HomeMy WebLinkAbout2003-07-18
August 15, 2003
MERIDIAN CITY COUNCIL MEETING
APPLICANT
August 19, 2003
j-B
ITEM NO.
REQUEST
Approve minutes of July 18, 2003 City Council Budget Workshop:
AGENCY
COMMENTS
CITY CLERK:
CITY ENGINEER:
CITY PLANNING DIRECTOR:
CITY ATTORNEY
CITY POLICE DEPT:
CITY FIRE DEPT:
CITY BUILDING DEPT:
CITY WATER DEPT:
CITY SEWER DEPT:
CITY PARKS DEPT:
MERIDIAN SCHOOL DISTRICT:
ADA COUNTY HIGHWAY DISTRICT:
SANITARY SERVICE COMPANY
CENTRAL DISTRICT HEALTH:
NAMP A MERIDIAN IRRIGATION:
SETTLERS IRRIGATION:
IDAHO POWER:
US WEST:
INTERMOUNTAIN GAS:
MERIDIAN POST OFFICE:
OTHER:
~
[Nf
Date:
Staff Initials:
Phone:
Contacted:
Emailed:
Materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City at Meridian.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18. 2003
The Special Budget Workshop of the Meridian City Council was called to order at
8:03 A.M. on Friday, July 18, 2003, by Council President Tammy de Weerd.
Members Present: Cherie McCandless, Tammy de Weerd, Keith Bird, and Bill
Nary.
Members Absent: Mayor Robert D. Corrie.
Others Present: Stacy Kilchenmann, Reta Cunningham, Gary Smith, Pauline
Skeggs, and Will Berg.
Item 1.
Roll-call Attendance:
X Tammy de Weerd X
X Cherie McCandless X
o Mayor Robert Corrie
Bill Nary
Keith Bird
De Weerd: I will to order this Special Budget Workshop Meeting to order. It's
Friday, July 18th at 8:03. I'll ask the City Clerk to call roll. Mayor Corrie will soon
arrive.
Item 2.
Adoption of the Agenda:
De W eerd: Okay I would accept a motion to adopt the agenda.
Bird: So moved as printed.
Nary: Second.
De Weerd: Okay it's been moved and seconded to adopt the agenda as printed.
All those in favor say aye. All ayes motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES
Item 3.
Presentation and Discussion of the City Proposed Budget:
HUMAN RESOURCES
De Weerd: The first item we have is-
Skeggs: Compensation.
Bird: Compensation.
i
Meridian City Council Speclalbudget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 2 of 108
De Weerd: Must be out of order. We're doing compensation first?
Skeggs: That's what I was told. Is that correct Stacy?
Bird: No.
Kilchenmann: Yes because I did the revenue yesterday.
De Weerd: Okay works for us.
Skeggs: Well Council Members, Mayor is not here. I am aware the financial
situation that the city is facing and I have heard from some of the Council
Members that you are considering no 0 r small increase for compensation this
year. What I had proposed that's in your manual to account in the beginning of
May, may no longer be applicable. It was to give a five percent pool of money
towards merit increases that would give an average employee three percent.
The five percent pool would also help to bring our pay for performance back in
line with the matrix that was set up when we had implemented the program. For
the past two years, a pool of three percent had been given and therefore some of
our employees are running behind our program. An employee needs to receive
an average of three percent to stay in line with our compensation program. The
increases are based on midpoint of the salary range. Receiving a three percent,
increase would give an average employee in the salary range an opportunity to
just stay in line with our program. It takes five years for an employee to reach the
midpoint of the salary range and then six years to reach the maximum of a range.
Therefore, it should take a total of 11 years for an employee to reach the end of
the range and the employees with excels or outstanding performance should
actually be running further beyond what our program has. The proposal for a five
percent pool of money was to give a marginal employee nothing and an
employee at satisfactory level a three percent competent would be four, excels
would be five and outstanding would be six. For an example, the employees who
were rated satisfactory last year only received a one percent increase.
Therefore, they would be running behind our program since it takes a three
percent to stay in line with the program. This year if they were to receive a
satisfactory, they would get a three percent increase, which just keeps them
barely in line with our program. Last year an employee who either excelled or
had outstanding performance were the ones that stood in line with the program
where if an employee just had satisfactory they fell below what we had set up
when we initially implemented our program. Since I haven't been given clear
direction on what the Council has considered for merit increase and knowing that
there is a significant increase to our health insurance premiums this year I would
recommend if you choose n ot tog 0 with either a five percent, fou r percent 0 r
three percent pool of money if compensation is given that is less than three
percent that you would consider doing it across the board for all those non-union
employees and the pay for performance program and the Police STEP Program.
Then no further compensation would be given for the remainder of the year. If
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 3 of 108
money is put into the pool that is less than three, percent it may be a hardship for
those employees who.are earning a lower salary. If they were to get satisfactory,
they wouldn't get any increase at all and then we're going to ask them to pay
more for their benefits. They would actually be bringing home less in their
paycheck then they are bringing home now. The Benefits Committee got
together last week and we did do a survey. We had asked employees what was
more important benefits or pay and the majority 57 employees basically chose
both. They said pay and benefits were equally important however pay was more
important than benefits to some employees it ran 42 to 33. I understand that
accounting had given you a merit scenario worksheet that went from one percent
to five percent to show you what the cost would be. Therefore, I am confident
that you will do what you feel what is best for the city. I would also ask I think
there is only one Department Head here to give you any feedback or any
recommendations on consideration to the merit program that Gary feels
passionate about because there are no other Department Heads here. Gary do
you want to add anything.
Nary: Will is here and Stacy is here.
Skeggs: And Will that's right.
Kilchenmann: I was just going to say that she was originally scheduled for 8:30
so they may show up later. We could discuss - then the Mayor had also
mentioned doing like a three percent merit pool so I don't know if he's going to be
here soon. Then maybe he could discuss that.
Nary: Madam President.
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Pauline, I guess one thing I'm curious about in all the material I've read
and what you've said is, is the program that we've had in place you know took
nothing into consideration this cost of living raise has it went on top of -
Skeggs: No because the cost of living basically shifts the salary ranges. It's just
keeping employees in line with the inflation. If we gave a cost of living of two
percent then the range has shifted two percent. When the employees got the
cost of living, they went back into the same place that they were in the range
before. It didn't go towards any merit. It just kept our program moving forward.
Nary: And what are the particular dollars that increases cost to the employees
on the benefits side then.
Skeggs: Well they're going with Option 2 on the benefits side that the committee
- well we actually went and took a survey and we just asked employees what
option do you want Option 1 or Option 2. Option 1 was basically to increase the
i
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 4 of 108
deductible from 250 individual and 500 family to 500 individual and 1,000 family
and have the dual option program of the traditional or the PPO. That increase I
think from accounting was going to be like a 23 percent because it would reduce
it from 34 percent that's what Blue Cross is asking. Option 2 was basically leave
the deductible the same at 250 and 500 family and to ask those employees in the
traditional plan that if they wanted to keep the traditional that we were only go to
pay for the PPO portion of it so they would have to pay the difference for the
traditional plan. However, in determining that that would save I think that was
like 20 it would reduce it down to like 21 percent. The committee found out that if
we don't have 20 percent of the employees choose the traditional plan then Blue
Cross wouldn't allow us to offer it. We would have to go totally PPO. We don't
know those employees - there was only 28 employees that said they wanted
Option 1 which was the higher deductible and than the Traditional PPO. Since
we were changing and having the employees pay the traditional portion on
Option 2, 119 employees voted f or Option 2 . We're not sure f rom those 119
employees how many employees would stay on the Traditional Plan. With the
number of employees on our plan right now we would need 36 employees to stay
on the Traditional Plan. Even those employees that were single where we were
paying the total amount on Option 2 if they wanted to stay on the Traditional Plan
they would have to pay $55 a month which right now the employees on family
are paying $56. I know like for an employee and spouse it was $178 a month
difference. For employee and family it was $226.
Nary: To stay on the traditional.
Skeggs: To stay on the traditional. If they went on the PPO then it was lower. I
think for - well it would be zero for an employee only. For employee and spouse
it would be I think it was $81 and for employee and family - do you remember
Gary? It was like 90 something and that was it. We're not sure how the
employees will enroll but it may be that we're going to end up going to a PPO
Plan only.
Nary: And on the options, if we don't provide an option and they only move
everybody to the PPO Plan is there any conflict?
Skeggs: No, we asked Blue Cross and they said no. That was our first question
we asked Blue Cross. We were hoping for that.
McCandless: Madam President.
De Weerd: Mrs. McCandless.
McCandless: Pauline I guess I don't understand. If a person had to go on PPO
if they use someone that was not on the preferred list, would they not get any
insurance at all?
(
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 5 of 108
Skeggs: No they would they would just have to pay. Blue Cross would only pay
what's reasonable and customary for that procedure.
McCandless: I see.
Skeggs: Then either they could go back to that doctor and ask them to write off
the difference or actually, the doctor can back bill them for the difference for that.
In actuality in Option 2, employees would be encouraged to utilize the PPO
doctors if they wanted that benefit. There are 85 percent of the PPO doctors in
Treasure Valley now participating. There were only like 60 percent two years
ago. It's now been around in Idaho for a while so doctors are now getting familiar
with it. I know I tell employees if their doctor is not on the PPO Plan to ask their
doctor if they would be interested in enrolling and then all they have to do is call
Blue Cross to get on the program.
McCandless: Okay thanks.
Skeggs: Since the Mayor is not here I would actually like to review the Police
STEP Program also. Every year and on an ongoing basis I review and look at
positions within the city to see if they're competitive to the market and also
internal equity. This year the Police Department, the STEP Program was
reviewed by the assistance of an outside consultant. For the most part, we felt
that the program was in line and that we were paying the individuals in line with
other agencies. However, with the exception of Seargents and Lieutenants these
two positions were lagging the market. Seargents were lagging at the entry level
of 16 percent and at the end of the STEP Program by six percent Lieutenants
were lagging 9.64 at the entry then at the end they came out okay. They were
only 1.75 percent. When we implemented the program back in 2000, we had
condensed the ranges for Seargent and Lieutenants to five percent instead of the
10 percent difference from the other classifications police officers and detectives.
It was to save the city money and at that time, it didn't have an impact on any of
those employees in that classification because they were above the entry of the
range. However, when Chief Worley reorganized the department last year it
would impact eight employees who are in the Seargent Lieutenants positions.
It's six Seargent it would impact and two Lieutenants. By adjusting the ranges to
five percent, it would bring those ranges in line with other agencies. The cost to
do that for the city would be $11,796.20, which I had stated, would impact eight
employees. Chief Worley was given this information and he had agreed that the
program needed to be adjusted to make his department competitive with other
agencies. Since he's not h ere right now if hew anted to comment 0 n t hat. I
would ask Council Member Nary if Chief had discussed this with you you being
his liaison. I had sent you that packet too. That would be the only impact to the
Police STEP Program to bring them back and in line to be an adjustment of that
$11,000.
De Weerd: Council is there any questions?
I
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 6 of 10B
Bird: Madam President.
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: This STEP thing is something that we had set up, in fact, we were going to
try to set it up throughout the whole city, and hopefully we will. I hate to see us
fall behind that drastic. I realize this but we didn't bring on the economy and if
you look out in the private world there is not a lot of raises being given out there
the five percent, three percent and all of this stuff. This is something we have to
wrangle with and stuff. I hate to see us fall behind when we get these STEP
programs going because they are the easy way to stay up and keep our pay and
stuff up where it should be. Hopefully we can figure out somehow to fund these
STEP programs and get them going. We're just going to have to tighten our
belts and see what we can. I'm like Mr. Nary and I were talking earlier there are
a lot of things in these budgets that are I think so blown out of proportion. They
throw in $12,000 and forfive years haven't used a penny of it in the budgets and
stuff on some of these areas. Hopefully we can get some of this switched across
and get to the wages. I don't want to lose this STEP Program that we have got
going and I don't want to get way behind because once you get way behind then
you're always catching up. This is something I think we need to implement
throughout the city, which Pauline was working on and is working on continually.
Skeggs: Yes the cost for that right now for this year though because you have to
give the equity adjustment and bring employees in line it would cost the city far
more. I know with the financial consideration it wouldn't be applicable for this
year.
(Mayor returned at 8:17 A.M.)
Bird: No.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I understand that consideration Pauline but it's hard to consider just
one class of employees to bring them in line and not all the other employees.
Skeggs: That's why I had recommended because the only bargaining union is
the Fire Department so if you were going to consider less than a three percent
increase that you would give ita cross the board. Even into the Police STEP
Program where they would get like if you considered a two percent increase then
it would just be across the board for all those employees and then no further
increase for the remainder of the budget year. Whether they were on the STEP
Program or on the Pay for Performance Program as well because those
Meridian City Council Speciall:ludget Workshop
July 18,2003
Pg. 7 of 108
employees on the Pay for Performance Program have been running behind the
program for the past two years where the STEP Program have been in line with
our program.
De Weerd: Now with the STEP Program they're getting an Increase anyway
aren't they?
Skeggs: Well I think t hat the money was put into the budget is that correct?
Again, they're non-union bargaining employees so that would be a consideration
for Council to take into when you make your decision on whether you wanted to
keep that in there or to utilize that money towards an increase for all employees.
De Weerd: What would be the difference there Reta?
Cunningham: It's like $45,000. You mean in the STEP increases?
De Weerd: Yes. If instead of the STEP increases that they got what all the other
employees got.
Cunningham: If they were just to get like a two percent flat?
De Weerd: Yes.
Cunningham: I actually have in the merit because if you look at these merit
increases like the one percent, two, three, four, and five that already includes the
Police STEP increases. There STEP increases were $37,000 just in wages and
you had the taxes and benefits. If we just put the flat two percent and then I took
out the STEP increases for the police then we would pay $76,000 for general
fund. If we give a three percent we pay, $135,000 and that took out the STEP.
Do you guys want to see the - so the STEP Plan is actually $46,000 is what we
have in the budget for their STEP Plan. That gave increases only to those - we
have some that are already over the STEP Plan so we didn't give them the
increases we were only looking at those employees that were do the next - their
increase. Does that make any sense? You can see this officer here he's already
paid over the STEP Plan so I put in for a zero STEP increase. The same down
here. All of them that I've highlighted this employee is over the plan so no
increase.
Skeggs: They would be over the plan if they had exceeded seven years of
employment with the city. The STEP Program goes to seven years.
De Weerd: So Reta is that the cost difference then the numbers you're giving us
or that would be then less what the STEP -
Cunningham: The cost difference if you mean if we don't give the STEP
increases?
i
(0"
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18,2003
Pg. 8 of 108
De Weerd: Yes.
Cunningham: Yes it's $46,000.
De Weerd: And the across the board is what?
Cunningham: It depends on what percent you're going to give.
De Weerd: Okay let's just say it flat.
Nary: 76 for two and 135 for three.
De Weerd: Okay. Then you would minus out the $46,000.
Cunningham: I already did.
Nary: That's already done.
Bird: That's already taken out.
De Weerd: Okay.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: With that flat two or three percent would that cover the increase from the
cost of the medical coverage?
Skeggs: It probably would come close of where it would even it out.
Cunningham: Except for Option 2 if they stay traditional.
Skeggs: Right if they stay traditional no they would have to pay the difference. It
would probably flatten it out if they went to the PPO Plan, which I think most
employees would because that's what it's encouraging them to do. Some of the
employees said well you're forcing us and I said well we're strongly encouraging
that.
Nary: Ufe doesn't always have choices.
Skeggs: That's true.
De Weerd: But that is a choice.
f
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 9 of 108
Skeggs: Yes, if they want the traditional they pay the difference.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: So in Option 2 you're calling it as a benefit cut. A cut in benefits but
they're still getting the same the $250 deductible and $500 so it's not really a cut
it's a choice. Either if they want to keep the traditional then they have to pay
more but if they don't they're not really getting a cut in benefits.
Skeggs: The only reason it would be a cut is if you didn't give any increases at
all and then they had to pay more for their benefits. They would actually be
bringing home less in their paycheck then they are today if there was no
consideration for increase and their benefits went up. The PPO is also going up
slightly too so they would be paying more for the PPO then they were paying for
the traditional right now I think it's going up from the traditional is $56 and it's
going up to like 90 something for a family. Where employee and spouse would
have been $40 no $36 and it's going up to like $81.
De Weerd: But we're covering the employee.
Skeggs: Right.
De Weerd: That's a huge increase. What is it in the PPO?
Skeggs: The PPO Plan?
De Weerd: Yes.
Skeggs: That's what it is in the PPO Plan. It would go up.
De Weerd: Oh, it would go up 50 to 90?
Skeggs: Yes that's if they chose the traditional. When we did the options as to
paying, reducing it - I guess Janice brought in some calculations that she just
plugged in. I think it went from like employee and spouse from 36 to 58 so it
reduced it down.
De Weerd: For the PPO.
Skeggs: Yes but what we had done is that we're looking at combing our short-
term disability, long-term disability, and life, which is going to save the city some
money on a monthly basis. If we use those dollars to cover the increase then it
would reduce it from the $80 like employee and spouse to like $58. Really, they
would only be paying $18 more a month by doing it that way. We would use
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 10 of 108
those monies and transfer it over so instead of being an 80 percent that the city
pays and 20 percent it would be like an 83 percent that the city paid towards their
benefits. We would pay a little more.
Corrie: And that's keeping the same amount of money in that pool of money?
Skeggs: Right. The Mayor was going to discuss the benefits portion with you
guys.
Corrie: We definitely don't want to give them less but also you want to make
sure that we don't give them less in their paycheck too. That's going to be a
double-whammy. They're going to really look at that. I think if we do what
Pauline is suggesting it would take care of that. We can still give them a choice
and I think the majority of them will take the PPO. There's about 95 percent or
90 percent of the physicians are on that. You maybe have some specialties like
your anesthesiologist, neurologists some of those that aren't on it. I looked at it
and there's not that many physicians that are not on there.
Skeggs: Right, yes.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: But if we give it across the board like you're suggesting to then absorb the
cost - it would essentially absorb the cost of the increase on the PPO Plan. The
employees who don't have families or spouses actually get an increase right?
Skeggs: Yes.
Nary: So if we wanted to just absorb the cost of the medical for everyone rather
than in across the board there wouldn't necessarily be any increase for
employees that don't have spouses or families to include that everybody would
still get the same paycheck.
Skeggs: Right. Like if you opted to not allow the employees to pay more than
they're paying now and you use those monies towards the benefits then say that
there won't be a merit increase but you're absorbing the cost for the benefits yes.
Nary: Yes.
Kilchenmann: As an employee with nobody else on the insurance I don't find
that fair. That's like I don't know.
Cunningham: A family employee gets more benefit than a single employee as
far as dollars.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 11 of 108
Kilchenmann: Because I could put my spouse on and then I would increase the
cost to the city but really he doesn't need it because he carries his own
insurance. I have made that choice to save the city money.
Nary: But I guess it just depends on the opposite though is if we just gave it
across the board this person who sits next to you who has a spouse really gets
no increase and you do just because you just don't happen to have a spouse or a
family. I don't know that that's fair either. I mean it just depends on which side of
the coin you're sitting on right?
Skeggs: It's a tough decision that you guys' have to make. I'm glad I'm not on
the other end. It was really difficult for the Benefits Committee because initially
when we did the survey we got - we didn't get a high percentage of employees
that responded back to the survey. We went back out, solicited them one on
one, and asked them to sign off on whether they wanted Option 1, Option 2, or if
they had no opinion at all. We had them sign the form and had their name on it
and that's when we got back 119 responded for Option 2 and 28 for Option 1.
The committee was having a rough time making that decision because if we
made the decision then the employees would complain and now we can say well
we went with Option 2 because it was the majority of the employees had voted
for this option.
Kilchenmann: Pauline can you talk about what some of the other cities are
doing?
Skeggs: As far as the increases. Well some of the other cities that I had given
you in a list when we had gathered survey information increases were ranging
anywhere from 1.5 percent to 5 percent. Those were just proposals none of
those had been approved. I think right now the City of Boise I think they - Bill did
they go with the 2.5 but that was just to absorb the benefit cost? That was my
understa nd ing.
Nary: Yes.
De Weerd: So they didn't see any increase in the wages but they didn't get any
decrease because they're maintaining the benefits.
Skeggs: Yes.
Nary: Right and for Boise we still have to pay our co-pay. We still have to pay
our portion it was just to not offset the increase. I think what we were talking
about was absorbing the entire increase right so it's a little bit different.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 1 S, 2003
Pg. 12 of 108
Skeggs: Well I know Nampa has a STEP Program that they had implemented
and sot hey are giving a two percent just to keep them in line with the STEP
Program so they don't go behind and that's it.
Bird: Yes I think Nampa got theirs implemented throughout the city didn't they?
Skeggs: Right.
Bird: All but of course they're like we are they have the union at the Fire
Department.
De Weerd: But did they get a decrease in benefits then?
Skeggs: No.
De Weerd: They were able to absorb the cost.
Skeggs: See because with benefits it depends on your experience. They may
have had good experience in Nampa where the city we have had bad experience
for the last three years. Their rate increase for health insurance could have been
15 percent where ours was 34. It depends on what their increase and what there
experience has been running for the benefits would determine what their rate
increase for health insurance would be. They had chose because they just
implemented the STEP Program to give those equity adjustments and therefore
the two percent which is covered to keep in line with their program because
some employees got equity adjustments to bring them in line with their program.
De Weerd: It's kind of an oxymoron isn't it when you look at your ratings and
you're trying to encourage your employees to stay healthy and go to the doctor
then -
Bird: I helped you out this year.
De Weerd: Thank you Keith.
Corrie: (Inaudible) we didn't want to but we did.
Bird: We did.
Skeggs: And I know ACHD at the beginning of April they just gave a flat two
percent. Ada County they are proposing a two to four percent but nothing had
been approved for that.
De Weerd: Still not?
Skeggs: Not that I'm aware of.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 13 of 108
De Weerd: Does anY0ne else want to-
Corrie: Gary oh there you are.
Smith: Good morning. I just wanted to make a comment concerning our present
pay matrix structure. I really feel a lot as though that is a I guess you could say a
modified STEP Program because it does outline over a period of 11 years salary
range increases. As Pauline mentioned those are based on, a three percent
change each year. If you have under the present structure if you have a
competent employee as far as an evaluation is concerned in our rating system, a
competent employee is a 90 to 95 percent accurate type of employee if you want
to put it in terms of a grade. That means that person is a good employee. That
type of rating garners them two percent increase so you fall behind without any
other form of or means of increasing compensation that employee falls behind.
We've got several employees in the Engineering Division ] haven't checked the
rest in Water and Wastewater but there are several in the Engineering Division
that have fallen behind that present matrix at this point. The change to PPO as
Pauline mentioned is an employee decision. They made their vote and decided
in that manner. I think it's going to in effect it's going to decrease the benefits to
some degree because there are as Mayor mentioned there a re some doctors
that are not subscribers to the PPO particularly the specialists, anesthesiologists,
neurosurgeons I'm not sure who else but a lot of specialists are not. That means
that the bill that the employee picks up is going to be increased from what it is
now at the present coverage. I think they understand that. We tried really hard
to explain the differences between the PPO and traditional so everybody really
understood that. As Pauline mentioned, that decision in the Benefits Committee
was very, very difficult. I understand where you are because that's the buck
stops here you might say. [just really feel as though - I understand that all the
departments are paid differently. Their salary structure is based on what they do.
I don't have an issue with that at a]1. My concern is just that the employees
receive equal consideration in increase and compensation. I guess that's my two
cents.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Gary, I think that you've got some unique rolls too because a lot of these
jobs that we have within the city there is no outside jobs that compare to them.
With engineers, planners and all that stuff that comes down here they're in
demand 0 ut t here I et's face t he facts. They're in very high demand 0 ut there
engineers are, civil engineers, and that kind of stuff.
Smith: Our technicians also.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 14 of 108
Bird: I think we need to - and I love the STEP Program don't get me wrong I
love the STEP Program but I think there's instances that we need to take a look
at with engineers, planners and stuff like that. I mean you just don't go over the
board with them because they do have some outside jobs that you can compare
it to where an operator for a well or something like that I mean there's very few
private jobs out there for that. Most of that is municipallties 0 r United Water.
Stuff like that I think we have to take that into consideration too. I think you've
got a very unique situation over in your department because of your engineers
and the same as Anna has with the planners. They do have some outside
sources to go work for where a lot of the people don't.
Smith: Thank you Keith. We really had a problem hiring an Engineering
Technician. We started in January and we finally hired him. In order to get him
to come to work we had to pay him close to mid-range of an Engineering Tech 1
position. That's what we're competing with.
Bird: That's right.
Smith: And it's fortunate or unfortunate it depends on how you look at it. I think
we're getting a good employee but nevertheless there's a cost to it. I think one of
the other reasons that he did come to work for us is because of our benefit
structure. He's coming from a small firm, which I don't know what their benefit
structure was like but I'm sure that what we offer was attractive to him.
Bird: I think Boise probably finds this with your attorneys Bill. You've got outside
sources there too that - and I think there are certain areas in the city that we
need to really work hard at. Like the engineers and the planners and stuff that
have outside sources that's hard to hire. I know Gary has a hard time getting
qualified engineers.
Smith: Thank you. I appreciate the opportunity to address you this morning. I
really do as I said yesterday I understand the difficulty in this decision and it is a
tough one. Thank you.
Corrie: Thank you Gary.
Powell: M r. Mayor t Mem bers 0 f t he Council I just wanted to a dd a c au pie 0 f
quick additions that that. Following up with Council Member Bird's comment
that's why we lost Dave. They didn't even have to woo him with too much more
salary to - when you looked at the benefits versus salary it wasn't even that great
of an increase but we did lose him for strictly monetary reasons there was no
other reason he left. Mainly what I wanted to say was on that survey when it
came around regarding the benefits everybody made that decision whether 0 r
not they wanted traditional or PPO but - and they looked at their own situation
but I think they also were considering the city. They recognize that the PPO Plan
was cheaper for the city and they were willing to say yes we'll go that way. On
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 15 of 108
the next column over where it said where it said what's more important payor
benefits well a lot of. them put both but a lot of them said we're thinking okay if I'm
going to make this decision to go with the decision hen we would like to say our
pay at least increase a little bit. That's all I wanted to say.
Corrie: I think as long as we're as fair as we can be and we're not going to be
fair in everybody's eyes. I agree with Keith there that you've got specialists that
have to be paid - take a n attorney for instance j f they're 0 n staff they should
probably make more there's no question about it than one at assistant level
starting at a low level. We have to think that consideration and we have to be fair
about it. I think this Council is trying to be fair within the confounds that we have
in our money. I do agree with you and the employees. They would like to have
both but when it comes down to where the rubber meets the road, they are
understanding. I just want us to be fair that's alii really need. Thank you Anna.
Powell: I think that's all they're looking for also.
Corrie: Yes I think so. Stacy.
Kilchenmann: Mayor and Members of Council I have to put in my two bits as a
Department Head not as a Finance Director. I think as far as an insurance I think
it's kind of a waive of reality that employees are going to have to bare more cost.
It's just a nationwide crisis so to speak. I think going to the PPO plan is just
happening company after company you know government agency after
government agency. I think that even if we go to the total PPO Plan I think our
benefits are very competitive. Just if you look at the market in Treasure Valley
but I would hate to lose the merit program. I guess one thing about our merit
program is it's applied to the midpoint of an employees range. I feel like it
benefits good long-term employees like Reta who is above her midpoint because
it's not like two percent of her salary it's just two percent of the midpoint. I hate to
lose the idea of a merit type program because I think that you know you say don't
tie merit to performance but I think it does give people a little motivation to kind of
try to step a Httle bit beyond where they normally would. That's just my two
cents.
Corrie: I feel that you should apply merit to performance I really do. If you have
somebody that's doing their job and that's it I'm sorry I don't feel they should be
getting as much as somebody that's going beyond the call of duty all the time
and really putting out there and think they should be paid for it. That's the old
pop method that I grew up with pay on performance. If you didn't perform you
didn't get paid. Maybe that was a little different than here but whenever you're
on a commission you perform or you don't get paid. Those others that did
perform and did what they were supposed to do and did more then they got paid
more. Comments.
Bird: I agree wholeheartedly with you.
(
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 16 of 108
Corrie: Any other discussion that we need here? I tell you I live with somebody
that's on the other end of the insurance business. She's seeing a lot of private
companies really backing down on insurance and going to PPO's or cutting a lot
of it out. J don't know anything about it. We don't talk that much but still - I mean
about insurance. She's noticing that the insurance - some of the private
insurance going up 45, 50 percent, and the employers just said we can't do it.
It's tough out there and it's going to get tougher.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I agree wholeheartedly. Three or four companies that I've - private
companies that I know they were having to cut back. Our company is two years
ago the first time we had to cut back and put more on the employee. The
employee had to pick up more of the benefits pay. We went to the PPO, which I
don't agree with. As a doctor I don't think I want my insurance company what my
rate is because I don't - if I'm going to be a doctor I'll go tell you what you can
charge for your insurance. I don't agree with it but I think it's the coming thing
that we have to do. Any insurance I'll guarantee you any insurance is very, very
nice people. I have learned in the last six months what insurance means to me.
It would have taken - if I hadn't of have good insurance it would have taken wale
of a whop out of my retirement fund I'll guarantee you that. It's something that
we can't let go and we need to get what's best we feel and it's for the employees.
Evidently, the employees have spoken and I'm for going down with that and
helping them on that part. I'm also for seeing if we can't give them a raise.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I think we need to look long-term too. Maybe some of our ratings our
employees are not as well aware of wellness programs. We need to get a little
bit more proactive on the other side of it so we can start not only helping our
workforce but the long-term implications of some of the catastrophic claims that
we have. As we look down the road Pauline, I would hope that we start
implementing and looking at wellness programs and preventative care. I think
health wise comes out with a handbook that employees can benefit from. It's just
how we get over this hump in trying to turn around even our cities ratings. As
Keith had mentioned and J agree, it's hard to say that we're going to only set
aside employees that are competitive out there to the private sector as well. It is
a reality but I think we need to look at it more in terms of competitive salaries and
going out. I know Council has mentioned maybe revisiting this in January. Doing
something that we can looks like we can afford to do now. Maybe it will be
minimal but in January to revisit it and look at how we can get some equity
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 17 of 108
adjustments and some of the professional classifications so that we're
competitive to the priv.ate industry so we don't continue to. I think it's the wrong
message right now to send to all of our city employees that these employees will
get more of an increase but you're not competitive out to the private industry so
we're not going to give you what they are. I think that can be handled more in
terms of how we can be competitive in those professional level categories and do
that in January. Do something across the board. I appreciate what Gary said we
just want to be fair. We want everyone to get the same thing. I think that's what
the Council wants at this time too. We want to be f air and we don't want to
elevate any classification above another because that's the wrong message to be
sending right now. There are the realities that have been already talked about
and we can do that in a competitive I'm losing the word. We can do that in a
survey and maybe revisit it in January so we can remain competitive. Those
certainly in the two areas - well I think all of our city employees are over
burdened with a good workload because we are lean, mean and-
Corrie: We're lean anyway, we're not mean.
De Weerd: Well we're being mean today.
Bird: No you hit it right on the nose we're lean and mean. We've had to be thank
goodness.
De Weerd: I do appreciate what our Department Heads have said. I think you're
trying to be fair, trying to keep the best interest of your employees in mind and
that's certainly, what we'll work hard to do as well.
Corrie: I think our constituence want the best service possible. Our employees
are the ones who are going to -
***End Of Side One***
Corrie: -- that's a very big asset to the city is our employees. We have to keep
them happy to some extents and I think we're doing it as best we can. Just keep
those two things in mind that they seem like opposite ends but it takes the
employee to make the customer service right. No matter what the Department
Heads want, it's the employees that do for us. They're the wee bees. They will
be here after we're gone so we must take care of them in consideration in which
(inaudible ).
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: You know I guess the difficulty for me is that it appears to me in the way
our structure is set up for our salaries benefits the way we've handled in the past
/..
I
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 18 of 108
in regards to employee increases that we are trying to compete with the private
sector and we can't We will - if we don't address it this year, we'll address this
next year. The cost of medical benefits isn't going to go down. It will always
increase. I don't think I've seen any place that doesn't have a double-digit
increase every year. I don't think that's ever going to change. I think we need to
look at our pay structure and how things are done. I think there are some values
to the STEP situation but I also I guess have a concern that you know the merit
side of the equation seems to get lost a little bit sometimes. I think merit pay is
important. I think it really does matter. I don't think marginal employees should
feel bad that they didn't get an increase because marginal employees at
Albertson's don't get one either. They sometimes get fired. I don't necessarily
think - I don't think we need to gear our pay structure, salaries or the like for the
marginal employee we should find the ways to reward the outstanding
employees. I think sometimes with the STEP Program we get a little locked in
our mindset of trying to make sure everybody gets at that three percent level
instead of saying that employee deserves six because they are outstanding
rather that employee deserves three because they showed up. What happens
sometimes I think in some of the departments from my discussions is that we do
a really good job on the front end and you get to your 11 year mark and you've
been outstanding now you don't get an increase for the rest of your life. That
doesn't help you to keep employees. You've got about a 10-year window and
then you're really lucky if you've got an employee after 10 years here to continue
to perform at a high level. We're missing something there. Something's a miss.
The other thing that we don't do people work for the government for lots of
reasons and pay isn't always one of them. Sometimes it is the stability that
they're looking for that the private sector doesn't offer. Sometimes it is the
benefits that the private sector doesn't offer. Sometimes it is the convenience
the ease. They live in this town the sense of public service that people have that
they want to do that. That they have a skill set that really fits the public sector
better than the private sector. Sometimes it's the alternatives that we can come
up with that creates a better work environment and a work atmosphere that at
least in t he last year and a half that] 've been here we haven't really focuses
much on. One of the things I've talked with Pauline about and talked to the
Council Members about is just the small piece but for certain people in this city a
great incentive would be flex time. If you had flextime for especially, support staff
that's a tremendous incentive. I have four secretaries that work for my team and
they have flextime. They all work - they all have a three day weekend every
other week. That's a tremendous value to stay if you can get a three-day
weekend every other week. They've - all of them have said they've had
opportunities to look elsewhere and they cannot find that in the private sector.
Unless you own the business that doesn't happen. That's the one positive thing
about flextime is it's free. It doesn't cost anything other than the logistics of
managing but other than that it doesn't cost anything to do that. We have talked
periodically up here about other employee incentives. Whether it's bonuses,
whether it's - and bonuses I know is a bad word. Some type of employee
rewards that are sometimes very small monetarily but yet have tremendous
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 19 of 108
incentive to creating a positive work environment. We don't do that. We don't
give an employee a gift card for doing a great job we just wait until their merit
time comes around or wait until their anniversary date comes around. Those
things can provide tremendous incentive and give people a reason to work here
beyond just paying benefits. I think if we just stick with that mindset of paying
benefits, only year after year we will price ourselves out of the market because
we can't afford it. We just won't be able to keep up if that's their only way of
compensating employees. I think we have to tackle this question I guess but we
also need to look beyond that after we set this budget. Whether we revisit this
issue later that we're going to have to find other ways to be creative in creating a
positive environment for our employees and get the culture and mindset away
from just paying benefits. We just won't ever be able to keep up with that with
the way the current economy is. The way the governmental structure is the way
taxes are we're just never going to compete in that level so we have to find other
reasons. I think if you surveyed your employees and asked them to be creative,
you may get lots of feedback as to what would matter to them. Why do they work
here? Why do they continue to work here? Is it just pay and benefits? I would
have guessed for many of them it's not. They like the environment they like the
people they want to be compensated fairly but if you found other ways to
compensate them, they would still find this to be a pretty attractive place to be. I
think we need to look beyond the box that we're in now so that we don't wrestle
with this every year.
McCandless: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. McCandless.
McCandless; I totally agree with what Bill has just said. Looking back over my
own work year's loyalty paid a big part of it. If you had good departments to work
in good Department Heads that worried about the department's environment and
their employees your loyalty would keep you there no matter what. I think we
have a very good bunch of Department Heads. I think we have a good working
environment and I think it will keep people here if they understand what we're
doing what we're trying to do. I don't think money is the most important thing. I
really don't. Our benefits have always been really good and we've worked hard.
Pauline has worked hard to keep them at that and I think people understand that
we have to change from time to time because of outside influences. I think the
environment we work in is extremely important too. I think you've all done a
really good job.
Corrie: As long as we get on a philosophical kick here Mrs. McCandless, myself,
Keith when we were growing up the longevity of an employment was the thing to
strive for. Today it's not. They move around considerably quicker five years I
think a lot of them are moving around. We're in a different culture now. Then
also we have to think in the background the big brother is really thinking hard
about charging taxes on benefits. If they do that then we really have our hands
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 20 of 108
full because they have an asaciable appetite for money and that's where they're
looking right now from what I'm gathering from Washington D.C. We have to
keep those in mind and I think Bill is right. We have to help our employees to
want to stay but the culture is a little different than our time.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: You're 100 percent right. It kind of takes me back because for a guy that
worked for 42 years for the same company that had the same paycheck
signature on the paycheck I never realized what it's like to be outside of one
company atmosphere. That's just the way our culture was raised up was to do it.
Now kids I can name you 20 year old kids who has had more jobs in their little
work lifetime then I'll ever have. I think it's - I agree with Councilman Nary that
there are a lot of things that we need to look at and stuff. It's something that
we've got to take care of and we need to take care of it. I don't believe it's
always benefits and I don't believe it's always wages that keep people working. I
know of a couple of a young attorneys that work for the AG's office that went out
in private, found out that having to work more than 40 hours a week they didn't
like. The benefits were a little better the wages were a little better but they didn't
like having to work more than 40 hours a week. Now they're both back at the
AG's office. I think there's just a lot of stuff to that kind of mentality too and
there's nothing wrong with that definitely nothing wrong. You get out in the
private world and you're going to work 60, 70 hours a week and probably not get
compensated for it too in most jobs. There are a lot of pros and cons to it but we
just need to be fair and make sure that we aren't - my philosophy is that we have
to be fair to everybody. There's just not one department in this city there's not
two departments it's everybody. Everybody is an employee and everybody is a
very important employee.
Corrie: With that being said (inaudible) go do.
De Weerd: I know I was going to say let's roll up our sleeves.
Corrie: Now we'll roll up our sleeves and go to work.
MDC
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Wasn't Steve going to be here in a few minutes to talk -
Kilchenmann: He's here.
i
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18. 2003
Pg. 21 of 108
Nary: Oh okay. Maybe we can cover that (inaudible) basin, take a little break,
and then get to it.
Corrie: Go ahead Steve.
Siddoway: Good morning.
Corrie: Welcome.
Siddoway: Did you want to - did you have questions for me or did you want me
to address the budget to you?
Bird: Yes well the budget I guess.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Okay Mrs. de Weerd,
De Weerd: Yes Steve if you can just give us an overview of what the MDC's
budget is for next year. I think the question is is do we - since you're paying
back the $60,000 do you really need it up front and how much do you really need
up front before the tax increment financing comes in.
Siddoway: A fair question. We had requested $60,000 and as I understand it,
there was some consternation over whether we should be funding the hiring of a
director, the office space and supplies for that person, and perhaps even the
grant writing services because we are discussing becoming a member of SAGE.
All fair points because I agree that the MDC would not want to enter into any
contract with a director until they have their own funds and a continuous funding
source in place. From that perspective, I would say yes those things could drop
out from the request. However, at the last meeting of the MDC when we
amended our budget we did add in a 15,000-dollar item for a vision study. We
do see a need up front and early to dovetail the market study that we're currently
working on with a master plan vision study of the downtown. We would like to
fund that up front and early in the next fiscal year. Therefore, I would request
that we change the line items but keep the total request at $60,000 and that
$60,000 would be repaid within the same fiscal year,
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: We have this amended one Steve. It's got completing the market study is
25,000 the downtown vision study is $15,000. The traffic parking solution study
is another $15,000.
Meridian City Council Specialbudgel Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 22 of 108
Siddoway: Yes.
Nary: So that's what you're talking about right?
Siddoway: That is.
Nary: Then the other 5,000 would be for like legal costs and that kind of thing.
Siddoway: Certainly we will have up front legal costs. The market study will be
ongoing. The vision study needs to happen right away. The traffic and parking
solutions is a current ongoing issue. That $55,000 is needed early in the fiscal
year. We do have ongoing legal costs on a monthly basis so I think the $60,000
is right in line with what we will need to keep going at our rate that we want to
anyway for the start of the fiscal year.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Stacy what was published? Which budget was published in the paper?
Kilchenmann: The one that I gave you with the yellow bars on it.
Nary: Not this revised.
Bird: Not this revised so now we have to re-publish this.
Kilchenmann: No.
De Weerd: No.
Bird: You don't.
Corrie: I don't think you do.
Bird: What?
Corrie: I don't think you do.
Bird: I thought you did.
Corrie: If it's the one that they -
Nary: This one here is what he is talking from this one that has -
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 23 of 108
Kilchenmann: Yes.
De Weerd: Yes that's the detail to it. You also got another one.
Corrie: The yellow one.
Siddoway: This one is correct.
Kilchenmann: So it's more -
Bird: It's just general yes.
Nary: Just general I got it.
Bird: But we don't have to re-publish.
De Weerd: It just doesn't give the detail on the studies and that sort of thing.
Siddoway: Yes it lumps the studies together under professional services.
Bird: Because I know we're short time. We're (inaudible).
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: For the legal costs is that a monthly flat around or is that an hourly that Mr.
Armbruster gets?
Siddoway: It's an hourly fee.
Nary: Okay and has MDC looked at other attorneys?
Siddoway: We interviewed two when they were selected. We interviewed White
Peterson and Elam and Burke. Elam and Burke was selected.
Nary: Thanks.
Corrie: Anything else?
Siddoway: Any other questions?
Corrie: Cover it up - no, I mean not cover it up. I'm really on a roll today.
Siddoway: Thank you.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18. 2003
Pg. 24 of 108
Corrie: Thank you Steve.
De Weerd: Thank you Steve.
Corrie: Time to get a hair cut early. Okay do you want to take a little break and
then -
De Weerd: I think so.
Corrie: I think I need a donut.
(Recess at 9:08 A.M.)
(Reconvened at 9:30 A.M.)
POLICE DEPARTMENT
Corrie: Well Jet's get back to the primary reason we're here for the next 30
minutes. Shall we just like you suggested go to-
Kilchenmann: Yes we have the Police Department up there and-
Corrie: This is the new right that they're asking?
Kilchenmann: Yes there's the two with the grants and we'll add that back in on
the revenue side. We'll show the total cost because we'll need to appropriate the
total cost and then when we get back to the general funds somebody that has
everyone will add the grants into the revenue so it will net out.
Corrie: Okay.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council Members)
Kilchenmann: Are there any changes to what they're requesting?
Corrie: (Inaudible).
Kilchenmann: Actually the cost for FY04 for the school -
Nary: Just a second we're not on the record yet.
Corrie: Oh we need to get on the record. Are we on the record?
Berg: Yes we've been going.
Nary: I'm sorry I thought it was off.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 25 of 108
Berg: When you said that we'd get back to the business.
Corrie: Okay thank you.
Kilchenmann: So the cost of the School Resource Officer will actually net out to
be $17,305 and the Crime Prevention will be $5,900 for 04.
De Weerd: So it doesn't say that.
Corrie: It says 64 why doesn't it say 59.
Cunningham: Okay the actual expense will still be there in the budget so what
we have to do is increase the revenue for the grant money. If I go to the
summary, what we did at the bottom is we added in the project safe grant
increased revenue $127,000.
Corrie: Okay thank you. That's right we have to make the two work.
Cunningham: So that's what we did. Then I'm making the changes on the police
now. See, we just have the shortfall of 46. That does not include a ny merit
increases. We still have that at zero. Now do you guys want to move to fire?
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess before we do that I mean I think the Number 1 thing we need to do
I think the police have been very good at trying to find these alternatives. I think
we need to make sure we - I think we acknowledge that and I think we really
need to support that. The other issue is on some of these things that both
warrant on the merits priority list are the ones that are somewhat smaller
numbers. Have we taken out the reserve police officer request then?
Cunningham: Yes.
Bird: That's what the wanted out.
Nary: Okay. I guess the only other discussion point I think that certainly the
Number 1 priority the three officers for the full year is an absolute need. I don't
think there's any real doubt about that. I don't know whether or not the three
officers for the half year it certainly saves us the first year it won't save us next
year and we'll have six new bodies to be paying another full year on. I don't
know whether or not we want to have a discussion about that jf everyone's
comfortable with the half year you want to look at a quarter of a year you want to
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 26 of 108
look at not I don]t know. A year would save us a little bit up front as well but
starting in July rather than in April.
Bird: I think they're being very fair and asking for just a half year myself. I don't
think -
Kilchenmann: You will in order to give any kind of merit though something's
going to have to be cut.
