that capacity isn't exceeded. But I can't stress enough hour critically important it is that we have access to the existing sewer line. There is one there, it was intended for building on that lot and it is very important that we have access to that even if on a temporary basis until that new line gets put in. Without it the project basically fails at least for the time being. We will work with the City Engineer in whatever way we can to get it done. The development agreement, there is an existing development agreement that was entered into with the Clark's quite some time ago. I kind of question where that development agreement stands, it has been my experience with some development agreements they are very rosy upfront whether they get enforced or not, whether they get complied with or not is sometimes questionable in some instances. I did have a chance to mention with Mr. Crookston just briefly before the meeting that we will proceed in whatever way the City wants us to proceed in order to get the project approved. If the development agreement is defunct and needs to be terminated then so be it. If the City wants a modified and amended development agreement I will draft that and have it over here post haste within the next week or two for Mr Crookston to agree. Even so you can have it in advance of the next Planning and Zoning Commission meeting were you to decide to request findings of fact and conclusions of law and a recommendation. We will go whatever way the City wants to go with a development agreement. Regarding hours of operation, I want to add that having the facility open from 6 in the morning to 7:30 at night would be on a as needed basis only. The normal hours of operation would be 8 to 5. I have included some language in my letter that I hope would accomplish that. Regarding the transfer of the permit or the property to two new owners that was my mistake. 1 didn't read your ordinance carefully enough, I found the section that does deal with transfers and as my understanding it does require City Council approval so I would like to delete that request from my letter. That staff condition looks fine. We request that the Commission order the findings of fact and conclusions of law be prepared, that you recommend approval to the City Council in accordance with the Meridian zoning .and development ordinance. That if it is at all possible that we get on the October 8, 1996 P & Z Commission agenda to have those findings of fact and conclusions of law reviewed. I have asked Ms. Stiles to fax them over to me a few days in advance, we will review them post haste and get our comments back in and do as much upfront negotiation with the city staff on all of the conditions we can before we come to the Commission again to hopefully reduce as many conflicts. I would also like to add I think the record supports a finding that Section 218 C of your ordinance has been satisfied that requires nine different findings, I won't go through them in detail but a couple of the highlights. First is it a conditional use, I think in fact if we wanted to get strictly technical and we looked at the zoning ordinance it is a permitted use. It is heavy farm equipment sales and repair section 2-409 C in an industrial area zoned C-G. I think it is clearly the type of use that is contemplated in that • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 29 area. We are more than willing to go through the Conditional Use process to get the conditions that the City wants. It is harmonious with the general vicinity, we have Arnold and Western States dealerships very close to us. Mobile home sales and service facility in the area, Meridian Ford in the area. I think it is fairly compatible with the vicinity. There has been a problem as you may know with some of the bright lights from the driving range in the past. Those will be removed, I repeat they will be removed. We will have low wattage lights that focus around the building sufficient for security but they will be focused on the property and nowhere else. You have ACHD comments we agree with them and we will comply with them. They seem to indicate the traffic can handle the area and the public facilities. There won't be any additional cost to the public for the facilities, traffic may even be less than what is currently there now, although I don't have those numbers in front of me but the traffic count from ACHD was 270 vehicles per day which isn't alarming and they indicated that the facilities can handle it. There aren't any natural or scenic features of any major importance that we haven't protected. I would also like to add that at least from the Staffs point of view we put a lot of time into the landscaping plan and I think that Shari might have made a comment that the landscaping exceeds City requirements and that was intentional, we would like to have as attractive of a facility as possible. Johnson: What is the distance from Overland to the building? McCreedy: (Inaudible) I believe it was somewhere close to (inaudible) from Overland to the building itself? Johnson: Yes, just to the face of the building. McCreedy: I don't have that figure off the top of my head but it looks fairly significant 80 or 90 feet. Johnson: (Inaudible) What would you say Mr. Architect? Shearer: Well the parking lot has got to be at least 65 feet across there so just the parking lot alone plus the landscaping, you would be 120 in that parking lot excuse me. Oslund: Is your scale correct there, the 1 inch equals 40 feet? You are probably in the 240 foot range. (Inaudible) Johnson: So we went from 80 to (inaudible) Is that the end of your presentation and comments, are there any questions of the applicant at this time from anybody other than Wayne Crookston? • • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 30 MacCoy: I do, you have done your Homework well, I like the fact that you have a berm out there on Overland, it is going to be a real nice addition. Based on the fact that you have done your homework and knowing that Overland is not going to be widened for awhile it is only a two lane road right at present. At best they are speaking of a three lane what about your trucks carrying equipment and so forth getting in and out of that place. You have run tests I am sure or at least (inaudible) McCreedy: ACRD worked with us allowing us to expand these radiuses from the traditional 15 degrees to 25 degrees to accommodate swing turns with longer semi trucks. The maximum driveways width that they would be willing to grant us was 40 feet. So our entrance is 40 feet and that is the maximum as permitted by ACRD. MacCoy: So you can make a turn and stay on the roadway without going off. McCreedy: We believe we can. MacCoy: (Inaudible) You already know from your site out there you have ditching on both sides, you put that truck in there and you just locked Overland and we have seen it happen very easily out there. So I would suggest that you look at that very carefully. On, you have already addressed lighting, what about signage. I know you are going to have to submit signage to us for review but what do you have planned? McCreedy: We have, I thought it was in the plan somewhere, we have a low profile sign in this area right here of the driveway that would say the words John Deere on it. MacCoy: Just like your cover (inaudible) that you gave us, like this one here. I didn't know if that was an artists conception or if that was (inaudible) McCreedy: That is the style and design of sign that we intend on using on the Overland Road side of the property. MacCoy: I imagine that it will be lit. McCreedy: Florescent type tubes, low wattage type lighting. MacCoy: What about up on the freeway side or anyplace else? McCreedy: We would anticipate doing a sign similar to what Western States and Arnold Machinery have done a display sign that would meet City ordinances as far as height and lighting requirements. It would be an elevated sign in this area of the berm. Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 31 MacCoy: You wouldn't plan to do what Ford did over there and put one up on Overland which was objectionable. McCreedy: It will be a low impact type sign, nothing flashing. Just again displaying our product name. MacCoy: And be sure to keep-away from flashing because that will get you for sure. Your ADA requirement code is required of you and (Inaudible) I would suggest that you, you probably already have worked out, although I don't see all the pieces here, on parking for handicapped, to the nth degree which means you have side pieces for your vans to get wheelchairs out and so on. Your building on this end the south end would be two story is that office building? McCreedy: It will be single story on the office portion the parts warehouse and shop area will also be single story but approximately 20 to 24 foot high ceilings in that area. MacCoy: You don't plan to excavate and drop that section down, it is all going to be on level land? McCreedy: It will be on level land yes. MacCoy: Everything internal will be with the ADA (inaudible). McCreedy: The architect, we haven't determined who we are going to use for certain, we have interviewed with CSHQA, ADA has come and we want to be sure that we are in full compliance. MacCoy: Good because that is a very important thing with us. Your trash receptacles and so on are going to be where? McCreedy: The trash receptacles for the building will more than likely be on access wise it will probably be located behind this screened off fenced area here, so whoever the trash contractor is will have direct access. MacCoy: So you will have a screened McCreedy: This is screened, this will be a fenced off area, the full facility will be fenced to this portion here, the back half of the building if you will and this will be screened (inaudible) that may be stored outdoors and trash receptacles etc. MacCoy: Okay you brought the next part us was will you keep any parts outside, will you • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 32 ' screen those because it becomes a used car .lot and you don't' want that. Okay, I think that is all I have. Johnson: Anyone else including Wayne Crookston? Crookston: I do have a question, excuse me the ditch that you said that you were going to tile, what is that ditch? McCreedy: The ditch that the city is requiring us to the is Cook's lateral, it is my understanding. It traverses both the Playground property and what is now the CESCO property. I am not completely sure it has been tiled in its entirety on the Playground property. I think there was some question regarding that in the past. Crookston: Do you happen to know the size of the ditch? Canfield: I can't answer that question I have no idea, I would take a hunch that it would take some 30 inch diameter pipe to the just an educated guess. Crookston: I believe that should have been tiled by the Playground. Do you know the status of that Gary? Smith: No I don't, it is my understanding there is a ditch that goes to the north that crosses under the Interstate. That might, I am sorry that was the Howell property. I don't know on the Cooks's lateral. Crookston: Thank you Canfield: (Inaudible) that says unless otherwise agreed by the City and Nampa and Meridian Irrigation District to not the it. Johnson: I was interested in your comment that you felt this was a permitted use and didn't require a conditional use permit. Did you look at it from that perspective Wayne, how did you arrive at that being a conditional use permit? Crookston: I believe that this is in a planned use area in which all uses are required to have a conditional use permit. Oslund: The same thing that we ran into last time with the one over on Eagle. McCreedy: The advice that I have given John Deere CESCO is to not worry about it and let's do whatever the City wants if they want a conditional use permit as a way of • Meridian Planning & Zoning Commission September 16, 1996 Page 33 - amending the development agreerY~ent. Let's do that- whatever it takes to satisfies City's conditions. We really don't want to debate that issue. Johnson: I understand that, I want to debate the issue because I don't want to be doing things we don't need to be doing. That is why I am asking that question. Any other questions for the applicant. This is a public hearing, anyone from the public that would like to address the Commission at this time on this application? Anyone at all here for this? Any other questions then? At this time I will close the public hearing and I would appreciate it if you would leave that diagram with us. Shearer: Mr. Chairman, I move that we have the attorney prepare findings of fact and conclusions of law on this project. MacCoy: Second Johnson: We have a motion and a second to have the City Attorney prepare findings of fact and conclusions of law, all those in favor? Opposed? MOTION CARRIED: All Yea ITEM #10: PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A RADIO ANTENNA TOWER BY WESTERN WIRELESS: Johnson: This application has been withdrawn FIVE MINUTE RECESS ITEM #11: PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A THRIFT STORE AND FARMERS MARKET BY IDAHO YOUTH RANCH INC.: Johnson: I will now open the public hearing and invite the applicant or his representative to come forward and address the Commission. Is anyone present representing the Idaho Youth Ranch Inc.? Ms. Stiles? Stiles: Chairman Johnson and Commissioners, due to the fact that the representative of the applicant is having some health problems, we stressed him out too bad. I think it is a very straight forward project, it is the Food Town existing grocery store. They have submitted their plan that they are showing adding the parking and some landscaping that hasn't existed at the site before. Ada County Highway District has placed some restrictions on in and out because they plan to still use the existing pumps as part of their program plus probably open to the public. The smaller 8 1/2 by 11 drawing you have is for Hills • Meridian City Council October 15, 1996 Page 50 MOTION CARRIED: All Yea Corrie: The attorney is instructed to find out some answers on the planned unit development and we will be back the 19th of November and we will get those answers. ITEM #13: CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT REQUEST FOR A JOHN DEERE DEALERSHIP BY CONTRACTORS EQUIPMENT SUPPLY CO.: Corrie: Is there a representative of the Contractors Equipment Supply Co.? McCreedy: Mr. Mayor and Council members, John McCreedy representing CESCO. A brief overview of the proposal, CESCO would like to build a sales, service and parts dealership for a John Deere facility here in the City of Meridian. They are currently located in Boise where they have been since 1955. Avery long standing company with a good history and a good reputation in the Boise area. They have to leave that facility because the airport in Boise is expanding and they need a new facility. They intend to expand the runway there. Their lease is up some time mid to late next year, I believe it is September of 1997. I think the Council probably knows some about this property, it is now known as what is called the playground property. It was annexed first in 1993, there was a development agreement that was signed with Mike and Sue Clarke at that time as the owners of the Playground Inc. There was an amended ordinance #615 in 1994 that changed the zoning on the property to C-G commercial general. A retail equipment dealer, rental and sales would be an allowed use under a C-G zoning here in the City of Meridian. This City Council did recently approve a final plat which subdivided the Playground Subdivision into 3 lots, this is lot 1 of that subdivision. It is currently a driving range. That is the use that is restricted under the development agreement