HomeMy WebLinkAboutDecember 12, 2006 C/C Minutes
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
Page 9 of 52
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you, Anna. Council, any questions?
Bird: I have none.
De Weerd: Okay. Do I have a motion -- or need to close the public -- is there anyone in
the public who would like to comment on this application? It is a Public Hearing. Okay.
Is the applicant here this evening? Okay. You have no comment? Thank you. Okay.
If there is no comment from the public, Council?
Wardle: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: Hearing no additional comment, I would move that we close the Public Hearing
on Item 8.
Borton: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. I have a motion and a second to close the Public Hearing on Item 9.
All those in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: If there is no discussion, do we have a motion?
Wardle: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: I move we approve Item 9, VAC 06-015.
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. I have a motion and second to close -- or to approve Item 9. Mr.
Berg, will you, please, call roll.
Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Borton, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 10:
Public Hearing: AZ 06-043 Request for Annexation and Zoning of 20.51
acres from R-R to R-8 zone for Spurwing Patio Homes Subdivision by
Spurwing Limited Partnership - Northeast Corner of North Ten Mile Road
and West Chinden Boulevard and west of North Spurwing Way:
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
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Item 11:
Public Hearing: PP 06-045 Request for Preliminary Plat approval of 73
residential building lots consisting of 46 attached single-family units and
27 detached single-family units and 6 common/other lots on 20.51 acres in
a proposed R-8 zone for SpuMing Patio Homes Subdivision by
Spurwing Limited Partnership - Northeast Corner of North Ten Mile Road
and West Chinden Boulevard and west of North Spurwing Way:
Item 12:
Public Hearing: V AR 06-020 Request for a Variance to exceed the
maximum block length allowed under UDC 11-2D-3C for SpuMing Patio
Homes Subdivision by Spurwing Limited Partnership - Northeast Corner
of North Ten Mile Road and West Chinden Boulevard and west of North
Spurwing Way:
De Weerd: Okay. Items 10, 11, and 12 are public hearings on AZ 06-043, PP 06-045,
and VAR 06-020. I will open these three public hearings with staff comments.
Canning: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, this is the Spurwing Patio Homes
project. It is located north of Chinden Boulevard and northeast of Ten Mile Road -
Chinden Boulevard intersection, if there were one. There is one on the south side of the
street, there is not one on the north side of the street. The property is kind of -- has a
flag coming out from Chinden Road to an existing lot within Spurwing Subdivision. It
does connect up the roadway within that subdivision, that county subdivision, and, then,
we have golf course property surrounding it on three sides. The applicant is requesting
both annexation and zoning and preliminary plat and variance approval. They are
proposing 46 lots for attached patio homes and 27 lots for detached homes. All of the
proposed lots do meet the minimum dimensional standards of the requested R-8 zone.
The average lot size in the proposed development is a little over 9,000 square feet. The
open space consists of 3.69 acres or 18 percent of the site. As you will see on the
landscape plan, a large portion of that is water features. Access to the site is currently
proposed from North Spurwing Way. So, this would be Spurwing Way and, then, you
get to Balata Court and, then, you come off of Balata Court into this proposed
development. The flag that I pointed out previously would be an emergency access out
to the Ten Mile and Chinden area. Any other access -- direct lot access to that would
be prohibited. The gross residential density is 3.56 dwelling units per acre. The net
density is 4.45 dwelling units per acre. Here is the landscape plan. And we have a
couple of elevations. The Planning and Zoning Commission recommended denial of
this project at their November 16th, 2006, hearing. At that Public Hearing Becky McKay
from Engineering Solutions spoke on behalf of -- or in favor of the project, as did Jock
Hewitt from Spurwing Limited Partnership. Tina Rice, Myron Tucker, Ed Davis. And
they also read a letter by Donna Larsen, the general manager of Spurwing Country
club, on behalf of Spurwing Country club. In opposition were Ron Ashley, Gina Ingle,
and also speaking for other homeowners in Spurwing Subdivision, Byron Brown, who
was also speaking for Beverly Brown, Joy Compton, Bob Treerice, sorry about that. I'm
sure I got it wrong. Grant Peterson and Andrea Nist. Fifteen other people signed their
names on the sign-in sheet provided at the meeting in opposition to the project, but did
not speak during the hearing. No one was just commenting on the application. The key
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December 12, 2006
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issues of discussion by the Commission were the proposed lot size and the transition
from the existing one acre lots along the north boundary. This one's the easiest to see,
I think. The proposed density, the increased traffic, and access onto Chinden
Boulevard and resident opposition to the project. The key Commission changes to the
staff recommendation, Commission did recommend denial of the project. Outstanding
issues for City Council -- because the Commission is recommending denial, you don't
have conditions included in your report. So, the two available actions tonight are denial
or a continuance in order for staff to get conditions of approval. You do not have what
you need to approve this project tonight. The applicant has submitted a revised plat
dated November 22nd, 2006. Since the Commission -- since the Commission hadn't
reviewed that plat -- we did include it, but we didn't -- it addresses some of those
concerns that the Commission and the neighbors had. The primary changes to the
revised plan are that the total lot count was reduced by two building lots to 69 building
lots total. The building lots along the northern boundary have increased in size,
providing more of a transition in lot sizes to the existing one acre lots to the north. The
open space along the northern boundary west of the common area was removed.
Visibility to the common areas located behind the building lots was noted as a concern
by the police department. And some of the attached units originally shown along the
north boundary have been relocated to the west boundary. Staff did look at the revised
plat and all the lots meet the dimensional standards of the proposed R-8 zone.
However, we didn't update the staff report, because that wasn't the Commission's
recommendation. So, you have Commission's recommendation before you tonight.
The police department has not commented on the revised plat, nor has the Commission
reviewed or commented on that plat. Since the staff report was written, we have
received three written testimonies, one from Carol Scott from the Spurwing homeowner,
the general tone of the note there was too many homes being proposed in the small
area. Patrick Haust, president of the Spurwing Homeowners Association who would
like to see density of approximately 30 to 35 homes as originally presented when he
bought his home. And Nichole Black, who is in favor, but concerned about density and
increased traffic, would like to see 40 to 50 homes total. There is also a variance
application. The variance application was for cul-de-sac length. Staff did make findings
for recommending approval of that variance. The constraining factors are -- they are
somewhat self imposed or they were created when the lot was created in the Spurwing
Subdivision, basically. It does have limited access and only has access at this one
location and, then, as noted before, the one going down to Chinden is just an
emergency access. So, that necessitates having an extra long cul-de-sac. With that I
will answer any questions you may have.
De Weerd: Okay. Council, any questions at this point?
Bird: Not at this time, Madam Mayor.
De Weerd: Okay. Is the applicant here? If you will, please, state your name and
address for the record.
