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HomeMy WebLinkAboutJuly 5, 2007 P&Z Minutes Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 29 of 62 Siddoway: Mr. Chairman, after considering all staff, applicant, and public testimony, I move to recommend approval to the City Council of file numbers RZ 07-011, CUP 07- 010, and PP 07-010, as presented in the staff report for the hearing date of July 5th, 2007, with the following modifications: Modify 1.2.2 to state that no new trees may be located within the easement. However, the trees may be located on the common lot if they are outside the easement. And -- was it 1.2.10, modify that one to comply with the Old Town requirements for street buffers, which there is no specific width. Why don't we just strike 1.2.10. Also to include all proposed development agreement requirements. End of motion. Moe: Second. Rohm: It's been moved and seconded to forward onto City Council recommending approval of RZ 07-011, PP 07-010 and CUP 07-010. All those in favor say aye. Opposed same sign? Motion carried. MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. ONE ABSENT. Rohm: At this time we are going to take a short break for about ten minutes. (Recess.) Item 12: Continued Public Hearing from June 21, 2007: PP 07-011 Request for Preliminary Plat approval for 18 commercial building lots on 18.5 acres in a C-G zone, for Paramount Commercial Southwest by Ustick Marketplace, LLC - Northeast corner of North Linder Road and West McMillan Road: Rohm: At this time we'd like to reconvene the regularly scheduled meeting of the Planning and Zoning Commission and begin by opening the continued Public Hearing from June 21 st, 2007, of project PP 07-011 and begin with the staff report. Watters: Mr. Chairman, Members of the Commission. The application before you is a preliminary plat request for the proposed Paramount Commercial Southwest Subdivision. The property is 18.5 acres in size and is currently zoned C-G. The applicant is concurrently requesting approval of a development agreement modification to remove the conditional use requirement and, instead, require design review approval of all commercial uses in a C-G and L-O zone. The Commission is not required to make a recommendation on the DA modification, only the preliminary plat. The subject property is located on the northeast corner of West McMillan Road and North Linder Road. The property is bordered on the north by rural residential property, zoned RUT in Ada County and a high school currently under construction, zoned R-8. To the east of the property, approved for single family residences, is Paramount South 60 Subdivision, zoned R-8. To the south by rural residential property, zoned RUT in Ada County, and to the west by single family residences, zoned R-8 and future commercial uses zoned C- G. The site consists of vacant, undeveloped land, with a residential home at the Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 30 of 62 northwest corner of the site here. This property is currently zoned C-G, which complies with the Comp Plan map designation of commercial. The applicant is requesting preliminary plat approval of 18 commercial building lots 18.5 acres of land. The proposed lots meet the minimum dimensional standards of the C-G zone. The proposed lot sizes range from 27,800 to 72,000 square feet or .63 of an acre to 1.65 acres. The applicant has submitted a landscape plan for this development as shown on the overhead. A 25 foot wide landscape buffer is required along North Linder Road and West McMillan Road. A 25 foot wide landscape buffer is required adjacent to the existing and proposed residential uses to the north and to the east as shown on the landscape plan. The applicant has provided a conceptual development plan that shows future uses proposed to the site. Multi-family on the north adjacent to the existing residential property and future high school. Retail on the west and southwest. And office on the east adjacent to the future single family residences. Conceptual driveway locations are shown connecting to the stub street at the east boundary from Paramount South 60 Subdivision and extending to two full access points on Linder here and one full access point on McMillan. Two additional right-in, right-out access points are proposed on Linder and one right-in, right-out access is proposed on McMillan. Two additional -- excuse me. Staff is supportive of the proposed access points, except for the northern right-in, right-out on Linder, which is right here in between the two other full access points. Staff is recommending that this right-in, right-out not be approved in accordance with the Comp Plan's desire to limit access on arterial roadways. Further, staff is recommending that one of the driveways connecting to Linder from the stub street at the east boundary be constructed as a public street, which is one of these two here, and connect -- align with either Deer Crest or Apgar Creek Street here to the west. Additionally, staff is recommending that the other driveway shown on the concept plan be constructed as a private street for addressing purposes. Staff has not yet received comments from ACHD on this project. The applicant has submitted conceptual building elevations for this development. This elevation is for a potential building at the northwest corner of the site where the existing home is. This elevation is for a proposed Walgreens on Lot 1 at the corner of Linder and McMillan. These elevations are examples of existing buildings in Paramount that may be used in this commercial development. And these are architectural details that are proposed to be included in future buildings on this site. Earth tone colors, timber, cultured stone, and roof pitches are examples of some of the architectural elements that will be used. Staff is supportive of the conceptual elevations submitted and building materials listed as they are consistent with the existing Paramount development. Staff recommends approval of the subject preliminary plat application with the conditions stated in the staff report. That's all staff has. Rohm: Thank you, Sonya. Any questions of staff? Siddoway: No questions of staff. Mr. Chairman, I need to disclose a potential conflict of interest. I have -- the company I work for, Parametrics, has been retained by Brighton to work on the road project. We have not worked on this specific project, the commercial project, but the adjacent roadway project for Linder Road, including the Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 31 of 62 access points, has been worked on by Para metrics, so I think it's probably best if I recuse myself on this one. Rohm: Your recusal has been accepted. Boy, I have never even said that before. Wow. All right. At this time would the applicant like to come forward, please? Marcheschi: Commissions, my name is Michael Marcheschi, I'm project manager of Brighton Corporation at 12601 West Explorer Drive, Suite 200, in Boise. And at this time I'd like to -- we appreciate, first