Bird: Yes. Of course that resource officer deal actually wound up only costing us
something like $5,900 because of the grant and stuff that we -
Nary: 17 for the resource.
Kilchenmann: We already have that in there and you're still 46 (inaudible).
Bird: I can]t see opening Mountain View High School without a resource officer
over there myself.
De Weerd: Yes, we have that in there.
Bird: I think those three - I think those one, two, three I think we need to really
look hard at. You know you bring it on a half year you're going to pay overtime.
That's the thing that's been killing us on the fire is instead of hiring some fireman
and getting them 0 ut 0 n the - getting them trained and 0 ut there we've been
paying guys $80,000 or better to come back and sit for two hours.
Kilchenmann: Our overtime on the fire station just goes up with every person
you hire.
Nary: Well the other thing and I know this is a capital expense as well. This is a
- Captain didn't remember exactly what this mileage was f or this car. These
three need to be replaced they're all at the 90,000 mark.
Bird: All four of them need to be replaced.
Nary: Okay and that's fine.
Bird: I've ridden in a couple of those and J've been surprised when we went over
a bump that we weren't going down on the frame.
Nary: And I don't have a problem with that but I think something's going to have
to give. I think we can - if we fund all of the this we're not going to have enough
for other things if we do that.
Bird: I think all they were asking us to fund was the first three items wasn't it?
(
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 27 of 108
Corrie: Yes crime prevention we could but if we-
Nary: Well but this was only $5,900. Remember most of this was out of the
grant so we almost have to fund that. We have to fund the $5,900.
Bird: Yes that's true.
Nary: And we have to certainly fund that. I think this is the only real discussion
point of funding. This is basically all they went was from a 47,OOO-dollar request
to a cabinet so I don't think there's any real issue there. I think that's fine. I think
this is the only one that we have to decide do you want to have three at a half
year. Do you want to have less than three at a half year do you want to have
none at the next year?
Corrie: Well the main point of the half-year for three patrol officers is my
understanding is that they can't get them into the academy until after that. That's
rather than having a full year of on they will wait until they get the academy and
come back. Either you're going to do it now or you will next year because they're
going to be three short.
Kilchenmann: The only thing we have to remember is that when we fund those
then next year we have a full year. Then those grants are only for two years so
when those grants run out in two years we'll have the full cost of those people so
we're just postponing -
De Weerd: The increase on our base.
Corrie: Yes but you do need those grants to help you on those two years ahead
of time.
Kilchenmann: Right I'm just saying that maybe we can't afford all six officers at
th is point.
Corrie: Can you afford not to have them?
Kilchenmann: I can't.
Corrie: Well yes but I'm talking a bout t he people 0 ut here in this community.
What do they see?
Kilchenmann: But something - we just have to put something.
Corrie: Well yes we do but we also have to think of some other things too. I'm a
little cautious about - and I realize three officers are good but next year they're
going to come back and do the same thing and we're going to give them three. I
t"
Meridian City Council Special bUdget Workshop
July 18,2003
Pg. 28 of 108
don't know where you have to cut but they're down to $394,000. They were at-
what was it?
Nary: 722.
Corrie: $692,000 or eight I'm sorry. Granted you don't get everything you need
that's for sute. Three is better than none to some degree.
Nary: I think three's a given. It's the other three is whether or not that's an
affordable number right now.
Bird: The argument is the half-year guys. The three at a half-year.
De Weerd: If we brought them on in July and made them - because I think we
do need them.
Nary: Oh, I think we do.
De Weerd: And we'll be needing them you know in years to come. If we look at
- if we could save the three months and yes it does increase your base going
into next year's well but that's just what we'll have to realize. Then we'll really
have a narrowing gap. You could split that in half to what $74,000. Then you
would have $74,000 then we'll have $20,000 in the good.
Nary: Right.
Cunningham: Actually we can only cut the wages because they're still going to
want the car. They're going to need the operating for the car and uniform
allowance.
De Weerd: Oh okay so that doesn't split it in half then?
Nary: No.
De Weerd: That's (inaudible).
Corrie: What's in their base budget?
Nary: It still saves $40,000.
Corrie: You're assuming so much for base budget?
De Weerd: Is everyone okay with the base?
Corrie: Well that's what I'm looking at if there was anything. I went through there
and looked at it.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18,2003
Pg. 29 of 108
De Weerd: Do you feel comfortable with the base Bill?
Nary: On the police?
De Weerd: Yes.
Nary: The one expense I did see in the base for police that I was a little curious
about is there's a professional services base of $14,000 that's never - that's a
new item I think?
Cunningham: That's actually for that fine officer.
Nary: Is that what that's for?
Cunningham: It is.
Nary: And the prosecution amount I think is too high.
Kilchenmann: Yes I think we can -
Nary: I think the prosecution amount could probably be cut about $50,000.
Bird: I was going to say that's a lot higher than our contract.
Nary: Right but I don't think the contract - well the contract increase if you took
the current contract and increase it three percent.
Cunningham: 160,000.
Nary: How much would that be $45,000.
Cunningham: 48.
Nary: $48,000.
Cunningham: $4,800.
Nary: $4,800 because I don't - even if you increased it five percent for anything
over because that includes - the current contract includes an extra cost for victim
witness service I think. That's kind of intangible to know how much it's going to
be. I think if you took the current contract which the victim witness services are
an add on to that -
Bird: That's where I don't know.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 30 of 108
Nary: So even if you took a 10 percent increase total that includes victim witness
you would still be looking at -
Cunningham: 176.
Nary: Yes and that's plenty.
Kilchenmann: We took $50,000 off.
Nary: So if you took $50,000 off for that base. Now the other one] thought was
pretty curious on the base one is the 1,286 percent increase to seminars and
training.
Bird: That's what we can't figure out.
Nary: That seems fairly significant.
Cunningham: We talked about that this morning. If you go to the second page
because what we did is, the police actually had two separate accounts for
training and they wanted one for the admin training and one for the rest of the
officer training. Then we decided to combine them back together we didn't like
the two separate accounts.
Nary: So when you take those two together it really is probably about the same.
Kilchenmann: Yes it is the same.
Nary: Yes and the interest expense is fixed I assume right that 500,000.
Bird: Yes.
Corrie: One of the things that the attorney talked to me about was when they
might want to court on this charting as for the assessment on the building that we
go to the bank. He said it's probably going to cost us about $10,000 but we'll
save $50,000. They think they can win that they really do so we must think about
that.
Nary: Right that's on the civil side.
Corrie: Right all right.
Nary: But we still probably need to budget the property taxes in case we don't.
Corrie: Right exactly.
Nary: We probably need to budget that anyway.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 31 of 108
Corrie: That's right..
Nary: And we may have to look to increasing some on the civil side.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: On the electricity on Page 2 Idaho Power you have $36,000 budgeted in
and the most actual is $17,000. How come we doubled the budget item?
Cunningham: We actually didn't double it we just left it the same. Because now
they're in the building for the full summer so we're going to find out what air
conditioning costs are really going to be.
Corrie: Oh the current is $36,000 and we've only used $12,000.
De Weerd: Yes but that's a projected. Right now, the current is $9,000.
Cunningham: Yes that was as of March.
Berg: They haven't been in there a full year.
De Weerd: That was of March.
Kilchenmann: These figures are March.
Corrie: We're projecting 17 to $18,000.
Berg: October to March.
Cunningham: October to March six months.
De Weerd: But still the projection is close to $18,000.
Kilchenmann: All that projection does is double it.
Cunningham: Yes it just takes it and -
Kilchenmann: And their high part the high cost for them in the summer. I hate to
change their building cost because they're always coming up with some new
expense that they didn't plan on.
Cunningham: I think next year we'll have a real idea of what their electricity is
going to be. Then if we have it budgeted too high we'll bring it down.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 32 of 1 08
Corrie: Overtime wages $120,000.
Bird: And we throw $5,000 in for employee education reimbursement and we've
never used it.
Kilchenmann: We're using it now because Bill Musser is going to school.
De Weerd: Okay that's one. You know we just think that instead of - things that
have always been there that they're justified. That they put in okay who's going
to be using this this next year needs to put it in so we can plan it for the budget
instead of carrying forward a bunch of money that is never used then it goes into
a fund that then we can never really get a better idea of where we really are.
Kilchenmann: I know.
Cunningham: We did talk to Bill about taking that out. He assures us that there's
going to be some going to continuing their education.
De Weerd: Okay.
Berg: Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council that is something that's in our
personnel policy that any employee could address. At one time, you could have
all of your employees taking advantage of that. Obviously, he didn't say pencil in
every employee with that possibility. It's one of those things that are really tough
but see if you don't use it hopefully, it goes back into your capital outlay for the
next year. That's always the way it's kind of been projected for what might be
possible but that's stated in our personnel policy and anyone could address it. I
could have all my staff be going to college for a class and I would have to
reimburse it because of what we said in our personnel policy. I think I know what
you're saying Tammy, but I think it's also you have to plan something in there
even though we didn't use it last year. Thank you we saved money but it might
not happen this year. It is stated in our personnel policy that they could do it.
Corrie: How much money do you think they're going to have left over for this
year to date? I mean do they have it spent. Do you have any idea? That's a
crystal ball question.
Kilchenmann: Yes because their overtime is high. Actually when Mike and I
looked at it last month and it we looked at the over accounts versus the under
accounts they all come out about (inaudible).
Corrie: Okay.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 33 of 108
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Maybe one of the things we could do too and I don't recall do we have a
policy of what benefit if any the departments gain by saving money.
Kilchenmann: No we don't.
Nary: So maybe one of the things we could consider as a group as a policy on
what to do with those savings. Obviously they go back to general fund but
providing those incentives to the departments that can save money that we can
basically return that money back to them a percentage of it towards again, I don't
know whether it's employee incentive or something else. That provides some
reason not to go spend the money in September, which I think is kind of common
in -
Kilchenmann: Government.
Nary: -- government. Everybody goes to seminars in September because we
use up the rest of the money. That might be something as a group we could
consider is some policy to provide that level of incentive that if it's saved a
percentage will go back to that department for something else.
Kilchenmann: Correct.
Nary: Did you guys hear that.
De Weerd: No.
Nary: Did you say no?
De Weerd: Yes.
Nary: Okay.
Corrie: I was wondering if they got it (inaudible) they got it.
De Weerd: No I didn't.
Nary: Oh I said what we may want to do as a policy is provide incentives to the
departments to save money is to provide them something that some of that
money that stays saved could be returned back to them. Whether it's for
employee incentive or something else we could decide what that is or the
department could come forward saying we got five percent back of what we
returned back to the city this is what we want to use it for.
De Weerd: I would love to do that. I think that's great.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18. 2003
Pg. 34 of 108
Nary: Do you want to use it for that wish list item that extra thing that they think
will enhance their employees lives and their workspace. It might be something
again to provide better incentive internally to the department as well as the
department as a whole saying if we save money we're going to get a benefit out
of it either way.
De Weerd: You're amazing Bill.
Nary: Well because one of the things we found in Boise, which has been very
frustrating, is what they do is they fund departments at 98 percent of what they
request. Well, it doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out that you really asked
for 102 percent of what you think you need so that you end up with what you
really wanted. I don't know that that's always the best way to do it but if you at
least provide that incentive the other way you'll get something else.
De Weerd: Well as long as your projections are within your historical I think as
long as you don't obviously inflate it that then there are actual savings. You are
being frugal. I have noticed in these vehicle maintenance lines do we have a lot
of really crappy cars that we anticipate a lot of vehicle maintenance issues.
Historically, these numbers that are budgeted are not really substantiated. Do
we have some really bad cars that -
Kilchenmann: Well we budget $500 a car. That's just our policy. The thing that
happens is hopefully you have some cars. Most cars that won't need repairs
because one care like we had to fix the air conditioner in Terry's car and that's
almost $500 right there. You hate to take that down because if you do have any
kind of repair -
Nary: And by sticking with our program on replacing police vehicles, we should
eventually be able to lower that cost. The problem has been is we have spent
more than $500 on a lot of patrol cars because the mileage is high. If we can
keep to that program which is where they're asking for these replacement
vehicles then maybe eventually we'll be a little bit more level.
McCandless: Plus they get a lot harder use than a normal car does.
Nary: Sure.
Cunningham: And on the police, we actually give $800 per vehicle on their
repairs or on their maintenance because that's for tires. They usually go through
a set every year.
De Weerd: Well the tires yes.
(
Meridian City Council Special bodget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 35 of 108
Corrie: One of the things I was looking at how come employee insurance - are
you just taking that as.a some went up a lot some just a little?
Kilchenmann: We just took it at - we just used an average.
Corrie: Okay I was looking at the animal control adjustment of $6,000.
Kilchenmann: Went up -
Corrie: That takes in everything considering?
Cunningham: Actually last year what we did is we literally took every single
employee line by line and said okay do they have a family are they single? What
are their actual insurance costs? This year we took it and we actually averaged it
all out, came up with an amount, and said okay we're going to need $7,500 per
employee on an average. We're going to have some of those divisions like the
animal control they are actually I think two single women or they have minimal
insurance so there is extra change. You're going to see some different changes
like that throughout the department.
Corrie: Did you take into consideration on animal control also that we're going to
have to do our own euthanasia work and otherwise Boise is charging us $25 a
dog or a cat.
Cunningham: From what I understand the Pollce Department is looking at doing
those themselves.
Corrie: Okay yes I know they are so that's what I wanted to make sure that's in
here because they don't - that's a $5,000 bill to Boise if they keep going over
there. [know they were talking about it.
Cunningham: They want to do it in house.
Corrie: I just wanted to make sure that they're covered in there somewhere.
Cunningham: Yes.
Corrie: One thing I was going to ask if we do that three police officers that fourth
of a year nine months are they going to be able to get them in the academy, back
and started at that time or will they - is it a timing problem for them?
Kilchenmann: I don't know.
Corrie: If they get them in the academy early then they have to hire them. They
can't have an interview. If they get out of the academy and there's three months
that they don't.
Meridian City Council Special b"dget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 36 of 108
Cunningham: Are they employees while they're in the academy?
Nary: Yes.
Corrie: Yes that's how come they only wanted half of them over here because
they couldn't get them all in the academy and they couldn't train all of them at the
same time so they were cutting them up.
Cunningham: So it really means they wouldn't actually have the officers in house
until probably the next fiscal year?
Nary: Right. Yes. I guess the question is, is if we can't start them in April does it
even - isn't it even worth starting them in July or would they rather just wait till
October if we couldn't do that because -
KiJchenmann: They don't know the timing of the academy.
Corrie: Because that academy works on a time schedule so I just thought about
that. I wouldn't want to get them in the academy then have to wait three months
to put them on line. Somebody else is going to take them believe me at their
academy. Yes, they have to go to the academy.
Nary: They have to go - Idaho is the only state that doesn't require you go to the
academy prior to becoming a police officer. You can actually work up to a year
before you have to go to the academy. We as a department a city have decided
which is for good reasons not to do that. To not have, people out there working
without having gone to the academy. They get hired on, they go to the academy
and then they come back out of the academy and they work. That's a good
reason we should continue to do that but I think the Mayor has raised a good
point is the academy has reserved slots for the city. If they can't start in April, I'm
assuming they risk taking the academy at that time was what the intent is. We'll
have people hired so that their start date can be April 1 st then go to the fairly
immediately so they're not getting paid to not do anything. If they can't start until
July is that going to make a difference that it mayor may not matter. Either they
have to start in April or not until October.
De Weerd: Can we have someone call and find out.
Kilchenmann: I'll go call them.
Corrie: Okay or they may have to hire three officers that have academy training
too. That may be happening because we start them at a higher salary so we
might be able to pick up somewhere else if it's a chess mate type thing for police.
Okay. We could hire three and at the ninth month already have academy
experience and that would be great but I don't know whether we can or not.
Meridian City Council Specia budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 37 of 108
De Weerd: Reta, did you also add in the amount that rural is going to be paying
for the fire engine? I guess that's something that we need to discuss is does that
go into general revenues or does that less money get taken out of the fire engine
fund?
Cunningham: No it actually increases our revenues so we actually need to put it
down there where we have the fire truck funds. If you'll notice on my screen,
we've already changed the general fund summary.
De Weerd: Okay so you took less out of the fire truck fund.
Cunningham: Yes then added $90,000 increased the rural fire share.
De Weerd: Thank you. Because I thought yesterday you said that it was
probably, an item we should discuss.
Cunningham: When I talked with Kenny last he said that they were talking about
- rural fire was talking about actually paying a portion. Evidently, he came
yesterday and said they decided they would?
De Weerd: They are, it's in their budget proposal.
Corrie: This is the point where rural fire has more money.
Cunningham: And they can afford it.
Corrie: Yes luckily because of the mill levy. They need to do their (inaudible).
Cunningham: Is there anything else in the police base?
Corrie: I don't have any I think. Anybody else have anything?
De Weerd: No.
Nary: I'm sorry.
Corrie: Police budget anything else?
Nary: I guess we'll wait until we get the answer on that patrol officer position.
Corrie: Okay. Are we going to go to fire?
Cunningham: Do you guys want to move?
Corrie: Yes.
i
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 38 of 108
FIRE DEPARTMENT.
Cunningham: I actually wasn't here for the fire presentation. Did they make any
changes?
De Weerd: Well we had a couple of discussion items. One is on the mobile data
terminals why those don't come out of the Title 31 funds.
Corrie: Yes and I haven't gotten back to them. Nobody could talk to me that had
any idea 0 f what there is I can dot hat. Maybe r can give t hem a call tot he
County Commissioners-
***End Of Side Two***
Corrie: -- yes Mr. Nary.
Nary: On the I guess the one - two things for me. The knox box although that
sounds like a very nice addition I don't know how necessary it is at this juncture.
I guess I wasn't totally sold that was really a need. The other one is the inspector
that contracted inspections. That to me should go with the other inspections
that's a special services type of need and should move over there. Again, it's a
contracted service but I think it should go over there because fees are going to
cover the cost of that. That's what we've been working on anyway. I guess to
me I don't see that that needs to be in the fire budget and I think the knox box
again I don't - I hate having to pay for the Opticoms but I think we need them. I
hate having to pay for the MDT terminals but I think we need them. Now if they
get paid by other sources at some point that's great. Same thing with the thermal
imaging unit I think Council Member Bird was right in thinking that we probably
get that funded but I think we need it if we can. I think it's another one of those
things that needs to be funded at this point. If we can certainly get donations or
something else that would help off set that cost that's great but I think we need it
anyway. The office assistant I didn't really have a feel one-way or the other on
whether or not that was a necessity.
Corrie: Comments.
Kilchenmann: Well just going back to the police. I just talked to Bill and he said
actually there is an academy that starts July 1st so he said they could definitely
work with that.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you Stacy. I think with the office assistant and Kenny
touched on it yesterday but with two more stations, it does kind of give them a
little bit more flexibility.
Nary: That's true.
1.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg, 39 of 108
Corrie: (inaudible) we, need.
De Weerd: Well yes but Greta is only in Station 1 so that gives them two other
sub-stations that -
Corrie: They can move around.
Nary: Well that makes sense.
Corrie: I think that might be a good idea. I've gone by Station 2 and there wasn't
a soul around. One of my suggestions to Council is that the Fire Department
look at an opportunity to at least have a phone out front because people go to the
fire station if they're in trouble or need something and there's nobody there what
do I do. They panic. If they have a phone at least a 911 phone on the outside
and I'll talk to the County on that. I think they should have something that they
can contact 911 if they don't have a cell phone or what have you they'll go to the
fire station and they've actually been there when I got there. They said what do
we do and I said I can't get in either. I called through the dispatch on my car
radio but that's something the Council might want to direct me to find out if we
can get the county or the sheriff or somebody to put a phone in there. They're
out - it's not because they're not there for any reason but they're out looking at
different things, inspections and they're not there. Okay again I'm talking to you
but I'm talking to the Council at the same time. Okay.
Bird: I agree with you Mayor I think it's a very, very good idea and we do need
something like that. I'm the same as you I've been there and nobody has been
there. I have no idea how to get in or - and if I was looking for an emergency I
would be in trouble. I think it's something we definitely need to look at. I have to
agree with Councilman Nary I think we need thermal imaging units. If we can get
them donated that's just $12,000 they can put back in something else. We have
to have the Opticoms who pays for them and we can argue that out. That
electric knox box for engine J think that's $5,500 that we can do without. The
contractor inspection should be over in the inspection contractor division not at
the Fire Department to start with. The mobile data terminals are another one we
have to have and who pays for them we can argue. The part time assistant I'm
like him I think that now that you have one more deal on and you have another
one coming on you need a part time secretary for them to move around.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: On the base budget at least in my look through on the base budget the
only one that I guess if is any notice to me was seminars and training for fire as
well. J am not against seminars and training I think it's a very good thing but if
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 40 of 108
you look at the factual of 2002 was $15,000 the projected this year and I
recognize it is just double of what happens from March to October but that's
$8,000. Thirty-four seems huge and I think you could move that base down to
about 20 and still cover what they've done at least historically and have some
money available that can be used. That's the only one that jumped off the page
at me unless there is something that's planned that's just not - if it's just because
of the potential that seems like a lot of money.
De Weerd: Yes.
Kilchenmann: Do you want me to call them?
Nary: Sure if you wouldn't mind.
De Weerd: Yes call Bill and see if there's anything specific.
Nary: Otherwise I think if you put it down to about 20 that should cover at least
what they've historically done and if there's increased costs I know all of those
trainings - any training in any field anywhere costs more than you ever
remembered. Any training anybody has ever been to.
Corrie: One of the things is the fireman are demanding that they get paid to go to
training.
Bird: Yes they get their salary.
Corrie: And I can't get that in my thought. If they're on duty why should we pay
them extra but that's a union that's something that's (inaudible) I guess.
Cunningham: I think what Kenny's done is he's actually put in $1,000 per
employee it's just kind of his standard. You're right I haven't seen him spend it.
Corrie: And it's there in case they use it.
De Weerd: And I think training continues to be an issue and a concern. Their
focus and in their strategic plan training has been an item that's been a high
priority. Certainly one that has come up in discussions with the Firefighters so
they may have specific plans I just don't know specifically what they are to
answer you on that.
Nary: Everything else in the base looked really pretty reasonable in line with
either historically or what's being spent in this budget year. That was the only
one that sort of jumped out.
Corrie: And they use the money that's in the fire truck fund to pay for the new
engine plus the money that the rural is giving right?
I.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 41 of 108
De Weerd: Yes.
Corrie: Okay.
De Weerd: And that's for the fire engine as well as it's fully equipped. It's
equipped as well.
Cunningham: So does everybody agree on the contractor inspector we go
ahead and put that to billing?
De Weerd: Yes.
Nary: Move it over.
Corrie: And I think I'm like Mr. Nary in that lock knox box when they were saying
(inaudible) think of a Captain that's getting paid enough that he can be
responsible for that.
Cunningham: So eliminate the -
Corrie: It's nice to have. It's great but I think a Captain should be responsible for
that there's one in every truck. He's the guy and if he can't control that I think I
would be re-look at the requirements for Captain. I've got to be careful what j
say-
Nary: No you don't.
Corrie: Up to a point. I don't want to embarrass anybody or add but [ think it's
necessary.
Nary: Yes people do need to think a little more before they just say things off the
top of their head.
De Weerd: You know Jonathan is on he's leaving town so he doesn't really care
on the Mayor said.
Corrie: Jonathan would you like another donut?
De Weerd: Remember he could have short timers attitude.
Corrie: Jonathan doesn't have a short timers attitude though.
Cunningham: Then the other item you guys were discussing was the thermal
imaging unit.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 42 of 108
Corrie: Yes I would like to take that on. My tinier here IS and kind of
spearheaded that because I think we can get it.
Bird: f think we can too but I think we need to leave it in there Mayor.
Corrie: Well yes I agree with you but I think we can get the money and they don't
have that much more money. I don't mean to take it out but I thought about it but
I haven't ever (inaudible) now but I think we should get that.
Nary: Yes I think we need to leave it in in case we can't.
Corrie: In case they don't yes.
Nary: Because I think we need it.
Cunningham: They could contact the girl scouts because that one-year we
raised like $5,000 towards that unit.
De Weerd: And the K-kids.
Cunningham: Yes I know.
Nary: If you take $14,000 out of this base you can pay for it too.
Corrie: I can always float down the river again and call people to give money to
get me out of the river.
Cunningham: There you go.
Corrie: They'll probably give the money to stay in the river.
De Weerd: Let's move on. Are we done with fire?
Corrie: I think so unless you have something that you need to-
De Weerd: Not yet.
PARKS DEPARTMENT
Corrie: Okay parks.
De Weerd: How did you plan that one?
Nary: His ears were burning.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 43 of 108
Bird: He trimmed this pretty good to start with guys. I tell you they worked hard
on this Parks and ReG. Doug and Elroy worked very, very hard on it.
Nary: I think that must be based on a (inaudible).
Corrie: It could be yes. That may be yes.
Cunningham: I had a question about the 8th Street footbridge. Was that actually
funded out of impact fees or general funds?
Corrie: No, general fund.
Cunningham: General fund okay.
De Weerd: Well we -
Bird: It's eliminated.
Cunningham: It's eliminated.
Corrie: Yes I think Doug said -
Cunningham: Take it out.
Corrie: -- caport yes. I had bleachers and tennis courts.
Nary: The tennis court issue I mean I guess I'm not sure why that wouldn't be
impact fees. We're still developing that park but-
De Weerd: They did have it as impact fees.
Nary: Oh, it is an impact fee? Not on this-
Corrie: Tennis courts, is that an impact fee?
De Weerd: It's in italic.
Cunningham: I don't have it listed as impact fees but you're right it could be.
Corrie: Could it be?
Cunningham: Yes Bear Creek-
Corrie: Okay.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 44 of 108
Nary: Certainly, if the developer wants to step up and pay for part of it. Those
are the ones we want to encourage.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: When we talked about this park and the tennis courts were put in
there kind of depending on what the high school did. The high school is putting
in a number of tennis courts. I know I'll get an argument from our City Clerk but if
the Mayor doesn't recognize him, he doesn't have an argument.
Corrie: Are you telling me how to do my job?
Nary: We would never do that.
De Weerd: But I think when this was originally discussed at the Commission it
was put in there as just a last option depending on what the high school did. The
high school is putting in a number of tennis courts, which will add to any deficit
that's over here. Right now, I just think we need to be careful with how much we
spend in our impact fees because it still does need to be matched until the
change is made. We can't get too lop-sided. I just want to proceed with caution
and things that we absolutely have to have.
Corrie: Good point. That's a good point.
Nary: Well and if I guess Mr. Mayor I'm sorry.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Even if it is impact fees and we don't opt to fund that at this juncture again
I don't think we're spending all the impact fees it will still be there. If that is
something that we feel there is a need to and Mr. Strong feels there is, a need to
we would certainly revisit that at a later time.
Corrie: Maybe use that $20,000 somewhere else that's true that's more
important than the convenience.
Nary: Well and I think the one thing with tennis courts is there is some ongoing
maintenance that's probably the one issue that maybe we need a little bit more
understanding of because I think there is some cost to that. I don't know how
significant it is. Ball fields generally have a different kind of ongoing maintenance
that may not be quite as expensive.
i
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18,2003
Pg. 45 of 108
Corrie: What about that seasonal groundskeepers Doug. You talked about a
little bit of it yesterday. Do you really need that one? I know you need the
groundskeeper.
Strong: (Inaudible).
Corrie: Did everybody hear that they have him full time then part time at the end
of it?
De Weerd: We want it on the record though.
Corrie: That was our discussion between the Department Heads.
Strong: We're going to have full time groundskeeper than part time. We had to
eliminate one of the two positions we'd rather see the part time go.
Corrie: Okay.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess my thoughts on that I don't have - looking at the numbers and the
number of people that we have and the volume of the ground that has to be
cared for I guess I don't have a real heartburn with one more full time
groundskeeper. I think Mr. Strong did hear yesterday at least my thought is we
really need to look at contracting for some of the service of maintenance whether
it's for the minimal maintenance that the undeveloped parks require or whether
it's simply the more the maintenance that really can be carried out like cutting the
grass and the like. I think some of t he things like maintaining the equipment
should be done by our employees. ! think there's some responsibility and
accountability when things that could injure somebody have to be maintained but
really, anybody can cut the grass. I think for the future and looking at
maintenance you probably want to at least explore that option out there in the
community. If there is a cheaper way of doing that for some of that maintenance
then you could focus your groundskeeper on the things that really have the high
profile the high necessity in need of maintenance for the city's needs. The ones
that are less so can be done another way.
Strong: We can certainly look at that. We do some contract maintenance now
since you mentioned it like the undeveloped property because we do hire local
farmers to disk that property and maintain it throughout the summer season for
weed control and (inaudible) efforts so you don't have a good stalk of really dry
stuff that burns. We do have to put a contract with (inaudible) and then the full
time person you have an investment in their training so that they can do the kind
of work that we need done in parks at a reasonable level of independence.
i
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 46 of 108
Seasonal workers require more supervision more direction as we add space
we're going to need more full time people that can go out, work independently on
park sites, and do the things that we need to do.
Nary: One thing I noticed though in the groundskeeper you don't have a vehicle.
You have adequate vehicles?
Strong: We have adequate vehicles for the groundskeeper.
Nary: Okay great.
Corrie: I think the one ton service truck is working too because that will cause
your cost to go down a lot of your employee administration and maintenance as
well. They will be able to be out on the job and not have to go back and forth.
Strong: It's saving a lot of money (inaudible).
Corrie: And you were getting a new truck so you're not a hand me down baby
anymore on that one.
Strong: Well the reason we have enough trucks for the full time groundskeeper
is because we do take hand me down trucks.
Corrie: Right okay.
Strong: But we don't go very far with them and we can keep them running for a
long time and do what we need to do.
Nary: So does the group want to eliminate the Number 2 the seasonal
groundskeeper?
Corrie: Yes. I think we (inaudible).
De Weerd: Yes.
Bird: Go ahead.
Corrie: Okay.
Cunningham: Did you guys want to increase any of the contract labor?
Nary: Well that's what we may want to look at. I don't know does anybody else
have feelings about the truck?
Bird: About the what?
r
Meridian City Council Special b"Jget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 47 of 108
Nary: About the one-ton truck?
Bird: No.
De Weerd: I do. I think in the past I don't know do you need a brand new truck,
There are used one-ton trucks and I don't know anything about trucks. I would
be the first to admit I do not know about trucks. I also do know when people see
brand new things sitting around in a tough budget year it becomes the first thing
that comes out of their mouth on why are we not getting a raise and buying a
brand new truck. It's just one of those perception things. I understand your need
but you know is there a less expensive way of doing it or is there another way we
can just bite the bullet 0 nit a nd do it next year? I don't know t hose a re just
questions that perhaps you can help answer.
Strong: Well I guess in response to that I think we have been biting the bullet
kind of getting a long. When we looked at buying new versus used like I said for
our parks maintenance workers we could get by with hand me down trucks and
do the job with them. We're willing to do that. T his is kind of a special use
vehicle. It's going to be specifically equipped to respond to situations in the park
where it's fully equipped to do just about anything that we need to do on site.
Most of the trucks that are equipped this way that are available to use are used
up. We looked around at what would be a possibility unless we could buy a used
truck and frame only somewhere that had not been set up with a utility box and
the other things that we're looking at here. The challenge for us was if we're
looking at anything used, the availability of this particular type of used vehicle is
not common. I t doesn't mean it's impossible it's just not common. The most
expedient way for us to go was to certainly buy off a fleet (inaudible) this type of
truck through the state contract. That's how we've looked at it and priced it is
what's available currently on state contract this type of vehicle. It would need the
utility box put on.
De Weerd: And how often would this truck be in use?
Strong: It would be used daily. It also has the capacity of pulling a trailer to the
larger pieces of equipment we have which I believe Elroy explained in some
detail yesterday.
De Weerd: But I thought that's why we purchased a flat bed that one time was to
haul around the larger pieces of equipment. I'm just depending on memory on
that one. That's - I think when we purchased the flat bed it was said at that time
we need it because the other pickups won't transport the larger pieces of
equipment.
Strong: It is used that way if Brad would be primarily using his truck as a
maintenance technician's out of site and needs the backhoe (inaudible) that he
takes both the trailer and the backhoe and then he has all the other equipment as
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 48 of 108
the loader, air compressor, full compliment tools and such all together. The flat
bed is used but doesnJt have a toolbox on it it's just a flat bed truck that's what it's
missing.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: The one thing to me I can see the use I guess I'm still not totally sold that
there's a need. I could probably be okay with the truck but I guess I'm thinking
the 500 pound gorilla we have to wrestle with here when we get done with some
of these is what do we do about employee compensation. That $42,000 goes a
long way towards employee compensation. What I'm hearing at least from you
Doug and what I've heard from Elroy is this will make our life a lot easier in our
maintenance and those things. Not that I don't want to do that but I guess I don't
know that I want to do that yet until we at least figure out what our employee
compensation is going to be and whether or not that is a need or just a positive
enhancement to what they're doing now. That's my only hang up is $42,000 is a
lot of money for a vehicle. I think we can use it and I'm not totally sure you need
it and I would really like to at least wait until you get the discussion about
compensation before we say let's just go ahead and (inaudible).
Strong: I guess going back to your original question certainly understanding the
decision that you're grappling with. Can we get by certainly we can get by we're
getting by now it's just a matter of how long. In this next year as we've had more
park space than we need for this type of vehicle becomes even more of an issue.
We would certainly come back next year if not funded this year with the same
kind of request. We may have other equipment that we need by next year that
we had to request. That's the challenge as you start to kind of backlog
equipment needs. It's delayed this year but then next year with more park space
we have to make a decision when do we add another mower or when do we add
equipment to maintain pathways because we don't have any special use
equipment for pathways. Those are things to look at down the road.
De Weerd: I think Doug that's kind of what we're seeing with every department is
we're not asking for it this year but next year we're going to need it. I think we've
even heard that last year. It's - we understand that and we don't want to
compound any problems that's why we have to ask you can you really - can you
do without it until next year because we are grappling with the merit increases,
and the benefits. It's one of those things of give us what you absolutely need
because we want to make sure that we actually also take care of the employees
that are going to sit in that truck.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Meridian City Council Special b;"dget Workshop
July 18. 2003
Pg. 49 of 108
Bird: You know it's.something that I've been pounding on for years is instead of
mileage we need hour meters. I think we've got equipment the big thing and if
you go back and look at the records of the last five years in the Parks
Department I have been against buying the backhoes and all that kind of stuff
because I think we can rent it and do that a lot cheaper. I realize it's nice to have
them sitting in your yard but I think they set for 75 percent of the time and used
for 25 percent of the time. Getting hour meters on them is what we need to do.
Anytime we can rent a piece of equipment we are much better off then going and
purchasing it because we not only have the paying for it we have the insurance
on it and all that kind of stuff. A truck like this no you can't go rent something like
this. How much we need it they seem like they think they need it pretty hard.
They are getting more stuff to take care of and doing more stuff. I think in all
purchasing I think that we with computers if a person wants to change a color of
their computer. They don't worry about it being broken down or if they want a flat
screen, they go get a flat screen. I think this is stuff that - I realize that is the big
item but you start adding up $1,500 worth of computers that isn't necessary to do
all the time it adds up. I think we just need to look at how we are purchasing and
stuff on all our departments. What do we really need to purchase and what can
we rent as we need it?
De Weerd: So do you think we need to keep it?
Bird: Do I think we need this pickup? Yes and no. I think you're going to need it
either by this year - I think $42,000 is very, very high.
Corrie: Mr. Bird would you think about possibly taking this out and then taking a
look at where the cost of the added incentive of the employees and then if we got
enough money we can come back to that one.
Bird: That's mine - my concern right now is to get down where we can
compensate the employees. I'm kind of like Mr. Nary that's my priority right now
as what kind of a deal - I probably won't agree with what some of you guys think
we need to compensate them because I don't see the five and (inaudible)
compensations out on the private world. [don't see the three percent
compensations out there and I know you guys don't either. We've got - I think
that's our priority and I think it's all being held up by one thing myself.
Nary: Mr. Mayor too.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I was just going to add one thing. Council Member de Weerd I think raised
the point is I can't imagine anything more frustrating for an employee to not get a
raise or get a very minimal raise if any and we buy a $40,000 truck that's sitting
out there in the yard.
,
, .
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18,2003
Pg. 50 of 108
Bird: That's true.
Nary: I think at least at this juncture we should at least take it out for the time
being. We'll come back to some of these things but I think we really as we go
through these really need to look very tightly at need. I think the police did that
and I think we've done that with fire. I don't see this as a need immediately until
we at least can address that other issue.
Bird: I think fire has got to address their overtime. Their overtime is out of hand.
It's way out of hand and how they do it we don't know.
Nary: What about the Bear Creek tennis courts? Do we want to leave that in the
impact fee I think Council Member de Weerd's thought was take that out at the
moment. I have no objection of taking that out. I think the other things are things
we really need to step up with. That one is probably the one-
Bird: We've got to watch our impact fees because (inaudible). Yes, I think we
need to take it out.
Corrie: Take them both out right now and come back when we can.
Cunningham: Okay so are we going to take the one-ton out?
Corrie: Yes that too.
Nary: And take out the Bear Creek tennis courts out -
Strong: I'm sorry Doug we'll come back and revisit it but we need to look at the
employees first.
Corrie: I'm anxious to see what that committees coming back.
Cunningham: We're taking out the $20,000 on Bear Creek?
Bird : Yes.
Corrie: Okay. I'm sorry I can't -
Cunningham: And were there any issues with the base?
Corrie: With the what?
Cunningham: With the budget base for parks.
Meridian City Council Specialbudgel Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 51 of 108
Nary: There are a couple of things I noticed in the base Mr. Mayor. I looked at
the adult sports expenses I think that's the recreation adult recreation program. It
appeared a couple of years ago we had $11,000 that was use. Now we budget
$15,000 for this last year and we've used $3,500 or projected use $3,500
throughout the year. I don't know if that's a better actual amount but $15,000
seems like a fairly large disparity than what we've been using and what's
budgeted. The contract labor I don't know whether or not - it looks like 17
historically was fine. If we're going to look at some other contracted labor for
maintenance that maybe a good amount to leave it out I don't know. I did notice
one other one that was just the large number of the increase. The furniture and
equipment was increase 125 percent to $1,800. I don't know if that was for a
specific thing or not but it seemed like the historical one two years ago was $539
projected this year $640 and we've upped it $1,000 more than what was
projected. That seemed like although it's only $1,000, $1,000 here $1,000 there
it turns into real money eventually. There's contracted labor line item on
personnel as well as the contracted labor in recreation as well as park
(inaudible). I didn't know if those were two different kinds of things I assume they
were.
Kilchenmann: One of those is for the recreation (inaudible).
Nary: Oh, I see.
Kilchenmann: And for parks, it's for the seasonal-
Cunningham: They actually use itfor like planting flowers (inaudible).
Nary: The spring and fertilizing amount looks like historically was significantly
than $20,000. They've got $22,000 requested. In 2002, it was $5,300.
Projected this year was $1,500 and again I know that was prior to the summer
season so it may be more realistic but that's a fairly large gap between actual or
even projected actual and what's being requested. That certainly could be
evaluated. This $12,000 in base for fuel I know as we get larger there's probably
some necessity because we have to go from Lochsa Falls to Kiwanis Park so
there's a lot more fuel cost but it looks again like a fairly small amount and that
some of that might be a little extra. There is $10,000 for tree maintenance in the
downtown area and there hasn't been any - and I know again that was March so
I don't know. It looks like last year it was $3,700 and now we have $10,000.
Strong: Actually t he reason fort hat is that many 0 f t he downtown street tree
containers need to be replaced.
Nary: Okay.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 52 of 108
Strong: They are fairly expensive each because they weren't put in. They
weren't large enough when they were put in. They need to be replaced because
the trees aren't going to fit as it grows.
De Weerd: And they're trying to do - they're not trying to do them all at the same
time, they're doing a few every year.
Nary: Isn't that something eventually maybe MDC might be assisting the partial
cost? Maybe not this next year but in the future.
De Weerd: They could possibly.
Corrie: What was that furniture and equipment Doug? What was that $1,800
that was normally eight 125 percent increase?
Cunningham: Yes we actually put in an extra $1,000 for Doug's office because
even then you're looking at changing out some of his furniture. He's just trying to
figure out exactly how to get it arranged in there and what to do with the
previous. A s far a s t he recreation you know that $1,500 for t he adults sports
(inaudible). Actually right now and as of the end of June they've spent $4,500. It
looks like we got (inaudible) considering what they're doing.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess in the recreation program it looks like our adult sports are
really going strong. I appreciate Doug's background because you have a strong
recreation background. I hope that we start seeing more out of our recreation
program but it seems like some of the momentum that we've built over the prior
couple of years has very much diminished. Adult recreation seems to be keeping
us afloat but I guess I'm concerned that our expenses in recreation are going up
and the number of offerings seems to be going down. I don't know if we're going
in the right direction but we're paying more money out to a program that's
offering less to our community. It's hard to justify that.
Strong: Actually I agree with that in just looking at what little history I can absorb
so far. There's - our current recreation superintendent position has been filled
for just a year. It was transitioned certainly that may have affected some of what
we saw and the actual results. Unfortunately, we're faced with replacing that
position again as of August 1 st Lisa's last day will be August 1 st. This weekend's
paper there will be an announcement to refill that position so there will be yet
another transition. Anytime you do that I think programs are certainly affected. I
would like to see those program numbers back up and t hat's going to be the
effort as we look for a new person and look into the next year. Now whether we
can cut back some dollars to help with that transition come back next year and
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 53 of 108
look at some history and see whether we're back up to where we were that might
be a practical way to look at it.
De Weerd: I appreciate that Doug. You know it just was concerning to see for
the first year in the history of our program we haven't had a summer camp for
kids. I know that the Boys and Girls Club has filled that void to a certain extent
but I was really unfortunate that we didn't have it this year. I again, appreciate
your background and assumed that the numbers would start turning around
because I know what your focus is and that's great.
Strong: Some of this is going to be a benefit from a relationship with the school
district that's improved from where it is now. Part of the problem with the
summer supervised play program understanding is location having a site to do it.
That's what I've been told. I think that can be resolved. I think that probably
could have been resolved this summer but it wasn't. We need to fix those things.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess when I look at that number there Doug, I mean I'm not again trying
to cut them off when there's some opportunities there but I look at it and think
you know some of that has to be also supplemented by the fees for the program.
Not all of it but some of it has to be supplemented and I guess I just think
$15,000 seems I ike a fairly large nu mber. I don't know what you would change it
to. I think it needs to be at 10. I think it needs to be 10 I just think that I mean all
of $5,000 I guess I would rather move it down to 10 and look at what kind of
programs. What kind of fee structure you can do so that it can be as - I don't
know if it were completely self sustaining but certainly it would be closer to more
self sustaining than the other way.
Strong: I have a disagreement with that. I think it's an area of what we do that
can be somewhat performance based and should be performance based to
some degree. That you see results and then you justify increases. Some of it
can be offset when it's an area of the department that we do generate revenue.
You don't generate revenue by mowing grass so there is a difference there.
Nary: Speaking of mowing grass on the spring and fertilizer on the $22,000 in
base for that that just seems incredible high from what the experience has been.
Even though we have added more park property I don't know how much has that
been to the end of June and I recognize you still have a couple of more months
of-
Kilchenmann: We have quizzed Elroy closely on this for the last two years
because it hasn't been spent. He says it's an issue of I need the money, I
actually need more money I just don't have time to do it. I was almost as we
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg, 54 of 108
talked about contract labor wondering if that was maybe - we could use that
money to contract maybe some of those expenses. We have had two or three
different landscaping companies approach us and ask for information so I think
they might be interested in doing that.
Nary: But do we really need a $22,000 base to begin with? I mean it seems to
me like we may have needed some of it in contract labor for maintenance but it
just seems like such a large number that isn't getting done but didn't we also buy
a sprayer. Don't we have a sprayer?
Corrie: Yes we have a sprayer. I believe I've been -
Bird: Very expensive I'll tell you.
Nary: Yes so it seems silly to buy a sprayer then we don't use it and then we
contract somebody else to spray. It just seems like a large number that we don't
really need and haven't experienced using so I'm not sure we need to maintain it
that level.
Kilchenmann: (inaudible).
Nary: I guess I would be more in favor of moving it to $10,000.
Bird: I would agree with you.
De Weerd: I wouldn't do it. Is that fine? I wouldn't cut it that drastically.
Bird: That's only counting 12.
De Weerd: That's more than - yes.
Nary: Half would be 11.
De Weerd: I said that's more than half.
Nary: We can make it 11 but I don't - I mean I don't know how much more
spraying is remaining throughout this budget year.
Strong: I know it's Elroy's intent to have a better handle on fertilizing and
spraying and certainly staffing will help that too.
De Weerd: Yes with the full time person.