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
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McKay: Becky McKay, Engineering Solutions, 1029 North Rosario, Meridian. I'm
representing the applicant on this particular project. Madam Mayor, Members of the
Council, as staff indicated, this is Spurwing Patio Homes. I'd just kind of like to give you
a brief overview of how this property became situated in this fashion that you see before
you. In 1995 application was made to Ada County for a nonfarm development. They
went in and asked for acre lots, which allowed them to develop approximately 25
percent of the property and leaving 75 percent in open space, which became the golf
course and the clubhouse area. What you see here was a platted lot within the
Spurwing Subdivision. They did -- there is a little sliver here and a little sliver over in
this area that was part of the golf course lots. We did go through Ada County and do a
property boundary adjustment to leave land surveying to that duty. So, when the entire
project was designed, they -- the golf course designer laid out these patio homes within
this area, with an access coming off of Balata Court, coming in and looping around in
this fashion. When Mr. Hewitt brought the project to me he brought me a concept that
was part of the original golf course development. He indicated that their overall plan
was to provide a diverse project, but that was, obviously -- this particular phase was
future based on the fact that no public services were available at that time. With this
particular project we feel, now that sewer and water is available, that the city has
extended their area of city impact out to the Phyllis Canal, that we -- this is the
appropriate time for this to be annexed and included within the city and, obviously, be
serviced by the city. You guys updated your Comprehensive Plan in March of '06. This
particular area here was designated medium density residential, which is that obvious
three to eight dwelling units per acre. With what we are proposing before you this
evening -- we have 69 single family dwellings, 38 attached, 31 detached. That's
approximately 3.36 dwelling units per acre as our gross density. In the modifications
that we made of the plan, we have presented to the staff, we sent it to them a couple
weeks ago, I did mail it out to residents within 300 feet. I mailed it out to the parties
which testified at some of the previous hearings to give people an opportunity to look at
it. The changes that were made were based upon some of the concerns expressed by
the neighbors and some reservations that Commission had. The Commission really
struggled with this particular project. They said we like the project, it looks good, we
have seen other golf course projects, we know that diversity in lot sizes, home types, is
common in golf course projects. Cherry Lane golf course, for one, is a prime example
of that. They have varying lot sizes. And so they like this. They ended up
recommending denial based on the overwhelming opposition testimony that came at the
second hearing. The primary problem was the attached dwellings were all located in
this area here. So, what we did is we got together and we have relocated the attached
dwellings on the western boundary here. All of these became 11, 12, 13 thousand
square feet, they ranged from 129 feet in depth up to I think 145. We have attached
dwellings here in this pod and these are all detached here and, then, I have detached in
through here and those are 10,000 and up. And that 10,000 was based on staff's
original review of the project, saying, you know, the attached lots being 4,000, 5,000
square feet, we would prefer to see ten. I left some attached dwelling here. There are
four lots -- or four attached dwellings -- or units with eight total lots located right here,
kind of in this little curve. I did that because this was the area where we had the
greatest separation. Our original plan -- this common area went all along here and,
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December 12, 2006
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then, terminated at this point. It was kind of a linear type open space. The police
department had some concerns about the visibility of that open space, being able to see
it from the roadway, accessibility by the public, even though we -- we are convinced that
that is like passive open space, they had some concern. I did meet with Bob Stowe, I
spent at least an hour with him. We took out some lots here, created what we call view
corridors in through here, and talked about non-sight obscuring fencing or no fencing at
all. We did make a commitment that this would be either wrought iron or no fencing
along here, to give maximum visibility to that area. We were trying to create a
landscape buffer or separation between the acre, more estate lots, and the more urban
lots that we are creating here. Obviously, when we got -- you know, this linear open
space here did not seem to satisfy the neighbors and we went to the detached type
larger lots, then, I utilized that area as part of our depth to get more separation. The
other thing that we proposed is a masonry wall, a six foot stamped concrete masonry
type wall, very similar to what you see at Lochsa Falls along that Linder Road corridor.
That wall would go along this area right through here. And that would also give us
some of that separation. This is a very unusual piece of property, very unique. The fact
that it is -- it has three sides are golf course. The fire department requirement mandates
that if we have 50 lots or greater we have to have a secondary means of access and
that's where the secondary access came about. So, we showed from the beginning a
secondary access coming out here at that Ten Mile alignment. Now, this -- the property
line right now just goes to the center line of Ten Mile. So, I could not make a second
public street connection. I can't make that alignment. So, the second best thing was to
provide the secondary access. Bob Stowe indicated that he could live with that as long
as we gated it here and gated it back a little bit in here, so that we didn't get any people
trying to utilize that for vehicular access. I also spoke in length with Joe Silva. He said
he was comfortable with that secondary access. In fact, he was happy to see it,
because this is only one way in and one way out of Spurwing Subdivision. Now, there
has been a lot of talk about traffic and what capacity is available out there. I did bring
an overhead that I'll give the staff.
Canning: Becky, it's not working.
McKay: Oh, it's not working?
Canning: We got a new computer today and they didn't load the driver for it.
McKay: Okay. I'll go ahead and submit that for the record.
Canning: Mrs. McKay, while you pause for breath, can you, please, use the overhead,
because when you point to the smaller one we can't see where you're pointing to.
Anybody behind you can't see.
McKay: Sure. Yes. That's fine. If you could go back to the vicinity map. Okay.
Spurwing Way is the primary entrance into the subdivision. This is a 40 foot back-to-
back collector type roadway. According to the traffic engineer, those collector
roadways, split median, no front-on housing, can handle six to eight thousand vehicle
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December 12, 2006
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trips a day. We have 70 single family dwellings within Spurwing development. They
are generating 700 vehicle trips a day. Based on the ITE, the golf course -- an 18 hole
golf course, private or public, generates approximately 645 vehicle trips a day. So, the
existing traffic on Spurwing Way here is approximately 1,345 vehicle trips a day.
Leaving an existing available capacity of 4,655 trips per day. What we will add onto this
is 622 trips. So, there is still excess capacity on there. Now, there were comments
made concerning left-hand turns and accessibility on Chinden. Obviously, Chinden -- I
know they have been working on trying to come up with a design for five lanes to
Caldwell, we have been hearing about that for a significant amount of time now and we
anticipate that, eventually, that will take place. Timing -- your guess is probably as good
as mine. In consulting with the traffic engineers the new signal at Lochsa Falls
entrance, which is the half mile, will create gaps in that traffic, especially for that
westbound traffic, therefore, allowing that left-hand turn to be easier. The fact that this
entrance is not at the half mile and was done, you know, back in 1995, I don't ,know how
that can be corrected. But the signalization, according to the traffic engineers should
help. As far as Balata Court, if you notice our entrance comes out right here as Balata
Court, which is a local street, just begins. Local streets, we try to keep those volumes
under 1,000 trips a day. So, the existing traffic with the 17 lots on Balata Court is 170
trips a day. That allows for 830 vehicle trips as excess capacity. We will be adding at
the front end here 622 trips. So, we would not exceed the threshold of Balata Court as
a local street. This project -- and like I told the Commission -- is unique. We always
have difficulty when we come in to areas as urban services are extended, as city limits
are extended, and we have estate acre lots or larger. Obviously, trying to make that
transition from that urban -- or rural to urban. We believe that the density of 3.36
dwelling units per acre is a reasonable density. When we are seeing what -- you know,
what other projects have out there, this particular project has a lot of attributes that we
don't see in other projects. One, it has that existing open space that's already been
created. There is over 200 acres in there in that golf course area throughout that that's
under Pacific Links Partnership. With the unusual shape and with the access that I
have, I feel that we have done the best that we can do to interface with the project.
Moving the attached dwellings to the west, locating them within the pod, these homes
we estimate will be high end. I mean these are going to be luxury homes. These are
not your low end type units. We believe that these will be between 300 and 400
thousand for each of the attached units. They will range from 1,200 to 1,800 square
feet. And the detached will be 1,200 to 4,000 square feet and probably start at about
550,000 and go on up. If Anna could put the elevations -- Mr. Hewitt did go to a
designer and have some elevations done. The elevation that you're looking at was just,
obviously, the first draft of the attached unit. As you can see visually in looking at it, it
looks very similar to a detached home. You have to look hard. And I have seen these
types of dwellings built in Idaho Falls, California. Driving by them you -- if you notice the
second driveway, then, you notice, oh, gees, there is two dwellings there and they are
attached. This is the garage. You'd have a driveway coming in this way and, then,
another driveway coming in on the other side. That's the detached unit. Mr. Hewitt is
going to have very strict covenants as far as the looks of these. These lots aren't going
to be sold to builders and be just a hodge podge of designs and styles, they will all be
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December 12, 2006
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consistent in this particular design with stucco, tiled roofs, and consistent in their look
and color.
De Weerd: Mrs. McKay, please, wrap up your comments.
McKay: Yes, ma'am. I'd like the Council to take a look at this project from a different
perspective. This is unique and if you have ever been to golf courses around the
country, you see that there are varying types of lots and homes and it does work, we do
have a good separation here, and I think that we have done a good job. Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. Any questions for the applicant at this time?
Bird: Madam Mayor. Becky, on your new preliminary plat you enlarged some -- the lots
that back up against the existing one acre lots, which I would imagine, what are they,
about 150 foot wide by, what, 275 or 300 to the acre lots. How wide is your lots? Are
you saying you had 12, 15 thousand square foot? What's the width?
McKay: Our lots are ranging from -- it looks like the widest ones along that corridor are
approximately 90 feet wide and they go from 86, 83, and, then, we have those pie
shaped lots.
Bird: Okay.
McKay: And they are approximately a hundred and I think 29, all the way up to 145 in
depth.