of all, the efforts of the Planning and Zoning staff and their assistance in developing the plans at this point. We are in support of their recommendations as they have been stated, with the exception of the access points -- the northernmost access points of right-in, right-out, which staff described, which they'd like to exclude and, in addition, I'd like to make the point that each of those access points that have been put into the site plan and into the preliminary plat have already been approved by ACHD as part of the Linder - McMillan intersection and widening project. They have been designed, they are in the bid documents, stamped and approved by ACHD. Rohm: Each of your proposed access points to Linder have been documented on -- in the ACHD stuff? Marcheschi: Correct. Moe: Has that been given to staff? Marcheschi: I don't know if staff has received that, but we do have copies that we can provide from ACHD. Rohm: Okay. Go ahead. Marcheschi: As you see here, we had provided a conceptual layout and our intention, obviously, with this commercial piece of property is to have it be integrated with the rest of the overall Paramount project. We wanted to have -- and incorporate a feeling, thus providing services for the residents in that neighborhood. Almost everyday our sales staff at the Paramount residential area get questions about services, when are we going to provide services or when are we going to build out these commercial corners, and we see a lot of interest already from people who are wanting to set up sandwich shops, coffee shops, you know, Walgreens, obviously, we have under contract for the corner, but even with them we have had to really push back and insist on some pretty strict design standards for this entire commercial corner. If you could go to the Walgreens elevation just so we can describe some of those for you. We are familiar with the typical Walgreens elevations. This is, actually, an elevation that came out of a store that we have seen in Arvada, Colorado, and the entryway and the use of stucco versus brick, the use of the cultured stone on the entrances, the base, the inclusion of timber -- wood timber onto columns under a canopy, gooseneck fixtures, all of these kind of elements are way beyond and beyond what they would normally do in a typical Walgreens here in Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 32 of 62 the valley and we have been told that this is probably the nicest one that we are going to see here in the valley, so -- so, they understand and we have been able to push them that far in terms of their design. In addition, you know, we have some other preliminary designs of the buildings there, but we do intend to follow the same themes that have been used at the Paramount Professional Center just north of Cayuse Creek at the entrance to Paramount that you saw, again, the natural stone, the timber, and we feel strongly that the viability and the ease of use and circulation into the property is aided by the number of access points that we have requested. The two full access points -- if we can go back to the -- I think the conceptual shows it. Our -- you will see our office sits -- Apgar and Deer Crest on the west side of the street. So, those are entrances that would be directly opposite existing access points. The access point to the south and the first right -- right-in, right-out and the right-in, right-out on Linder are both surrounding the Walgreens parcel and, then, the triangular piece there we intend to probably put retail, some small shops and possible public, you know, sitting or eating areas and we feel that that right-in, right-out there is an appropriate location. Linder is being widened to five lanes at that point. It's an arterial, 40 mile per hour, and according to the ACHD requirements for offsets and for distances between right-in and right-outs, we are well within the necessary distances for those access points. So, while we can appreciate the interest in limiting access points on Linder, for the Comp Plan we feel that these are well within the Comp Plan and also ACHD requirements. We should also point out that in the residential property to the -- if you can go to the preliminary plat, Sonya. It's residential property right now and there are two residential access points that we would be not using, essentially, and giving up. So, in essence, we would be trading those access points for a right-in, right-out further down the road. Moe: But you would have a lot more traffic going in and out on yours, as opposed to the house. Marcheschi: That's correct. That's correct. I stand for any questions. Moe: Mr. Chairman. Can you go back to the other slide as far as the site itself? On the commercial office portion -- back one. What are you envisioning as far as office buildings? Are those going to be single level, what were you anticipating? Marcheschi: If you could go back to the elevations, the pictures. The one on the left -- upper left would be the largest that we anticipate using there. It's a single level with an upstairs loft, kind of meeting area. And that is a -- about a 5,800 square foot building. The one down below on the left -- right is a 2,800 square foot building. Moe: Okay. Marcheschi: So, both single levels as a buffer along that edge, residential transitional use. Moe: Go back to the site again. Under the multi-family what are you anticipating that would kind of go along with the houses there on the east side of it? Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 33 of 62 Marcheschi: SO, at this point -- Moe: I'm just curious. I realize it's -- Marcheschi: Sure. At this point, you know, we really have not taken to level, we have looked at some layouts and when we say multi-family, we are not anticipating apartments, we are anticipating more like townhomes and three or four-plex units and even that, again, is all kind of market driven. This is a commercial property and so any residential use there would need to go through a separate CUP procedure to get that approved. Moe: That's kind of where I was going with it. My biggest concern is I'd hate to see elevation going up next to those other homes on the east side. Marcheschi: Right. Moe: Thank you. Marcheschi: Thank you. O'Brien: I'd like to have one question, Mr. Chairman. So, your access point here going into the residential areas, do you have any idea of approximate usage of that at full capacity of what that might be for -- and what impact it might have on these people and was there a meeting -- a town meeting with the people there? Marcheschi: The property that's platted on the right there is under review right now. It's not actually constructed -- O'Brien: Oh. Marcheschi: -- it's a preliminary plat as well and what we are hoping to provide there is a neighborhood kind of center, essentially, with access from the residential neighborhoods, both vehicular and pedestrian, to services and that's been one of our primary motivations for this corner. You will also see at the top right there -- just to the north is the high school, so there is a small parcel there, a thin parcel, where there is existing sewer -- or sewer coming through, but that's also going to be a pedestrian walkway for students to not have to drive, essentially, on the road to utilize or come and use the services that are provided there. O'Brien: So, I -- the question I have is it seems like this is going to be almost -- I wouldn't consider it a bottleneck, but very heavily used and you put a residential home on either side of that, I would like to think that a buffer there might be well looked into, just so there is some kind of a -- either a barrier, shrubs, and things of this nature. Marcheschi: Right. Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 34 of 62 O'Brien: Especially with the high school near by, I can anticipate a lot of people living in that area that utilize that that aren't going to be using the businesses that are in that area. Marcheschi: We will have the required 25 foot landscape buffer along that edge. So, everything will be offset at least 25 feet from the neighborhood fence along that side and will have detached sidewalk. One of the points staff made was that this -- we would look to and try and include a public road, either, you know, coming down to Apgar or Deer Crest and so we intend to use a lot of landscaping, a lot of, you know, heavy landscaping along those edges and the reason for curves and, again, that T into the residential neighborhood is to decrease the possibility of just straight through, you know, high speed crossing to the site. There are no direct lines of sight in any of the proposed roadways for cross-through traffic. O'Brien: Okay. Thank you. That's alii have. Marcheschi: Thank you. Rohm: I guess from my perspective, to take a look at this conceptual site plan and, then, put the preliminary plat adjacent to it, there is not a great deal of similarity between the two and albeit that this is conceptual, it would be nice to have some feel that that's -- even though it is conceptual, that we could count on that a little bit. It's a great -- it's a nice looking layout, I appreciate the conceptual feel for that, but what assurances do we have that a conceptual and at such point of build out that the two are going to be -- Marcheschi: Sure. I mean the -- we are approaching this, obviously, that this is a commercial corner, it's zoned C-G, and so the range of uses there are fairly wide and allowed within the C-G zone and in addition the size of this and if you were to look at the preliminary plat the way it's been presented in the application, all the lot lines that are there, with the exception of the ones that would form that kind of triangular piece in the center, are actually in line with the roadways and, for example, along the right side there, those would be kind of individual office pads along that right side. The Walgreens piece up in the left bottom corner is defined as is. Each of the -- each of the lines basically are centered on a road. So, in terms of the preliminary plat, you know, the conceptual plan is, obviously, just that at this point, it's a conceptual, but the roadways and the access points coming into the project would be consistent. The only things that would change might be that triangular configuration in the center, depending on the use that we can get. Rohm: How do you feel about the roadway coming out of the -- Marcheschi: The neighborhood? Rohm: -- the neighborhood and going through the commercial being a public roadway that is tied into either the north or south road that is across to the west. Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 35 of 62 Marcheschi: You know, we are very open to that and we feel that it would be an amenity and that it would allow for a wider cross-section and requirements that would continue that road out of the neighborhood, it wouldn't just be a stub anymore, but it would be a consistent look and a feel to it all the way through the street. The one concern that we have, though, is that when you introduce a public road -- if we could go to the conceptual plan. When you go to the -- let's say, for example, that the top road there was the public road. At the point where it intersects Linder Road, you have got a public neighborhood road meeting an arterial and the access point on that public road would have to be pushed way back to back behind the parcel, because of the necessary distance from an intersection. Do you understand? And that was another reason why we felt like to cross that right-in, right-out off of Linder was a -- a necessary type thing in order for us to put in a public road in that location. Rohm: You're saying that the access onto Linder on the furthermost on this conceptual plan is being proposed to be right-in, right-out, not -- Moe: Is there a pointer there? Marcheschi: This one right here, if this were a public road, then, because of this intersection of two public roads, the access point into this parcel would need to be pushed back the requisite distance from the intersection. So, unlike this one here, which would be a private road, the access could be much closer to the intersection. Rohm: Okay. And do you take exception with that? Marcheschi: It's a trade off, really. Right? I mean if you introduce a public road and make amenity a possibility, then, there needs to be something along here which compensates for that being pushed all the way back to the back of the property, essentially. Rohm: Do you see that entire commercial retail section as having access of maybe like a roadway all the way across the -- parallel to Linder Road, cross-access from south to north, north to south? Marcheschi: We do. All of these would be, you know, drive aisles all the way down along the bottom and across here, with cross-access easements in place for all -- all motion to the property. Rohm: Well, with that, then, there is quite a bit of ingress-egress available, even with that north line public road access being pushed back to -- I guess back to the east, do you think? Marcheschi: This one there all the way back to the back side? Rohm: Yes. Uh-huh. Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5. 