HomeMy WebLinkAbout2026-01-20 Work Session Meridian City Council Work Session January 20, 2026.
A Meeting of the Meridian City Council was called to order at 4:34 p.m. Tuesday,
January 20, 2026, by Mayor Robert Simison.
Members Present: Robert Simison, Luke Cavener, Liz Strader, John Overton, Doug
Taylor, Anne Little Roberts and Brian Whitlock.
Other Present: Chris Johnson, Bill Nary, Curtis Anderson.
ROLL-CALL ATTENDANCE
X Liz Strader X Brian Whitlock
Anne Little Roberts _X_ John Overton
_X_ Doug Taylor _X_Luke Cavener
X Mayor Robert E. Simison
Simison: Council, we will call this meeting to order. For the record it is January 20th,
2026, at 4:34 p.m. We will begin this afternoon's work session with roll call attendance.
ADOPTION OF AGENDA
Simison: Next item up is adoption of the agenda.
Overton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Overton.
Overton: There are no changes to the agenda this evening. I move to approve the
agenda as published.
Little Roberts: Second
Simison: Have a motion and a second to approve the agenda as published. Is there
any discussion? If not, all in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay? Ayes have it
and the agenda is agreed to.
MOTION CARRIED: ALLAYES.
CONSENT AGENDA [Action Item]
1. Blue Horizon Flex Water Main Easement No. 1 (ESMT-2026-0004)
2. Findings of Fact, Conclusions of Law for Vanguard Village East
(SHP-2025-0008) by Kimley-Horn, generally located at the southeast
corner of W. Grand Mogul Dr. and S. Umbria Hills Way
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3. Findings of Fact, Conclusions of Law for Vanguard Village West
(SHP-2025-0009) by Kimley-Horn, generally located on the south side
of W. Grand Mogul Dr., located midway between S. Ten Mile Rd. and
S. Black Cat Rd.
4. Findings of Fact, Conclusions of Law for 3780 Overland (H-2025-
0038) by Jesus Madrigal, located at 3780 E. Overland Rd.
5. Resolution 26-2562: A Resolution of the City Council of the City of
Meridian to amend the Future Land use Map of the City of Meridian
Comprehensive Plan Concerning 5.99 acres of Land to Allow for
Commercial Uses, Generally Located at 2350 W. McMillan Road, in
the Southwest Quarter of the Southeast Quarter of Section 26,
Township 4 North, Range 1 west, Boise Meridian, City of Meridian,
Ada County, Idaho; and Providing an Effective Date
6. Resolution 25-2563: A Resolution of the City Council of the City of
Meridian Approving City Council President's Appointments of City
Council Members to Serve as Department Liaisons; and Providing an
Effective Date
7. Resolution 26-2564: A Resolution of the City Council of the City of
Meridian Approving City Council President's Appointments of City
Council Members/City Staff Members to Serve as Interagency
Boards, Committees, and Initiatives Representatives, and Providing
an Effective Date
Simison: First item up is the Consent Agenda.
Overton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Overton.
Overton: Move that we approved the Consent Agenda. For the Mayor to sign and the
Clerk for attest.
Little Roberts: Second.
Simison: Have a motion and a second to approve the Consent Agenda. Is there any
discussion? If not, all in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay? The ayes have it
and the Consent Agenda is agreed to.
MOTION CARRIED: ALLAYES.
ITEMS MOVED FROM THE CONSENT AGENDA [Action Item]
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Simison: There were no items removed from the Consent Agenda.
DEPARTMENT REPORTS [Action Item]
8. Fiscal Year 2026 Budget Amendment in the amount of $5171 for
Drone First Responder/AI Axon/Peregrine
Simison: So, we will move on to Item 8, which is a fiscal year 2026 budget amendment
in the amount of 5,171 dollars for Drone First Response program. Turn this over to
Captain Leslie.
Leslie: Thanks, Mayor, City Council. So, we are back after our meeting last week. My
numbers weren't quite even, so we met with the Finance staff and repaired the budget
amendment. We are 5,171 dollars short of being zero on that. I also got the numbers
for you for a secondary site or additional sites to the south. We talked about better
coverage to the south with the Drone First Responders. We have identified two
locations that would be ideal to move south to improve that response time. Those cost
per site is around 68,700 dollars per site.
Simison: Thank you. And you are forgiven on the fifty-one seven, at least from me. I
can't speak for the rest of the Council though.
Leslie: I appreciate that, Mayor.
Simison: And, Council, I TI did have a brief conversation and said we nl didn't want to
delay the conversation on this one, but maybe during the budget process we could
discuss whether not a third one made sense in the upcoming budget Tor fourth?
Leslie: Fourth. Sorry. Yeah. And just to clarify the Tthe three sites that we currently
have are creating an ideal response time of two minutes, which is the lithe target time
on target that we would like to have. Does not mean we can't cover into the south with
a Twith a critical incident and get a drone there, it's just going to have less time to be
there and to have to come back, but Tand take a little bit longer to get there, but the
flight distance we can cover the entire city with the three sites that we have.
Simison: Thank you. It's not Tnot dissimilar to the challenge we are having with our
Parks and Rec and our Planning and Zoning Commission is we have got a large blank
spot in south Meridian with low coverage. So Tsorry. Just searching for someone in
south Meridian that wants to serve. It's hard out there, so TCouncil, any questions on
this budget amendment? Okay. Then do I have a motion?
Little Roberts: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Little Roberts.
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Little Roberts: I am honored, because it's rare that we get to put something forth that
can potentially change how a department does business and I think this is going to
greatly improve efficiency and just the officers' time and so I would like to make the
motion that we approve the budget amendment for 5,171 dollars for Drone First
Responder Axon Peregrine.
Overton: Second.
Simison: Have a motion and a second to approve Item 8. Is there discussion on the
motion? If not, clerk call the roll.
Roll Call: Cavener, yea; Strader, yea; Overton, yea; Little Roberts, yea; Taylor, yea;
Whitlock, yea.
Simison: All ayes. Motion carries and item is agreed to. We look forward to seeing this
move forward and get implement and, like you say, hopefully great things to ensue, but
that means that there is bad things happening for great things to ensue in the process,
so Dyes. Thank you.
MOTION CARRIED: ALLAYES.
9. Mayor's Youth Advisory Council Quarterly Update
Simison: Okay. With that we will move on to Item 9, Mayor's Youth Advisory Council
quarterly update. I will turn this over to Sahand for an introduction.
Rahbar: Mr. Mayor, City Council Members, thank you so much for once again providing
us with the opportunity to come before you and provide some updates on some of the
goings on with our Mayor's Youth Advisory Council for the City of Meridian. I will just
start with some brief introductory remarks before turning things over to my friend
Conner, who will lead you through some updates that we have had through the
semester so far and what we have got planned ahead. As many of you are aware the
school year starts earlier every year seemingly, so our MYAC meetings Min previous
years they typically started in September. The past couple of years we have had our
first meeting start in August and so as of this moment we have had eight general council
meetings. Those are our big meetings that are held right here in Council Chambers and
we have about nine left for the remainder of the academic year. So, thinking of August
2025 to May 2026 and so if any of you alor if anyone who is visiting City Hall ever sees
a group of teenagers here on a Monday afternoon, that's what those meetings are. You
might hear some strange noises, nothing to worry about. But we are delighted to host
the students here from grades nine through 12 and to really give them an opportunity to
learn more about local government, to hone their skills as future leaders and to serve
their community by coming up with community service projects of their own and so with
that I will welcome Conner up here to introduce himself and guide you through some of
these activities that have been taking place.