Bird: Thanks.
De Weerd: Okay. Anything further. Thank you. Okay. I do have a number of people
who have signed up to indicate support or opposition and I will preface announcing
these names with please don't hold it against me if I mispronounce your name. And I
will take corrections. Chuck Compton. Signed up against. And when I read your name,
if you would like to provide testimony, if you will come forward at that time or we will
read this into the record, so if that's sufficient we will move on. Okay. Ron Ashley
signed up against. Okay. If you will, please, state your name and address for the
reco rd.
Ashley: I'm Ron Ashley, 6851 North Penncross Way Meridian, Spurwing Subdivision.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Ashley: Council Members. Mayor. I had two problems with this before, I still have two
problems with it. The traffic being the major problem. They have said that it would help
the westbound traffic -- Lochsa Falls stop light east to us is about 175 yards.
Eastbound is still going to be a mess. Basically, we are doubling the traffic in there.
The other thing is when I built my home there five, six years ago, I was told by the
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December 12, 2006
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seller's agent that there would 35 condos going into that area there and the
representative happened to be the developer's wife that told me that, so -- and told a lot
of the other people that live out there, too. So, that seems to be forgotten somewhere
along the way here. So, I recommend that you vote no against this.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. Ed Davis signed up for.
Davis: Madam Mayor, City Council, Ed Davis, marketing director, Spurwing Country
club. on November 16th --
De Weerd: If you can give your address, too.
Davis: 6800 North Spurwing Way, Meridian.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Davis: On November 16th we presented a letter on behalf of Spurwing Country club
supporting the development of the piece of property and, once again, would like to add
our support toward that.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. Larry Harpe signed up for.
Harpe: Larry Harpe, 1092 Surewater, Eagle.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Harpe: I bought a lot in Spurwing in about 2000 and just wanted to come forward and
say that I sold that lot a couple years ago, because my wife and I felt it was too big, we
did not want to buy an executive lot and an executive house, but we were told that
condos, townhouses, would come into play sometime down the road. And, of course,
we are anxious to buy a condo or a townhouse in this area, because the club is
spectacular. And I guess hearing what's going on with the community, I would strongly
recommend that you defer this back to the Commission and that the applicant seriously
look at reducing the number of units a little bit. But I think there needs to be a good size
number for this to pencil out and make sense. The second thing is that Spurwing is
clearly probably the best club in the area. To have it annexed to Meridian I think would
be a huge benefit to Meridian and I think that's really important, and I'm sensitive to the
community that lives there. I'm not sure if I had a one acre executive house I would
want a bunch of small lots next to me. But the way this is designed I think it works, I
think it fits, and I support what's being proposed.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Tina Rice for.
Rice: Madam Mayor, Council, my name is Tina Rice and I live at 2851 Balata Court.
I'm on the north boundary of this project. I have the executive lot. One acre lot. And
I'm also a realtor and I'm also related to the developer. But, believe me, I wouldn't be
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December 12, 2006
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standing here supporting this if it had any way that I thought it would devalue my
executive lot and home. I support this project. I think it's well planned and I wish it well.
De Weerd: Thank you. Bailey Nix signed up for.
Nix: Good evening, Madam Mayor and Councilmembers.
De Weerd: You can pull that down a little bit. Thank you.
Nix: How is that?
De Weerd: Great.
Nix: My wife and I moved to Meridian --
De Weerd: Mr. Nix, if you can also give your name and address.
Nix: Sure. Excuse me. Bailey Nix is my name. My wife Lita here is -- well, we live at
12723 West Sage Creek Drive.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Nix: We moved to Meridian in 1979 and bought an executive lot, built the house, and
we have enjoyed living in Meridian for years. Unfortunately, we were annexed into
Boise a few years back. It's our desire, as we grow older, to find a place smaller to live
and we think this development is just what we are looking for or one like it would be
great in our consideration. So, we hope that you will approve it, it will get built, and it
will be in consideration for us in the future. Thank you, ma'am.
De Weerd: Thank you. Debbie Kelly signed up for.
Kelly: Madam Mayor and Council, Deborah Kelly. K-e-I-I-y. 6971 North Spurwing Way.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Kelly: We live in the Spurwing Subdivision, which is a very lovely subdivision. We
started researching it in 1997, we knew from the get go that patio homes were going to
be there. We even have a plot plan that is stating that from 1998 that future
development was going in. We chose not to be by that, simply because we were aware
of it and decided that we would rather be on a different fairway. We think that
everything that Spurwing has done, including their entrances and so forth, has been first
class. The developer Jock Hewitt and his wife live in Spurwing. We would see no
reason that they would take their beautiful home and cause the real estate value to go
down in any way. I don't think that any of our real estate values have gone down. We
have always been aware of this and we think it will be a first class subdivision with
fabulous design guidelines. Thank you.
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December 12, 2006
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De Weerd: Thank you.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: I'm sorry--
Borton: If I could ask you one quick question.
Kelly: Me?
Borton: Yeah. Sorry. I was trying to catch you before you ran down. When you make
reference to being aware of the patio homes in this location, were you also told any
particular numbers of patio homes or any density?
Kelly: You know, we have lived in other private communities in other states and we just
knew that we didn't want to be by additional houses, so it really wasn't a concern how
many there were going to be. It just wasn't something we wanted to do. So, we live on
another street in Spurwing. But we do also know -- well, I will add to it. Our neighbors
have left and moved to the state of Florida, but they plan on moving back and buying
one of these patio homes, because they enjoy Spurwing and the patio homes are right
up their alley.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes.
Borton: I take it that's a no?
Kelly: Yeah. No, we didn't -- we didn't -- didn't care.
Borton: Okay. Fair enough. Thanks.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Monte McClure signed up for.
McClure: Madam Mayor and Council, my name is Monte McClure. I live at 2626 West
Penick Pointe Lane in Spurwing. We bought there in '95. We were probably, I think,
about the third people to buy a lot in Spurwing. We knew at the time that we bought
that there was going to be patio homes, townhouses, something -- I don't recall that
there was ever a number placed on that. There may have been, but I don't recall that
number. In 1995 I figured it would be 20 years before we'd have sewer -- the City of
Meridian would ever get there with sewer and I knew that sewer would be necessary in
order to get more density in that piece. It's come a lot quicker than we anticipated, but I
think it will be a very good project. It looks good. The pictures of the houses that Jock's
going to build look nice, I think it will be a very nice addition to the City of Meridian and
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December 12, 2006
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to the area. It will be good .- it will be good for the golf club, for the country club, and I
recommend your approval. And I will stand for questions.
De Weerd: You know, it's just too good to pass up.
McClure: Oh, no.
De Weerd: We talk about 20-26 corridor and we have gone through a plan of that
corridor and we are hoping that ITD board will recommend putting that on a priority list
for improvements. What is the plan for that?
McClure: Well, as you know, Mayor, there is a corridor study going on now and a
corridor preservation committee that you and I both sit on, that is -- is trying figure out,
with public involvement, what people want, what we need in that 20-26 corridor. I can't
answer the question. It will be a five lane facility, I'm positive. I'm fairly positive of that.
Through this area I don't think there is ever going to be enough room to have a divided
type highway or expressway, it will probably be a five lane facility with center turn lanes.
Out further west on towards Caldwell I think we will get -- we may still be in time to have
a divided expressway type -- type facility. Time line? I don't know. Our funding
situation is such that -- that I don't know when we are going to have enough money to
build that particular piece of highway, but I travel it every day and it is getting bad. I
don't ever get jammed up at the intersection of Spurwing Way and Chinden, other than
the traffic on Chinden. It's not the traffic on Spurwing that causes the problem, it's the
traffic on Chinden. I guess I can't pass this opportunity either. The transportation board
has made a recommendation to the governor to raise fees and fuel taxes in order to
build facilities like this and I would hope that this Council supports that issue and I hope
that the audience here learns more about the issue itself and supports it. I have to -- I
would be remiss if I didn't thank the City of Meridian for all their efforts in helping us
maintain the access that we do have or restrict the access onto our state highways
within the City of Meridian on both Eagle Road and Chinden Boulevard.
De Weerd: Well, we did supply a letter to your board chairman of our support of your
recommendations for funding and we did cc the governor and our congressional
delegation. So, we wish you luck on that and we will be there cheering you on.