2007 Page 36 of 62 Marcheschi: Again, it's a trade off, you know, coming through other developments to get to a store, having to go through a parking lot to get there is one thing, coming along a five lane road and just coming off that into a right-in, right-out is a completely different thing and if that right-in, right-out were centered, for example, on the buildings, then, it no longer is an access, but is also an architectural feature when you enter that property and you see buildings or you see a corridor -- a view corridor or whatever it is as you come in. Rohm: Well, quite honestly, I like the conceptual plan a lot better than the preliminary plat. It's just -- I mean it looks doable. Marcheschi: Right. Rohm: Whereas the preliminary plat, you just come back, you know, something that doesn't even resemble this and I'm much more comfortable with this concept than just -- just moving forward with just the preliminary plat that has no definition. Moe: Mr. Chairman? Rohm: Commissioner Moe. Moe: Not for you, but, Sonya, can you speak to ACHD as far as them already granting that right-in, right-out? Have you seen anything from them at all? Watters: Chairman Rohm, Commissioners, Commissioner Moe, I have not received a staff report from ACHD yet. I did speak with Mindy at ACHD this morning, she was not convinced that ACHD had approved those access points, but she did need to speak with her supervisors to investigate that further. They are out of town, I guess, for the holiday, so I can't confirm or deny that. Rohm: Okay. Marcheschi: We do have the designer of the roadway widening project who has worked extensively with the City of Meridian and ACHD here tonight to confirm that as well. Moe: Well, I'm not so much concerned with that as I am -- I want to know what ACHD's going to do. That's -- the city doesn't want to grant it and you're saying that they will, I would like to know one way or the other before I act on anything, so -- Marcheschi: Okay. If I may ask a question? Moe: Sure. Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5. 2007 Page 37 of 62 Marcheschi: What I'd like to understand better, I think, from planning staff is how they make that determination and what is the appropriate amount of limiting access points and by what criteria they make that judgment. Rohm: I think we'd have to ask staff that. Caleb, would you like to respond to that? Hood: Sure. Mr. Chair, Commissioner Moe, you know, it is case by case and I didn't measure out the distances of these driveways, it does look like they probably meet ACHD policy and we don't have a specific policy for offsets of driveways -- between driveways or public streets to driveways or -- in light of ACHD's jurisdiction, but the development occurs within the City of Meridian, so you need to have both approvals to move forward and so we just thought it was an appropriate staff level, based on the Comp Plan policy, to limit access. This seemed like if you lost that right-in, right-out access -- the northernmost right-in, right-out access, the vehicular traffic would still function internally adequately, as well as not hinder through traffic along Linder Road, you know, people have to slow down to turn right in or slow traffic if they cut someone off turning right out, so we do try to limit those access points and we don't always agree with ACHD staff or ITD staff for that matter on where access points should be. So, it's kind of case by case and we just kind of play with it and, again, we don't have any established code that says a driveway shall be this far from the next or a line or anything like that, but it is just kind of case by case. I hope that helps. It's more of an art than a science, that's for sure, when it comes to driveway locations, it's just kind of preference. O'Brien: Mr. Chairman, I have a question. So, if I understand this -- these are access points on either side here? Marcheschi: That's correct. That's a right-in, right-out access point. O'Brien: Right there? Okay. So, if I was coming on Linder Road here and I wanted to use Walgreens, which I'm assuming is going in this area? Marcheschi: Correct. In the bottom right-hand corner. O'Brien: How would I get back to point of origin? Marcheschi: If you were turning this direction, you could come across here and either come down this and come back out or you could come across here and come back out or go that direction. O'Brien: Okay. I just wanted to understand how this thing was working. Marcheschi: If you come up to here, I think the -- you know, one of the points is more about coming south on Linder and allowing for the opportunity to, you know, come off of here on these two full accesses and for people coming north not to have to utilize the same one pulling in. Having two right-ins, right-outs coming up and having two left-ins Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5. 2007 Page 38 of 62 coming down provide for opportunity for cars to move into the center at essentially the same time. O'Brien: Okay. Marcheschi: Does that make sense? O'Brien: Yes. Thank you. Marcheschi: Uh-huh. Rohm: Commissioner Moe, did you have something that you wanted to ask of this applicant? Moe: Yes. So, basically, we have this one and you're anticipating you're going to have both of those; correct? Marcheschi: Correct. Moe: And you also want this one to be full access as well? Marcheschi: Right-in, right-out. Moe: Right-in, right-out. Marcheschi: Correct. Moe: Okay. O'Brien: No left-hand turns going in there? Marcheschi: Correct. O'Brien: Okay. Marcheschi: So, you have two full and two right-in, right-out. Moe: Full here, full there, right-in, right-out. Marcheschi: Yeah. Exactly. Moe: You're sure which one you're planning to marry up to the street here yet? Marcheschi: Again, these would both be installed, it's just a matter of which one would be the public road. Our intention at this point is probably to do this one up here the Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 39 of 62 public, again, because of the necessary setback for that first access point from the intersection. O'Brien: Mr. Chairman. So, from what you know from the Ada County Highway District, is there going to be signals there at all or any kind of a -- Marcheschi: There is a signal -- O'Brien: -- traffic lights or -- Marcheschi: There is a signal here. O'Brien: Okay. Marcheschi: A new signal will be coming in at the end of this year. Again, this is going to five lanes with a center turn lane. And this is going to three lanes with a center turn lane. O'Brien: Okay. Towards the high school. Marcheschi: I'd like to defer it to Jay Walker on that one, he's the actual designer of the widening project, if that's okay? Moe: Mr. Chair. Staff, again, I just want to make sure I'm clear. On the one you guys are opposed to, is it -- where am I at. Here I am over here. This one or -- this one or this one? Watters: This one right here. Moe: That one right there, You'd just as soon see that one go away, so that, then, they have to come in from that point right there. Watters: Correct. O'Brien: Oh. Okay. Moe: And I'm not so sure I have a problem with that either, especially if you're going to make this your public road right through there, because you're going both ways there anyway. But I understand you're looking at putting in some type of amenity there to, you know, esthetically pleasing point to that -- Marcheschi: Correct. I mean one of the possibilities you have looked at is having a couple of buildings here with something in between and, then, green space or something back in the center of the development as an amenity for the entire development and what happened when you push this all the way back here is you're basically entering behind the building and, then, having to come back around to the Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 40 of 62 front, whereas commercially that doesn't