HomeMy WebLinkAbout2020-07-28 Regular MeetingMeridian City Council July 28, 2020.
A Meeting of the Meridian City Council was called to order at 6:10 p.m., Tuesday, July
28, 2020, by Mayor Robert Simison.
Members Present: Robert Simison, Joe Borton, Luke Cavener, Treg Bernt, Jessica
Perreault, Brad Hoaglun and Liz Strader.
Also present: Chris Johnson, Adrienne Weatherly, Bill Nary, Sonya Allen, Alan
Tiefenbach, Clint Dolsby, Dale Bolthouse, Tracy Basterrechea, Joe Bongiorno and Dean
Willis.
Item 1: Roll-call Attendance:
__X__ Liz Strader __X__ Joe Borton
__X__ Brad Hoaglun __X__ Treg Bernt
__X__ Jessica Perreault __X__ Luke Cavener
__X__ Mayor Robert E. Simison
Simison: All right. Council, I will call this meeting to order. It is Tuesday, July 28th, 2020,
at 6:10 p.m. We will begin this meeting with roll call attendance.
Item 2: Pledge of Allegiance
Simison: Item No. 2 is the Pledge of Allegiance.
(Pledge of Allegiance recited.)
Item 3: Adoption of Agenda
Simison: Item No. 3 is adoption of the agenda.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: It looks like we are going to have to add another Executive Session after the last
line and I'm going to get that real quick. I didn't print this out. So, it would be -- I -- do we
make it Item 10? Is Item 10 where we want to put the Executive Session?
Simison: Yes.
Bernt: All right. So, we will add Executive Session per Idaho Code 74-206A(1)(a). I just
want to confirm that with Bill that I got the -- the Idaho Code correct.
Simison: That is correct.
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Bernt: Okay. With that I move that we approve the agenda as amended.
Hoaglun: Second the motion.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to adopt the agenda as amended. Is there any
discussion on the motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay.
The ayes have it.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 4: Future Meeting Topics
Simison: Mr. Clerk, did we have anybody sign up under Item 4?
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, the only sign up was for an agenda topic later on the agenda.
Item 5: Resolutions [Action Item]
A. Resolution No. 20-2220: A Resolution Appointing Natalie
Schofield and Thomas Vannucci to the Meridian Arts
Commission
Simison: Okay. So, we will move on to Item 5-A, a Resolution No. 20-2220, appointing
Natalie Schofield and Thomas Vannucci to the Meridian Arts Commission. Council, as
has been --
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: -- the history --
Perreault: We can't hear you.
Simison: Council, can you hear? Can you hear me now sort of? This is going to be a
fun night.
Bernt: Not really.
Simison: Chris, just let me know -- you guys keep telling -- I will talk until you guys can
give me thumbs up that things are going well. The Yankees are doing quite well this year.
I think that they are going to win the World Series. What do you say, Mr. Nary? Do you
agree.
Nary: I totally agree.
Simison: Totally agree. Does this mic sound any better?
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Cavener: That sounds much better, Mayor.
Simison: All right. We will move over to this mic and move forward. As has been the
custom history of commissions, I sat down with the chair of the Arts Commission Leslie
Mauldin and we interviewed several fine candidates for the two vacancies on the Arts
Commission. One is the full term and one is filling a partial seat for approximately a year.
The two people I'm bringing before you for your consideration are as listed on the agenda.
Natalie Schofield and Thomas Vannucci. Just to speak very briefly about each of them,
Natalie is what I would -- as you can see there she is at her house, you can see the mural
that's in her living room. She is a lover of art. I think that that's -- that's how I would
describe her and her viewpoint and it's really bringing the non -- the non-artists to the
commission to provide that general appreciation of art, which is something that's very
important when you are with a lot of artists, sometimes to get the other people's opinion
from that standpoint, but she -- she is very much committed and dedicated to art and is
looking forward to serving the commission in that role. Tom is -- comes from a wide variety
of background that -- when you look at his resume you may never realize how involved
he's been in all sorts of art throughout his life and career, ranging from ballet, into, you
know, some more recent artistic endeavors with Disney and others through his
companies, as well as some other work that takes him from New York City to California
and back again and he just happens to be located here in Meridian, Idaho, and is looking
for a place to put his wide variety of artistic endeavors into place for the Commission. So,
I bring these both to you for your consideration. I would be happy to answer any questions
you have and if the motion is successful I will open it up for either one of them to provide
some comment. If not, I would entertain a motion.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: Very pleased to make a motion on this. I'm so excited to see what the Meridian
-- what the Art Commission has been doing and the growth of the art community in -- in
our city. It's wonderful to see and I know our community appreciates the good work of
the commission. So, Natalie and Tom, we appreciate both of you being willing to volunteer
and provide your time and talents to the commission. Mr. Mayor, I move that we approve
Resolution 20-2220, appointing Natalie Schofield and Thomas Vannucci to the Meridian
Arts Commission.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Second the motion.
Simison: I have a motion and a second. Is there any discussion on the motion? If not,
all those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay. The ayes have it .
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Bernt: Congratulations.
Simison: Congratulations. We will do ladies first. Natalie, if you have any comments you
would like to say to the Council at this point in time.
Schofield: Thanks for having me. I'm excited to be a part of the Arts Commission and
serve our lovely city. I love Meridian and am excited to be a part of it. Thank you.
Simison: Thank you. Tom, same to you.
Vannucci: Thank you. I echo Natalie's sentiments and particularly I'm most excited to
have an opportunity at -- at this growth period of time for our city and I think what a
wonderful time to -- for all intents and purposes get in on the ground floor. So, I'm really
excited as how we are growing and bringing the arts and culture to life.
Simison: Excellent. Well, thank you both. Again congratulations and I know they are
eager to get you to work. So, look forward to having you at the first meeting and
Councilman Borton will make sure to keep you in line. Okay. Thank you.
Item 6: Action Items
A. Request to Withdraw Application of Franklin Storage (H-2020-
0033) by Franklin Storage, LLC
Simison: Council, moving on to Item 6-A, this is a request to withdraw an application for
Franklin Storage, H-2020-0033. I would be happy to turn this over to -- is Mr. Parsons
online? Is this going to be given by Alan?
Parsons: Mr. Mayor, I'm here this evening.
Simison: Okay. I will turn this over to Mr. Parsons.
Parsons: All right. Thank you, sir. Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, happy to be with
you tonight. I will make -- keep my remarks brief, but if you recall this applicant was before
you several weeks ago with a concept plan that you didn't -- originally staff had
recommended that a concept plan not be tied to the development agreement. That led
to some deliberations by the Council. In moving forward with a recommendation of denial
the applicant was clear on the direction that you -- they wanted -- you wanted them to
proceed and so rather than going forward with a denial potentially having to wait a year
to come back and submit another application, they are just asking that you acknowledge
their withdrawal this evening, so that they can continue to work with staff and bring back
a project that you can support in the near future. So, I think they just want to keep working
with staff to bring forward some industrial property to the city and a concept plan that
hopefully this body will support at a later date. That's all I have and I will stand for any
questions.
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Simison: Thank you, Bill. Council, any questions for staff at this time? If not, Mr. Nary,
do we need a motion on this or --
Nary: Mr. Mayor, yes, we need a motion and a vote.
Simison: Okay. Do I have a motion?
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: Move that we accept the request to withdraw the application for Franklin Storage,
H-2020-0033.