McClure: We need a little bit more than cheering, we need somebody up there
hammering on the legislature.
De Weerd: I'll dust off my knees.
McClure: All right. Thank you, Mayor.
De Weerd: Thank you. Paul Seidmeyer signed up for.
Seidmeyer: Good evening, Madam Mayor and Members of the Council, my name is
Paul Seidmeyer, live at 2680 South Loftus Way in Meridian. I have lived in Meridian for
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December 12, 2006
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15 years and Boise before that. I'm a member of Spurwing Country club and I'm on the
board. I have belonged there for ten years and at the time my family and I joined
Spurwing we still had children at home, but in talking with Jock and Charlene early on,
we always knew there was a possibility of a project on that ground there and we look
forward to purchasing one of those units. We are empty nesters over the last few years
and we think it's a very good project. I'm not here in an official capacity for the
Spurwing board, but my personal opinion is that this project would be very good for
Spurwing, because of Jock's intentions of making a membership of some capacity --
there are several different kinds of memberships, but there would be some linkage
between the owner in this development and Spurwing, which would be nothing but
helpful to the club. But, you know, we have all seen the quality of the work that Jock
and Charlene have delivered so far and I think that the fact that this land has been in
the Hewitt family since 1880 says to me that these are no Johnny come latelys, they
have shown excellent stewardship over the resource and I would urge your approval of
this project.
De Weerd: Thank you. Brent Kelly signed up for. I'm sorry, sir, if you have testimony I
will need it on the record.
B.Kelly: My name is Brent Kelly.
De Weerd: I'm sorry, you will also need to step up to the microphone.
B.Kelly: My name is Brent Kelly, 6971 North Spurwing Way.
De Weerd: Thank you.
B.Kelly: And my wife has already spoken to you in regards to our joint belief and
support in the project. I will answer Joe's question, though. I sat in the initial
presentation when we discussed the number of units that was to be proposed and it
was somewhere 50 and 55. So, initially, when we bought -- my point here is that we
knew approximately how many that they were going to be and they are consistent with
what's being proposed.
De Weerd: Thank you, sir. Okay. Joe Olsen signed up for. Okay. Stephanie
Stevenson. Stevenson. Signed up against.
Stevenson: Hi, my name is Stephanie Stevenson. 3075 West Balata Court. I'm the
last house on the end back there. And when we bought our home three years ago, I
was told by our realtor and by Mr. Davis that there were going to be 35 to 40 condos,
townhomes in that area, and it's not -- it's not the quality that I dispute, it's quantity. I
have no doubt that it will be nice and classy, as is everything in our neighborhood, but I
feel like it's too many. That's alii have to say.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Richard and Marie Crist. There is not an indication for
or against or neutral. No comment. Thank you, sir. Andrea Nist signed up against.
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
Page 21 of 52
Nist: Andrea Nist. 2932 West Balata Court. Good evening, Mayor and Councilmen.
I'm here on behalf of a lot of the neighbors to discuss -- to save time, so some us I
thought I would just talk. I'm here tonight to ask the City Council to please concur with
the staff and the commissioners and deny this project as presented based on the
following: First, Spurwing is a private 18 hole golf course and country club with
approximately 70 single family homes on one acre lots. This plan as presented does
not fit well within our neighborhood due to the lack of the transition density. By
squeezing a 70 unit neighborhood within our neighborhood will negatively impact our
property values. The staff's report states, quote: The design of the development does
not fit well into this established area. Second, Spurwing is not just a neighborhood of 70
homes. We are a country club with golf and swimming facilities. The golf club last year
had 22,000 rounds of golf played, not including tournaments and charity events. Every
Wednesday in the spring and summer there is a men's league that has over a hundred
men playing. These men drive from work, all the cars are stacked up on -- I don't know
if they can go back to the picture of the main Spurwing Way. On Spurwing Way from
the corner of Penncross almost up to Balata there are cars stacked on Spurwing Way.
The cars overflow on Spurwing Way and Penncross every week posing safety
concerns. This corner is also a designated bus stop for the elementary school where
children come home about the start of the men's league. During tournaments the cars
also back up onto Salata. This 70 unit development will add 150 to 200 cars, doubling
the size of our neighborhood. This increase in traffic to a neighborhood that still only
has one entrance and exit onto a very congested Chinden is a detriment to our
neighborhood. We all bought a lifestyle, we did not buy a feeder road or 6,000 cars.
Property owners purchased lots and both residences in good faith, based on the
existing R-R zoning designation for Spurwing Country Club and the open space
included in the subdivision. At the time the applicant told buyers and has maintained up
until very recently that he planned to build approximately 30 patio homes on this
property, with the extra acreage being devoted to open space. I respectfully ask the
Council to also review the record of the Commissioners meeting from the numerous
homeowners who were also told that there would only be around 30 of these patio
homes. Patio Homes -- we looked up the definition. The definition of a patio home is a
detached single family home with no common wall. It describes duplexes as two units
having one shared common wall. The applicant promised patio homes, not duplexes.
The applicant also stated at a previous meeting in our neighborhood that this
neighborhood would be gated and would have no impact on our neighborhood and they
would have their own entrance. It is also our understanding that neither of these
aspects of the project will occur. It is generally perceived that a development is
supposed to improve the land, but in this case with this much density, it will not improve
this land. We were all told that there would be much open space saved. Thank you
very much.
De Weerd: Thank you. Amy Jorgensen signed up against. Okay. Thank you. Okay.
Alexa --
Gillihan: Alexa Gillihan.
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
Page 22 of 52
De Weerd: I didn't know if that was a G or an A or -- so, thank you for filling in the blank
Gillihan: Yes. My name is Lexy Gillihan. I live at 2947 West Balata Court. My lot
backs up to the high density area.
De Weerd: There is a pointer on there if you wish.
Gillihan: Is there a pointer? It is that lot right there.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you.
Gillihan: Just a little history about me. I have lived in Idaho my whole life. I have
moved four times, which is kind of unusual. When we were looking for a lot to raise our
family and -- or a residential area, it took us two years and we looked everywhere.
Eagle. Meridian. Everywhere. And this area looked best for my husband and I. I
mean he could golf, I could raise my kids, and we talked to the developer and they said
there is going to be 70 homes and that was it. I was concerned -- we were looking at
three different lots. One was on the rim. One was on the other side of Balata Court.
And the previous lot that we have right now is one he's looking at. My concern was I did
not want to be on the golf course dodging golf balls, so we chose the lot we have now
and my concern was what was going behind us. So, at that time I asked Jock and
Charlene -- I asked them what was going to go back there. They told me at that time
nothing. They had nothing planned, nothing was going to go back there. They said
possibly tennis courts. At that point I asked them for a master plan. They gave me one
and I'd like to submit this. Which does not have roads that Becky said were on the
original master plan. The other point that I'd like to make is on our website -- the
Spurwing website it's quoted and it's still on there, if you go on our website it says: Be
one of the original 70. Phase one and two and three are sold out. The fourth and final
is now open and available for reservations. Of the 70 lots at Spurwing, 80 percent are
sold and remaining premier will not -- or the -- yeah, the premier lots will not last. And
I'd like to submit that, too. When we bought our lot there was -- when we were talking to
Jock and Charlene, they were marketing Spurwing as open spaces. It's going to be
unique.
De Weerd: I'm sorry. If you could wrap up.
Gillihan: Okay. Well, I have some quotes from Jock. The decision to seek permission
to build a golf course came through the family's desire to retain the natural look of the
land and minimize housing on it, Hewitt said. It just preserves things for time, Hewitt
said. Number two. Hewitt says in building the course we want to preserve as much
open space as possible. Of the 385 acres, 86 acres or 22 percent will go to the
residential use and 299 acres or 78 percent for open space, which includes 230 acres of
golf course, 69 acres of habitat and wetlands, lakes, meadows, streams, embellish the
property.
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
Page 23 of 52
De Weerd: I'm sorry. I will have to ask you to--
Gillihan: Well, I have some more and I'd like to submit that.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you.
Gillihan: Thank you.
De Weerd: Council, any questions? Okay. Nate Jorgensen signed up against.