with the Clark's. Last fall CESCO representatives started meeting the Clark's and City officals to determine the possibility of locating the facility here. The purchase was complete after many months of negotiations with the Clark's and the Playground just this last June we were informed by the City that they wanted a conditional use perr,+it in order to accomplish two things one, to get the use in place, two, it was my understanding that was the procedure that would be needed to amend the existing development agreement that is on the property to allow an alternate use. CESCO has put together a very comprehensive development team. They have CSHQA as the architect, Wright Brothers as the builder, Jensen Belts is the landscaper, Hubble Engineering has done some of the engineering,. J.J. Howard who is here to speak to the sewer issue has done some engineering on the sewer. The building for the site, we do have the landscape plan here, is approximately 24,000 to 25,000 square feet. You will notice it is setback quite a ways from Overland Road in excess of 200 feet to provide as much distance from the road as possible. The neighboring uses, I understand that lot 2 of the Playground Subdivision which would be located here is now up for sale by the Clark's. Lot one is the RV facility that they have. On the east side you • E ~. Meridian City Council October 15, 1996 Page 51 have the Howell facility that was recently approved by the City Council that is a truck and tractor sales and service facility. The freeway, on this end, you might note from the staff report that the (End of Tape) equipment dealership, very extensive landscaping for the facility. There is bermed and raised landscaping along the freeway. I think they put a lot of time and detail into it. On the back side of this we have a little bit of a layout of the building and an example of what the sign would look like. Very low profile sign, very low wattage on the sign. Very attractive building, plenty of parking, 66 spaces, it is my understanding plenty of handicapped parking. It complies with the Americans with Disabilities Act. Screened trash receptacles for the facility. You may remember that there was a lot of testimony about the glaring lights on the driving range that you have heard over the last couple of years. That problem will be eliminated. The lighting that will be along the freeway will be low wattage, low intensity and the lights that are now on the driving range will be removed. The comp plan calls for mixed use in this area, I believe it complies with that requirement. The public hearing was held there was no written or oral testimony in opposition. I believe it is harmonious and appropriate for the area. You do have two other equipment dealers in the immediate vicinity, Arnold and Western States. Really just two outstanding issues that we have been wrestling a little bit with. One that I think is fairly easily resolved and that is do we need an amended development agreement, we have indicated to staff and to Mr. Crookston that we will do whatever the City wants on that issue of a development agreement. It is my opinion that since you have an existing development agreement out there and since it does restrict the use to the property an amended development agreement would be appropriate. I have put one together in a draft form after Shari's office sent me an example of a development agreement you have done with another facility. I have sent that. to Mr. Crookston and hopefully get some comments from him and work that issue out prior to issuance. of a building permit if this application is appropriate. I think the more sticky issue is sewer, it is my understanding and Mr. Howard can speak to this tonight that sewer is available for this facility. I did the negotiations for CESCO when we were buying the property from Playground. I can assure you and I did provide a copy of the agreement to staff that there is an easement in place for CESCO to a-,nnect to the existing sewer system that exists on Lot 2 and 3 of the Playgrourxi Subdivision. That. easement allows us to connect to it, to increase the size if we need ta, to move the location if we need to, so I think CESCO has full legal right and access to that sewer system. The question of capacity for that sewer line has been answered by Mr. Howard, I think you have a letter. I did fax over another copy of it again today to make sure you had an opportunity to lack at that. It is-his opinion that there is plenty of capacity and I think he does have quite a bit of familiarity with it as he was the engineer that worked on the. project quite some time ago. I think the better issue or the issue that we have been wrestling a little bit with staff is the policy of allowing this facility to hook up outside the drainage area for the sewer facilities in that area. tt is my understanding that the Five Mile Trunk Extension and the plans for that include connecting this piece of property to the Five Mile Trunk Extension. All be it the other two Meridian City Council October 15, 1996 Page 52 lots in the same subdivision are connected the other way to the City system_ The question I think of whether that is an appropriate area to divide it but that is more of an engineering question. I do note that this is all one subdivision that is platted all as one subdivision now. It seems to make some sense that entire subdivision be connected to the same system. But I want to let you know that CESCO really doesn't have a lot. of dispute with that, their proposal is that they be allowed to temporarily connect to that system. They -have indicated several times that they will participate financially with the other existing and coming users to get that Five Mile Trunk Extension accomplished. We would like to try to look to a solution that gets that accomplished. I think if the facility gets approved and you have a good tax base and you have a very good long standing history with this .company in Boise I think it hopefully will be the last time you have a land use application on this piece of property for at least a couple of years, maybe for quite a long time after that. I think also you get an owner in there that is willing to participate financially in the Five Mile Trunk Extension and that seems to be quite an advantage. I don't think they had the ability to pay for the entire thing themselves. But they certainly have the ability to pay as they should for their fair share. We have indicated that all along. So I think there are some advantages to approving the conditional use permit, allowing them to temporarily connect to the existing system that does have the capacity. And then given them some breathing room or some time to work with the other owners in the area to get that Five Mile Trunk Extension extended in compliance with the City Attorney's objectives. I did fax over a letter today, I am not criticizing, but I find a couple portions of the proposed findings and conclusions confusing on the sewer issue. On page 4, we have a couple of statements, one it does reflect our desire to temporarily hook to the existing system. And then it indicates that details for that arrangement need to be addressed in a development agreement and we agree with those two statements on page 4. We need the temporary hook up or basically we have no facility. At least not in the time that we need it in order to get moved out of Boise and into Meridian in compliance with some lawful leases. Second we do want to work out the details of that in an amended development agreement. However if you turn to page nine, and I am not arguing on a technical basis I am just concerned with what might be a later interpretation of these findings and conclusions. It is my opinion that they might be a tad bit ambiguous on the sewer issue. In paragraph 17, it says that it isn't know whether it is physically possible to sewer into the existing