Hoaglun: Second the motion.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to accept the request to withdraw. Is there any
discussion on the motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay.
the ayes have it.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
B. Public Hearing for Gyro Subdivision (H-2020-0061) by
Tealey's Land Surveying, Located at 3030 E. Magic View Dr.
1. Request: A Short Plat consisting of 2 buildable lots on 0.97
acres of land in the L-O zoning district.
Simison: Okay. Items 6-B, a public hearing for Gyro Subdivision, H-2020-0061. I will
turn this over -- I will open this public hearing with staff comments and turn this over to
Alan.
Tiefenbach: Thank you. Alan Tiefenbach, associate planner with the City of Meridian.
Good evening, Mayor, Members of the Council. This is a short plat. The property is about
just a little shy of one acre. It is zoned light office. It's located at 3030 Eastern Magic
View Drive. Let's see. So, Eagle is here and this is Magic View and, then, this is South
Allen here. So, again, the property is about just shy of one acre. It's consisting of one
existing lot. Put some pictures up here so you can look at it, if I can get it to work. Here
we go. This property was annexed in 2000. In 2002 the development agreement that
was required at the time of annexation -- it was amended. The reason why they amended
this development agreement was to allow a restaurant as a standalone use. Restaurants
are only allowed as an accessory use in this particular zone district. There was also a
conditional use that was approved in 2002 to allow a drive-in restaurant and, then, in 2020
there was a certificate of zoning compliance -- or, sorry, 2002 there was a certificate of
zoning compliance that was approved for a Subway restaurant. This was here for a while
until in 2019 there was a -- a Gyro Shack that was built and that's what you see here.
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Looking at the property here we are on the east and we are looking to the south . Here
we are looking south and this is along South Allen Road and I took these pictures just to
show you the sidewalk and the landscape buffer that exists. And, then, on East Magic
View looking east, again, here is the sidewalk and the buffer. And so this present proposal
was to subdivide off a lot of approximately .38 acres. That's what you see here, all this
vacant land here, here, and here. Two of our conditions on this plat were for common
lots or easements to be there for the required landscape buffers and also we
recommended that there be a shared access easement between the two lots from East
Magic View Drive, so when this is eventually sold off the access wouldn't be cut off to this.
I received a plat from the applicant last night that meets the conditions. So, the easement
is what you can see in these dotted lines here and this here is the cross-access -- a cross-
access easement. There is an existing curb cut here that is here now. At that they have
met all of staff's conditions and I will take any questions if you have any.
Simison: Thank you, Alan. Council, any questions for staff at this time? Okay. Is the
applicant on the call with us or present in the room?
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, I cannot identify the applicant by name, so if they are here if they
can raise their hand using the button or pressing star six. If you want to go in the room
right there, the audio works better in there for you.
Simison: And if you could state your name and address for the record, you will be
recognized for up to 15 minutes.
Miller: My name is Doug Miller. I reside at 14150 North Broken Horn, Boise, Idaho.
83714. Mayor and Council Members, I am the owner of the property and just here to field
any questions. Everyone's done a great job with this and was trying to split the lot I
purchased last year.
Simison: Thank you very much. Council, any questions for the applicant? Thank you
very much. This is a public hearing. Is anyone signed up to testify on this application ?
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, there were no advanced signups.
Simison: Okay. If there is anybody who is online that would like to provide public
testimony on this item, please, do so by hitting the raise your hand -- hand function at the
bottom of your screen or press star six on your phone. Give just a second.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, I want to apologize. Star nine to raise the hand.
Simison: Star nine. Thank you. Seeing no one who is wishing to testify on this item, I
will ask the applicant if they have any last words they would like to make, just so we are
official.
Miller: No, Mayor.
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Simison: Okay. No further comments. Thank you. Council, any questions or comments
or motions?
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: I move that we close the public hearing for H-2020-0061.
Borton: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to close the public hearing. Is there a discussion
on the motion/ If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay. The ayes
have it.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: After hearing all staff and applicant testimony, I move to approve H-2020-0061
as presented in the staff report for July 28, 2020.
Borton: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to approve item H-2020-0061. Is there any
discussion on the motion? If not, Clerk will call the roll.
Roll call: Bernt, yea; Borton, yea; Cavener, yea; Hoaglun, yea; Strader, yea; Perreault,
yea.
Simison: All ayes. Motion passes.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
C. Public Hearing for Delano Subdivision (H-2019-0027) by Boll
Cook Investments, LLC, Located at 14120 W. Jasmine Ln. and
2800 E. Jasmine Ln.
1. Request: Annexation & zoning of 15.22 acres of land with R-
8 (2.76 acres), R-15 (8.82 acres) and R-40 (3.64 acres)
zoning districts; and,
2. Request: A Preliminary plat consisting of 66 single-family
residential building lots, 1 building lot for a future multi-family
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development, 8 common area lots and 2 other (common
driveway) lots.
Simison: Item 6-C is a public hearing for Delano Subdivision, H-2019-0027. I will open
this public hearing with staff comments and turn it over to Sonya.
Allen: Thank you, Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council. This project was last heard by the
City Council on May 12th. At that meeting Council voted to deny the project. The
applicant filed a request for reconsideration of the Council's decision , which was heard
and approved by Council on June 9th. The request was based on Council's failure to
voice their specific concerns to the project during the public hearing, so that the applicant
could respond and address those concerns. The applicant felt there was not adequate
opportunity to present all of the information necessary for the Council to make an informed
decision on this project. The applicant has since submitted a revised phasing plan and
that is shown there on the bottom right for the development that he believes addresses
the concerns of Council. A secondary emergency access driveway is proposed to be
constructed from Dashwood at the north boundary to North Centrepoint Way at the
southeast corner of the site with the first phase of development. Four phases are now
proposed, rather than three, with the fourth and last phase consisting of seven buildable
lots, which are not proposed to develop until such time as Centrepoint Way is extended
to the north to Wainwright Drive. If the Council approves of this proposal a provision to
that effect should be added to the development agreement. Many letters of testimony
from neighbors have been received since Council's approval of the request for
reconsideration, in addition to those previously received that are included in the public
record. Staff will stand for any questions and if no questions turn it over to the applicant
at this time. Thank you.
Simison: Thank you. Council, any questions?
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Was that Councilman Cavener?
Cavener: It was. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. A question for -- I guess Mr. Nary. Mr. Nary, am
I correct in that we are hearing this, then, like a brand new hearing?
Nary: Mr. Mayor, Members of Council, Council Member Cavener, yes. So, this is like a
redo of the prior hearing. So, all of this information is all part of the record. So, everything
the Council heard and discussed at the prior hearing is part of the record and so, again,
the -- the decision is new. Basically you have set aside your prior decision to reconsider
it. You could still grant it or you could still go with a denial. You can still go with approval,
make modifications. So, it is -- it is a new hearing.
Cavener: All right. Thank you.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
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Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: So, I had a couple of questions for staff. On page 11 I think of the staff report I
just wanted to clarify the staff recommendation. Toward the bottom of the page it says
staff recommends North Dashwood Place is extended as a full access street with the first
phase and I recall that ACHD recommended it can be connected as a temporary
emergency access until Centrepoint is extended or within ten years. So, I just wanted to
clarify -- I think I just heard staff say they are recommending it as an emergency acces s
and I just wanted to clarify that that is what they are recommending.