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Rudishauser: Hi. My name is Conner. I am a sophomore at Renaissance High School
and I am the Vice-Chair of Government Affairs for MYAC. So, today I'm basically going
to talk to you a little bit about what we have been doing this past semester I should say.
So, first I'm going to talk about our three main pillars. Our first pillar is leadership and,
then, we have community service and government affairs. So, let's talk about our first
pillar leadership. We had a couple guest speakers come this year to talk about our
leadership development and help our leadership development. Our first one was Karen
Manthey. She was with Comedy Sports, which is like an Improv Club, basically, that
she participated in and she was kind of imparting her wisdom of improv on to us and
allowing us to become more brave speakers and leaders within our city basically and,
then, we had Mary Kummer from ICRMP and she did this activity where we had to
basically complete a task without knowing what it was. So, we had all these bands that
we like strapped to our fingers and we all had to work together to complete a task
together without basically knowing what it was and it was a blast. We also had the
Treasure Valley Youth Safety Summit at Wahooz, which was so much fun. We got to
drive go karts and learn about how horrible it is to text and drive and drunk driving all
that kind of stuff. The Police Department brought drunk goggles to show us what it was
like to like golf while impaired, so that was really fun. Now, I want to talk a little bit about
T oh, we have one more slide on leadership development. We had our kickoff at
Wahooz with bowling where we kind of met all the new MYAC members that were
coming in this year. So, we did that at the very beginning of the year and it was really
fun, because we got to, you know, meet everyone in a kind of familiar environment with
bowling and just kind of laid back meeting new people and stuff. Then we had our
Friendsgiving where it was pretty much just a big Thanksgiving with all our MYAC
friends and it was really fun, because we got to eat a bunch of food and play games and
very similar to our holiday party. But our holiday party, of course, was based more
around Christmas and I even dressed up in a bunch of Christmas stuff for that which
was really fun and it really helped our recruitment and bring in new people, because we
always suggested that MYACers bring friends to these parties and they kind of get a
taste of what MYAC is from an outsider. Okay. Now on to our community service. We
had a couple community service opportunities this year. We had our Trunk or Treat
where we set up a booth and handed out candy in kind of a unique way. We decided to
have ducks in a little bowl and people had to scoop out the ducks and if they had a
sticker on the duck, then, they got like a bigger candy than if they had no sticker, which
was kind of a unique thing our MYACers came up with on how to make this experience
more fun and, then, we had the See Spot Walk, which I did not go to, but we had a
registration for the Idaho Humane Society, so I'm pretty sure it was a Tkind of outreach
about adopting dogs and that kind of stuff. So, yeah, our community service coordinator
could talk to you all about that, but we also had letters to veterans where everyone
wrote ILLI mean as many letters as they wanted, but everyone wrote at least one letter to
a veteran in November and it was kind of just a great way to celebrate Veteran's Day
and, you know, have a good community service oriented activity in one of our MYAC
meetings. And, then, we rounded off November with Rake Up Meridian. I and a couple
of my Tour MYAC members went to a house in Meridian and helped rake up all their
leaves when they weren't able to and it's, of course, more of a widespread event in
Meridian and it really helped Tyou know, help the people that can't, you know, rake up
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their own leaves so their grass doesn't die. We also had some government affairs guest
speakers. So, Emily Kane came to talk about Trias Politica, which talked about the
branches of government and how different the federal, state, county and municipal
levels of government are and kind of the differences between them, which was really
cool to learn about. And, then, we had Aaron Bennett just this last meeting come to talk
to us about advocacy and lobbying, which I will get to about Youth Lobbying Day, which
is something I myself am planning to go to. She was with the American Heart
Association, so she talked a lot about how her past experiences with Youth Lobby Day
and answered any questions we had about lobbying in general to all the MYACers. Oh,
there we go. We also had our City Hall tour where we toured the City Hall that we are in
right now and we learned about the Parks and Recreation Department. We learned
about the city attorney's office I'm pretty sure was also there and, you know, all the
departments in our City Hall and it was just a great experience for everyone to kind of
go away from the usual and learn something new in a more of an active setting. So, we
have quite a few things up for this next semester and one of those is next meeting we
are having ACHD bring our LLor their snow plow vehicles and we are going to be able to
like go get in the vehicles and learn how what to do when around them on the road,
because many of them -Uus included, we can drive, so it's very important to know what
to do around these snow plows, even if there hasn't been much snow. Then we are
also having Youth Lobby Day coming February 5th, which will be pretty exciting,
because Lvwwell, we are going to be able to go lobby to senators and talk about issues to
them at [Efrom a child point of view, which I'm really excited for to go and do. We have
a community service panel coming up in February. We have Mad City Money coming in
February as well. This is really exciting to me as well as we get to learn about
budgeting and kind of real life things that you will have to know after high school and
college and all that. We have Do The Right Day, which I went to last year and that was
a great experience. We ran a little booth at Meridian Middle School and kind of just
helped spread awareness about the day and the holiday and it was really fun just
hanging out with people handing out stickers and letting people write cards to people
and all that. So, that was really fun. And, then, we rounded off with our senior prom
where Tat the Senior Center all of the seniors will go to a little dance, like it's a high
school prom, but for seniors because I mean it's been a long time since they went to a
prom and it lets them re[experience those things and, you know, have a great time with
people that are in high school that Ito help them through it. Yeah. And so, yeah,
think that's it. If you have any questions I'm happy to answer.
Simison: Thank you, Conner. Council, any questions?
Whitlock: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Whitlock.
Whitlock: Great presentation. It's been a few years since I was a senior. I can relate.
This is extensive in LLin terms of all the different things that you are doing and all of the
insights that you are gaining into leadership and city governance and state governance.
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Where does this take you do you think? What do you T what does your MYAC
experience mean to Conner's future?
Rudishauser: Well, I, for one, would love to experience some sort of local government
later in life, like after I have a stable income I TI want to be an engineer, so maybe after
a couple years of doing that trying to get into local government would be really cool, but,
yeah, 1 TI think it's really fun.
Whitlock: And just follow up. And this experience has Thas whetted your appetite for
that and T
Rudishauser: Yes.
Whitlock: Tmade you excited. Good. Excellent.
Simison: Additional questions, comments? Thank you, Conner. Appreciate you doing it
solo. Your 1111your teammate couldn't make it.
Rudishauser: Yeah.
Simison: But we appreciate you being here and taking the full Tfull report.
Rudishauser: Yeah. All right. Thank you. Yeah.
Simison: Thank you.