Jorgensen: Hi. My name is Nate Jorgensen. My address 2992 West Balata Court in
the Spurwing Subdivision. Just to reference the documents that Lexy provided were
from the Idaho Statesman detailing what was public record at that point on what was
going to take place on the number of lots, which I think, again, is consistent with the 30
or so that other homeowners have described as a total amount, as opposed to the 70 or
so that he proposed. Thank you.
De Weerd: Thank you. Ed Duke signed up against. Okay. Thank you. Gerald Bailey
signed up against. Thank you. Anna Mae Bailey. Against as well. Okay. Gary Ackre.
Okay. Signed up as neutral. Paul Seidmeyer. Signed up for. I believe we have
already heard from Paul. Jim Johnson signed up for. Okay. Claire -- thank you.
Signed up against. As well as Bob. Okay. Morton Hardwood. Okay. Signed up for.
Those are the people who have signed up. If there is anyone who would like to provide
testimony please come forward. If you will, please, state your name and address.
C.Hewitt: Thank you, Mayor and Councilmen. I'm Charlene Hewitt. I'm the sales
manager. I sold the lots. And I'm -- my husband is the developer and I will swear on a
stack of Bibles right here, strike me dead, that when I sold the lots originally -- now,
Andrea Nist rebought hers from a realtor, not me. Any of the re-buys I can't swear on.
But I always told them there was future development back there on that piece of ground
and I didn't -- could not say whether they would be one story, two story, or whatever or
we are going to run cows back there, you know, which we could. And in this -- I would
like to submit -- it says right there --
De Weerd: Ma'am, I do need you to speak into the microphone. Okay.
C.Hewitt: It says right on that plat future development and when I talked to every one of
them I told them there was future development back there, we are planning on some
sort of something like patio homes -- I could not say how many, one story, two story, or
whatever, but down the road we were going to have development back there. That's
why all the lots on Balata Court that border up to that land we sold cheap.
De Weerd: Okay. Council, any questions?
Bird: I have none.
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
Page 24 of 52
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Rountree--
C.Hewitt: So, anybody who said that I said 30 to 35 lots, 50, 55 lots, are lying, because
I did not. Because we didn't have even a plan for this. You know, we just knew we
were going to do something, but we didn't have any number or whether it be two story,
four story, 15 story, whatever. Thank you.
De Weerd: Thank you. Councilman Rountree does have a question for you.
C.Hewitt: Yes.
Rountree: I have a document that was submitted as testimony. Attached to it I believe
is your business card and it shows Spurwing master plan. I have no idea of a date, I
don't have any idea if this was part of a package, but I --
C.Hewitt: That was part of a package.
Rountree: -- guess I'm just asking you if you would verify that that, in fact, is a part of
marketing documentation.
C.Hewitt: This is -- and it's just for the lots that we had for sale at the time. I would also
like to comment as far as the website goes, we have no control over the website. That
is through the club. We are not connected with it. All we tell them is what lots are sold
and what are not. What are available. And they do the website.
Rountree: Thank you. We will need that back. Part of the additional submission was
your website information and it does reflect what you have provided in terms of
testimony, that that area would be future development, so --
De Weerd: Okay. Yes, sir.
Moritson: My name is Rick Moritson. I live on 3028 West Balata Court. I submitted an
e-mail also. I wasn't sure if I was going to make it tonight, but I'm going to, more or less,
read what I submitted. I live on Balata, the street adjacent connected to the proposed
patio home development that is to be discussed in tonight's meeting. I would like to
state for the record that I believe the current proposal is too high of a density.
Obviously, there was no guarantee, but when I was told -- what I was told when I
purchased my lot prior to building that there would be in the neighborhood of 30 to 35
patio homes built on the acreage between Balata and Chinden. I would like to state
from Charlene's commentary that I did hear from her that there would be building back
there. I cannot tell you whether she told me a number or not. I did hear a number of
30, 35 from the person who built my home for me that purchased the lot from the
Hewitts. I'd also like to state that in that Statesman article I think there was a quote in
there from Jock quoting 19 patio homes. The current proposal will add too much traffic
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
Page 25 of 52
entering and exiting at the head of my street and I feel it does not integrate very well
with the one acre home sites currently within Spurwing. I'm also concerned that the
proposed patio home development will have its own homeowners association and
covenants. There is no guarantee that these covenants will all be held to the same high
standards that the other homeowners of Spurwing abide. I'm okay with a patio home
development, but it needs to be more reasonable, 30 to 40 residents or families. A
single duplex style home, which may only appear as one structure, I have no problem
with, but it still counts as two residences or families when it comes to traffic and noise.
Thank you.
De Weerd: Thank you. Any other testimony? Yes, sir.
Brown: My name is Byron Brown. I didn't get my name on the list, because I think it
was snatched just before I got here.
De Weerd: That's all right. You don't have to be on there to speak.
Brown: Basically, 1--
De Weerd: If you will, please, though --
Brown: Oh. Excuse me. Bryon Brown. 7019 North Penncross Way, Meridian, Idaho.
Spurwing Subdivision.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Brown: Basically, I think you have heard all the arguments about density and traffic and
all of those things and I think my final point is process. There is a process where all of
these things are submitted, they went to the Planning and Zoning Commission, all the
arguments were heard, staff had voted against it, the Commission voted against it, fair
hearings have been held -- and even the Supreme Court says you don't get a perfect
trial, you just need a fair one. Okay? So, basically, I think we have all had our say, the
Commission's had its say, and I think the process has been carried out and I think that
should be the end of it. Thank you.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Any further testimony before I ask the applicant for
rebuttal remarks? Okay. If there is no further public testimony, would the applicant like
to come forward.
McKay: Becky McKay. Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I'd like to state a few
items and, then, I would like to turn the podium over to Mr. Hewitt, since a lot of the
comments, obviously, stem from the purchase of the lots over ten years ago, which I
was not involved in the original Spurwing development, so I cannot address those
issues.
De Weerd: Okay. You do have five minutes for your wrap up.
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
Page 26 of 52
McKay: Thank you. I guess what I would like the Council to focus on is the fact that
this year you guys did a reanalysis and your staff of that north Meridian area, looking at
designations, expanding that area to the Phyllis Canal. This particular piece of property
was designated medium density residential. Now, if we look at some of the other
projects that have been approved in this area, what we are requesting with the R-8
designation and the density, just a little over three, is not out of the ordinary. Irvine
Subdivision just south right across the street was approved as an R-8 designation. You
have Knight Sky Subdivision to the east, you guys gave them R-4, R-15, and C-C
designations. The Tree Farm to the west, they were given different designations. They
have higher density up toward Chinden. I mean we all know at some point in time
Chinden will be five lanes. We need to, you know, look at the whole picture and look at
this project. There have been comments about there should be no more than 30 units
on this property. No more than 40. If we had 30 units on this property, that would be
.68 dwelling units per acre. I mean it just doesn't -- I mean it doesn't make a lot of
sense. There are certain thresholds economically that we look at. If you drop below
that threshold, then, it doesn't -- it won't pencil out. We look at -- we look at these
projects and we try to come up with what we believe is a density that is supported by
the Comp Plan, that transportation capacity exists to support, which we have
demonstrated that there is capacity out there, and that is consistent with the other
projects that have been approved along this corridor. I think by dropping our density
along that north boundary, I think we have demonstrated that we are trying to make an
adjustment here to meet in the middle. We still have about eight units right here that
are attached. Obviously, it's up to the Council. Maybe they feel that those units there, if
you removed four of them, then, they would be identical to all the ones along that north
boundary. We feel that this is a good project. It is consistent with what we see in other
golf courses around the country. I have -- no golf course just has only acre lots. They
all have varying densities, because you have this enormous amount of open space that
supports different lifestyles and different lot sizes and the Comprehensive Plan supports
that. Finally, your own staff in the staff report states: The proposed development is
generally compatible with the existing single family residential properties to the north in
that they are both residential. They are both residential. That is one thing we got to
remember. Staff recommends that a minimum of 10,000 square feet be provided along
the north boundary of this property to effectively transition to an urban density proposed
-- urban densities proposed. We have enlarged all of those. There are 10, 11, 12, 13,
with the exception of these. They could easily be made ten, if that would be the will of
the Commission. Staff finds that the requested zoning designations contribute to the
variety of residential zoning categories in this area and is generally consistent with the
Comprehensive Plan designation for the site. Staff generally believes that the density
proposed with this project is appropriate. Is appropriate. I mean even though the
finding was for denial, I think we need to look at these other facts, because that
Comprehensive Plan, that is guiding the growth. That is our guiding document. And I'll
turn it over to Mr. Hewitt. Thank you.
