HomeMy WebLinkAbout2024-05-14 Regular Meridian City Council May 14, 2024.
A Meeting of the Meridian City Council was called to order at 6:00 p.m. Tuesday, May
14, 2024, by Vice-President Liz Strader.
Members Present: Luke Cavener, Liz Strader, John Overton, Anne Little Roberts and
Doug Taylor.
Members Absent: Robert Simison.
ROLL-CALL ATTENDANCE
_X_ Liz Strader (vacant)
Anne Little Roberts X John Overton
_X_ Doug Taylor _X—Luke Cavener
Mayor Robert E. Simison
Strader: Welcome to the City of Meridian's Regular City Council Meeting. Today is
Tuesday, May 14th, 2024, at 6:00 o'clock p.m. We will begin tonight's meeting with roll
call attendance.
PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
Strader: Next up we have the Pledge of Allegiance. Please join us.
(Pledge of Allegiance recited.)
COMMUNITY INVOCATION
Strader: Thank you. For the community invocation I would like to welcome David
Reese from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. Please join us in a prayer
or a moment of your own personal reflection.
Reese: Our Father in Heaven, we are grateful to come before thee in prayer at the
beginning of the City Council meeting tonight. We are grateful for our community, for
the good people who are our friends and neighbors. We are grateful for those who
spend their days in service to our community and especially our first responders and we
ask thy blessings upon them and upon their families. We asked thy blessings upon
those in our community who are in need and ask you to help us who are positioned to
help that we may know how best to do so. We ask that thy blessings upon those who
are innocent victims of the wars in Ukraine and in the Middle East and elsewhere. Pray
that their suffering will be relieved and that a way to peace may be found. We ask you
to bless us in this community, that we will promote friendliness and neighborliness and
peace with one another. We ask thy blessings upon this proceeding this night and do
so in the name of thy Savior Jesus Christ. Amen.
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ADOPTION OF AGENDA
Strader: Thank you. Okay. Next up we have the adoption of the agenda.
Overton: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Yes, Councilman Overton.
Overton: Seeing no changes to the agenda, I would like to move that we approve the
agenda as published.
Little Roberts: Second.
Strader: Excellent. We have an adoption to approve the agenda and a second. All in
favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay? The ayes have it and the agenda is
adopted.
MOTION CARRIED: ALLAYES.
CONSENT AGENDA [Action Item]
1. Chik-fil-A Ten Mile and Vanguard Water Main Easement (ESMT-2024-
0054)
2. Jump Creek Subdivision No. 7 Sanitary Sewer and Water Main
Easement (ESMT-2024-0058)
3. Prairiefire Subdivision Water Main Easement No. 3 (ESMT-2024-0055)
4. Final Plat for Millwood Subdivision (FP-2023-0011) by Epic
Development Victory, LLC., located at 1975 E. Victory Rd.
5. Final Plat for TM Center East No. 2 (FP-2024-0008) by Brighton
Development, Inc., located at 700 S. Wayfinder Ave.
6 Findings of Fact, Conclusions of Law for Reveille Ridge Subdivision
(H-2023-0050) by Bailey Engineering, generally located on the west
side of S. Eagle Rd., approximately 1/2 mile south of E. Lake Hazel
Rd.
7. Final Order for Biltmore Estates Subdivision No. 5 by Engineering
Solutions, generally located at the northwest corner of S. Kentucky
Way and W. Harris St.
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8. Development Agreement Modification (Ultra Clean Franklin H-2023-
0064) Between City of Meridian and WWOZ Boise Meridian LLC, for
Property Located at 3070 E. Franklin Rd.
9. Agreement between the City of Meridian and DG Boise Chinden, LLC
to Accept Payment in lieu of Streetlight Installation at 1840 West
Chinden Blvd.
10. Approval of AIA A133 Construction Management Agreement for Pre-
Construction Services with Kreizenbeck LLC for the Not-To-Exceed
FY24 amount of $15,000.00
11. Approval of AIA B133 Design Agreement for Architecture Services for
the PD Roof & RTU Replacement project with LCA Architects, Inc. for
the Not-To-Exceed amount of $79,475.00.00
Strader: Next we have the Consent Agenda.
Overton: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Councilman Overton.
Overton: I would like to move for approval of the Consent Agenda, with the Vice-
President to sign and the City Clerk to attest.
Little Roberts: Second.
Strader: Excellent. We have a motion and a second to approve the Consent Agenda.
All in favor signify by saying aye. Nays? The ayes have it and the Consent Agenda is
approved.
MOTION CARRIED: ALLAYES.
ITEMS MOVED FROM THE CONSENT AGENDA [Action Item]
PROCLAMATIONS [Action Item]
12. Building Safety Month Proclamation
Strader: All right. Next we have Proclamations. We have three proclamations, so I'm
just going to let everyone know the order. Okay. First we will have the Building Safety
Month Proclamation and I will recognize Director Bruce Freckleton for that. Next we
have World Neurofibromatosis Awareness Day and I will recognize the Shannon McNall.
And, then, finally we will have the Public Works Week Proclamation and I will recognize
Director Laurelei McVey. Okay. First up is the Building Safety Month Proclamation.
Director Freckleton and Brett Caulder, if you could join me at the podium. Okay. Better
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the higher up. There we go. Thank you. Whereas Mission Possible, the theme for
Building Safety Month 2024, encourages us all to raise awareness about building safety
on a personal, local and global scale and whereas each year, in observance of Building
Safety Month, people from Meridian and all over the world are asked to consider the
commitment to improve building safety, resilience and economic investment at home
and in the community and to acknowledge the essential service provided to all of us by
local and state building departments, fire prevention bureaus and federal agencies in
protecting lives and property and whereas building safety and fire prevention officials,
architects, engineers, builders, trades people, design professionals, laborers, plumbers
and others in the construction industry are dedicated members of the International Code
Council, a nonprofit that brings together local, state, territorial, tribal and federal officials
who are experts in the built environment to create and implement the highest quality
codes and whereas modern building codes include safeguards to protect the public from
natural hazards such as snowstorms, wildland fires, floods and earthquakes and
whereas the City of Meridian is committed to recognizing that our growth and our
strength depends on the safety and essential role our homes, buildings and
infrastructure play both in everyday life and when disaster strikes. Therefore, I, Liz
Strader, on behalf of Mayor Robert E. Simison, proclaim this week of May 2024 as --
actually this month of May 2024 as Building Safety Month in the City of Meridian and
encourage all citizens to join us as we participate in Building Safety Month activities and
recognize those that helped to strengthen our community and to protect us in the
buildings where we live, work and raise our families. Fantastic. I think we all can
intuitively understand that building safety is critical for all of us. I would like to recognize
Brett Caulder to make a few remarks.
Caulder: Thank you for recognizing this. It gives us a platform internationally and
nationally. This has been an ongoing platform through the International Code Council,
which is our adopting body for codes and building standards for 43 years and I
appreciate the opportunity and the support from Council in this, because we are kind of
the -- in-the-shadows heroes in the sense of building, safe buildings and expectation for
longevity and for sustainability. So, again, thank you for your support.
Strader: If you would like to join me for a quick picture with the proclamation and I
would like to congratulate you again.
(Picture taken.)
13. World Neurofibromatosis Awareness Day
Strader: Okay. Great. Thank you. And I realize Council may have comments, so I
think we will save them for the end of all three proclamations, if that's okay, for the sake
of efficiency. I would like to recognize Shannon McNall and your team. Come on up.
Fantastic. Thank you. We will go ahead and read the proclamation. Whereas
Neurofibromatosis, NF, causes tumors to grow on nerves throughout the body, which
can affect the development of the brain, cardiovascular system, bones and skin and
affects all populations equally regardless of race, ethnicity or gender and whereas the
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Children's Tumor Foundation leads efforts to promote and financially sponsor world
class medical research aimed at finding effective treatments and ultimately a cure for
NF and whereas patient and family support is provided by the Children's Tumor
Foundation through its information resources, youth programs and local chapter
activities and whereas much remains to be done in raising public awareness of NF to
help promote early diagnosis, proper management and treatment, prevention of
complications and support for research and whereas the Children's Tumor Foundation is
observing May 17, 2024, as World Neurofibromatosis Awareness Day to educate the
public about this rare genetic disorder. Therefore, I, Liz Strader, on behalf of Mayor
Robert E. Simison, hereby proclaim May 17th, 2024, as World NF Awareness Day in the
City of Meridian and encourage all citizens and community members to become
informed and involved in the fight, so we can imagine a world without NF. Thank you.
Shannon, would you like to come and make some remarks?
McNall: Thank you guys and the Council for recognizing World NF Awareness Day. I
am a person affected with NF and if you are affected, please, raise your hand. That's
my son Carson. NF is -- is a rare disorder that really has no cure and only one real
effective treatment that they found so far. So, the Children's Tumor Foundation's
mission is to really reach out and raise awareness and raise research for a disorder that
causes tumors anywhere on the nervous system and really make a difference in our
communities and it starts with -- it starts with things like this. It starts with awareness
like this. So, we just really want to thank the Council. Thank you guys.
Strader: Thank you. Thank you for raising awareness about this important issue and
let's go ahead we can take a quick picture with the whole group if you would like.