Rudishauser: Thank you.
Simison: And it is great. We still do have LUI spent some of the time where we have T
and I just spiked on his name who came back from Stanford THoyoung came back and
sat down and, you know, so we know the influence that MYAC has on some people and
their desire to serve and, you know, as Tas he was going through and rounding out his
years at Stanford trying to figure out how he gets back and how he continues to stay
engaged. So, definitely can lay the Tlay the groundwork for people early in life, so
appreciate it very much.
10. Commercial Property Assessed Capital Expenditure (C-PACE)
Program Discussion
Simison: Okay. With that we will move on to Item 10, which is the continued
conversation around commercial property assess capital expenditure or C[PACE
program discussion. Invite Curtis back up to continue the dialogue.
Calder: Well, thank you for inviting me back. I do have some virtual guests that will
participate this afternoon, so, again, my name is Curtis Calder, Economic Development
Administrator with the city and two weeks ago we gave a presentation on the C-PACE
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program. That material I TI placed it back in your packet, so I don't know if you would
like me to go back over it, but I'm happy to do so. I think probably a better starting point
would be to introduce the guests and have them explain CPACE in their own words,
because they are in that industry and that may go a long ways towards answering your
questions. So, with that is Chris Robbins on the virtual The Zoom link?
Robbins: Yes, I am. Hi, everybody. Thank you T
Calder: Okay. Well, I will introduce Chris and Tand let him have you know, explain in
his own words what CPACE is and what it can do for the City of Meridian.
Simison: Thank you. Chris, welcome.
Robbins: Great. Thank you very much for having me and for your time. So, by way of
background, Chris Robbins, I have been in the CPACE world since kind of the
beginning about 12 years now. My background prior to CPACE, structured finance,
commercial real estate, energy finance and I live out here in the San Francisco Bay
area and the Tin talking to Curtis last week we had a great conversation and kind of
walked through some of the initial conversations and questions that Tthat you have,
you know, kind of talked through and along with my Tmy partner Joe Euphrat and some
folks over at Gilmore Bell that do a lot of the PACE financing from a legal perspective
and have been very involved in the Idaho programs, I [III put some of these talking
points together. What would be the best use of Hof your time in terms of what you
would like? I mean I could go through and Tand spend a lot of time talking about, you
know, CPACE and from the various, you know, lenses and stakeholder groups, but
what would be helpful for me to try to impart during this T this time that we have
together?
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I read the lithe presentation that was attached and I thought that was very
helpful. I TI kind of just wanted to check on the structure of it and really understand the
potential volume that could come from this program. So, Mr. Mayor, if you don't mind,
like my first question is just how often do senior lenders give Tis it effectively a super
priority position through the CPACE program, because the T the senior mortgage
holders, right, have to basically agree to this structure and so I just want to kind of
understand the trade offs. How often do you see this? How often do you see senior
lenders agree to that priority of payment position changing? And maybe just kind of
walk me through what kind of volume you expect to see in Idaho. My understanding is
there has been one deal that's closed in Idaho in 2024, but if there has been Tif there is
kind of a big pipeline of it coming I would want to understand that. So, those are some
of my questions.
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Robbins: No. That's Tand that's a Tthose are great questions and the senior lender or
consent has been I would say one of the Eithe challenges, especially in the early days
of PACE where, you know, maybe four or five states had actually amended their
legislation to allow PACE to be The accessed. But the Tthere is Tthere has been
north of, you know, per PACE nation, you know, 12 and a half billion of PACE financed
since inception and the vast vast majority of those deals have come with lender consent
and what we have Twhat we have experienced Tand I think what the industry has
experienced from a trend perspective over the last three years is more and more
lenders in this could be banks, it could be debt funds and so forth, really kind of digging
in and understanding what PACE is and how it kind of works in conjunction with their
senior first lane debt and once they do the feedback that we get is, oh, this is just like
traditional assessment financing that's been around for a long time and we deal with T
with it, although it's voluntary and there have been TI would say the Tthe thing that Ell]
that we do and Tand I think a lot of our other peers in the market do is instead of, you
know, asking a senior lender if they are okay with Twith PACE as part of a capital stack,
it's really spending the time to kind of understand, one, how much PACE is applicable at
a project level. What's Twhat are kind of directional terms, so when that conversation
happens with a senior lender Tand we support a lot of these conversations Tit's not
are you okay with CPACEs, here is how the sponsor, the property owner, the developer
is looking to capitalize their project. It's with equity. It's with some CPACE and with,
you know, 40 to 50 percent first lien debt and what Ti once [El once senior lenders
understand that kind of the Tthe mechanics of the CPACE, which is Tis not a it's not
a traditional lien, like a first deed of trust on a property or a second, it's an assessment
at the property level and because of that structure it can never accelerate, can never be
called in the event of nonpayment of a property tax bill and associated assessments.
Can also be prepaid at any time and so it's very quiet flexible financing and, you know,
the Tif I'm sitting in a senior lender's kind of the head of credit chair I'm looking at is this
financing creative to the project? Is there debt service coverage that is Tyou know,
makes sense. So, I'm LLI'm looking at it from an underwriting perspective and what we
are seeing from a PACE plus first lien debt on projects is, you know, anywhere from 65
to 70 percent for new construction, combined PACE and mand wand senior debt and,
then, a little north of that for reimbursement projects where 1111where one can look back
up to three years in most states and reimburse themselves and use that liquidity to
maybe recapitalize or right size a loan or for, you know, other capital improvements,
tenant improvements and commissions to stabilize the project. I will stop there, see if
that answered your question.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: That's very helpful. Maybe just to drill down on that a little bit. Does the
program administrator take on any risk because the the debt can't be accelerated
and my understanding is that it's kind of a current pay situation. So, in the event of
nonpayment at that point you would have a default, right, under the PACE loan and so
help walk me through if there is a default how a PACE lender recovers and what the
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program administrator from a city perspective's role would be in that type of a situation.
Has there ever been a bankruptcy of a PACE loan? How did that play out? Maybe just
an example would help crystallize kind of the priority of payments and how that would
work.