Hewitt: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council --
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
Page 27 of 52
De Weerd: Mr. Hewitt, I'm sorry, your time is very short. Although your representative
talked very fast, she still took a lot of time.
Hewitt: I will try to be brief.
De Weerd: Okay.
Hewitt: My name is Jock Hewitt, I live at 7212 North Spurwing Way. I have been
spoken for by everybody in the crowd tonight I feel like. You know, did I say all that? I
want to preface my remarks by saying that I have been asked how many patio homes or
what's going on there ever since we started this project in 1993, 1994. I have always
said I really don't know and talked about numbers, but I said it just depends on what the
plan is. This is the first plan we have ever done for this property, detailed plan, and so
until you do a plan like that, you really do not know, but everybody we sold a lot to,
whether they lived in that general area or anywhere else, knew there were going to be
patio homes in there. It's no surprise to anyone else. And so that -- those are my
remarks. I think this is a great project. This property has been in our family since 1880
and we have taken very good care of it and this is a fine addition to Spurwin9 and a
tremendous addition to the City of Meridian, which we have been a part of for all these
years. Thank you.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Council, any information needed from staff or the
applicant at this point? Okay. The public testimony has been concluded, so if you're
ready to move on, I would entertain a motion to close the Public Hearing.
Bird: Madam Mayor, I'm not. I got a question for Becky or--
De Weerd: Becky, Mr. Bird, has a question for you.
Bird: To verify what she -- I thought I heard her say. Along the north there where you --
and we can't hardly see this new revised plan, because you could take some lot out and
make those at least a minimum of 10,000.
McKay: Madam Mayor, Councilman Bird, the lot lines are kind light. I do apologize. All
along here these are 11, 12, and, then, here these are 10,000 square feet all along
here. What you're looking at here is an example of a structure and, then, this is an
example of the two units attached. I have eight -- there are eight lots here, four
buildings that are attached. If I eliminate the lot line in between those, eliminate four
units, then, these would be -- meet that 10,000.
Bird: And, Becky, as you have known on some of your other projects, we have always
tried when we backed up to a larger lot, we have always tried to get somewhat close.
We know we are not going to get the 44,000 acres -- or feet that they have in their one
acre lots, but, you know, 10,000 isn't even a quarter of that, but it is -- you know, it's
much better than having four or five of them next to an acre lot. You answered my
question. Thank you.
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
Page 28 of 52
McKay: Madam Mayor, Councilman Bird, we did feel that with that landscaping and the
masonry wall that we were adding additional buffering, which we typically don't see
when we are just sticking straight lots up there, so we are trying to kind of almost double
up on creating that separation and that buffer. Thank you.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I have a question.
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: Mrs. McKay, would there be an objection for consideration of a duel zoning,
as oppose to all R-8? Most of your larger lots are R-4.
McKay: Yes, sir.
Rountree: That alleviates some issue of if, in fact, this were to change hands in total
that, then, you would, then, have another round of -- well, it's R-8, therefore, you could
put eight lots per acre, so I'm just asking is that something that would be acceptable?
McKay: Madam Mayor, Councilman Rountree, the Council has done that on some of
my other projects. I believe Cardigan Bay was one of them, where we adjoined acre
lots and I believe that as a compromise to insure that these lots would remain that
adjoined the larger lots bigger, you had us write a legal description that encompassed
that area as R-4 and, then, this was -- would be the R-8 -- this would be the R-8 area
here where we have the attached. So, we could separate the product via zoning if that
would make the Council more comfortable. It's not problematic and we could meet
those standards, yes.
Rountree: Thank you.
De Weerd: Any other questions from Council? Okay. Okay. Council, any further
information needed?
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I don't have any at this point in time, but I suspect as we start
discussing this we might, so I don't know what the Council's preference is, whether we
close or we discuss and if we can see where we are going and, then, close, as opposed
to close, reopen, close, reopen, that sort of thing.
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree, I think discussion at this point is appropriate.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes.
Rountree: My discussion initially is going to be along the lines of process. One
individual, Mr. Brown, talked about process and for clarification for the audience,
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
Page 29 of 52
Planning and Zoning and staff are recommending bodies. City Council makes the final
decision. So, the process is not over, in spite of the fact that there has already been
one Public Hearing, it is a two hearing process, and potentially more, so as that
comment, I have a question for Mr. Nary. We have before us a plan that is somewhat
different than what was presented to staff originally and different than Planning and
Zoning saw. It seems to me that the plan -- the new plan was a plan to address some
of the issues that we have had before us in the past in terms transition. Just had the
comment that we potentially could up zone or down zone, however you want to look at
it, and have multiple zones within one particular annexation, so from a process
standpoint can we make a final decision at this point without submitting it back through
Planning and Zoning -- and I ask that knowing that in some instances when we have
seen this sort of -- in most instances when we see this sort of change, which is a
positive change from what was presented previously, we have taken action. I guess I
just need some comfort there in terms of your perspective of does this constitute a
significant change.
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, Councilmember Rountree -- and it is
within your -- the Council's discretion as to how significant the change is. Here you
have had a plat change, you are looking at a zone change -- again, it's not automatically
required. The staff analysis has all been geared around a recommend of denial. They
did ask for findings at the Planning and Zoning Commission level at one stage of
conditions for approval based on a different proposal. Ultimately that was still denied.
So, I don't think staff has done any analysis over the changes that are being requested
or the zone change that's being considered. So, you might want to ask Mrs. Canning,
but there is certainly a lot of information that's been developed to this point that might
make the Council lean towards a remand and a revisit in front of the Planning and
Zoning Commission. I don't know if Mrs. Canning has a different perspective.
Canning: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, Councilmember Rountree, we can
develop those conditions of approval for your consideration without it going back to the
Planning and Zoning Commission, but I would like to point out that those other projects
where you have made what would seem to be a significant change, those all came
forward with a recommendation for approval from the Planning and Zoning Commission,
not denial. So, this is a little different in that aspect that we haven't had an application
come forward with a recommendation for denial in some time. It would seem
appropriate to me to go back to the Planning and Zoning Commission in this instance,
to let them review the revised plan given that past recommendation.
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Nary.
Nary: I could make a different point in regards to process, because it hasn't been
discussed greatly and if there is certainly other concerns that Council has about that,
the hearing is still open. You can address it -- on that map it's not shown very clearly,
but the connection point to the city is a service road that's a private drive. If it was a
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
Page 30 of 52
public road this wouldn't -- we wouldn't be allowed to annex this property in this fashion,
because the state law prohibits us using a roadway as the connection point. Because
it's a private road it would be allowed, but the only connection to the city is that small
sliver that goes from the western boundary of the property to Chinden. So, the entire
parcel that we are looking to annex is an enclave in sort of the reverse sense and this
Council in the past has been very reluctant to use this process to annex parcels in this
manner. So, since you were discussing process, I don't know if all you have thought of
that or considered that, but if -- again, if -- it is allowed, it is legal to do it this way. It
wouldn't be if that road was public, but it is a very small connection to the city and we
haven't annexed other properties in this fashion before.
De Weerd: Anna, I guess that just raised -- I don't know. I think I get sometimer's
disease and I don't know if I dream things or they really happen, but did we not discuss
the annexation on this and was discussion about annexing some of the holes along the
fairway and was that during the Comprehensive Plan testimony? I guess I just
remember discussions about that and maybe I should be asking Mr. Hewitt that.
Canning: No, ma'am, you asked the right person. Madam Mayor, Members of the
Council, I did come to you -- I did not speak about the development proposal at all. The
only question I had for you, because I didn't want the applicant to invest several months
into a process -- I did ask you for -- I asked Mr. Nary for legal advice on whether it was a
shoe string annexation and allowed at all. There was -- he informed me it was okay, but
I asked Council would you be in favor of an annexation path that had this form. Your
answer was -- well, I believe two of the Council members answered that that did not
seem to be enough of an annexation path. I relayed that information back to the
applicant, they went forward with the application without adding a golf course lot to it,
but I did ask you that question without raising any of the development proposal itself, I
just asked a question of the shape and form of the annexation.