(Picture taken)
14. Public Works Week Proclamation
Strader: Great. Thank you. And, finally, I would like to welcome Director Laurelei
McVey to the podium for our Proclamation for Meridian Public Works Week. Whereas
City of Meridian residents have peace of mind with every faucet turned on, shower
taken and toilet flushed, thanks to the professional employees of the Meridian Public
Works team and whereas each often unseen essential worker, engineer, inspector,
operator, technician is committed to protecting our health, safety, environment and
quality of life through the 24/7 supply and distribution of clean, safe water, efficient
collection and treatment of wastewater and management of solid waste and whereas
the Meridian Public Works Department educates the community about the work they do
through informative and engaging public outreach and whereas advancing the quality of
life for all is the theme for the 2024 National Public Works Week and it represents the
often unseen, steadfast and heroic efforts put forth by the Public Works professionals
across North America. Therefore, 1, Liz Strader, on behalf of Robert E. Simison,
proclaim the week of May 19th to 25th, 2024, as Meridian Public Works Week in the
City of Meridian and call upon all citizens and civic organizations to acquaint themselves
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with and to recognize the substantial contributions which Public Works employees make
every day to our health, safety, comfort and quality of life. Laurelei. Thank you.
McVey: Well, thank you so much. This is more people than ever come to the Public
Works Proclamation, so I will take that as a win. We really appreciate the support and
recognition, like Bruce and his team, I call the, you know, Public Works employees
heroes of the underground. So, it's services that every single resident of the city uses
every single day and it takes a lot of work to make both our water and wastewater work
every single day without fail and that trust that the community puts in us for that
essential service is so important. So, I would also like to thank the Council and Mayor
for their continued support. It takes a lot of resources to make this happen and they
continue to support us to meet these requirements and support our staff in those efforts.
So, I would also like to invite everybody to the Public Works Week Expo. It's next week
on Wednesday from 4:00 to 7:00 out in front of City Hall. It's a really fun family event
where we bring out all of our big equipment, all of our employees put on little
demonstrations and booths and it's free and a great event if you are interested in
learning more about Public Works.
(Picture taken.)
Strader: Okay.
Little Roberts: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Council Woman Little Roberts.
Little Roberts: Madam Vice-President, I would just like to acknowledge everything that
goes behind these proclamations. Anybody that knows me knows there is two things
that are near and dear to my heart, among many other things, but our team, which we
have mentioned two, with Building Safety and Public Works, I mean our teams are just
amazing and we wouldn't be able to do these without those of you that work so hard
and so diligently and love our city and my other passion is nonprofits and so thank you
so much for the work that you do near and dear to your heart, because without people
like you all going out and educating the rest of us we wouldn't know about things like
this and be able to support research and those that are looking to find a cure. So,
hope you participated in Idaho Gives this year. If not, think about it for next year. But
thank you all.
Strader: Thank you.
Taylor: Council President Strader?
Strader: Councilman Taylor.
Taylor: I just want to take a minute, too, and I think -- I'm not -- I'm just going to say NF,
because I can't say the words, but never had heard of it before, so I really do appreciate
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that if one person became aware and it was me, then, success. So, I'm very interested
and want to look -- look into this a little bit more. But I appreciate that and also to our
team, I would be remiss also if I didn't acknowledge them and as Public Works liaison
and the good work that Laurelei and her team does is really fantastic. It's -- it's almost a
modern miracle to see how the water gets to where it needs to go without any errors,
contamination, things like that and so I just think it's really great. So, I'm glad we are
recognizing their good work in this way and I do hope a lot of people come next week.
I'm excited to bring my kids.
Strader: Fantastic.
Overton: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Councilman Overton.
Overton: I will be the second one. I have never heard the term before and I have to
also say NF from this point forward, but I appreciate what you brought forward for us
and the rest of the city to educate us. It's -- sometimes if it wasn't for what you just did
and the proclamations we would never know. Under the city departments. This has
been one of the fastest growing cities for over 30 years and what continues to amaze
me is with the Community Development and the Building Department is how we
maintain such a high quality of safety for everything from the ground up and, then, you
walk right over to Public Works and we do the exact same thing from the ground level
down. I mean the fact that you can keep up with our heavy growth and keep the highest
quality of standards and safety as we do it is impressive and you -- say thank you for
our support, but we got to thank you guys every day for everything you do, because you
are what makes our city great. We just get to stand and take the kudos for it. But your
teams, your people are the ones that really do the hard work. Thank you.
Strader: Thank you. Well, these were three fantastic proclamations. I want to
congratulate everyone who received one and also let you know that you could stay for
the whole City Council meeting, but you are not obligated to do so. Okay? So, if you
have other things going on feel free.
PUBLIC FORUM — Future Meeting Topics
Strader: With that, Mr. Clerk, do we have anyone signed up under the Public Forum?
Johnson: Madam Vice-President, we do not.
ACTION ITEMS
15. Public Hearing continued from April 9, 2024 for Rosalyn Subdivision
(H-2023-0056) by Givens Pursley, LLP, located at 200 E. Rosalyn Dr.
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A. Request: Annexation of a 0.014-acre of land from RUT in Ada
County to the R-8 zoning district, including the remaining portion of
E. Rosalyn Street cul-de-sac right-of-way.
B. Request: Combined Preliminary/Final Plat consisting of 6
residential building lots and 1 common lot on 0.733 acres in the R-8
zoning district.
Strader: Okay. Great. Thank you. With that we will move on to our Action Items this
evening. First up we have a public hearing continued from April 9th, 2024, for Rosalyn
Subdivision, H-2023-0056 by Givens Pursley, LLP, and with that I will turn this over to
Stacy for staff comments.
Hersh: Good evening Madam Vice-President Strader and Members of the Council, this
application was continued for Rosalyn Subdivision. The applications that are before you
are for annexation and combined preliminary/final plat. Tonight the applicant is still
wishing to remain with the six lots. Also staff just wanted to reiterate that the -- this is a
picture of the piece of remnant area right of way that staff directed the applicant to
acquire -- acquire from ACHD to -- so we could clean up our map and annex those
pieces into the city, so they wouldn't be out there forever without being annexed. There
were two written testimonies since the last hearing, one from Carol Sue Johnson and
Brenda Violet. Concerns with the increased traffic flow and safety, overflow parking on
the street and dense -- and the density proposed on the lot. Staff -- this concludes
staff's presentation and I can go over anything that we need to revisit in staff's last
presentation and that concludes my presentation for tonight and I stand for any
questions.
Strader: Great. Thank you so much. Fellow Council Members and not forgetting
Council President Cavener also who is online, does anyone have any questions for
staff? Okay. Great. And I would like to welcome the applicant to make some remarks
for up to 15 minutes.
Koeckeritz: Thank you, Council Member Strader, Members of City Council. Elizabeth
Koeckeritz with Givens Pursley. 601 Bannock. With me tonight are Brett and Julie
Bingham and they actually would like to present to you this evening and explain to you
why they think this project -- this is the right time and the place and why this is near and
dear to them and they would like to speak with you about that.
Bingham: Okay. Julie Bingham. 2400 West Wapoot Drive in Meridian. We would like
to thank Madam Vice-President Strader and City Council Members and staff for your
time to review and hear our application tonight on our Rosalyn Subdivision project.
Tonight we would like to present an overview of our project from our perspective and
encapsulate into a few minutes its origin. As was stated, we are business owners in
Meridian for the last 20 years. We are both lifelong Idaho residents and have lived here
in Meridian for the last 24 years. We have five children, four of whom are adults now
and who grew up in Meridian attending West Ada School District. So, why this project?
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Our project began three years ago when we saw a need for our children, my mother
and our community. As mentioned, four of our children are adults who are currently
attending or have graduated college. They have all expressed interest in moving back
to their hometown here in Meridian where they grew up. However, dreams of
homeownership in Meridian have dissipated due to the lack of small home availability
over the last few years. Our oldest daughter and her husband are recent college
graduates and young professionals who have experienced this new reality due to the
lack of small single family homes like our project. They have ended up purchasing a
home in Nampa. We know that homeownership provides opportunities for people to
plant roots into a community and in-fill projects of small single family homes like this
development will provide opportunities for home ownership to our returning young
adults and/or retiree family members. This is the why for our project. Now we would
like to address the project itself, along with concerns that have been brought up from
our neighbors and from City Council. We are not professional developers and we have
gratefully received help from Ms. Koeckeritz along the way, but tonight we would like to
speak as the owners of this property and share our first-hand experience as previous
members of this neighborhood. You see, we lived in the current house on Rosalyn for
two years and so we have good experience while being there. First we would like to
address the position of the current house on Lot 2. There we go. The position of the
house on Lot 2 and the concern of its orientation. Our reasoning for positioning this
house this way was that there are five large beautiful trees on this lot. If we oriented the
home on Lot 2 straight like the others we would have to sacrifice those trees. By turning
it slightly we can preserve almost all of them and it squares it up with the road. In doing
so it provides privacy, shade and honors the history of families who lived here and
planted those trees years ago. Second, fencing is not required with our application, but
we wanted to address it. Our plan is to retain the current privacy fencing that is already
there to the north and the east and add additional privacy fencing to the west that is
adjacent to Mrs. Larrea's property, which is currently a barbed wire and electric fence.