make as much sense. You want to have access, you know, in front of the building and, again, this becomes an architectural element, not just a vehicular access point at that point. It's all about approach, view corridors, and such. I mean if you come in through here you could very easily come into the dumpster area of the building. Moe: Okay. I have no more questions right now. Rohm: Thank you. Marcheschi: Thank you. Rohm: Would Brad Moulton like to come up? Moulton: My name is Brad Moulton. I live at 5940 North Linder Road, which is off this conceptual plan north of the high school. It is on Paramount's north boundary, just passed Cayuse Creek. Okay. First, let me say that Paramount builds a very nice project and they do a lot of nice things out there, they have managed to take 640 acres and put it all under concrete. Outstanding. But in this concept right here, they are building a bottleneck that is going to last for 50 years on Linder Road right there. Right now traffic is so tough on Linder Road that I can't get out of my driveway some days. It's bumper to bumper from McMillan to Chinden. When that high school opens up this fall there will be a thousand cars on Linder Road at 3:00 o'clock in the afternoon and at 7:30 in the morning and every one of them is going to be cutting through that commercial space to get back into their subdivision or they are going to be going down these other two subdivisions, come out of Lochsa Falls or they are going to be coming out of Cayuse Creek where the next light is going to be. Five lanes of traffic is going to turn Linder Road into the next Eagle Road. Now, that five lanes stops at my south boundary, so you're going to take five lanes and cram it down into two lanes right in front of my house and they are going to be landing in my orchard when they are all trying to squeeze into two lanes. ACHD does not have any plans to finish that widening up to Chinden until after the year 2012. I have talked to them. This widening right here is being done ahead of schedule at Paramount's request and funding. Okay? The access points on Linder Road -- there is nothing on McMillan Road. From that driveway on McMillan Road clear back to the entrance to their subdivision there is not another driveway on McMillan Road. This corner -- the southeast corner of McMillan is bare ground right now. It will be commercial development at some time. The southwest corner of McMillan & Linder is going to be the apartment complex that everybody is raising heck about right now. The ten acres on the northwest corner of McMillan and Linder is going to be developed and I see just way too much traffic happening to have that many access points on Linder Road, in 1,300 feet. Right there. It's an accident waiting to happen. There are a couple of options. The access road on McMillan could be moved over closer to the houses and that could be the main access point to that entire development right there and you could put a couple of driveways in there. You could make them move some of their housing a little bit and make that section a little bit larger to make access. You wouldn't have the excess traffic on Linder at that corner Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 41 of 62 right there. You could make them all entrances and no exits onto Linder and not have any left-hand turns across Linder coming in there. They could all be right-in, right-outs only. With that center turn lane in there it's -- you're not going to get across Linder. You will sit there for hours. Okay. I also had a question concerning their residential and family -- multi-family units up there as to how many are going to be in there. I heard them say that they don't know right now. But that's going to add congestion to that facility. Everybody's going to be trying to come out and get onto Linder and either go up to Chinden or get back down into Meridian. Right now Linder is the -- is the crossing point across the river. Idaho Transportation is talking about putting another crossing point out at McDermott, but that's years away. Right now the crossing point across the river is Linder Road. When they do the corridor on Chinden they are talking about having access points every two miles with frontage road. Make them put in frontage roads. You need to be -- as planning we need to be thinking about what -- how this is going to happen for the next 50 years. There is a lot of homes out there right now, there is a lot of people right there and there is just going to be more. If I wanted to live in southern California I would have stayed in southern California, but I grew up in Meridian and around here and I don't want to see this valley paved from Mountain Home to Ontario and that's what's happening right now. It's the golden rule. He who has the gold rules right now. Okay. I'm also concerned about the water. In their plan here it says that they are going to use existing wells. The only well that I know of on this piece of property right there is the -- at the house that's on the property right now. Mr. Walker has told me that they are going to be bringing the water from the well that's over off Fox Run Road through their system, through their pressurized system. That well was initially put in based upon a permit to be down on Meridian Road through the Department of Natural -- or Water Resources. There was a mistake made when they were doing it and it got put up on Fox Run Road and there has been some discussion about the water right on it. Right now the water right on that well is from March 1 st to November 15th and it was to be used for irrigation purposes only, to keep their -- and it's being pumped -- was being pumped during the wintertime this year -- I can't say year around, but it was being pumped and I'm concerned that it's going to lower my well. We have already had wells run dry in that area when farmers over on Black Cat and McDermott and Ten Mile put in wells and started sprinkler irrigating their 40 acres of sod farm out there it dried up two wells, my neighbor's and mine. So, new wells have been put in. I'm concerned about the consumption of water out there. Okay. And that's all I got right now. Thank you. Oh, I had one other thing. Excuse me. On the -- they want to change the development agreement from Conditional Use Permit to design review. I don't have a problem with that, as long as there is something in that design review that says what's going to be in those buildings after they are built, but if you give up the authorization power of what's going to be in those buildings in this design review process, then, I would have a problem with conditional use going away. Thank you. Rohm: Thank you. Scott Stanfield. Okay. Yeah. That would be fine. Walker: Jay Walker. I work with Brighton Corporation, 12601 West Explorer, Suite 200, Boise, Idaho. 