Allen: Mr. Mayor, Council Woman Strader, Council, the applicant is proposing it as an
emergency access until such time as Centrepoint is extended to the north to Wainwright
Drive. At that time, then, they would plat that last phase of development and -- and the
street would be extended as required by ACHD and the city. Until such time it would be
emergency access only.
Strader: Thank you. One more, Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: Could you give us a little -- I saw that the phasing that was proposed by the
applicant was changed -- fourth phase or I think the last phase. Could you just give us a
flavor of the staff discussion with the applicant and any concerns that may have led to
that and just -- just the context for that change?
Allen: Mr. Mayor, Council Woman Strader, Council, the applicant made the change in
response to the discussion at the last Council hearing. Staff has really had no interaction
with the applicant on that matter.
Strader: Mr. Mayor, follow up?
Simison: Yes.
Strader: I think I -- I saw in the materials for the application a revised -- like a letter from
the applicant saying that they were adding additional buildings into phase four in response
to a staff concern about the possibility of phase four not being completed. That's what I
was getting at, if that prompts anything or if there has just been too many changes that's
okay. I just wanted to -- if there is something specific to that piece of that phase I wanted
to get some context for that as well.
Allen: Yes. Mr. Mayor, Council Woman Strader, I believe the applicant will address that
also. But -- but, yes, staff wanted some -- a few substantial lots to ensure that that phase
would actually get platted in the future and not just a couple.
Strader: Thank you.
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Simison: Council, any further questions for staff?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: Just to follow up on Council Woman Strader's question. Also have a question
about the staff's recommendation in the original staff report and, then, ACHD's
determination. In that situation, because it's staff -- in the staff report had -- had put in
there that it's -- it's city code to -- to require access off a local street if it's -- if it's possible,
because of city code, but because ACHD made a different recommendation, is it,
essentially, up to us as Council to determine which route to go or maybe that's a question
for Mr. Nary as well.
Allen: Mr. Mayor, Council Woman Perreault, Council, are you referring to the local street
access to the property that's in the county that -- or in the Boise city to the east that's
developing as an assisted living facility? I'm unsure what you are referencing, Council
Woman Perreault. I'm sorry.
Perreault: That's okay. I'm referencing the connection of Dashwood to -- instead of using
it as an -- so, ACHD recommended emergency access until Wainwright goes through --
excuse me -- until Centrepoint goes through and/or ten years. That was what was
recommended by ACHD, but in the staff report staff had -- had cited code regarding
access taken off of the local street, instead of Centrepoint as the collector.
Allen: I'm sorry, Council Woman Perreault, I'm still not unsure -- I'm still unsure what
you're -- what you are referencing. Dash -- Dashwood is a public street -- maybe this
answers your question -- and it's -- as such it's required to be extended -- I'm sorry.
Simison: Maybe it might be good to hear from the applicant on these items where they
can address it in their comments.
Allen: Thank you, Mr. Mayor.
Simison: Anything further for staff at this time? Okay. Then we will turn this over to the
applicant. Mr. Clark, you are recognized for 15 minutes.
Clark: Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Hethe Clark. 251 East Front Street. And doing my best
not to wear out my welcome. Appreciate everybody willing to listen to this and try to get
to a -- to a good outcome here. Address for the record 251 East Front Street in Boise.
Let me go ahead and share a quick presentation with each of you. So, to just kind of give
you a quick reminder -- and there is no reason to dive too far into these details , because
everyone has looked at this from just about every angle , except for the one that we are
going to discuss tonight. So, as a reminder this is the location of the property, again, near
major transportation corridors and Eagle Road and Ustick. Shopping within walking
distance. And, you know, most importantly it is in-fill development. You can see that the
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entire square mile is built out, including the areas that are right near us, other than the
long parcel, which is to the northeast. The area in red is the Brickyard and the senior
center that the city of Boise approved in the past few weeks. The area in purple has just
been recently acquired and our project is the area in yellow. As a reminder, the project
not only completes your water and sewer loop, but it is precisely in accordance with your
Comprehensive Plan, which has this area designated medium density and mixed use
residential -- excuse me -- mixed use regional. Also as a reminder of how far we have
come since I took over the lead on this, we have reduced the number of lots by more than
20 percent with the access down Jasmine and Centrepoint. Reduced the number of lots
on the northern boundary, but still kept the single story limitation, which I think is a big
deal. We reoriented the internal lot and we expanded the park . Kept it facing Alpine
Pointe. We also proposed an emergency only access at Dashwood, which as you know
has been a topic of discussion and debate. I don't think that there is any question about
the quality of the project -- project, the density and the layout at this point. I re-listened to
the Council's comments at the last hearing. Appreciated the kind -- kind comments that
were made about the effort that the applicant has gone through to try to address these
issues. So, let's talk about the issue at hand. When we were before you last the major
issue that led to denial was the possibility of Dashwood Avenue opening before
Centrepoint Way is connected. In other words, Dashwood would become a sort of de
facto collector prior to Centrepoint being completed. Council Members Bernt, Borton and
Strader all indicated that that was the basis of their vote. Other members of the Council,
including Mayor, all indicated that that was the linchpin of the year. So , as this was
previously proposed when we last spoke, ACHD was going to control that timing -- the
timing of opening of Dashwood and Council was uncomfortable with that, because they
didn't feel like there were adequate safeguards in place and that Dashwood would be
overwhelmed if it was forced to replace Centrepoint. So, our solution is to take that control
and place it firmly in the city's hands. So, rather than dedicating the Dashwood Avenue
right of way to ACHD with phase one, we would hold that back as part of a new phase
four. For now there would only be an emergency access at Dashwood . That would be
constructed according to Meridian Fire requirements. There wouldn't be bollards. There
would be pedestrian and bicycle access. We would create a new phase four, which is
shown in blue on this map, and phase four would include seven loss, plus the Dashwood
right of way and, Council Woman Strader, that -- Sonya -- Sonya's description of that is
accurate. We would have -- we discussed it with them and they indicated that they wanted
to make sure that there was adequate value in phase four, so that no one would forget
about it and -- and I promise you that that will not happen with seven lots there. There is
about half a million dollars worth of value with a fraction of that required to complete phase
four. So, the -- no one's going to forget about it, just put it that way. So, with that here is
the critical point. As a condition of our development agreement phase four would not be
allowed to proceed until Centrepoint connects to Wainwright. This is a simple solution. It
eliminates the issue identified by those who voted to deny the application. It is within your
standard practice that you regularly condition phased development using a development
agreement. The condition would run with the land and you would have a clear standard
for when phase four would be released. From a practical perspective you get Centrepoint
built up to that final missing link just north of our property, so that both properties can
develop and aren't waiting on the other. That would address the concern that Council
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Member Perreault identified at the last hearing. Again, the city would have security
ensuring that no one's going to forget about it, because with seven lot there is a lot of
value and it won't be forgotten and the development agreement will keep the applicant
and staff on track with regard to future final plats. With regard to the highway district, you
have in your record response from them they have already indicated that they would
agree to this proposal and no further action would be required. So, to sum that up it does
put the -- put this matter back in the city's hands, gives you the control and, then, it will
ensure that the concern expressed by Council Members Bernt, Borton, Strader and
Council Member Hoaglun will be addressed. Now there was a companion issue that was
discussed, which is, you know, what happens in the meantime. You know, can -- can the
roads function until Centrepoint is connected and I want to clear up any confusion about
how traffic would flow and whether the roads have capacity. So , with regard to traffic
counts, remember this project has been through multiple reviews at ACHD, including
when there were 20 percent more lots proposed. ACHD back in 2019 issued a letter
clarifying Centrepoint's capacity and stated that Centrepoint would be at about half
capacity at full build out. Dashwood at full build out also less than half capacity. And now
we have 20 percent fewer lots. So, there just isn't a traffic capacity issue. The other
question was, you know, whether there are ways in and out of the area and whether traffic
is going to channel only in -- in one particular roadway and Council Member Perrault hit
this one on the head. The Brickyard also already exists. It has far more units than what
are proposed here. So, this is an existing question, but, luckily, we are not talking about
a single access point out to Eagle or a single access point out to Ustick. The area is
actually quite porous already as you go down to the southeast. There are multiple ways
to access out to Eagle Road or Ustick, including through the adjacent shopping center,
which has four roads and multiple access points onto Eagle Road and we have shown in
dotted lines here the areas that will -- the roadways that will connect in the future , but in
the meantime this is already a very connected area with only one segment left to complete
Centrepoint. So, the way I would wrap that up is that what we have proposed here is a
solution that puts the control in your hands in terms of traffic and in terms of roadway
connectivity in the existing route, there is just not a basis to deny on that. ACHD has
reviewed and approved it and ACHD has also approved this phase four solution that we
have identified. So, let me just hit one other thing before I wrap up and there was a fair
amount of conversation at the last hearing about, you know, why now and I think a lot of
that was based on this idea of, you know, can we do this before Centrepoint connects
and I think I have answered that question, but let me give you another -- another reason.