Strong: Yes we have additional staff for that. That makes more staff time
available, which would be one of Elroy's concerns, is he just doesn't have time to
get it done.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 55 of 108
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council Members)
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: Doug would it seem reasonable if we did put that at $10,000 and
then transfer $5,000 into the contract labor? I know that Councilman Nary said in
Boise, some of the neighborhood parks are contracted out because it just costs
so much for the personnel to load up the mowers, go over to those smaller parks
and maintain them. Maybe some of that contracted labor could be used for some
of the things that Elroy can't get to and you don't have a full time groundskeeper
specifically in charge of them. Most of their time is for the larger parks. Would
that seem something -
Strong: I think in the future that might be an option. We don't have very many
neighborhood parks right now that wouldn't probably help us much. I remember
when we discussed this Elroy was concerned having enough to buy fertilizer and
actually get it on.
De Weerd: So $15,000 in that account.
Strong: (Inaudible) it looks like what's being proposed there is higher than what's
currently - in my current practice it might make sense some adjustment to it. I
don't have anything that I can grab at right now.
De Weerd: There's no magic number?
Strong: Not in my head. Elroy would probably respond differently.
Corrie: (Inaudible) cut out too much we get telephone calls about why it's
(inaudible). It's because we don't have fertilizer and then they're going to say
come on Council get the fertilizer. Would you like to put that at 15 and that would
give you another 12.
Strong: That would give us something to work with.
Corrie: $7,000 excuse me. Put it at 15 yes and -
De Weerd: Do we want to put some to contracts?
Corrie: We had $20,000 for that.
Nary: It's $2,000 on the bottom.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18. 2003
Pg. 56 of 108
Cunningham: Actually in the maintenance it's only $2,000.
Corrie: I was looking at contract labor.
De Weerd: Yes.
Nary: It seems to me I mean I guess to me what we could do is we could move I
think $15,000 based on the size of what we're talking about. You can move the
spraying and fertilizer under the departments' budget to 11, take four of that, and
put that in the contract labor. That puts you at $15,000. If there's a need to
transfer that later because there's - they can come and ask for that. It just
seems like $15,000 that just seems like plenty. Whether or not we take 11 into
the one that's the departments doing it, take the portion of the other four, and put
it into the contract one that should cover what we're trying to accomplish.
De Weerd: (Inaudible).
Cunningham: Okay so that puts out a $10,000 reduction and then you take 11
from the spraying and four in contract labor.
Nary: Do you think that would work Doug?
Strong: What's going through my mind is when we have contract labor what's a
part of the contract. They actually do the spraying and fertilizing but do they also
provide fertilizer. A lot of what this costs is the actual purchase of the spray and
fertilizer. We can always contract people to apply it but I would think in most
cases we would have to supply the fertilizer for the sprayer. Again, what's not
clear in my head (inaudible) the cost 0 f the product not the application of the
product.
Nary: But our experience level is at $7,000 to this year. We can leave the
$15,000 in your departments line but I mean it seems like that's almost double
what you've experienced at this point and I know there's still more of the summer
to go.
Strong: Well with my limited history of the department my projection of what
happened last year since Elroy spent much of the last year with additional
responsibility in the department didn't leave time to do some of these kind of
things that now he can focus on.
De Weerd: So that number is not really reflective of what the actual need is.
Strong: I think we've added acres as well in the last year. It's going to require
more fertilizer next spring particularly new park land until you have established
grass. It needs more fertilizer it needs more weed (inaudible) as well. I'm a little
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 57 of 108
reluctant I guess in just my projection of that cutting back too far on the ability to
buy the product on this new grass.
Kilchenmann: Elroy's actually (inaudible).
Strong: I guess the best answer is that next year when we come back and look
at this again if we don't produce then you were right. That's not a very good
answer but unfortunately, I don't have a year's history to know exactly either.
Nary: I guess I'm still more on moving it down at the end if that's fine.
Bird: And I agree with Councilman Nary. The actual used in 2002 was $5,302 I
just -
***End Of Side Three***
Bird: -- and we're going to have the time to do it.
Corrie: Does anybody else want to - the two that's left put it in 15? The two
ladies so far haven't said.
McCandless: I think I would put it at 15 for this year.
Corrie: Move it to 15 then that's three.
De Weerd: I already said.
Corrie: Okay that's right I'm sorry.
Nary: Okay move it to 15.
Cunningham: Then the contract labor I'll leave alone.
Nary: Yes.
De Weerd: Unless you want to add to it.
Cunningham: Is there anything else?
Corrie: That's pretty good for right now we may have to come back. (Inaudible).
I can't hear you.
ADMINISTRATIVE
Kilchenmann: The Laserfiche (inaudible).
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 58 of 108
Nary: Mr. Mayor I for one can't see how we can't upgrade the system that we
already have. I can't'see how we can't do that. I didn't see - that didn't seem
like a luxury to me.
Corrie: Yes that's fine.
Nary: I think I heard Mr. Bird in supporting technology.
Bird: 100 percent.
De Weerd: I know.
Bird: 100 percent I think it's something that we as a city has - we don't have
enough choice. It's a benefit that just helps the whole city. It's something we've
got to do.
De Weerd: As we also went into this one we talked about the appropriate place
for street lighting. I don't know if anyone has been able to get any kind of
information on that.
Berg: (Inaudible) so I have to give them a call.
De Weerd: Well geez Will can't you do two places at one time.
Nary: Maybe it was closed at five.
De Weerd: Oh, you're not a mom so you don't know.
McCandless: I (inaudible) a mom.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: On those, other three J guess in that I think it was very helpful to have
(inaudible) for MDC. I can see the need for the up front costs. I guess we're all
hoping that it should be reimbursed in the next fiscal year so it should be
ultimately a wash. I can understand the need of the up front money and $60,000
is within line of what they're trying to do initially so I don't have a real big concern
with that. Again, I think the Mayor was right on the money with the Senior
Center. I don't have a problem with the amount I think we just need to be real
specific as to what it's for so that's real clear to the seniors as well as anyone
else what we're helping fund. SAGE you know we have wrestled with SAGE for
more than we probably should for the last five months.
Bird: For the amount of money.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 59 of 108
Nary: For the amount of money we're talking about. I look at it this way and I
have no problem next year in saying these again. This is a one-time shot. We
asked the two most affected parties for SAGE to come and tell us that they could
use it. MDC and the seniors said they could that would help us. MDC you know
in looking at what their proposed budget was that $3,000 that they were looking
at for a contract grant writer my assumption is, is that's the market for that type of
thing. If we pay the membership for SAGE and those two main entities have the
ability to use them and gain some advantage or gain some opportunity because
of our participation in that great. Next year, we spend four months arguing over it
and we can't really identify that it really has benefited those things we won't join
them again. I think it's a one-time shot. It's still again, marketable for what it
appears it would cost to hire a grant writer. We would actually get more bank for
our buck with SAGE than just hiring a grant writer for one project that MDC is
hoping to do they would have the opportunity to use them for multiple projects.
Again, it's a one time shot for me. I have no particular other affections for SAGE
other than I think they might benefit our folks so we'll give it a shot.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I would agree with those sediments. Actually, we identified one more
project that SAGE could help and that's the pathway or the bridge for the parks. I
would hope that all of these entities do take advantage of it and understand that
this is a one shot thing and they have to utilize their services because that's what
we're doing it for.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I would agree with joining them for a one-time shot. I think the biggest
thing I had against them was when they billed us for expecting us to join it then
before we even knew anything about it. It's just a one-time shot and it might be
very successful. I understand why C aldwel] and Garden City have very good
success with it. They happen to have the type of housing and stuff that falls into
SAGE's category real easy and we don't. Hopefully not to be sounding big or
anything like that but hopefully we don't have to in Meridian. If the Senior Center
can use it then like Tammy said, the parks now we can use that on the pathway,
the bridge, and MDC can use it. For $2,500 I say let's, give it a shot.
Corrie: Okay we'll give it a shot.
McCandless: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. McCandless.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18. 2003
Pg. 60 of 108
McCandless: I have been very opposed to SAGE membership but listening to - I
think the thing that convinced me that we ought to at least try them was the fact
that MDC had $3,000 in there for grant writing alone. I'm willing to go and try it
this year. By golly, if they don't come through I'm going to be totally against it
next year.
Bird: Well and I think you'll have all of us.
Nary: Mr. Mayor if I could just add one more thing. I think the other thing is that
if it is successful that may be a portion of the contributions at the Senior Center
next year. Then maybe a portion of the MDC contributions as for that
membership and it won't be (inaudible). It will be incorporated in their
contributions if it is successful. If it isn't I don't think we'll have any question that
everybody else would feel the same way.
Kilchenmann: Mayor and Members of the Council an answer to the street
lighting. It's kind of what I thought it would be no you cannot move that to an
enterprise fund. It's considered a fund of general government. When we switch
- so we can move it to Planning and Zoning / Building that we currently call
special services. Actually, under Gasby 34 those special services although
we've tagged it and called it special services fund they'll actually be combined
with the general fund and they'll be just expenses of general government.
Corrie: Okay.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Stacy you were going to call Deputy Chief Johnson about the frame the
fire engine.
Kilchenmann: He's out of town. Kenny doesn't answer his cell phone but this is
the information I got from Greta. She said there will be if we go right to date,
they've spent $9,000. She said the nine Firefighters are going to go to training in
August the nine new Firefighters. They will start their training in August. She
was adamantly for not decreasing it. She said we have a 30 percent increase in
staff because of the new nine Firefighters. She did not know the cost for the
training the nine are going to go to. I think it's like for basic training.
Nary: Mr. Mayor but that's in this budget year so this is next budget year why
would they need another $34,000 next year.
Kilchenmann: I don't know. I just could not get a hold of any of them.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 61 of 108
Nary: That's going tog et phased 0 ut 0 f this 0 ne son ow we have continuing
budgets. Being their history (inaudible).
De Weerd: I do know it is a higher priority. It is identified in the strategic plan. I
do know it has come up in our discussions that a higher priority needs to be
placed on training. It certainly can be one of those negotiable points too that we
can say to the table that this is our commitment to training. Training is an issue.
You know I guess even when we discussed this earlier the additional nine
employees do add a significant increase. I would propose leaving it there and
revisiting it next year when we can know what the playing field is.
Kilchenmann: Yes she's trying to page Kenny but she said there's a structure
fire somewhere.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess since we're in general administration and maybe this is
something that we can come back and address after we've looked at some of the
benefits and merit issues. We have the City Hall issue. We have paving of a
parking lot over by the Centennial Park and we have the citywide appreciation
type of function. I guess that does get into an employee merit or benefit is how
we do our appreciation and is Christmas the time to do it when each department
seems to already be doing their own thing. The question is do we continue to do
the Christmas Party and I think you've had some discussions already Mayor with
some of the employees about that. Also, I would like a specific line item for the
volunteer barbeque. I know we just happened to do that out of the City Clerk's
budget wherever he could fit it or wherever we could fit that. I think our
volunteers are extremely important to our city and having a specific recognition of
a line item would be an appropriate thing. I would also like to propose, maybe
during this time of a budget year it's not the appropriate time, and since I will not
be City Council President next year, I have no personal gain for this. The City
Council President does have an increase amount of time commitment and
anyone stepping into it that you may want to think of some form of compensation.
I know it's been done in the past where they get a little bit more than the other
Council Members. I would like to just put that on table for discussion as well. I
know I just added a whole list for your consideration or discussion but those are
items that have been pending. We've talked a bout many 0 f t hem, I've talked
independently with the other Council Members on the Council President position,
and I think there's a feeling that that's worth discussion.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 62 of 108
Nary: Yes you've brought up a bunch of different issues. On the City Hall one,
first I guess we do need to keep our eye on how we do that. I think whether it's a
study whether it's something if we don't set money aside for that it's never going
to happen. I think there are probably some people who doesn't think it's ever
going to happen anyway but I think we need to have - we need to fund that. We
need to have that money and then not just turn around and reallocate it
somewhere else. On the employee incentives and the like again, I'm really
(inaudible) I think if anything could transition from a winter activity to a summer
activity it might take a little bit of a push to do that. I think as I've stated before I
think it's a good opportunity to support our local business and look at the cost of
holding an event at Roaring Springs. A lot of employees could bring their
families to something like that. The winter function is nice but it's fairly a small
attendance and a fairly limited attendance is the people that can come. For that
kind of activity, you have to get a sitter and you have a lot of other needs. One of
the things that we've done with Boise that we haven't really talked about here but
if having some of these employee things like a summer picnic at Roaring Springs
or something like that we could certainly invite the volunteers to participate in that
activity as well. At least for Boise, we've always had employees contribute a
portion to the cost a fairly minimal amount two to five dollars per person. Most of
the reason that the cost was passed on was to just assure people to attend it. If
they paid, two or three dollars to come you're going to come. If you make it,
three you'll have no idea how many people are going to show up until they get
there. It's a way to get a head count essentially up front and a fairly minimal cost
to offset a little bit of the cost of food or something else. I think we do need to
have something like that. I think that it would be better attended and a better
opportunity. Again, it changes a little bit of how we do things. I don't necessarily
think you want to do that for the rest of your life but if in a couple of years you
want to do something different again I think it provides some variety of activities
for the employees. On the issue of the Council President, I agree with Council
Member de Weerd. I think it's warranted because I think there are
responsibilities for the Council President that take up a little extra time, take a
little more time. I don't think you can good faith do that though until we address
the employee compensation. I think we have to address that first showing no
way any of us could sit up here and say we're going to give the Council President
another $150 a month or $100 a month or whatever it is and everybody else
gets (inaudible) you can't do that. You can't do that but I think once we've
addressed the employee compensation I don't think it's unreasonable to
compensate the Council President given the additional time that's taken and all
the multiple needs (inaudible).
De Weerd: City Hall.
Nary: Oh yes I said that works.
De Weerd: And saving for that parking lot.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 63 of 108
Nary: Oh and that's another one I think there maybe some up front costs and
hopefully that's another thing either a lot more maintenance could be done by the
end of the MDC. Whether we do the up front paying on then the ongoing
maintenance is eventually done through their program.
De Weerd: I think that's -
Nary: (Inaudible). Right we have to do it now but-
De Weerd: We have to do the up front with the MDC could maintain it after this
first year.
Corrie: I'm going to call ZGA and find out what an update on our feasibility study
what we need for the City Hall. Find out how much it's going to cost.
Bird: We've got money every year. I think we got one even now for City Hall for
the update. We've had a couple 0 f free updates on it but I think you're right
Mayor we need to get another update.
Corrie: Do we have money in the budget right now for updates on City Hall?
Kilchenmann: I would have to go through and look at everything now that we
have two members. I think we will not need to hold back as much as we
originally planned on but I need to look at June.
Cunningham: Another thing we have is the actual (inaudible).
Kilchenmann: Oh okay that's right we've already moved them.
De Weerd: We had the part time employee for parks for-
Kilchenmann: We're talking about - we went back to the current year. That's
right. You would still have about almost $30,000.
Corrie: So we can get that update -
De Weerd: Yes, it would be good to get it in this budget year. Then what if Mr.
Mayor when we talk to my - after we get this study update what would be the
next step and if that has cost associated with it?
Kilchenmann: You know the other thing you could do is you could budget some
out of the capital improvement fund because that's what that's for. The Building
Department - we keep putting a good amount of money into that every year.
Corrie: I don't think this feasibility update is going to be a lot. I think it would be
good to know (inaudible).
I
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 64 of 108
De Weerd: Yes whatever cost associated with City Hall could be taken out of it
for next year. Let's do what we can to absorb the cost this year if at all possible.
Corrie: I would like to see the MDC get involved with this because they can
really borrow the money and help us out because it's always a process concern.
I'll find out what the cost of the update is for this year.
Cunningham: What do you guys think about moving the (inaudible).
De Weerd: Personally, I think that would be an appropriate move.
McCandless: I do too.
De Weerd: I still would like the supervision of it from Will since he has
traditionally done that. He oversees a lot of the functions in Planning and Zoning
anyway so it still would be an appropriate fit. That's just my personal opinion.
Corrie: We can still do it.
Kilchenmann: Yes, where it's funded it's different-
Corrie: Different funding but they still have the accountability.
De Weerd: Do the other people want to do it that way.
McCandless: I agree.
Bird: I agree with that.
Corrie: It would still be under (inaudible) scrutiny there.
De Weerd: Okay so what's the damage?
Cunningham: (Inaudible).
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council Members)
De Weerd: I guess we could add that police officers back in to the original
request.
Nary: You still have the employee compensation that's-
Bird: Yes I was going to say you still have the employee compensation.
Corrie: You've got 73 percent averaged.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 65 of 108
De Weerd: Averaged~out.
Cunningham: Are you guys ready to talk about compensation?
Corrie: Because I think they are okay with that police starting three months later
so that's all right.
Kilchenmann: But it's kind of six months (inaudible).
Cunningham: At first we came up with the merit increase you know the percent,
which actually gave the police their STEP plan, is already budgeted in. Then the
merit is actually just on the other employees based on midpoint. I have 135
percent including - actually including 10 percent. Then we had a flat two percent
that Pauline started talking about so she said she was going to recommend a two
percent increase just on the actual gross wages. That included police and fire
and taking out the STEP plan. Then also the Mayor mentioned three percent so I
did a three percent scenario on the general fund only. Three percent would cost
us $135,000 no STEP increases for police.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: Okay I'm sorry I'm going to have to work through my mind process.
The two percent there -
Cunningham: The merit.
De Weerd: The $74,000 that would include the STEP increases for the police
but not give them a merit as well.
Cunningham: No police they actually their STEP is their-
De Weerd: They would get their STEP and then across the rest there would be a
two percent average merit.
Cunningham: It would be a two percent pool right on their actual midpoint.
De Weerd: Okay.
Cunningham: So on the two percent too then if you go with merit that also
means the employee wouldn't get their raise until their anniversary date. It
wouldn't come into effect October 1st.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 66 of 108
Kilchenmann: So a two percent would be the upper end of that so most people
wouldn't get anything..
Cunningham: I know Pauline didn't want a two percent merit.
De Weerd: You know I am like Councilman Nary. I like the merit because you
recognize employees that are performing.
Kilchenmann: The only thing is the way we do it is it's on your midpoint so she
has this matrix of two percent is like for the highest achieving employee and we
usually only have like this year we only had two people that got that. The
confident employees get zero percent. Maybe I should get her in here so she
can -
Nary: No that's fine.
Cunningham: I did a scenario too on wages. I took some various positions with
some different types of insurance options so we looked at a Well Tech he's a
BCT, which is a traditional family. I looked at his pay for September 30th he's at
$1,809 net. Then if we went with Option 1 the insurance plan his nets going to
go down to $1,798 and Option 2 it will go down to $1,687. If we give him a two
percent merit increase then his pay would go up on the net if we don't change his
insurance or if we go to Option 1, he's going to get less of an increase. If he
goes to Option 2, he'll actually net out less than what he did in September. Then
we have to remember too these insurance changes don't happen until January.
Anybody that was on a PPO so the BCP's you'll see the PPO's at a two percent
they still get an increase even if their on Option 2. If you come down to anybody
on traditional, the two percent won't cover their insurance increase. Then it
depended -
De Weerd: Which is still a choice. That's still their choice.
Cunningham: It is a choice right. Then if you look at say that Department
Specialist if you give them - in January is actually when they're going to see the
insurance increase but they would not see a merit increase until April. It means
they would have four months where their pay would actually decrease before the
two percent would come in if they actually received a high enough evaluation to
get a raise.
De Weerd: Can you show a scenario Reta, where their out of pocket remains the
same as it is now with the Option 2.
Cunningham: Well it would mean that the city is going to have to absorb the
cost.
De Weerd: And how much would that cost the city.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 67 of 108
Cunningham: It's going to cost an extra $50,000.
De Weerd: Okay because I would like to at least protect their out of pocket
expenses for their benefits. If we go to Option 2 at least that way they have a
choice but we're protecting their out of pocket expenses. Then we can look at
their merit. At least we're starting at where they are today and then looking
forward.
Cunningham: Okay for general fund it will cost well it's an extra $48,000.
De Weerd: An extra $48,000.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Cunningham: Because what we did is we have budgeted for general fund
insurance $915,000 but if we're going to take - we're going to have an increase
of 34 percent and if we don't want to increase the employees' contribution we'll
need 963. That difference is $48,000.
De Weerd: And we still want to show that as an increase like Boise did. They
said you know the Boise employees got a 2.5 increase because they're covering
that out of pocket expense. I do want that to be aware. Everyone knows well
Boise got a two and a half percent increase well not in their wages but yes, they
did overall because now it's not coming out of their pocket. I think that's an
important factor to communicate.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess to me really realistically as difficult as it is I think the only thing that
we really can't afford to do at the moment is to assure the employees that they're
not going to lose pay. The merit - I don't want to get behind the curve on the
merit stuff but I don't think we really have the dollars at this juncture to give it. I
think we'll have to revisit the merit side of the equation. I think the only thing that
we can really do is just make sure they're not going to cost them more money
come October 1 st.
Bird: Out of pocket.
Nary: Out of pocket. Whether that's done through a flat across the board that
sounded like that was the only real way to accomplish that at this juncture was a
flat across the board rate that they have for everybody so they don't have - I
know there is some loss of incentive when you don't have merit. We've in Boise
we've experienced that a couple of times in the last five years but something's
got to give and that's at least the assurance the employee can have is that
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18. 2003
Pg. 68 of 108
they're not going to lose money. Then we'll have to readdress the merit issue
later.
De Weerd: So are you suggesting that we do the extra needed to no increase to
the employee on the benefits the $48,000 and then a flat two percent.
Nary: No, I thought the flat two percent covered that $48,000. I guess I thought
- that's what I thought Pauline said earlier was that either the two or two and a
half if we wanted to kind of split the difference there. If we had just two and half
across the board for everybody that would cover, their increased medical cost
and then that's about it. For some people it would probably be a - it would
actually be a little bit more money for - it wouldn't be any less money for
anybody.
Corrie: Would that be about an 82 percent 82 plus - and 13 on the other end.
We talked about that before rather than 80, 20 it would be 8317 is that what it
would figure at?
Cunningham: Right.
Corrie: Okay so they're getting a benefit and not having any more money taken
out of their paycheck. Yet, they're still saving that money as far as the benefits
are concerned in giving them the same thing. Is that long-term care included in
that budget?
Cunningham: No.
Corrie: It wasn't okay.
Nary: And then I think on the other side is that like I said earlier if we're going to
do that then we need to take a portion of the money that's remaining and pool
that. Then between finance and HR coming back in at their meeting discuss it
with Department Heads what other things we can do for employee incentive.
Whether it's flextime, which is a no cost but a management issue versus a
summer activity. Whether it's bonus, money or things of that nature don't use
that word bonus Jonathan. Something like that to provide employee incentive
but I think we need to take a portion of that money and set it aside so the
employees know we're still committed to employee moral and employee
incentives we just don't know what it is yet. We're going to set money aside so
we know it's there so that when they finish that staff work to decide what would
work the best for the different departments and how to accomplish it and
administer it then the money will be available. We're not just totally just cutting
their benefits off or payoff but we're saying we're going to put it in a different
way.
Corrie: Like that working with the time off.
! .
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 69 of 108
Nary: Right.
KHchenmann: We also like you had said we could look at it in January so we can
see if interest rates improved or (inaudible). If our income (inaudible).
Bird: Yes.
Corrie: I think it will but that's just a crystal ball guesstimate. I hope I'm right in
more ways than one.
De Weerd: Well and we just need to make a real commitment at this point at this
juncture to revisit it in January and make sure the employees know that we will.
That we appreciate them we just don't know the financial picture at this point.
Nary: Then like I said the staff work just going to get done between now and
then between finance, HR, and the Department Heads is coming up with those
alternatives. I think that again, shows our commitment to doing it is we have the
money available and we've asked for that type of work to be done ahead of time.
De Weerd: So the recommendation is a flat two percent.
Nary: Two or two and a half. I don't know -
Corrie: Whichever one -
Nary: -- so that we can make sure to cover it the best. You had a two and a
three so I was just trying to make it more complicated by-
Cunningham: The two percent would cover everything traditional.
Bird: Everything but what?
Cunningham: Except for those employees that wish to stay with traditional.
Bird: Well that's there choice I guess.
Nary: I think that's their choice too.
Corrie: I think you'll see a lot of change real quick.
Bird: Just make sure that we don't get - we're not costing them money out of
their pocket. That's my main concern.
Corrie: We are but that's there choice.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 70 of 108
Bird: On that part but I mean if you go to the PPO and it's not going to cost-
De Weerd: Do you want to address that issue with the STEP?
Nary: Does that include the STEP Program or is that - the two percent is for
everybody.
Bird: The two percent was for everybody.
Nary: So there's not a STEP Program.
Cunningham: Well wait (inaudible).
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council Members)
Nary: I didn't think it included the STEP I thought that was for everybody.
Corrie: Everybody but?
Nary: Well I thought the two percent included everybody. Police, fire everybody
there's no merit there's no nothing there's just two percent to cover everybody's
increase medical expense.
Bird: Then we will take a look at the merit stuff.
Cunningham: We also have that discussion about the Seargent adjustment in
the Police Department.
Nary: Seargents and Lieutenants wasn't it?
Cunningham: And Lieutenants. We need $12,000. We don't need to discuss it
you need to discuss it.
Corrie: Will did you have something?
Berg: Yes Mr. Mayor I was just going to emphasize something that the Benefit
Committee has done for the last couple of years is tried to make a little bit more
of a concern to the employees that they will have to pay for some of these
increases in our insurance. Last year we went to a 20 percent, 80 percent type
of thing so we're trying to make it more important that the cost of insurance it has
to be somewhat accepted by the employees to pay their share or a share and
they can control sometimes the increased premiums. I think the Benefit
Committee has tried to somewhat make a plan to do that. Not to do it all at once
but to make those little steps that they have to realize insurance is not an easy
thing anymore. It's not just a flat rate from year to year it's an experience rating
for us. Differences in benefits may have to happen. We may not have as good
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg.71 of 108
of luxury to have all the benefits that we have in the past or make it more optional
for them to pick and choose. Hopefully, they've kind of gathered that over the
last couple of years.
Corrie: So what is the bottom line that we're looking at right now?
Cunningham: Actually I typed in a wrong percent so it's $221,567 excess.
Nary: That's with the two percent.
Cunningham: With the two percent.
Corrie: With the two percent we're that much ahead so we can put that into
incentives that Bill was talking about.
Nary: Not all of it necessarily. That would be nice. A part of that incentive I think
also in the work from HR and Finance is that department incentive of saving their
savings being going back to their employees also went to incentives.
Kilchenmann: We can also look at giving a merit with that.
Nary: I have one more thing on the Seargents and Lieutenants you know I guess
I don't look at that the same as a raise in my mind. I think that is trying to keep
them status quo with the market for them. To me it isn't the same thing. I think
we needed to do that adjustment just to keep them in line and again it puts them
in really the same boat, as everyone else is all it is. I don't have a big heartburn
with that $11,000, $12,000 whatever the number was to keep them just in STEP.
Then they're still looking at the two percent as the same across the board for alj
of us.
Corrie: I will talk to the Department Heads too about this incentive of having
maybe a three-day Friday, Saturday, and Sunday for some at one time. They
move it to - well it's going to be a little bit of work for the Department Heads and
the people there but maybe the employees would also look at it as a benefit that
they would possibly one week out of the month they have a three day holiday.
We c an work on that with them and I think that is a pretty good deal without
costing us any money technically. Pauline do you have something?
Skeggs: Weill was just going to add to Council Member Nary's comment as far
as the police. That's just going to put them back in alignment with their program.
At the time that we implemented the program, there was a difference between
STEP's from police officer to detective to Seargent where it was 10 percent. We
condensed those from Seargent to Lieutenant to five percent because we had
those individuals were already above their range so it wouldn't be an impact.
Since Chief Worley reorganized his department and he's promoted some
/
,
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 72 of 108
employees up to Seargent's and restructured the Lieutenants position it now
does impact. It only impacts eight employees.
Bird: Yes this has got to be taken care of.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess my reluctance to not just making sure there's no out of
pocket expenses and absorbing it into the benefits and maybe giving a slight flat
increase of one percent or something is that that's taxed money. The benefits of
maintaining - I just don't know if you figure in if they're really breaking even when
you consider they're paying taxes on the flat two percent increase. As a tax
preparer I always kind of look at tax implications and those things you know you
still are affecting the out of pocket and the bottom line.
Skeggs: Well Councilwoman de Weerd if they're doing the pre-tax for their
benefits for their health insurance and flex plan that's pre-taxed so it's coming out
on a pre-tax basis.
De Weerd: But how many people do you have doing that?
Skeggs: A majority of the employees are doing the pre-tax. We have a few
employees that this year we're going to encourage them to do the pre-tax as well
because they actually get an increase in their paycheck. They're giving
themselves a pay raise by doing that. We had the employees that were left last
year when the other employees had converted who hadn't done it the previous
year because you can only do it during open enrollment came and asked us I
want to do that. I didn't realize I would get more money in our paycheck. We
said unfortunately we only have open enrollment once a year so this year when it
comes up again we'll remind you. We have several employees that didn't do it
that want to do it this year because they can actually give themselves a pay
increase because it's on a pre-tax basis.
Kilchenmann: So it's a choice.
De Weerd: As far as I knew the participation and that was a couple of years ago,
it wasn't very high.
Corrie: It's increased.
De Weerd: It looks like it caught on?
Skeggs: Right the first year it's always new people are apprehensive then the
next year it catches on and more people enroll. Last year we talked to every
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 73 of 108
single person that didn't do the pre-tax and explained it and we had several
employees switch over. Then those employees that were still apprehensive once
their fellow co-workers switched over then they were telling them wow, she's right
I did get more in my paycheck we got a lot of calls.
Nary: And it's free money.
Skeggs: It is it's free money.
Nary: It's really free money and the plus side too for the employees is the fixed
cost ones are easy. It's the guesstimate of how much you're going to use at the
doctor and how much you're going to have. The fixed amount to pay your
premium that's easy. That's an easy one so you can figure that exactly. It's like
free money to you.
(Inaudible discussion among Council Members)
Kilchenmann: Could you guys take a five minute break while she fixes the-
Corrie: Yes I was going to say you're moving figures around there faster than I
can see them. I'm getting confused. Let's take a five-minute break.
(Return at 11 :44 A.M.)
Corrie: Okay we're coming back from recess.
De Weerd: What was that?
Nary: This sound system just doesn't work very well. Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: The bottom line up there looks a whole lot better at the moment. You had
mentioned I think Stacy about setting aside some of the capital improvement
project fund towards the city hall thing. I don't think we've done that yet or were
we-
Kilchenmann: We haven't done that yet.
Nary: Is that my - I mean that certainly makes sense to me.
Bird: I think we ought to throw $50,000 at least at it.
De Weerd: Throw what of what?
Bird: $50,000 for the city hall.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 74 of 108
Nary: The city hall issue.
De Weerd: City hall.
Corrie: You're awful loose for that throw.
Nary: Does that come out of that 301 or is that-
De Weerd: How about dedicate. I think we need to dedicate it.
Nary: That doesn't come out of the 301.
Kilchenmann: If you did it out of the capital improvement fund it wouldn't come
out of the 301.
Bird: What?
Nary: It wouldn't come out of that 301 if we did it out of the capital improvement
plan.
Bird: No but it would affect the bottom line on that 301.
Cunningham: No.
Kilchenmann: No it wouldn't.
Bird: Oh it wouldn't?
Nary: Different fund.
Bird: (Inaudible) you're going out of capital.
Nary: Right but that makes sense because that's what it's for.
Bird: You can go out of capital.
Nary: Do you think $50,000 is adequate?
Bird: I think $50,000 to start yes because if you - regardless you're going to
have to finance it and that's all the money you're going to have anyway from the
city that you can use out of the city. You could use $50,000 out of the city and
then your financing would take care of everything else.
Nary: Sure.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 75 of 108
Cunningham: I'm just going to make note down here so $50,000?
Nary: I think that's fine.
Cunningham: Then also we were discussing whether there was going to be a
three percent merit or three percent flat?
Nary: Weill thought we had said two percent flat.
Corrie: Two percent flat but we just wanted to look at what a three percent flat
would look like. What the bottom line comes out at.
Cunningham: Because a three percent flat will be another 23, $24,000.
Nary: So move that other one down to $276.
Bird: That should be fine.
Cunningham: Also another point is if we do the merit those employees that have
their salaries frozen or above the STEP, they actually won't get any kind of an
increase. Then they would have the change in the benefits so their net pay
would go down.
Nary: But if we did the flat wouldn't that be for - that would mean everybody.
Cunningham: A flat means everybody regardless of where they are in the-
Bird: In the STEP and everything.
De Weerd: Yes we need to.
Corrie: So if you went to three then that bottom line would be $277,000?
Cunningham: Yes.
Corrie: I guess I just wanted to know what your bottom line - what you ended up
with.
Nary: At least from what I had heard initially and for looking at this very lean the
two percent from what we've been talking about a lot the two percent would
cover everybody's extra cost not including those that chose the traditional plan.
To me, that makes the most sense. We're trying to figure out what's the leanest
way to do this without hurting people's pocket book. The two percent does that.
That gives us a larger bottom line at the moment. I don't think we had a lot of
things left to discuss other than the truck I think for the Park's Department. We
said we would at least talk about it once we got past compensation.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 76 of 108
Corrie: And the paving maintenance.
Nary: And the paving. Then it would give us a fairly large number or at least an
adequate number to set aside for both the merit -
***End Of Side Four***
Nary: -- all the money so we could have some of the money allocated for some
future things some reserve. I guess I don't have a problem with the two percent.
I think it holds in line with what we've been talking about of making sure there
isn't a bottom line hit to the employees then we'll have some money available to
be able to revisit it.
Bird: I can go along with that. On the park truck, I don't know. That's - I just see
so much stuff bought down there that's not used 100 percent of the time and it
just - that has been my bugaboo and on that whole department ever since day
one. They run out and buy something they think they need and they use it for
one week then it gets parked for 51 weeks do you know what I mean?
Nary: Right.
Bird: If we're not going to put the hours on them then I don't think we need it.
McCandless: I think we can get along without that truck this year.
Bird: I have to agree with you. I'm glad I wasn't originally but the more I think
about it the more I think of the waste of equipment. It's just like that sprayer I
don't know how much we've got in that sprayer down there but - and we budget
it every year and it's not being used right. I don't think they're the only
department. We've got - I think the water and Wastewater needs to be - all of
their equipment needs to be looked at. You have two mules out at the
Wastewater Plant because two guys don't like sharing one.
Nary: Well Mr. Mayor I wasn't advocated for it we just said we would come back
to it once we got done with the conversation. I'm with you. I don't really see the
need. There may be a better identifiable need next year and I just I think right
now it still would be more out of line of what we have been talking about of really
trying to be very need based. I don't see that as a need yet.
McCandless: And I think by next year the interest rates will have gone up again.
They're starting up again now so we're going to have a little -
Bird: Weill think that there are just a lot of things that we need in our purchasing
and stuff. Like I said earlier, everything including computers and everything else
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 77 of 1 08
we need to be more approval on when we're purchasing it. There needs to be a
need for it. A real need not just a want
De Weerd: Well and I think our IT person is really keeping an eye on that. If one
person doesn't need the computer he or needs an upgrade like an engineering
that other computer can be dedicated to another department that - if you have
one person kind of overseeing that you have at least someone coordinating that
effort. I would like to ask for an increase in fire of the clothing expense to
$27,000 up from the 23.
Corrie: Clothing what?
Bird: Clothing expense?
De Weerd: The clothing expense.
Bird: Why do they need more in their clothing? Why?
De Weerd: I'll give you a print out if you would like me to.
Bird: I want to see some proof. I tell you -
McCandless: You wanted to increase it to what Tammy?
De Weerd: To $27,000. That doesn't mean it's going to be used.
Corrie: Yes it will.
Bird: It will be used.
Corrie: You put it down whether it's going to be used or not because they will
come back and use it. They really will.
De Weerd: We have nine Firefighters that we're adding on.
Bird: How much are we allowing per person per year?
Cunningham: $650 for firemen.
Bird: $650 is that what the contract says.
Cunningham: Yes police are $600.
Nary: So Mr. Mayor is the $23,000 reflecting the new nine Firefighters?
Cunningham: Yes.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 78 of 108
Nary: So why do we need that again?
Corrie: That's actually at $2300 isn't it?
Nary: $23,000.
Corrie: I have it at $23,100.
Nary: Yes $23,100. If that includes the contracted amount for all the employees
including the new additions, why would we need to increase it more?
De Weerd: Just a buffer.
Nary: Was I unclear?
De Weerd: No.
Skeggs: Councilman Nary from what I know during the negotiations that in the
fire rules and regulation book that just got approved that Kenny has requested
that the Firefighters do not work - they have to have Meridian logos on their
workout clothes. They have to have collared shirts and the Meridian logo when
they're there just at the fire station whether they don't go on calls. These are
additional expenses for them for clothing allowance above and beyond the
regular fire uniform. I don't know the specifics of that. Kenny would be one to
probably better answer that. Because of that that's why they're asking for more.
Like if they were working out and they got called to a car fire or something and
they rush out to help them or an EMT call and they may be wearing these T-
shirts with not so good language or stuff on them. He wants them to wear work
out clothes that has the Meridian logo on it. Also, when they're there in the fire
station to have collared shirts. They put it in the rules and regulation book as
that's what was explained to us right Tammy when we were in the negotiations
last time. That's about all I know and that's why they were asking for more
because if they're going to have to spend money on that that's going to take
away from their standard fire uniform as well and replacements for those.
De Weerd: How about $25,000.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary. I'm confused here.
Nary: I don't get it yes I don't get that. Do they show up at fires dressed in T-
shirts and shorts?
Skeggs: I'm not sure how that works.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 79 of 108
Nary: I don't get that: They already have T-shirts that they buy and the already
have pants that they buy.
Skeggs: I'm not sure how that works Kenny didn't explain it.
Bird: They do have shirts and shorts and they have the logo on it and everything.
Yes, that's what they usually put on underneath and then they put their turnouts
on top of them. It's nothing unstandard. As a rule in a policy, if they're wearing
what I understand is they're wearing T-shirts that has crappy sayings on them. I
had that problem too at work but you know what I did? If they come in with them,
they went home and didn't get paid. If you can't respect yourself and wear
something decent if you have to have these stupid sayings on these T-shirts then
you have no business being there or being an employee.
De Weerd: But Keith that wasn't a decision - that was a decision that the
department made.
Bird: That's fine that's a rule. That's a rule Tammy and we don't have to replace
their uniforms. They get their standard uniform, which is what it should be. If
they want to work out in a decent blue gym suit or something like that, they can
work out in a decent gym suit. Now if they want to wear those crappy things that
have all these great sayings across them then they don't need to be at our
station in our city.
De Weerd: Okay well do you want to negotiate?
Bird: No you don't want me to.
De Weerd: What's your counter offer?
Nary: I guess their bottom line is is they -
Bird: We're not having it anymore.
Nary: And the bottom line is they have a clothing allowance and that's what they
contract for. That's what they have to deal with. If they want more then they
have to negotiate for more but I don't see a reason to fund it just so they cannot
have to wear shirts that have inappropriate logos on them. They already have
money to buy shirts with and they need to set a policy that says this is what you
wear when you come to work.
McCandless: Yes I agree.
Corrie: They want to have boots every year and it's not needed.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 80 of 1 08
Bird: That's right Bob. Those boots last two and three years. How often do you
have to buy a dress. uniform?
Corrie: Most of them have them anyway.
De Weerd: It depends on whom you're asking.
Bird: Well yes me too. I kind of shouldn't say anything.
Corrie: You have to keep your old stuff in case you get back.
Nary: If they want more money then let's make the seminars and training a little
less. Otherwise, I think just leave it the way it is.
Corrie: Yes you can move that back and forth. If they want more, for one thing
they have to take it from another.
De Weerd: Okay well let's take two out of that and move it to clothing. $2,000
out of training and move it to clothing.
Corrie: Let's see what we have for training.
Nary: That was the one where we discussed on the seminars and training and
all that Greta indicated was that t here are nine a dditional Firefighters that a re
going to training in August. That's this budget year. As Council Member de
Weerd pointed out with nine additional Firefighters, there may be an increase
cost we just don't know what it is. I don't care if we want to take $2,000 out of
that base -
De Weerd: Let's rob Peter to pay Paul.
Nary: -- and put it into the clothing.
Bird: Let me tell me what you're doing you're just cutting your hands off at
negotiations. You're already giving them $2,000 more for uniforms they know
they've got that because you budgeted it.
Nary: Right.
Bird: So you have no negotiations. I wouldn't put another penny in there in fact]
would take some out and then let them negotiate. Then we can trade off some.
If they want an extra $50 or they want an extra, this then they can give us
something back.
Nary: I think that makes perfect sense.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18. 2003
Pg. 81 of 108
McCandless: Yes me too.
De Weerd: Okay you guys go walk in that door.
Corrie: I will.
Bird: That's what you get the money for.
De Weerd: The same money you get.
Kilchenmann: F or our purposes right now we really don't need to do the line
items that are already within the budget.
Corrie: I think they have enough as it is.
Nary: But I think the bottom line is I think Council Member Bird is right. I think if
we fund it they'll know it's there, we won't be able to stop them now we're not
going to do it - he already funded anyway. We can move it around if we need to.
Bird: We have Tammy over the barrel she can't do a thing. They've already
funded it an extra $2,000.
De Weerd: That's a pretty site.
Bird: Don't kid yourself Tammy they'll do it to you. They'll get you in the back if
you add that in the funding.
De Weerd: Okay did you put in something for paving that parking lot?
Cunningham: No how much do you guys want in there?
Bird: Well I don't know we have to figure out how much we need. Do you
remember what the other one was Will or Bob? Do either one of you guys
remember?
De Weerd: The one on Pine Street the actual cost not the cost of the land was
around $36,000. Now Broadway was more but I think they had some issues with
that one.
Bird: Oh Broadway they had a problem down here.
De Weerd: The one on Pine was $36,000.
Bird: And how many years ago was that Tammy?
De Weerd: That was in '98.
.,.,~:," "".
!
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 82 of 108
Bird: I would put at least $40,000 in that.
McCandless: I was going to say today it would run $40,000.
De Weerd: $40,000 then.
Corrie: If you get a good bid yes.
Bird: Yes we'll have to go out and see if we can't get some better bids.
Corrie: See how hungry they are. Probably $40,000 at least put it in there.
De Weerd: $45,000.
Bird: Probably yes.
Nary: Yes, because you're going to have some design costs too aren't you?
Bird: Definitely yes.
Corrie: I can design it for nothing.
Nary: You get what you pay for.
De Weerd: What Will and I were thinking was that we could use at least some of
the same information that we have from the Pine Street. They will have to go out
and do the surveying and that sort of thing.
Bird: And you'll still have to have drawn up plans.
De Weerd: But let's just do $45,000 it doesn't mean we have to spend it.
Nary: And if it costs a lot more than that we may have to wait a little bit or-
Bird: We might have to come back and revisit it.
De Weerd: Or we can take it to Council and you can figure it out then. Okay so
$45,000.
Cunningham: Also we were talking about the flat increase versus the merit then
we brought up another point. If you actually do the increase say October 1 st then
all the employees are going to see a raise. Then we do the benefit change
January 1 st then they're going to see a decrease. You may want to look at
making the raises effective in January.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 83 of 108
McCandless: Yes I agree with that.
Corrie: It makes sense. It won't affect anybody up here.
De Weerd: Yes, you'll get less. If you get insurance you'll get less out of your
paycheck.
Corrie: Well I'm going to go to PPO so it won't make any difference.
Cunningham: Even the PPO there will be a change.
Corrie: What?
Cunningham: The employee contribution will change for everybody.
Nary: Well that makes sense.
Kilchenmann: I'm not - we're lost a little bit on what we're doing. Have we not
decided what we're doing with the compensation? We're sort of lost on what's
happening with the compensation. Are you still in the process of deciding that?
Corrie: Not really we're just there. We just wanted to bring to Council where
they want to put it if they have the same amount in the compensation and what
we're doing it will stay there. We have that two percent - I'm sorry the only thing
we didn't include was the long-term care. We didn't need to.
Kilchenmann: So the decision has been made to do a flat two percent start
January 1 st? Is that-
Bird: Weill don't know whether we -
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I would like - I know we've kind of talked at two and three. I would
like to see two and a half and effective in January.
Corrie: Would that make a difference?
De Weerd: There benefits are not affected until January and they may see just a
little slight increase.
Corrie: The only effect in the insurance will be the long-term short term and it
starts in August. That's okay that's the reason for the cost of savings too.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 84 of 108
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Our fiscal year starts October 1 st and I know it will be a little bit for payroll to
move back around. They will see an increase and they will see a decrease in
their take home but I think that that can be explained pretty easily. I just assume
we start the pay raises October 1st like we always have and I'm like
Councilwoman de Weerd I think the two and a half percent I think if we can give
two we can give two and a half percent hopefully and see what the bottom line
left over is. That way we do give them a tad little bit of an increase.