Because fencing is not required with our application, we have not decided on interior
fencing between the homes, but our intent is for the HOA of this development to
maintain our yards, flowerbeds, shrubs, trees, irrigation and snow removal to ensure it is
consistent among homes and is maintained to an excellent standard. Any future interior
fencing proposed will comply with strict HOA. So, there were questions and concerns
about the sidewalk improvements from our home to Meridian Road. It is correct that
there is a small portion of the street extending to Meridian Road that does not have
improved sidewalks. These two locations marked in red have not been developed and
still have not required improvements. After living in this home for almost two years we
did not find this to be detrimental to our experience in the neighborhood. In fact, we
enjoyed walking through the neighborhood to the commercial developments that include
restaurants, dry cleaning and an ice cream shop. Owners of these potential homes do
not need to walk to Meridian Road, nor would they want to, because the Meridian Road
is not developed with sidewalks or biking lanes. The interior neighborhood sidewalks
are a perfect way to walk to your favorite ice cream shop. Fourth, we would like to
address the concerns our neighbors have voiced with our project, as well as changes
that we have made to address their concerns. We began our project with a proposal of
seven attached units with some two story homes and emergency access coming from
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the common drive to the east that we have legal access to. We proposed this plan,
which met all requirements for zoning and safety, with the assumption of approval of
annexation of the sliver of land we were granted from our ACHD hearing. At our
neighborhood meeting we met with over 20 neighbors who voiced concerns about
density, use of common drive to the east, two story sight lines, attached homes, parking
and trash. We listened to them, took notes and, then, met with our legal counsel and
city staff. We want to be good neighbors and address their concerns while still being
smart about the development and the costs that will be incurred for developing. We
landed on the proposal that you see before you. We believe that this proposal is the
best fit for the parcel, while also addressing concerns from our neighbors, those being
going from the seven smaller lots with attached homes to six bigger lots with detached
homes like the rest of the neighborhood. We are now utilizing a hammerhead that
provides emergency access for our project, negating the need to use the common drive
to the east, of which we have legal access to. We have reduced home sizes to be
within 1,300 to 1,600 square feet. This reduction inherently reduces the amount of
people who reside in each home and is consistent with the homes of the neighboring
neighborhood. We reduced homes from two story to single level or story and a half to
maintain a less visible presence. We have addressed trash services and confirmed with
sanitation department that they will be able to collect trash bins from inside the
hammerhead, alleviating multiple bins lining the road on Rosalyn. We also confirmed
with the post office regarding a central mail collection box, which they require now.
They chose a location at the top of the hammerhead, because it is convenient and
meets their regulations for forward motion of their vehicles. They also said the common
drive provides them safety and protection from the main road where they are stepping
out of their vehicle to deliver mail. Parking for each of these homes has a two car
garage and a two car parking pad. We feel that the size of these homes is suited for
young professionals or retirees and that the concern for parking for more than two
drivers will not be an issue. We know the concern City Council has regarding the
overcrowding of the schools in which this project lies. We have lived within these exact
school boundaries for many years with school aged children and know firsthand the
challenges our schools face. However, we feel that the impact of the proposed smaller
homes also limits the impact of school aged children to the schools. Brett would now
like to address the concerns about density and annexation.
B. Bingham: So, I'm Brett Bingham. I'm a veterinarian here in Meridian. I was actually
working the late shift last time, so that's why I could not be here. So, I appreciate you
recording these proceedings, so that we can watch and hear your concerns. That's very
helpful. You, obviously, care a lot about our community, which means a lot to me. This
project has meaning for me for a couple of reasons. One, Julie addressed the personal
reasons, but also professional. As a veterinarian I own -- we own four veterinary
hospitals here in the Treasure Valley, two here in Meridian. We employ over 105 team
members. One of the biggest challenges we have for our team members is finding
available homes for them to live in. So, this is significant to us, not only for personal but
professional reason as well. Then we have a lot of friends who are business owners in
this area who have the same concerns and frustrations as we do. I want to share a
quick history about our neighborhood, so that you can see where we are coming from.
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The slides will be above. In this picture from 1992 you can see the original cul-de-sac,
which is part of our application for annexation. You can also see the original four
homes. In May of 2005 another home was added onto the cul-de-sac. In October 2006
-- 2006 the cul-de-sac was replaced with a through street Rosalyn Drive, to the new
Larkspur neighborhood. In 2010 the neighborhood continued to be developed and one
of the original lots was divided in half. This is what it looks like today. The original lots
to the south are highlighted in yellow here. In listening to the previous meeting, a slide
was shared showing the four largest original lots implying that our project -- project was
out of character with the density of the neighborhood. As I have shown you, these four
lots were part of the original home sites and thus are the largest lots in the entire
neighborhood. They are, in fact, out of character with the neighborhood and not the
standard. For comparison I would like to show a bigger picture regarding density of the
rest of the neighborhood. You can see from this map that there are 108 other homes
surrounding our development. If we remove the four -- or if we remove the original
home sites, the average lot density is .124 acres, which is within that red square. The
average density within our development is .122 acres per lot. So, that's a difference of
87 square feet. So, our development is in alignment and consistent with the
surrounding neighborhood. Another question that came up was that of annexation.
Could this project be viable without the annexed portion? We had our designer map out
the lot lines with this scenario. This is what the application would look like without
annexation. There is enough room for six lots that meet all R-8 zoning standards.
However, we feel that our current development provides better lot lines for adjoining
development and it cleans up city and ACHD lines by annexing this into the city.
Another concern was the common drive. As you can see, the three homes on the east
in green are served by a common drive outlined in red, showing that our project is not
unique -- unique in this regard either. When we lived in Rosalyn we observed -- when
we lived in the Rosalyn house we observed how the common drive to the east serves
these homes very well and parking was never an issue. Our development will comply
by the same parking standards. A few other benefits of our common drive are the three
homes in the back are in a quiet and private location off the main road, which is a
desirable feature for many people. Our common drive is larger than the one to the east
and provides a turnaround option. Not only is it more functional and safe for
homeowners, but it also provides an interior collection for trash and postal service. This
picture shows the common drive is wide enough for cars passing each other. It's not
like we see vehicles being passed -- or being parked in the -- in the common drive. We
have counseled with city staff, our engineer, architect, to make this common drive very
functional and safe. It is compliant with all emergency service requirements. Our intent
is and always has been to develop a project with quality homes that we are proud of
and they add value to our community. We listened to the concerns of our neighbors and
city staff and adjusted our plans, even when our original proposal complied with all
requirements. We hope that you can see our vision and why we have submitted this
proposal. Having lived in this area for the last 24 years we have seen the changes our
city has gone through and we understand the project can cause unsettling feelings for
our neighbors, but we feel like this is the best thing for our community, for our neighbors
for the future, for our children, retirees. It's a good opportunity to use this in-fill land and
improve our community. Thank you. We will stand for any questions.
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Strader: Thank you, Brett and Julie. Council Members, do you have any questions for
the applicant?
Taylor: Council Woman Strader?
Strader: Councilman Taylor.
Taylor: Thank you. Thanks for coming back and the -- to add a detail to some of your
presentation. One question I have been wondering about -- and, first off, I -- there is a
lot I like about it. I agree with you, the type of housing is -- is needed and I think that's --
I like a lot of what I'm seeing, but a couple of questions. You took into consideration
concerns of the neighbors and tried to accommodate them. You took into account some
of the concerns of Planning and Zoning. When we had the hearing before City Council
we kind of -- you know, some of us shared some concerns and -- about it. I didn't see
any effort to kind of maybe meet us part way with some of the concerns we outlined.
I'm just wondering, you know, why that's the case. And I -- you know, some of the
response you provided was, you know, a little bit more information, but I didn't -- I didn't
-- I thought -- we kind of did the continuance of the hearing in an effort to sort of see if
we could address some of the concerns that we brought up, but I didn't -- I didn't see
that from you. So, I just wanted to ask you, you know, some of your thinking along
those lines.
Strader: Go ahead.
B.Bingham: We feel like we addressed a lot of those -- or sorry, Councilman Taylor. We
-- we feel like we addressed a lot of the concerns initially when we met with him and
Julie addressed that, you know, we -- it was originally seven homes with attached and
that would be atypical for the neighborhood. I can see their concerns and so we feel
like we have already complain -- complied with a lot of the concerns that were brought
before us and -- so, financially speaking, it will be very hard to do this with -- I mean the
only -- the only other alternative is to do fewer lots and it's not -- it just won't work. I
mean financially it won't work. It just costs too much for development. So, bottom line if
-- if this is not approved it will stay an old home on three quarters of an acre that's not
developable. That's really why we haven't been able to make any more changes and I
think we have already done as much as we can.
Taylor: Follow up if I may.
Strader: Councilman Taylor, go ahead.
Taylor: So, the -- the one area that I was -- that I highlighted that I was troubled with a
little bit was the -- the access with this hammerhead and looking at your site designs it
looks like that access road into it is 20 feet wide and just -- yeah. So, it's 20 feet wide
coming in from East Rosalyn Drive. You know, the average car is six feet'ish wide. Your
fire trucks, your garbage trucks, those are eight to ten feet wide. Now, I know it's not
designed to have parking there and I know there will be some signs posted, but it's a
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really dense development. I agree, the lot sizes match what's around -- I don't have -- I
don't have any concerns with that. But I look at that and I -- you know, I brought that up
last time and -- and we discussed that with the Fire Department as -- that is a big
concern that they have to have the access to those three in the back. So, to that end I
-- I am still -- I'm not sure how I'm going to vote tonight on this, but I am concerned
about that, because it is a pretty narrow access point. While it sounds like it still checks
all the boxes, I'm still concerned about some kinds of incidences or not having that
access with that. So, just kind of bring it up and just whatever -- you know, whatever
you can share with that. But that still remains a concern for me.