system. I think we do know that it is possible to do that. The next page on page 10 there is a phrase that says the City does not have a time table for the extension of the Five Mile Creek sewer line. So I think if one of the conditions of approval is that we connect to the Five Mile Creek sewer line I have some real cxincems with that because if there is no time table for that happen then I don't think we have a facility that we can move into. in time. So I really think the temporary hook up is absolutely essential for this facility. Then I think those are primarily comments and as Mr. Crookston explained earlier tonight they might not be the final say so. But what is the final say so is the conclusion on page 14 and 15 which would be 7 B, or actually excuse me, let me back up. Page 13 and 14 which would • • Meridian City Council October 15, 1996 Page 53 be 5 E on page 14, excuse me where it says the property does not have sufficient sewer service and the phrase that concerns me is and provisions for applicant at its cost to supply the necessary sewer service must be worked out as a condition of granting this conditional use permit. I guess it is that phrase provisions for applicant at its cost to supply the necessary sewer service. If the interpretation- of that is the applicant has to pay to connect to the existing service then I don't need to say anything more and !can go. But if the interpretation of that is that they have got to pay for the Five Mile Trunk extension then I think there are some real concerns there. So I think that language needs to be clarified. We need some guidance as to exactly what the City Council is looking for. Our request is that we be given that temporary hook up. t think maybe a reasonable proposal would be to set a time frame on the temporary hook up and then perhaps indicate that ~nfien that time runs out if an extension is necessary then so be it. But we are more than willing to include in the amended development agreement a statement that we will pay our fair share for the Five Mile Trunk Extension. So I would ask that even if we can tonight (inaudible) some language on that paragraph 5 E on page 14. Then on page 15, 7 B, I think that needs to be changed to read that applicant shall enter into an amended development agreement with the City prior to issuance of a building permit. That is 7 B on page 15. The language that is there that requires us to comply with the existing development agreement be taken out because I don't think we would be able to comply with that existing development agreement, it limits the use to a driving range. We are clearly contemplating something different. I think there is also substantial concern about that development agreement every being fully complied with in the first place. We kind of want to have a fresh start with a new amended development agreement and this company and opportunity to show you that it is serious about keeping its word on those things. I would certainly stand for any questions, I do have Bob Nemick who is a representative of CESCO, Mark Canfield couldn't make it tonight, he is the president of CESCO, he is actually up in Vancouver looking at some building designs to compliment what we have going here. Corrie: Questions from C~~uncil? Bentley: I have a question for staff, Gary, I would like to have your interpretation and views on the sewer issue. Smith: Okay, Mr. Mayor and Council members, som+~ years ago we established, the City of Meridian established a policy that we tried very hand to contain sewer service in sewer service areas, drainage areas. We felt that we didnst want to get outside of a drainage area with sewer service because of possible future impacts on the sewer mains within a designated drainage area. For instance if we were pumping from one drainage area into another drainage and then a heavy use was proposed in the drainage area to which we were pumping we could have an impact on the capacity of the sewer line in that drainage • Meridian City Council October 15, 1996 Page 54 area. So we pretty much stayed with a couple of exceptions I guess to keeping sewer drainage in or sewer service to specified drainage areas. I don't recall the date but when Dr. Clark was the owner of this property he came to me and asked for a letter of sewer service to Lot 1 which is the driving range. I did give him a letter stating to the effect that sewer service could be extended to a support facility for the driving range. Basically the intent of that was to provide a sewer line for the burtding that housed the driving range operation. And possibly a small concession stand perhaps. But my intent was not to authorize any sewer service beyond that type of flow. I don't doubt what Jim Howard has said, I haven't had a chance to look at it myself but I don't doubt that there is capacity in the line if it was extended. I don't have any record that it was extended across lot 1, that is something that I will have to check with our plumbing inspector because it was a service line it is not a public facility. It was built to serve the lot. But again we would be putting a use, a sewer use back into a different drainage area. The drainage area is delineated by the Hunter lateral as the high ground, that property to the east of the Hunter Lateral was destined to flow into the Five Mile Trunk Extension property to the west flows into the Nine Mile Trunk Extension. The R.V. park that exists out there flows into the Nine Mile because it is on the west side of the Hunter lateral. These sewer drainage areas are not defined by lines etched in stone. Obviously there are places that service can be provided outside of these magical drainage area lines. It depends on the use that is being proposed. The quantity of sewage that is -going to be generated from that use and possible impact that it would have on the drainage area that it is going tQ be discharged into. I doubt very seriously that this use this particular use would be of that great of an impact. What Jim Howard is saying, is that there is capacity in that line and as I mentioned I don't discount that. I guess it is a policy thing that we have tried to maintain for several years. We need to be cognizant that when this happens if it happens that the property is or could be taken out of financially taken out of financially participating in the extension of a trunk line. This applicant has indicated that they would participate financially as far as their fair share, I don't know what that amounts to. It is a temporary connection and I agree there needs to be, if possible a time placed on that connection. I don't know if that is possible. Everybody gets fired up to extend a sewer IinF until it comes time to write a check. Then it becomes well you do it, I will just stand by and you do it and I will connect later. The school district as you know purchased 50 some acres from Gary Voigt and in order for that the property to develop as a high school site the sewer line is going to have to be extended under the interstate. When that happens I don't know, someone said within 5 years, within 3 years, I am not sure what their plans are, what their requirements are for a high school. But when the high school is needed that sewer line will have to be extended. There is another piece of property to the east of this piece that is being touted as a truck transport facility and there is a property to the east of that that for a long time has been interested in being developed as a residential subdivision. So there is a lot of property out there that needs the sewer or can use the sewer once the sewer is extended that property is going to be developed. It is not just a matter of connecting this property, it is a matter of gettir~ this Meridian City Council October 15, 1996 Page 55 property getting sewer to this property once the sewer gets under the interstate. And I think there are