De Weerd: Thank you for keeping my sanity intact.
Canning: It wasn't a bad dream or a dream.
De Weerd: So, Council, do you have questions for the applicant, further information
needed from staff?
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I can make a comment now or make a comment later, it
doesn't matter to me the status of the hearing.
De Weerd: Okay.
Rountree: Given what I see with the -- with the new submission, it seems consistent
with what we have done with this issue of density and adjacent rural or estate size lots,
typically we are dealing with lots that are two to ten acres and normally are around three
to five acres when we run into this situation and we have required larger lots adjacent to
those in terms of transition that are consistent with an R-4 lot and typically we get the
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
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response that's like this where it's in excess of the now 6,000 square feet, but I'm dated
by thinking that it used to 8,000 square feet, but they are typically 10,000 feet to 17,000
square feet that are adjacent to the ranchettes and the larger lot subdivisions that are in
Ada County. So, in that regard I see that the proposal here is responsive to that -- the
new proposal is. I don't necessarily see and I can't speak for the Planning and Zoning
and staff, that that was necessarily the case when they had the initial information on this
particular project. So, that's my observation on the newness here. As far as the
annexation question, I don't know what the status of that particular hole of golf is that
borders Chinden, but if it's identified as a lot, it could be annexed in with this particular
request and there would be no question as to whether it's appropriate or not, beings that
most of the property across the street is within the city limits of the City of Meridian.
Canning: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, the golf course is on platted lots. It's
part of the original Spurwing plat.
Rountree: And that results in a question for the applicant. Is that something that they
would consider? I see some heads shaking, but we like it on the record.
De Weerd: Okay. We do need it on the record and so if you would, please, state your
name.
Hewitt: My name is Jock Hewitt. I reside at 7212 North Spurwing Way. And I would
say, yes, that's something we would definitely consider.
Rountree: Thank you. Madam Mayor, I don't have anymore to say about either
clarification or confusing this particular matter. I don't think I can create anymore
questions in my mind, so --
De Weerd: Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: Madam Mayor, I'll see if I can help Councilman Rountree create some more
questions. I will agree with Councilman Rountree's initial assessment and some of the
negotiation that's gone on and agree with a split zoning on the property may provide
some protection for buffering of density to the neighboring lots. The one issue that I
have had and clearly remember the meeting where the annexation path was discussed,
is the issue of secondary access and, really, the annexation path that provides some
problems for me, initially provided some problems for the fire department as we heard
testimony from the applicant on. It would seem that -- that that is the only path of
annexation and the only available -- at anytime in the future for these lots, whatever
they may be, to have a secondary emergency access, that that would be problematic. It
seems more likely -- and Councilman Rountree has, I believe, alluded to what appears
to be hole number two where I have lost of number of golf balls into this particular
development application. They are probably still there. But it would seem more likely
that a -- and the applicant has submitted that, that it would be more likely and it would
make me feel more comfortable with the overall development path and scope.
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December 12, 2006
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Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Borton.
Borton: I don't really have any questions. I can let you know where my thoughts are on
this. The annexation path doesn't, in and of itself, create any particular problem for me
anymore than including a hole or two to create a more contiguous annexation path. I
don't know if that really solves anything, other than it provides additional green space as
part of the city limits. You still have the same fire access concerns. It's a project and
annexation that I support. I empathize with the concerns of neighboring residents I
guess in support and in opposition when you look back over ten years and I think Mr.
Hewitt made reference to various conversations and remarks that mayor may not have
been said and promises -- if there is anything that's certain from sitting up here on
Council is that individuals that move into particular areas and are, then, trying to
forecast what's going to take place on adjacent properties, are never going to be one
hundred percent right and never going to be told anything by the developer, if anyone,
anything of any certainty, because they don't control a lot of those factors. I see the
concerns of density, you know, 35 versus 70, that's a vast difference. I don't disagree
with the comments of Mrs. McKay. I do see this as a beneficial mix of housing product
in this particular area. I would ask the applicant -- and I appreciate Mrs. McKay's
comments with regards to increasing the lot sizes throughout the northern boundary to
10,000 square feet or up. I know we made that request before in other areas and I think
that transition is important. I appreciate that being provided. And with regard -- for what
it's worth, with regards to any remarks at least for this Councilman regarding what was
said or wasn't said by developers or realtors, making any particular reference to quotes
placed within the Idaho Statesman is not particularly persuasive. With all due respect to
the Idaho Statesman. I have been here long enough to be sensitive of that. So, I
empathize with anyone who was quoted or misquoted in that particular journal. And I
think Councilman Rountree's remarks with regards the split zoning on this -- it just
provides some additional protection should there be any change in ownership. I think
that's appropriate. I doesn't sound like it's going to be a problem for the applicant to
comply with, so all in all it's a project that I support.
De Weerd: Thank you. Any other comments?
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I can support it if we get all this -- I do have a problem with the annexation going
up the street and it has been done in Meridian. In 1976 they went down 30 feet of East
-- or West Pine so they could have a councilman on the Council, but I didn't like it then
and I don't like it now. Mrs. McKay's remarks about making her lots bigger back there, I
believe would be sufficient for that. I, for one, would like to see the -- and I don't know
whether Spurwing would have to do it or the Hewitt family still owns old number two if
it's a separate lot of its own -- I'd like to see that at least brought in with the annexation.
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
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But in the same token we have made so many changes I don't know if we should -- and
I'll leave this up to Anna or Mr. Nary whether we need to bring it back through or not.
We are making -- throwing some changes out here that are pretty drastic.
De Weerd: Mrs. Canning, would you like to address that?
Canning: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, you have a planning commission to
make recommendations for you and work things out. Sometimes they workout,
sometimes it's up to you, you want to work more things. When the Planning and Zoning
Commission has recommended approval of a project and you want to rework it -- I have
always been supportive of the Council just not remanding it back. But in this case I
think it's only fair to those folks that sit on the Planning and Zoning Commission, that
devote a lot of their free time, to that task, that they have the opportunity to see this
revised plat and to make a recommendation on that to you.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Okay. Yes, Mr. Bird.
Bird: You know, it's not only a revised preliminary plat, we are talking about split zoning
and we are talking about more area of annexation.
Canning: Yeah. And, actually, if they expand the application area, as has been
requested, they may need to actually re-notice. I didn't think about that. But I would
think you would need to re-notice.
Bird: Well, I don't want to do that.
Canning: You will have to one way or another. You cannot -- yes.
De Weerd: Okay. Mr. Nary, do you have anything to add?
Nary: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, I mean I was going to bring up the issue
of notice and the number of people that have testified in this and those are fairly
significant changes that you're discussing as a possibility of taking one hole out of an 18
hole golf course and annexing the hole. I think you want the staff analysis. I think you -
- I think you would be wiser to have the staff's analysis, as well as the applicant's
opportunity to make sure it fits for them. Right now it's real easy to want to commit to
that, but they still have to make that analysis that it makes sense from them as a
business standpoint to annex one hole out of their golf course, as well as getting --
make sure all the appropriate parties and all the surrounding area has an opportunity
and, then, to have that fully discussed at the Planning and Zoning Commission would
bring back to this Council a better recommendation based on all those changes.
De Weerd: Okay. Would the applicant like to make comments? Becky or Mr. Hewitt.
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December 12, 2006
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Hewitt: My name is Jock Hewitt. I reside 7212 North Spurwing Way. This lot in
question where we are planning to do the patio homes -- the entire project was planned
by Chris Corty and when the golf course was originally designed and laid out, Chris __
the only practical way we had of attaching this lot to Chinden was to do that little portion
there. And so that's the way it was originally platted. I mean it's not something that
was ever changed recently to accommodate this project. That's the way it was from the
get go. And it is legal. Mr. Nary -- your counsel has said it. So, I mean it's legal to go
ahead and annex it just the way it is. There is just no practical other way to do it. If you
want to annex a second hole into the city to make yourself feel more comfortable, I
mean I don't have total control over that, because that's part of the golf course and it's
leased to Spurwing Country Club. And so that's a little bit of a kettle of fish. But you
can -- that lot has been that way ever since the original plat was approved. It was that
way from day one and it was Chris Corty's foresight that it was set up that way. And it is
-- your counsel has said it, it's legal to go ahead and annex it on that basis, so --
De Weerd: Okay. I guess my question more was towards the remand back to Planning
and Zoning and that you would have some of those discussion points and be able to
weigh the pros and cons of the recommendation from Council in the remand back to
Planning and Zoning.