Strader: Are we -- Elizabeth, would you like to be recognized to answer the -- go ahead.
Koeckeritz: Council Member Strader, Council Member Taylor, yes, the fire code -- it
does meet all of the city requirements and all of the International Fire Code
requirements and so that's why that width and size and distance was landed on. It has
been reviewed and it has been approved as it meets them all.
Strader: Let me interject for a second. I think there is kind of a concern -- not only a
safety concern, but there is a concern around parking; right? It's throughout the staff
report. We know that people use their garages for storage. We know that a lot of
households in Meridian have more than two vehicles. I was kind of hoping -- actually,
think -- did we have someone from the Fire Department online? Is it Joe Bongiorno? If
you are on, I would love for you to provide some commentary from the Fire Department
on your level of comfort here.
Bongiorno: We have similar lists throughout the city and I always express my concerns
with them, because when it's a little tight knit neighborhood like this it turns into -- that's
the RV parking spot. That's the boat parking spot. And people feel that, oh, well, it's --
it's -- it's in front of my house, so I can park there. It's safe. So, it's a problem for us.
Unless you have something in your CC&Rs or in your governance that -- I recommend
towing. If someone is parked on that blue section they get towed, because that's how
much of a problem I feel they are. So, we have this all over the city. It can be done
right, but, like everybody says -- you mentioned to yourself that people don't use their
garages to put cars in anymore. That's their storage units and, you know, I had two high
school girls and we had four cars and so if your garage is full of stuff where are the
other two cars going to go? There is no guest parking in here. So, now you have six
houses with Christmas, Easter -- pick a holiday, there is no way for people to park.
They are automatically going to park in that blue spot. And, then, if we get called when
their kitchen fryer catches fire, it's going to be a problem. So, yes, it does meet the fire
code, but it's not the best solution for this scenario.
Strader: Okay. Thank you, Deputy Chief. And, then, Councilman -- Council President
Cavener, I saw you unmute yourself. I just wanted to check if you had a question or a
comment.
Cavener: No. Thank you, Council Vice-President Strader.
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Strader: Can you --just a little bit hard to hear.
Cavener: Sure can. It is that better?
Strader: A little bit, yes.
Cavener: This is -- this is a great compliment when people say they can't hear me. I'm
loving this. I don't have any questions. My fellow Council Members have asked and the
applicant has addressed them. I just -- I want to commend the Binghams for really
coming this evening tonight and presenting their application on their own. Oftentimes
we will get an applicant that will send somebody for a continuance to give them an
opportunity take another crack. Sometimes it changes and I appreciate at least this
evening that you came back and said, hey, we are -- you don't want to make any
changes. We are going to keep our project as we envisioned it based on -- on the
feedback and for you to come and do that as individuals is to be commended. So, I just
I want to thank you for -- for coming and doing that this evening.
Strader: Thank you. Okay. Do we have any other questions for the applicant? Okay.
Thank you. All right. This is a public hearing. First I would like to check -- are there any
HOA leaders in the room that are speaking on behalf of a group? Uh-huh. You are
recognized for up to ten minutes. Come on up. Please remember to state your name
and address for the record, please.
Freeze: My name is Ken Freeze. I live at 195 East Rosalyn Drive and I'm here
speaking on behalf on the San Gorgonio HOA. I see that they didn't change after a
number of changes were asked for. The development -- as I said in my last
presentation -- it's not -- I don't feel it's within the future land use. It's out -- it is out of
character and I will show you how. Too many units and common driveway it just makes
it unsafe. I'm not going to dwell too much on the Comprehensive Plan, except, you
know, I think it's a real shame that there is this plan out there that seems to be stifled
and -- and road blocked, because of legacy rules and zoning and whatnot. I -- I don't
know what can be done about that in the future. But it seems a real shame that there is
this beautiful plan for what Meridian could be and should be that seems to be blocked at
every turn. This is what the Comprehensive Plan shows for this area and you can see
that this lot's right in the middle of it. These lots right now -- currently we fall within what
the Comprehensive Plan calls for, which is R-2. So, this is their plan. They have shown
it to you a lot. I want to say one thing though. If you look at the common driveway that's
to the east that's for the other HOA. In the event of a fire fire trucks wouldn't even need
to use that road -- that common driveway, because there is complete access from the
road on the other side. So, that's very different than what we have with the other three
units in -- in their plan and their plan, if that road is blocked fire units can't get to it or
they are going to have to drag some hoses off an awful long ways. An EMT unit
wouldn't be able to get to it either. Something else I noticed was that a couple of the
Council Members last time were doing a little bit of math and thought that the density
was denser than eight per -- per acre and I added up some numbers and some -- some
of the numbers don't add up. I came up with a difference of 21 square feet, Now,
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granted, it's just 21 square feet. It's 21 square feet in their favor. But have to wonder
where else are the numbers wrong on this plat, especially when they are wrong in their
favor. So, this is the neighborhood. This is the street. All these lots currently are over
5,000 and most are over 6,000 square feet with the ones directly across the street just
under 12,000 feet to 16,000 square feet. That's the neighborhood. They can show you
homes all over the place. Show you how dense they are. But I'm talking about the
immediate area. I found it very interesting, based on the comments from the last
meeting, that the April 9th plat was the same plat tonight. Didn't make any effort to
make any changes. In fact, when they were showing the -- the elevations they still had
cars parked in the driveway. So, at the 9th -- on the 9th Council Member Cavener, our
role as a Council is to listen to both sides, look at the map, look at the zoning and see
what's in -- see what's entitled and make a decision about what's best for our
community. Council Woman Strader -- Council Member Strader talking about the
current zoning, you said it's been a long time and we have changed that -- the direction
that we are going as a city. I don't feel that this is an appropriate transition for the
neighborhood. Councilman Overton. I cannot in good conscience approve a
development that's going to be R-8 that's going to be driving through low density
residential roads out to Meridian Road. Three or even four of that is as much as I would
ever give a yes vote for on this project. Councilman Taylor is talking about the
hammerhead. Common driveway. The public safety component of this really does
concern me, which he echoed again tonight. And Council Woman Roberts comments:
don't feel in this case it's the best fit after what's around it, especially five acres, but it
doesn't seem like it's going to change any -- anytime soon. I hope you come back with
something that works for everyone. I think that we would like to see that. And, then, our
representative from the Fire Department whose last name I won't try to butcher,
because I'm sure I would -- he echoed again tonight about the parking. Hey, that's
where I'm going to park my boat. Says it's always been a concern. Hammerheads,
common driveways are always a problem. I don't like them, because they turn into
parking places. Which he echoed again tonight. I presented this last time. You know,
cutting this project from six homes to three homes is not going to have any effect on the
housing market in Meridian. You all have seen all the homes that are being built. Even
if this were to be six homes, it's like adding a drop of water to a swimming pool. It's not
going to have that much effect on the housing market, if any at all. It would fit very
nicely in the neighborhood as it sits right now. This would be in character. But I did go
a step further. I went -- tried to put in four homes. Now, I would hope that their
architectural firm could do a better job at squeezing the four homes than I did, but I was
able to do it, so I would think they would be able to do it. This -- all the homes still have
street access for emergency vehicles. Maybe a bit less attractive, but it's closer to the
Meridian's own comprehensive plan for in future use land use and you can see this is
how it would fit on the street. There will be better trash and mail pickup room off street
for any parking when the residents there decided to have a party. Plenty of parking.
The HOA is not against developing. I just -- I just showed you two different examples
that the HOA would definitely support. Six homes are just wrong for this. There is much
safer ways to develop this property fewer homes that fit into the surrounding
neighborhood. We ask that the request to annex the .014 acres of land be rejected until
suitable plans are presented to the Council. Got some closing thoughts for you. I work
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with a guy -- he had been -- he was a Coast Guard officer. He was a commander. His
name was Jack Hardin and he had been an investigator on the NTSB and we were
talking about accidents and he made a statement that I didn't understand. He said there
is no such thing as human error, just poor designs that allow errors to be made. This
hammerhead in virtually any common driveway are poor designs and shouldn't be
allowed in the city. The design needlessly puts lives at risk. Thank you.
Strader: Thank you, Mr. Freeze. Council, do you have any questions?
Cavener: Council Vice-President Strader?
Strader: Council President Cavener.
Cavener: Thank you, Mr. Freeze. Always appreciate your presentation. I hope your
HOA gives you like a plate of cookies or something. That was a well put together
presentation. Just -- just one question for you to kind of get where you need and your
homeowners association stands to the annexation point that you -- you are
recommending that we deny. Should the Council take up your recommendation and
deny that annexation, the applicant still has some current entitled rights and they feel
that they could move forth and develop six homes as presented. I think I asked you this
question last time you were before us, but taking all that into consideration do you still
feel that the Council should deny that small annexation request that was recommended
by our Planning Department?