So, I represent the group that's acquiring the property. Over the past several months I
have also gotten to know the sellers, spent a fair amount of time on the phone with them.
The area in which they are living is rapidly changing. The square mile is now largely built
out and so if you look at this map, the only open spaces you see are owned by the church
on the east across from -- from Eagle Road. You also have a little bit of open space on
the northwest that is owned by Idaho Power. You have some space on the west that's
owned by the school. That square mile is built out. But let me show you what the -- what
the immediate area by the Cooks is going to look like here shortly. The Cooks are retired
school teachers. They have lived here for a long time and the area is building up around
them. The Brickyard's been constructed on their doorstep with Centrepoint stubbing right
as their driveway. You know what the Brickyard looks like. We have shown you this slide
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a few times. It's, you know, R-40 at 22 to 30 units per acre, 215 apartments. That's on
their south. On their east, you know, since we last spoke with you in May, at that point
there was nothing on their -- on the east side yet, but since then Boise city has approved
the Stellar Senior Living Project. It's a three and a half story project right on their eastern
boundary with several hundred units. The third down -- the elevation third down is what
will face the Cook's property, again about three and a half story project. Large wall. Now,
remember, we worked with the City of Meridian and Boise city to get this property into
your area of impact and that -- you know, that still makes sense. Boise city is now
approving property -- development on the east. You know, the Brickyard is built on the
south and the Cooks are severely impacted and the large lot single family residence isn't
viable here any longer. They have got three and a half stories looking down on them on
the east and the Brickyard looming over them on the south and they need to move on.
And we think that we have proposed a project that should let that happen. This has been
run through the wringer in every sense of the word. I don't know that anybody -- I can --
I will proudly admit that I have never been through as many hearings on -- on -- on an in-
fill project as this one and I haven't even been to all of them. You know, for months and
months we have worked at this. We have iterated. We have tried to address the city's
concerns. We have tried to make the neighborhood happy and with this reconsideration
we have come to you with a solution for the problem that was identified at the last hearing.
In-fill development is hard. Never has that been more truly the case than in this
application. There are always challenges and we think that we have overcome them in
this case with a tool that is squarely within your toolbox. This is -- this is in accord with
your Comprehensive Plan. We have made significant modifications to address the
concerns. There are no traffic issues. This meets your code, it meets your planning, and
we ask that it be approved as conditioned and so with regard to those conditions we only
see one that would be modified from the staff's current condition and that has to do with
Condition 1-F. This is the one that we previously spoke to and we discussed at the last
hearing about whether the temporary or permanent language would be there. What we
would suggest is just instructing staff to modify that condition to say that the applicant's
proposed phasing plan would be adopted and as a condition of the development
agreement that phase four not be allowed to be a part of a final plat and Dashwood not
be opened as more than an emergency access until such time as Centrepoint Way is
connected the Wainwright Drive. So, with that I appreciate your patience and I'm happy
to answer any questions.
Simison: Thank you, Hethe.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council, any questions? Mr. Bernt.
Bernt: Thanks, Hethe. Got a question for you. Would you guys be willing to include the
multi-family, which is currently in phase three, and include that into phase four?
Clark: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Bernt, the -- you know, obviously, we -- we have to
look at every -- every issue there, but I'm -- I'm not tracking why that would be necessary
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July 28, 2020
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at this point. Are you pointing to a traffic issue or what are your -- what's the -- what's the
issue you are trying to address?
Bernt: Traffic. One exit, one entrance into the entire subdivision. Been my concern from
the -- from the beginning, it continues to be my concern. I go to Fast Eddy's quite a bit. I
know exactly which -- which entrance you are talking about. It's routine to have cars
parked on both sides of that private road going through the -- I believe the apartment
complex. I just -- I just don't think -- I -- I just -- I just think that that -- that that's going to
be a disaster. The traffic is going to be a disaster with the multi-family included in that,
so that's my concern. I have been up front with it from the beginning. I'm talking to you
about it now. I'm the guy that we got concerned with that didn't bring up his concerns until
the -- until the public hearing was closed. So, I'm -- I'm trying to be open as possible.
Clark: No hard -- no hard feelings either, Council Member Bernt. So, let me -- let me
attack this in a couple of different ways. You know, when we were at the hearing and
listening, the -- the concern that was stated repeatedly was that there was going to be a
traffic issue primarily for the folks at Alpine Pointe if Dashwood was open and became an
alternate or de facto collector and so that's the concern that we are solving for. That's the
concern that we heard at the last hearing. With regard to the question of whether there
is capacity on Centrepoint, which I think is what your question is now, Council Member
Bernt --
Bernt: Hethe, I am not going to argue with you about capacity. You know, I see the
numbers. But I see the optics and, you know, I think those are two different things. Do I
feel like there is -- that that -- that street can -- can take traffic, you know, maybe. I mean
-- but when -- what it looks like now it's going to -- it's going to cause problems and --
because currently as it stands cars are able to park on both sides of the road and when
you are -- when you are including, you know, 60 plus single family residence -- homes
and -- and, you know, almost a hundred multi-family units on that one entrance and -- it
makes it -- it makes it pretty tough, it makes it -- there is going to be a lot of traffic going
in and out. That -- I'm not saying that the capacity is not there, I'm just saying that it
doesn't mean that it's not going to be safe.
Clark: So, I'm -- I'm -- I'm struggling a little bit with the question, Council Member Bernt,
and -- and let's continue the discussion. So, when we -- when we analyze traffic questions
there is an empirical basis for doing so and there is for a reason, because, you know, if
we base it just on kind of perceptions we wouldn't know if -- if there was an issue or not,
you know, so when we talk about it quantitatively, ACHD has specific -- as been very
specific in saying that it is -- that Centrepoint's at half capacity. Now, when it comes to
the rest of this, it is gridded out everywhere below us already. So, we are not talking at
-- talking about just a -- a single -- call it a luge pipe, you know, for lack of a better word.