Corrie: If I'm not mistaken Tammy said two and a half starting in January and you
say two and a half starting in October.
Bird: In October yes.
Corrie: How much difference is that going to make if we do it in October or if we
do it in January.
Cunningham: I don't know I have them calculated by partial year. For a full year,
you're going to need for two and a half I think about another $31,000.
Bird: Yes and that's - is that going to take too much out of the bottom guys?
Corrie: It's going to take out a -
Nary: It's going to take out a big chunk.
Bird: Whether you start in January or whether you start in October you're going
to be - you're affecting a full - you're not going to affect that fiscal year. You're
going to be three months short on that but you're going to add three months to
the next fiscal year unless you just go for nine months.
Kilchenmann: So you're at $289 with the 2.5 in October.
Nary: Well and this will go to an employees base so it won't - in the next fiscal
year it will roll over anyway so it's not going to impact differently. They're not
going to lose it but October will roll forward.
Bird: You're not going to lose it but it's going to be there. Actually, can you get
that back up there again?
Cunningham: Yes the $289.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 85 of 108
Bird: You're $289,171 still and that's still got the $50,000 and it's got the $45,000
for the parking lot right?
Nary: That's for two and a half starting January or two and a half staring
October?
Kilchenmann: October.
Cunningham: You can do it either way but it funds it for as of October.
Bird: I don't know I just think that if we start screwing around with our fiscal year
with these people and you're expecting or at least you know.
Corrie: You're going to have to explain to them what we're doing though
because come January it's going to change.
Bird: And as I understand, they're pretty well up on board with the benefits. Am I
not right from what Will and you guys are telling me?
Kilchenmann: That's correct I think the Benefits Committee has really worked at
communicating to all employees and Pauline's done surveys to individual
employees. I think the education process is going on and the communication is
there.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess I would be in favor of the October change only because it will give
the employees the opportunities to budget themselves to figure out what they
need come January. It's not a significant increase for three months but it will give
them that cushion to whether or not they need to readjust their financial situation
and their dollars. It's just three months and since the bottom line isn't going to
change a huge number, I think that's fine.
Bird: And you've also got a Christmas coming through there.
Nary: Right. Like you said, they have to readjust a lot financially to figure out
how to make it work the best for their needs. Three months isn't going to kill us.
Corrie: We're going to see a loss and that's what they'll remember.
Nary: I don't think we're going to get a lot of thanks for doing a great job card
either way.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 86 of 108
Kilchenmann: I actually think that they will appreciate it because there has been
talk of having no increase at all. I think that two and a half percent starting in
October will be appreciated. I appreciate it.
Corrie: I hope they would.
Nary: One other thing we haven't talked about on whether or not there is some
money needed. I read some article in the paper the other day about this mill levy
election.
De Weerd: Yes I read that too.
Nary: Somebody wrote some article about that. I don't know if - we haven't
certainly made any decision about that but I don't know whether or not we need
to increase - we shouldn't increase election costs. My assumption would be if
we were going to do that since we would be running an ejection anyway. I just
wanted to make sure if there was any necessity for increased money to advertise
and promote that if that's what the decision is to do.
De Weerd: We can't advertise and promote on the city dollar anyway.
Nary: That's true you're right.
Bird: It has to come from private.
Nary: But to inform you can advertise and inform. You can't promote it. You can
certainly inform people as to what you're doing. I don't know whether or not you
need some money at least budgeted or a line item for that. Again, we'll know
within the next couple of months if we're going to need it. I just wouldn't want to
end up getting to September and we make that decision, we decide to do it and
then we don't have any way to promote it well we're pretty much shooting
ourselves in the foot to do it if we do it that way.
Kilchenmann: We did put an extra $1,000 in the election line item on Will's
advice.
Berg: And Mr. Mayor Members of the Council that's because it's going to cost us
more for the punch card and for the Ada County to count ballots.
Corrie: We are going to that though.
Berg: That was your instructions that I need to do that. They can't tel] me
exactly all the costs yet but it is a lot more expensive for the punch cards then
they have to program their computers and use their machines. There is more of
a cost. I'm just hoping to try to keep it down like you know what we've done in
the past in trying to keep our costs down as much as we can. Obviously if you
Meridian City Council Special budget WorkshOp
July 18, 2003
Pg. 87 of 108
have another election you have to do other separate notices. It shouldn't impact
as far as the staffing and that type of thing the polling places.
Nary: Well for informational stuff I don't know that we need a lot of money in a
line item for that or whether or not we have something in the Councilor the
Mayor's budget for that type of public noticing. I don't think we need more than
$1,000.
Corrie: I think we've got enough.
Nary: That may already be absorbable into the budget as it is. I just like I said if
we decide to do something we certainly aren't going to bother doing it if we don't
have any money to at least give people notices to what it means. If it can be
absorbed in what we've got that's fine.
Berg: I'll make it work.
Corrie: I think he can.
Nary: How much of that $289,000 do we want to set aside for this reserve of
dealing with employee merit, employee compensation, employee-
Bird: Merit deal? I think we need to set a pretty good chunk aside myself
truthfully.
Nary: I do too.
De Weerd: Do you want to throw another amount at it?
Bird: Yes.
Nary: I think $200,000-
Bird: I would go with $200,000.
Corrie: That would be less than (inaudible) look at that bottom line there and say
you've got money we want it. I've been through the negotiations last year and I
know what they're going to say. I'm not trying to tell you how to do your job but
it's going to come out that way.
Nary: Either two or $250,000.
Bird: I would have no-
Corrie: I agree I think so too.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 88 of 108
Bird: I would have no problem with $250,000.
Corrie: Because we're still in the plus. It makes your place any stronger than
your negotiating team. If they see a lot of money in there they're going to go
after it.
Nary: And if we put it in that for employee compensation we're talking about all
employees not just anyone particular group of employees but all employees. I
don't have a problem in putting $250,000 and we're still in the plus.
Bird: Reta put $ 250,000 in employee benefits. T hat could mean part of that
picnic.
Nary: Employee incentives.
Bird: I ncentives whatever you want to call it. Merit and incentives maybe.
Corrie: One thing I was going to ask too is do you not - what about the
Christmas dinner compared to the summer picnic. Do you want to use it next
year, this year or not have a Christmas and have a summer next year? If we
have a summer this year, we have to think of it pretty quick.
Nary: Yes I don't think we have time for a summer this year but I guess what I
would suggest is that we not have a Christmas party this year. I still think the
turkeys are something we should do. I think that's a nice tradition that people
like. I don't recall what the cost of that is or whether that's already built in.
Corrie: It's already in there.
Nary: That's already built in. The turkeys and whether or not we want to
transition to a summer activity to whether or not to provide a very small amount
to the departments to be able to help offset a little of their employee costs for a
potluck, lunch or a dinner or something like that.
Bird: We can buy a ham or something for that.
Nary: Yes $100 for each department so they have something to purchase food
for their people with. Then again some m ore of a transition to next summer.
That's just a thought.
Corrie: That's good. We need to set how much the limit is and then they can go
from my office and tell them what they want to do. It's up to them and the
Council will give them $100 or $150.
Bird: Each one of them is doing their little Christmas parties anyway and I think
that we've kind of outgrown our Christmas party myself personally. I would like
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 89 of 108
to try the picnics for a couple of years. I'm like Bill I think we don't have to be a
die in the wool every year deal.
Nary: Try it for a couple and see how it works.
Bird: We can try it for a couple of years and see how it goes. If it's successful
we can do it a couple of more years or if we want to move back have a Christmas
party once every five years or every 10 years something like that they can do
that.
Corrie: We don't have a regular place to have it (inaudible).
Nary: Would that be then a - what do you think on the idea of having something
for each of the departments to be able to use $100 or something like that?
Bird: Well isn't this something we can do in this $250,000?
Nary: Sure.
Bird: This can be employee benefit.
Nary: We could also again, we could -
Bird: Or we could fine it in our own thing.
Nary: Right we could basically create a line item for the Mayor's Office or the
Council for that holiday incentive whatever.
Bird: But we (inaudible) each throw in $1,000 for us for our liaisons. There's
nothing wrong with $100 of that going back in we never use it.
Nary: Right. Maybe we don't need a separate item for that it's just something we
need to-
Corrie: Talk about.
Nary: Yes. I just want to make sure the departments know that we want-
Corrie: As long as you know about it that's what I'm concerned about. I don't
want no surprises of somebody from Council doesn't know about it. The Mayor
said go ahead and vote (inaudible).
Nary: Well $100 goes for other (inaudible). Mr. Mayor Will just brought up a
good point. Some of the departments are quite a bit larger so $100 for his
department goes a lot further than $100 for the police. If we did have a -
whether it's a line item or something else that we did so that the department if
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 90 of 108
they want to use it all they have to do is come and ask. Say we would like to do
this could you folks fund this much and we'll do this much something like that. I
don't know if we need a line for it or not.
Bird: (Inaudible) $1000 or so to help them with their little potlucks.
De Weerd: To pay for meat or whatever.
Bird: Then we'll transition next year into a picnic.
De Weerd: Yes, you're a two-person department you can ask quite the balance.
Corrie: The guys are sharper than I am. That $100 goes a long way in that
department.
Nary: So that other $39,OOO?
Bird: That's just extra.
Nary: Just set that aside for right now.
De Weerd: Well who knows what interest is going to do. It's bottoming out. We
already are experiencing a shortfall this year. We were conservative in our
revenue estimates then so it - and I think we even went into it with a little bit of a
buffer.
Bird: We did.
De Weerd: I think it's more than appropriate to have that for that shortfall.
Nary: Well and the other thing too is we talked about them we didn't really
readdress is the potential cost of civil litigation issues like with the taxing on the
police station. We may need it even for those unanticipated costs. It's probably
good to just-
Bird: It's nice to have a little buffer there.
Berg: Well and (inaudible)
De Weerd: Can we have it in something - revenue shortfall.
Nary: We could just have it as a reserve account.
Bird: I'll tell you what, Tammy you just hit a point $39,000 isn't nothing to lose in
revenue.
Meridian City Council Specialb"dget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 91 of 108
Nary: Exactly.
Bird: All it takes is one bad month in the sales tax, we don't get our share, and
then we've lost it. Do you know what I mean?
Corrie: The Board of (inaudible) takes it away.
Bird: So you're 100 percent right there. I'll tell you I don't know if you guys - you
could go out and buy something that extra one percent adds up.
Nary: Do we allocate that $39,000 to some line so-
Corrie: That it comes out at zero.
Nary: -- so that it comes out at zero.
Corrie: It might not be a bad idea.
Cunningham: Yes we just - what we can do on the $39,000 - what we've done
inthe past is we just show that as a contribution to the capital improvement fund.
Corrie: Okay or you can put in the Mayor's Office anyway.
Nary: Can we transfer it back if we needed it then?
Cunningham: Yes.
Corrie: Yes we can do that.
Nary: That's fine. That makes sense.
Bird: Weill have no problem taking this before the public.
Corrie: Well if we can come out this good it's going to be a little difficult to get an
improvement.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I just want to express my appreciation to you and the Department
Heads. I know they came forward very conservatively this year and to the
Accounting Department, a lot of time and effort was put into really tightening the
belts. I think this was a good reflection of that. We need to keep in mind of
commitments that we've made for future progress. We really need to get a fourth
station on the south side of the freeway and if we don't start setting money aside,
Meridian City Council Specialb"dget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 92 of 108
we're going to be in the same situation. Also, the last couple of fire engines that
we have bought have .been taken out of the fire fund and nothing has been put in
for that same period of time. As we look at Station 4, we're going to be looking at
a possible shortfall even in our fire truck fund that we won't have anything in. We
may have $39,000 left over this year but it certainly isn't a true indicator of what
we're going to be facing in the future years. I do appreciate the ease that Mayor
you and the Department Heads and the accounting staff have provided us this
year in making it as a more seamless process but we will have challenges in the
years to come.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Yes I think so. Mr. Bird.
Bird: I echo those words and I think that this has been - this is my sixth budget
year. This has been the easiest one to get through. I think it's been very plain
and I think it's because just what Councilwoman de Weerd just said that through
your help and the Department Heads being conservative which we knew we had
to be makes a big difference. I certainly appreciate it. I am very happy that our
Department Heads bought in with you and through your leadership that we got
this thing taken care of. There was nothing here that was way out of bounds like
I've had in the past. There was nothing asked for that couldn't have been used
let's put it that way even though we had to cut some stuff. Nothing was
outrageous that we asked for. I think that's a very good tell of how you managed
to run it with the Department Heads.
Corrie: I want to say thank you. I really want to really give the credit mostly to
the Department Heads because they really sat down and they went down to cut
as much as they could I think. They did a good job there. I think we have two
girls sitting over there that's really helped us. I remember like Keith we sat up
here, we cut and sliced, and then we ended up with a figure. All of a sudden
somebody comes up oh I remember this. I really appreciate the comments from
the Council. We do have a lot to thank to the Finance Department too they really
helped us out an awful lot. A lot of the work was done ahead of time and they
got it done f or us. I do echo the f act that t he Department Heads have been
really, really good on this this year. I think every year it's going to be maybe a
little easier. I agree with Councilwoman de Weerd that we will have to look at
that new fire station and things like that. We have one entity that has more
money. We may be - we have some too but get those two together that's the
thing we have to work out.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
i
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18. 2003
Pg. 93 of 108
Nary: Great comments and I'm not going to add anything more other than I know
at some point when we discussed the fire station off the freeway at some point
we're going to also have to decide on whether or not a truck company is
necessary for our community. Those trucks cost a lot more than the engines we
buy. That's another very large expense that we may have to look at some time in
the future.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Getting on that truck fund expanding on it. I believe this truck thing has
been probably a 15, 20-year project that we started that you guys started years
ago even before your time Mayor. I think it's something that we can't live - if we
can just you know put in 40 or $50,000 a year it all adds up and we've always
had that money there to buy our truck fund so we haven't had to take out or buy
our trucks and stuff. If we loose it, it's just so hard to get back and gain it again.
These guys had a foresight to see ahead and do this. I just don't want to be part
of the people that lose it. Hopefully, if our economy turns around and stuff
maybe we'll have enough that we can throw a little bit of money back into it next
year or even this fiscal year if we come up ahead. It's something that we can't
lose that's my personal opinion.
Corrie: Very true, very true.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess with the employee incentive merit pool that we put money
into we're asking Stacy, you're office and the Department Heads or HR to come
up with some formulas or some recommendations for us. What kind of
timeframe are we looking at? Are we looking at something in January that that's
when it would be implemented so at least the employees kind of know what our
timeframe is on further compensation or at least merit type of programs. Also, [
know this has no budget impact but we do need to have further discussion on in
town mills and flowers. I think that that was kind of - it's now been budgeted for
now we just need to make sure that we have clear guidelines on how those
things happen. I would assume that our volunteer appreciation is going to be
partnered in with any citywide function as well so we don't need - I would have
preferred a specific line item for that just to let them know there is appreciation
there for volunteers and there is something there to go to, to thank them.
However, the Department Heads and the Mayor's Office come back with a
recommendation is fine. As long as that's part of that consideration.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 94 of 108
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Are we done with the general fund for the moment?
Kilchenmann: I believe we are and ready to move onto the next fund.
Nary: It's 12:30 do we want to just work through it? Do we want to eat
something I don't care?
De Weerd: Oh yes we have the enterprise fund.
Nary: And then special services. We're not done.
De Weerd: Why don't we take a break or maybe just have pizza delivered and
we can work through it.
Kilchenmann: If we could do that Reta actually has a trip planned for this
afternoon. If we could work through it it would be great.
Nary: That's fine.
Bird: That's fine with me I want to get out of here.
Kilchenmann: I think the next two funds will be easier.
Corrie: Okay Will if you want to order some pizza for us.
Berg: Sure can.
De Weerd: Pizza and beer.
Nary: No, I don't think we'll have any beer since Mr. Brundt is here.
Kilchenmann: If he wasn't here.
De Weerd: We have no alcohol in city hall. I was just kidding. You guys take
everything so serious.
Corrie: If you want to do that Will if you want to take a two-minute break. Two
minutes turns into five.
(Return at 12:49 P.M.)
Kilchenmann: Is everybody ready for enterprise fund?
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 95 of 108
Corrie: Shoot.
Kilchenmann: We added their 2.5 percent and their merit / incentive. We need
to take that counter off of there too.
De Weerd: We probably need to have the discussion on the building contractor
too the Building Inspector.
Nary: Right. Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Is this the section that we would be also looking at that Fire Inspector too?
Kilchenmann: No that will be the last one. Special -- Planning and Zoning.
Nary: Planning and Zoning thanks.
De Weerd: I got ahead of myself. We'll start with Public Works.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: At least for me I don't really see anything in this particular list that gives
me any real pause any that I'm personally am always a little concerned when it
says miscellaneous office. It's really pretty vague but I don't see it as a frivolous
item I just always prefer a little more detail when you budget money. Other than
that, I don't really have a concern about what they're asking for or whether there
is a necessity for those things.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I agree with Councilman Nary. I hate anything that says miscellaneous.
Kilchenmann: Let's look a little bit and see what it is.
Bird: What?
Kilchenmann: I'll look and see -
De Weerd: It's in the description.
Meridian City Council Special hudget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 96 of 108
Kilchenmann: One part of it is pretty miscellaneous it says furniture,
bookshelves, plan racks, file cabinets, and tables. Then the capital outlay part is
four pick up shelves.
Nary: That was to secure the water equipment and stuff.
Bird: That's right.
Corrie: What did they have down there? I noticed -
De Weerd: And I wasn't really sure why bookshelves, plan racks, file cabinets,
and tables were all considered capital because they're all under $1 ,000.
Kilchenmann: Those are in operating we don't have them in capital.
De Weerd: Oh okay.
Corrie: What did we say the miscellaneous expense was $1500 the last there
the second page?
Nary: On the base?
Corrie: Yes. What did they use that for before? It's gone down $600 but-
Cunningham: Oh you're talking about their miscellaneous in their budget base?
Corrie: Yes.
Cunningham: That is for like the Christmas party, the turkeys, or flowers.
Corrie: That's w hat I was thinking that we a [ready have a I at 0 f that i n there
already in the base. Whatever the Council wants to do with them, they can do it?
Cunningham: Yes.
Corrie: All right.
Nary: In looking at the base as weill mean there's a couple of ones that again I
guess it's - the experience level hasn't been there but I understand that there are
even ones here like vehicle repair. They have $3,000 their experience level is
significantly less than that but they have lowered it I guess to address that. I
know we use a formula for that number.
Kilchenmann: Actually t hat vehicle repair was a 0 ne-time item that t hey were
going to get a major repair down. I asked them what because it was - what was
it they were going to - oh okay she said she took it out.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 97 of 108
Cunningham: Do you.see how I've got a minus $2500?
Nary: And again, it's the same question on the travel meeting seminars training.
I think we do need to have that. Their experience hasn't been anywhere near
that. They've got $6500 in seminars and training and two years ago, it was only
$4,000. That's a fairly large number gap on those two things but I don't know if
we want to adjust those or not.
McCandless: What about dues, scriptions, and memberships at $25,000 good
grief.
De Weerd: Well that has COMPASS-
Corrie: Professional engineering and stuff like that.
De Weerd: And it has COMPASS in that.
McCandless: It has COMPASS.
Nary: COMPASS is part of that yes.
Corrie: Well I don't see anything myself.
Kilchenmann: The next one would be MUBS. If you remember the front counter
remodel, they had put the extra money in. Now that we've made some changes
we would like to see if we could get that done this year. I think we need to get
the person up at the front and the locking cash drawers. We're going to see if we
can get it done with the remaining, money left over that we have. This year I
think we had $7,000 left and take this out. I'm not-
***End Of Side Five***
Kilchenmann: -- can get it done for $7,000.
Bird: Well sure try.
Kilchenmann: We'll try.
Corrie: Give it a go.
Kilchenmann: We'll give it the old college try.
Corrie: Okay that's good. We need to get that taken care of and done.
Bird: We need to get that done.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg.980f108
Kilchenmann: We need to get that done right away yes.
Corrie: Yes I agree with Mr. Bird on that.
De Weerd: Just remember that with that remodel I think Will is our building
person that he's included in the planning part of it. Aren't you our building guy?
Kilchenmann: We already have a plan. We already paid for the plan.
Corrie: Yes that kind of got me but okay. I can draw the plans a lot easier.
Bird: Yes Steve Trout has already got the plan started.
Corrie: Okay we're set there then. Any other questions.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Yes I guess the only question I had in the base budget is the write offs. Is
budgeting the write offs so we're increasing it 150 percent. I guess I wasn't clear
why we need to do that.
De Weerd: Yes.
Kilchenmann: Well what we decided to do - normally what you do is each year
you expense a uniform amount to a balance sheet account for uncollected
amounts. Then when you actually expense them you do it to the balance sheet
amount but they have never done that in the past. It's like we would build up the
balance sheet account for uncollected accounts and write off against that. If we
get to the point where the write offs slow down then we wouldn't have to keep
expensing it. This would be one percent of our accounts receivable which is a
pretty low amount to expense every year.
Nary: I certainly can't see anything up there 0 n the board to eliminate really.
Basically, a half time service coordinator for a full time position and one other
person doesn't appear to me to be frivolous.
De Weerd: And that's to get 24 hour coverage I think is what's -
Nary: Exactly. That capital outlay of existing wells would that go from a different
account or is that - since that is a capital expense is that different?
Kilchenmann: No, actually when we get to the summary - enterprise summary
they will be going into their fund balance.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 99 of 108
Nary: I see.
Corrie: One thing that we were - I guess water is involved here. We were
talking about in staff and also to the Water Departmentthe possibility of the city
and this is something the Council is going to have to talk about later. The city
takes over that backflow device checking. I get a lot of calls that people don't
mind putting in the backflow device on their house but they hate to pay that $33
or more every year to get it tested. In just a bugaboo on them and I'm going to
ask the Council to possibly look at thinking about a dollar or 70 cents on the
water bill everybody and then we take it over and do the inspecting. If something
goes wrong we fix it and then that way the people are not so -
Kilchenmann: Irritated.
Corrie: -- irritated that somebody has to do it and others don't have to do it. That
way everybody does it. It's right on their bill and they don't' see it again after it's
done. I'm going to bring that to the Council's attention here. Garden City does
that, some of the others do, and it's working very nicely. I've talked to some
people about it and they said yes I'll do that and I don't have to worry about it
after it's on there. They'll be happy and I would. They put mine up crooked and
they wanted to do it again and they said yes it's $700 more. I was very Christian
about it but it's still crooked by the way. I just assume Council will know I'm
going to bring that to them and have them look at it too. That's just something I'd
inhere.
De Weerd: I think with the requirement to have irrigation water and not use city
water the majority or we're starting to have more residents who don't have
backflow devices to check.
Corrie: But you still have those like me that don't have use of irrigation water and
they use the city water to irrigate their lawns then they have to have it.
Bird: Me too.
Corrie: It's mandatory and those that don't have that and some of the older
sections don't have it then that's the one gripe they have. If they've got a new
subdivision, they have it all medically taken care of them for them so they don't
hear from them. I'm sorry to take up your time on that I'm waiting for lunch.
De Weerd: Okay weill don't see anything in water.
Bird: I don't see anything in water.
Corrie: They are pretty good there yes.
Meridian City Council Speclalb"dget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg, 100 of 108
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Yes Mr. Nary.
Nary: I did notice in the water that there's another contract labor one that's
$20,000 and their actual in '02 was $7800 and their actual this year is zero. I
guess I was a little curious as to what kind of contract labor do they use that they
need to fund such a large amount in that particular line item. It just seemed like a
pretty big disparity.
Cunningham: It is when they have to go out and repair lines out in the street
connections. That's what they've had that in there for. You're right so far this
year it has zero.
Nary: That would probably be a winner expense. Okay well that's fine that
makes sense.
De Weerd: And the thing is in this if they don't spend it, it just stays in the
enterprise fund.
Nary: Right exactly.
De Weerd: Now in Wastewater Treatment they did add an enhancement Reta
do you have that?
Cunningham: We do we added it on.
De Weerd: Okay.
Nary: Where did Number 8 go? Why is there a 7 then 9?
Kilchenmann: When you looked at Public Works they had the warranty TV
inspections. Brad presented it in Public Works but he actually asked for it in - he
presented it in Wastewater but he actually asked for it in Public Works. There it
is.
Corrie: Was this one that we were adding to the 1.2 -
Kilchenmann: Yes that North Slough Sewer Trunk.
Corrie: Okay thank you.
Nary: Well Mr. Mayor this is another one I don't - as usual I think with Public
Works I think they've really identified really where the needs are and how to
accomplish them. I don't really see really any type of excess here. I think it's
always the issue of can you get it all done. They certainly have done an
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18. 2003
Pg. 101 of 108
admirably job every year but I don't see you know the two biggest items there are
the Black Cat Trunk S.ewer and Lift Station and the North Slough Sewer Trunk. I
think we pretty much decided we need them. We're going to need those.
Bird: We have to have them.
Nary: We have to have them so I think we really need to proceed on them.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I agree with that. I feel in some of our budget discussions over the
last four years they've had projects there that they thought they would get to but
never did. You see this list is more realistic and I appreciate that. I think they
really have been starting to really not bite off more than they can chew and
included in their budget. This is a nice change.
Kilchenmann: If you look not now but in the capital improvement, request or the
CIP Plans that are in the budget book I compared their capital improvement plan
with what they've actually done side-by-side so you can kind of see that.
De Weerd: Yes that is nice.
Kilchenmann: That's what they look like in total. They will go I think 9.9 million
dollars into the fund balance. I think some of these projects will be long term
they certainly won't be completed next year.
Bird: You won't see it this year. Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Getting back to the impractical. I think experience has helped t hem as
much as anything on these projects because we went in blind. We never - the
White Sewer Trunk was the first sewer I think we ever put in. There is this crew
here that we've got now and I think they've learned a lot. I think that shows a lot
of - it's like Stacy said we might be nine million into the fund balance but I will tell
you there's a lot of that project that isn't going to be done in one fiscal year it's
not possible to do in one fiscal year. I don't have the slightest idea what that lift
station for the Black Cat takes but I know you don't go build that in one month.
It's probably a six to eight month design a lone. I think they've got an aggressive
deal here and I think it's stuff that we really do need if we're going to have a
controlled development we're going to have to have these sewer lines in place
and we control them.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 102 of 108
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: The other thing I guess too is the positive is that this is really going to
address I don't know all but certainly a large portion of the city north of the
freeway the north area and the area around the Ten Mile area. I assume at
some point in the future we're going to see requests for things dealing with the
south side of the freeway but this is really going to address the north side needs
as much as we can and that's great.
Corrie: That's a definite.
De Weerd: We all and really prepare an interchange.
Bird: You're right Tammy.
Corrie: Just hope the federal government doesn't throw us a backlash on our
stink of it.
Bird: That scares me again.
Corrie: That's scary. That's scary but that's not here now. Any other questions
or discussion?
Bird: I don't.
Nary: Would this be the area of the fire inspector issue?
Corrie: Yes I think so.
Cunningham: Yes. I actually already put that up in the budget base.
Corrie: That's what I was thinking you did yes.
Cunningham: So I increased the budget base for the Building Department
$20,000 for the fire inspector and $153,500 for the streetlights power and
maintenance. That still leaves and then we have in there I just put in the merit
increase and it still leaves in the $332,000 that will go back to the capital
improvement fund.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: So Reta is that employee merit amount this is based on the number of
employees in relation to the other 250 is that what it was?
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 103 of 108
Cunningham: Yes..
Nary: I guess I'll start off on this building official inspector. I don't - I think it is
time. I really do think that it has been an admirable job by Mr. Whitman. I think
we've heard lots of lots of positive things as to how that's been accomplished. It
is a financial a fiscal difference that has really got to the point that I think it makes
more sense to have a person that's accountable and works for the city in doing
that. I don't know whether or not that's going to grow. I don't know how that's
going to be impacted but I think the numbers are just supportive of the idea of
bringing it as an in house position.
Bird: I'm with you 100 percent Bill. I can see pros and cons both ways. If we're
slow we're carrying an official but what the heck there's plenty of work they can
be doing and getting ready for when we do get busy again. We've got it in place
over t here. I feel that it's time that we need to definitely dot hat. I think 0 ur
survey showed that too. That's probably the biggest and I think we might as well
bite the bullet and go do it.
De Weerd: Well it looks like there's a tremendous savings too.
Bird: Yes Tammy.
Nary: That's $100,000.
Corrie: I've been around a long time I'm glad to hear you talk that way believe
me. (Inaudible) four wasn't there.
Nary: She already put the fire inspection in the base and the streetlights in the
base.
De Weerd: Now we're adding one building inspector. We have two that kind of-
that work out of there right now. We still will need money under contracted -
Nary: That's two.
Kilchenmann: There are two.
Nary: A building official and then one inspector. It's two people. Further, on the
column it's two.
De Weerd: I can't see.
Bird: You'll have one that's in charge and one that's-
De Weerd: I hate to admit that.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 18. 2003
Pg. 104 of 108
Kilchenmann: There just is 0 ne thing that we've kind 0 f been talking toG ary
about with the building inspectors. We're switching from contract to employees
for these two but we still have the plumbing the other mechanical and electrical.
We just have to be really careful that we make a clear distinction between how
we treat the employees versus how we treat these other contractors so that we
don't come back with IRS issues that the others are employees, we should be
paying their benefits, and they should have vacation and retirement and so forth.
That's something we really we've talked a lot about we'll have to be careful with
hat. He eventually does want to switch all of them to employees he just didn't
want to take on five employees at once.
Bird: Weill think the plan in the long run is to probably switch.
De Weerd: Over time.
Bird: But we have a contract with them and the Mayor signs a yearly contract for
those sub-contractors. They're sub-contracted we have nothing to do with their
IRS or benefits.
Kilchenmann: Actually the city - because the city did go through a big-
Corrie: I RS deal.
Kilchenmann: -- yes and I know that happened to us at the Department of
Correction and we lost.
Corrie: Yes we have to be careful.
Nary: Defining the duties that they perform and how they perform it will depend
on whether (inaudible).
Kilchenmann: Reta just said it was $187,000-
Bird: If we control where we're sending that stuff t hen they are basically like
employees. We had the same thing because we had contracted glaciers that
worked for Atkinson's. We had the same thing if we controlled where they went
then we had to take care of them.
Corrie: IRS (inaudible) different.
Nary: I didn't see anything in the base budgets that were. There are some
services, contracted labor and legal services but I think those are pretty decent
numbers. Some of those things are really hard to estimate up front.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 105 of 108
De Weerd: Yes and in particular with P&Z we want to - still with the new director
coming in. She is trying to focus on some training. Give her a year and then be
critical.
Bird: I don't think you will have to be.
Corrie: Are we going to put that fire inspector (inaudible)? I need glasses too.
De Weerd: Okay.
Kilchenmann: We're done?
Corrie: We have to put the figure in for street lighting.
Cunningham: Actually I have it up in the budget base. It's not like new money
and that's just enough to me.
Corrie: Okay.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: The only note I had left that we hadn't talked about or we were going to
come back to is the Council President pay. I don't care if we want to take that up
at another time but that was the only note I had left that we said we would wait
and see where else we were and everything else.
Bird: I just assume take it up another time.
Nary: That's fine. I think we want to make clear on the record too that that
money that's budgeted and set aside right now for employee merit and incentive
is for the Council's administration of that so it's clear on the record that was what
we intended. Other than that, I think that was it. Those are all the notes I had
anyway. Mr. Mayor I know that this isn't part of our meeting but obviously, we've
got this little addendum from ACHD. Do we want to put that on our Pre-Council
Agenda to talk about how we did that? Maybe invite Mr. Lyttle to come to our
Pre-Council Meeting.
Bird: On the right of way.
Nary: Yes.
Bird: Terry doesn't have anything -
Nary: Okay.
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18.2003
Pg. 106 of 108
Bird: Gary will be here. Gary Smith from our - I think Gary approved all of these
didn't he?
Kilchenmann: He actually - we paid the first one and then Gary got involved and
said he didn't think we should be paying some of those. That's why Number 4 is
unpaid. Now he approves them so the last two on the bottom ort the ones that
were paid in July, Gary approved paying those then he's holding one then the
$,179,000 we haven't paid. If we don't agree with the first two we paid, we're
going to take money out of the $179,000.
Bird: Well I think Gary and the Mayor need to both approve these.
Kilchenmann: Gary is really up on these.
Bird: Yes but I also think the Mayor ought to be involved in this too. He knows
what the agreement was made and it looks to me they got us in places that we
didn't' agree to help.
Nary: We would at least like to talk about it next Tuesday you think.
Bird: I would like to Bill.
Nary: then make sure maybe Gary knows to be here.
Corrie: Pre-Council.
Nary: Pre-Council I think.
Corrie: Yes on the 22nd Pre-Council to talk about ACHD right of way.
(Inaudible discussion amongst Council Members)
Corrie: Start at 6:00 and have Gary first. I would like to discuss this.
Nary: Yes this ACHD right of way Agreement.
Corrie: (inaudible).
De Weerd: Yes. I guess so. I didn't.
Corrie: I didn't see it.
Cunningham: Excuse me Mayor and Council. I just wanted to bring to your
attention. I was just looking at the general fund and I had added in the extra
Meridian City Council Special 8udget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 107 of 108
needed for the extra half a percent the $31,000. I hadn't brought over the total
so now it changed your bottom number to only $7,668 left. Sorry.
Bird: That's okay.
Nary: It's still a plus.
Bird: Yes that's all we care.
Berg: So what was it $7,000.
Nary: That was the remainder.
Cunningham: Okay.
Kilchenmann: I have a question. When we do the Public Hearing how long
should I make it. How long should I -
Bird: As short as possible. I'm serious.
Corrie: There won't be probably a lot of people here but you never know.
Bird: There won't be a lot of people.
Corrie: Maybe one or two.
De Weerd: We probably won't even have Jonathan he's going to be gone.
Kilchenmann: Oh he's coming back for it.
Bird: Is he coming back for it?
Nary: When is that is it August?
Bird: Yes it's August 26th.
Nary: I guess you might be able to gauge between now and August if you here a
lot of feedback and response that may need longer. I would think 30 minutes
would be plenty. I don't think we'll even use that but I mean if you hear a lot of
response or Mr. Berg does or certainly the Mayor would hear the most then could
also adjust that.
Berg: Just for the scheduling of this Public Hearing on the 26th, we're going to
notice it in the paper the 18th and the 11 th and we'll need to approve the tentative
budget before the August 8th newspaper deadline. August 5th Regular City
Council Meeting we'll have a line item or an item on the agenda to approve the
Meridian City Council Special budget Workshop
July 18, 2003
Pg. 108 of 108
tentative budget. That way the Finance Department will have everything all put
together.
Bird: Can we do that on Consent Will?
Berg: It would probably be best just to have it as a line item. It's not going to
take much but a motion to approve the tentative budget. Then we'll just publish it
from there if that's okay with you and the timeframe.
Corrie: I think the attorney would ask us to bring it down anyways.
Bird: Yes they probably would.
Berg: That would make sure everything is double-checked and if anything needs
to be changed, we can discuss it too if that were the case on the 5th.
Corrie: Anything else?
De Weerd: Yes I move we adjourn.
Bird: Second.
Corrie: All i~ favor say aye. Meeting is adjourned
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 1:19 P.M.
(TAPE ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
APPROVED:
h~'.J
ROBERT D. CORRIE, MAYOR
g /Ir /&3
DATE
ATTESTED: d~p~
WILLIAM G. BERG, ,
August 15, 2003
MERIDIAN CITY COUNCIL MEETING
APPLICANT
August 19, 2003
ITEM NO.
3~A
REQUEST Approve minutes of July 17, 2003 City Council Budget Workshop:
AGENCY COMMENTS
CITY CLERK:
CITY ENGINEER:
CITY PLANNING DIRECTOR:
CITY ATTORNEY
CITY POLICE DEPT:
CITY FIRE DEPT:
CITY BUILDING DEPT:
CITY WATER DEPT:
CITY SEWER DEPT:
CITY PARKS DEPT:
MERIDIAN SCHOOL DISTRICT:
ADA COUNTY HIGHWAY DISTRICT:
SANITARY SERVICE COMPANY
CENTRAL DISTRICT HEALTH:
NAMPA MERIDIAN IRRIGATION:
SETTLERS IRRIGATION:
IDAHO POWER:
US WEST:
INTERMOUNTAIN GAS:
MERIDIAN POST OFFICE:
OTHER:
,,j./
-(j\J
{;Jllr
Contacted:
Emailed:
Date:
Staff Initials:
Phone:
Materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Meridian City Council Special Budqet Workshop
July 17.2003
The Special Budget Workshop of the Meridian City Council was called to order at
8:05 A.M. on July 17, 2003, by Mayor Robert Corrie.
Members Present: Robert Corrie, Cherie McCandless, Tammy de Weerd, Keith
Bird and Bill Nary.
Staff Present: Bill Musser, Stacy Kilchenmann, Bill Johnson, Kenny Bowers,
Barb Hohler and Will Berg.
Item 1.
Roll-call Attendance:
X Tammy de Weerd X
X Cherie McCandless X
X Mayor Robert Corrie
Bill Nary
Keith Bird
Corrie: I will open the City Council Special Budget Workshop on Thursday July
17,2003 at 8:05, City Council Chambers. Roll call vote Mr. Clerk.
Item 2.
Adoption of the Agenda:
Corrie: All right we have adoption of the agenda, which is the presentation and
discussion of the city proposed budget.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I move we adopt the agenda as published.
Nary: Second.
Corrie: Motion has been made and second to adopt the agenda as published.
Any further discussion. All those in favor say aye. Opposed no? All ayes.
Motion carried.
Item 3.
Presentation and Discussion of the City Proposed Budget:
Corrie: We are now officially in the proposed budget hearings. Stacy.
Kilchenmann: Mayor and Members of the Council. To start the hearings off I
want to briefly run through the revenue projections for FY 04. We have numbers
for June in so I'm going to update you on what the General Fund is looking like.
Then if there are questions we can talk about this again tomorrow morning. So
just briefly I'm not going to spend a lot of time on the Enterprise Fund. There's
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 2 of 90
two the basic components the Water and the Wastewater Treatment Plant. Plus
we also have public .review fees. As you know they changed the way, they
calculated water and wastewater rates last year and we discussed that last year.
Basically, if we look at the actual and projected utility revenue you can see it's
pretty much on a straight increase up and that's due to the increase in the
number of accounts and water has dropped below sewer, which was what Brad's
intention was. Assessment fees are basically the fees we use to build out line
and so forth and we charge a flat rate for that. The increase in those again is
due to the increase in the number of accounts because the actual rate charged
does not change. That's kind of a brief picture of enterprise fund revenue. We
just project that it will steadily increase. Latecomer's fees are a little hard to
predict so we predict them at a low flat rate. One thing that I did want to mention
with the enterprise revenue as I think its important that we start to pay a lot of
attention to the fee development and that we start to involve the Finance
Department a little more. Brad and I both worked on when he redid the fees last
time but I think it's important that we look at those every year basically because
they have a pretty aggressive capital construction that will take a lot of money.
As the city grows the faster, it grows some more of that, construction plan is
going to be impacted. I think we need to start paying attention to including the
cost of capital construction in our fee structure. We want to try to avoid
borrowing at all costs because borrowing has there is a cost just fees to do the
debt financing plus interest and so forth. That's something that we will probably
be talking about more in the coming year.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: Stacy on that I think you had mentioned something before about the
costs of borrowing and the interest. It doesn't quite look like the deal that it is, Is
there any way that you can put that on paper?
Kilchenmann: Yes in fact for the Police building it probably costs us over a
million dollars to finance it the way we did because we paid bond issuance costs.
Then we paid interest and plus we now are paying property tax because we don't
own the building. When I added it all up and I can put that on paper for you and
show you the components, it was a bout 1 .4 million additional costs to dot hat
type of financing. I think when you do the utility financing we wouldn't have to
pay property tax. It's just something if we can avoid I think we should try to
avoid. That I think will be an area that we haven't spent a lot of time on. There is
a capital construction plan in your notebooks for the enterprise fund and it
compares Public Works plan to what we've actually done so that's something
we'll probably be talking about a lot more in the upcoming year. On the special
services side just briefly its driven on permit revenue and that definitely is a bright
spot in our financial picture as you can see by looking at the growth in residential
permits 2003 actual continues to exceed the two prior years. Commercial
Meridian City Council SpecIal Budget Workshop
July 17. 2003
Page 3 of 90
building permits they are up. They are hard to project so we pretty much project
a low flat rate for them because they are all over the up and down and all over
the board. That's just a look at Building and Planning and Zoning revenue. Now
we get to the General Fund and this is a summary and it's also in your revenue
manual. It breaks down property tax revenue into the basic property tax, the
amount from new construction and annexation. Then it gives a projection of the
levy rate. We've talked about this quite a bit. If we look at this on a graph that's
what the different components look like. New construction has stayed pretty
consistent with the base gradually going up that three percent. The other basic
components of our general fund the biggest one is revenue sharing. This one
has been hard to project its usually done by AIC, they do the projections.
There's a possibility that it could - it actually has exceeded what they projected
for the current year. That spending didn't drop off like it was predicted to. We
are going to get to this other worksheet and I'll talk about that a little bit. It could
potentially be about 75,000 dollars less this coming year then AIC projected. The
other one, court revenue, has actually decreased. It could be about 15,000
dollars short of what we had predicted it would be for FY 2004. Another big area
are the utility franchise agreements, which are Idaho Power, Intermountain Gas,
Cable and Sanitary Services. This one has been really hard to predict because it
depends on rate changes it depends on the weather. Cable depends on the
competition and how their sales do. We try to call ahead and talk to them and
figure out what its going to be and it actually has dropped this year over the last
year for the past maybe three or four years it just showed a steady increase and
now this year its fallen off as rates have gone down, we had a mild winter. When
we get to the final sheet, I have revised the projections to downward to be even
more conservative then I had originally had it. We just have to hope that rates go
up and we have a really cold winter.
De Weerd: That's out of our pocket.
Kilchenmann: But you'll be glad that you are helping the city out. Then our other
bug-a-boo is interest income. This is kind of a summary of that you see in your
financial statements of where interest income has gone. One bright spot was this
in June the pool went u p quite a bit, it went up to like 3.73 percent so if that
continues that would be great. That would really help us. Apparently, there is
talk of them lowering interest rates again which would not be good. When we get
to this other sheet, I have revised interest income down slightly. This impacts the
enterprise fund too because they have a fairly high amount of interest income so
this is going to impact them as well as the general fund. This just kind of shows
the two sources of income property tax and non property tax revenue. Non
property tax revenue stays fairly stagnant, it doesn't really increase very much.
Now that's the chart that we look at that shows how much of our revenue that is
taken up by the base budget. Restrictive revenue that little red spot on the top
those are park impact fees. The yellow is the revenue that we have left for new
programs, new people. On the other sheet that I gave you its just like an excel
spreadsheet. It says FY 04 revenue analysis compared to actual June 30, 2003.
r..
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 4 of 90
I've taken the basic categories of general fund income and I look at this every
quarter and change tbe estimate depending on any indicators or actual and so
forth. I have highlighted on Rural Fire the budget for 2004 we actually, we were
able to increase it over what I had initially have when I first did the revenue
manual. Kenny has warned us that the percentage that rural fire is going to pay
is actually going to drop a percent to 25 percent versus 26 percent. The 895,000
is taking Kenny's actual base with his new firefighters in it and that would be 25
percent. Then interest has been revised downward again so I have it at 300,000
and then the franchise fees I revised downward. When I totaled it up to what I
had originally projected in the revenue manual and based on the latest figures
there is only a difference of four or five thousand dollars. It didn't change
significantly because we were able to increase the amount contributed from the
rural fire. As we go through our discussions and so forth today and you have a
chance maybe to look through these materials more, if there are any more
questions we can address those first thing tomorrow morning. I just wanted to
kind of give you a basic idea as you listen to the presentations what the revenue
picture looks like. Are there any questions right now?
Corrie: Don't have a question but I hope is not a business decision. I hope that
we have the money but sometimes its not there.
Kilchenmann: I've tried to be very conservative.
Corrie: You are thank you.
Kilchenmann: If things turn around we always have the opportunity to re-look at
this during the next fiscal year. Okay then, I will turn it over to the Police
Department.
POLICE DEPARTMENT
(Inaudible discussion)
Worley: Mayor and members of the Council. Thank you for the opportunity to
present the 2004 budget for the Meridian Police Department. Since Chief
Musser is going to have to live with this budget I'm going to let him present it.
Nary: Hey thanks for stopping by Mike.