Freeze: Yes. I think it should be denied until they present a plan that is suitable to the
Council. You mentioned about the right to develop it and I agree they have a right to
develop it. However, zoning rules and laws and all these things, they can never be a
hundred percent a hundred percent of the time. That's why something like all these
come before the Council, because it needs to be looked at by people and people need
to look and see what will work, what's safe and what's the best for the people who are
going to buy these homes. If -- if all you had to do was go by the zoning rules or laws,
then, you wouldn't even need to bring it before the Council. You just have it go through
planning, planning looks at it, legal looks at it and it gets stamped and it gets built.
That's not the way things are done in America and that's why something like a plan like
this comes before a council to make a final decision, so that -- so that real people can
do the weights and balances and figure out what is really the best in spite of what
maybe all the codes and having all the T's crossed and all the I's dotted properly. Thank
you.
Little Roberts: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Council Woman Little Roberts.
Little Roberts: Mr. Freeze, thank you so much for your presentation. I'm not as familiar
with that area as I should be, so when you named your HOA I did not know where it is in
relation to the property.
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Freeze: It is the three houses that are right to the east that adjoin this property.
Little Roberts: Okay.
Freeze: In fact, had at one time been part of that property.
Little Roberts: Okay.
Freeze: And when it was -- it was basically subdivided, the person that I talked to that
had owned that he was going to build a home there and decided it was going to be too
expensive, so that he thought it was only going to be one home built. All the neighbors
had -- were told there was only going to be one home. Next thing they know -- nobody
attended any of the meetings and the next thing you know three foundations are going
in. Shock to everybody. So, that's one of the reasons I'm at this meeting.
Strader: Thank you, Mr. Freeze. Are there any further questions? Okay. Thank you so
much.
Freeze: Thank you.
Strader: Are there any members of the public who would like to testify? Please go
ahead and raise your hand if you are here in the room. Okay. Sir, with the white shirt.
Come on up. Please remember to state your name and address for the record. You are
recognized for three minutes.
Olsen: How long? I'm sorry?
Strader: Three minutes.
Olsen: Three minutes. Okay. My name is John Olsen. I live at 5090 West Overland
Road here in Meridian and I am here in favor of the Binghams' proposal. I work actually
professionally as a commercial real estate agent here in town. I was born and raised
right here in Meridian. I have been here since 1981 . My mother graduated from
Meridian High School. My grandfather graduated from Meridian High School and my
daughter is graduating this week for Meridian High School. So, to say that I have seen
a lot of development would be an understatement in this area and I have -- myself have
been part of some of it. As I see it -- I ran into Brett recently and he said, hey, I have got
this small development going on I'm trying to get done. I'm a veterinarian. I heal dogs
for a living. Would you mind taking a look at it and seeing what you think. And so I
said, sure, I would love to. I looked at it. I compared it to the, you know, Meridian
development laws and kind of the Bible that we abide by in this city in terms of
development and I said this looks great. I believe it should be approved. I don't really
see too much of reason why it shouldn't be and he said we have gone through Planning
and Zoning and reworked a few things and asked if I would be here to speak. As I see it
in Meridian we have got a little bit of a problem. We talk about Meridian being a great
place to live, work and raise a family and our housing costs are out of control. Quite
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simply the opportunity to raise a family doesn't exist in Meridian if your household
income isn't north of 150,000 dollars. Under current real estate prices and interest rates
these homes -- I talked with Brett today, he said the goal is to land them at a price of
about 425,000 with 25,000 dollars down and a seven and a half percent interest rate,
which is what things are sitting, you would be looking at about a 3,000 dollar a month
payment. The apartments that had been approved consistently in Meridian, most of
those are right now leasing for 2,000 dollars. So, this would be a step, hopefully, from
those apartments to maybe some single family homes. As I mentioned, I was born and
raised here. I wanted to raise my family here and I experienced this exact same issue
25 years ago when I was married. We wanted to live in Meridian and we could afford a
hundred thousand dollar house and it just wasn't there. So, we moved to Nampa. The
same house in Meridian was 140,000 at that time. But, fortunately, my wife raised our
five children and is raising them right now. My income increased and we were able to
move back and we came back to Meridian as soon as we had the opportunity. We
claim to be a family friendly community. I wonder if we really are.
Strader: Can you complete your thoughts?
Olsen: Yes, I will. We have these rules that are in place to protect the property owners
around us and I believe that this project with the six homes and that 42,5000 dollars fit
within what Meridian is trying to accomplish according to its mission.
Strader: Thank you, Mr. Olsen.
Olsen: Thank you.
Cavener: Council, Vice-President?
Strader: Councilman Cavener. Oh, please stick around if you don't mind for questions.
Olsen: No problem. Yes, sir.
Cavener: Just a -- just a quick question, because, again, I'm remote, so I may not be
hearing you correct and I want to give you a chance to correct the record. But it
certainly sounded like you insinuated that if we are opposed to this project that we
somehow don't subscribe to the notion that Meridian is a family friendly community. 1,
too, have lived in Meridian my entire life and certainly don't feel that way and, frankly,
have never heard somebody make that type of insinuation. So, I wanted to give you a
chance to see if that's truly what you were trying to state or maybe you misspoke or
potentially I misheard you.
Olsen: Sure. Yes. When I -- and maybe I'm a little old school, Mr. Cavener, but
believe that a -- you know, a family friendly community makes it so that people can
afford to live here and I'm just really truly worry that Meridian is priced -- I'm looking
down at you, sorry, because I'm seeing --
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Cavener: That's okay.
Olsen: I really am truly worried that we have kind of priced ourselves out of that. If you
look at Meridian, our population is aging and most of the people that have lived here
and are graduating from local high schools and local colleges simply cannot afford to
live here. The first group that happened to was the north end of Boise. Second it
happened in Eagle and now it's come to Meridian. If you look at the price of real estate
in those areas, Meridian, in terms of -- in terms of the cost of real estate sits about third.
North -- south Meridian sits third, North Meridian sits fourth and so I really worry that we
are pricing ourselves -- for those that have lived here for a while it's okay, sure, but for
new families coming in, yes, sir, I do believe it's an issue.
Cavener: Council Vice-President, follow up?
Strader: Just answering Councilman Cavener's question, just a comment. You know,
the gentrification has been a part of real estate processes in many cities for years. It's
unfortunate, but it is a reality and certainly our, you know, national monetary and fiscal
policy has created a lot of large asset bubbles, including in real estate, and I think it is a
bit of an overstep to accuse the Council of not caring about the cost of housing in our
community. So, I appreciate you answering Councilman Cavener's questions. Does
anyone else have a question for Mr. Olsen? Fantastic. Thank you. You can sit down.
Thanks.
Olsen: All right. Thanks.
Strader: Madam Vice-President, if I may?
Strader: Absolutely, Council -- Council Woman Little Roberts.
Little Roberts: Madam Vice-President. Mr. Olsen.
Olsen: Yes. You're welcome.
Little Roberts: Just off the top of your head about how many homes are for sale right
now in Meridian and about how many of those are at the 425,000 dollar price point or
kind of in that ballpark?
Olsen: I'm glad you asked. I'm glad you asked. I actually looked at it today -- and keep
in mind I do mainly commercial -- commercial groups and commercial assets. But I did
look today and there were currently -- at 425,000 or less homes built right -- south of the
freeway I should say. I didn't look north of the freeway, but where this development is
south of the freeway I looked and it was right around 40 1 believe is how many -- how
many there were and that was under construction or currently on the market.
Little Roberts: Thank you.
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Olsen: Yes. Thanks.
Little Roberts: You're welcome.
Strader: Okay. Any -- this is a public hearing. Any other members of the audience or
the public who would like to testify? Ma'am in the yellow, if you would, please, approach
the podium and, please, let us know your name and address for the public record.
Thank you.
Larrea: Thank you. Thank you, Council. I don't know exactly the proper thing. I am
Jan Larrea. I live at 100 East Rosalyn and I have been here 50 years and I have been
in that house 48 years. We are in the county, so it doesn't really -- there is no -- like
Councilman Overton mentioned, there is no sidewalks and gutters from that property all
the way down the Meridian Road and it's the same -- you know, they came back with
the same plan and I have the same concern. We maintain all the property from our
fence line to the road. It's mowed, taken care of all the way up to Meridian highway.
They are going to be parking there. There is just no doubt about it. They are going to
be parking there. So, it's just too dense. I think they could get by with three or four
houses and it would be great. I know how much they paid for the property. So, it's --
you know, how much profit they want to make, but that's not any of your concern. So,
it's just wrong. It's just too many houses and too many people up and down the road
and they go fast on that road, because they think nobody lives there. So, that's my
concern. Any questions?
Strader: Thank you, ma'am. I'm just checking if there are any questions. Okay. Looks
like there are no questions. Thank you. Okay. I think there was another question the
gentleman with the glasses in the back, please.