Robbins: So, that's a great question and in terms of a Ta project where the property
tax is not paid. So, generally what we see happening Tand this has happened and the
Tthe senior lenders' covenants will have been tripped and they will move kind of to
enforce their remedies Trights and remedies under their loan documents and in many
cases in wand these discussions happen kind of prior to PACE being placed on a Ton
a parcel kind of during underwriting, the senior lender will look at, okay, if things go bad
here or sideways what is the outcome going to be for me the senior lender and it's
typically we are going to want to keep property taxes current as we work through our Ell]
you know, work Twork through the CLthe issue. In the event that they are not kept
current the Twhat's due and payable at any given time from a PACE perspective is the
current property tax bill and associated assessments, of which this would be one, a new
one, and any default or delinquent property tax payments and assessments and so
what cannot happen is the PACE provider saying, okay, this is a five million dollar PACE
financing and T and we did not get our assessment payment, nothing T we can't
foreclose or start a process on the T on the five million, it's just that outstanding
payment and so that kind of ties back into the senior lender conversations where they
are like, okay, so maybe I reserve, you know, a payment or in our underwriting I
understand that if we are in a workout situation I might have to and we need to keep the
LLthe taxes current, I will need to factor this in as well. From a city in a Tin a PACE
administrator perspective it's Tlit's still pretty quiet, because it's just Tit's Tit's on the
tax roll, so there is not a whole lot to do and I don't know if Tif Jacob from Gilmore Bell
is on the line as well and would defer to him. They have Tthey have done a lot of the
underlying PACE legislation and guidelines work in L-in Idaho, but we are a Twe are a
PACE program administrator in California and, then, it's Tit would just be monitoring to
Leto TLto see what's Twhat's happening with the Twith the payment of the property
taxes and assessments.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: But just EEjust so I understand. So, the Tthe PACE lender it sounds like is an
unsecured creditor with a LLright? Because you have a first mortgage holder already
and so Twould that be accurate? Would it be an unsecured creditor and would the
source of repayment in the event of a default of a PACE loan eventually be like around
the Mike would Twould the Twould the transfer of a Twould it Twould it be effectively
a lien against the property and against the title, so that would L-if a new lender looked to
purchase the property they would have to clear that out before they could transfer it?
Robbins: That is correct. Yes, that is correct. So, it would just L11
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Strader: Okay.
Robbins: It would -lit would Eit would LLit would accrue like any other unpaid property
taxes M
Strader: Uh-huh. But they are LLbut LLbut they are not property taxes, just to be clear;
right? I mean it's EU it's a Efl it's a Ti that's the stream of repayment is the same as
property taxes, but it's it's actually an unsecured claim; right?
Robbins: It is a -Lit is a tax lien that is assessed on the underlying parcel or parcels that
are being improved. So, it sits just under, you know, ad valorem taxes and other wand
some other assessments. So, it would still wit would not be expunged for could not
be expunged from the Myou know, the tax roll.
Strader: Got it. Okay. That's really helpful.
Robbins: And I can -land we can get some more clarity on Ton that as well through
Gilmore Bell, who may be on this remotely as well.
Simison: Yes, Jacob is here. Jacob, do you have anything you would like to add?
Carlton: Yeah. I mean, no, that's right. I mean like Chris kind of said at the -Lat the top
of the HE you know, his comments I mean if you think of this as like a traditional
assessment on a property that's exactly what it is. I mean there is an assessment lien
that's put on the property that is in Tas Chris mentioned it's, you know, just below a lien
for taxes and other assessments, but it's LLit's a L-it's superior to any mortgage lien on
the property and so that's that's really the Frthe security for the assessment itself.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: Yeah. That makes a lot of sense to me. So, it really Tilike this is a program
that is highly dependent on first mortgage lenders in Idaho being comfortable with giving
a super priority position to this gap financing and one of the biggest risks that I am trying
to wrap my head around is just around the cost of program administration and the
amount of time, you know, city staff would have to put into this type of a program and
will there be volume and wand deals to actually support it? So, I LIDI'm kind of curious
like do you see a big pipeline of projects coming in Idaho? Are you mare you aware of
a reason that we would LLyou know, besides that it's just generally spreading this type
of financing, but like help me wrap my head around the risks to this program
administration, setting this whole thing up.
Robbins: Yeah. That's a great question. And I will maybe take the first part and, Jacob,
if you can take kind of part number two in terms of what you have seen in terms of
program administration kind of time to set up a program and mand kind of administer
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projects as they LLas they come to the LLto the city. In terms of the pipeline, absolutely,
we are seeing a T a healthy pipeline in Idaho. We have been actually T and the
marketplace has been waiting Llhad been waiting for Idaho to amend their legislation to
allow PACE to occur. We have a couple projects that we have spoken with a local
developer about ourselves in terms of their interest in T in accessing and T and
exploring PACE for Tfor projects in Meridian and the TI would say the Tthe majority of
the Tithe projects that we see kind of fall into two categories, PACE being used for new
construction and typically, you know, it's 25 to 30, sometimes 35 percent of the lithe
capital stack from a PACE perspective, the remaining balance up to that 65 or 70
percent being filled with traditional senior debt, construction lending, and, then, the
second wand ELand those projects range anywhere from, you know for financing from
a PACE perspective range anywhere from, you know, two to three million to, you know,
20 to 30 million plus of PACE. And, then, the second is Mis this reimbursement that we
talked about where a building owner let's say that has recently delivered a project and
because of, you know, the capital markets and the Tthe Tyou know, what Twhat's kind
of going on in the last couple of years we have Tyou know, there is Tthey might have
construction debt that has come due or coming due and they need some time to
stabilize the — the property and this is where we are seeing as well a lot of lender
consent coming to LL into play where, you know, there is a really solid relationship
between the sponsor and the lender, but the lender needs some relief, needs to get, you
know, a 11you know, maybe a sizable pay down of their principal balance and -land,
you know Tyou know, updating appropriately reserve requirements and so that owner
can go back and reimburse themselves for, you know, 30 percent of the Tof the hard
and soft costs typically and use those Tithose funds to pay down that senior lender and
Tand Tand allow them more time to stabilize or come in with a new first lien lender and
PACE to retire in full that construction debt. So, absolutely, there is a Tthere is a T
there is a Ta growing interest and window in various counties within Tin Idaho and we
have seen projects coming across our desk for the last, you know, year, year and a half.
Simison: Yeah. And then EII
Robbins: I'm sorry. Passing the baton to you, Jacob.
Carlton: Yeah. And, then, in terms of the Tthe program administrator as you may be
aware 71 mean the Idaho statute T I mean the Twhat the program administrator is
anticipated to do on the CPACE deals is kind of review applications as they come in to
the city just to make sure that they are meeting all the Tthe requirements set forth, you
know, in the Tin the CPACE program that's adopted by the city. That being said,
mean the way these Tthese CPACE deals work is, you know, you have a CPACE
lender, you have the city that would come in and put the assessment lien on the
property, but once the city, you know, does the initial putting the assessment lien on the
property it assigns all of its rights over to the CPACE lender, so the CPACE lender is
the one that would enforce the lien if it ever got to that point and so T and T and
because of that the CPACE lender is really the one Tor the entity that is reviewing the
application and the accompanying materials in depth just to make sure that they are iT
you know, everything's on the up and up. So, really, from the city's perspective the
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program administrator would just be the entity just coming in just to make sure the
application is EUyou know, everything is there in the application, almost like a Tsort of a
check the box sort of thing. I would also mention, too TI mean to the extent that the
city didn't want to do that work, the statute allows the city to hire an outside program
administrator to come in and do that on its behalf as well.