some financial questions that need to be answered if this applicant is interested in participating financially, I think those dollars needed to be generated to see what that participation is-going to be like. I don't want to see this property taken out of the picture in terms of participating financially because it is in the drainage area to the Five Mile Trunk. Bentley: Thank you, that is all I have. Corrie: Any other comments or questions from Council? Do you have. anything further? McCreedy: I just want to add that if we need to start generating some proposed or potential numbers for the sewer line extension I think they would be willing to look at that. We tried to look at that and we got concerned about it being so vague that it is not possible to do that. I think if we can get a date that we can have a temporary hook up for a period of 3 or 5 years and then the right to extend that if necessary. And then during that time period I am sure the numbers will become more concrete but I just want to assure you that this company is willing to participate financially and pay their fair share for that and that seems to be the important thing. I don't know if Wayne and I can massage some language in the development agreement to accomplish those goals, we will do that. (Inaudible) Morrow: Mr. Mayor, if I might, as a comment towards the sewer coming under the freeway, I think that we currently are beginning to deal with some modifications to our- late comers agreement. Part of that has been motivated by development that has gone on. It is also a request by Mr. Roylance's office for some clarification with respect to I believe Mr. Howell's property and wanting to see some adjustments in how that latecomers agreement was being done. I guess the point of the observation is that there might be in Mr. Howell's case some pressure to dr: that crossing in the very near term because he does got have the capability of having temporary service. So (inaudible) benefit is that the City was the lead group with respect to the extension of the St. Luke's site and will not be the lead group with the extension of any trunk line to any place in the short term. So that is not an avenue that is available to this project or any other project. So, (inaudible) that would be my comments on the sewer issue. Rountree:. Mr. Mayor, I would have a question for Council, is the development agreement the place to address something like that given the condition to do that in the conditional use permit. It seems that we have a willing party but we don't have a time table or a dollar amount and yet have the ability to put them on line on a temporary basis. How do we best look at that from the City's standpoint? Meridian City Council October 15, 1996 Page 57 development agreement that needs to be changed. So that whatever you two wish to call it we get something that reflects what is really going to go on here. I don't have any dispute with Mr. Howards engineering expertise it is well known around the valley. So I agree with Gary Smith's acceptance of that. So those would be my thoughts.with this project. Bentley: Mr. Mayor, I too agree with the project concept and (inaudible) the sooner we get some commitments from people to do an extension maybe we can get some more of them on line and get the line moving. Cowie: Have we significantly answered your question on page 14, number E, the property does not have sufficient sewer service available (inaudible) for the applicant at its cost to supply sanitary sewer service, have we taken care of that for you? McCready: I think maybe the facts are that it does have sufficient sewer. Cowie: That is what I want to make sure that you are understanding that we are saying. The City Engineer says it is a possibility but we need to find out where the sewer line is. McCreedy: I think we know where the sewer line is (Inaudible) Morrow: Being as there are findings of fact ar~d conclusions here and we are going to do things that reflect major changes in these findings of fact and conclusions I would move that we instruct the City Attorney to prepare new findings of fact and conclusions. Bentley: Second Cowie: Motion is made and seconded that we have the attorney draw up new findings o fact and conclusions of law based upon the testimony tonight, any discussion? Bentley: des, would that include the Morrow: The new findings would be inclusive of everything that we have discussed here this evening in terms of making the adjustments to the development agreement and the temporary sewer to everything else. So that appears to me to be the fastest way to get to the objective and the simplest way that we can get to where we need to be. Rountree: Sounds reasonable to me. Crookston: I have a question, just on the da#e, when you want those done. Morrow: By the next meeting. Meridian City Council November 19, 1996 Page 10 ITEM #4: TABLED NOVEMBER 6,1996: FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT REQUEST FOR A JOHN DEERE DEALERSHIP BY CONTRACTORS EQUIPMENT SUPPLY CO.: Corrie: Council do you have that in front of you? Morrow: Mr. Mayor if we could, City Atfomey Crookston handed us a revised findings upon coming to the meeting tonight, could you have him briefly or could we have him briefly explain the difference between that and the findings we had prior to this? Corrie: Mr. Crookston? Crookston: Certainly, Mr. Mayor and Council, these, the difference between what you had previously had is that this relates, the changes relate to basically an agreement that has been proposed to the Council in my discussions with the applicants Counsel John McCreedy and myself and Gary Srrsth who I informed of the representations that had been made by Mr. McCreedy. It relates to the sewer line coming across the freeway. That it was agreed subject to the Council's approval of course that there would be no requirement immediately that the sewer line be placed at this time. That they would connect to the existing sewer connection that is in the playground on lots 2 and 3. CESCO proposed to develop on lot one that they would have five years to try and do that. If they connected, if someone came across let's say just another third party or a 6, 7, 8 or 20th party decided to combine and get that sewer line across the freeway that they would connect to that line as soon as it came to them. If however that sewer line was not constructed by someone else in five years CESCO has indicated that they would place that line, put the line in. I have told them that it is an 18 inch line underneath the freeway then goes to a 15 inch line from the point where it ends on the south side of the freeway to where it connects to Overland Road. Then it would beaten inch line goir~ west on Overland Road so they are informed of that. They have basically entered into an agreement that is certainly subject to the Council's approval. With that connection to the existing sewer line in the Playground that they could operate for up to five years after the time that they obtain their building permit. So it likely is longer than 5 years from today or whenever the proposal is agreed upon. We are still working out the development agreement. Mr. McCreedy and I have discussed it somewhat. So there are still some questions some minor questions that still need to be (inaudible) and weed upon. Ultimately we would come back with the development agreement and ask the Council to approve that assuming that CESCO also signed that development agreement The real difference is in that the original findings said that CESCO had to put the sewer line across the freeway from north to south and take it to their property. Morrow: Thank you, I have no further questions. Meridian City Council April 1, 1997 Page 3 list there you can see that the community is making this happen. I also am pleased to officially hand you a pledge form and I do look forward to having you join us the