83713. Back in July of 2006 we entered into a cooperative agreement with ACHD. They had scheduled to build the intersection improvements, did not include Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 42 of 62 the extent of the widening -- roadway widening that we have currently in the plan, but that was scheduled in the CIP for 2008. With the Heritage Middle School and the Paramount Elementary School and the high school being built, there was a definite need for ACHD -- and we recognized that as well with our development -- to expedite that project in advance of the 2008 CIP plan project. So, we entered, at the request of Gary Inselman, into a cooperative agreement with them to do the design of that intersection, the 500 by 500 intersection. When we saw that there was a great opportunity to do some further extent and tie in some -- tie into widening both on South Linder, as well as North Linder and, then, as far as the 500 feet on the West McMillan leg of the intersection and, then, we were required as a part of our DA to make some improvements on our Fox Run Way entrance for the Paramount development on McMillan. So, we -- we entered into this agreement and had ongoing discussions with ACHD and the adjacent property owners to complete this work prior to these schools coming online and opening this next fall or the fall after that. And I do have a copy of those plans. They were finalized and it's ACHD project number 307009, if you would like reference to that project, and, again, coordinated efforts with Christie Richardson and Gary Inselman and their team, Daren Terrell did do design review and approval of that and stamped that and they are ready to go out to bid. With the Heritage Middle School we quickly saw the need to improve Meridian-McMillan, which you're seeing done right now. I'm also in a cooperative development agreement with ACHD on that intersection. That was not even in the CIP plan until I think 2012 or something of that nature. So, for a need of the Heritage Middle School, we quickly advanced -- we discontinued the bidding process on linder-McMillan and jumped over to the Meridian- McMillan, which you're seeing closures currently being done and those legs of the intersection widened. Now, the intersection of linder-McMillan will be widened to a six- by-four intersection, meaning that Linder will have an exclusive left turn lane and an exclusive right turn lane, as well as two through lanes. So, it is per our completed traffic study, traffic analysis completed as a part of this -- of this development, as well as Frank Varriale's Bridgetower development and some of the adjacent developments of Jim Durst and Tom Bevins. So, it's a coordinated effort with ACHD and all those adjacent property owners, with obvious accommodations for the upcoming traffic and the development on those adjacent corners. And I -- again, I can show you how we have coordinated accesses on the adjacent properties, both sides of Linder and both sides of McMillan and, then, we have utilized full access points at Apgar and Deer Crest, which are currently in in existing state full access points as well. We are not changing from what exists currently on Linder Road. And I think Michael brought up a good point, we are eliminating a couple of residential access points, but adding some different use access points as part of our development. Now, all these access points will be servicing this same 20 acre commercial property, whether you throw all those exiting or entering vehicles in three access points or four access points, you will still have the same number of trips entering and exiting the development site. It will not change that. So, in my studies, in my analysis as a traffic engineer, spreading out sometimes assists in that. I can -- I can understand the city -- the staffs report on desiring to minimize access points on an arterial street and -- but I can tell you that I have worked with ACHD and their team and as far as I'm understanding they have approved the plans and put their stamp on them and have signed off on the access points, but I will, as they Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 43 of 62 are, continue to work with Mindy and when Gary Inselman returns back, meet with them at the first of next week and find out exactly what they would desire to bring closure to that, so that P&Z can feel comfortable and rest assured that that's done. So, I do have a couple of -- you know, you can see the -- this is the McMillan intersection. I wish I would have brought a bigger set of plans and you can see the exclusive right turn lane and left turn lane for Linder. That's southbound and this is northbound. And, then, the McMillan would have exclusive right turn lanes, with the center turn lane being utilized for the exclusive left turn lane and just one through lane. This will be more than two and a half times the capacity of that Linder Road. I will also bring up a point. In the staff report there was made mention of the need to extend or install water mains to and through this development. I have worked with Kyle Radek as a part of this plan. He approached us when -- knowing that we were tearing up the road, he quickly seized the opportunity to bring in the water main concurrently, so we aren't replacing a roadway or cutting into new pavement over the moratorium that ACHD requires. So, the city has already entered into a cooperative agreement with myself and I can give you a copy of that if you would like, but it includes both an agreement to pay for the water stubs that are located, I may add, in some of these access points and there is an elimination of an access point. We may need to go back and revisit the plans and what Kyle Radek and I had designed with Parametrics as far as water main stub outs and blow off. So, it does play into the overall picture and we carefully laid out this -- this design -- roadway widening design and intersection design concurrently with the developers on all four sides. So, there has been quite a cooperative effort in coming to this point of having bid documents ready upon completion of Meridian-McMillan, to, then, move into a closure of linder-McMillan and complete the improvements there in preparation for the high school coming online and some of these other developments. But I wanted to make mention to the staff and to P&Z that the water main has been designed. The city has paid for -- well, I paid for the design and will be reimbursed by the city for the water main extension and we have worked concurrently with all adjacent developers in locating the stubs into the necessary locations and obtaining the necessary easements, temporary and permanent easements, to work within those properties and rights of way. And, then, each individual property owner will pay for those blow offs, water main stub outs, and appurtenance associated with that, so -- there was also a comment made in the staff report from the police department regarding cut-through traffic and calming -- traffic calming measures. In considering this development, we carefully laid out and provided curvature in our access roads, so that there wasn't a direct visual corridor for drivers and we keyed in to several locations, as you see