Musser: Well good morning and thank you for inviting us. What we are going to
start off with today is just basically run through where we are at with our initial
enhancements that we put in and then of course into the Mayor's priorities and
then line out some strategies that we've developed in conjunction with the budget
proposal. First things that we are looking at doing is with gearing in where we
are at with the Police Department we are doing our budget so that we focus
towards our mission statement in particular our last items on there through our
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17. 2003
Page 5 of 90
education prevention and enforcement activates that are continually ongoing
within a department in order to meet our strategic plan and fall into compliance
with the cities strategic plan as well. Capital replacement to get that one out of
the way. We started with 136,000 dollars basically only to replace four marked
units at a total of 34,000 dollars a piece and that's all we have slated for this year
on it trying to hold the line a little bit but we do have four units that are due for
that area that's between 85,000 to 90,000 three of those are pushing the 90,000
or at least two of them have exceed it all ready at this point but they'll be well
within the confine by October one. Moving on to our enhancement requests. We
submitted a total of seven requests, which totaled up to 722,913 dollars. In
meeting with accounting Stacy and Reta and going over some of that, we were
able to delete some of the miscellaneous off as we were moving through and
looking at what we can potentially work on within this current budget year. We
were able to drop that down a little bit for the final submittal that went in for the
Mayor's review. As a result, with the Mayor's priorities on it, this is pretty much
what happened with what we were looking at and our first and second priorities
remained in tack bringing us down to a grand total of 367,388 dollars. Those first
two priorities has we move into of course are personnel ones that deal with six
police officers we are looking at three of those plus a car for a full year so they
would be coming in in October and then three again following in April at the half
year point within the fiscal year to provide us a little bit of savings and also to
allow us access to be able to get the officers up and trained through the year and
then out into the field. As we move into that for explanations on where we are at
with the first one we are looking at October of 03 for being able to implement this.
It would be three officers with one car, which is the standard we have been trying
to make the approach on when we are hiring. If we have three officers we do like
to request a car within that packet so that we are able to spread it out a little bit
more on the vehicle usages. Again the strategic planning issues that we are
addressing within this is again compliant with adequate staffing for our growing
city trying to impact crime rates and the traffic issues that we have and also this
is the third year that we have been requesting for additional patrol people in
particular on this and we feel very confident that we need it at this point and
that's why we had those listed as number one and two on our priorities and we
were very happy with the Mayor concurring with us on that on his priorities. The
second one we have here is a follow up. This is the half year one which we had
looked to implement in April of 04 so half way through the fiscal year which does
drop us down to an expenditure of 148,490 dollars and again three officers for
one car and again with the same strategic plan issues being addressed within
those confines. One thing that this will do for us in terms of patrol out on the
field, the six officers will augment each one of the squads and we have basically
two full teams a weekend team and a weekday team comprised of squads that
work each one of the shifts a day shift a swing shift and a graveyard shift. These
six officers would allow us to put one officer additional for each one of those
squads so everybody gets one officer on each one of those shifts to be able to
increase our overall coverage's in the town. Priority Number 3 was a school
resource officer for Mountain View High School. Initially we were looking at
Meridian City Council SpecIal Budget Workshop
July 17. 2003
Page 6 of 90
76,335 dollars on that. One of the items that we were looking at on that again is
manpower related to investigations, remaining proactive in our policing programs.
Our SRO program has been a very good proactive program, a very collative
program as well with the school district and as you all know we do have that new
large high school coming online out there at Millennium and South Locust Grove
area off of Overland. In meeting with the school district their also concerned they
are facing the same type of budget crunch as we are and they didn't feel that
they could include this within their contract this year which lead us to look at
some alternatives and we do have an alternative to be able to propose today and
that alternative encompasses only using 17,305 dollars. That's what we would
need to set aside in order to do alternative funding through our cops in school
grant which we've already made an application for and which we have brought
before this Council in order to get authorization for the Mayor to sign on that
application. We did have that application go in we are waiting for award notice
on that. We probably won't know until sometime around October which is why
we are presenting this as an alternative. It would be a total of 125,000 dollars
from the Federal Government over the next three years. It would take a
commitment on our end of it to at least 17,305 dollars available should we
receive t he award. That's why we are putting it up here now because wed 0
have the potential to get that and we should be in pretty good shape to continue
this program and add to the school by putting another body in. We have
discussed this with the school district as well and the school district is more then
willing to continue our partnership at the end of the three years where in the
fourth year we have to assume this officer and the school district believes that
they will be in a better position at that time to be able to absorb it within their
contract as well.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: If J could ask. Bill I don't know how we could open that school without an
SRO over there. I just absolutely don't know how and this alternative plan if it'll
work its fine if not I don't know how we are going to dig up the 76,000 but we can
not open that school without an SRO officer over there. I feel those are some of
the most important people we got in this department because of the relationship
they get with the kids and stuff over there. I mean this is a nice big high school
coming on board and everything and to be without a SRO. Somehow we've got
to get that in and get it taken care of and this alternative plan is a good one but
we better have something back up to make sure that we do have an officer over
there. That's my personal feelings.
Musser: M r. Mayor. Councilman Bird, members 0 f t he Council. I appreciate
those sentiments and believe me we are in a position where we can pull up our
bootstraps if needed and Mountain View High School will be covered. However
in an attempt to put us in a better position if we can, that's why we did apply for
Meridlan City Council SpeCial Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 7 of 90
the grant. We did want to point that you know this is a significant savings if we
get the grant award. . I do feel fairly confident that we maybe able to do that
because we have an excellent track history with the cops program for the eight
officers that we brought on in prior years. The only problem is I can't give you an
answer as to the absoluteness on that award at this point. We probably won't
know until October possibly even after. One of the things we were looking at for
being able to set this aside though. In discussions with Chief Worley and looking
at where we were at. We've had a part time crime prevention position, which
was approximately 19,000. We haven't been able to fill that position we do have
some alternatives in regards to that one that will be coming up shortly but there is
some money available from that position which could be reallocated and set
aside within this budget if necessary 0 nit. However 0 ne 0 f the things I went
through and was looking at when I was reviewing the current salary settings and
placements on that it appeared that we no longer had that within the salary
placement so I don't know if that was an adjustment by finance or not because
the position hasn't been filled for two years. That was one thing that we were
looking at where we had potential monies in the base that might be set aside say
in the Mayors budget as an administrative one, which we would have it, available
then. It could be reallocated at the end of the year as we amend budgets and it
could specifically go towards this but that would be the Council's choice.
Bird: I just feel that we've got to open that school with a SRO out there.
Musser: We do have a plan, they will have a SRO come August. I believe its
August 14th when we initiate the SRO contracts back in there. There will be a
body at the school Council member.
Bird: Thank you Captain.
Corrie: Yeah Bill one of our jobs is going to have to be to convince the school
that they do need that and they better really look hard at it. I know that we
discussed at how we could cover it but we want to make sure that the school is
on board with that.
Musser: At this point based 0 n our negotiations we have had with them and
talking with them on the contract. They feel that there wouldn't be a problem at
the end of the three years being able to commit so we can retain this person and
it would become part of the contract. We are all facing some of those financial
woes right now.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I agree with what Councilman Bird has s aid. I was a t a meeting
yesterday, it was regarding The Boy's and Girl's Club, one of your officers has
,/0--00
i
Meridian City Council SpeCial Budget Workshop
July 17. 2003
Page 8 of 90
been hanging out at The Boy's and Girl's Club on a regular basis, they only know
him by Gary, and so I "have my suspicion who that is. Apparently and the reason
for this story is to underscore the importance of having the officers in these
schools is the relationships that he has made at The Boys and Girls Club while
he's out on patrol now the kids recognize him and call after him. He has a
different level of respect with these kids, that are so important, and merely those
are the ages that are important to reach the kids. The presence in our schools
has got to be one of our priorities and I appreciate your department looking at
how we can make it happen because it is vital. It is a crime prevention type of
thing. I guess it's very important also looking at your crime prevention money as
maybe supplementing some of this. I think we all appreciate your concentration
on making this happen because it ahs to be one of our priorities.
Musser: Mr. Mayor, Councilwoman De Weerd, members of the Council. I
appreciate those sentiments and that is part of our goal. Like I said at the
beginning we take our mission statement very much to heart at the department
and you can't do it all through enforcement. It also takes us being proactive and
moving out into that community to do some educational type things and do some
direct interaction and hopefully here as you move into priority four we'll have
some more for you in lines for that.
De Weerd: Just to wrap that up, do you know who this Gary is?
Musser: I believe I do. I only know of one Gary that we have and I'm sure he
probably has a dog along with him.
De Weerd: I am assuming so too but if you will please pass along the
appreciation and that its been noted publicly in the community because it did
come up at a meeting yesterday of the appreciation of The Boy's and Girl's Club
for as well Kenny for Scotty and his crew they hang out there too. I think its just
phenomenal, what a great statement your departments are making to those
youth.
Musser: I will pass that on for you Councilwoman De Weerd.
Nary: She meant hanging out in a good way I think.
Corrie: Yes. Also, tell him good luck this week.
Musser: Moving along to priority number four, this is one where we had initially
submitted in for a Crime Prevention Specialist and Public Information Officer.
We wanted to move the Crime Prevention Specialist position to a full time one
and also incorporate Public Information Officer functions with that position to
justify that full time aspect. As a result it included 64,998 dollars most of which
was salary related and benefits. There was a portion that was related directly to
operating costs and some associated capital. What we were looking to do with
Meridian City Council Specld[ Budget Workshop
July 17. 2003
Page 9 of 90
that is continue in our bridge building within the community, something that we've
been working to do for the last two years but with the part time position we
haven't quite got to the point we needed. We've had a number of applicants,
we've looked those applicants over and to be quite honest they weren't the
people that we needed in order to represent the community of Meridian. There
were some issues and after discussion in sitting down and looking this over part
of what we were seeing that may be problematic with the part time position was
just that it was part time. Therefore we went getting as good of an applicant pull
submitting in for that position so we were going to make an attempt here to go full
time on this. Then coupling in the Crime Prevention along with Public
Information it allows us to disseminate better reports and that type of thing and
get thing out to the community so we can enhance our partnerships. Again, the
strategic planning issues its non-traditional staffing and also research and
development of planning. As I just noted there this is a move from the part time
position to a full time one. Based upon the 19,000 we had currently approved in
FY 03 the overall increase would actually be about 45,998 dollars. However, this
was not one of the chosen ones on the Mayors priority so we have also provided
an alternative on this one. On this one, we are looking to do two full time
positions, the Crime Prevention Specialist position full time and then also a new
elementary school resource officer and this is part of what we refer to as the PSN
grant. This is the Projects Safe Neighborhoods grant, which I presented to you
at a Council session. I think this figure right here speaks highly of what we are
able to do with the monies available here. This would cost the city 5,900 dollars
investment for this first year on this grant. What we are looking at here on it is
that we do have the Projects Safe neighborhoods grant. We did receive an
award, which has been accepted by the city as authorized by this Council, that
total amount for the next two years is 256,500 dollars. The grant is like I said for
two years, we currently have 127,422 dollars budgeted on our outline to the state
for how we were looking to spend this in FY 04. That leaves us a remainder for
next of 129,079 dollars for use in Fiscal 05. The grant proposal would allow for
the full time crime prevention - I'm sorry.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: Bill just a question. When we received this grant has those monies
already been included in the revenue projections?
Musser: No.
De Weerd: Okay, I just wanted to verify that. Thank you.
Musser: Your welcome.
De Weerd: Sorry.
"
Meridian City Council SpecIal Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 10 of gO
Musser: And again to reiterate full time crime prevention position along with the
full time elementary "school resource officer on that. The needed allocation of the
needed 5,900 dollars from the city is for expenses not covered by the grant. In
particular reference the officer we have expenditures such as uniform, belt, the
holster, hand gun, those types of things. They don't cover those out of these
types of grants so we would have to look at that. They also don't cover direct
overtime. However, they will pay the benefits towards it but they won't pay the
direct overtime. Those were the costs included in that 5,900 basically
equipment, uniform, allowance and direct overtime. Before I move on with that
one also in conjunction with that Safe Neighborhoods Grant just to give the
Council and the Mayor an update here on it. We did have a meeting last week in
which we were able to bring Saint Luke's Meridian to the table along with the
school district and BSU who is potentially doing some follow up review on this
program for us. We were all able to come in and everybody seems to be very
excited about the program and what we've initially outlined in our abstract and we
are keying it directly back into looking at our youth in particular the Elementary
and Middle School children. Incorporating classes that go into more then just
firearm safety but also awareness and expanding out what we do inside the
schools through that elementary school resource officer. Our Crime Prevention
person would also help coordinate through businesses and also through civic
groups in town here to help us to this. The Crime Prevention position will also be
involved with helping develop a curriculum that's acceptable to the school district
and incorporates what Saint Luke's is currently doing with some of their
programs so that we can get to a much wider target to a group of our youth. One
other aspect and I believe that they were probably tied up that day but The Boys
and Girls Club of Ada County is also excited about this because we plan on
continuing this educational format into the club itself here in town. However they
were tied up and weren't able to make it to the meeting but I have met with Curt a
number of times and he's very excited about the possibility here of having
additional officers become involved down at The Boy's and Girl's Club as well.
So this is another community outreach program that we're really excited about
that brings in a whole lot more partnering between some major components in
the city. These are some other items that we had. Priority number five was a
traffic emphasis personnel enhancement. We were also looking at replacing
motorcycles at this time. The motorcycles can probably survive another year and
I notice we do have them projected out for replacement for next year so these
147,490 dollars was to specifically address traffic issues and also to help us meet
variance in our objectives from FY 03 in relations to the strategic plan. We do
have three officers now assigned to the traffic squad and they have become very
active in doing a number of things in town besides enforcement and we've had a
lot of collaborative efforts between Ada County, Idaho State Police, Boise Police
working a number of different types of traffic task force. Such as on the Fourth of
July we had a combined DUI taskforce going again for holiday driving under the
influence and we've also done a number of corridor traffic enforcement activities
along Fairview down on Eagle Road all the way through on the corridor there at
Eagle Road and also in conjunction with the interstate. It has been fairly
f ~-:.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 11 of 90
successful and our officers even helped Ada County with Highway 16 on the way
up to Emmett because there has been a lot of speeding, accident problems up
there on that roadway as well. It has been paying off I think overall for us.
Priority number six an additional personnel enhancement for reserve police
officers we were looking to increase reserve officers by four on the department
we currently have six. However we also had to look at the issue of equipment for
those officers. W here they are not paid we do provide the uniforms and the
handgu ns and that type of stuff to them and that would cost us 18,780 dollars. At
this time the reserve officers are the only officers that are not issued a
department issue handgun. We took care of all the other officers. They do carry
similar handguns to what we have. They all carry glocks but what we were
looking to do was issue them a department handgun as well rather then a
privately owned. This also was a result of a numerous contacts both Chief
Worley and I have had reference people wanting to become involved in our
program so we were looking to increase it to a base of 10. It does have costs
associated with it
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: Can you tell us on your reserves what kind of impact they have?
What kind of duties they perform and what kind of impact they have on your
staffing?
Musser: Mr. Mayor, Councilwoman De Weerd and members of the Council.
One of the biggest things that our reserves are able to help us out with was right
at the beginning of the year when we had two very tragic episodes in town here
that involved first a homicide suicide and then another homicide. We had to
contain scenes, which meant we had to be able to control them utilizing officers
to do that. Our reserves became very valuable for having somebody in uniform
with authority that was there to be able to control the scenes while at the same
time keeping our overall overtime costs down a little bit because as you all know
during t hat period wed id have a lot of 0 fficers 0 ut. We had a lot 0 f ongoing
expenses related to overtime but we were able to utilize our reserves to help us
out with securing those scenes. In past years they have also performed that
function with us. On parade days because of the amount of traffic we have in
town the need for doing traffic control and also doing crowd control. The
reserves are an iatrical part in being able to help us out with that. They provide
us additional manpower on those days. Again it helps reduce some of the
overtime and they become involved with it. All of our reserves we encourage to
attain their level one reserve certification. We do make available for them
attendance at the southwest Idaho reserve academy which one of our reserves
at this point Craig Rohm is a coordinator over at Post 4. By helping, them do that
and providing some of the funding that's needed there in making our officers
available that makes them that much more trained for us as well. I'd say
)~
Meridian City Council SpeCial Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 12 of 90
probably the biggest thing though to help augment us at times when we need two
officers in the cars on. nights when staffing may be a little bit low. They are out
here on the weekends to help us out so that we have two people in the car so
that we have a car that can respond just as a single unit with two people in it to
say a domestic call or something like that and it doesn't take two cars out of the
field then. We do have a back up in that manner. However with the growth and
everything else that we've been experiencing and need to put officers on they do
occasionally get bumped because we are busy also trying to run a number of
officers through our field training program right now. These gentlemen bend over
backwards they don't receive any compensation whatsoever they willing come in
when we need them and when we call them as we did at the first of the year.
They adjust their schedules to be able to cover a sitting for a whole night out in
front of a house without much of anything else to do except just keep an eye on
things for us and make sure that things stay secure. They are dedicated citizens
and the only way I could really compare them it's the same as our citizens that
are in the National Guard that voluntarily give up their weekends and part of their
summer to be of service to their country. These gentlemen are being of service
to their community through the Police Department.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Corrie: Bill. I came from Boulder who had reserve officers. They had 125
officers but they got paid when they worked but they didn't get their uniforms paid
for or their guns. They did all that on their own. They did get paid when they
came to work or fill in. Have you looked at that as a possibility rather then giving
them all their equipment and that to let them be paid? Because an officer would
have to be doing that if they weren't there and you would have to charge for that
and looking at it another way can they get paid by the people that's asking that or
what they need for that. It's an idea but it would be less cost but yet they would
still be being paid for what they were doing and you can kind of get a trade off
here. I don't know, we can talk about that a little later but it really worked well
back there and the merchants and the people didn't mind paying for that and it
would also help augment their uniforms and their time that they put into it. Just a
thought that you might want to look at it that way. There's lots of different ways
to look at reserve officers so.
Musser: Mr. Mayor members of the Council. We have looked at the option of
being able to provide them some payment. Garden City for example utilizes their
reserves as part time employees and they are able to pay them when they need
the additional staffing and all. However given where we are at with some of the
budget crunches that becomes a question for us as to where do we get the
additional monies when we need them and yes it may be less then the overall
equipment. However I don't have a good measure at this time but I certainly will
look at that so I can provide you an answer in the future.
Corrie: Okay. Thank you.
./
I
Meridian City Council Spe(;lClI Budget Workshop
July 17. 2003
Page 13 of 90
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Bill I guess I should ask when you talked about capital improvements and
the vehicle replacements. You said three of the vehicles were near the 90,000
mark. I'm assuming that's the 97 and the two 98 vehicles. I just didn't know
where the 2000 vehicle was since it's in the replacements as well.
Musser: Mr. Mayor and Council member Nary, members of the Council. I would
have to double-check those figures again. I know two of the vehicles were ones
that we've kept on for an extended period because they were assigned to one
officer, they were both canine vehicles and that's why their mileage got up and
we were able to run them a little bit longer. One of the 2000's and I believe it
was a 2000 came on and has been running around the clock until we got other
vehicles on so it picked up a lot of usage when it first came on that it started to
slow down a little bit. I didn't grab the current figures on it because I didn't go in
to the station this morning but I will get that information over to you because we
do track that on a monthly basis now an update where the mlleage is on those
cars.
Nary: Thank you.
Musser: Priority Number 7 was a miscellaneous grouping of items for us. It
included LCD monitors for records. We were looking about 2,400 dollars on that.
However we have found some means to be able to get most of this taken care of
at this point for us. We were also looking at record storage in our record section.
We do need another center shelving storage unit to purchase and put in there.
That's going to cost us 3,817 dollars for that u nit and get (inaud ible) but wou Id
allow us to keep our three years of reports available there within as we rotate
them through. At this point we are going to fill up the current shelving units that
we have. An additional one we were looking at involved building security both
perimeter within the temporary holding facility or the holding cells down at the
Police Department. That is going to be 28,675 dollars, a majority of that cost
over 13,000 of it is related just to the multi-port digital recorder that's necessary
for all the different camera hookups. That's the single most pricey item within
that whole project and something we will have to evaluate as we move down the
road. Another issue we were looking at is also trying to reduce overall liability of
the city by having the officers record all of their stops and contacts. We were
looking at what Boise City did with conjunction with their-
***End Of Side One***
Musser: - and because micro cassette recorders have a tendency to break down
and with the advent of digital recorders we are also finding that there are not very
(
Meridian City Council Speckll Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 14 of90
many people making micro cassette's anymore, the individual cassettes
themselves. We were looking at being able to purchase and issue out to all of
the officers a digital recorder along with an extra memory stick so that they had
one that they could use, pull it out if something happened have another one to be
able to go with. These would download directly right into our computer system at
the station and we could record these out, make copies of them right to a CD,
rather then have to continue to have to transcribe tapes and remain with bulky
tapes and that type of stuff. We can go right to modern technology and get them
done a heck of a lot faster then what we do now. However in looking at where
we are at with it we were able to say that you know we can fix this one here with
the monitors, that ones in process right now and we think we maybe successful
in going ahead and completing what we were looking at there. Our records
personnel were the key issue in order to provide them some eye relief by using
the LCD monitors. The building security with the cost overall associated with it,
that's another one that we were looking at. As much as we would like to have it
bottom line is the majority of the cost is going to be the unit itself right now so it
would take a commitment in order to get it. We could do it in phases if need be
but buying the recorder and then hooking up primarily the holding cells number
one so that we can videotape when the officers are in there with a person for
utilization of the intoxilizer in there. It provides them a little sense of security
when they are in there by themselves with a prisoner. Then expand that one out
later. The digital recording system didn't make it to the priority list as well either
when we received the paperwork back from the Mayor on it though we all did
concur that it would probably be a strong liability issue but it does take 13,000
dollars to commit to that. The only one then we have left is that we would like to
consider or have strong consideration on is the shelving unit for records in
particular because there is a definite need for it they will have to have it in this
next fiscal year and it is 3,817 dollars, probably one of the cheaper ones that we
had submitted overall. As a result, our revised proposed budget for FY 04 for the
Police Department consists of priority, one and two which is the six officers
equipment and vehicles for 367,388 dollars. Priority 3 is an alternative was the
Cops in Schools grant in particular the SRO for out at Mountain View High
School which would need a funding set aside incase we get that grant award of
17,305 dollars. Priority number four again an alternative provides us two
positions from the Project Safe Neighborhoods Grant, there would be one
elementary school resource officer and still provide us that full time Crime
Prevention position with a commitment of 5,900 dollars from the city. Priority
Number 5, the records storage cabinet for 3,817 dollars which would bring the
overall budget proposal from the Police Department to 394,410 dollars. I did go
back and gage this in against the revised budget information and numbers that
we did receive from accounting and I did notice while we do not have a whole lot
to play with or anything else there was approximately a projected 58,000 that we
might have. I tried to keep us within the confines of that by still not trying to jump
on everything there, utilize it, and then also find additional alternatives such as
potentially that past Crime Prevention position as potential funding that may have
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17,2003
Page 15 of 90
been out of place that we could utilize as well. I would stand for any questions
from the Council at this point.
Corrie: Well I want to commend you and the chief and your department for what
you've done here. You realize that you've cut out 300,000 dollars about out of
your budget and I commend you for that. J know it's very hard, it's difficult but I
think you've done a real good job here and what you've asked for is really
definitely what you really need. Not that you didn't the first time but I do want to
commend you and your department for doing that and you did exactly what I
wanted you to do. Go back and look at it so you did a good job.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Musser: Thank you.
Bird: I think the whole Council will like all those sentiment for a job well done.
You guys have been first class the last couple years of realizing what the city
situation is and this is all departments have done it I believe that everybody has
tightened their belts and worked cooperatively and get this thing taken care of
and we certainly do appreciate it. You do a lot of the work for us that we would
have to do it and by your priorities and alternatives and all that stuff working out I
think really helps and I think the Mayor and Council's very appreciative of what
you guys are doing and -
Musser: Mr. Mayor, Councilman Bird, members of the Council. Thank you very
much for your comments and I would just like to mirror that I felt it was very
worthwhile for us to be able to sit down and meet with the Mayor to have the
Mayor establish our priorities and lay them out and then see what we can do be
able to provide alternatives and t his year I'll be quite honest we've been very
fortunate in particular with the Project Safe Neighborhoods Grant which was a
very last minute thing and we receive the only award for a law enforcement
agency off that grant and things just fell together pretty well for us.
Corrie: Thank you Bill. Very nice presentation. Chief you are leaving good
hands there.
Worley: I think so.
De Weerd: Do we want to take a few minute breaks?
Corrie: Chief I also might commend you for being the one helping Bill in doing
this. You've done a lot for our department the last two years. Thank you. Yes
lets take that break.
(Recess)
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17. 2003
Page 16 of 90
FIRE DEPARTMENT
Corrie: Chief Kenny Bowers, Fire Department.
Bowers: Thank you. Mayor Corrie and Council Members. We were talking
about the Boys and Girls Club and I think kids like Scotty, BZ, and Drew just kind
of come together down there. They all run in the same pack I think. It's working
real well. I hope you've received some of those thank you's in your boxes and
stuff. A little bit of recognition for them. I really appreciate what you guys are
saying.
Corrie: Kenny I might add that when I go down there. Every time there seems to
be more and more kids that want to be Police and Firemen and I think the Fire
Department has the edge right now. Thank you guys.
Bowers: That's good because we need that for the future. We do. It's going to
work out good. Mayor Corrie and City Council members I appreciate you inviting
us here today to present our budget request for the year 2004. As you know it's
been a very busy year. Councilman Bird kind of gave us a bad time last year
about not having PowerPoint so we are going to try that this year. I already went
backwards twice with it so we are learning. Our Number 1 enhancement was a
thermal imager and in the past, the public has helped us out tremendously with
the prices on these thermal-im.aging units. In the last several years, the Meridian
Firefighters Association has helped us out. So far this year the Meridian
Firefighters association has decided to put all their monies towards the safe
house that we are moving over to the school. We thought this would be a very
good enhancement for the city and the Rural to purchase one. These are the
units that we use on an everyday shift. I mean we go out to homes that have hot
wires or hot walls, hot plug ins. We were able to zone in on the correct wire or
the correct plug in without tearing the whole wall out. We can go into commercial
businesses and check which balance is bad without taking down every light and
looking at the balances. We've also used it in the past as grass fires going out
after we've thought we had the grass fire out. We go around the perimeter with
this to see if there are any hot spots still. We believe that each station should
have one. It cuts down on the time that a fire crew has to be on a location. Also
where they come into account the most of is assist with search and rescue,
finding victims. Several years ago as you heard Caldwell Fire was able to go
down in the basement and pull a person out of a fire there. They work
tremendously. They really show the heat from a body, from a hand, from a foot.
That is the most important part of this unit here. We use it daily, I mean it is an
important tool for us, right along with a defib. It is a very important tool. The cost
of that was 12,000 dollars. They have come down from 25,000 when they first
come out so they are getting a little better in price. Our next enhancement was
our new fire engine for fire station number three. The engine that we have now
in back up 304. That picture right there is 11 years old. It has somewhere
around 86,000 miles on it. As the age increases in vehicles the maintenance
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17. 2003
Page 17 of 90
cost goes up. The down time of the trucks, taking them to Boise to repair and
work on them increases. This is going to be a - station three is going to be a
very important part of our district. It's going to run 0 n m any calls, so we are
going to need a first-rate engine out there that will withstand the riggers of the
calls. If we do not purchase a new engine this year we will have to approach you
guys next year which then it will be a year and a half before we get it on scene.
Also, we would only have one backup reserve engine so if anything happens and
we have an engine go down with a problem we would be able to fill that position
but we wouldn't have any other extra trucks. Councilperson de Weerd and
myself, we believe we heard some good news Monday night from the Meridian
Rural Fire Protection District that if things go has good as it has with the new fire
station three they would be able to put in their 24 or 25 percent of this engine.
That would be around 90,000 dollars. I believe that's what both of us heard the
other night and I think they are probably going to be able to back that up.
De Weerd: We have it on tape.
Bowers: We have it on tape, correct. That would help us out tremendously too.
Our next enhancement and we didn't have a picture of an office. We should
have had Greta or somebody sitting in an office. Anyhow, we would like to bring
in a part time office assistant. Able to fill in for vacation time, able to fill in for sick
time when Greta is gone. Four hours a day turns out to be 19 and a half hours a
week. The ability to have current assistant work on more details. We would be
able to have a little bit more help on our projects. We wouldn't have to pay a little
bit of overtime when we have a big project come up and we need Greta to stay
afterwards. That would be able to help us out in that and we still haven't slowed
down much on the transmittals from Planning and Zoning and the City Clerk's
office. It hasn't slowed down much so we are trying to get a person to help us
out in t his area a nd to do purchase 0 rders for us. This would be a part time
position 8,544 dollars. If I could go back to the fire truck, that 380,000 was truck
and equipment. The truck we just learned several weeks ago, diesels now have
to come out with emission check system on them now for the emission, which will
cost 10,000 dollars per diesel truck now. That will put the price up 10,000 more
dollars just for the emission stuff. That's scary. Our next enhancement, mobile
data terminals. This is basically a laptop like you guys got in front of you that sits
in our Captain's position of our fire engines. We get information from dispatch of
the address, what type of call it is, where we are going, and a map section. In
the past Ada County Sheriff's Office has owned these and divvied them out to
each department. They will not be doing that anymore. We will have to start
replacing our old units that are starting to become unreliable from all the
bouncing that they get in the fire trucks. The new units that we would be looking
at, Terry Paternoster believes that we will have better performance with the new
ones. We will be able to put maps that we can pull up a map on our MDT's. We
will be able to program when a bridge is out or when a road is closed, we can
program that right into the computer to pop up as we get into the truck and head
to that direction. The cost for two of them would be 7,500 dollars.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 18 of 90
Corrie: Kenny would the money that you got the other terminals from the
dispatch, do they come under the title 31 money?
Bowers: Yes they sure did.
Corrie: Why are they not doing it again with title 31 money? I'm on the ECAB
board and I asked that question and nobody seemed to know. Maybe you guys
might know this because I'm going to fight for them to give each one of those fire
trucks and the Police as well out of that title 31 money because it's from the
government and we should be able to use it. I don't know can you tell me?
Bowers: I cannot Mayor Corrie at t his time and Council. Let mea sk 0 eputy
Chief Johnson to see if he knew.
Johnson: The report to us at PSCB which is the Public Safety Communications
Board the user board from the Sheriffs office was it was just getting too costly to
take out title 31 dollars and continue to do the upgrades to the communications
system, such as the new radios that they put in. The updated CAD system, we
took a pretty good hit when we went to New World and then back to PSI. So
some of that cost, and that was a proposal that came out of the Sheriff's Office
directly driven by the Sheriff's financial folks. They just went to PSCB and says
we aren't going to do this.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: My understanding, its been for awhile now that has been - it was a policy
change by the Sheriff's office has well as - before the board configuration has
changed a couple of times it was just a policy choice of basically they paid the
initial cost. Then they've only done the replacements or the replacements have
been done by the cities now. Certainly, that's something that can be revisited.
Corrie: Yes I've been talking with the County Commissioners and they are also
asking the same question. Why? Whose decision was ita nd it wasn't really
exactly - they've changed people too but they are looking at that possibility but
we still need to look at it here in case they don't.
Bowers: Thank you.
Corrie: Thank you Kenny.
Bowers: Our next enhancement is opticom. Basically, it continues to upgrade
the traffic signals in Meridian. This gives the green light to the Meridian Fire
Department apparatus when responding to alarms to improve the safety for the
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17.2003
Page 19 of 90
citizens and the firefighters. We are looking at two intersections, and the cost
would be right around 9,000 dollars.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Bowers: And I just got call from Ada County Highway District yesterday saying
they are going to do two more intersections this next two months. I didn't know
anything about, Overland and 5th and Overland and the school.
Nary: Chief I was going to ask on one of these enhancements here is Franklin
and Locust Grove and I didn't know if that intersection - is that going to get built
in 2004?
Corrie: We think so.
Nary: I guess I was thinking that it went with the extension of Locust Grove north
before they would rebuild that whole intersection.
Bird: No that's part of the Franklin Road widening deal.
Nary: Okay.
Bowers: Yes. Mayor Corrie and City Council members, Councilman Bill Nary. I
believe that' supposed to be this year, I mean this coming year when they come
in and start moving the bridges, the canals, the ditches. Just kind of put that
intersection in.
Corrie: Kenny are they going to wire it and everything and ready to put out to
come in, right?
Bowers: Yes.
Corrie: So that 9,000 dollars is just the opticom (inaudible)?
Bowers: Yes.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: You need that. Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: Kenny there are continuing talks right now at the chiefs level isn't
there about the costs of opticom and how that cost is distributed?
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17,2003
Page 20 of 90
Bowers: Correct. Mayor Corrie, City Council members and Councilperson De
Weerd. Weare getting very concerned, the fire departments in the area are
getting concerned that we are having to pay for all the opticom in the
intersections where we believe that should go under Ada County Highway District
when they put in an intersection. Ada County Highway District's concern is they
are only into moving traffic, they are not into stopping traffic or helping fire
departments get through intersections. That's what their biggest concern is they
want to keep the traffic moving. We have. The Fire Chief's Association has got
together with Ada County EMS and we are sending letters to Mayors, City
Councils, Ada County Commissioners, everybody that basically has anything to
do with intersections and trying to plead to them with our concerns of why we
have to put the monies up for this. There are some talk and you guys will
probably be seeing that in the near future, these letters that we will be writing to
you guys.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess just to circumvent the need to write our own city. Hopefully
maybe we can take a little bit of a proactive approach on this. About the opticom
also why is it that the City's continue to be the only ones that pay for the
installation. Since its also utilized by the EMS the you know - yes. So that
would be another one. Kenny if you can come up with a suggestion on what you
would like to see the Mayor and City Council do in response in letter writing, what
the Mayor can do on the various boards that he sits on to be an advocate for this.
We certainly can do it because it needs to change.
Bowers: Thank you. I really appreciate it. Yes it does. We've even discussed
to Ada County Commissioners on how we could pass this cost on to some of the
developers again. There we go again another addition to a permit but you know
there's got to be some other way of paying for these and we keep shelling it out
every year.
Corrie: The EMS Board is in conjunction with the City's. They would like to see
the County Commissioners pay for some of that. However they are in the hole
too. So-
Bowers: Exactly.
Corrie: They are in between a rock and a hard place. That board is making the
recommendation to the County Commissioners do pay for some of that through
EMS funds.
Bowers: I'm not sure how it worked out in the Boise City. They just updated their
lights downtown, I believe it cost them over a million dollars for opticom. I don't
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17. 2003
Page 21 of 90
know if that was all funded by Boise City. I'm sure it probably was. There's got
to be some other wayJo do this. Thank you. Oh and Councilman Nary. One of
those intersections there, the 1-84 and Eagle eastbound, we've already done that
one. That one sprung up on us a couple months ago. We will just put another
intersection in there.
Corrie: Go ahead Kenny. I'm sorry.
Bowers: Electric key locks. Each building in our district that has a sprinkler
system or an alarm system in it, we have them put a knox box on their building.
What that is is a key that we get out of that little box right there on our dash, we
go to the building open up the knox box, get the key out and go inside the
business with Meridian PO not just by ourselves but with Meridian PO there. To
either shut off the alarm, to turn off the water if we've got a broken sprinkler head
before the RP gets there. Our concern is we are getting so many knox boxes in
our district because almost every building now has an alarm system or a
sprinkler system in it. That we would like to update our boxes to electronic box.
We realize that if we lose a knox box key out of our truck. We will have to go
around to every business in Meridian and recyclinder, rekey their box. These
electronic boxes will go in the truck. We will need to punch in a code that will tell
us what day and time it was opened up and there'll be a big blue light? Red light,
green light on top of this so that our people will know that it is open. We would
like to update this in our six engines at this time. Right now that box up there is
just a combination box lock. We don't know when it gets opened, we don't know
who opens it so we would like to update our knox box keys in our trucks.
Corrie: Kenny don't you have somebody that's in charge of that key box there
like a Captain or does everybody have access to that box?
Bowers: Every fireman has access to that box. Our first out trucks, the captains
are responsible for that box. Our backup, our reserve trucks, it could be a
volunteer, it could be a part time person that's taking the truck out. We want to
make sure that we do not lose a key anywhere.
Corrie: Okay. Thank you.
Bowers: Stacy and myself talked about this quite a bit of where we should put
this plan reviewer and inspection contract laborer. We didn't know if it would
need to go in to the base budget under contract laborer or put it in an
enhancement. We kind of decided that since this is kind of a new thing to us, it's
a pretty good chunk of money that we probably ought to bring it into the
enhancement and bring it for the Council. Right now we do have our Deputy
Chief which does all the planning's for all the buildings in the city and then the
Rural we would like to bring on a part time person or a contract laborer to do the
sprinkler systems and fire alarms for our district. Since there's being do many of
them at this time. We came to last year I believe and asked for a fulltime position
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 22 of 90
on this a nd wet hought that there w ou ld be abetter way 0 f doing its 0 we've
come back with a contract laborer person. This also allows to use this person on
the needs and demands, if it's for some reason a slow month or a busy month we
can both work that out with him. He's not getting paid every month like a full time
person would be.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Wasn't this the discussion we had recently about the fee increase and it
was for this type of purpose and we sort of held off on that pending a little further
study? Because would this be basically reimbursed out of fees?
Bowers: That's correct. That's how we thought we would be able to pay for part
of this or all of it would be out of those fees. You betcha.
De Weerd: All of it.
Bowers: All of it. That was all of our enhancements that we have presented to
you guys. The Meridian Rural Fire Protection District. Rich Greene had an
emergency today he wants to give you his apologies for not coming today. HE
had a tooth problem and had to go to the dentist this morning and of course
Steve Elliot and Terry Leighton is out on vacation. They appreciate everything
you are doing for them too. We discussed the budget a little bit Monday night
with the Rural Commissioners and t hey are w hole-heartedly backing a budget
that we have shown you guys today. There were several questions on each
enhancement also. They understand what we are doing here too. Also to pay
ourselves little bit on the back too. If you haven't heard, we received a 29,000-
dollar grant for our fire safe house. The rural has set aside a few dollars to help
out on that grant. We will be able to buy chairs tables, VCR equipment and
remodel 0 ne of 0 ur bedrooms into a sprinkler room. It's going to help us 0 ut
tremendously and as you've, guys have talked about and we have talked about.
We believe that we need to start with our kids showing them fire prevention,
showing them fire safety when they are cooking. Giving them a little bit of first
aid training. That is going to help out tremendously too. Mayor and Council do
you have any questions?
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: Just to add to that Kenny there is only a 10 percent match required
on that grant which I didn't suggest that the other night.
I.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 23 of 90
Bowers: Oh you have told them? You have mentioned to them that we got a
grant?
De Weerd: Yes.
Bowers: Great. Wasn't knew news. I thought I was going to get a chance to pat
myself on the back Tammy.
De Weerd: Well we have already patted you.
Bowers: Oh good. Thank you. I didn't know it.
De Weerd: Really hard to -
Bowers: All right. Any other questions that we can answer for you guys?
Bird: Thank you for the presentation..
Bowers: Thank you for giving us the time and we got through the PowerPoint
without going backwards.
Bird: You bet.
Bowers: Thank you.
Corrie: Moving forward. Thank you Kenny and nice presentation.
Bowers: Do you guys - will we need to come tomorrow for anything? For any
questions or anything tomorrow that you know of?
Bird: I don't know.
Bowers: Okay I didn't know if we did or not.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess I do want to make sure that we got an update on our
revenue. If that money from the rural is also included in that? Is it Stacy?
Kilchenmann: The grant money?
De Weerd: Yeah their portion for the engine, for the fire engine.
Bird: No it hasn't gone in.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17,2003
Page 24 of 90
Bowers: No.
De Weerd: Okay.
Bowers: Mayor Corrie and City Council members, Councilperson De Weerd. No
that was not put in there. We felt the City would have to pay for that whole thing.
So it did not show up in the revenue from the rural.
De Weerd: Okay and it is in their published document they are having their
public hearing next month and so that number is in there. Stacy if we can modify
our revenue analysis one more time to include that.
Bowers: Thank you very much I appreciate it.
De Weerd: Thanks Kenny. Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess I would have a question on our fire inspection fees and really
how we want to best deal with that and I don't know if the budget hearing is
where we want to have that conversation or during the fee process as we are
considering the those fees. We do want to know how we do the accounting to
make sure those fees go directly to offset this cost.
Corrie: I think that would be in the public hearing so that you can make sure that
it gets on the record too.
Bird: Would it be during a public hearing of the budget or we've got to have a
public hearing on a fee deal. That's where it would come forward at and at that
point I think when we pass the resolution, which on the fees we just have to have
resolution if we just make sure that t hat's where it goes - it pays for itself by
revenue.
Nary: Right.
Bird: And once you get it in the resolution then I don't think anybody can change
it.
De Weerd: I just want to make it a special fund similar to our building fees so it
doesn't get lost.
Bird: That section has got to just be self-supporting and all the fees comes in
stays there.
De Weerd: And doesn't move till (inaudible).
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17,2003
Page 25 of 90
Bird: And doesn't go into anything else.
Corrie: Okay any other questions of Council?
De Weerd: Nope.
Bird: I have none. These reports have just been so first class Mayor and I'm
very very satisfied with them. They are very very first class and I think this is a
reflection on you and Stacy and the work you guys put into this too.
Corrie: I would like to explain a little bit about the priority that I put on things.
You'll notice that in the Fire Department a thermal imaging unit was not in the
priority list and it wasn't to the fact that I didn't think it should be number one. I
thought that perhaps with a little help from the Mayors office and what have you
we could generate that amount of money from donations and I would be willing to
spearhead that and I think that they would be able to get that amount of money
that wouldn't have to come out of the budget. They've done an excellent job in
what they have done here and asked for and to cut down on an awful lot and I
think that if we work with them on the fire truck we might be able to reduce that
even more but I really feel that that thermal imaging unit can be taken care of by
donations and that. I've had a lot of people already say they'd like to do that.
We may half of that already.
Bird: I can vouch that a couple organizations I know who would be glad to
donate towards it.
Corrie: Yeah and we may even be able to pick up two for that price because it
ahs gone down.
Bird: I think that truck is very important.
Corrie: Definitely.
Bird: I think we ought to get that thing ordered right now.
Corrie: And I think we have ways to do that and really work on it.
Bird: I think there's ways we can do that but that truck has got to be ordered.
Because that isn't something you just go buy off the lot. Don't just go drive
home. We got to have it ready to go.
Corrie: And I've talked to Kenny about that thermal imaging and I definitely
agree that they need it. It's just a matter of how we are going to get it.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 26 of 90
Bird: I think every station has got to have one but I think we can get it through
donations just like you. said.
Corrie: Thank you anything else?
Bowers: I think we brought in a pretty conservative budget. If you take the fir
truck out of there I think it's been very conservative. That was a very good
discussion between Stacy and I and the Mayor. What are we going to do are we
going to take that fire truck out of our fire truck fund or are we going to pay for it
through city funds? We pretty well thought we would take it out of the fire truck
fund this time but we still are going to have to start putting money back into that
fund one of these days. We can't forget that, we need to start -
Corrie: With what we have been talking about by the time you're ready for
another truck you'll have that much amount of money again if we do that. I was
looking over a 700,000 dollar deficit and from my standpoint I was trying to find
some ways to widdle that down and still get you as much as you can and that
was one of my reasoning with the fire truck was to rather then - we'll explain that
why I came to that conclusion but I think everybody the department heads and
that have done an excellent job and you've come in and the Police Department
the two big ones have done an excellent job and I commend you as well chief
and deputy chief.
Bowers: I do know that the Meridian Rural Fire Protection District wants to meet
with you guys again and discuss our future plans and keep talking about that with
Tammy at our meetings so and I didn't get to thank before the crew left. I want to
thank the fire guys. Thank you guys. Station one and Station two for showing up
today.
Corrie: Very good. Thank you guys.
Bowers: A little late but that's okay. Thank you.
Corrie: Thank you Kenny, thank you Bill.
Kilchenmann: You are scheduled for a break at 10: 15. I think maybe we'll just
squeeze Will in here while Terry's still here. Terry is going to have Lasik's eye
surgery so hopeful we won't have our IT staff using brail at the end of that. I'll get
Terry and Will if that would be okay with you.
Corrie: Okay.
Bird: Sure.
Corrie: I think its fun to squeeze Will.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17,2003
Page 27 of 90
Kilchenmann: We just have one administrative enhancement request so.
Corrie: Okay very good.
CITY CLERK
Corrie: Hi Terry.
Paternoster: Hi Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: When are we going to get those new codes that I have to put in my
computer to get on it? Is that coming up?
Paternoster: Codes?
Corrie: I'm trying to think of what my password is going to be. I got to change it
every 60 days. I don't think I'm that smart or not to think of a new one. That is a
good idea I'm glad you are doing that. Go ahead.
Bird: Go ahead.