Robbins: And, then, one final part on the program administration and time, I believe the
Tthe statute allows for the city, if they wanted to, to levy some fees or charge some
fees. I think it's up to 500 dollars for an application fee and, then, you know, some other
amount capped at Tat 50,000 dollars and what we have seen in the market as the
market has grown to now 41 states have Thave amended PACE Ultheir legislation to
allow PACE to occur, a lot of the markets are looking Ta lot of the counties and cities
are looking at this as kind of an economic development, you know, option or Tor
capital, you know, program that can be accessed by their Tyou know, their Ttheir
constituents and, you know, or kind of the Tthe way that we see a lot of cities look at
the fees is, you know, what is fair and equitable. We don't want to, you know, stick our
amour citizens with a Twith a hefty fee just because we can, but we Twe also want to
cover our costs as appropriate, you know, to [![]to manage to stand up and manage a
program and I believe Tand, Jacob, correct me if I'm wrong, that you have the authority
to, you know, put whatever fee schedule that you want into place and also to Tyou
know, as was deals get Lioget going and you see how much time may or may not be
needed to administer the program, is to amend those fee schedules at your discretion.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: If I can just follow up on just that one question. Do you typically find that
people do an hourly fee for administering the work or is it a flat fee or is a fee based
upon total value of the project? Just trying to understand T
Robbins: That's a Tthat's a great question and what we see generally speaking is there
Tthere is a Ttypically an application fee and we see that run anywhere from, you know,
200 dollars to 500 dollars, depending upon, you know, the size of a Tof a project,
especially in the Tkind of the Tthe initial kind of standing up of a program and, then, in
a lot of states there is a percentage Ta fee that is a percentage of the funded amount
that is capped at a certain level and we have seen kind of step down. So, from, you
know, one million to three million it might be a -La one percent fee, you know from,
three to five. So, it's Tit's Tit's typically Tyou know, in most of the cities and the
counties that we have talked to they are like we want to make this as easy as possible
for everybody and we want to make it fair and reasonable, so, you know, there could be
a T a T a fee that is about one percent of the amount, capped at twenty thousand
dollars or ten thousand dollars. But, again, it's Tit's Tthat's kind of the way that we see
it. We also see some other places that, you know, kind of go the opposite way, but they
don't get a whole lot of deals done.
Taylor: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Mr. Taylor.
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Taylor: A follow up on the -Isort of the fees. If cif we opt to do this and we choose to
have a third-party administrator does the city still establish what those fees would be or
does this third-party entity who is administering it establish the fees?
Robbins: Jacob, how have you seen that work with like SRS and others?
Carlton: Yeah. I think under the Idaho statutes EEI mean I would have to go back and
double check, but I'm EEI'm fairly certain it was written so that the city establishes those
fees. It wouldn't be the -Ithe program administrator. It would be set forth in the uyou
know, the CIPACE program that you set up.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: Isn't that a key risk for us to evaluate? My understanding is that in Idaho the M
the application and servicing fees are capped. So, I think that there is the EIII guess
what Twhat I would want to make sure is that we had some rationale that if we were
going to set up this program, even if we were outsourcing it to a third party, that the
program would be self[Sustaining. In other words, that the application fees and
servicing fees would cover whatever we are paying a third party to administer it. In
Idaho specifically have you seen a way that cities are handling that kind of risk? I know
Idaho is kind of early in the adoption of -Ulof this type of financing.
Robbins: Jacob, do you want to use Utah maybe as a L-you know, because Utah went
with a third party as a mat a state level and, then, it's kind of reverted back to cities and
counties running their programs.
Carlton: Yeah. I mean Utah is a little bit different. I mean in Utah I can just say if cities
and counties and all the deals we have done where city and county has, you know,
been the governmental entity that levies the assessment lien on the property, they have
not traditionally taken a fee. I mean there is not they have taken the approach you
know, there is not a heavy lift on reviewing the materials as they come in and so they
just haven't taken a fee. I would say we did do two deals with Coeur d'Alene last year.
That being said, we weren't -Uwe didn't have any direct communication with the city
there and so I don't know what they did as far as their fee goes, but we could go back
and look at that and just see if we can figure out what L-what Coeur d'Alene decided to
do for their fees.
Simison: And 1 TI think that's a question ELI mean Curtis has identified for me how
much time he thinks he will need to set it from his dayltoiday job to set up the
program, but once the program is actually set up I Ethis goes back to my original
comment in terms of asking the questions, like, okay, if it's a LLdecide how much the
size of the project actually, you know, impact the amount of work that needs to be done
by the administrator. You know, if 1111 if 1111 if it's just looking to make sure that the
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financers checked all the boxes and, you know, the LEI the T the 0 sign the right
paperwork and throughput it compared to, well, for every thousand square feet you can
expect to spend one hour, you know, but, you know, what's the metric to help us
determine if we were to establish a fee, because, yeah, fifty thousand is half a year
salary for someone that just has to pass paperwork, it seems like a pretty easy LLyou
know, more than enough to capture. But that's not typically how we do business. We
typically want people to pay and you want to set something that's fair and equitable.
How do we determine what's fair and equitable from the start compared to after doing
five projects and realizing we way overcharged or way undercharged?
Robbins: Yeah. I think Tso, to your question the Tmy answer would be the LLthe
former, you know, not necessarily size dependent or size translates to more work or less
work depending upon which way you go up Tup or down the scale Tsize scale and the
LL LLthe capital Tthe provider of the financing is the one that's going to be doing the
underwriting and Tand the work and to Jacob's point, you know, kind of the program
administrator, just making kind of checking the boxes to make sure that the LL the
structure of the financing falls within the Tthe guidelines of the Tof the program and,
then, once the lien T the assessment is placed on the property, as Jacob was
mentioning, you know, the Tthe transfer of the Tyou know, the Mthe LLthe rights and
liens and everything else is going to, you know, be transferred from the city to the LLto
the capital provider and so we haven't seen wand we have done QLwe have done deals
in 15, 16 states and a lot of different counties and cities and we haven't run across a
program where we have seen a heavy lift by staff. Not to say that the first four or five
are going to be kind of a learning experience and, you know, that might be LLwe have T
we have Twe have heard of other cities look at Tso, all right, maybe we start a Twe
have a flat fee of —]of X, 2,500 dollars or 3,000 dollars or 5,000 dollars and, then, in Tin
12 months, you know, we can go back and Tand see Tyou know, to LLto somebody's
point it was are we overcharging? Are we charging mare we not charging enough?
And Tand Tand, then, kind of reassess at that point.
Simison: And I'm just guessing here, but if the cities took it back in Utah or were giving
it back to them it was either viewed as it not Tnot that much work or was producing
more revenue than necessary or the state couldn't get to it because they didn't have the
resources to actually get it done quickly. I don't know why else cities would say, yeah,
we will take it back if it's overly cost burdensome to them. More timely.
Carlton: Yeah. I mean 1 TI can jump in there, because I TI mean I have LLI have been
working in Utah CPA since the beginning. It's actually none of the above LL
Simison: Okay.
Carlton: --]why the state opted not to do it. The state just they set up the program.
The person that set it up, who was at the state, left the state and, then, when she left no
one else at the state really had any appetite for doing the state program, so they just
said we are not doing it at a state level. Cities and counties, if you want to do it you can
do it, but we are not going to do it at a state level.
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Simison: Okay.
Taylor: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Taylor.