to this preliminary plat of the Paramount South 60 property, there is no direct cut-through location for them get onto Fox Run Way at the quarter mile and approach McMillan from the north through the development. It would be very difficult and I don't think that there wouldn't be any reason for drivers, students, or commuter traffic to make that cut through, it's just not a direct -- and we are more than willing to provide more of a traffic calming measure to prevent -- prohibit those cut-throughs if they were ever to became a problem, because I just don't see it as a problem as far as that discussion with the police department. Now, Mr. Moulton, Brad, he mentioned several things. First of all, we will be connecting to city water as designed concurrently with this project and we will be utilizing the Bisbee and Harrow water rights -- surface gravity irrigation water rights that are associated with Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 44 of 62 this property and this 20 acre piece. None of that will come from wells. We have designed and installed a 150 horsepower pump in our current pump station on Cayuse Creek that will provide a pressurized irrigation system for this 20 acre piece. So, shouldn't be any -- any difficulties with wells or, you know, impact to neighboring property well draw down, so -- the other thing that Brad Moulton mentioned was the desire to make access to this property off of Linder right-in only. When you approach limiting access one way through a particular development, I found in my studies that what it does is it -- it increases almost two times the circulation traffic on your external infrastructure, only worsening most of the time traffic conditions in those adjacent roadways, causing greater cuing, more of the delay that drivers don't want to expect when commuting. One great thing that we have here is the misalignment of -- of operating times between the high school and any commuter traffic. The high school will release at around 2:30, 3:00 o'clock, whereas commuter traffic comes from the four to six hour of the day range, thus staggering the peak commute time. With that I will stand for any questions. I believe I have answered or addressed briefly most of the questions and I apologize for taking more than the three minutes. Rohm: That's fine. Thank you. Questions? O'Brien: Mr. Chair? Mr. Walker, what does the Ada County Highway District's traffic study speculate -- what is the current traffic flow on Linder and what's expected in 20, 30 years from now? Walker: I would need to revisit the study. It was done by a gentleman, Pat Dolby, quite some time ago, back when the -- these projects came online. O'Brien: Yeah. You had mentioned that the plans were made before the high school was envisioned to come into being there; is that true? Didn't you mention that? You made some plans -- Walker: Possibly. I'm not sure that that included -- it did include this commercial area, but the high school may have been excluded from that original traffic study. Further work has been done, though, to -- to design a facility that would accommodate that traffic by putting in a signal here at Cayuse -- or here at Linder and McMillan and, then, there will also be a signal at Cayuse. O'Brien: Okay. That's alii have. Thank you. Walker: All right. Moe: Mr. Chairman. I'm a little bit curious as far as at the north end when we do go off the widening of Linder Road down back into a two lane and whatnot -- I'm kind of curious as far as to terminate that down into two lane and whatnot, how far are we traveling before we get back into the two. You know, Brad's concerned about cars landing in his property and whatnot, I'm just trying to get a clear indication of what kind of room we are going to have to be able to drop back down into a two lane. Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 45 of 62 Walker: Well, I know that ACHD is attempting to obtain the right of way necessary to widen this five lane structure clear through to Chinden. One of the impediments is actually Brad Moulton. We haven't been able to acquire the right of way necessary to continue that widening through his property, so prior to his property line we will be -- we will widen right up to his southerly boundary, but the striping will narrow down to a two lane just prior to his property, that's currently for sale and I think upon his selling of his property ACHD will -- you know, at the re-platting of his property will insure that the additional right of way is acquired, so that the continuance of the five lane facility will be clear to Chinden. Moe: Got you. Walker: But that's the reason why it's not -- we haven't proceeded any further north. Moe: Okay. Thank you. That's alii had. Rohm: Thank you very much. Let's try and keep this brief. Stanfield: Real short. Scott Stanfield, project engineer, 314 Badiola in Caldwell, Idaho. How do we tie the preliminary plat, which looks rather blocky, in with this conceptual plan. That was a dilemma we did face when we prepared the preliminary plat, but we knew that that would be of some significant concern. So, if you look at the notes on the preliminary plat on the right-hand side, we have some items that include all lots shall have shared ingress-egress, that will insure the internal traffic pattern movements. We even have a note in there that describes verbally that there will be a public street connection from east to west, lining up with one of the two existing roadways across Linder. That does conform with what the staff report does condition us to, so there are elements of the preliminary plat text format that will help insure in that this is followed and the staff condition on their own about ingress-egress and about a public east-west street connection. So, with that I'll close and stand for any questions. Rohm: Thank you. That was -- I appreciate that very much. Thank you. Okay. There is not anybody else signed up to testify to this application, but if anyone would like to come forward, now is that time. Durst: My name is James Durst, Black Hawk Development, 12400 Menaul Boulevard, Suite 150, Albuquerque, New Mexico and I'm the owner of the five acres across the street and to the west of this project and I concede to the -- all the efforts that we have made to do the joint development with all the property owners and ACHD, it's taken about a year and a half to do, but all these access points we worked out with ACHD in the meetings and were what were bid and proposed and I'm in favor of the access points as submitted by the developer. Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 46 of 62 Rohm: Okay. Thank you very much. Appreciate your testimony. Let me ask our attorney. Mr. Nary, previous individual that testified would like to provide just a little bit more testimony. Is there provision for that or -- Nary: Mr. Chairman, it's within your discretion. The applicant will still get the last word and so if it's something really brief and I guess -- it's not a debate. Rohm: Yeah. That's a good point. Nary: If it's a brief clarification, something that he feels is pertinent, that's certainly within your discretion. Rohm: Please come forward and emphasis on brief. Moulton: Briefly. Brad Moulton again. I just wanted to say that I have not been approached by anybody to purchase the right of way or have any right of way in front of my house by either ACHD, Paramount, or anybody. I just wanted that to be perfectly clear that I'm not holding up anything, I just hadn't been asked yet. Rohm: Thank you. All right. Because we have taken additional testimony from the audience, would the applicant like to have one final word? Marcheschi: I will be brief. Just again reiterate that we do have in our possession, through ACHD, signed, approved plans for the access points as described. ACHD has studied them, has worked with Jay Walker and other developers in the area regarding those access points to make sure they were aligned with other proposed access points across the street and we feel strongly that that right-in, right-out, again, will not only aid the commercial property there, but also ease and help mitigate any traffic that might occur on Linder Road. So, with that I will stand as well. Rohm: Okay. Thank you very much. Okay. Moe: Is that it? Rohm: I believe that's it. Moe: Mr. Chairman, I move that we close the Public Hearing on PP 07-011. O'Brien: Second. Rohm: It's been moved and seconded to close the Public Hearing on PP 07-011. All those in favor say aye. Opposed same sign? Motion carried. MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. ONE ABSENT. Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 47 of 62 Rohm: Discussion? Commissioner O'Brien, would you -- do you have some final thoughts on this application? O'Brien: Well, I have some questions and they weren't totally answered, so my concerns are with the traffic, what they are today, if the current proposal for the intersection changes or improvements will satisfy the traffic flow tOday and 20, 30 years from now. I think it's inevitable that we are going to have traffic problems on that main corridor. I don't know if this commercial venture will change that, I doubt it seriously. I think there is still going to be problems with traffic regardless of what we do, because they built the homes there and the corridor is in direct connection to Chinden and over the river, so I think there is just always going to be traffic and with the high school coming in there, it's inevitable. I think the best thing we can do right now is to minimize that impact of this venture that would not increase, but leave it the same or minimize the impact the commercial property will have on the traffic flow. So, I think that the current proposal by staff is correct. Rohm: Thank you. Commissioner Moe. Mae: Well, traffic's going to be a problem around this entire city, it's not just happening in that corner right there, and it's inevitable that we are going to be fighting that for years to come. The Comprehensive Plan is noting that this development is Okay to be built, you know, I mean it's noted in the Comp Plan such that that's what it's zoned for. I think that -- you know, that the Paramount development as it is, I think they have gone -- they have done a lot of forethought into how they were developing the whole thing, especially showing the commercial lots in and around the development as it is. As far as -- so, number one, I'm in favor of the project. Based upon the explanation I got from the applicant in regards to the northern right-in, right-out, I'm of the opinion to approve that right-in, right-out in that point, especially if they are looking to put some type of amenity and whatnot within that area and have the parking in there, it makes a little bit more sense there, so that the -- you know, their trash and whatever else that's on the back, that you're not driving into that property as such, but I guess we will see that once that area is developed out. I guess if it doesn't happen that way, we can make changes at that point on that. So, as the development sits today, I'm in favor of the project. Rohm: Me, too. That's about it. I would like to say, though, that I don't know that from my perspective I'm ready to relinquish the -- the right to review and go straight to a design review process only. That's just my personal opinion. I -- you know, we hear a lot of projects and sometimes it's almost a moot point to bring them back to the Commission once the preliminary plat's been established and I guess just -- I'm afraid to let go of things that are unknown and that's my only last comments on that. So, other than that, I like the project as it has been proposed and, again, I do concur that the right-in, right-out is -- actually, I believe would aid in the movement of traffic, rather than hinder. End of comments. Mae: Mr. Chairman, atter considering all staff, applicant, and public testimony, I move to recommend approval to the City Council of file number PP 07-011, as presented in Meridian Planning & Zoning July 5, 2007 Page 48 of 62 the staff report for the hearing date of July 5th, 2007, with the one modification that the northern right-in, right-out access point be granted. End of motion. O'Brien: Second. Rohm: It's been moved and seconded to forward onto City Council recommending approval of PP 07-011, to include the staff report with the so noted modification. All those in favor say aye. Opposed same sign? Motion carried. MOTION CARRIED: THREE AYES. TWO ABSENT. Rohm: The motion is completed but go ahead, we can discuss it. Marcheschi: Sorry. Thank you, Commissioners. The one issue that we -- one or two issues was the water line that was in the staff report from Public Works saying that the developer was responsible for the extension, was, in fact, a misstatement in the staff report and so that portion would also need to be amended or substituted for Jay Walker's testimony and I believe comments from Public Works, so -- Steckline: Mr. Chair, Members of the Commission, those statements were put in place - - we -- I have talked with Kyle Radek about this and, basically, they were put in in case that if your project went ahead before the Eagle -- or, excuse me, before the McMillan and Linder project. So, it's a precautionary measure and I would support those statements. Marcheschi: So, maybe we could just word it so that it's just to that effect, so that if we did go before the widening, then, we would be responsible for the extension, but if we come after, then, that's not our responsibility. Steckline: I would support that. Moe: I think that's the intent already, so I don't know that there is any rewording necessary, is there? Steckline: That's pretty much the intent. Marcheschi: Okay. Thank you. Moe: For the record, now that we know that. Marcheschi: Thank you. Item 13: Public Hearing: CUP 07-013 Request for a Conditional Use Permit per requirement of the Development Agreement for detailed site plan approval of the Cherry Lane Christian Church site for Cherry Lane Christian