You know, there is not just one way out. If you can see on the map that we have provided
here there is a whole number of ways out for and that is an existing condition with
Brickyard having already been approved and constructed. So, I mean what I'm trying to
get at here is that if we are going to say that there is a traffic issue that requires denial ,
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July 28, 2020
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we need to -- we need to say what it is and the -- the empirical evidence that is before the
Council doesn't show that to be an issue.
Bernt: I guess you and I are just going to agree to disagree until the cows home, Hethe.
I just think that's what it's going to have to be. I -- I get that there is multiple ways to get
to the streets, like to Eagle Road and to Ustick. I get that. There is probably three or four
different ways to get to those two roads from this -- this proposed project. But getting out
of the project there is one way in and one way out and that's what I'm talking about.
Clark: Council Member Bernt, you know, I -- I'm -- I am having a hard time figuring out
how to put your mind at ease there. You know, the -- it's not just three or four, it is one,
two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight connections onto Ustick and Eagle and --
Bernt: That -- that's not my concern. My concern is what happens way before then. My
concern is the actual entrance and exit to the sub -- your proposed subdivision. That's
where my -- that's where my concern lies.
Clark: Well -- and let me also point out that it's my understanding that Fast Eddy's has a
secondary access condition as well, which would also create -- and it -- I don't know if it's
been built at this point, but we have reviewed the approvals and that does require a
secondary access. So, that adds to the already high number of connections that are
available through there. In the meantime, what you would be saying is that you are going
to deny based on no -- based on -- in -- and I will just put it straight forward -- an opinion
that this can't handle -- these roads -- area roadways can't handle the traffic that isn't
supported by ACHD's reporting and you would be also basing it on a condition of approval
that we would have to connect Centrepoint through on a third -- on third-party property up
front and that's not warranted by the traffic figures and so you would be placing an
impossible condition on us that doesn't have a basis for it. So -- go ahead.
Perreault: I'm sorry. Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: I think I'm seeing -- I think I'm seeing -- I'm understanding what -- what
Councilman Bernt is -- is stating and I'm understanding what you are saying, Mr. Clark,
and I don't want to put words in Councilman's Bernt's mouth, but I also am very familiar
with this area and when you are heading south on Centrepoint and you are going through
Brickyard there is cars parked everywhere, because Brickyard truly doesn't have enough
parking and they are on both sides of Centrepoint Lane as you are heading south out of
Brickyard. So, it -- it's south of Delano. It's not right as you would be coming out of
Delano, but as you are on Centrepoint and you are in between Brickyard, you have got
kind of the office on the east -- or on the west -- west side and you have got a whole
bunch of people parked everywh ere and, then, as construction has been happening on
the road that -- that is going east and west between Centrepoint and Eagle Road where
-- where you would access Fast Eddy's, there is also many vehicles parked on both sides
of the road there and I think some of that has to do with the construction of Brickyard
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July 28, 2020
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apartments. You have had construction vehicles parked there -- probably some of that
will clear up when all of that construction is done and so I understand that there is some
congestion involved in this and so I'm wondering if Councilman Bernt's concerns are really
safety related and not capacity related.
Clark: If I could just jump in real quickly as well. You know, I -- Council Member Perreault,
it's also my understanding -- and last time I was there Brickyard is still under construction
and they still -- portions of it that are staging. So, I see a lot of that as being a temporary
condition that's related to the conditions for the construction of Brickyard. In the
meantime, you know, when we are talking about safety issue, we are talking about sight
distances and we are talking about roadway geometry and, you know, there is just not
evidence of an issue like that. Yeah. And maybe one other thing to add to that is just,
again, because Centrepoint is a collector roadway. You know, it's -- it's built to be large,
it's built to move traffic, and in this case it's going to be moving traffic to the south on
Ustick until the connection is made to Wainwright.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, Mr. Clark, this isn't a great picture, but I was looking at Eagle View,
which comes out -- which is just north of the flag pole part of the property and connects
into Eagle Road. Yes, right in there. And it looks like that turns and comes close to the
boundary of the property at the apartment complex. Is -- is that going to be -- does it not
match up -- it's hard to tell on this, but is -- when -- when would that be matched up? I
know Centrepoint is outside the realm of this development as it connects to Wainwright,
but what are the connection possibilities to that Eagle Point, you just -- I just can't see it
from here very well.
Clark: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Hoaglun, thank you for the question and I will clarify
that. So, the -- the dotted line that is on -- that I'm pointing at right now is within the -- the
senior center property and that -- and we are stubbing into that, so that will provide
another access. The senior center property has access on -- has an access onto Eagle
Road. We anticipate that when the Wong property develops that there would also be a
stub in this location generally that would provide for additional connectivity there. So,
those dotted lines are what we anticipate with future development based on the city's
standard practices for stubbing to neighboring property.
Hoaglun: So, Mr. Mayor, follow up?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Mr. Clark, if you move your cursor there to the left where the dotted line curves
-- a little bit -- yeah. Then you come back down south, that curve right there just -- there
seems to be a paved -- you know, it's a street right there and I didn't know if that was a
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July 28, 2020
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connection that could be made that curves into Eagle View -- if that -- Centrepoint is
extended to that point, but it sounds like that's not a possibility at this time.
Clark: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Hoaglun, those two points -- I mean one is that we --
we are stubbing to the property on the east and so to further address Council Member
Bernt's questions, that also provides an outlet. There -- Council Member Hoaglun, when
you are talking about the area that is kind of sweeping here on the S curve, that's the
piece of Centrepoint that everyone is waiting on to connect. We have committed as part
of our phase one to build all of Centrepoint on our property. So, that's ready as soon as
-- as possible for that connection as it -- as it moves forward and continues north, so --
but we do not control the property that's adjacent to us on the northeast and that's been
kind of the crux of the issue here.
Hoaglun: Right. Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Mr. Clark, yeah, I was just hoping that there was a connection that looked like
from this, you know, satellite view -- but it's not easy to see. It almost looked like by
stubbing to your property you could almost connect to that curve that, then, loops out to
-- curves around to Eagle View. So, it doesn't look like that can happen. Thank you.
Clark: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Hoaglun, that -- that is what I'm -- we do have a stub
to our east into the senior center and so when that -- when that develops that will provide
another alternative, if that's what you are asking.
Hoaglun: Okay. Thank you.
Simison: Council, any further questions for the applicant?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: I missed who that was.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor, it's Council Woman Perreault.
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: So, I was reading -- reading through everything again in preparation of this
and I recall there being conversation about the -- the landscaping and the sidewalk on the
east side, which would be, essentially, in phase three being built as part of phase one.
And I apologize I don't remember what the applicant agreed to do in that regard and
whether the -- the applicant was in agreement to put in that landscaping an d sidewalk in
-- you know, in advance of building the multi-family and that being said, would there be
any possibility of, then, going ahead and connecting that road at that time or is that --
does that not line up with -- with putting in the infrastructure and the utilities?