day of this event and celebrating our current and future park projects.. Thank you very much for your time and the proclamation. Morrow. Mr. Mayor I would like to recommend that we give a big hand to all of the members of the committee and all of the corporate sponsors and company sponsors they have all done a heck of a fine job for us and it is a great event. I would urge all of you that are here for other reasons to support this issue also when it comes time to do this. Corrie: Also at this time I would like to recognize we have a couple scouts here from Troop #130 and welcome fellows we appreciate you being here tonight. ITEM #1: TABLED MARCH 4, 1997: FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR VARIANCE REQUEST FOR ASHFORD GREENS SUBDIVISION BY BRIGHTON CORPORATION: Corrie: Mr. Crookston you have some information on that. Crookston: The information that I have is that the Nampa Meridian Irrigation District and the City still have some items to work out and it is not a done deal yet. Morrow: That being the case Mr. Mayor I would suggest that we table this until probably the first meeting in May which would be May 6. Rountree: Second Corrie: Motion made by Mr. Morrow, second by Mr. Rountree that we table this to the first meeting in .May which is May 6th, any further discussion? All those in favor? Opposed? MOTION CARRIED: All Yea Corrie: Council with your permission the City Attorney as requested that we put item #16 up further the request on Cesco Agreement. So if the Council has no objection we can move that to the second spot. ITEM #16: CESCO LATE COMERS AGREEMENT: Corrie: Is there a representative from Cesco here this evening? McCready: Thank you Mr. Mayor and members of the Council, John McCready representing CESCO. We have been trying to hammer out what is now called the partial amended development agreement for this property. You may recall we had a principal Meridian City Council April 1, 1997 Page 4 issue of the Five Mile Trunk Sewer extension when we were doing the conditional use permit application on that. My client CESCO agreed to participate in the construction of that extension if it wasn't constructed by another party either with or without CESCO within the next five years. And the City Attorney and I have been hammering out the language on that. We have one issue that remains and that is should the Five Mile Trunk Extension if it has to be constructed by CESCO be extended to CESCO's eastern or western boundary. Now I did submit a letter to you earlier today short two page letter and I provided copies to Mr. Berg earlier this evening so I was hoping that you might have a chance to just briefly review that issue. In light of that I would like to take a very short couple of minutes and give you some background, First I have a document that I would like to pass out if I might. What it is, basically is our version of what the Five Mile Trunk Sewer extension should be. I understand City policy is that the developer or City property owner should extend the sewer line to the farthest point in the boundary. Fully agree with that, when the next person down the line doesn't have sewer and it needs to continue to run in a logical fashion. I think the exception that should be made in this case is basically a factual one. -You may remember and be familiar with the Playground property. Lot 2 of the Playground property already has adequate sewer service. You heard some testimony when we were doing the conditional use permit to that effect from Mr. Howard. He is here again tonight and I would ask that he have just a few minutes to kind of briefly recap that issue and briefly explain to you how CESCO is going to hook up temporarily to that sewer service for five years. So our position is that it doesn't' make a tremendous amount of sense to extend the, if the Five Mile Trunk Sewer Extension has to be built to extend it to the CESCO western boundary. Because the only property that could be served by that is Lot 2 of the Playground Subdivision which is owned by the Playground and they already have adequate sewer service. In fact I would like to hand to you a copy of a couple of pages from the development agreement that was entered into between the Clark's Playground and the City and in that development agreement the Playground agreed to provide their own sewer service. In fact they agreed at that time to provide sewer service to the lot that we eventually bought but that never came about. There was never sewer service provided to that lot. But they did provide in compliance with that agreement, I have highlighted the relevant provisions of that for you. Their agreement to provide sewer service to their own property. So we don't think it makes much sense to impose upon CESCO the economic burden of ripping up the extensive landscaping that they are going to put in here in the next few months and running a sewer line approximately 400 to 465 feet to the west to serve a piece of property that already has adequate sewer. Our goal tonight is not to have this thing extended for another couple of months to do this issue. In that regard I have brought original partial amended development agreements that I would like to give to the City Attorney and I have attached to this as exhibit B the issue that we are debating tonight. That is the diagram that I provided you earlier. We are ready to go, we are ready to sign, we have signed in fact this agreement and my client's signature has been notarized. We are hoping that you will see an exception here for that general policy. It doesn't seem to make a tremendous amount of sense to impose and it is approximately $30,000 in today's figures to run that line to the western boundary of Meridian City Council April 1, 1997 Page 5 CESCO's property. I would stand for any questions that you might have and if not turn it over to Mr. Howard for a very brief (Inaudible). Corrie: -Thank you Howard: My name is Jim Howard with JJ Howard Engineering. If you have any questions, any location, size, depth of manhole whatever that I can, any of the engineering questions. I have a little, should I place this on the board over there in case you want to refer to it (Inaudible). This is the CESCO property and this is the Playground area (Inaudible) portion that now presently has sewer. (Inaudible) The rest of this is gravity flowing over to Locust Grove. Here is CESCO, this the line they are building a 2 inch pressure main into a manhole and then gravity all the way over here. So all of this gravity line (Inaudible) presently being served by a sewer that ranges in a depth of 5 feet here to probably 8 to 9 feet here. That is the kind of schematic (inaudible) to a point (inaudible). Crookston: Mr. Howard, I understood you to indicate that they were extending the sewer along their southern boundary? Howard: (Inaudible) and then they would (Inaudible) and run this way with it (Inaudible) Crookston: That is what my understanding was from my discussion with John McCreedy was that they wanted to stop the sewer at their eastern boundary. Howard: (Inaudible) Here is a gravity line that runs all the way (inaudible) Morrow. Mr. Mayor, Mr. Howard, if it can be shown in the event that the sewer line that is currently proposed to terminate at the eastern boundary went to the western boundary what would the approximate elevation be when it got to the western boundary? Howard: I can't speak to that because that is a design (inaudible) perhaps your City Engineer would know better than I (inaudible). Morrow: What you are suggesting to us then is currently in order for this line to be serviced off of the gravity flow line the elevation is not sufficient that it will gravity flow it is an elevation issue where it has to be a pressure line to get into that gravity flow line. Howard: At one time we thought that it would serve gravity but this is so much more than (inaudible) that most, efficient