Jensen: Good evening, Members of the Meridian City Council. My name is Eric
Jensen. My address is 1763 Micron Lane in Meridian. I'm an Idaho native. I grew up
here in Boise and I moved to Meridian shortly after my wife Mary and I started having
children 20 years ago. My business is also located here in Meridian and I'm proud to
say that I live, work and play in Meridian every day. I have also spent many years in the
past volunteering on various Meridian city boards and committees. Through that time I
have had the pleasure of watching as the city has grown into one of the best places, in
my opinion, to live in the entire valley. Part of what attracted -- attracted us to Meridian
back then was that it was the center of the valley, which was convenient for me in my
real estate business, but also it was an area that we could afford a home here in
Meridian as a young family raising our children. Today, as a real estate broker with 25
years of experience representing buyers and sellers -- sellers around the valley, I see a
growing shortage of smaller, reasonably priced homes that are similar to what me and
my family purchased 20 years ago. Having access to all the sales data I thought it
might be beneficial to share with you some of the challenges that are facing these
young professionals or retirees that may be looking for a smaller, low maintenance
detached home that they can call their own. So, as of today there is only one home for
sale between 1,200 and 1,700 square feet on a smaller low maintenance lot within a
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one mile radius of the proposed development. Expanding my search to the entire area
of Meridian there is only eight homes that fall within that same criteria that somebody
could purchase right now. In the last year within that same one mile radius there were
only 13 homes which were approximate -- there were only 13 homes were sold and
these homes sold in an average of ten days, which is approximately 80 percent faster
than the county average of 49 days, which to me means that there is an outsize
demand for homes like the ones that are being proposed in the Rosalyn Subdivision.
This location is an ideal spot for an in-fill project like this. It's an efficient -- an efficient
use of the existing urban space. It reduces urban sprawl. It's got great walkability to
stores, restaurants and amenities and immediate access to the freeway. It doesn't pose
any additional burden on any of the infrastructure. That's already there in my opinion
and -- and my understanding is that it's still well within the density guidelines for the
Comprehensive Plan. For these reasons I'm in favor of approval for the proposed
Rosalyn Subdivision and if there is any questions I appreciate your time. Thank you.
Strader: Thank you. Okay. Are there any questions for Mr. Jensen? Okay. Thank you.
Okay. Sir, in the green.
Nauslar: Thank you. My name is Nick Nauslar and I live at 215 East Blue Lark Court in
Meridian. I share a fence on the north side of this property and I applaud the Binghams.
I said this in March at the Planning and Zoning Commission for going from seven
townhomes down to six single family. I think some of that was they were never going to
get seven townhomes probably approved. But they did listen to us in that sense. It's
still, you know, by my math violates the R-8 zoning barely, but it does, but I know that's
not exactly a hard and fast rule. But from my perspective -- I know some of the
neighbors may disagree with me, but maybe five single family homes, there would be
no argument from me, because it complies with the zoning, the need for, you know,
smaller single family homes for someone that's moved here relatively recently the cost
of homes is skyrocketing as we moved here and understand how those price points can
accelerate quite quickly. So, understand the need for more homes, especially at this
price point. Also understand the need of return on investment that the Binghams made
and I respect that and applaud them for taking the risk and trying to do this. I just think
it would be better at four to five homes, given the current zoning and just the
construction -- or, excuse me, the design of what they are using in terms of the roads.
My brother -- brother-in-law and cousin are both firefighters in Omaha. I have worked in
wildland fire and so, you know, first responders and emergency services are always on
my mind and that always gives me pause to see those sorts of designs. Thank you.
Strader: Thank you. Are there any questions? Okay. Thanks. Okay. Checking if
there are any other folks in the room who would like to testify. Okay. Going once.
Going twice. And is there anyone online -- if you are online, please, go ahead and use
the raise your hand feature on the Zoom platform to indicate if you would like to testify.
Mr. Clerk, do you have anybody -- I don't see anyone online, but do you see anyone?
Johnson: Madam Vice-President, anyone I don't recognize, but they are not raising
their hand.
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Strader: Okay. Again, we have a second, if you would like to raise your hand. If not --
okay. Thank you. All right. Council, do you have any questions or discussion or should
we go ahead and invite the applicant to close?
Little Roberts: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Council Woman Little Roberts.
Little Roberts: I would like some clarification. We have had a couple of different
discussions regarding the piece -- and this may come from Bill or Stacy -- that they can
go ahead and build if we deny the annexation and as it is, with just kind of carving out
that piece, I just wanted to make sure that that was -- we were understanding that
correctly.
Strader: Thank you. Mr. Nary, would be a good person to answer that in conjunction
with Planning. Thank you.
Nary: And, Madam Vice-President, Members of the Council, Council Member Little
Roberts, the only concern I have is we had that prior discussion is that the way the plat
is currently situated it is included in -- in the plat design, so they would have to redraw
the plat. Now, I would concede to Stacy if they felt comfortable from Planning that if the
plat were to be approved with a requirement that it have to be withdrawn without that
piece, that it wouldn't significantly change the design, then, you could certainly do that.
But that -- I don't know that answers your question. That's my only concern is I think the
prior discussion was we would have to redraw it, because of taking that piece out of it,
but I wasn't sure how much significant that piece is to the rest of the project, so --
Strader: And, Mr. Nary, can I ask a question as well?
Nary: Certainly.
Strader: So, with that if this -- this application and the plat were denied this evening if
they wanted to proceed under the existing zoning would they need to submit a new
plat?
Nary: Madam Vice-President, Members of the Council, yeah, I mean -- so, if -- if the -- if
the plat could not be -- could not be done without that annexed piece without making
significant changes they would have to bring it back. Again, they would still need to
comply with all our code and requirements, which may still look similar, but I just --
again, I -- I'm not a planner, so I couldn't tell you if that piece could simply be excised
out without a significant change to the plan as it's presented.
Strader: Thank you, Mr. Nary. Stacy, over to you. If that little piece were not annexed,
you know, would they meet the dimensional standards? Is that something you have
been able to establish or not?
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Hersh: Madam Vice-President Strader, Members of the Council, so here is their
example. But they would just have to meet the required lot sizes and the required
dimensions for the -- for the lots and the homes on the lots and it looks as though they
can.
Strader: There is a plus and a hash tag -- well, there is a plus and a minus -- that might
be doing some heavy lifting there. So, I'm not sure -- I think in the applicant's closing
remarks it would be important for them to try to walk us through what the plus-minus
means exactly and what the difference is exactly. Thank you. Okay. Council Woman
Little Roberts. Did that answer your questions for staff? Are there any more?
Little Roberts: Yes. Thank you.
Strader: Okay. Fantastic. Okay. All right. Seeing no further questions for the applicant
or staff at this time, I would like to go ahead and invite the applicant up for their closing
remarks. I will check with the clerk. I believe you have ten minutes. Okay. Thank you.
Koeckeritz: Madam Vice-President, Council Members, Elizabeth Koeckeritz with Givens
Pursley. First, to address the lot sizes with the plus-minus, this was not done fully
dimensioned. It was -- no one actually -- it was done as a rough sketch, but not as an
actual plat to be submitted. However, in looking at it each of these lots is enough over
that I think we could get there, where we could meet with the actual architect, land
surveyor and lay it out. Because the minimum size is the 4,000 square feet and so
these are somewhat over it. So, we do believe that we could get there. But this was
just to be more of a rough -- rough showing to show that it still could work, even without
the annexation. I would like to just briefly address -- Council Member Taylor, you asked
why we didn't really come back with that, there really weren't any changes and the
applicants here they explained to you just the hope, the -- the reason why is that they
really wanted to come back and just try to give you a better understanding of why they
had made the choices that they made at the time that they made them and, two, try to
hope to get you to understand better why they made these changes, why they didn't
want to make anymore changes and really leave it at that. But this plat, it does work.
The annexation piece is at the request of the city. How it is currently laid out there
would have to be a little bit of reconfiguring to make this sort of work without the
annexation parcel. However, we are very confident that it could work in the future. As
far as the roads go, it is a road that's been improved up to local road standards. This is
not like some really small tiny road there, it is the road that was improved all of the other
traffic from the remaining subdivision all behind it. They use the same road. It has been
improved. It is something that is used regularly by vehicles, But as you heard most of
the people go up north through the neighborhood to get to the local businesses, rather
than going out onto Meridian Road, which doesn't have sidewalks at this point in time.
Additionally, as far as the hammerheads go, they are approved throughout Meridian.
The drive directly adjacent -- that private drive the individuals park on their driving pads
or in their driveway. There haven't been any real concerns there. The other neighbors
throughout the neighborhood are also able to primarily park on their driving pads. It will
be signed no parking. There can be towing signs as well. And the Binghams intend to
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maintain control and have some control over this for some time, so they will be there
sort of watching these things to make sure that it really does happen. And I guess just in
close, that this property is -- is zoned R-8. It has been zoned R-8 for quite some time
and it does meet all of the dimensional standards for the R-8 zone, excepting those four
lots, all of the rest of the lots surrounding this development are within, you know, 80, a
hundred square feet of where they sit on these lots. It is absolutely congruent with the
neighborhood. It meets all of your zoning standards and requirements. It meets all of
Meridian's parking access lot size, all of those dimensional standards and so we do ask
that it be approved this evening.
Strader: Are there any final questions?
Overton: Madam Mayor -- or Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Council Councilman Overton.
Overton: Put that in the bank.
Strader: I don't know about that one. Go ahead.
Overton: I have got to ask you. I have known Rosalyn since about 1977 and my first
thought -- that was before it was asphalt. What improvements have been done to that
road?
Koeckeritz: The improvements by the house have all been done. As far as continuing
out it's my understanding that it meets the ACHD minimum road requirements.
Overton: For a county road.
Koeckeritz: For a county -- for a county road, yes.
Overton: Correct. Thank you.
Strader: Thank you. Any other questions? Okay. Thank you. Stick around. Okay.