Meridian City Council
July 28, 2020
Page 18 of 81
Clark: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Perreault, that was an item that was discussed at P&Z
at -- you know, at some length. We agreed at that time to build all -- you know, and
confirmed that agreement to build all of Centrepoint, the entire road sections, you know,
with -- with phase one. The concern that we had about doing all of the landscaping, et
cetera, on the east side, you know, up against the apartments, but since they haven't
been designed yet and we would have to go through a public hearing process in
connection with that design, which would further subject that to change and so our
concern is -- is not about -- it's not about costs or anything along those lines, it's a concern
about just having throw away construction and having to redo all of that if we do it prior to
the kind of normal course thing, so -- but I appreciate your point. As I see it, the -- you
know, the question of the apartments would be handled at the same time. Essentially,
you know, when the part -- when the apartments develop that's going to create the stub
into the -- out to the east as well that's going to further address Council Member Bernt's
question. So, it wouldn't be necessary until the -- until -- it wouldn't do anything until the
apartments come online.
Simison: Council, any additional questions for the applicant at this time? Okay. Thank
you very much. Mr. Clerk, I'm going to turn this over to you, because I imagine we have
a few people signed up.
Johnson: Yes, sir, Mr. Mayor, we do have 34 people signed in on this hearing application.
Seven indicated they wish to testify. And the first is Frank Marcos. Mr. Marcos, you are
now able to unmute and turn on your camera if you wish. And it went away, but now it's
coming back. Mr. Mayor, I'm not sure what the difficulty is. It's not allowing me to bring
Mr. Marcos in, but he is able to unmute.
Simison: He does appear to be in.
Johnson: He is in now? Okay.
Simison: He is in the room. And he's out.
Johnson: I'm getting an error message on my screen. I'm going to keep trying here. Mr.
Marcos, thanks for your patience. Mr. Marcos, this is Chris. I don't know what the issue
is on this end, but it's not allowing me to change your status. If you -- we can move on to
the next person. If you can leave the meeting and rejoin we will bring you in as soon as
I see you back in. Mr. Mayor, next I would bring up Susie Mimura. I will change her status
now.
Mimura: I'm present by telephone. Can you hear me?
Simison: Yes, we can. If you could state your name and address for the record.
Mimura: Thank you. Susan Lynn Mimura. It's M as in Mary, I, M as in Mary, u-r-a. My
address at my law firm is 3451 East Copperpoint Drive, Suite 106, Meridian. 83642.
Meridian City Council
July 28, 2020
Page 19 of 81
Simison: Okay. You are recognized for three minutes.
Mimura: Thank you very much. Mayor, Council Members, I appreciate the time that you
are affording me. I represent Mike and Maggie Bernard individually. I have met with a
number of the homeowners at Alpine Pointe and I certainly don't represent all of them. I
know that this is a very contentious issue , but my clients had engaged me to open
discussion with the developer and although initially we did have questions as to the
Council reconsidering, it has afforded us an opportunity to speak with Mr. Clark. Mr. Clark
has indicated that the developer does not oppose Dashwood Place from being an
emergency access only lane. It should be noted that the Fire Department also do not
oppose it. It does provide the secondary access for them to proceed on development.
What I would note is that their modification for accepting a new phase for -- assures the
Council that the connectivity between Centrepoint to Wainwright must be completed
before take -- undertaking any issue related to Dashwood. In further discussion I believe
that listening to -- and I did listen to over an hour and a half of testimony when the
applicant was first before ACHD. ACHD's Commissioner Baker made it very clear that
their province in the review is certainly just to look at the preliminary plat as presented by
the developer. It was not to say that this Council does not have the ability, nor the authority
to make determinations, it is our position that the City Council -- the City of Meridian is
the one that makes the determination related to traffic, the streets, and my clients have
accepted the project with the understanding or discussion that the city should exercise its
authority in making Dashwood Place permanently the fire or safety access only and that
allowed the development to be constructed as such. By doing so on the one hand it
benefits the developer, he would have several more feet -- approximately I think 16 feet
more -- if Dashwood Place was to be constructed in the standards of an emergency
access lane, which is 20 feet. The ACHD report also indicated that Dashwood should be
emergency access at this time with pedestrian only access. I think that in looking at
Meridian city comprehensive plan -- and I know that from the prior discussions that there
was an issue about connectivity and the community. Having the --
Simison: Susie, if you could, please, wrap up, please.
Mimura: I'm sorry?
Simison: If you could, please, wrap up your comments, please.
Mimura: I will. That you are able to connect by promoting alternative modes of
transportation, which is also in your comp plan. By the developer agreeing that they will
connect Centrepoint, you will already have the two accesses and you will not need
Dashwood Place to be connected as a public street, thus providing Alpine Pointe not
being the cut through of approximately 2,000 added daily trips. I think that by --
Simison: Thank you. I --
Mimura: This proposal -- thank you. By this proposal it meets everyone's agreement.
Thank you.
Meridian City Council
July 28, 2020
Page 20 of 81
Simison: Thank you. Council, any questions? Thank you very much.
Johnson: And, Mr. Mayor, the Deputy Clerk's attempting to bring Mr. Marcos in now. See
if she has better luck. We do you see your hand raised. You should be unmuted.
Marcos: Can you hear me now okay, everybody?
Simison: Yes, we can. Thanks, Frank.
Marcos: Great. Okay. Frank Marcos. 2580 East Lacewood Drive, Meridian, Idaho.
83646. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Council Members, Mr. Mayor and city staff. Although
I am the current president of our HOA, I am speaking tonight as a resident and not as a
board member. I have some set to go. Unfortunately, a curveball by the applicant's
attorney has now -- has now put me in a position to address some other issues. First of
all, Mr. Clark identified that there -- that there is no traffic capacity issue. Yes, there is.
Dashwood would feed Wainwright, which, according to his PowerPoint, showed
Wainwright as a mid mile collector. Wainwright will have front facing homes as a -- as a
mid mile collector feeding to McMillan. So, the traffic issue becomes Dashwood and
Centrepoint feeding through Alpine Pointe for everybody wanting to go left on McMillan
Road. So, there is a traffic safety issue. In that few years of our home sales here at
Alpine Pointe 75 percent of our homes have been purchased -- purchased by families --
people with families 12 and under. So, where we were previously more of a 55 and older
type of community with RV garages, we are getting more and more family-oriented
residents coming in and so there is a traffic safety issue if Dashwood is open at this point.
Keeping Dashwood closed to through traffic would greatly reduce that issue. Someone
just said that there were eight connections through Alpine Pointe. That's eight
connections through to McMillan going through residential area with the front facing
driveways. The connection for Centrepoint in phase four, according to Mr. Clark, why not
instead of opening Dashwood connect to Centrepoint. He could very easily throw a road
that would connect to Centrepoint, keeping traffic off of Dashwood and not making it a
collector road. Dashwood was not built as a collector road. Someone just commented
that Centrepoint was -- is being built or has been built as a collector. With all the cars that
are parked on it it's not sufficient. Certainly Dashwood with residents parking their
vehicles on it will also not be sufficient to be a collector road. At the end of the day I hope
that all of you will look to what you had originally said and were concerned about and
that's the safety of your residents. Your residents that have put your decisions in their
hands for their safety and at this point closing Dashwood to vehicular traffic on a
permanent basis is the right decision. Several of you made that decision and we hope
that you would go that direction again. I'm not going to get into the particulars about the
reconsideration letter, which we have some concerns about, but you have heard Mr.