cost (inaudible) Morrow: Thank you Corrie: Any further questions Meridian City Council April 1, 1997 Page 6 Bentley: I have one, in the event that proposed sewer line does come up, you say if you can gravity feed then you will abandon that line? Howard: Yes (inaudible) Crookston: Excuse me Mr. Mayor and Council I would like to have Gary Smith make a comment on this. Smith: Mr. Mayor and Council members, the extension of the sewer line in Overland Road was not only intended to sewer property on the north side but it was also intended to sewer property on the south side of Overland. As the applicant has pointed out the property on the north side Lot #2 of the Playground Subdivision is apparently sewerable by the existing private sewer service line that runs through the RV park. We don't know at this point what the status of the ground to the south is going to be. At one time as you. know it was proposed as a subdivision, since that time 50 some acres I believe has been sold to the school district the Meridian school district for a high school site. The frontage remains in the ownership of the original property owner or developer. I don't believe that there is any problem with elevation on the sewer line as far as extension in Overland Road. The ground slopes from the Hunter Lateral which crosses Overland Road west of CESCO's site. It slopes to the east downward. So I believe where the line is brought under the Interstate and south to Overland Road will have sufficient depth to extend to the west across the front of CESCO and indeed pick up CESCO's sewage. The reason that the applicant is here before you tonight is that the policy that we have established in the past to extend the sewer and or water along the frontages of properties that develop. Their request was contrary to that policy that is the reason I asked Wayne to have them come and talk to you. Crookston: Mr. Mayor and Councilmen, it is actually more than a policy it is an ordinance that requires that for the person that puts in the line to extend it to their farthest boundary from the point in which the sewer and or water it is the same policy in both the water and the sewer. They are to extend it to their farthest point from which it enters. (Inaudible) McCready: We understand the ordinance and we understand the policy we are asking for an exception to that and there are two principle reasons for that. One, I think you see that CESCO has made a commitment to approximately a $300,000 expenditure. If in fact they can't get that thing constructed in cooperation with some other parties over the next five years obviously there are some land owners on the south side of Overland that are going to need to be consulted about that including the school district. We are aware that there are some agreements and some plans already in place where there is some money dedicated by the school district. So we hope to solve that problem through some good communication and negotiation. What our principal point is we have made a pretty serious commitment of $300,000 to take- it to at least the eastern boundary our or Meridian City Council April 1, 1997 Page 7 property. We did that commitment because we believed in having a facility in the City of Meridian. We had an argument that we could have made about a year and a half ago that we were entitled to a building permit instead of a conditional use permit and an amended development agreement. I think from my client's standpoint I have to express to you that they believe that they have done enough. They are looking for a little reasonableness and a little compromise from the City Council in that regard. That is quite an expenditure and quite a commitment that they are making. If the property owners on the south side of the property that would have the ability and the financial where with all to come and negotiate and get the sewer line from the eastem point I think they are more than able to do that and more than willing to do that. I also understand that their driveway is going to line up with our driveway which is on the eastern. side of the facility. So 1 question why -they would want to come across Overland Road at the western side of the facility to get that particular line. Although I recognize the status of their site plans and the approval of their plats is a little bit in flux. It is not exactly clear where they are going to need to do it. What our point is we have made a serious commitment, we think we have done enough and we are asking for some reasonableness and some compromise on the City Cpuncil's part, that in short is our request. Morrow: I have a question of Gary, with respect to the Playground the way that it was originally approved the sewer line that the Playground was to put in was also to and through their property was it not? Did they in fact do that? Smith: Mr. Mayor and Council members, Councilman Morrow, the, as far as I know the agreement with the Playground was that Lot 1, the driving range which CESCO has purchased was not severable by gravity. As you know it is in a different drainage area it is in the Five Mile Drainage area. When the property owner before CESCO, Dr. Clark came to me one day and asked if they could extend their private sewer line to that lot #1 for a facilities building for the driving range, the ball shack in other words or a place that may dispense soft drinks and that sort of thing. I wrote a letter to him and said yes you could if it was physically possible to do that. The reason that I limited that service was because it is in a different drainage area. There was no prospects at that point that the Five Mile trunk line was going to be extended in the near future and that was the reason that t wrote the letter. But I don't believe that the Clark's the developers of the Playground Subdivision were required to extend sewer through there because it just physically. wasn't possible. The ground elevations would not permit it, the ground is sloping from the Hunter Lateral to the east, the sewer is sloping from, it is adverse grade you might say. As Jim Howard pointed out, its present elevation it pokes out of the ground it is just not deep enough to serve that lot. Morrow. My question then would be is the ordinance that Attorney Crookston refers to does it have a provision within that ordinance that allows us not to require them to sewer to and through their property even though it doesn't meet the grade requirements or the drainage requirements. Is there provision that allows us to have that exception and have them not extend that sewer? Meridian City Council April 1, 1997 Page 8 Smith: I can't speak to it Councilman Morrow, I don't know that it does or doesn't. I don't know if there is a provision for a waiver or not, without looking at it I couldn't tell you. Crookston: Mr. Mayor and Councilman Morrow, the only provision that the City has to really get around that requirement is through a variance. Morrow. Did we give them a variance from that requirement, the Playground? Crookston: Not to my knowledge. Morrow. Mr. Mayor, a follow up question for Gary, the Voigt property that is across the street from this particular parcel. That property by and large flows to the east is that correct? Smith: Yes I believe it does Morrow. They have an obligation also with respect to the sewer line or the extension of the sewer line to serve their property do they not? Smith: Yes Morrow: And in this case would that obligation be to extend it across the front of their property to the point of the Hunter Lateral? Smith: Yes, it would need to be extended as far as it was needed to serve that property. At this point we don't know where that point is. It wouldn't go, I would not believe that it would go to the Hunter Lateral because of the way that streets are laid out and lots are positioned. I think on the preliminary plat and recalling from memory that there was an access