Taylor: Yeah. Chris and Jacob, last time we had some questions we were kind of
drilling into trying to understand how this program essentially allows for lower interest
rates for this type of financing. Can you just give some insight? Is it the length LLlike
length of the Tthe terms? Is it Twhat is it? What is that sort of, you know, little nugget
that allows for a better interest rate with CLIPACE financing versus a traditional loan?
Carlton: Yeah. No. That's Tthanks for bringing that up., So, you know, traditional
banks, you know, will twill bring in, you know, deposits and use those deposits and
lend those back out and, you know, as a kind of a first lien L-or second lien in some
cases debt instrument. The Tthe nature of [Mof assessment kind of financing Tthere
are a lot of interested buyers of this paper in the marketplace, you know, because it's T
it's Tin a lot of Efla lot of cases looked as Mas like muni bonds or municipal financing
where most of the Tthe buyers of this LU]of this product are insurance companies kind of
down the road and so they have access Tit's just a different Tit's a different type of not
only attachment point, but it's a different type of Hof financial product that allows for a
much broader base of buyers or, you know, people providing capital for this Tthis work
and where this Twhere Twhere we are seeing this going is most PACE prices off the
ten year treasury. In some cases it can price off the five year treasury. This is from a
lender perspective. And, you know, spreads two, three years ago were 350 or 400
basis points over whatever that benchmark was. Now they are coming down. We are
seeing a lot of spreads in the high two hundreds, low Tlow three hundreds and we think
that there will be continued kind of pricing compression. The more of these PACE deals
that get funded in the 1111you know, in the marketplace there is just going to be more
money coming in and so it's Tand that's Tand that's where a lot of the banks will say,
well, this is accretive, because if I'm lending at say seven percent and PACE is at six
and a quarter percent, that blended cost of capital is going to be beneficial to the project
to the sponsor and what a lot of these lenders are saying Tand I'm kind of delisking
myself, because my first lien attachment point might be now 40 percent, instead of 65
percent and I will allow PACE to kind of fill in the rest there. So, I jumped around there
a little bit, but, hopefully, that answered your question.
Taylor: Yeah. That's Tthat's helpful. Mr. Mayor, if I could just a quick follow up.
Simison: Councilman Taylor.
Taylor: I'm kind of curious. You mentioned you said this and I'm just trying to make
sure I understand it LLkind of priced off the ten year treasury note just a little bit. I know
that's an important benchmark for a lot of commercial loans. So, does it track the ten
year treasury note kind of as that fluctuates a little bit or does it kind of have an adverse
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sort of Tor inverse relationship as that goes up some of this might go down? I'm just
kind of Tthat's a really interesting concept to me. I want to grasp that a little bit more.
Carlton: Yeah. So, as T as the T as the benchmark fluctuates, once T once the
assessment is placed Tthis is fixed rate financing. So, once the assessment has been
placed on the property and the capital funded, it won't move it. It's --it's a fixed rate.
There is a Tthere is an amortization schedule that is provided and that's kind of what
the Tthe Tkind of the Tthe Tthe tax assessments are Tare based off of, so you know
what your payment will be every time you pay your tax bill until the meither the Tthe
PACE is retired or the term sunsets. What does change Land this is where the lender
TPACE lender kind of group out there can can move the spread up or down based
upon what that benchmark's doing to keep the financing in a place that it's still a
accretive to a project, if that's a deal that they want to do.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: My other questions are (Tare (Tare kind of along the same vein, just really two
questions. This just doesn't look like something that would work well for single family
homes to me, but I'm kind of curious just generally what types of projects are we likely
to see if we implemented this program that we would not otherwise see? So, that's a
question that I have. And, then, along those lines, you know, out of the projects you
referred to that people are looking at Meridian, are those greenfield or are these
primarily projects that have gone sideways and they haven't stabilized and they need
gap financing to fill an air ball with their situation in the multi Jamily market?
Robbins: Yeah. So, to your first question, correct, single family homes, this would not
be applicable. It's typically, you know, five units and greater and, then, really any type of
LLof nonresidential development, which would include, you know, we are working IL-and
when I say we, I'm -1 I'm T I'm talking about the industry generally on, you know,
manufacturing plants, we are looking at a biochar facility in the northeast right now, but
the majority of the projects would fall into multi[family, would fall into mixed Luse, office,
retail, industrial and hospitality. So, those are the LLthose are the kind of the primary
and, then, you know, there is cold storage, there is data centers, there is Tthere is all
sorts of other applicable asset classes that kind of sit, you know, outside of that. In
terms of the T the types of projects, we are seeing a lot of kind of urban reuse
conversion redevelopment as well. My understanding is you have got a [Ilia block
across City Hall that is in need of some Tsome work to Tto bring that back into the
community and so it's -Uwe -Uwe see a lot of kind of adaptive reuse projects that, you
know, have quantifiable Ta number of quantifiable benefits for communities in terms of
bringing back jobs and taxes Ttax bases and -Land people and Tand _Land vibrancy
to Tto neighborhoods. The [Ithe reimbursement projects [III wouldn't necessarily put
them in a kind of a distressed box. There are, of course, projects that are CLthat are
just, you know, underwater and we don't kind of look at PACE as coming in and being
that Tthat silver bullet to help kind of fix Tffix a project that needs to L-you know, is not
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fixable, but more of a Ta really good Ma good project, a good sponsor, kind of bad
timing in that, you know, PACE in min some cases will come in and provide that liquidity
so that that project either, one, you know, can Tthat owner can sign a lease and know
that they have funds to Tto Tto do the TI build out and pay commissions and, again,
bring Tbring business into Tinto the community. Did that answer your question?
Strader: Mr. Mayor? Yes, it did. Thank you so much.
Robbins: Oh, you are welcome.
Simison: Council, any other questions for our guests this evening? Chris, Jacob, I want
to say thank you for allowing us your time this evening to help get some questions
answered. I don't know that we are done yet with this conversation even tonight, but I
just want to make sure we got that out on the record for you, so thank you.
Robbins: Thank you so much for allowing us to participate.
Simison: Chris, I don't know if you had more to present on this or TI'm happy to give
my two cents for you if you Tunless you have other Tothers to say.
Robbins: Yeah. Mr. Mayor, the only other thing I would add is I did speak with City of
Rexburg just to get an idea of how much time they actually spent putting the program
together, standing it up. It was a multi Tit was a team effort on their part, they are a
small city, so they had probably two or three different individuals. They had to ask how
many hours each person worked on it and the cumulative number was about 50 hours
of staff time. So, with regard to the setup of the program that's probably about what we
would expect to see and Tand I certainly have capacity to do that. I can't do it all in one
sitting, but I can spread it out and work on it here and there and I have the benefit of
other cities putting these together in advance of me, so I can look at their templates and
I talked to City of Boise as well. They took a little bit longer time just because of their
process, but it wasn't that heavy of a lift for them either, so probably about the same
when you add it all up. That's all I had.