Clark, you have heard our residents, you have seen our number of testimonies or letters,
please understand that we are about the safety of our residents, not just creating an in-
fill project that will have access through a residential area. So, hopefully, you will see
that, you will debate that, and you will understand that it should be the safety of the
residents of Dashwood and all of Alpine Pointe as your main concern.
Meridian City Council
July 28, 2020
Page 21 of 81
Simison: Thank you, Mr. Marcos.
Marcos: And what I --
Simison: If you could, please, summarize.
Marcos: Thank you. We are not concerned about trying to stop the project, but we want
it to be a smart project and connecting Dashwood doesn't do that. So, please, consider
voting to either deny or keep Dashwood as a vehicular -- or a pedestrian and bike pass
through only. Thank you very much.
Simison: All right. Thank you. Council, any questions from Mr. Marcos? Okay. Thank
you very much.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, next -- Mr. Mayor, next is Malissa Bernard.
Simison: If you could state your name and address for the record. You will be recognized
for three minutes.
Bernard: I would like to speak for the HOA, please. Would I be allowed the ten minutes
as chairwoman of the neighborhood outreach committee for Alpine Pointe HOA?
Simison: Okay. You are recognized for ten minutes.
Bernard: Hello. My name is Malissa Bernard. I live at 40225 North Dashwood Place in
Meridian. That is 83646. The only way I would ever support this project is if Dashwood
Place is emergency only in perpetuity and bike and pedestrian access. Connectivity in
many ways and for pushing for pathways and such this might be a good alternative to --
to introduce this very vital sort of connectivity. Against the bulk of Delano's plan as it
stands and unless these changes are made specifically to this street , there are also
concerns with the density to the north to the adjacent homes. I don't know if I can share
a screen, if someone could help me with this.
Simison: Chris, could you help her share a screen?
Bernard: -- share a screen option that I --
Johnson: Mrs. Bernard, you can hit share screen right in your Zoom. You have that
ability.
Bernard: Okay. Here we go. Okay. Now we are up. Can you see my screen? Okay.
As we can see there has been very much a -- there hasn't been much change between
the plan presented in 2019 to the present plan. In fact, it's a carbon copy, except for
increased density on the R-40 -- or R-15 parcels -- that they are asking for R-40, three to
four story project -- or product in this project. I do not think this is compatible. It was a
view shed. We have R-4 homes behind us. So, I would consider perhaps R-15 for this
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July 28, 2020
Page 22 of 81
sort of parcel -- for the Cook parcel. There is not a named builder or company, charter
price point. There seems to be far too many modifiers. This annexation and rezone
without dedication, passion, and follow through is going to result in a run-of-the-mill in-fill
project. In-fill projects should be held to strict standards, not the bare minimum to barely
meet the Comprehensive Plan and as you can see from this illustration here these slides
are well over 15,000 square feet. They average 15,000 -- nearly 15,300 square feet. The
average lot size of the adjacent to Alpine Pointe is 5,661. That's a three to one ratio and
it's not necessarily a two to one ratio. So, I don't think the neighbors are seeking apples
to apples. They are seeking a better transition to their properties that are adjacent to
Delano. And we also have to remember that place is in your code as a closed cul-de-sac
or a dead-end street. And in all of -- many of your streets throughout the valley we know
that place is a closed cul-de-sac or a dead-end street. So, no one was foolish when they
bought in Dashwood Place. No one was foolish. The name implies in your code, in Ada
county's code. Furthermore, I would like to address the emergency access at Dashwood.
It is within your purview as City Council to grant as to the emergency access. You do not
need ACHD's okay or their approval on this. This is the power that 's granted to you by
code and -- and you can waive that. You -- you get to choose where your transportation
needs are and if this is going to be a problem as a de facto collector, then, perhaps the
best thing to do is to do that to -- to really rescue our neighborhood from a fate that no
one knew in 2005 when this was accepted and the master street map and COMPASS
didn't come into play until 2008 -- 2009 during the retrofit of the collector street elements.
Also we are very high density to the south. As you can see from this we have got the
Brickyard. We have four-plexes. We are going to have Stellars. We don't know what the
Stellars is going to -- we don't know how big it's going to be. We have all the commercial.
We have the possibilities of the Wong parcel and who asked the Wongs or Enslers what
they would want. I have spoken to both Mrs. Wong and Mr. Ensler called me this evening.
They would prefer one story behind them. Nobody asked them. Well, I'm telling you now.
I propose that perhaps for a transition from all this three story product that we consider a
two story product. This would be R-15. It could be transitional. And it would also help
with the traffic pattern and heaviness that we are going to be experiencing in this area.
Here is a very attractive with multi-phases. It is attractive. I don't think anyone wants
three to four stories moving behind them in the future . We need to transition from those
three story products and this might be a good fit for that parcel. Traffic patterns. I pointed
out the 330 foot rule for access points on collectors. If Wainwright is the vehicle collector,
then, we should hold this to the standard. It is roughly 180 feet -- 185 feet maybe -- 179,
something like that, for both points from Dashwood. This isn't a safe street for -- it's
probably fine for a cul-de-sac of very low use, 76 trips per day. When you start increasing
this for 2,000 trips per day, then, you do not have the same spacing on a collector. So, I
think I have pointed this out the last time. We can pretend the traffic isn't coming. It's
coming. We realize that. We accept that. But we still object to having it run through
streets that were never designed to handle it. We are designed to residential streets here
and we are being retrofitted as mid mile collectors. We were approved in 2005. The mid
mile collector retrofit did not come into place until maybe 2008 , 2009. We also need to
think about what's across the street from us. We get everything across Wainwright from
Records. So, as the parcels develop to the east of us we are going to be funneling that
traffic in the loop via Wainwright to cut through to Locust Grove and also up to McMillan.
Meridian City Council
July 28, 2020
Page 23 of 81
We have all front-on housing. There is very little of our streets that do not have front-on
housing. So, maybe consider this as well. And it is named a collector. They keep
changing where the goal post is on the collector, whether it's this street or another street.
Well, what's happening is it is going to be a full collector throughout Alpine Pointe. So,
we need to prepare for when that is going to occur. And we should be held to collect or
street standards for access points. If you use Dashwood in proximity to Rosepoint it is a
dangerous situation and the 330 foot minimum that always applies and also approved
access points may be relocated and repurposed in the future as the land use intensifies.
Now if there is -- I believe this would qualify as an increase and it changed and perhaps
these access points need to be reconsidered. The stub street to a landlocked parcel for
the Wagnilds -- not the Bollingers. It's no longer planned. They have everything they
need at Centrepoint Way. So, we need perhaps to reconsider the access points of
Dashwood Place, which we have seen since 2005. It may not fit 2020 standards. And
as you can see here is some measurements. You know, the Centrepoint Way a collector
is only going to be 540 feet away. I think if you add Dashwood you are going to add an
overconnection to the situation and also for the stopping sight distance. The minimum
sight -- sight distance that is required by ACHD is 200 feet. This is where 200 feet runs.
It runs between -- to Maple on a curve. This is the view. These two Maples are a way
out here. This was in May. This is where you are going to have 2,000 trips per day
coming to this point and this point right here it's 179 feet away. That is not to collector
access standard, nor is it safe. We have cars going 40, 45 miles per hour sometimes on
the streets. So, it's not safe for anyone in the neighborhood. It's not safe for the people
who might be living in Delano. So, we need to reconsider this.
Simison: If you could go ahead and wrap up, please.