Hewitt: Well, I don't know. I really want to keep the ball rolling on this thing. You know,
originally Planning and Zoning's first recommendation was approval on this project.
That was their original recommendation. Wasn't it? Well, that's what I thought the
motion was. I stand corrected then. But, you know, I -- you know, I would prefer that
we move ahead. That would be my consideration. If it does get remanded back and
they say, well, we have got to have a second hole or something like that, I would work
to see if I could help out in that process, but it just doesn't seem to me that it's
necessary.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. Mr. Bird.
Bird: Mr. Hewitt, I take it, then, that you don't have control over annexation of hole
number two, that would have to be -- the applicant would have to be the Spurwing
Country Club?
Hewitt: Well, Spurwing Country Club leases the property from us and they have a long-
term lease and so if that hole is annexed into the City of Meridian, because of the
potential changes in real estate taxes and things like that, might have an adverse
impact on their operation.
Bird: Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Okay. Council, I would look for your direction on this item.
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December 12, 2006
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Bird: Madam Mayor, this is one Councilman that I can go -- I have no problem voting on
it tonight.
Wardle: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: I have heard from both legal staff and planning staff that the changes are
significant. I think we have a consensus in regard to where we would like to see the
project go. My question for either Anna or Mr. Nary is can -- and I feel this needs to be
remanded. If we remand it can we do so with specific direction or do we just remand
the entire project and ask them to read the minutes of this meeting?
Canning: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, Councilmember Wardle, you have
remanded with specific direction in the past.
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Nary.
Nary: And, additionally, the Commission still has the independent ability to make a
recommendation consistent or inconsistent with that, as well as other recommendations.
But, certainly, if you want them to address a specific point or you want them to at least
make sure that their recommendation includes a specific point back to you, that's
certainly within your prerogative.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you, Mr. Nary.
Rountree: Mr. Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: To move this along, I would move that we close the Public Hearing on Items
10, 11, and 12.
Bird: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. I have a motion and a second to close the public hearings on Items
10 through 12. All those in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
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Rountree: I move that we approve the request for annexation, Item NO.1 0, AZ 06-043,
with the following conditions: That there be a split zoning of R-4 for the larger lots as
identified in the revised plat and that the lots on the northwest corner that are identified
as townhome or patio home lots on the north side, be also expanded to a minimum of
10,000 square feet -- that would be northeast. Yes. And the secondary access be
provided as identified by the applicant with gates at both -- on the Chinden side, as well
as the subdivision side. Or methods agreeable to the police and fire department.
Borton: I will second.
De Weerd: Okay. I have a motion and a second to approve the annexation __
Canning: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: -- requested with changes? Yes, Anna.
Canning: Madam Mayor, I assume that the maker of the motion meant to reference that
those would be conditions in a DA, not conditions of the annexation.
Rountree: They would be conditions of the development agreement, but conditions for
my vote to approve annexation.
Canning: Okay. I just wanted to clarify that we needed a development agreement.
That was all.
Rountree: Yes.
Canning: Thank you.
De Weerd: And second agrees?
Borton: Second agrees.
De Weerd: Okay. We have --
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes. Discussion.
Borton: Anna, you had mentioned earlier that should there be an approval that you
suggest a continuance to prepare conditions of approval?
Canning: Yes, sir. The annexation it wouldn't be necessary, because there are no
conditions on an annexation. But for any of the other applications you have before you
tonight, you have no findings for approval, nor any conditions of approval.
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December 12, 2006
Page 37 of 52
De Weerd: Okay. Any further discussion from Council? Okay. Mr. Berg.
Wardle: With reluctance to the specific annexation path and the precedent that this may
set in the future, I will vote aye.
Roll-Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Borton, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. Item 11.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I move that we approve the preliminary plat PP 06-045 with
my previously stated comments as part of the development agreement.
De Weerd: Okay. Do I have a second for discussion?
Bird: I'll second and, then, I got a question.
De Weerd: Okay.
Bird: On the preliminary plat I need to know -- we need a date on it, because what we
have seen up here wasn't one that we are passing on or that I'm voting on.
Canning: Sir, you have no -- sirs and Madam Mayor, you have no conditions of
approval. You have no ACHD conditions, no standard conditions. You have nothing to
approve on the preliminary plat tonight, so --
Rountree: Given that, I would amend my motion to -- we will let those folks who yet
have not seen the proposed changed plat know the Council's position of endorsing it.
Bird: Second would agree.
Rountree: That further complicates it.
De Weerd: Just a point of order. Mr. Nary, would this not be more appropriate to
continue to collect the appropriate feedback and bring that back at a further -- a later
date?
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I would --
Nary: You're absolutely right.
Rountree: -- withdraw my motion.
De Weerd: Okay. The motion has been withdrawn. Okay. Do I have a new motion to
continue Items 11 and 12 -- although, staff, what would be the appropriate time frame?
Meridian City Council
December 12, 2006
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Canning: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, we could have it -- is there one the
26th? We -- no. So, we are --
De Weerd: January 3rd -- or January 2nd.
Rountree: January 2nd is -- January 9th.
De Weerd: January 9th.
Canning: January 9th. And, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, Commissioner
Zaremba did correctly note that you have already closed the Public Hearing, so you will
need to reopen the Public Hearing on those two items in order to continue it.
De Weerd: In order to collect comments.
Canning: Yes. And you do have findings for -- I mispoke earlier. You do have -- staff
did make findings for approval for the variance and there are no conditions to the
variance. I would still prefer to have you pull -- continue that one as well, just so we can
get a clean record for you all for next week on those two items.
De Weerd: Thank you, Anna.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I move that we reopen the public hearings for Item 11 and
12.
Borton: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. Motion and a second to open the public hearings on Items 11 and
12. All those in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, I move that we continue the public hearings for Items 11 and
12 to receive additional input from the review agencies for preliminary plat and variance.
Wardle: Second.
De Weerd: Do I have a date?
Rountree: And that's July 9th, 2007.
De Weerd: Do you want January?
Rountree: Yes. July is probably better. January.
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December 12, 2006
Page 39 of 52
Wardle: Second agrees.
De Weerd: You were agreeing to January 9th; right?
Wardle: Second agrees.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. I do have a motion and a second to continue Items 11
and 12 to January 9th, 2007. All those in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: I will go ahead and call a five minute recess.
(Recess.)
Item 13:
Public Hearing: AZ 06-050 Request for Annexation and Zoning of 4.64
acres from RR to an R-8 zone for Tree Farm Addition by Treehaven, LLC
- 6745 North Black Cat Road:
Item 14:
Public Hearing: MI 06-010 Request for a Miscellaneous application to
modify the existing Development Agreement to include the property
located at 6745 North Black Cat Road for The Tree Farm by Treehaven,
LLC - 6745 North Black Cat Road:
De Weerd: Okay. We will go ahead and call this meeting back to order. We are on
Items 13 and 14, public hearings on AZ 06-050 and MI 06-010. I will open these two
public hearings with staff comments.
Borton: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Yes, Mr. Borton.
Borton: I need to we recuse myself from Items 13 and 14.
De Weerd: Okay. We will let you know when Council has made a decision. Thank
you. Okay. Anna.
Canning: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, this is the Tree Farm Addition
project. It's located on the west side of North Black Cat Road, approximately a quarter
of a mile north of the Chinden Boulevard. So, the out-parcel circled in red is the
proposed project. They are asking for annexation and zoning of 4.64 acres and a
modification to the development for Tree Farm. This property was at one time actually
part of the Tree Farm annexation submittal to the city. However, the previous owners,
the Rabehl, rescinded their affidavit of legal interest consenting to have the application
as part of the property, so we re-noticed it without the Rabehl property within it.
However, the Tree Farm property -- the concept plan always included this property. It