Council, we have heard from the public. We have heard from the applicants. Do we
have any discussion, deliberations, motions?
Overton: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Councilman Overton.
Overton: Where we get into discussion should we close the public hearing? If so, I
move that we close the public hearing.
Little Roberts: Second.
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Strader: Okay. We have a motion and a second to close the public hearing. All those
in favor, please, signify by saying aye. The ayes have it. The public hearing is closed.
MOTION CARRIED: ALLAYES.
Overton: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Councilman Overton.
Overton: I didn't speak much before, because, basically, I spoke before and nothing
really changed. We are looking at the same application that was brought before us
before and my position hasn't changed. When I got on this Council one of the first
things I got involved with was making sure that we don't approve a development that
causes any more danger to anyone on our roadways where we can prevent it from the
very beginning. Having additional cars driving on Rosalyn, which is not built to city
standards, it's not a city residential street, it's a county road, and even though we are
the city, I still respect those areas that are in the county, because they are all around us
and I have remembered them for the last 45, 46, 47 years. I spend my time working
with our transportation planners on trying to enhance the safety of our roadways and
our intersections and I could never in good conscience approve this when I'm dealing
with a roadway I'm adding traffic to that has no curb, gutter, sidewalks or streetlights.
don't like the situation the way it is now, but I wasn't sitting on Council when those
earlier decisions were made. They are there and we have to deal with them. But where
my stance is is from where I sit right now. There is a need for houses this size. I run a
real simple exercise when it comes to projects like this. Two pronged. It's the right
project and the right place. I think there is a need for projects like this, but I think it's the
wrong place and even though we are only talking about an annexation of land here
tonight and the fact that you may still be able to build this regardless of what we do,
cannot support the annexation tonight to build this project in this location.
Strader: Okay. Thank you.
Taylor: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Councilman Taylor.
Taylor: So, I think the answer to my questions, why nothing changed, wasn't to just give
us more information about why we were there, the real answer was because it makes
sense financially. That's the only way it works. I have zero problem with that. I think
that's great. I have no problem with that. I don't even have much of a concern with the
density. Sympathetic to the concerns for the neighbors, but that doesn't bother me.
The school issue, that's not a concern. And I -- the topic that was brought up about
addressing the issue of housing and affordability I mean last week we approved
hundreds of homes and we took a lot of heat for that approval and continue to do so.
So, definitely you will hear me often say the solution to our housing problem is more
housing, because that brings supply and demand online and that brings it down. We
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are a little bit of a victim of our own success for having such a great community,
because everybody wants to come here and I agree unless something changes in 20
years Meridian is going to be the city of older people and not younger families and that
really bothers me and concerns me. So, I do constantly struggle with that. So, I do
appreciate the idea of bringing some more homes on. In terms of access with the
hammerhead -- again, I'm just going to repeat that. I know you can say that the HOA
and the Binghams will watch it and help to kind of manage it, but this property will be
here in 50 years -- in 40 years and it's going to outlast the people in this room and I
think the concern is still really valid. When my Meridian Police Department says tonight
we have a big problem with hammerheads, it sticks out in my mind, so I think I'm
inclined to not support the application tonight, even though that probably goes against
what I typically would say, because objective -- if someone is objectively meeting all the
criteria we laid out, it's really hard for me to -- to not say, then, yes, let's move forward.
But there is a measure of subjective analysis that we have to put into this and I'm just
going to kind of echo what Councilman Overton said about this, it just doesn't seem like
it's a good idea and for me it's a public safety component. I have no problem, again,
with the density or any of that. I like -- I like the homes. I have been complimentary of
that. But I'm bothered by that and I don't in good conscience feel like I should say that
it's okay to move ahead. So, tonight I'm going to -- I'm going to be opposed to this
application.
Strader: Thank you.
Little Roberts: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Council Woman Little Roberts.
Little Roberts: Madam Vice-President, I'm definitely struggling. Gone back and forth.
We have worked diligently over the years to try to get great in-fill projects and I do
believe that this meets that criteria. Definitely bothers me about the hammerhead. I
understand that it meets all the regulations, but when fire brings up again that doesn't
feel like it's optimal as far as safety and, then, didn't realize about the road that
Councilman Overton has brought up from his years of experience with police, those
both concern me, but, on the other hand, I'm also -- you know, like to honor the hard
work of our staff and we asked for this potential enclave to be annexed and so that
weighs heavily on me, too, because we have worked diligently trying to get these
enclaves annexed in. So, honestly, I am still -- I'm leaning more towards supporting the
project, but there is definitely my concerns, but I think that their diligence in working with
and creating an HOA and making sure that they work with the fire for whatever would
remediate Fire's concerns, whether it's posted that it's towed or things like that, I think
that we can work with that. So, I will be supporting the project.
Strader: Okay. Thank you.
Cavener: Council Vice-President.
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Strader: Councilman -- Council President Cavener.
Cavener: Thank you, Council Vice-President.
Strader: Get a little closer if you can.
Cavener: Sorry. I was hoping it would help, but maybe not. A quick question for -- for
staff.
Strader: I don't think we can hear you at all. Just a minute. Just hold on a second.
Chris is going to adjust the volume.
Cavener: Check one. Check two. Better? There we go. All right. Thank you, Council
Vice-President Strader. A question for staff. It seems a little bit -- it sounds like at least
two of my colleagues are in opposition. I remain opposed to this project. It's a -- it's a
bad project. Our -- we -- we all have different philosophies about the proper role of
government, but I think we all agree that health and safety and well-being of our
community is what makes Meridian a family friendly community and those are going to
be my biggest concerns about this project, because I don't -- I wouldn't want my kids
living in this house with the challenges with the streets. I think the challenge with the
hammerhead, I hope there is no emergencies that are going to be needed. We are
going to have a real big challenge if this project is built. Which brings me to my
question for staff. Because the applicant said they will move forward with this project
regardless, are there any recommendations -- or I don't know if we can implement a
development agreement or something along those lines that give greater protections for
towing, emergency response -- I mean, candidly, I will just -- I will just be frank. I -- the
applicant says they are -- they are Meridian people. I believe that. They said they care
about our community. They care about our neighbors. That the right decision here is to
withdraw this project and come back and bring something that's better. And because
there has been a lot of insinuations tonight about our community, I guess I will make
one, which is that if you care about our community you should withdraw the project and
bring back something that's more in line with what our community desires. If you don't
want to do that I think that we need staff to work with them to put added mitigations in to
make this a safer project. So, that would be my question for staff, if there is anything
that we can do around that. I sure hope there is, because that is the -- the best worst
scenario that we could explore.
Strader: Thank you. I will go to Stacy first from Planning's perspective, what guardrails
could be put in place here?
Hersh: Madam Vice-President Strader, President Cavener and Members of the Council,
so we can add Fire's comments about no parking signs in the development agreement,
but I -- Bill might have to weigh in on towing signs. I don't know that we can control
putting towing signs up on the common drive.
Strader: Okay.
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Cavener: Madam Vice-President Strader, some -- maybe quick question as well on that
for Fire. Could we require these homes to be sprinklered?
Bongiorno: Absolutely.
Strader: Okay.
Bongiorno: If you guys wish that is another option you can do.
Strader: I like that that's creative and might solve the issue to some extent, although I
don't know the cost. Thank you. Mr. Nary, do you have anything to add from a legal
perspective?
Nary: So, Madam Vice-President, Members of Council, I would agree with Stacy, we
can certainly require signage, because this is a driveway not a road we couldn't require
towing off of that. So, there is no -- no tow requirements that we could impose on that
and I don't know from -- Deputy Chief would know better to me on whether or not there
is any requirement -- minimum requirements to require houses be sprinkled. I know we
have had that question when dealing with access issues regarding secondary access,
but I -- I'm not aware of any other project we have had of this size that we have required
that, so --
Strader: Okay. Thank you, Mr. Nary. But legally is there any reason that we would not
be able to require sprinklers?
Nary: Madam Vice-President, I guess that's the question I don't know. We haven't
talked about that previously and Deputy Chief Bongiorno and I, but I can't think of one
project of this size that we have ever required it. So, I don't know what requirements
might -- might be a trigger. We haven't talked about that and that hasn't been discussed
throughout this project. So, I don't know.
Strader: Okay. Did that answer all of your questions? Council President Cavener.
Okay. Just -- just to add my thoughts. I also am opposed to this project. I don't think
that this is the right project in the right place at the right time. I agree it is critical that we
continue to approve housing in the City of Meridian and we are absolutely doing that,
despite a lot of challenges that come with growth, but in this case I share the concern
around parking and safety and I think those concerns kind of go together, as well as,
you know, adding more density along a county road that does not have any of the, you
know, amenities that we would expect in the City of Meridian. I think it remains to be
seen and I think the neighbors probably understand this, but if this is denied this
evening that doesn't mean that this project might not happen, it could -- it's possible that
it will still move forward. I think it remains to be seen and it's a question about whether,
in fact, they will be able to meet the city's requirements, you know, with six lots and not
that little annexed piece. I don't know. I don't think we received a direct answer to that
question. A probably was the answer. So, you know, we will have to see on that. But
overall I'm where Councilman Overton is in the sense that at the end of the day there is
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a level of subjectivity and just a question of is this the right project. I don't think that this
is the right project for this location at this time. So, I think it sounds like we have -- we
have got -- with the exception of one person I think we have some alignment. So, I will
ask the Council if there are some motions they would like to entertain at this time.