Simison: Yeah. I was, essentially, going to say that. You know, at least from my
perspective, you know, through the first one, you know, generally I would be supportive
of setting a fee that's based on hourly time invested, you know, as a start. From what
have heard it Tthis would not be onerous enough Tno different than setting up the
program where you might have to invest some time, but I think after doing one or two
we could quickly figure out do we have the bandwidth or do we need to off load or what
would be that appropriate amount to Tto do it. If we are Tif you were interested in
going a different direction that's fine as well. But I think that's at least Twhat I hate is to
charge ]overcharge on the first one, unless we say we will ewe will charge this and
we will refund it if that's not how much it takes, but even if you are going to contract it
out I think a contractor would want to know what's 111nrhat they are going to receive in a
Tin a set wage or set amount per hour's work seems to be more appropriate than a
dollar figure based upon it and not going to get into my good friends that sell homes
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where sometimes there is that question mark is just because the home is worth more,
the cost you receive is that the fair and appropriate way and I don't know that's the way
we want to do business. But we want to recapture our hours, whether we look at those
50 hours and build that in that it takes to build the program or we say that's our cost T
that's our contribution to the program, but we want to be compensated for those who
actually use the program on a Ton a fair basis. But, personally, in my conversations
with Curtis and what I have learned, I'm Ti I'm comfortable recommending that we
consider moving forward with this project, but happy to see if you all believe that's true
or not and if you need to have further dialogue before getting to that place yourselves,
so T
Overton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Overton.
Overton: Had a huge shout out to Jacob and Chris for Tfor helping with this tonight,
along with Curtis. You know, I don't TI don't ever want to look at this as something we
would add to our city based upon one project. I got to keep telling myself that what we
are looking at here is adding a tool to our toolbox for economic development. It's getting
to the point Tor getting past the point of trying to decide how much money we think we
need to be compensated for when, really, we don't have that idea right now. We don't
know the size of the project or what's going to come in the door. I would much rather try
to stay focused on is this going to be a benefit to our community and, if so, it's the right
thing to do or it's not. I have learned a lot since the first time I met with Curtis on this.
think this is a Ma tool that can help our city in certain situations. It can help certain
projects and situations. I think that a lot of the questions that were asked were valuable.
Some of them, quite honestly, people on this dais have tremendous amounts of
information in areas that I don't and I'm glad you asked those high level financing
questions, but I don't think as a city we are going to be dealing with having to answer
those questions as we administer these projects. I think our role is going to be much
different on how we administer it. So far everything I have heard, from what the load
will be on our city versus the benefit to our community is positive and I would be
supportive of this moving forward as we get closer to adopting it.
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: My concern is about putting a lot of resources into setting up a program if it's
premature and I think Idaho is pretty early in its adoption curve of this type of financing.
Like what I would be looking for would be TI think the CEthe main risk that we run is that
there is a cap built into this program of what we can charge reasonably for servicing
fees and I think I would want to make sure that we can capture Mno different than our
kind of parks philosophy. I want to see that we can capture our cost of service and our
cost of administering this program properly. That's my main concern. So, that's
something I think I would need to get, you know, working through with you guys as you
try to develop what this program would look like, a rationale around what type of
servicing fees we would charge and why and why we think that we are comfortable that
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that would cover our cost of administering the program. The other aspect I would like to
see TI TI could not agree more, I don't think it makes any sense to set up a program
just for one project. I think I would want to see a pipeline of potential projects. Like I
think that would help me feel comfortable that there is demand for this tool. If it was a
pipeline of like five projects that we thought, you know, one of these Tchances are one
of these would come to fruition. I think that kind of information would help me feel
comfortable that we are investing in something durable. So, it's not a no for me, it's just
E111 feel like it's a little early and that we need to develop a sense of a pipeline of projects
and kind of keep working on this and work on a rationale for how we capture our cost of
doing it.
Taylor: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Taylor.
Taylor: Is there anything that would prevent us if we spent the time and resources to do
that here in the city and, then, decide that we wanted to pivot in a few years and have a
third party administer that. As far as I understand it we could Twe have that flexibility;
is that correct?
Simison: Correct. And, Curtis, what is the current cap and say code on max cap
recapture?
Calder: So, statute is 500 dollars max application fee and, then, one percent for
servicing fee up to a maximum of 50,000 dollars. So, that's the absolute statutory
maximums.
Simison: Okay. I don't think there is a question would we be able to recapture, it's
what's the appropriate amount to set for the recapture and how do we get there. Yes,
Chris.
Robbins: In terms of the pipeline, happy post today to have one of the larger
developers in your city get in touch with you and talk about their projects. I TI didn't
want to LUjust for, you know, nonLdisclosure and everything else, confidentiality, you
know, put forth names right now, but this Tthis group would be I believe very open to
have that conversation with you and, then, also to have IT11you know, get their thoughts
on, you know, why as a developer would this be of Tof interest to you from a capital
option.
Simison: Thank you.
Whitlock: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Whitlock.
Whitlock: Kind of always operate under a philosophy of I want to be first to be second
and Tand I think there are some others that have blazed the trail on this for us and my
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understanding is that the city of Boise has put out some pretty good promotional
materials on this and they are really pushing that program. I understand that Valley
county has recently approved this as well. So, others are looking at this as a valuable
tool for economic development in their communities. We are certainly not first and we
can certainly learn from those that have helped blaze the trail. So, I'm interested in
continuing the conversation and getting these questions answered.
Taylor: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Taylor.
Taylor: Maybe, Chris and Jacob, if I can just ask you another question. I'm just going to
go back to the fee. From the projects you you have worked on, if there is a 500 dollar
application fee and a cap of 50,000 dollars as a percentage of the servicing fee, is that
Tfrom what you have seen in other states Lill don't know what the statutes say in Tin
other states, you know, where are we in the sort of the ballpark? Does that seem in line
with what you have seen? Is that kind of tracking where other states have been and
does that seem a reasonable structure sort of Tlas far as having a cap on the program?
Carlton: Definitely reasonable having a cap on the program and what we have seen,
again, from a Tfrom an application fee, you know, that two 11250 to 500 dollars, you
know, that seems fair, because there is Tyou know, there is some work that Li-that goes
on there. A little bit of work. Not a lot. And, then, in terms of Tso, the 111there is a Ell
there is a servicing fee that is much smaller than that 50,000 dollar cap. This would be
more of a program administration fee that is paid upon close of the financing and that's
the one percent capped at the Tthe 50,000 dollars. So, if you put that into perspective
from Tand the Tthe programs that we have worked with or know about that charge a
percentage --]either a straight percentage with a cap or some sort of a Ma kind of a
staircase with a Twith a cap, the Tlyou know, a ten million dollar PACE financing, you
know, you would be looking at a hundred thousand dollar fee there. But it would be
capped. No. At ten Tten thousand dollar fee. Excuse me. It's been a long day. And
so in Tin that 1111those fees Tail fees are capitalized, so, you know, where LLwhere we
have seen programs kind of misstep I would say is to not have a cap and to try to
recoup in the first two or three deals, you know, all of the Tthe, quote, unquote, time
and expenses, which is Tlis very T150 hours I think, Curtis, you were saying, that Tthat
it cost Tit took to set the program up. So, it ITthe first two or three users of the program
would disproportionately pay for setting up the program. So, I think that's the misstep
that we see and [],]but most Tlmost cities and council myou know, council LLthe council
Mcouncils are very fair and pragmatic and, you know, what is Twhat's equitable, with
the understanding that once Tlonce the program is up and running that you have got,
you know, the ability to Tito step back and take a look and say are we still comfortable
with this fee schedule or do we need to augment it.