Berg: Thank you Mayor, members of the Council. Hopefully you read through
your manual and if you had any questions about the budget itself in my
department you could ask me now or ask me later. I handed out a sheet that
went through the one enhancement that we are requesting and its in conjunction
with getting information out to the city dealing with our website. We are in the
stages of trying to keep our records electronically. Scanning them and putting
them in files as you can see the laptop project from last year I think is working
successfully. We are retrieving documents electronically, emaiJing them to
people. This is one of those unique software situations that when you continue
with the same firm you have to upgrade with the system. Fortunately or
unfortunately, that's there business and so this is an upgrade to the Laserfiche
system. It will enhance our ability to hook up into the website. I think everything
is pretty well self-explanatory on the enhancement page. I tried to put it in pretty
much easy terminology what we are trying to accomplish with this upgrade and
Terry is here. He probably has some answers to your technical questions. I'll
kind of leave it at that.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: This enhancement, the Laserfiche upgrade. Will you know its only 24,000
dollars but we are going to see a savings of better than that by bringing that
enhancement in. I think it's something that we've got to do. If anything its
proven out, these laptops for us and stuff is just to me and I'm the dumbest
Meridian City Council SpeCial Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 28 of 90
computer guy here but it has been a real blessing to me to have the things and I
think this is something that we certainly need to move forward on this
enhancement. I don't see it has even being a questionable item myself.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I'd just like to make note that Mr. Bird is now supporting a computer
enhancement. That's very good.
Corrie: He's getting smarter.
Bird: I feel that's just an upgrade in the city period.
Nary: I would concur. [think you're absolutely right.
Bird: I know Boise City is down on that Laserfiche down at their building
department and you talk to developers or builders and stuff and they love it.
They think it's the greatest thing that's every happened and I believe that also
and I think that's what it will do for us too Will.
Berg: Thank you. Mr. Mayor, members of the Council. Also just to point out our
Police 0 epartment is a Iso in L aserfiche system scanning their documents and
filing them electronically. Just to make sure I point out that Sharon Smith has
spearheaded and kind of made sure these things are trying to get organized into
our electronic system. Our whole staff has really liked the concept of being able
to retrieve documents, at least our current documents electronically and emailing
them out to people. That has been a real asset. Everything is pretty much done
electronically from getting comments from our staff to us and then us getting it to
you and to the rest of the public and developers of the projects. It is going to by
far save cost for personnel and storage. Not to say that we don't need a new city
hall, but we do need a city hall. Did we -
Corrie: Okay any other questions?
Bird: I have none.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess Will you have the new sound system in here somewhere
don't you?
***End Of Side Two***
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 29 of 90
(Recess)
PARKS DEPARTMENT
Corrie: Come out of recess and we now have Parks presentation. So Doug you
are on.
Strong: Good morning Mayor members of the Council. Not having done this
before, I'll just kind of shoot from the hip. I don't have a formal presentation and
I'm prepared to answer questions primarily. I think just in summarizing our
budget request I hope fairly straight forward. We have essentially two new things
we are asking for in our base budget and that's a maintenance position and a
one ton utility truck would be the two enhancements there. Then the rest of what
you see is in impact fees. The primary focus of what we are looking at in our
request with impact fees is to get moving on master planning and construction
document work for many of the parks that will need to be developed. Essentially
our undeveloped parkland so that we can keep progress moving along with those
and contribute in that way to in some cases partnerships. Not all cases are there
partnerships involved with the master planning. An example would be the
Autumn Fair neighborhood park that j think it's identified to start master plan
documents. There is no partnership identified for that park yet. In order to keep
progress moving along with the land that we currently have we need master
planning and construction document work done. That's what's identified with
most of the impact fee amounts. With that very short introduction, I would stand
for questions and staff is here also to answer questions that I can't.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Doug could you talk about this truck a little bit. This 42,000 dollar request
for this service truck and -
Strong: The intent behind the service truck is that our staff person that does a lot
of maintenance in the parks when something has to be repaired in the park. This
truck would be essentially self-contained. Everything that we would need to go
out to a site and operate remotely would be on it, welder, and air compressor
things like that, all the tools. It would prevent the running back and forth to the
shop to do many of the tasks that are encountered in the repair of play
equipment or things that have been vandalized in the building things like that.
For everything that needs to go on the truck, it needs to be a fairly substantial
truck to do that so it's a utility truck.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17,2003
Page 30 of 90
Nary: So its not replacing something this is essentially a new item that you are
looking at and its basically sort of takes the place of a couple three different other
ways that you have been doing it currently? Is that the way that you -
Strong: Right now we have tool boxes on pick-up trucks and we have some of
what we need typically for a job on site and then we often encounter where we
have to run back to the shop to weld something or to use a cutting torch. To get
something done where if we had it on site it would save that trip back and forth.
As we have more parks developed. Where the need to be out and mobile to
increase our efficiency and just staff time becomes more apparent and that's the
intent of this truck is to help us be more efficient and when we go out to a site to
repair something and Elroy can add to that.
Huff: Thank you Doug. One other thing on that. In the department right now we
have the one-ton dump truck that we use quite a bit. It's the one that's heavy
enough to pull one of the two trailers that we have. My three quarter ton truck
does not handle those in a really safe manner when they are loaded. This truck
in addition to that would give us an opportunity to pull either one of those trailers.
If we are using simultaneously well then that truck can be as well as a tool truck
we can tow one of the rigs somewhere which a lot of times Brad does with the
skidster and the loader and the truck all at one time. That would be handier even
yet. Instead of having, to always have that truck he can take that truck and that
equipment, go, and we can still use that other truck. Sometimes we lose a little
time by having to split out how we trade out time on those. That would be a little
more efficient having another vehicle that has capacity to take whatever we
need. I f we have to go rent a piece of equipment, which occasionally we do
sometimes, it comes to with a little bigger trailer and the truck can handle that
too, we don't have to have them deliver. That saves us a little bit.
Strong: Thanks Elroy. Maybe just to add on why we are asking for new is that
we are typically very content in inheriting pick-up trucks that other departments
give up. This particular piece of equipment is not available by hand me down
process. It's kind of specialized and unique to that specific need. The best way
to acquire it is new.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I had a question regarding your groundskeeper. Last year there was
a request and it showed kind of acreage per employee that you had. Maybe I'm
out of line you probably already have this in your request form. What are your
average acres per employee and what kind of impact would this one position
have?
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 31 of 90
Strong: I'm going to let Elroy address the majority of that question I think. To
lead into that as we .Iook at the staff positions that we currently have in the
department I think its important to understand how many of the positions that
have classified as groundskeepers have been used. T hat we take out of the
formula for people that actually do grounds keeping work. Brad whose kind of
our maintenance technician. We have Terry Whipple who's a fabrication person
that we just redid a classification on that position so rather then groundskeeper
he's identified has maintenance technician part time. Elroy often has been
counted as part of you know a person on the ground but as park superintendent
and with administrative duties it's not appropriate to fit him into the mix for how
many people we need per acre. We've tried to identify in our description of
staffing the people that really aren't full time groundskeepers and then the
number of acreage that we have to take care of to address that so. Elroy will talk
about the acreage per person and some of the standards that we came up with
for that.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Huff: Just something that we were working on. I'm finding myself a little bit more
administrative. I do go out and take care of some things that are absolute
necessities. Late in t he afternoon some 0 four staff i s already g one, I do get
pulled into the everyday work but the percentages is smaller all the time mainly
because of the amount of construction that we have going and different things.
Just looking at the acreage compared to last year we really are at the point now
of about 90.6 actual developed acres of parkland. We are still out there with 117
acres of parkland undeveloped that we do some maintenance on in order to keep
it looking halfway decent. We get pulled around quite a little bit so if you get to
looking at what we really actually have in groundskeepers is about three times
groundskeepers. We have Dennis and Rick and S pence those are the three.
Then we have summertime help that jumps our staff up for those anywhere from
three months to six or seven months and that brings us up to where our standard
of maintenance is 18 acres per person at this time. The national average is
about 15 it depends on what amenities you have in the park denotes how many
people you have to have. We are putting more stuff into ours all the time and as
the more amenities we put in the more required labor that it takes to take care of
those things. I'm looking for some kind of a happy medium of where to stop at so
we can handle it. We really are struggling a little bit with the manpower issues.
The other thing that we want to be able to make sure that the Council
understands is we are very frugal about is that if we do end up with a person to
go on staff for full time we probably won't bring them on in October we may bring
them on next spring when the workload increases. When we get ready. It'll
depend a little bit too on what our construction projects look like they are going to
shake out to next year. We could very well have some acreage get close into
things going on with it this summer and during the winter if it allows a little bit. So
sometime next summer we could have more acres to take care of then we now
have. I'm looking down the road and then trying to figure out when we would
Meridian City Council SpecIal Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 32 of 90
implement our needs. If something happens and we don't implement the needs
then we just won't do.it. We are trying to make sure that we're not just jumping
out there and dragging that person in here to go to work when we're running just
kind of so so. We are actually behind personnel wise but we're willing to do
whatever we can do to help in the budget and to not bring that person on until we
really need them so we are good that way. It's a challenging time and we know
that we have all the right acreage out there undeveloped and now we are going
to get some more acreage and we just want to make sure that we don't get
snowballed in the process of it. It's the same thing where we got things coming
up with pathways, we have developers that want us to take over some of those
pathways that we worry about being able to take care of when we take them over
so we are trying to make sure we don't take more then what we can budget for.
At this point, Doug and I have discussed that at length about what are standards
might be on taking that over because that is going to increase our needs and our
manpower and our staff and our base budget. We want to soften that up over
the next several years as soft as we can especially in the budget crunch, we are
in. We don't take over more then we can handle and then impact the city in that
way too. We want to be careful of that.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Well while you are there and Doug's here. Kind of let the Council know
about this 8th Street footbridge. We discussed it in our meeting and I'm
determined that maybe we could be 100,000 dollars saved there for this year and
kind of let them know what we were thinking on that.
Huff: We had a really good discussion on the 8th Street footbridge. We didn't get
as much solid information on that as I would of liked to. I still think the 100,000
dollar figure is a lot, especially if we went with a about a four foot wide bridge.
But there is always that geotechnical stuff (inaudible) and different things with I
think its Water Resources that gets involved with that creek down there when you
start doing things with it. Same similar things that we run into when we work with
that other bridge that we put in by Tully Park. You know connecting that bridge
with asphalt paths affects the cost of that entire project. The bridge itself is
probably not overly expensive but connecting up to it with pathways adds quite a
bit to the cost of whatever it is per square foot of asphalt and then bedding it and
everything else to get it there through the park over to the end of Chateau that
then on around to the end of 8th Street. Those added quite a bit of cost to that
and gets you up into that high number range. We still feel like its something that
we would like to do and need to do. Its just when to do it that's the best time and
we kind of felt like maybe we could skirt by on that for a little while if we had to.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
(,
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 33 of 90
Nary: Elroy you know on the groundskeeper issue. Is there any opportunity or
has there been any, look at either two seasonals rather then a full time
groundskeeper and a part time seasonal that you've asked for and whether or
not that will self fill the bill for you. Or the other alternative I guess what you are
talking about for some of that work is what it sounding to me like was really
ground maintenance and have you looked at costs for contracting for that service
rather then hiring employees to do that?
Huff: I have not looked at the cost of contracting. Generally I don't look at that
so much because I know what I have a good feel for what those costs are and
what service you can get from that. The problem that I have sometimes with the
size of our parks which range most of the time are going to be 18 acres or 20
acres and we have Settlers which will eventually be 58 or 56. The problem that
we get at seasonal help is that I will usually will turn them over a lot of times and I
spend a lot of time in training and if I can get to the point where I can keep a
certain number of full timers that I have trained that I can depend on and know
what they are doing it makes it a lot easier in day to day business. You're part
timers you can use for lots of different things but its not necessarily some of the
technical stuff that I'm going to need them for coming on. Because I turn them
over too much and then I'll have to start back in if they go on to college or don't
come back the next year. I spend all year working with them on certain things
and then I don't get them back next year so then I have to look for somebody and
start that over again. I don't mind having some of the part timers, the ones I have
now are all good guys but they are doing things that if they don't come back next
year it won't adversely impact the department. I can train other people to do the
things I got them doing but as our acreage increases that's where I need full time
help that can get trained and I can count on being there day after day and year
after year.
Nary: And some of that maintenance that you are talking about I guess if I
understand what you are saying is that contracting for some of the more base
type of grounds maintenance mowing the lawns and trimming up the parks and
those kinds of things. Its cost prohibitive to do it through a contract that you are
better off hiring seasonals to do that rather then just contracting that service out.
Huff: Generally I think the contracting service would cost me more then the
seasonal would cost. That's in my past experience, I haven't run those numbers
recently I figure those would hold true.
Nary: Even by putting out an RFP or something like that just seeing what the
markets out there and whether or not you got people out there -
Huff: It's an interesting thing to do. I've done it before in years past, it's been
some time since I've done that but it didn't pencil out (inaudible). Like I say you
do add a lot of things in there if you bring them in and they are not using our
equipment, if they use their own. You add to their cost so you are not just
{
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 34 of 90
dealing with labor and we are trying to deal with whatever equipment we already
have and stay within those bounds and if that works out okay then my part timers
work pretty well. I am just limited on what I have them do so that I don't depend
on them so much that when they leave it causes problems. I don't like hand an
18-acre park over to the part timer unless he's really sharp because then that
means that next year I don't have somebody else to staff that area. Those things
get to be a little tense there sometimes. I hope I've answered your question right
or not Bill.
Corrie: Tell me ortell us I guess tel! us about that 20,000-dollar Bear Creek
tennis court. I initially cut that one out in the priority but I come to realize that
maybe half of that 40,000 is paid by a developer, is that correct? How does that-
Huff: Yes. Bear Creek LLC or Greg Johnson I guess if you want to put it that
way are still interested in developing some amounts of that park. They had an
estimate that it would cost about 40 to do lock stock on the tennis courts. They
asked us if we could think about budgeting for half of the cost and they could pay
for the other half. They are more then willing to do that depending on how we
budget. I'm assuming that that park is what we call not all the way developed so
that we could still use impact fee money on it I would think but its something that
we think in that part of town would be a good amenity we don't have anything like
that out there that we do have some space for.
Corrie: They haven't discussed doing it at all have they? Help sell their homes
out there.
Huff: We discussed several things in the past but they have been staying about
half half. I think they are smart enough to know to do that. I wish they would
come across with a couple other things but.
Corrie: That helps them sell homes out there. I believe that the tennis court will
help some. I really believe that all the amenities out there between that and the
playground. Those are the two that would.
Strong: I'd like to jump in for a minute and add to the discussion about the
seasonal versus full time staff. I think there is another issue that we don't want to
overlook here and it relates to the park ordinance that we are working on
currently and once that park ordinance is in place, we will establish rules for
different areas of parks. One of the things that's identified in the park ordinance
is who can enforce those park rules and working out agreements with the Police
Department there is many things that can be dealt with on site by city staff or in
this case park staff. That's best handled by either full time or trained seasonal
staff. If there's something going on at the skate park or something going on at
the playground where rules are being violated they would have authority to
approach that situation and deal with it to the extent of actually writing an
exclusion notice of the person that needs to be expelled from the park for a
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17,2003
Page 35 of 90
period of time. That I think is going to be a continued and growing issue with
parks as we build more parks have more activities in parks is how we control the
activity in the park. I mean what we are talking about with groundskeepers
typically is just taking care of the green space the open space but we are going
to have more of the challenge of dealing with the behavior issues that come up
with space that we provide for citizens to use and manage in conflict or potential
conflict in parks so. As we look into the future, we are going to be looking at the
potential for positions that might have similar orientation to the recreation
facilities person that we brought on board this summer to deal with the issues at
the Tully Skate Park. Particularly to add other active use areas like the
adventure land playground area, which could be very inviting to a large number
of people including disabled or handicapped population. If that helps any.
McCandless: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. McCandless.
McCandless: Tell me about that Bear Creek bleachers and what its for? Do you
have a soccer field out there or something?
Huff: Yes we have two softball fields out there and we did not look at the seating
at the same that we did at Tully Park there is big bleachers on four on each side
of the field over there. There are two on each field. What we did on this park is
we put some room back there for one bleacher behind each field behind each
field right behind the backstop. That's a limited amount of seating because there
is enough space out there in the long fence runs and things we did for people to
bring their lawn chairs or just sit on the grass. We've tried to soften that up so
the amount of bleacher space that we would need would be less.
McCandless: So that's for softball.
Huff: Yes.
McCandless: Okay.
Huff: We discussed not doing that. I can't remember now how much the
bleachers are but we were trying to just hopefully that everybody would come
and bring things. T hey do like to do come sit in their lawn chairs and watch
games and things so we had that pretty well set up that way. We know there's
always a need for some bleacher space but I think the seating for each one is
only about 50 or less they are not really large. That makes them pretty easy to
work around if we had to move them or something we could they wouldn't be so
hard to move around. If we had to coast a little while longer without those that
wouldn't be the end of the world.
McCandless: Thanks.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 36 of 90
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Yes. Mr. Nary.
Nary: On that one Elroy on the bleachers and things. Has there been any
discussion with some of the leagues that use that? Whether or not some of
those you know making that part of the fees for the leagues to help off set some
of the cost for some of those kinds of things. No there hasn't been discussion
with them on that partly because we weren't sure when we were going to do that
We haven't made that discussion. That is a possibility to do something like that
and plan ahead for that that is possible. The other thing I was going to ask was
on the groundskeeper you said that that wouldn't probably be an October start.
That would probably be a spring start and the seasonal I would assume would be
the same thing. Something in the spring or late spring.
Huff: Usually our seasonal vary from depending on the weather a little bit I'll try
to not bring them not until I have to but they run anywhere from mid March to mid
April. It's better for me if I bring them on about March 15th and run them through
till October. We usually suffer some bit in October and November after they are
gone and there has been a couple times I've saved enough money where I just
used a little bit in the next years budget and kept one of them on through the
month of October mainly because I was short manpower after October 1st
because they are usually gone about then.
Nary: Are the dollar figures here reflective of that (inaudible) or would it be less
then what's requested here.
Huff: What you see there is the dollar figures for - are you talking about part
timers?
Nary: Well both yes, the groundskeeper at 41,453 and a seasonal at 15,306 and
I didn't know if that was an October one beginning of the budget year amount or
whether or not it would actually be less then that.
Huff: That's beginning of the budget year groundskeeper on the 41 that's if we
ran him all year and put him all full time. The other is from March to the end of
September. Anyways there's some things that I think are the first things that I
see that are going to happen with us manpower wise is I believe that in the next
six to seven months there are going to be some interesting happenings to the
west side of Settlers Park. Looking now already at 26 acres developed there and
that other side is probably going to develop so when it does our grounds keeping
needs we get a little upside down again. That's what I'm looking out for and it's
pretty hard to really have one person out there taking care of 58 acres when we
are one person for every 18.
(~,.
(
Meridian City Council Spedal Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 37 of 90
Nary: I wonder. Has there been any discussion with, I know those groups are
raising money to improve those fields both baseball, soccer and (inaudible). I
wonder if t here has been any discussion with any 0 f those g rou ps as well for
some partial assistance on long-term maintenance.
Huff: We have had some lose discussion over that. We are trying to get things
to if it works right what we are maintaining out there from the Parks Departments
is everything related to turf and irrigation and we won't do baseball fields for
games. They take care of all those kinds of things we don't have to prep those
like we do some prep at Tully now for our men's leagues and things like that. We
won't be involved in that prep. There's some other things there we are trying to
figure out a way to minimize our impact. There are other things that we will still
be responsible for out there and other amenities that go into the park plus
adventure land playground. Those things are all going to take some serious
maintenance time, I just got a feeling there is not way of getting out of that.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: This is for Councilman Nary. On these bleacher s we seem to have a hang
up on 4,400 dollars I can tell you that the cost of those that's probably for two
sets of bleachers. We happened to purchase the ones that went out at Harold
Cox's field and I think the set of bleachers out there was about 2,600 bucks we
paid for that. Most of the cost of that is government restrictions and safety things
that come along. Its something I think you need to have behind everyone, I don't
think its an outrageous deal to ask for that's two sets to go out there behind the
nice fields that we do have at Bear Creek Park. I don't know, but that's where
the cost comes in Bill. I mean back in 87 I got those two big ones that sits at the
Legion Field for 5,600 bucks for the two of them and look how much bigger they
are then the ones sitting down at Harold Cox but we didn't have the federal
regulations on it at that time. Now we are paying for it (inaudible).
Nary: Well I guess I didn't have any concern with the cost more of looking
alternative ways to fund ita nd if we have some leagues that use t hose fields
predominately then maybe one of the ways to do that is for the fees to off set a
portion of cost.
Bird: With the impact fees we got to be using some of our general fees to match
up with these impact fees too if you look at our impact fee ordinance and so stuff
like that is costs that will do it. At least add 10 bucks on every player's fee to
register and it's a fairly small impact to the player but yet that fee can go towards
park maintenance and you know they can maybe do bleachers one year and
maybe do something else another year. Maybe they are going to re-enhance the
dugout or something like that but I was just thinking that kind of discussion would
be a good thing to have. Same thing with the (inaudible) that are helping develop
!."
Meridian City Council Specldl Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 38 of 90
the other fields in looking at long-term maintenance to avoid the taxpayers having
to pick up the 100 percent of the tab. That they look at some long-term
maintenance for soccer and baseball and all the other things that are going on.
Bird: I can tell you that in Boise the optimist, we pay for some of the
maintenance if we don't do it.
Nary: Sure.
Strong: Maybe a part of this question to is we talked earlier is if we have
somebody that i s willi ng to contribute bleachers f or a park can, we c ou nt that
toward a match for impact fees?
Bird: You bet.
Strong: And I think that would be a question that would be real helpful for us.
Maybe encourage us to go out had look for partners knowing that were also
helping the match for the impact fees.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I think the Finance Department '5 looking in to that. I have already
asked them the question and I did ask that they run a report on where we are at
with the impact fees. We still are ahead in our match and I also understand that
the recommendation coming forth from the impact fee committee is to reduce the
matching for the impact fees from the current 50 percent to 25 percent. That will
be a really good thing for the department as a whole. Right now we are about
100,00 ahead. Reta did plug in the current budget year as well. As you can see
most of the requests in the Parks are impact fees. I think we can get on top of
that, it doesn't have to always go the 50 percent every single year. They just
want you to remain cognoscente of it. I think we should be okay this year and
with the additional information on it if we can account in kind and donations
towards that match we will be well above because then we can go back and look
at what's been donated and in kind donated to Tully Park to Bear Creek to
Chateau -
Huff: Which we have quite a few on spread out through those three.
Bird: Boy you take the Harold Cox softball field down there, which was
completely donated, and I bet that hasn't been counted.
De Weerd: But that's an existing park. I don't know if-
Bird: No it was not an existing park. It was under impact fees when it was done.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 39 of 90
De Weerd: Oh was"it..
Bird: Yes.
Huff: I know some of the - I haven't looked at it for a while but I know we can
figure out what improvement costs have been donated by the developer at Bear
Creek. We have had quite a few things on that one and then it seems like we
had a little something on Chateau and so we do have some things out there
where people have donated certain things to the park.
Bird: Skateboard Park.
Huff: Yes we have a lot there, which goes into Tully I guess. We have a lot on
skateboard and of course (inaudible) a few other things like that putting things in
to so all those things count. I lost my train of thought.
De Weerd: I'm sorry.
Strong: Something I think I want to come back to if this is an appropriate time to
do that is as we talk about master planning and construction documents for the
parks that we are in the process of developing. The requests here are what it
would cost us to do it if we had put everything out to bid at current market. As we
look at master plan we also have some other ways that we can be efficient which
we will pursue and I want to make you aware of that so that you know in
everyway that we can or that we can find or based on suggestions that come
forward we want to be as cost effective so that we have as m any impact fee
dollars available as possible to not just develop parts but also acquire parts. We
have an offer from Boise Parks and Recreation to use their planners for master
planning and the cost would essentially be their salary and benefits. We will take
advantage of that as much as we can and it's made available to us so that they
can keep their planners busy and keep them on the payroll. Its kind of a win win
for both departments. We will do the same with the completion of construction
documents when people are willing to step up and contribute to some of the cost
of completing construction documents or completing master plans, we will take
advantage of that. We already have some interest in Lochsa Falls from the
developer and the architect that is working next door in Verona Subdivision
because they have a lot of the site work already completed for Verona that will
help for some of the initial planning for Lochsa Falls. Like I say we will take
advantage of much of that kind of contribution as possible in completing these
plans. We feel even if when we are working with partners that this takes us a
step further along in completing a park and actually in some cases can help us
turn a park green as much as a year or so earlier then if we waited for the partner
to go out and get master planning construction document work completed where
in many cases they are asking for donations of that work. An example of where
that's worked I think is with Kiwanis park where Pinnacle Engineering has
Meridian City Council SpecIal Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 40 of 90
donated much 0 f the work that's been done t here for that park. That's pretty
unique I think, an" engineering firm stepping forward and being willing to
contribute that amount of work that they don't make any money on.
De Weerd: [think you can't say no to Gordon Harris.
Strong: No they have some very influential members in that group. In may
cases those people will jump forward and like we were talking before the hearing
when we just in the work that we've done so far on our newly named Centennial
Park all of a sudden we have two local people that want to jump in and put some
money there. I think when people see progress being made and they see
something happening I think people will come forward and help with that. That's
what we are attempting to do with much of this request is keep progress moving
along on planning for parks so that the bottom line for us that we have a Jot of
control over the basic specifications of what goes in a park. Then when we work
with the partners its very clear what's going to be there and the standards that
are going to met to develop it. Because we will have the task of maintaining it for
the years to come and want to make sure its done right so we don't have
inadequate irrigation systems and other things that can happen. That was kind
of our thinking as we put this together and the next step as we look at the
expenditure of impact fees is to look for more parkland. That's something in the
next year or two that we need to look further in how we want to fill out that map in
our Comprehensive Plan for additional park space. Next year when we come
back I hope that we are talking about more parkland purchased too and our
challenge will be to balance acquiring parkland and developing parkland and
using what limited impact fee money we have to do that. That's our thinking and
I guess we are here to have that thinking modified if you see.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Let me tell you these guys Doug and Elroy has worked hard with the Parks
and Recreation Commission to go with this budget. I think this is a very fair
budget that they've brought forward. Very lean. It's like Tammy said on the
impact fees, most of this purchase stuff is going to be through impact fees, which
thank goodness we have. I know they have worked on it. I'm for one that
doesn't like to see extra people on board or extra material but they do need the
groundskeeper they do need the one-ton service truck as we get larger and stuff
and we are saving ourselves a lot of money by not having to hire this stuff out. I
know Doug and Elroy have looked at both aspects of whether how you do it and
what's the best way to do it and this is come up the most cost effective. I feel
they've got a very fair proposal before us at this time and I think they've just done
a real fine job of presenting it and I know Doug hasn't had that long of experience
of how we do it here at the City of Meridian. He's jumped in and done a great job
Meridian City Council SpeclClI Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 41 of 90
for us, I certainly appreciate it, and I think it's a very fine budget. It's a class act
on their part.
Strong: We've also proposed some places where if we needed to cut things out
where we would recommend that. I think that's in the Mayors budget as well so.
If there are places that we need to cut and the 8th Street Bridge has been
discussed as one place that we can save a lot of money in our budget request
there and we can find other ways to maybe either fund that or just delay it and
see where we are next year. We are willing to work with that.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: Doug is there for a pathway connection for a bridge where there not
be some grant money available for that? I know you worked - Elroy is probably
shaking in his boots over there at that suggestion since they had to fill with it on
the five-mile path. I would imagine that there should be some grant money
available out.
Strong: I think there is.
De Weerd: Is that correct Elroy?
Huff: I know that it's out there and I'm not a grant writer and I know it's out there.
Doug is a lot better on that then I am. I think that's a good addition to our
department the fact that Doug has done grant work before and that helps us out
a lot.
De Weerd: I think in particular these kinds of projects are a lot more prime for
that kind of grant writing.
Huff: The 0 nly thing that you 9 et into with t hat especially d own there 0 n that
creek is where we'll come back to some of the same issues that we dealt with the
Five Mile Path and the bridge and I guess if we have to deal with that we have to
Corrie: One of the things that we are looking at of course is an organization that
we might be belonging to here and will work on grants and help us with that
writing and that's particularly what they do and when we find them they will help
us get those grants written. I think grants are out there and if we don't take
advantage of them we are really missing the ball really because we pay for it in
the long run.
Strong: I think a project this size Mayor is looking at grants. Smaller projects
and I'll just throw out an amount and say 10 to 20,000 dollars are often not worth
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 42 of 90
writing a grant for because of the administrative costs of dealing with it but of we
are looking at 100,000. plus project like this one's been identified at this point then
it is worth while to look for grant money but there are some expenses that go
along with it i n the sense 0 f record keeping, staff time and some 0 f t he 0 ther
things that are often required to complete the grant. Depending on where it
comes from but that would be worthwhile! think in this case.
De Weerd: I think with SAGE this is ITD money that I was thinking of as far as
the grants and they are very familiar with that can help write it and I believe they
even help with the administration of it. It's just another help for you and your staff
in pursuing those funds.
Strong: And we will do that.
Corrie: Any other questions of Parks? Okay very good Doug. Thank you and
Elroy and I think we made an excellent choice in Parks Director and we want to
keep that going good and thank you very much you've done a great job. Elroy
the whole staff really, congratulations to the staff as well because they've worked
hard and they are coming along really good so.
Strong: Great thank you.
Kilchenmann: Mayor and members of the Council. You may now break for
lunch.
Corrie: Oh okay.
Kilchenmann: And please try to return at 12:20 and then we will do and discuss
SAGE and MDC and so forth.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I was just going to ask you know. I guess I didn't notice until we've been
sitting here but I know they didn't necessarily ask for any enhancements but we
are not having discussion with the Building and Planning and Zoning
Departments about any of - its just because they are not asking for
enhancements? There is one thing on there but it looks like it was off set by
some other revenue for a building inspector or something like that.
Kilchenmann: Gary will talk. He will be discussing that this afternoon and the
Public Works and Planning and Zoning is not scheduled for presentation.
Actually that was one thing I thought we should talk about. I did put in here have
them turn in their variance reports from the strategic plan. I'm thinking that I don't
know if we want to do it in conjunction with the budget or a different time but we
should maybe have annual presentations from each department as it relates to
their strategic plan.
/,0.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17,2003
Page 43 of 90
Nary: I guess that's~ what I was thinking but I realize they didn't ask for any
enhancements but last year they asked for a minimal enhancement and we had
a whole lot more to talk about. I guess I just thought it was odd that we didn't
have any presentation at all.
Kilchenmann: What we could do is actually incorporate that as part of the
hearing maybe in the future. Like have them spend 20 minutes on their
department and their strategic plan because it's not taking a complete hour for
them to present their enhancements. Would that work?
Nary: Yes and like I said and I don't necessarily have something in mind but I
guess I thought like I said we've had discussions with other departments about
other things. There wasn't and like I said I just didn't notice until I was sitting
here that they don't have any time scheduled at all for Planning and Zoning and
its such a significant department of the things that go on here that it was sort of
surprising to me that we wouldn't have any conversation a bout it.
Kilchenmann: I could actually ask them to come in tomorrow morning.
De Weerd: And Bill just wanted the opportunity to really drill them.
Nary: I don't think so.
Bird: You just wanted to get after on them again.
Corrie: One of the things that we want to make sure is if you got questions, if
Council has questions we want to get them asked. If your not sure of something
you want to ask and find out and if something's not being done here don't be
bashful. I mean I ets talk a bout them because it's the city's money and that's
what you are in charge with.
Kilchenmann: I'll ask them to drop by at eight because we are going to be
finishing ahead of schedule and we already did the revenue discussion so they
could drop by.
Nary: Okay.
Corrie: Okay well back at 12:20 is that what you said? 12:20? All right we will
recess till 12:20 then.
(Recess)
(Return from Recess at 12:47 P.M.)
***End Of Side Three***
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 44 of 90
PUBLIC WORKS
Smith: Ladies and Gentleman of the Council. For the record, I am Gary Smith,
Public Works Department Director. It's my pleasure today to introduce to you the
supervisory staff of your Public Works Department. These folks are instrumental
and efficient in compliant operation of this department. First of all, Brad Watson,
our City Engineer. Len Grady, Len is our Staff Engineer. He spends a lot of time
out in the field so you may not of seen his face as often as the rest of us. Daunt
Whitman is going to be here. He is our Building Official as you now and he
hasn't made it yet. Rick Clinton out Water Superintendent and his assistant,
Chip Hudson, is ill today so he's not available. Don Case is here and Don is our
Chief Water Operator for the Water Department. Jon Shawcroft our Wastewater
Superintendent you all know and Danny Higgs is John's assistant superintendent
and Brent Grover is the Chief Operator at the Wastewater Treatment Plant. We
as a Public Works Department are pleased to present out budget to you today for
fiscal year 2004. I will discuss the one enhancement that we have for the
Building Department a nd Daunt said he was going to be here to make a few
comments to you also. Brad will present the budget enhancement for the
Engineering Division and Rick will present the budget enhancement for the Water
Division. Brad and Rick will answer any questions you may have concerning the
enhancements or any other areas of the operations of our Department or the
Water Department. Jon will present the budget enhancements for the
Wastewater Division and again Brad and Jon will answer any questions you may
have concerning the enhancements or operations of that department. I take this
time to offer a special thank you to Brad for coordinating and putting this
presentation together, it's taken a lot of work and effort on his part and we really
appreciate it. I had a doctor's appointment at 10:00 this morning and it was
cancelled at about 9:15 and moved to 2:30. It's one of those appointments that
has been a long time in getting and I would rather not endure having to move it to
August, which is what the receptionist told me. I would with your permission if we
are still in the process at about 2:15 I need to leave. I hope you understand. In
case these proceedings do go into the 2:00 hour I respectfully call your attention
to a memo that I sent to you on June 30th concerning employee compensation. I
know this is a really tough budget year for general fund revenues and I very
much respect the difficult decision that you have to make concern ing not only
enhancements to our city but also employee compensation. I understand the
bottom line. Money in equals money out. My hope is that employees from all
city departments can be treated equally as regards in any salary increases that
are given. As you know the enterprise fund supports 100 percent of the salaries
of all Public Works Department staff. 100 percent of the salaries of all MUBS
Department staff. 50 percent of the salaries of the Finance Department and 50
percent of the salaries of the HR Department. I've said it before and I'll continue
to say it that our employees are our most important assets. Without them the
wheels of what we do don't turn. I know it's a time where benefits are under
scrutiny and monies are short for consideration of salary increases and just to
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 45 of 90
pay for a cost of living increase if that is possible. I support funding salary
increases for monies ~within the enterprise fund for the departments that I have
listed above and I do support the proposal that has been submitted to you from
our HR Department concerning this subject. I'd like to start with the Building
Department enhancement and Daunt isn't here yet and I'm hoping that he does
come and when he does come I would like your permission to have him make a
few comments concerning that position. This is a difficult proposal to make from
two standpoints. Number 1 Daunt and Steve, his assistant, have done a very
good job in providing inspection services for new construction and that was very
well documented in a recently completed customer service survey. Secondly,
they have been around for a while, they become friends, and they have
contributed to the well being of our community. They have contributed their
services for no cost on special projects. This change is being proposed because
it has been expressed that the size of our city can support full time employee
inspectors in these two position to provide some additional time for the inspectors
in the office and that there would be some cost savings to the city.
Corrie: Gary just for your information. Daunt did come in.
Smith: Thank you Daunt.
De Weerd: You are late so you need to sit in the front row.
Smith: Daunt is here and he's obviously very interested in maintaining his
contract for these services and he would appreciate the opportunity as I
expressed earlier to make a few comments to you. I publicly apologize to Daunt
for dropping him out of the loop concerning notification on these budget
presentations and I sincerely Daunt apologize for that oversight, it was not
intentional by any means. That's all of my opening comments and I guess at this
point with your permission if Daunt would like to say a few words concerning his
position in life at this present time I think he would appreciate that.
Corrie: I would like to hear his position in life at this time.
Smith: Concerning building inspection. Did you want to make any comments to
the Council?
Whitman: Mr. Mayor and members of the Council. I didn't have a whole lot of
time to come up with anything actually to speak to you about other then I guess
questions I would have would be, what would the expected change would
improve. You know if there were a problem with the service you had been
getting from myself and my subcontractor and or if it was a matter of financial -
strictly financial change. At this point we have some flexibility in when we get
extremely busy we could fairly easily call in some help to handle on slot of
additional work without putting on anyone has a full time position. It just gives us
some flexibility and the staffing I guess would be the best use of that. And as far
r"
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17,2003
Page 46 of 90
as I know that Gary had indicated to me he's budgeted for a Building Official and
one Building Inspector and I frankly don't think that one Building Inspector is
going to be able to keep up with the workload working and eight to five taking an
hour lunch. Because currently Steve Pierce who is working with me. Steve
doesn't always get here at eight, he gets in usually more like nine, but there's
days he's out in the field until well after 6:00. He does what it takes to do to get
the days work done, a lot of times neither one of us stop for lunch we kind of
continue on through just to get what we have to done. Currently I'm in the office
until about 11. I'm back in the office typically by four. Generally can have all of
my phone messages taken care of by five, so I guess I'm just some of it. My
question would be what would be the benefit to the city and if there's a problem
that we haven't dealt with? If there was anything I could do to change? Are
there any questions or can I answer anything specific?
Corrie: I don't k now of anything Daunt t hat reflects 0 n t hat anything t hat you
have done. [think it's more financial than anything else where we are. That's a
decision that Council's going to have to come up with and we may continue with
what we are doing and it's really a financial thing rather than you doing your job
because you are you know that, you are working hard at it. They will have to
make that decision and we'll let them see how they want to go and what they
want to do but I wanted to assure you unless there's something that I don't know
about that your not doing your job, you are and I think you are doing a great job.
Whitman: And I guess as far as the financial end of it. [wasn't able to get any
kind of numbers as far as what kind of percentage of total revenue is spent in
support of the Building Department. I know I've talked with Dennis Davis over in
Nampa, indicated to me that his department spends 40 to 45 percent of all the
revenue that's come in to staff the 14 some odd people that they have in their
department. I guess some 0 fit, I had some contact earl ier this summer from
George Clomp who is Idaho Falls, and he indicated Idaho Falls is considering
going to a contract basis partly for the flexibility of staffing. They have some
different condition where their winter months are much slower over there
because their winters are much more severe. They were looking at trying to be
able to not have full time people sitting around playing computer games.
Corrie: Well we are pretty close to that 40 percent anyway so. You got a good
point there too.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Daunt I think the biggest thing is we just - I for one felt that it was time we
went ahead you know. You are a subcontract employee and if you decided to
pull out or something we could be in hot water. I think its just time Boise by doing
their things I think if by having their survey here five or six years ago and getting
Meridian City Council Spec;lal Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 47 of 90
theirs turned around is definitely as set kind of a cap of how it could be done and
I realize there's pro's and con's. I like the subcontract in a lot of ways but I also
think that looking out for the city we need to be looking ahead and I think right
now at this point is where we need to start bringing our own people on board.
Our own inspectors and stuff, now whether its going to be as efficient I can't tell
you that's going to be something - its like anything else its going to depend on
who you get in there and who's running the deal. You guys have done a
tremendous job I've absolutely never heard a complaint on you. I feel that we
have got to the point where we need to for our own protection and stuff that we
need to get on with it and get our own department of that deal going. That is
mine and whether it's right wrong or different I can't tell you. It might prove to be
something that we shouldn't have done but I don't believe it is. I think you can do
like some of these other entities and let your departments get out of hand. We've
done that in some of our departments, not very many of them because we don't
have that much money to work on but you can look over at some of these
departments in some of these other cities and right hand doesn't know what left
hand is doing. As conservative as our people are I don't think that's going to
happen around here. I don't believe we are going to allow that to happen. That
was my reasoning behind it.
Whitman: Any questions from anyone?
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess Daunt at this point it's just on the table for discussion. I know
that idea has come up for the last couple of years and so we-
Whitman: How about the last 10 I think.
Corrie: I faintly remember about ten.
De Weerd: Before my time. It has nothing to do with service.
Whitman: Good. Well thank you.
Corrie: Thank you Daunt.
Smith: At this time ladies and gentleman I'll turn it over to Brad Watson and he
can start through the engineering section.
Watson: Thank you Mr. Mayor members of the Council. Hopefully I can lighten it
up a little bit here. I need to hand something out to you before I start. Are we
ready? I'll just dive in here. This presentation doesn't look a whole different from
last year, except has a lot bigger numbers in it. We can go ahead. The Public
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 48 of 90
Works Department is composed of as you know the Water, Wastewater,
Building, and Engineering Departments. We try to over the last year sort of make
a subtle change in names where we don't have all these different departments.
We have a Public Works Department with engineering water, Wastewater and
Building divisions. Currently we 62 employees, that is down from last year simply
because MUBS is now under the Finance Department. You'll see later in the
enhancements we proposed three and a half new full time employees, which
equates to about a six and a half - well about five and a half percent staff
increase. The slide simply shows the mission statement of the Public Works
Department as a whole. It has been for the last couple years and probably will
continue to be for quite some time. One in which we plan, construct, operate,
maintain, be safe, attractive, functional facilities that contribute to the community
prosperity. We now have that up on our wall in our foyer at Public Works. Gary
made sure that everyone knows exactly w hat we are there for. It looks really
good if you haven't been over. Now we get into the real numbers of what's been
going on. I know you've seen a lot of plats come before you over the last nine to
12 months. I'm not sure we all stop and count them up at times but these are the
numbers of what's actually coming through the department as a whole. These
numbers are through the first nine months of the fiscal year. The single-family
building permits alone are up 24 percent from the same time a year before.
Commercial permits almost 50 percent higher then they were for the same period
a year before. And the total permits are about 35 percent. When we look at the
numbers through the Engineering Department its just astounding what's been
coming through. Just plan review submittals are up over 60 percent. Same for
commercial plans. As you may recall about a year, year and a half ago we
instituted review and inspection fees through I think it was June 30th it was either
May 30th or June 30th we had generated a quarter of a million dollars. All those
fees are based on the number of lots or the quantity of pipe going in the ground.
We had projected a full year revenue of about 220,000 I believe and through nine
months, we're way ahead of that. In the end that will fund about 35 40 percent of
the Public Works Engineering division. The rest of the list there just shows some
of the things that we've been doing over the last year. The list could be a lot
longer but I run out of room on the slide. I don't necessarily need to bore you
with all those smaller ones. Continue to make improvements in our plan review
permitting process. Big one that you are well aware of because you approved
the design contract with J UB is the Black Cat trunk a nd lift station. It's really
moving into full swing now as far as design and it's an exciting project. The one
administrative thing that we did that maybe not all of you know about is we
moved all the new water line construction, inspection to the engineering division.
Previous to that all sewer and drainage inspection had been from our department
and we moved the water line guys, one water line inspector to our department
and they are being cross trained so that they can just take a project and see it all
the way through and I think we are already seeing some increased efficiencies
because of that. Next slide just shows some of the highlights of the water
division over the last year. Main one to point out I guess is at the top zero
bacteria hits, no boil overs. They've increased their certification. Obviously if
\
Meridian City Council SpecH:11 Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 49 of 90
we're approving that many subdivisions they're adding a lot of commercial
accounts. The one thing on this slide that maybe we ought to emphasize is
somewhat we changed in the way we operate and design the water system.
There's a long laundry list there of projects that probably don't mean a whole lot
to you. What we've tried to do is reduce the need for new wells. The old mind
set was that we'd put a well at Ten Mile, basically every section corner and as
you look at this map on your left if we were to do that now we would need six to
seven wells immediately. Well we haven't done that and we can't do that first
because of water rights second because just the time involved to do it. What
we've done is really increased the efficiency of what we do have by optimizing
the well system extending and tying in loops for the distribution system. The
Water Department and Len Grady have been instrumental in doing this. They
enjoy it and I don't understand at all. It's getting very very high tech, it's really
cool we w ill see a slide of it here in a little bit. Some of the highlights at the
Wastewater Department, first one I guess what everybody is usually concerned
about. Zero permit violations. They have done a really good job out there. All
the stuff that we put on line over the last couple years has really helped. It is
doing what it's supposed to. Some of you may remember we had what we call a
catastrophic failure of a sewer line crossing over a creek. Well that kind of got us
to thinking maybe we should do something about that. We've slipped lined all of
the sewer crossings and make sure that those pipes stay there forever, they
don't get corroded. You'll see a picture of that here in a little while. Again there's
a long laundry list of smaller projects that we've completed or are underway. The
two big ones that everyone knows about is the White Drain Trunk and the South
Slough Trunk are completed. The facility plan update, it's the road map of
everything we are doing at the Wastewater plant. Carro[Jo Engineers came here
about a year ago almost year ago and gave you a little dog and pony show on
everything we were going to do out there for the next 20 years. I remember that
presentation went really well and everybody seemed very interested in it. Well its
still going and they are doing a really really good job. We are about 70 percent
complete with that, should have it wrapped up here in early fall and eventually
that will come back before you because it's a facility plan. There will be a public
hearing we are required by DEQ to have a public hearing so you will see that
again and see what we've been up to and that side of things. There's a little bit
more to follow up on that with when we get into the enhancements. Again just
some other projects that Johns been working on out there computerized
(inaudible) manual from what I understand is going very well. This is more of just
a summary sheet of major projects that we are doing to expand the system to
meet the continuing growth. One thing I'll point out for the second time is that
you see five wells fifth line and that seems like a lot but again if we were doing it
the way we used to we would be looking at about ten of them up there right now.