Taylor: Council Vice-President Strader, just to clarify. So, obviously, I think we know
where the Council's feeling is on this, but in terms of a development agreement with any
additional guardrails, would that be -- would we need to have that as part of the motion
tonight to instruct the staff to work on a new development agreement with the applicant
on that? I'm just not clear what's required. This is, essentially, a new application. So,
can you clarify, because I think there is a consensus -- obviously we are not approving
this, but if we are to ask for some guardrails to be in place do we do that in the motion
tonight?
Strader: That's a great question. Well, I think maybe before we go to that question I
would like to ask the applicant maybe one more time if they would like to withdraw their
application this evening or if they would like us to go ahead and -- and vote, because I
would like to give them that opportunity.
Cavener: Madam Vice-President, do we need to reopen the public hearing, then, on
that?
Strader: My apologies. Yeah. That would require opening the public hearing again.
Cavener: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Yes, Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: I move that we reopen the public hearing to allow the applicant an opportunity
to provide input.
Strader: A second?
Overton: Second.
Strader: Okay. Great. Would the applicant or the applicant's representative like to
approach in a second when you have a chance to --
Cavener: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Yes, Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: I recognize probably a lot was thrown out at the applicant. Certainly if they
need a few minutes to confer if we want to recess for a few minutes. I --
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Strader: That's what I was just thinking. Let's go ahead and take like a ten minute
recess to give the applicant and everyone a chance to take a bio break, get a cup of
water and, hopefully, we will hear from them. Thank you.
(Recess: 7:33 p.m. to 7:43 p.m.)
Strader: Okay. Welcome back, everyone. Go ahead and come back from our recess.
And I would like to recognize the applicant. If you could, please, approach and
comment on whether you are open to withdraw or you just would like to move forward
this evening with a decision. Thank you.
Koeckeritz: Elizabeth Koeckeritz. Givens Pursley. Madam Vice-President, City Council
Members, the applicant would actually ask for one more continuance to see if there is a
way to come up with a financially viable smaller lot subdivision that really meets some of
your concerns without having -- that still allows the property to be annexed, which is
something the city had requested to -- without having to go back through the entire
reapplication neighborhood process -- neighborhood meeting process. It seems like
that's what we are hearing and so that's what they would -- that is what we would ask
for at this point in time. If we are unable to come up with something that works for that,
then, they would intend on just withdrawing the application.
Strader: Okay. Thank you for that feedback. Councilman Overton.
Overton: Madam Vice-President.
Strader: Yes.
Overton: We need a continuance date before we move forward and close the public
hearing.
Johnson: I was going to defer to the applicant, Madam Vice-President.
Taylor: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Councilman Taylor.
Taylor: If you were to have a continuance -- four weeks, six weeks, 12 weeks, what --
what's the -- four weeks?
Strader: Just some feedback. I do feel like the purpose of the continuance last time
was for this very purpose and if I were putting my -- we tried to -- we always are trying to
find compromises, you know, that work. If I'm putting myself in the shoes of the public I
think I would have a level of frustration here around the number of continuances. So, let
me mull that over for a second, too. And, then, I will check with other Council Members
how they are feeling about that as well. Council President Cavener, you are speaking,
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but we cannot hear you, so we will give you a minute to get a little closer, please.
Thank you. You are on mute still.
Cavener: Yeah. I was -- I was on mute. Boy, way above my technical expertise. So --
and Elizabeth had sat down. But my question would be -- Council President Strader,
your feedback has -- is exactly where I am. The members of the public had been
through Planning and Zoning, a couple of City Council meetings, and what -- I guess
what I'm looking for is -- I don't want the members of the public to have to come to
another City Council meeting to learn, then, that the applicant intends to withdraw their
application and so I think some commitment from the applicant that they are either
going say bring something back that is in line with the feedback that Council has
provided that they have heard from the community or notice of their intent to withdraw to
give the members of the HOA and our community that have been coming to these
meetings to keep them informed, so that they aren't giving up yet another night to come
down here only to find out that their intention is to withdraw.
Strader: Thank you, Council President Cavener. I think that's some fantastic feedback
for you to comment on, please. It is very frustrating for members of the public to find out
something's being withdrawn right before a meeting, so --
Koeckeritz: Madam Vice-President, Council Member Cavener, that is in -- that -- I agree
that is a very good point. It is strange to look down on you standing right here. But,
yes, we would commit to withdrawing with adequate time to notice -- to let people know
that this would not be coming forward.
Strader: Uh-huh. And I have a further question. Will we be seeing an application with a
reduction in density.
Koeckeritz: That is the intent, if they can go back, look at it, financially make it work.
Strader: I would highly encourage you to take that approach, yeah, of reducing the
density significantly in order to garner an approval if possible. Thank you. Okay. Sorry.
Because our -- Mr. Freeze, I will go ahead and recognize you quickly for relevant
comments specific to the possibility of a continuance, please. Thank you.
Freeze: Again it's Ken Freeze. 195 East Rosalyn. If they come back with a plan that
has three or four homes, I can virtually guarantee the endorsement of that project from
the HOA.
Strader: Thank you, sir. Fantastic. Okay. And that wasn't -- it sort of related to
continuance, but I think it gives us all really good feedback to go off of what some folks
would like to see. Okay. Okay. So, four weeks from now. Do we have some dates
from the clerk that will work? Fantastic. Okay. We are going to need to close the public
hearing once again and, then, we can entertain -- oh, no. I'm sorry. We will keep the
public hearing open, but I would entertain a motion for continuance at this time.
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Overton: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Councilman Overton.
Overton: The dates June 18th or June 25 for a continuance.
Strader: Okay. If the applicant could go ahead and provide some feedback on those
dates real quick. I'm sorry, you need to come to the microphone here a little closer for
Dean and all of us to have an accurate record.
Koeckeritz: What are the dates after that? I have a long-scheduled vacation under two
weeks.
Strader: Okay.
Overton: Madam Vice-President.
Strader: Yes, Councilman Overton.
Overton: The date after that appears to be July 9th.
Koeckeritz: July 9th works great.
Strader: Okay. Thank you.
Overton: Madam Vice-President, should we now close the public hearing?
Strader: That would be fantastic if you would move to do that. Move to close the public
hearing.
Strader: Okay.
Johnson: Madam Vice-President, you will keep that public hearing open for the
continuance.
Overton: Oh. Pardon me.
Strader: Well, we made the same mistake twice. Mr. Clerk, I apologize. Councilman
Overton.
Overton: Madam Vice-President, I withdraw that motion to close.
Strader: Withdraw accepted.
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Overton: Make a motion to continue File No. H-2023-0056 to the hearing date of July
9th, 2024, to allow the applicant to meet with staff to see if they can come up with a
suitable density level for this project before being brought back.
Cavener: Second.
Strader: Okay. Do I have a second? Fantastic. We have got a motion and a second to
continue the public hearing to July 9th. Do we need a roll call on this? Okay. All those
in favor signify by saying aye. Nays? The ayes have it and the application is continued.
Thank you everyone for your patience. I know it's been a very long process, but
hopefully we will get it right. Okay?
MOTION CARRIED: ALLAYES.
Cavener: Council Vice-President Strader.
Strader: Council President Cavener. Yes.
Cavener: Real quick. I apologize for being out of order. Sometimes we have an
opportunity for comment before a vote. Just real quick if I may, just a quick moment of
privilege. You all know how much I love City Council. You know how much I love our
community. I'm fiercely defensive about our community and our Council and sometimes
that passion and enthusiasm bubbles over, particularly in a hotel room in Denver,
Colorado. I allowed my emotions to get the best of me this evening and I just would like
to take a quick opportunity to apologize to the applicant, staff, the public and certainly
you all, Council. I am always constantly trying to improve and apologies for letting my
emotions get the best of me.
Strader: Council President Cavener, that's very thoughtful. I think all of us have
positive intentions for our community and it comes out in different ways, that passion,
and including members of the audience and that's okay. I think, you know, robust
discussion is fine and robust defense of City Council is fine, et cetera. So, thank you.
FUTURE MEETING TOPICS.
Strader: Are there any future meeting topics?
Cavener: Council Vice-President Strader?
Strader: Yes.
Cavener: I promised folks I had a goal not to talk very much tonight. So, I apologize.
Just real quick before we adjourn. I just want to take one more moment of privilege and
commend our Vice-President for doing an exceptional job as being traffic cop in
tonight's meeting. This was thrust upon you and you have led admirably and just
Meridian City Council Work Session
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appreciate your great work. We are all very lucky to have you steering the ship for us
tonight.
Strader: Oh, that's so nice. Thank you. All right. To keep this on the rails and finish
strong, okay, is there -- I will entertain a motion to adjourn.
Overton: Madam Vice-President?
Strader: Councilman Overton.
Overton: Motion that we adjourn.
Strader: Fantastic. We have a motion to adjourn. All those in favor signify by saying
aye. We are adjourned. Have a great evening.
MOTION CARRIED: ALLAYES.
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 7:54 P.M.
(AUDIO RECORDING ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
5 / 28 / 2024
COUNCIL VICE-PRESIDENT LIZ STRADER DATE APPROVED
ATTEST:
CHRIS JOHNSON - CITY CLERK