road over there someplace across from CESCO. There wouldn't be any reason for the sewer line to extend past that if that was indeed where the access point was going to be. But I believe that plat has become null and void because of time since it was approved. Morrow: Then also if that was the case then we wouldn't have to follow the ordinance that says. that to and through their property: In other words their extension where they developed first would simply be that portion of their property that could be served by that line. Smith: The intent of the ordinance as I understand it is to provide the extension of the sewer and water line so that the adjacent development can pick it up and extend it on through their property. This property is near the end of that line extension. So there would be no reason to extend it to the Hunter Lateral and stop it at that point, it can't go any farther to the west. It would be redundant unless there was a need on the south side for the sewer line at the Hunter Lateral. Now I can't envision that there would be Meridian City Council • April 1, 1997 Page 9 because the way the ground is sloping to the east. But at some point to the east of the Hunter Lateral It could be needed. Morrow. If in the event that the requirement of CESCO was to extend to their western boundary and the only beneficiary of that is on the south side of the street then would they be required to reimburse CESCO that cost of that extension through a Late Comers Agreement or other means? Smith: Well typically we haven't, unless it is a very restricted use on a sewer or water line extension we haven't earmarked it as such. It is more generalized in terms of the number of equivalent residential connections that are being made to the line that has been extended. Perhaps a late comers agreement could be crafted so that it was indeed equally shared, the cost, if there were only two users for example. Morrow: I guess my concern here is that if it is extended that distance to the western boundary then clearly the only beneficiary to that is the folk to the south side of the road unless there is some provision for them to reimburse or pay it looks to me like you have a case for unjust enrichment on their part. That doesn't seem to be fair to me. Smith: They are the only ones that would be using it. That is right. Morrow. Thank you Rountree: I have a question for counsel, it appears that really the only solution if we are to respond to the request of the applicant is to have this brought to the council in the form of a variance hearing, correct? Crookston: That is correct Rountree: I would suggest that we do that as soon as possible and proceed with working with the applicant on getting at least the language of the development agreement worded. Morrow. I guess my comment would be to that is very candidly from our side as the City I think we have been remiss at getting this issue handled in a timely manner. I think the other thing is that if we are going to do the variance route which is the legal way to do it that we ought in fact instruct our Building department to process those plans and specifications so that process can be ongoing and permit taken out so folk can begin their construction as quickly as possible while we resolve the technical issues. So I would offer that comment to the Council. I think that we first dealt with this issue if memory serves me back in October. Here it is April some five months later or six months later that we are resolving this issue. That is not very timely on our part. Meridian City Council April 1, 1997 Page 10 Bentley: I would agree, I think we need to as Councilman Rountree stated we need to get the variance going. And in agreement with Councilman Morrow I feel we need to get on the way and get this man his permit so they can get started on their building. Tolsma: (Inaudible) Crookston: The only concern that I have is that the property directly west of the CESCO property we have no idea what use that will be put to. It is right now is in the Clark's ownership whether or not that can be sold and the buyer need eventual sewage I have no idea. That is the reason it was my understanding that the original extension of the sewer line to the west was set to go to CESCO's western boundary so that property to the west of CESCO could possibly connect to it. If tat can be sewered by means of the private line that the Playground now has the Clark's that is totally acceptable to me but it is a private line. It is not a City line, that line does empty into a City of Meridian line in Locust Grove Road but it is a private line right now. Is that not correct Gary? Smith: Yes that is right. Morrow: Does that line gravity flow at the current time? Smith: As far as I know, I know it gravity flows through the RV park, I don't know how far beyond the RV park that line was extended. Morrow: Mr. Howard may I see your map please? At the point of the green at the round point that is point of connection? Howard: (Inaudible) Morrow: And is currently exists and was functioning before its gravity flow line? At what point is the private line? Howard: The private line extends (Inaudible) on the east. side of Locust Grove (inaudible) Morrow: Follow up for Gary, where is the, does the private line start at Locust Grove? Smith: The private line starts at the line in Locust Grove correct, not at the right of way but at the sewer line. Bentley: Mr. Mayor, how large is that line? Howard: This is a 6 inch and (inaudible) right now there is only one, no one being served by that sanitary sewer even with the exception of these few service lines by (inaudible) you really wouldn't want it any larger than that (inaudible) Meridian City Council • April 1, 1997 Page 11 Corrie: I guess it seems like we have a fairly good consensus of what we want to do is to have them move on with their project and we'll have the variance put together for us. If you want to go ahead and start the Bentley: I have one more question, on that existing. 6 inch line there is no actual obligation on that field to sewer to that line is there? Crookston: Under our ordinance the Clark's were supposed to or should have extended that sewer to and through their property which would have extended to their eastern boundary which is the western boundary of CESCO's property. Bentley: But basically what that design shows on that map that they have done that. Crookston: That is correct but it is not a public line it is a service line. Morrow. Mr. Mayor, I would move that we instruct the City Attorney to take the steps to complete the development agreement, that we instruct Mr. McCreedy and his client CESCO to immediately apply for the variance that is needed. We also instruct the City building department to immediately begin processing of the building permits and the plans and specifications in preparation to award a building permit to proceed upon completion of the variance and for the staff to expedite the variance process. Rountree: Second Corrie: Motion made by Mr. Morrow, second by Mr. Rountree, you heard the motion, any further discussion? All those in favor? Opposed? MOTION CARRIED: All Yea Crookston: I have one more question Mr. McCreedy do we have a new child? McCreedy: (Inaudible) ITEM #2: FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW FOR ANNEXATION AND ZONING TO I-L BY MICHAEL AND MICHELLE MURASKO: Corrie: Counselor? Crookston: Mr. Mayor and Councilmen., what is cleaned up I believe it is paragraph 22. Morrow: Mr. Mayor I have a question or I guess a comment., question or comment or both. Findings of fact do clean up the issues we were kind of concerned about. I guess my question is this particular parcel does not have a development plan (Inaudible) annexation and zoning (inaudible). It seems to me in the plat process or on the plat there should be some kind of notification that there are pending issues to be dealt with