I'm going to give you some more numbers. This one just amazed me when we
pulled it up. I had Keri Glen in our department go through and count up every
invoice we have charged a review for and add up the footage of lines. When she
first emailedthistome.ldidn.t believe her. Double-checked and that's what it is
34 miles of water and 24 sewer and then combined another 12 that the city has
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 50 of 90
done over the last year. Total of 70 miles go in in one year. Like I was telling
these guys that's almost all the way to Cascade, almost. That's a fairly long
drive. This slide is what you see on the easel in front of you it is a little
misleading on how it reads the right access that goes from 0 to 140 is adding up
the commercial building permits that have been issued over the years. The blue
bars correspond to the left access that goes up to 1,400. The 2003 numbers are
simply doubling what's happened over the first six months of the calendar year.
As you can see we are at the highest levels ever both residential and
commercial. All those plats that have been approved are coming through in a big
way. This is the final statistic I think I will give you. As a matter of signing plats I
track these date in, date 0 f review, date 0 f signature that w hole thing. Well I
started thinking maybe I should add up the number of lots as well that are in my
office. Just since January first there have been 1,300 lots submitted and that
doesn't even include final plats that you have approved that haven't come to my
office yet. There is another 850 or so. In six months, we are looking at about
2,350 r esidentiall ots t hat a re being p Jatted that means they a re ready to sell.
Somebody say they are doing really well or there is going to be a lot of empty
houses this winter, we can't quite figure it out but they are proceeding through.
Commercial is just as crazy. We have over 100 lots in commercial subdivisions
just this year. I guess that wasn't the last number statistic thing. This one just
concentrates on the North Meridian area. It's amazing to me that the city can
build a sewer truck and it was like igniting a grass fire out there. This isn't even
totally up to date because of the subdivision that was approved Tuesday night. I
think it was called Birchstone. Those that have already seen preliminary plat
approval total over 1,800 acres 4,600 residential lots. It's filling up fast. Those
were the numbers here's the picture that shows what's happening up there. The
green are the preliminary plats that you have approved the blue are projects that
they are working with staff on they haven't formally submitted yet. They are
having pre-app meetings and phone calls that whole pre-design questions.
Again this isn't up to date because this one withdrew Tuesday night. However
the very next morning this guy called me to talk about how he was going to sewer
it and how he was going to submit that project. I think the next page in your
packet is just a bigger version of that. It's a little easier to read. What does that
all mean to us in our planning. As Mr. Shawcroft can point out it takes a long
time to build treatment facilities. We thought we were doing pretty well with all
the projects we had done over the last three of four years and with all this growth,
it's making me a little nervous. Its making John really nervous. We put together
this little sheet to show what we have planned that's not in this next years
enhancements but will be following in probably 05 06. On the waterside of
things, we do have to do more wells. Just not as many as we would have
previously needed. Of course we have line extensions just to increase that
efficiency. On the wastewater side of things it gets even scarier. We've got
approximately eight million dollars that's going to need to be spent over the next
three to four years. (Inaudible) not only provide additional treatment capacity but
they will provide some redundancy to John so he can take these units out of
operation and do some really mandatory maintenance on those things. There
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 51 of 90
are a couple other potential projects that Carollo is looking at as part of the
facility plan update. that may be requ ired. The big one I th ink were all really
worried about is the phosphorus removal. That 2.5 million is a shot in the dark.
And it all goes back to the Snake River Hells Canyon TMDL and how that affects
the lower Boise TMDL. Right now with the lower Boise TMDL all they did is put
limitations on sediment and bacteria and we are fine with that there are no added
requirements but the phosphorus that's a big issue. If anyone has any questions
please interrupt me.
Corrie: As head of the environmental committee for AIC. 0 n this phosphate
removal are the cities going to be responsible for everything even though they
can't even know where it's coming from?
Watson: Mr. Mayor that's a great question. I think the way they should be
structured and the implementation plan obviously hasn't been written yet but the
way it should be structured is that there would be a uniform increase across point
sources, which we a re a n on point sources. Which really equates to A G a nd
stormwater, which can be municipal, or obviously ACHD. However after that
plan is implemented and if it proves out that its not improving water quality there
is only one place to go and that's the point sources. Our consultant Carollo
Engineers has been very - it was a very good choice that we made because they
have been working in the Provo, Park City, Salt Lake area on similar issues and
we think we have it bad here on some of these water quality issues. Go to Park
City and I can't remember the name of that river but it's astounding what they
have to treat too, but they've done it so they know what we need to do here.
They are working very closely with DEQ on that issue.
Corrie: Thank you.
Watson: The bottom table on that slide is something that I just put together after
the little COMPASS summary that came out earlier this week or late last week. It
showed about two and a half years since the census an annual growth of about
eight percent. I thought well what if. That what if is in five years, five budget
years we would be looking 67,000 people. The whole reason we look at this is
because that turns into gallons at the wastewater plant and that's why weare
trying to bump up our schedule on those improvements. Following slides are just
some typical development around the city. I don't know if you all get a chance to
drive around very much and see what's happening. I don't seem to because
some of these I've never seen. Well I've seen Cedar Springs, that's pretty close
in. I think their fourth phase is coming in for plan review now. Havasu Creek,
Farwest project upon Locust Grove Road. They submitted I don't know how
many phases of this project at the same time for construction, four or five
something like that. They are going great guns. Just another couple picture of
the Tuscany Messina Hills complex out there that Westpark is doing. This is the
last one I'll bore you with. This is Bonito Subdivision used to be El Dorado that
(
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 52 of 90
Winston Moore Company is doing. Its about 80 acres that's being developed all
at once for commercial sites.
De Weerd: Why are they always changing the names to these subdivisions?
Watson: I thought that the county did reserve names up front before it was
submitted but-
(Inaudible discussion)
De Weerd: They just want to confuse us.
Watson: I think particularly in Autumn Faire Sub 0 nee it got to Mr. Priester's
office for some reason it was rejected it was too close to something else so the
engineer who is actually a friend of mine, his wife's name is Tricia, so he was just
trying to get it submitted. How about this? T hat's the story behind that 0 ne.
We'll just run through a couple of the wastewater projects. We've already
summarized them up front in this report but we have a few pictures to go a long
with the words. This is the central SCADA monitoring screen at the wastewater
plant. We have done some work on that this year that was budgeted. You'll see
enhancements we are proposing to fund that again to even further refine the
capability of this system. Anything we can do with SCADA whether its water
systems wastewater ita II increases the efficiency a nd red uces manpower a nd
reliability. Just the on going DAFF project out at the wastewater plant. This is a
bit of a hold over from last year but a year ago we had just started this project. In
fact that picture on the left you'll notice it's in last year's packet, pretty early in the
project. The picture on the right is, the pipe is in the ground, and it went right
along that dirt road by Mr. Cooper's place who has a bunch of mules I think.
Anyway I just wanted to show that to you. There are stories behind all of these
people. Speaking of stories this is the South Slough sewer and water project.
This is Carols Subdivision after its been completed believe it or not. That's what
it ended up looking like. Len Grady watched this project and I don't think I even
know all the stories that he knows out there but we got to know quite a few of
these people pretty well. It was an interesting project, it was very difficult to
coordinate. There were a lot of access issues during construction and I believe
there is an annexation application coming to you in the next month or so for
some of these properties out here. It's all done and I think 95 96 percent of the
people out there are happy with what finally got done.
De Weerd: Good.
Watson: This is just a picture of the slip lining project that I thought was pretty
interesting what it is is they have this flexible sock for lack of a better word that
they insert into a sewer line and then it has some resin in it and then they pump
heated water through it that cures the resin. It just conforms to the inside of the
pipe. It's a material that's corrosion resistant. It's really a neat process.
r
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 53 of 90
Somewhat expensive process but compared to the alternative its good. You'll
notice he's not here in the audience but our collection system manager Fred
Putzier is there in the white t-shirt chatting up the boys. Just a little more heavy
construction going 0 n 0 ut at the plant. There's been very few weeks 0 r days
even over the last seven years since I've been here that there hasn't been
something dug up out there. Just another picture. This is a little more detailed
slide of the Black Cat lift station sewer project. It shows a revised service area
based on what JUB has done already to this point. They've determined that we
can serve a little bit more west of Black Cat Road then we originally thought with
out master plan and that's just based on on the ground surveying. We're hoping
you'll see this enhancement in the wastewater section, this is probably the
biggest enhancement you'll ever see, well that you've seen so far for this project.
What we are hoping to do is if you approve that start construction on portions of
that project this winter early spring. We are going to try and break it up into four
or five different phases so that we don't have to wait for that last part to be fully
approved and designed before we can start the whole project. A couple other
smaller wastewater treatment plant projects they paved all the entrance and the
interior roads out there. They were just so torn up after all the construction over
the years that they were sinking in. So we did that project that you approved last
year. A Iso installed a standby diesel tank out there that's half full. N 0 its an
inside thing with Stacy. It's half full for sure though. A few water projects. Again
this is the telemetry screen at the Water Department that shows instantaneously
what's going on with all the wells, the reservoirs its getting again from what I
understand very advanced. Len and Chip Hudson and Jaime Allen out at the
Water Department have really put a lot of time and effort in to this. They've done
a really good job. This just shows a boring pit, we've done a lot of boring over
the last year, we had three 0 f them 0 n the South S rough project a nd we a Iso
crossed 1-84 just recently with a 16 inch water line that will really really help the
pressures in the Saint Luke's, Touchmark, Silverstone area. It was really needed
and it's going to be a good addition. I just thought that was a neat picture that
really shows the size of what goes on out there -
De Weerd: That is a neat picture.
Watson: From what I was told on this project they bored really easily about 200
feet all the way through and then they ran into problems. They had to send a guy
on a little skateboard or whatever all the way down so he could weld off the end
of it and weld new driving shoes on the end of it.
De Weerd: Wow.
Watson: I don't know how much that guy would be paid but it would have to be a
lot. That hole would look like a pin prick that far in. Anyway this is the inside of
the water tower that was coated and this I think we showed you some of this
about a year ago. It was underway at that time. This was just a neat little
i
\.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 54 of 90
picture, it shows the inside of it. I'd never seen the inside of it so thought maybe
you'd enjoy it too.
De Weerd: So how did you get the picture?
Watson: Len do you know how?
Grady: (Inaudible).
Watson: Standing at the bottom of the bulb.
De Weerd: Cool.
Corrie: You can save these pictures. I have a place for them.
Watson: These are all digital pictures. They are all saved and they can be used.
How many pictures of this do you have? A couple hundred?
Corrie: (inaudible) good thank you.
Watson: Every year we have to show you a well, pump house that's under
construction. This is this year's version. Its out at Tumble Creek number 24.
Primary purpose behind this one is to push flow to the north Meridian area.
You'll in enhancement five under the Water Department that we've included
amongst a couple other things money for an additional lot. This well lot was
donated to the city years and years ago and it's 100 by 100 which used to be the
minimum it still is the absolute minimum that DEO will accept. We've learned
that there are some cases where we need replacement wells right next to the
well house and in even some cases possibly some sort of treatment. This one is
just crammed into this little lot and the entrance off Linder Road is just north of
this one lot. There is one vacant lot between this building and the main entrance
and it's really not a very good spot for building a house. We've talked to the
developer of that and I think we've come to at least a verbal agreement on that
but you'll see some money in there for that. This is a laundry list of non-capital
improvement projects that the department has worked on over the last year.
We've updated the standards specifications and drawings last fall, issued those
to all the consultants and contractors that we could get a name for. Again we
continue to streamline plan review process almost, well is seems like daily, but its
probably just every week or two. DEO completed a state, well it's an EPA
required source water assessment of our system. This took a lot of time and that
we felt that the assessment they did was very poor. We had a hydrological
consultant draft his own source water assessment, which we were allowed to do
which was very good but they rejected. So we did get this all put to bed and
we've required or we've complied with both DEO and EPA. Gary has spent
numerous hours working with water rights and the issues with United Water and
their integrated municipal application package. That is ongoing that will continue
(.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 55 of 90
for quite a while I think. We've also started another EPA mandated project it's
the water system vulnerability analysis and that is required to be done I think next
June. Required by E PA to be done. That legislation 0 r t hat mandate was in
response to September 11th incident. We may have discussed this with you
maybe not -
***End of Side Four***
Watson: - you'll notice there's money additional money in the enhancements to
do the second part of that project next year, which is the actual safety manual,
which is really a collection of policies, and procedures that we'll implement. Then
just a couple other minor things. Plat submittal procedure and as you remember
the standardized easement acquisition policy for the Black Cat trunk. Those are
just a handful, there like I said at the beginning we could probably put three or
four pages together but those are the highlights. This next slide is one that you
didn't see last year and I just thought we'd put it in and it just kind of shows you
we do know what we are doing most of the time. We've bid probably 30 projects
over the last couple years. We did have a very very high profile project that had
some bidding irregularities and I'm sure you all remember that because the two
contractors and their attorneys were standing here in a hearing before you.
Other than that we've everything has worked very very well, we've done some
requests for proposals for professional services, those have all gone very well.
This caught my ear when the Fire Department came up a couple weeks ago that
it sounded like maybe there was a problem with (inaudible) or something. I didn't
quite understand the whole problem but I just asked Len to put together a list of
all the projects that we bid and see what our track record is. That's what it is. I
think we already talked about this as a Building Department enhancement. Okay
I get a break. I'm going to ask Rick to come up here and talk to you a little bit
about the Water Department enhancements and if you have any questions on
those either he or I will be glad to assist you and if you have any questions
before I sit down and what we have already done I'll be glad to answer those.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I really don't have any questions but I did want to take the
opportunity since a lot of the supervisors are here. First you mentioned the Fire
Department. Public Works I think the Water Department have just been
phenomenal in getting the safe house up and going. They've donated a lot of
time in helping pull the plans together, finding donations and all of that. We really
appreciate that it really showed a great collaboration between all the departments
to get that going and that's such a neat project to begin with. I appreciate that.
Also I know I had sent emails to both Rick and John when you sent out your
annual reports. I think that the work that the departments are doing is
outstanding and you know I believe that the Mayor said at the time that it isn't
/
(
Meridian City Council SpecIal Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 56 of 90
until we have something fail that we really realize how important the behind the
scene work really is.and so that is very much appreciated. With regards to Public
Works I know every time we approve something, we really don't understand the
implications it has on our staff time. The numbers that you have pulled together
just really underscore how demanding the work is that you all do and what you
pull together and its very appreciated. How you got through the South Slough
and the White Trunk work I think those have been projects that since Cherie and
I have been on have been talked about, its nice to see those coming to
completion and seeing that you get to now move on to the Ten Mile Trunk or
Black Cat Trunk, that's just exciting.
Watson: Thank you.
De Weerd: Just an appreciation for jobs well done.
Watson: Thank you. I appreciate those comments. There are probably a lot of
people here that should be hearing that that aren't. That is doing a lot more of
the work then just us.
Corrie: To piggyback on that I just thought about if the Council would be willing is
to have department heads do this twice a year rather then once a year to really
inform us of what's going on. Once a year is great but twice a year you get better
exposure to what you guys and gals are really doing. I think if the Council might
agree or they might not but I think that's what - we can take an afternoon and
invite the public too to hear it and see what we are really doing. We got to toot
our own horn a little bit here. You guys are doing a great job and let them know
about it. We get a lot of the complaints but they don't here the good parts. Think
about that. It's a lot of work for you but its good (inaudible).
Watson: Well thank you. I don't think that's a bad idea at all. The opportunity
rarely arises. I'm sort of sadistic in that I look forward to these to let you know
what's going on.
Corrie: Good.
Watson: Because the opportunity doesn't arise to let that.
De Weerd: Weill know that John doesn't.
Corrie: I don't know about the sadistic part but.
Watson: I'm dragging Donny and Danny and (inaudible) and all these guys every
time. It is good we don't bring these things up quite a bit because you have a lot
on your plate. This is kind offun.
Corrie: Thank you.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 57 of 90
Watson: I guess if there are no more questions I'll have Rick come up here and
we'll start going through water.
Corrie: Okay.
WATER DEPARTMENT
Clinton: Mr. Mayor, members of the Council. Thank you Brad. Do we need a
seventh inning stretch or are we doing okay?
Bird: Fine.
De Weerd: Still can't get used to you without all that hair on your face.
Clinton: Well wait a few months. I'll start it in September.
Nary: The whole subject has us on the edge of our seats.
De Weerd: No that's sewer.
Clinton: Well I would like to take an opportunity to first of all to somewhat
capitalize - can everybody hear me okay? Okay. To capitalize on Mayor
Corrie's comment. If I could ask Don Case I've got a visual aid that I'd like to
have s end a rou nd to somewhat demonstrate t he val ue 0 f the product that we
deliver to the customers. To somewhat put some perspective on price of a gallon
of water.
Nary: We need that for the public record.
Corrie: This is coming from water not from wastewater?
Clinton: Correct. Wastewater will follow.
De Weerd: We hope it was a little bit-
Clinton: That's for display purposes only?
De Weerd: Rick I hope it's easier to understand then that letter you sent out.
What all those levels meant. I think it was good. Well Gary's cover memo said it
was good.
Clinton: In a nutshell with our current rates one penny will buy you 10 gallons of
water.
McCandless: Clear water?
I
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 58 of 90
Clinton: Clear water. " It's probably worth pointing out to that the bottled water is
not subjected to the testing requirements that the drinking water is.
De Weerd: That's cool.
Clinton: Thank you.
De Weerd: We need to just set it up here.
Clinton: Well what I actually would hope to be able to do is that after this
presentation is I've spoke to Leslie about actually placing it as a display on the
MUBS counter so that it somewhat emphasizes and that's why the display only
disclaimer at the bottom.
De Weerd: You may want to change the water every couple days.
Clinton: Exactly.
De Weerd: Just so it doesn't turn green or anything.
Corrie: I'm going to ignore that remark. If you would like to put a gallon a week
in my office, I'll take it.
Nary: Maybe we should be selling that as some way to make money.
Clinton: Well it's prompted some interest. I guess I'll start out here with
enhancement Number 1. I t's increasing a p art time office person to full time.
Primarily our interest is in addressing additional customer service needs with this
increased comes increased demands on our staff across all aspects. This is just
a way to try and continue to improve our customer service. I'll keep moving
along and I do recall from last year some interest or appreciation for not dragging
this 0 ut so I'll keep moving if you guys have any questions you can s top me.
Enhancement Number 2. This is a request for an additional work person
position. One thing that's probably worth pointing out, currently in the State of
Idaho it is now mandatory for water certification and there's really no place you
can go and take schooling and achieve operator certification to a level two, three
or four. It's very similar to an apprenticeship program. These work person
positions are very important to us. They are an entry-level position that allows a
good qualified individual to start learning the trade and working their way through
the certification process because there is no real pool of personnel out there
other then the purveyors to provide these operators. Number 3. This is the
capital outlay for existing wells. v I think Brad touched a little bit on the telemetry
upgrades. It really came to my attention yesterday through a little bit of an issue
that our telemetry system is - and the improvements to our telemetry system are
very valuable. We had some flow problems yesterday, we were able to - Len
{
Meridian City Council Specll;l1 Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 59 of 90
and Chip and Jaime were able to really key in on what was going on with our
wells because of these enhanced improvements to the telemetry system. If there
were technical questions I'd have to refer them to Len, he's the man to ask those
questions to but its certainly improving the productivity of the wells or the
efficiency of the wells as Brad had addressed minimizing the need for new wells.
Number 4. Number 4 is consulting. Probably t he biggest 0 ne is 0 ur Ram W
consulting which I think Brad had addressed a little bit earlier. It is a mandate I
think it originally came through the homeland security from the 911 incident.
We've got a pretty tight timeline on that and it's a very significant task we need to
achieve. The safety manual I think Brad addressed a little bit already. One thing
I think is real important to address here is that I'm asking for half of the funds
from Water, John will be asking for the other half for Wastewater and we really
need to balance those so that both ends are funded so that we can achieve the
completion of this manual. I think in one of the past years I was funded, Jon
wasn't, and that handicapped us. If I can point that out. The last one is water
rights (inaudible). Number 5. Water main extensions are a big one. Public
Works has been very, very, very active in putting a lot of water main in the
ground. There is a very substantial list in your enhancements that there's a lot of
water main that - I'm very proud of the distribution system that's being developed.
Number 6 is addition of two more wells. Actually, each of these were partially
funded last year and this is just the remaining funding to allow us to complete
these two wells. I believe that actually concludes the enhancement request for
the Water Department. Are there questions?
Corrie: There was one that you had a homeland security mandate. There are
grants, I mean not grants but payments by homeland security I think we might
look at. I get them every so often in my email and I'm going to send those over
to you and then let you maybe follow up on or if you need my help to follow up on
them. They are asking that they can pay for some of them - I haven't seen a lot
of money yet, but they've appropriated a lot of money but nobody seems to get it
yet. I'll send them over to you.
Clinton: Okay. One of the critical things with that is the timeline and securing the
funds.
Corrie: Right.
Clinton: Because of our deadline.
Corrie: They pay you back. That's what we like to have.
Clinton: Does anybody else have any other questions? Thank you very much.
De Weerd: Thank you. Wish I could of given you a hard time but.
i
Meridian City Council SpeclClI Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 60 of 90
Corrie: Well from what I understand it's coming later, we want to give you a hard
time. They'll understand what I meant by that after a bit.
Clinton: I'll turn it over to John.
WASTEWATER DEPARTMENT
(Inaudible discussion)
Shawcroft: As Rick pointed out it seems like we just did this a year ago.
De Weerd: It's always good to start with (inaudible), right?
Shawcroft: Well it is my pleasure to present the Wastewater enhancements for
the upcoming budget year. We exist as it says to provide reliable, continuous,
safe and economical sewer service to our customers. We protect public health
downstream water users and the environment, in a nutshell. My first
enhancement is to ask for two operators. One of them being a chief operator
and the other, it says level three but we say that in case we can hire one, it'll
probably be a level one or a level two operator. That seems to be what will
probably be available. We are doing this - one thing we want to do is to go to a
24 hour a day manning the plant that will decrease our response time in case
something goes wrong. This is because of the complexity of the wastewater
plant has increased over the years. Another thing it does is it enhances the
security of the wastewater plant. As the city has grown the subdivisions have
continued to come closer and closer and closer and so we can see where one
vandal or a couple of them getting in when we're not there could really screw
things up. With the investment that we have in this wastewater plant, it just
seems appropriate that we take action and protect that investment. Also right
now Rick's involved with Ram W, the wastewater part is coming down the road
and right now. I think May of this year wastewater certification for operators
became mandatory. Out of the 50 states, we were the last one to give in and
adopt that.
Nary: Big surprise. So John with the two people that'll put you to being able to
be 24 hours.
Shawcroft: Yes we will be able to rearrange the scheduling of all the people we
have and get 24 hour a day, seven-day a week operation or manned operation.
One of the other things that it will do is to lighten the workload of my present chief
operator who puts in probably in the neighborhood of 55 or 60 hours a week and
has supervises what is it Brent 13 people? 12, which means all the
administrative duties, go along with that as well not just the operation of the plant.
It's significant. Enhancement two is small wastewater plant upgrades. These
are the small things we like to improve every year. One is a genset Number 1
relocation, its generator Number 1 is a 1 978 vintage so it's i n the mechanical
(
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17,2003
Page 61 of 90
building and it currently is in t he way 0 fa dding any more equipment into that
building. One of the easiest things to do is just move and we do have a place
just outside the building that we could locate it to. Standby digester mixer, its
actually a spare mixer, a whole complete there. We have four of them two on
each digester, one on each side and to get parts and to repair it usually takes
several days. While that's out then that digester loses efficiency. What we
propose to do is to buy a whole complete one, change it out if we have to and
then work on the other one at leisure. (Inaudible) building air conditioning. Its
not really an air conditioning, we just need some methodology to tone down the
heat inside that building on the hottest parts of the summer we do have some of
our blowers tripping on high temperature. We need to lower that overall
temperature inside the building. Add a digester condensate removal, right now
we do burn our methane after we run it through a scrubber. Because of the high
temperatures that we run our digesters at its 135 degrees a 133 degrees
Fahrenheit we get a lot of water in the gas and it comes over and what it tends to
do is bleed the scrubber media out and reduce its effective life. And when we
run that scrubber and burn methane we save about 4,000 dollars a month on
natural gas costs so it's well worth getting the water out. We want to enclose a
couple of truck bays. The bays that exist are just open to the atmosphere and
not heated and it would allow us to make sure that in the middle of winter what
we put in there will start. Of course, we want to pave the approach to the fuel
tank and that 5,OOO-gallon fuel tank is currently being utilized by water and
wastewater in our emergency generators. We figure on a total power outage we
can keep services up and running for about a week if that thing is full when we
start. All right. Enhancement three, consulting of professional services. Here
again is the safety manual that's the funding for the wastewater half of that.
NPDES permit application is due to EPA April 4, 2004. That's in this budget to
prepare that. That's a document that when we send it its about a inch and a half
thick. The bio solids permit is due at the same time, in fact it maybe due just a
hair earlier. The pretreatment program EPA is requiring us at this current time to
revisit our local limits that are in our pretreatment ordinance and that's going to
require some sampling and some calculations and we need a consultant to help
us to do that. The last two. The ONM manual and the SCADA expansions are in
the professional services part and since they are non capital the monies cannot
be carried forward so we have to rebudget for that. That's just to complete those
projects that we funded last year. Mobile lift station generator we need to buy
another trailer mounted generator. We currently have one and it's a 40 KW set
but it will not start the pumps at Ashford Greens lift station. In an extended
power outage, we can pump every lift station but that one. What we intend to do
is buy another one that will start those pumps and will also give us redundancy
because it will also run all the other lift stations as well so we can be out there in
a power outage with two generators routinely walking through and pumping the
lift stations down. Keeping people in sewer service. Lift station SCADA system
right now we go out twice a day to every lift station and how many are there?
13? See I always got 13 stuck in my head. 12. What we intend to do is radio
link those to our SCADA system and by doing that we can see how the pumps
Meridian City Council SpecJClIBudget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 62 of 90
are performing and watch the levels pump up and down and we can reduce our
visits to once a week .instead of twice a day. Build out improvements. As Brad
alluded to we are doing the facility plan this Carollo Engineers and we are
headed for the five MGD mark. Last year we treated 1.5 billion gallons of
sewage and we can typically build a trunk main in about a year and a half but to
build a clarifier or anything in plant takes two and a half to three years. We have
to be ahead of that curve and so that's what this is designed to do. Not only
complete the facility plan and present that to DEQ but also to get ahead of our
growth curve. Slack Cat trunk line lift station I'm going to turn this over to Brad
this is more his fun stuff.
Smith: Mr. Mayor and Council. I need to leave. Before I go though I do want to
say a very special thank you for all your support in the past. We don't get where
we are without that. Again I also extend a very special thank you to all of our
staff and the work that they do, the results that we have that we are very proud of
has just directed proportional to their abilities and their knowledge and I'm very
appreciative of that personally so thank you very much.
Shawcroft: And before I relinquish the microphone. I too would like to extend my
thank you to Dan Higgs and Brent Grover. Although I run a wastewater
department these two gentlemen run the wastewater plant. And they are the
reason that we had zero violations last year. Thank you.
De Weerd: Good job.
Watson: I believe we are on the Black Cat enhancement. ] gave you a
forewarning earlier t his a fternoon a bout the immensity 0 f t hat one. I think we
plugged in six million dollars for that project. That was the estimate that JUS put
together when they did the Ten Mile Interchange sewer study about a year ago.
What we intend to do here in the next couple months is convene what we are
calling a finance steering committee and I think I've warned you about this before
too. We are hoping to have the help of the Attorneys office, the Finance
Department and at least one Councilperson to sit in on that. Take the place of
the Fence Committee I guess.
De Weerd: Bill is under the assigned (inaudible).
Corrie: Get rid of the fences (inaudible).
Watson: That's what I figured. Although we are requesting funding of this
project out of the fund balance we do want to put together a steering committee
that would figure out how these properties will contribute to the project once they
are either annexed or whatever trigger mechanism there is. I guess that's the
point of the steering committee. We hope to have not only those members but
maybe a developer or two that has property or is interested in property in that
area, maybe a consulting engineer that works with developers quite a bit come in
Meridian City Council SpeclClI Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 63 of 90
and sit on that. There will be a plan in place to recoop that money but what we
are asking for in interest in getting this project started and constructed is funding
of six million. Before I goo n I can certainly a nswer a ny questions you might
have on that. There's enhancement number eight is the slide on the screen
doesn't match the slide that's in your book. I updated it at the 1 1lh h our this
morning or late yesterday. These are just a few of the projects that are separate
from the Black Cat trunk. Three of the four are joint projects that we will be doing
with ACHD Franklin Road rebuild, Locust Grove rebuild and they are also doing a
drainage project down 3rd Street and across Broadway that I think we are going
to have to do some sewer replacement or remediation on. The fourth one is a
catch all there isn't a designated project that goes with that 200,000 dollars but it
seems like every year something comes up either during applications or
something where we need to build something. We have kind of kept that in
there. Well the last couple years we've had this line item called sewer line
extensions, which was supposed to be for the white trunk, and with your approval
we've been using that for these other small projects. A good example would be
the Locust Grove sewer extension up to the Charter High School that they're
building. Valley Life Christian Church is up there as well. The last one is one
that didn't make it into the Finance Department and it is therefore not in your
budget packets. If you read that it will sort of explain what has happened, as you
most certainly will recall during the Paramount Subdivision annexation public
hearing the issue of sewer easements was first and for most in everyone's mind,
I think at least for a while. During that testimony I suggested that perhaps the
city should initiate this project to complete the North Sloug h Trunk sot hat we
didn't have a 0 ne-mile square island 0 ut in no mans land. My selfish reason
behind that is so I don't have a bunch of lift station proposals coming in on that
section of land as well. [brought this before you and I probably should've given
Stacy some forewarning on this but I plugged it in a day or two ago bringing this
more for discussion sake then anything. [do have an estimate in there of about
1.02 million that if you direct us to we will certainly put that in. I'll move on if there
are no questions on that.
Bird: You're putting in aren't you?
Watson: Excuse me?
Bird: You are putting it in aren't you?
Watson: Because this came after we submitted to finance I will put it in if you
direct me too and Stacy allows me too.
Bird: I think we need to. I think this is something t hat's very very important.
Something that's going to be happening.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 64 of 90
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess the only question I'd have is we're talking about that fairly large
project of Black Cat of putting some of that money aside in this next budget year
towards that. I mean just from a management standpoint is this of that same
magnitude, is this going to be something realistically that can really be done to
any degree in the next budget year or do you think its something that really we
need to do some preliminary stuff at this point? You just don't want to get your
plate so full that really - that you are kind of strapped by everything.
Watson: Sure, appreciate that. The plate is already really really full so I'm not
sure the magnitude of this project-
Nary: You need a bigger plate.
Watson: Right we need a bigger plate. The magnitude of this project would be
equivalent to say half of the White Trunk project. I mean it's big but it's not even
close to the same magnitude as the Black Cat project. The hardest part of this
project would in my soul opinion will be easement acquisition. Design will not be
difficult at all. Construction once the easements are granted should not be
difficult at all.
Nary: So in that projected easement legal costs there if you are saying that's - [
mean is that an adequate number, obviously it's a guesstimate to some degree
anyway but and is that done in house or is that done through consultants? Isn't
that how we've done them. Well I guess we've done them both ways depending
on the magnitude.
Watson: Right. Council Member Nary I think anything we do of any magnitude is
going to be through a consultant, the easement acquisition process. When I say
the easement acquisition will be the most difficult part I don't necessarily mean
the costs or the - I'm trying to be politically correct here.
Nary: Or the time it takes to get that.
Watson: There may be some ideological differences between the proposed
grantors and we. If we were to do that through consultants or something then
that would at least wouldn't add the same level to your plate. It just seems to me
that if we divide up to many things all at once it just really straps you even more
then what you have to do. If that's something were the biggest bulk of the project
is going to be working through those issues of easement acquisition and they're
done through an outside consultant then that sounds like that would at least
won't raise the level of your departments workload more then the normal
everyday strapped workload that you have now.
Meridian City Council SpeCral Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 65 of 90
Watson: Right J think you've hit it square. It will increase the workload no doubt
because we have ~ to coordinate and evaluate everything they submit and
everything they propose to do but we have learned a tremendous amount on the
White Trunk and the South Slough projects on how to handle these. It's been
very educational and I think we're not perfect but we are getting better.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess what Councilman Nary is brought up is this needs to be kind
of your call. If you feel that your staff is not going to be overloaded by adding this
to the budget request then you know we would be willing to support that request.
We just don't want it to overburden the staff that we get low moral or you know
you can't do it al.
Watson: Right Council Member de Weerd. The alternative in this particular case
is I alluded to you earlier is I get four, five or six different proposals for lift stations
in that area and those affect me personally more then this project would because
those are huge time consumers.
De Weerd: I don't see why that would be an issue if we don't have services there
and we have a designated line that those go on it can't be built yet. Unless they
want to bring the line out there themselves.
Watson: Unfortunately the way the process works and maybe its fortunate for
you you don't get to see this. Is that these proposals come in and they want to
meet with me. I tell them no, they go hire an engineer and they do some
preliminary engineering, they submit it to me and I have to evaluate it and tell
them its ultimately the Councils decision but my recommendation will be no.
Then they say okay, then they prepare the application and they will come to you
and we will still say no. It still work, even if I say no up front on a lift station they
can still bring it to you. The application that was withdrawn Tuesday night was
that very case. Where I met with them repeatedly over the course of a couple
months and evaluated what they did and told them no no no. It went all the way
forward until it was right before you. They withdrew so it is work.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I think again too as Council member Bird said a minute ago. I mean if we
don't at least consider it this year we will be considering it next year. I mean I
think it's more of a division of work and can the work get all done. I guess from
what I'm hearing is this isn't really going to raise the bar tremendously as some
of these other ones will. I mean so its doable is what I guess I'm sort of hearing.
Meridian City Council SpeclClI Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 66 of 90
Watson: I think it's doable and I guess when it comes right down to it my
recommendation would be to include it. It may not be done in fiscal year 04
completed but if I can tell a developer out there that this is funded and it's a city
project and to just wait we don't want your lift station wait that goes a long ways.
De Weerd: So it's going to be a wash essentially. Either if we don't fund it you'll
spend the time and fighting the applicants against it and if we do do it you can do
it a little bit more on your time.
Watson: If it is funded right I can usually manage to put them off and say have
some patience it's coming. Just a summary of what John talked about is listed
out there for quick reference if you want to tab that sheet for future reference. On
the North Slough I guess I will proceed to prepare on enhancement number nine
and submit it to the Finance Department to include in your packets unless I hear
otherwise.
Corrie: Good.
Watson: All right we've got one more little section. Well medium sized section to
go through if you want to take a break. I'm in no hurry but I can certainly go
through it if you are ready.
Bird: Let's go.
Corrie: Go ahead.
Watson: All right. We are going to jump into the engineering division
enhancements. These are pretty mundane most of them. First one I don't
actually remember what the dollar value is pretty small its just some
housekeeping things that we need to take care of. We learned that when we
move water inspection to our department and all the tools that they come with we
don't have any place to secure those tools. We need to enclose the pickups that
they have the beds with some shells so that they can lock those up. The rest of it
is just more furniture basically in our department. Our file cabinets are full are
plan racks are full and we just got stuff stacked on floors to much right now.
Enhancement Number 2 is the addition of two field inspectors as I mentioned we
moved one of the two water line inspectors who engineering so we have three
field inspectors now. Whereas four people were doing it previously so what we
were trying to do is fill the one that didn't come over in addition with all the city
projects and just the overall growth rate we are feeling like that we probably need
a fifth one. These guys are out in the field so much right now that we are finding
that perhaps there a dministrative responsibilities, record keeping, updating the
drawings is perhaps to the point we would like it to be. We want to make sure
these guys get some office time and are able to do that. We have two new field
inspectors slotted in there. Enhancement Number 3 is really the only big one
Meridian City Council SpeciClI Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 67 of 90
that we have and I think there is some interest on the Council about this project.
Len can probably speak to it a lot more clearly then I can but last year you
funded a needs assessment a GIS needs assessments and HGR Engineers
completed that. Basically it was a road map to tell us three things. What we
need in terms of software, hardware and personnel to have a computer based
GIS system that would meet what we told them we wanted it to do. And what we
told them we wanted it to do was be a platform where we had not only land use
which would include property owner just all the stuff that comes with Archview
that I think a lot of you are familiar with. Also to incorporate facilities, computer
modeling that Len and I do, maintenance inventories that John's staff does. Rick
has a lot of stuff that he does whether its tracking complaints, brown water calls,
they track a bunch of stuff I don't know what it is. But it's a lot. We are trying to
figure out a place where we can have all of that information in one spot. Right
now if somebody comes into our department and asks about this sewer line on
East 3rd Street north 0 f Broadway or whatever I don't know anyplace. Those
poor ladies at the front they have no idea where to start. They come back and
they ask Bruce Stewart what project was that put in with? He doesn't know, well
actually he does know but if he's not there, he knows everything. They'll ask me
they'll ask Gary they'll ask Bruce they just go on down the line, This is how we
find plans right n ow. I s who ahs been a rou nd long enough tor emember that
project and who did it. Rick could probably talk to that one for hours. When I first
came to work here I bugged him way too much. Anyway that's the goal of this
and we are proposing 150,000 dollars to get going in this. It includes money for
both consulting which is how to build a system and it includes money for
hardware. Fourth and final enhancement is pretty small. This GPS unit goes
somewhat hand in hand with GIS we are just kind of getting our foot in the door
with both of them. This is I think Submeter GPS unit that we are going to rotate
amongst couple different departments and personnel including inspectors,
(inaudible), perhaps meter readers. Just to see how we can use that data so that
they can locate things in the field bring it in and we download it and we know
exactly where it is. The way we are doing record drawings right now is probably
not really efficient, its much better then it was five years ago but there are still
things that we don't know where they are. Or we don't know precisely where
they are, I think if that's a success in another year you'll probably see us here
asking for multiple GPS units. That's followed just by a slide of summary slide.
We are getting to the end. We started out with a mission statement. We'll wind it
down with what I think was our vision statement in our strategic plan. We don't
see it easing up in terms of growth and in terms of expectations or in terms of
regulatory complaints. Those are the three driving factors that make us do
everything we do. I'm not quite sure of this is mission, vision or exactly what it
was but I think it was in our strategic plan. This is our final feel good statement of
the whole packet. I think-
***End Of Side Five***
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17,2003
Page 68 of 90
Watson: - I liked it so we kept it in there. That's it. I guess in closing I would just
like to thank you all Jor your patience this went longer then I thought it was going
to. We had a lot of good questions and appreciate it. One thing to point out Gary
gives me credit for this packet but a lot of the information comes from John, Rick,
Len they are the ones that are actually pulling this stuff together. Also, Kari Glen
at our office she was about to pull her hair out this morning because I had more
slides I had to insert. She had those books made brought it back and I told her
that. At arms length. She did a lot of work on this, did a very good job.
De Weerd: Well please tell her thank you.
Watson: We will.
Bird: Thank you Brad for a nice job.
Watson: The very last thing I just slipped in the back just a little sheet that comes
out of the magazine from Water Environment Federation called Pipe Dreams and
I won't read it 1'1[ just let it speak for itself. Thank you if you have any other
questions let me know.
Corrie: Very well done. Questions.
Bird: I have none.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I just have one. Brad I was looking through this and one of the things that
I guess I'm more just curious about is - I don't know what the expense is I
couldn't remember when I looked through here but you know as long as I've
known you guys have a Iways rented space, you folks have moved space this
year for your department and such and I guess I'm curious as to with all the other
things that have gone on. Has there been discussion on permanent space for
that so that we weren't paying rent anymore?
Watson: My take on it Councilman Nary is that the Engineering Division and
Building Department would eventually be moved into a permanent City Hall.
Something that has been discussed is a permanent facility for the Water
Department either increasing the size out there or finding a new location. With
Lyman's school out there their very cramped to the point where they can't hire
new people because there's no space. That's kind of apart from what you asked
me. There are discussions a bout facilities are own facilities the Public Works
from and maybe Mayor Corrie can speak to this better then I can. I've left that
pretty much to Gary but I think that was my understanding is that we would
permanently move in to City Hall at some point.
Meridian City Council SpeCICl! Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 69 of 90
Nary: Thanks.
Corrie: Thank you.
Watson: Thank you.
PLANNING AND ZONING DEPARTMENT
Powell: Well Stacy called me earlier this afternoon and asked me to make a brief
presentation. I certainly don't have everything prepared with overheads like a
fancy response. I think I'm fortunate in what my staff does is that we are before
you on a regular basis or at least the end result of our work is before you on a
weekly basis and I think you can appreciate the time and the thought and the
care that goes into preparing all those applications. I think you have a good feel
for most of what we do and the numbers that Gary and Brad showed regarding
the subdivision plats I think speak to the Planning Department as well. I don't
know if you noticed a recent article in the Statesman about the population growth
for the different cities and how basically the physical number of growths between
Boise and Meridian was the same and their planning staff is probably three times
larger then ours. I think it's a real sign that they are moving these through
efficiently, getting the work done and moving them on for you to make decisions
regarding the growth for the community. I think they s pent most of their time
since they were short a leader most of the year. They spent most of their time
just kind of trying to keep the applications in process. There were a few things
that I wanted to point out that they did get done. Our new enforcement officer
has gone great guns in just jumping in, defining the job for himself. He's done a
great job answering questions for - kind of reacting to complaints but also a great
proactive job at particularly the sign ordinance and enforcing that. We are
working now to kind of broaden his understanding of the zoning ordinance so that
he can work proactively on other things as well on ones that - he's learning but
we got him doing that. He's going out with the staff now on site visits and just
kind of looking around so that they can kind of point out to him what they see as
violations and so he's working on that and he's doing a great job. I also believe
the wireless communication ordinance went through this year which would have
been a big job. The sigh ordinance is just ready to get into the process and you'll
see that soon. I know Brad spent a lot of time working with various businesses
on revising that sign ordinance. Steve and his work with the MDC may not be
quite as evident to you but he has spent a lot of time on the design standards
and working with that group to get that organization moving along. As part of that
Steve and I have been working on getting a parking study done for MDC and
we've got a consultant figured out that's going to kind of help us do the work and
then we are going to hire an intern to walk around town and count parking
spaces. I think we've got that figured out within this year's budget. Also as part
of that we are looking at new aerial photos for the city. COMPASS has asked us
to participate in that and hopefully those aerials will work for the parking study as
(
Meridian City Council SpeclClI Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 70 of 90
well. It depends on when they were taken, we are investigating that right now.
We are also in the" process of hiring a new planner. The turnout was
phenomenal for that planner position. I guess it was a good time to be looking
for a planner because we just had ten exceptional candidates with educational
background as well as great experience in city planning. We know we are going
to have a great new planner two its just we don't know who it is yet. It's going to
be a guy we know that much. We start interviews tomorrow and we have one
more on Monday. We should be able to know by the end of next week hopefully
who that will be. They've also hired a new Planning Director I hear and so far
that seems to be going well.
De Weerd: Depends on who you talk to.
Powell: Yes. You know I knew I had a great staff when I took the job but it is
why I took the job. I just knew they were a great crew and I was really looking
forward to working with them. What I didn't expect or what I didn't know is how
great the rest of everybody was going to turn out to be. Just the reception I've
got has been so warm and so wonderful and I just wanted to thank you all for
that. I'm very encouraged and very excited about being the Planning Director for
the City of Meridian and to that end for the last couple months, its almost three
months actually. Aside from learning how to work the overhead projectors I have
been doing some other things. I took some time just assessing the staff potential
and asking them what do you want to be when they grow up and just finding out
what was driving them, what they wanted to do, what they weren't doing in their
current jobs and trying to set aside some expectations 0 n what I expect from
them and then also what they can expect from me. Related to that I have an
education and training are very important to me so we've been discussing that
and we've set up a few things, all the Planning and Zoning Commission
members are now AP A members and will be receiving that magazine so it can
kind of further their training and the planning field. My administrative assistant is
now enrolled at BSU, she's going to get her associates degree so that was kind
of exciting for her and I thought that was great. Steve is now a member of the
landscape architecture and Joe and Wendi, Sonya, and Brad are all going to
various conferences. There has been an emphasis there just setting aside or
finding out what was important for them and I think they have really appreciOated
that more then anything so far just that feeling they are being trained and they
are valued. On the trip back from Coeur d' A'lene its probably a good thing I
drove up there because the 10 hour trip back was really a great time for me to
reflect on what I wanted to do for the department. Aside from the strategic, plan
things just really kind of what I wanted to do. I sat down, I wrote out an operating
philosophy, and I forwarded that to the staff to give them an idea of what was
important to me when I was assigning work tasks. When I was purchasing
things, when I was looking at the budget, when we were talking about the
strategic plan just so that they knew okay this is where I'm coming from. In a
nutshell that is when a developer comes up with a great project I want them to
say you know this would be a great project for Meridian. 1 want them to have that
Meridian City Council SpeCial Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 71 of 90
trust, that comfort that they can come to us with a new innovative project and
really do great things .and to do that I need to have great staff and we need to
have some better standards and we'll work on those. That's where I'm coming
from. To that end, I've compiled a list of projects that was a compellation of
things from some joint meetings and also from the Comprehensive Plan, the
immediate action items only and just other things that we've been asked to the
last few months and it was about two pages long. I'm going to be coming to you
and asking you for some help in prioritizing those list of things so that we can
jump in and start moving. That's where I'm at, I've done my fact finding I'm ready
to jump in and get some work done. That's all.