Taylor: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Taylor.
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Taylor: Yeah. Just kind of share my Losome of my thoughts here. I Tthis is really
helpful, Chris, Jacob and Curtis, I really appreciate the follow up. This has been really
what I was looking for to kind of get some deeper insight as to kind of how the program
works and some of the financing structure might be the opportunity. Yeah. I TI like the
conversation. I think it's going in a Tin a favorable direction. I think I'm inclined to want
to continue that and see Tyou know, see that it maybe we Twe find ourselves doing
something here. I am very interested TI think Council Woman Strader's point about
this is for a project, that's Tthat's one discussion or if this is, hey, there is some interest
for LLthere is Tthere is several in the pipeline. But, of course, we also know that there
is Tthere is opportunities for things that are yet unforeseen that may come down the
road because this opportunity is there. So, yeah, I [Ell like where this conversation is
going, assuming we find a sweet spot to kind of put some Tsome things in place to
make sure that we are not devoting a lot of time and resources that we are not
recapturing some of that here in the city.
Simison: I T I guess T unless you want to have T come back and have another
conversation with Curtis at this point in time it would either be Tstart working towards it
or we can let this sit and come back and have another conversation, unless there is
additional information that people LEoutside of saying what Twhat's the pipeline and,
you know, we can help identify that to a certain extent, but that's where TI think where
we are sitting where we are Twe are prepared to start going down the Tthe road and
engage where we see the need is and maybe the one thing that is Tis it ultimately an
ordinance, resolution, that needs to be done at the end of the creation of the program?
Is that when that occurs, Curtis?
Calder: Yeah. So, walking you through the steps, we would if Tif we decided to move
forward I would start working on the program documents, which involves a lot of the
ancillary forms that go along with when you check the box and the application forms and
things of that nature. That's going to take some time. That would all come back to the
City Council for approval and there is I believe a resolution and possibly an ordinance
that needs to be approved to adopt the program and make it the City of Meridian. So,
each city, local government, county, whoever is going to do this has to go through their
own process to Tto codify it for their use. So, that would be the formal approval of the
process.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I think the components that I would need to be comfortable approving that final
resolution or whatever is kind of at the end of the yellow brick road here for us would be
the pipeline, the application and servicing fee structure and rationale of why it covers
our cost, which I think is the critical work that you all would be doing next and, then,
think at that point those would be the Tthe key components that we would need to
move forward. So, I think you Tlyou just need a TI think a strong rational. I don't think
you have to be a hundred percent. I agree once the program's up and running you can
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tweak it, we can look at it. Maybe one additional component. I think I understand Tlike
I EU I think we are all on the same page, but I think I would want a more granular
understanding of any nonperformance risk that the city would have. Are there actions
that if we did or did not take would give us legal exposure from either the PACE lender
or the senior lender? And it could be that that's an easy answer. Like all you need to do
is Tiis, you know, file your tax lien or LLor whatever. Like I rTl'm sure that LLthat it's a
pretty discreet set of actions we need to take, but that would be kind of the third thing I
would want to understand maybe on a more granular level. Is there any
nonperformance risk that the city would have where we could get sued by someone
because we did not take or did take certain actions and Land what are those I think on
a more granular level. So, the TII'm totally great with moving it forward and working on
it, but those are the three things I would TI would need to understand.
Simison: Okay.
Calder: Yeah. We can 71would it be helpful Mil think Chris offered up to bring a
developer in and -land actually have that conversation, assuming we could get one to
come in.
Simison: I think if we could bring in three to talk about the value benefit that they see or
something of that nature, as compared to one to say here is my projects that I LIII don't
know, but I'm IIII'm weary on one hand of asking people to come in and start talking
depending on what type of projects they are, so Tif that makes sense.
Robbins: Yeah. And —land I'm so sorry to interrupt here.
Simison: Yes, Chris.
Robbins: The what QDwhat I would 11111 would propose is to have a LI]a conversation LD
I think most people know this Tlthis group. I think everybody does. And they would
have a conversation with you. But coming in and having three developers [11 we
typically LLa lot of developers don't want to talk about their dhow they are capitalizing
their projects in [lin Tin public necessarily and so I think whatever you LLwhatever the
best line of communication would be where I can make an introduction to somebody
that you know in the community there, that has multiple projects and, then, they would
also know peers of theirs who are doing developments as was well and, then, maybe
the last thing I will say wand Jacob and I have done mdone this where we do a lot of
just education. So, when programs are kind of launched initially I'm happy to, you know,
come to town and sit down and do a kind of a PACE 101 and I'm LLEI'm LLJacob, I'm
going to ILLI'm going to corral you into doing this as well where we Miyou know, where
we invite the LLthe folks that have LLhave projects that could use the financing and we EE
we see that as a Mas a good kind of community benefit at times.
Taylor: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Taylor.
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Taylor: It's my sense that 1 11111 11E1 think we are all on the same Mwe are moving in the
same direction where we want to see this move ahead. I'm not sure that we need
another conversation for more information, as much as I think some of the information
we have I think it can be ewe can receive that through, you know, some you know, I
FTFeFinails or phone calls or conversations that I don't think need to be done in front of
the public in terms of having developers come in and disclose all these projects they are
working on. We understand, you know, the need for them to have that 1111 to work
through those things, unless there is an objection to that really. I EII I think these
questions could be answered for the most part =for me at least with just some informal
communications and sharing that and sitting down with some of our =our folks to just
give me a better sense of that. I don't need another informational discussion in this type
of setting for me to feel like I'm satisfied. I'm pretty much =you know, 95 percent of the
way there with questions answered that [Iii assuming there may be some more
questions, but I =1 don't EIE I don't see why there is a reason where Curtis needs to
stand up here again with more questions that can't be answered, sort of just one off or
in some informal discussions. That's that's my thought on this. And so libut I also 111
don't think there is a rush. So, I don't want to say we have to act and move this along
quickly, we want to make this done the right way. So, I think in just terms of moving
along that's kind of how I would view a productive way to do this.
Simison: Okay. All right.
Calder: Very well.
Simison: Thank you, Curtis.
Calder: Okay. Thank you.
Simison: Council, we are at the end of our agenda. Do I have a motion?
Overton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Overton.
Overton: Move to adjourn.
Little Roberts: Second.
Simison: Motion and second to adjourn. All in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed
nay? The ayes have it. We are adjourned.
MOTION CARRIED: ALLAYES.
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 5:57 P.M.
(AUDIO RECORDING ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
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MAYOR ROBERT E. SIMISON 2-3-2026
ATTEST:
CHRIS JOHNSON -iCITY CLERK