Corrie: Anna you are doing a great job so far.
Powell: Well thank you.
Corrie: I think you will in the future too and we've been very fortunate to have
three new ones here that's all panned out to be real good and I know-
(Inaudible discussion)
Corrie: Back there in the Finance part - Finance of course has helped this one
immensely. I'll tell you that. I'm always amazed at 180 employees getting this
much done. Whenever I talk to other Mayors they say they are amazed that we
only have 180 employees for a town of 42,000. They may have 40,000 and they
got 300 or 400 employees. I ask them what they do all the time and they said
they have a lot of coffee drinkers and the coffee shops are employed there. I do
want to say for the record that we got a tremendous bunch of employees that's
just great and I want to see that we take care of them and do them right and I'm
sure the Council feels the same way and they will too. We will have this budget
here pretty soon and thank you all.
Powell: Thank you.
McCandless: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. McCandless.
McCandless: I just wanted to say that I am absolutely positive and I'm sure the
Council joins me in the fact that we found the right person when we hired Anna.
We are very very proud of you thank you. I'd also like to say that I'm very
grateful to the Public Works staff and to John and to Rick and to Brad and Gary
and for putting up with me for the last two years and teaching me so much.
Nary: I feel your pain.
McCandless: So thank you very much I think you guys are great.
Meridian City Council Speclel Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 72 of 90
Corrie: Thank you. ~ I will add that there isn't a time when I haven't picked up the
phone and called an employee that didn't have an answer for me and it was the
right answer. They didn't make one up. They knew what they were doing and
they do know what they are doing. Again I want to thank all of you, everybody.
Anybody else.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: This may surprise you. I was the one that asked about Planning and
Zoning. I guess I was curious about was that the fact that there wasn't any real
enhancements and such. I think you've explained that real well, as to how you
folks are meeting all the needs, so I think that's really great. I really appreciate
that.
Powell: And part of that was I got here late in the process and I actually haven't
thought about it much. I can see that as - I think we got a lot of preliminary plats
done and has the Final Plats come in I don't know if its going to be to
overwhelming or not. You know next year I would imagine I'll be asking for a
new planner, the problem is I don't have space for one. You know I'm not quite
sure what we are going to be doing there.
Nary: And I would echo the same thing that both the Mayor and Council member
McCandless said. I mean the work is tremendous that you and your staff all do.
I mean we see it every week. We probably don't acknowledge it as often as we
should but that it really is excellent. That's really, what makes the city go you
know at least in that arena. One of the areas on the base budget that we've had
discussion with in the past that are surprisingly near and dear to me is the legal
costs that are a part of your departments budget and seems my recollection in
the past and I guess this is more of an area to sort of keep in the for front. Is part
of that legal cost I think eventually was supposed to decrease as the planners
time and expertise increased because they would be doing less of the stuff that's
been prepared by legal in the past that they charge us for, preparation of findings
and (inaudible) would be done by your staff rather then the legal staff as a cost
saving measure and I noticed that here its increased again and it's a fairly small
increase amount but I mean it is just one of those things that what we are looking
down the road and costs and operational costs. That's something] know that we
have at least looked at and tried to evaluate and I know its more of a discussion
probably for you and the City Attorney as to how to kind of keep a hold on that so
it doesn't become a runaway train.
Powell: Well I think that there's certainly room there for staff to take over a lot
more of that work actually. Some of it depends on your comfort as a Council in
how those are prepared. I mean the City of Meridian, I don't know of any other
r
Meridian City Council Specj81 Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 73 of 90
city that has their legal staff do all their findings of fact and conclusions of law.
They look very different from any other cities. I mean they are much lengthier. I
think there is an opportunity to not have them be quite so legalistic I mean
everybody else seems to get by with them not being quite such the legal
document. I would think you could do the same. Generally, the Development
Agreements are the only ones where the legal staff is completely immersed in
those. I think there is great opportunity there, if I ask Bill he's going to want them
done the way that - I'm sorry the City's Attorney - He's going to want them done
the way that they are probably currently done. It may be advantageous to have
perhaps you Councilman Nary meet with both 0 f us to discuss how we could
maybe come to a compromise on how those are structured because I do think it
would be more efficient for staff to do it as well as perhaps more accurate.
Especially coming from Planning and Zoning going to the Council because they
are there, they heard the discussion, its not one person trying to communicate to
their administrative assistant. Not that there are a Jot of errors that occur. J just
think it helps when you are there at the hearing and to understand what
happened.
Nary: Everything else I think has just been great and even the changes and the
enhancements even in the short time you've been there, I mean we've seen it. It
has been a very very positive thing. I mean it really has been a good thing for
the city with you being here and I think that's great.
Powell: Thank you.
Nary: Good luck on the priority thing. If I know the rest of us up here it'll be one
(inaud ibJe).
Powell: And I forwarded the list to the Mayor (inaudible) what should I do with
the list. We'll see what his answer is.
De Weerd: I keep trying to keep her grounded and you guys are just kind of
puffing her up there.
(Inaudible discussion)
Nary: Well she is here on Tuesday night's too so she knows (inaudible).
De Weerd: He can be short-lived Anna, take it while you can. Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mrs. de Weerd.
De Weerd: I guess I see the transit contributions here. Where is COMPASS?
Where are the COMPASS contributions? On Anna's budget. I thought
COMPASS somehow came out of P and Z in the past.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 74 of 90
Kilchenmann: I think its combined in there. If we are going to goon to that
subject we can go ahead and bring up that worksheet that shows all the different
memberships and how they are split out.
De Weerd: Well j only brought it up because I didn't see it. Anna is standing
there.
Kilchenmann: Part of it is in it. I just have to look it up and see exactly how it's
split up.
De Weerd: Which line item.
Kilchenmann: I think she has 6,500 of COMPASS in her budget.
De Weerd: Oh okay. I see where it is.
Powell: I do you have one request when the new city halj that's built. Please
don't put these things. They make me so dizzy, these things out in front. I don't
know if you've ever spoken up here. I'm grabbing on.
McCandless: They are terrible.
Powell: They are terrible.
Corrie: They are.
Powell: Did you have further questions?
Corrie: Any other questions?
Bird: I have none.
Powell: Tammy I think that comes out of the dues and membership, is what I
understood.
De Weerd: Thank you Anna.
Kilchenmann: Would you guys like to take a break while we set up our computer
and then we could go over the miscellaneous things? Then in the morning we
are scheduled we are scheduled - I would have Pauline come in now but she's
not here today so she's scheduled first thing in the morning to talk about
compensation.
(Recess)
Corrie: We will come back into session now. Reta and Stacy you have the floor.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17. 2003
Page 75 of 90
Kilchenmann: We don't really have a presentation. I guess just ,if anyone had
questions.
Bird: I think we got some questions here but J think it's some that Mayor is going
to have to check into like that Emergency Management that's awful expensive.
De Weerd: Yes.
Bird: (Inaudible) is no problem but I think that's something Mayor is just going to
have to ask about.
Corrie: Valley Transit. They asked for 25,000 something.
Cunningham: They sent in a request.
Corrie: They called me and I said what we had on the books but I couldn't
remember the exact fee.
De Weerd: There's Clair right now. You are so (inaudible).
Bowman: My ears were burning.
Nary: The Mayor said he was not going to rejoin the conference of Mayors?
De Weerd: Yes.
Cunningham: Then Pauline decided to drop that IEC.
Bird: What are we going to do (inaudible)?
De Weerd: Yes.
McCandless: Idaho what is it?
Cunningham: The IEC? I'm not sure what it stands for. Do you guys know?
Nary: Good thing we aren't paying for it anymore.
McCandless: I don't know what half of these things are.
KiJchenmann: Some kind of employee thing. An HRish thing.
McCandless: I know there are a bunch of HRish things in here.
Berg: Idaho Employee Council.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 76 of 90
Kilchenmann: Yeah I was going to say Idaho Employee Council.
McCandless: What the heck is HRA TV.
Cunningham: Oh are you looking at the ones down below?
McCandless: Yes. The fourth one down.
Kilchenmann: I bet its Human Resource Association of Treasure Valley.
Bird: Why do we belong to all that?
McCandless: Yes why do we?
Kilchenmann: Well that one is only 50 dollars. I think they actually have
meetings in the Treasure Valley and they -
Nary: You know here's what I think for what its worth. I think for some of the
departments, I think within reason and most of these are fairly low. I mean within
reason I think the department has to have some flexibility to be able to decide
what helps them do business and what helps them work with others.
McCandless: I agree.
Bird: I agree with you.
Nary: And because all of these are fairly low. On these lower ones, I guess I
don't have a real heartburn to try to second guess whether or not they really think
they need it. If it was quite a bit more money then I think we want to do that but I
think even if you look at HR 350 bucks a year seems fairly small. We can
certainly ask though tomorrow if you want to what those particular organizations
do. I think the bigger numbers up above are the ones that we probably need to
talk about more as to viability and usefulness for the city.
McCandless: (inaudible) Valley Transit. That's a big amount of money.
Nary: They are. You know last year I know since I only have one-year frame of
reference when we talked about those. I mean part of that is you know we are
part of a large regional group in trying to maintain those things and I think we've
at least from last year. We are looking at the bigger picture from a region
standpoint rather then just the individual needs of the city and our residence and
how much they use it and all that. I think as the budgets get a little skinnier and a
little bit tighter we at least have to ask those questions and at least know what we
are going into eyes open that if that's where we are spending that kind of dough
on then what exactly are we getting as a turn around for that or our residence.
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 77 of 90
Corrie: It says for accounting billing fund. Those three figures on top are they
coming out of the billing fund. In other words, people are paying for that anyway.
Cunningham: Yes it's coming out of the billing fund.
Corrie: Okay so its not general fund item.
Cunningham: No.
Corrie: So that's going to come out -
Cunningham: It's coming out of the special service fund.
Cunningham: See on the P and Z actually has the line item for it.
Corrie: Right. Okay.
Cunningham: Transit dues.
Nary: I mean you think if you look at the top row I mean other then those transit
ones which again are fairly large and most of these are pretty much what it takes
to do business. AIC, COMPASS, I mean maybe we need to talk about the
assessment number, same thing with the EMS one but I mean (inaudible) these
are ones that we cannot participate in.
(Inaudible discussion)
Nary: Will in these other dues I mean there's (inaudible) a way for Stacy but
don't you belong to that?
Berg: No.
Kilchenmann: Actually I dropped that one.
Nary: Oh.
Berg: I have a line item in my budget for 500 dollars for dues but I'm a member
like of ICCTFOA-
Nary: Right I guess that's-
Berg: liMe and PRIMA. I'm a member of PRIMA.
Nary: Those aren't on here so -
{
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 78 of 90
Berg: I noticed that so I don't know where -
Kilchenmann: What happens to those is like Reta and I both belong to the
Association of Governmental Accountants and in the state you can't really pay
dues so what the state does for some of those associations is they combine the
membership into the training seminar. Like we go to a two day training and part
of the training conference registration we pay is for - then we have a
membership for the year. I think that's what's happened is people have coded
them is its in conjunction with the conference and so they don't show up here.
Nary: Is there dues for PRI MA? Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: On these ones for the regional transportation. I don't recall that we had a
presentation from the TV Metro. Treasure Valley Transportation is what I thought
the one that was here most recently and then we have had Valley Ride. I don't
remember the Treasure Valley Metro doing a presentation or maybe I have them
backwards.
Corrie: The Midday Express you did and Katherine - if I remember right I think
everybody did.
De Weerd: I think Katherine's been here.
Corrie: They were all there and I can remember going back they were all
presented.
Nary: Maybe it was but I just don't remember. I'm kind of torn I know it's a good
regional thing, I know it's a long term commitment we've really made to doing
those and not necessarily wanted to eliminate funding but I think at some point
someone's going to call us on it and say what am I getting for that. And I'm not
sure what we get for that. We have some benefits to our community, I think there
is no doubt about it, I just don't know dollar wise what that is but I know if you
don't participate then there is nothing. I guess I'm just torn about it.
Corrie: I would like to see them get more of the businesses involved. Like Saint
Luke's and Saint AI's and some of those. I think they are trying to, we have a lot
of people that call and say thanks that that's there. I used to get some people
that when they changed the spot I got a lot of phone calls the first week. There
are a lot of people out there using it and there's more everyday. I agree with you
I think we are going to have to draw the line here somewhere. I don't know how
Boise is going to do keeping that bus service there.
Nary: You raised a really accurate point is I think that was the least part of the
discussion I recall was they had some frustration in trying to deal with the private
t
Meridian City Council SpeCial Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 79 of 90
businesses that are really gaining a benefit like Saint Luke's or the mall or those
places and they don't want to participate in the maintenance of the program.
They certainly don't mind that their workers can get there on the bus, they don't
mind that their patrons can get there on the bus system but they don't want to
help pay for it and so I'm not sure there's a real answer to that either. Obviously
they a re working to dot hat b ut that does make ita wfu lIy tough sometimes to
keep funding something that appears to be only getting larger not smaller.
Service is getting a little smaller because it's very tight for ridership and it's a lot
of money. 67 almost 68,000 dollars is a lot of money.
Corrie: They may have to go in the back door at those places to. They say they
are not going to be able to do it and they may step forward and say -
De Weerd: Well and that's where I think the Cities can step up and start helping
people think out of the box and maybe give incentives for smaller parking lots for
a commitment to something like this so that we can make it happen. We need to
build that into ordinances and that sort of thing.
Nary: That is exactly right.
De Weerd: You know for this year I'd like to see us maintain it and let them know
we would like more information on who your funding partners are and if the
private industry can't step up to the plate you know the city can't continue to do it
on the backs of their taxpayers. Although the taxpayers aren't paying for this our
fees are and right now the building community is supportive of mass transit.
They see the benefits but I think we to have to respond to them and if we can't
show more collaboration. Yeah we need to take a second look at it but right now
we need a partner in hoping it succeeds.
Nary: I would agree.
McCandless: I should know I know but I'm either new or have forgotten or
something but what's Treasure Valley Partnership?
Corrie: All the Mayors and the County Commissioners that meet and put things
before the P and Z and Council and ordinances that come - that was raised on
like the communications towers that we get an ordinance for, we put that together
and then they get all the Comprehensive Plans put together and make sure they
are not putting a contractors yard against something else -
(Inaudible discussion)
Corrie: We did goof on that one but. Actually we are getting quite a bit of bang
for a buck on that one.
Nary: Is the dues for that based on population too like COMPASS?
Meridian City Council SpecIal Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 80 of 90
Corrie: Yes.
Nary: Okay.
De Weerd: I don't see anything on here that hasn't already been addressed or
answered. I would like to go to the enhancements in the admin side. Meridian
Development Corporation they are paying back its indicated in the bottom. It will
probably be towards the end of the budget year because they won't get their tax
increment financing until January at the earliest and probably a smaller portion.
Bird: I was going to say probably more like July.
De Weerd: But it will get paid back. I guess I didn't know why the Senior Center
was at zero.
Corrie: Okay. Let me get there. That was a question mark.
De Weerd: Okay.
Corrie: If we go into SAGE membership and they are going to grants for them
would they be able to get part of that 15,000 or more then 15,000 in grants. Why
would we pay them double if we can do that? That was the only question that
was brought up to me. Can we still want to give them 15,000 when they could
probably through these grants that we a re going to be working with get 50 to
100,000.
De Weerd: Mayor last year we raised it to 15,000 it was at 10,000 and they use
the 10,000 in their operations. And it was an ongoing to help offset the cost of
doing business. Last year when we increased it 5,000 was about the same
conversation we just had about mass transit, they had just gotten their new bus
they were talking about partnering with Meridian Elementary School and we
wanted to help offset the cost of their new transportation system which has really
been successful. They are utilizing it for a lot of seniors they have on a monthly,
they already beat the numbers we see from the Treasure Valley Transportation
and the Treasure Valley Metro. Their van hauls around 450 people a month and
that's pretty good numbers. That 5,000 were to offset some of their
transportation costs. I do know because of the number of repair projects that
they have going that they certainly can take advantage of the SAGE membership
but that's kind of over above their transportation and operational type of
expenses that they look to the city and the county for support from, and they do
get county support as well.
Corrie: I agree. I think what you have to do though if you keep the 15,000 in be
specific on where it's to go. Not that they have a choice of where they want it to
go. The attorney gave us that advice that we can't just give them a lump sum of
Meridian City Council SpecIal Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 81 of 90
money and do what you want to with it. We have to ear mark it to be legal and of
course we can do that. If you want to earmark it for new sidewalks or what have
you then that becomes not a problem for us and not for them neither. We can't
just say here's 15,000 dollars use it the way you want it.
De Weerd: I understand that.
Corrie: I'm not objecting it and one of the reasons I brought that up was the fact
that we do need to - if we do give that we have to specifically say where its going
to and then if you want to give them 15 or 20 that's up to you. I did want to bring
it up for discussion, this is the quickest way I could get it to your attention, and it
was going out.
De Weerd: Mayor I appreciate that and I think that and I think that we still need
to continue to ear market 5,000 to their bus. It's very important. J don't want to
see them take away that partnership with Meridian Elementary and as they start-
pinching pennies that's what they do. We are there to remind them that's why
you got that extra 5,000 dollars. The 10,000 I'm sure they won't have a problem
designating that either as a match to something that they might get a grant for or
a particular problem or a particular project. We'll just have to be specific with
them and hope when they submit their information to the accounting office it's a
lot clearer then it was this last time.
Nary: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Mr. Nary.
Nary: On the MDC one I guess so I understand isn't the intent to repay that?
Corrie: Yes.
Nary: Or this is on top of something.
Bird: They are going to pay it back.
De Weerd: It's on the bottom.
Nary: Okay but then is there some necessity to even fund it? I mean is there
some start up that they have a need for?
De Weerd: What I had just said is their tax increment financing at earliest they
will get a small proportion in January.
Nary: I understand that. What do they need the 60,000 for in October then?
Why do they need 60,000 dollars?
Meridian City Council SpeCIi::l1 Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 82 of 90
Bird: You're basically running their deal when you are paying seven, eight 9,000
dollars a year in legal. fees, which we have been and stuff like that. The city is
basically funding MDC until they get some of this increment and money in it. I
think we are going to have to help them for a couple years but they should be
able to pay us back. That's what its basically doing is you are funding it.
Nary: I understand that I just didn't know what we were funding.
Bird: We are funding the expenses of MDC.
Nary: Right but all we've got is -
Bird: They want to hire a director and everything else so you know you are going
to have to -
De Weerd: Will can you get a copy of their budget.
Kilchenmann: Its in here.
De Weerd: Is it.
Bird: Yes it's in there.
De Weerd: The updated one too?
Kilchenmann: It's pretty much the same.
De Weerd: Oh okay. Right off Bill mainly that money will be funding the market
feasibility study. The traffic study is being done now and the parking. Well the
traffic maybe funded during their next budget year. There's a number of projects
that there having consultants do to help set the base for generating some interest
and some investment into old town.
Kilchenmann: They also want to hire a grant writer. The fayade and streetscape
improvement and then they are looking at the end of the year of hiring a director.
Their ideas of hiring a director I feel are rather vague because they don't have a
job description, they don't have a range. I think they are going to ask the city to
share that cost with them but they haven't really developed the cost they want
the city to share office space because I don't think on their own it would be a long
time before they could afford to support a full time position with insurance and so
forth. I wouldn't think that they really would need the full 60,000 dollars up front.
Nary: I'm looking at their request I mean 10,000 is to hire a director, I don't know
if t hat's for process, it's 0 bviously not a salary. I don't think. 3 ,000 for grant
writing when we are paying 2,500 dollars to SAGE and Craig Slocum came and
said that's what they would use. I'm not sure that they really need 3,000 dollars
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 83 of 90
more to contracted a grant writer if weare going to pay for SAGE. I guess I
would look at a couple of those things. An office space and supplies is 2,000
dollars and r don't know that they need it. I don't know what they need yet
specifically. Some of these things seem like, completing of a market study
25,000 I mean if that's already an ongoing project that makes some sense the
same thing with the street fagade but some of these other things I guess I don't
see a necessity for them at this time.
De Weerd: The audit the legal. I don't know, if you need them to come in and
talk to you. Well what do you mean them, that's us. I think it's going to be paid
back so you know rob Peter to pay Paul. It's a lush and its.
Nary: I just don't see a reason to fund 13,000 dollars for hiring a director when
there is really nothing defined as to what that means or 3,000 dollars for a grant
writer when we are going to pay 2,500 dollars for another grant writer -
De Weerd: Weill agree with the 3,000.
Nary: But 10,000 to hire a director with no idea of what that's for seems like a
waste of money. If they define what its for-
Bird: I agree with you, they just threw out some numbers. I think they just want
to make sure they are protected because nobody has any idea what kind of tax
revenue they are going to get this first year, your not going to know until you see
it. They've got tog 0 0 n I mean you've already basically funded this thing by
throwing out the first 15 or 20,000 whatever we put out the first year and you've
got to start it Bill. Its like Tammy said there is no guarantee that they will get us
paid back next year because we don't know what the revenue sharing is going to
be. We will get it back and I think they just put this stuff in here as a guess and
hopefully because nobody had any idea when, where and why we would be
hiring a director when we would or anything but they hope to do it next year.
Kilchenmann: Maybe instead of just writing them a 60,000-dollar check at the
beginning of the year we should just do it more on a monthly basis.
Nary: At least for me. I mean I don't have a problem with some of these things I
mean I think the market study I think the streetscape funding, even the office
administration a udit. I think t hat's fine even t he legal expenses. 1ft hey don't
have legal services they really can't operate. The miscellaneous, 1,500 dollars is
a lot, I don't know what that means. Is that pop and cookies? I mean I don't
know what its for but between that and 2,000 dollars for office space and
supplies when they don't have an office and they don't have supplies seems like
a lot of money. I'd rather say you know if we are going to fund them up front and
be repaid we fund the things that are defined specifically as to a need and the
other things that at least at this point haven't identified a specific need that can
wait and we can address that later if there is a need and the funding for their tax
(
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 84 of 90
increment is inadequate and they realize that and again I understand those
things but I just have a hard time saying lets just - when we are talking about a
very tight budget for our own employees, I have a hard time saying lets just give
another 20,000 to this group when we don't really know what its for.
De Weerd: Mr. Mayor.
***End Of Side Six***
De Weerd: - they don't intend to hire him towards the end of the budget year.
You can guarantee they will have a description and everything else by then. It
will be similar to the other descriptions for positions similar to that in the valley.
What they are asking is only going to pay a couple months of someone's salary
anyway so they won't be looking for that person until next summer. Why would
we expect that they have a job description a year ahead of when they hire a
director? You know I guess I don't have that expectation for that board other
then I know they are working towards that. The office space and supplies they
are hoping to have some space in City Hall that they've talked about, they don't
know if that's realistic because they know the space constraints. They have
mailings, they want to do some public visual type of things. They are going to be
going through a visioning process to create a vision for Old Town. Be doing
some visioning boards and that sort of thing. I can see how those expenses will
accumulate. I don't think that this is an unreasonable budget. If you want more
detail, we can ask the chairman to send himself or one of the other members
who would not have a conflict like myself and Mr. Bird. You know if you want
more detail, I think we need to ask them instead of trying to second-guess what
the intent is. Like Councilman Bird said we've already made an investment of
55,000 dollars and we are invested. We want to see this work and if you need
rationale then we need to ask them to be here.
Nary: That's fine. They can be here tomorrow then.
Corrie: Let me ask you, did they say that they would probably pay it back as
soon as they got paid their monies and that's -
Kilchenmann: That's correct. They don't know what the cash flow will be
exactly.
Corrie: Okay.
Kilchenmann: So we could. Some of these expenses like hiring the director they
do have slated for the end of the previous year. To help our cash flow we could
not give them the entire amount up front, as we have in the past.
Corrie: Let me ask you a question. Was this talked about at your MDC meeting?
(
Meridian City Council SpeclClI Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 85 of 90
Kilchenmann: Yes.
Bird: You bet it was.
Corrie: The amount that they wanted.
Kilchenmann: Yes.
Corrie: Okay. I'm concerned with if we don't what kind of message are we
sending to them? We either support this or we don't and I can see his point, we
got other things to do. I'm in a stage to (inaudible) saying 60,000 is not that
much maybe but in your case, it is and my case it is too. I'm more inclined to say
this is fine and in January we are going to get it so why -
Kilchenmann: We won't get all of it in January. This is actually a guess as to
how much.
Bird: Mr. Mayor.
Corrie: Yes.
Bird: They started out wanting 75,000 from us. Tammy and I said that there was
no way that we felt that we could give that much because we were going to be
pretty tight. They went back in and cut down and did some stuff. There is no
way in January are we going to get the 60,000 paid back. If we get it paid back
in July when we get our second installment because nobody has any idea what
kind of tax increment they are going to get.
Kilchenmann: This is though, this is based on some numbers that they got from
Ada County. They didn't just pull it out of a hat.
Bird: We're hoping its right. Then they will get plenty back a nd I see where
Councilman Nary is coming from. I mean I don't like it any better then anything
else but we do have this thing going, it is going to help downtown and I firmly
believe that. Downtown needs help. I assure you they just didn't throw this out,
they went and looked at seeing - and they are trying to be as practical as - but
they have no track record Bill on you know we have no track record we have no
idea - we have an idea on what our revenue is going to be but there's no
guarantee.
Kilchenmann: Once they get through this first year then it'll be like our property
tax. I think they will be able to predict it. It will be based on market value but it
will be easier to project and then I think they will have a better idea.
Nary: Well like I said we can all have our own positions. I can see out of what
they have requested, I can see 45,000 dollars of that being based on some
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 86 of 90
reality and I can see about 15,000 of it not. I wouldn't support more then 45,000
dollars for it and they can find the rest of the money or if they get something more
to find and the money is available then we can assist further. I'm not trying to cut
their legs off but they are supposed to operate independent of the city. We are
going to help fund some things and we are going to keep doing that but when
they a re a sking for these things t hat don't really have any definition to t hem I
don't see a reason to spend at least 15,000 dollars for this request.
Bird: Do you want one of them to come then?
Nary: Sure. I mean that's fine if they want to come. I just think 45,000 of this
seems like you can at least base it on something and they are all pretty rounded
numbers anyway. 45,000 of it seems to make some sense but the director, the
grant writing service and the office space to me don't. They don't make sense at
this time. Now they may later. We may have the money to fund that later if they
have more specifics as to what they want and what they need and why they need
it but I guess to me at this juncture I would be much more comfortable then
saying we will commit 45,000 to their request and we'll see about the other 15
later. That maybe the first 15 they make up out of their tax increments is that and
they can make that up first, I don't care but without being real defined.
Bird: Bill that's something that we can do tomorrow. If you want to do that you
can make a motion and we can find out.
Nary: Okay.
Bird: I'm not saying you are not right but like I said they start at 75, Tammy, and I
told them there was no way we could give it that. They got down to 60 and we
said we would try to sell that.
De Weerd: I thought we took the grant writer out.
Bird: I did too. Weill don't recall us saying we were going to join SAGE.
haven't voted on joining SAGE.
Nary: Well we said we were going to talk about it. Your right we didn't agree to
JOin.
De Weerd: And I guess that's why they kept it in there.
Corrie: (Inaudible) take all of you to do it so then that's what it's there for and you
can discuss that (inaudible).
McCandless: Well you look at that page, they haven't got a darn thing in there
that says what they are going to do or-
Meridian City Council Special Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 87 of 90
Corrie: SAGE you mean?
McCandless: Yes.
Corrie: Other then -
De Weerd: We've heard it.
Corrie: That's the democratic way to vote on it. Okay what else are we talking
about here? Is this the new figures that - no two reserve officers - 18,000, that's
not what they asked on -
Cunningham: We haven't made any changes.
Corrie: Because they came up different then what they were asking for.
Cunningham: Did they?
Corrie: Okay because they can get about 3,000 dollars (inaudible).
Cunningham: Okay we will make changes and have that ready for you.
Corrie: Okay good for me as a dummy accountant who drank beer in college
instead of going to the accounting class make it as simple as possible. Okay.
Lets bring up knox box for engines. You know I hate to say it but I think a captain
would be in charge of that and he could open a box. Not to have to spend 6,000
dollars for an electric - I don't Tammy maybe you can come up with it but
everybody can get in that box. I think the Captain should have the responsibility
of putting that key back. 5 ,000 dollars - give me 5,000 dollars a nd I 'II goo n
every trip.
(Inaudible discussion)
Bird: I'm with you Mayor and I can't figure out why.
Corrie: Anyway that was just a - I was going to it and I thought no don't go there.
(Inaudible discussion)
Nary: This shows they aren't going to repay the 60,000.
Kilchenmann: It's at the bottom.
De Weerd: Yes it does. It says repay City of Meridian. I mean how much more
clearer do you want it?
Meridian City Council SpeclClI Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 88 of 90
Nary: I still don't buy it.
(Inaudible discussion)
Nary: I just don't agree with it. Its funny money, it's not based on anything. It's a
guess, it's not worth it. How are going to explain to our employees that we have
a tight budget and then we say but that 15,000 dollars that the MDC wants is
based on a guess but we will go ahead and give them that but we can't give you
anything. I mean come on.
Bird: You got a point there Bill.
De Weerd: B ut we a Iso have money going in a nd money going 0 ut. It's not
taking away from the bottom line.
Nary: But they can get it themselves and pay themselves back first. They can
pay us back the 45 after that. I just don't see funding it up front.
Bird: Well you said if they needed it, we could fund it later or something. Its got
to be in the budget as the funding starts with one way or the other its got to be in
the start of our budget.
De Weerd: We'll just have Steve come and speak to what the professional
services are. What constitutes the 64,000? The plans for the director and they
did take the grant writing out. What was the other issue you had Bill was it the
director, the grant writing and something else?
Nary: It was the miscellaneous, the office space.
De Weerd: Miscellaneous and office. Okay we will have them address that.
Nary: It looks like I assumed that the 6,000 that they are telling us for the legal
services are just they anticipate coming up with the other 4,000.
(Inaudible discussion)
De Weerd: Well when that went out that went out before they had a chance to
even get it to the board. It was 10,000, which was approximately, what they have
spent so far now too.
Bird: Isn't this what they published Stacy.
Kilchenmann: Yes they still have the grant writer in there. (Inaudible).
De Weerd: They have it in where?
(
Meridian City Council Specldl Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 89 of 90
Corrie: It's in hers. That was a different thing that she made for us.
De Weerd: Okay and we want to have our discussion tomorrow? After we get
this then we can just go? Although Cheri wants to stick around because Glen's
making dinner and she doesn't want to get home to early.
McCandless: I didn't say I wanted to stick around here. I said I would find
someplace to go.
(Inaudible discussion)
De Weerd: We will just all go to Cherie's house for dinner. Can I bring my kids?
McCandless: Sure, why not.
(Inaudible discussion)
Bird: Every department was very very understanding and very very helpful.
McCandless: We had some good presentations today.
De Weerd: Excellent.
Bird: They all worked to get it as tight as they could too.
De Weerd: Well and Mayor I appreciate this process. You know you working -
McCandless: Yes me too.
De Weerd: - you working with them has really helped clarify their presentations
and what you should come and request and it's been - every year it gets more
pleasu rable.
Corrie: The thing is in meeting with them one thing I found out is I looked at it
and I said why do you want this? Why? They came back and said well we could
use it. We can always use something. I start (inaudible) and now go back and
all this I've cut out you tell me what you can if you want it back, how much you
can really stand to take out. You saw thought really in the Police Department.
You really did and when they cut 300,000 dollars out there I knew there was
money to be cut.
De Weerd: I know I like their red lines.
Nary: And also though I think the real positive of the process was you know the
one thing the other departments saw is the police do that so you know next year
the Fire Department will have gotten that message and say lets go find the
\
Meridian City Council Specldl Budget Workshop
July 17, 2003
Page 90 of 90
alternatives and that's positive. It's not going to be turned around one time but I
think there's some real positive (inaudible).
Bird: And 1'[1 tell you Doug Strong did the same thing in the Parks you know he
really went and (inaudible) and what he asked for was what he felt he basically
needs and that's it.
De Weerd: So Stacy I think - I hint that Councilman Nary is giving is keep the
presentation by the Police Department as a template for what they can do next
year.
Kilchenmann: What they do is you just ask for 65 things and then you show red
crosses through them. Then it looks impressive.
De Weerd: Oh Stacy.
Corrie: Okay anybody else have anything else? I'm just sitting here waiting for
someone to say something.
De Weerd: I move we adjourn.
Nary: Second.
Corrie: Motion made and second to adjourn. All in favor say aye. Okay 3:50
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 3:50 P.M.
(TAPE ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
APPROVED:
Jk~,:>
ROBERT D. CORRIE, MAYOR
9 / 1'1 / OJ
DATE
ATTESTED:~"":' ft
WILLIAM G. BERG,
1\,\\111111111/
\\\1 ~4 Ilf.
\\\\_1 of .~?EFtl;"" '1///
\\' .,("\ v.;;,., /,..
... ,"" -.UI. ~
~... (j o?,?OR-47; 'v ~
~ _-P ~ ~
~ ~ ~
- ~
- -
~ SEAL ::
f?
___ K ....O;c02
~ "0 s{ 1S\ . ~ $
-;..'" '-1 'f.:) ~ ,,'"
"'",""/f/COUNT'!' \\,\\,,,,
fllltlllllllll\\\\\
MAYOR
Robert D. Corrie
t>UDS~( O~ fOy rLlblA(/No.t~- C"c {
~.. ,.
'r~~' ~ .
~~_.~~
~ P / CITY OF Et~\,;.;.;:.,
L/Vlerldian
IDAHO
.:...,..
,.
~,
"f
\'
\~
i/
~y
0._ smCE
lhoJ
LEGAL DEPARTMENT
(20B) 288.2499 . Fax 288.250 I
PARKS & RECREATION
(208 888-3579 . Fax 898.5501
PUBLIC WORKS
(208) 898-5500 .Fax 887-1297
BUILDING DEPARTMENT
(208) 887-2211 . Fax 887-1297
PLANNING AND ZONING
(208) 884-5533 . Fax 888-6854
CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS
Tammy de Weerd
William L. M. Nary
Cherie McCandless
Keith Bird
NOTICE OF SPECIAL WORKSHOP
MERIDIAN CITY COUNCIL
NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN that the City Council of the City of Meridian
will hold Special Workshops at City Hall, 33 East Idaho Avenue, Meridian, Idaho,
on Thursday, July 17th, 2003 at 8:00 am and Friday, July 18th, 2003 at
8:00 am. The Meridian City Council will be receiving and discussing preliminary
budgets and presentations from each specific department of the City of Meridian
towards approving a tentative budget.
The public is welcome to attend.
\\\\111111111/111
\\\ F MIll
",\\ -{ 0 ERID III,;,;
~,,\ ~.......
" r~ 0 -7A. -';
~ v cpf\P R..41'; 'V ~
f ~ ~"\
- -
. -
. -
-
DATED this 10th day of July, 2003.
Meridian City Council Special Workshop - July 17 and 18, 2003
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearings,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
33 EAST IDAHO · MERIDIAN, IDAHO 83642
(208) 888-4433 . Fax (208) 887-4813 . City Clerk Office Fax (208) 888-4218 . Human Resources Fax (208) 884-8723
** TX CQNFj""",TION REPORT **
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
DATE TIME TO/FROM
07/10 16:17 3810160
07/10 16:1S PUBLIC WORKS
07/10 16:19 2084664405
07/113 16'20 8841159
07/10 16'21 2088840744
07/10 16:22 2088467366
07/10 16:23 8985501
07/10 16:24 LIBRARY
07/10 16:25 IDAHO STATESMAN
07/10 16' 26 208 388 6924
07/10 16:27 2088886854
07/1(3 16:27 12084674538
(37/10 16:28 8950390
07/10 16: 29 Laure I
07/10 16'30 208 387 6393
(37/10 16:32 208-888-5052
07/10 16:33 CHERRY LANE
07/10 16:34 POST OFFICE
(
AS OF JUL 10 '03 16'
PAGE. 01
CITY OF MERIDIAN
MODE
EC--S
EC--$
EC--$
EC--S
EC--S
EC--S
EC--S
EC--S
EC--S
EC--S
EC--S
EC--S
EC--5
EC--S
1OC--S
1OC--5
EC--S
EC--$
MlWSEC PGS
00'35" 001
00'25" 001
00'25" 001
00'24" 001
00' 25" 201
00' 26" 001
00' 25" 001
00'30" 001
00'25" 001
00'30" 001
00'24" 001
00'25" 001
00'24" 001
00'26" 13131
00'25" 001
00' 25" 0e1
00'29" 001
00'35" 001
MAYOR
RoOcn D. Corrie
CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS
Tammy de WeCfd
WUli:lm L M. N:uy
Cherie McC.ll,dlm
KelU, BiJd
J~,
of1e~dl~n~~;""\
~IOAHO I~
~ /.7
. ..Y
~ "" .....(~iJ!t:..."L-:.: $l"'1
. 1:m1-
CMDl:!
1El5
105
105
105
105
105
105
105
105
le5
105
105
Ie5
1e5
105
105
le5
105
STi=lTUS
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
OK
LEGALD:EfARTMSNT
(208) 288.2499' F;>.>; 2SB.2501
1'h1\KS a RECRBATtON
(208888.3519. F,. 898-5501
PUBUC WORKS
(Ulll) 898.5500 'F.... 837-1297
BUILDING DEl'AItTMENT
(208) 887.2211 . 1'1'< X87.l297
PLANNING AND ZONINc;
(208) 88405533 . f;>.>; 888.6854
NOTICE OF SPECIAL WORKSHOP
MERIDIAN CITY COUNCIL
NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN thatlhe City Council of the City of Meridian
will hold Special Workshops at City Hall, 33 East Idaho Avenue, Meridian, Idaho,
on Thursday, July 17th. 2003 at 8:00 am and Friday, July 18th, 2003 at
8:00 am. The Meridian City Council will be receiving and discussing preliminary
budgets and presentations from each specific department of the City of Meridian
towards approving a tentative budget
The public is welcome to attend.
DATED this 10th day of July, 2003.
Meridian City Council Special Workshop - JUly 17 and 18, 2003
All materials presented at publio meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring aceommooation for disabiliUes related 10 documents and/or hearings,
please conlactthe City Clerk's Office al688-4433 at leasl48 hours prior to the public meeting.
33 EAST IDAHO. MBRlDIAN. IDAHO 83642
(208) 888.44~~' FlIl< (W8) 887-4813 . City Clerk om"" fox (208) 888.4218 . tlu",.n R~o\lrcCS Fax (208) 884-8723
~
"'* TX CONFIRMATION REPORT **
('
\
AS OF JUL 10 '0316:46 PAGE. 01
CITY OF MERIDIAN
DATE TIME - TO/FROM MODE MIN/SEC PGS CMDt:l STATUS
01 07/10 16:35 IDAHO ATHLETIC C EC--S 00'25" 001 105 OK
02 07/10 16:36 887 0816 133--5 013'43" 0131 105 OK
133 137/113 16:37 ID PRESS TRIBUNE EC--S 1313'24" 0131 105 OK
04 07/10 16:42 208 888 671313 EC--S 130'25" 001 1135 OK
05 07/10 16:46 ADA CTY DEUELMT 133--5 00'40" 001 105 OK
------------------------------------------~-------------~-----------------------------------
MAYOR
Roben: D. Corrie
~lta8e.. 10Si ~y t{rj;}li.cAJo _..~ i~{
>It, .
.~1~ .~
~
~p / CITYO!" C____ '.
L/YLerldian~ 1/ ..\
~tD^HO l
~ /Y
. '1 ..P'
'l>''i,. ~~Q,d~'E
-~1~t1~
LEGAL DEPARTMENT
(208) 288-2499 . Fax 288.250 I
['ARKS &: RECREATION
(208888.3519. fax 898.5501
PUBUC WORKS
(20S) 898.5500 'F;,x 887.1297
flU1LDINO DEPARTMENT
(208) 887-2211 . F,,-~ K8?-] 297
PLANNING AND ZONING
(208) 884-5533 . F:l>; 888-6$54
CITY COUNCIl.. MEMBERS
Tammy deWeerd
WiJH~ l.. M. NaJ}'
Cherie McCandless
KeJ[1\ Bird
NOTICE OF SPECIAL WORKSHOP
MERIDIAN CITY COUNCIL
NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN that the City Council of the City of Meridian
will hold Special Workshops at City Hall, 33 East IdahO Avenue, Meridian, Idaho,
on Thursday, July 17th, 2003 at 8:00 am and Friday, July 18th, 2003 at
8:00 am. The Meridian City Council will be receiving and discussing preliminary
budgets and presentations from each specific department of the City of Meridian
towards approving a tentative budget.
The public is welcome to attend.
DATED this 10th day of July, 2003_
Meridian City Council Special Workshop - July 17 and 18, 2003
All materials presented at publio meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents andfor hearings,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 886-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
33 EAST IDAHO' MERIDIAN, IDAHO 83642
(208) 888.441:1 . FlIX (208) 881-4813. . Cil)' Clerk Office F3X (208) 8BIl-4218 . Humnn Resources Pax (208) 884-8123
CITY OF MERIDIAN
CITY COUNCIL SPECIAL BUDGET WORKSHOP
AGENDA
Thursday, July 17, 2003
at 8:00 a.m.
City Council Chambers
1. Roll-call Attendance:
Tammy de Weerd
Cherie McCandless
Mayor Robert Corrie
Bill Nary
Keith Bird
2. Adoption of the Agenda:
3. Presentation and Discussion of the City Proposed Budget:
Meridian City Council Workshop Agenda - July 17,2003 Page 1 of 1
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian,
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents ancllor hearings,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 72 hours prior to the public meeting.
CITY OF MERIDIAN
CITY COUNCIL SPECIAL BUDGET WORKSHOP
AGENDA
Thursday, July 17, 2003
at 8:00 a.m.
City Council Chambers
1. Roll-call Attendance:
Tammy de Weerd
Cherie McCandless
Mayor Robert Corrie
Bill Nary
Keith Bird
2. Adoption of the Agenda:
3. Presentation and Discussion of the City Proposed Budget:
Meridian City Council Workshop Agenda - July 17, 2003 Page 1 of 1
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearings,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 72 hours prior to the public meeting.
MAYOR
Robert D. Corrie
~I
, ,'~-i'!_'''''::;''
;-Of-,':!'
k"t--.!J
cMe~;di;~'_."; ,
ClTY COUNCIL MEMBERS
Tammy de Weerd
William L. M. Nary
Cherie McCandless
Keith Bird
IDAHO
,.
'-,
\'
v
l
"ty
q;
\ 1903
LEGAL DEPARTMENT
(208) 288-2499 0 Fax 288-2501
PARKS & RECREATION
(208 888-3579 0 Fax 898-550 I
PUBLIC WORKS
(208) 898-5500 oFax 887-1297
BUILDING DEPARTMENT
(208) 887-2211 0 Fax 887-1297
PLANNING AND ZONING
(208) 884-5533 0 Fax 888-6854
NOTICE OF SPECIAL WORKSHOP
MERIDIAN CITY COUNCIL
NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN that the City Council of the City of Meridian
will hold Special Workshops at City Hall, 33 East Idaho Avenue, Meridian, Idaho,
on Thursday, July 17th, 2003 at 8:00 am and Friday, July 18th, 2003 at
8:00 am. The Meridian City Council will be receiving and discussing preliminary
budgets and presentations from each specific department of the City of Meridian
towards approving a tentative budget.
The public is welcome to attend.
DATED this 10th day of July, 2003.
Meridian City Council Special Workshop - July 17 and 18, 2003
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearings,
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
33 EAST IDAHO · MERIDIAN, IDAHO 83642
(208) 888-4433. Fax (208) 887-4813 . City Clerk Office Fax (208) 888-4218 . Human Resources Fax (208) 884-8723