Bernard: As you can see this is -- I will wrap up it. Thank you, sir. If we are closed to
vehicular traffic there are two future access points. Every street in Alpine Pointe is
important. So, we need to consider mitigation standards before the traffic problems
happen. We need to think about road s. We need to think about retrofitting a
neighborhood from 2005 to 200 -- or 2020 standards. The traffic is coming. We are over-
urbanized in our area and we really ask for your consideration. It is within your purview
by ACHD. The city has final authority to implement conditions related to the transportation
system. This right was granted to you by Supreme Court decision in 2003. Please I ask
you to consider our neighbors and our neighborhood . This comes before every ACHD
meeting, this disclaimer of it does fall within your land use and your land use decision.
Thank you so very much. I'm glad you are all well. I really appreciate you. Happy to see
you this evening. Do you have any questions?
Simison: Council, any questions?
Bernard: Thank you so much.
Simison: Okay.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, n ext is Laura Trairatnobas.
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July 28, 2020
Page 24 of 81
Simison: Laura, you are muted. If you could unmute yourself and state your name and
address for the record.
Trairatnobas: Can you hear me now? Okay. Good. Thank you. I hope you don't hear
my dog, too. I am Laura Trairatnobas. 4621 North Camas Creek Way here in the Alpine
Pointe Subdivision. You have heard and seen me before and are probably tired of it. So,
I'm going to keep it really short and sweet. This is what I want to say. If we can keep
Dashwood closed until Centrepoint opens sometime in the next ten years, then, we can
keep Dashwood closed permanently forever. Think about the logic of that. If we can
handle the traffic with both Dashwood and Centrepoint closed, then, why can't we handle
it with Centrepoint only once it opens up? Now, if Dashwood has emergency access,
great, we need that. If it has pedestrian and bicycle access I think that's fine. I might
want to ride my bike over to Panera sometime and I think connectivity doesn't necessarily
have to be by way of cars, why can't it be bicycles and people walking. So, let's encourage
less car use, more bicycle and walking use. Let's keep it emergency only in perpetuity
with bicycles and pedestrians allowed and as Malissa has clearly stated, it is within your
purview as the Council to make this decision and I ask you to make it tonight. Please,
just put us all out of our misery. We have all been through this for two -- more than two
years now. So, let's just -- let's make this our final night together, folks. Thank you very
much for your time. Bye.
Simison: Thank you. Council, any questions? All right. Thank you, Laura.
Trairatnobas: Thank you.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, next is Patty Pitzer.
Pitzer: Good evening. Can you hear me?
Simison: Yes, we can, Patty.
Pitzer: Thank you. Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council. Thank you for hearing us tonight.
Although I am a Planning and Zoning Commissioner, I am speaking on behalf of myself.
I am here on behalf of the six of the seven property owners. The Argos, Schumachers,
Jobs, Kings to the north and Suzanna Walch to the east. We are opposed to the lot
transition along the northern border. If I could get -- let me see if I can search through
here. Thank you. So, on --
Simison: Patty? Patty, can you make sure you speak closely into the mic so we can all
hear you and at the end of your testimony I need you to state your name and address for
the record.
Pitzer: Oh. Thank you. Yes. Patty Pitzer. 2703 East Wainwright Drive, Meridian. Am I
better now?
Simison: Right there you are great.
Meridian City Council
July 28, 2020
Page 25 of 81
Pitzer: Okay. Great. On November 12th, 2019, this was heard. Commissioner Bernt
and Cavener opined that southern portion was fine. The northern border needed to be
reworked. That was his top left item. At that time Jim Conger stood before you and said,
quote: We don't want a denial, we would look at the northern borders. That would be
traditional lots similar to what's across the street -- across the fence from us. Unquote.
Council, Mayor, with all due respect I submit that this is not to happen. Our lots are 1,530
-- 15,000 square feet and the lots proposed are 15,000 square feet. There would be five
homes behind the Schumacher property alone. Hardly similar to what's across the street.
These are our houses here. This is the Schumacher property that has five houses across
there. This is not similar in any fashion. As Malissa stated, this is really a rework of the
plan from January 2019 to -- to today is almost identical. So, not a lot of hard work. They
did reduce the density from 85 to 66, but that was something that increased the lot sizes
in the middle. They did not fit the northern border. Now, I was taught don't come to me
with a problem, come with a solution. Several options have been offered to the applicant
and I noticed that he has seen many great transitional in -fill projects. Here -- here are
some examples of well done transition that could be done here. R-4 to the north. R-8 in
the middle. R-15 to the back. There could be an ingress-egress heading out to the future
property of the Wongs and the Walkers. I mean why a shared drive when we are -- there
is -- we are looking for that new ingress-egress in the future to go through what may be
commercial or possibly another small in-fill. We ask that you provide this application as
it stands and have the applicant come back with a feasible plan that holds Meridia n as a
premier community, instead of just low hanging fruit. We feel they have had more than
ample opportunity to accomplish this task, but, instead, just gives us plan B. And, then,
last, the time allowed. When ACHD approved the initial plat it was with a -- it was with
660 feet going down Jasmine from Centrepoint, which created natural connectivity. Now
the new plan coming here creates a hard right and becomes a de facto all the way from
Ustick to McMillan.
Simison: Patty, if you could, please, wrap up your testimony.
Pitzer: So, Mr. Mayor, thank you. So, this yellow line is what is taking you from Ustick
through their subdivision to our subdivision and here. Hobby Lobby, Fast Eddy's, you
name it, they are going to find that route very soon. So, in closing I thank you. Perhaps
this in-fill is just premature before the infrastructure. And I will stand for any questions.
Simison: Council, any questions for Patty?
Pitzer: Thank you, everybody. Have a great evening.
Simison: Thank you, Patty.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, next is Kenneth Clifford.
Simison: Mr. Clifford, if you could state your name and address for the record and you
will be recognized for three minutes. You will need to unmute your microphone.
Meridian City Council
July 28, 2020
Page 26 of 81
Cavener: Mr. Mayor, you were a little faint there. Mr. Clifford might not have been able
to hear you.
Simison: Mr. Clifford, if you can unmute your microphone. There you go.
Clifford: How about that?
Simison: There you go. That's great. If you can state your name and address for the
record. You will be recognized for three minutes.
Clifford: I can't hear you.
Johnson: Mr. Clifford, can you hear this?
Cavener: Mr. Clifford, I think I heard the Mayor say that he was going to recognize you
for three minutes.
Clifford: Okay. Can you hear me?
Simison: Yes, we can.
Clifford: Okay. All right. Sorry for that. My name is Kenneth J. Clifford. 4523 North
Rosepoint Place, Meridian, Idaho. 83646. Good evening, Mayor and City Council
Members. I oppose this application as submitted an d appeal to the City Council to deny
both the request for annexation and zoning of the 15.22 acres , unless the maximum
zoning is restricted to R-15 and deny the request for the preliminary plat of Delano
Subdivision, unless the North Dashwood Place cul-de-sac is permanently closed to
through traffic. Opening the North Dashwood Place cul-de-sac will create critical safety
issues and as a de facto commercial collector violates ACHD and Meridian city rules for
commercial collector streets regarding the required minimum 330 feet distance between
access points, front-on housing, driveway spacing, traffic conflict mitigation and stopping
sight distances. Meridian City Council created this problem in 2005 and Meridian City
Council can and should correct it now. The absolute and non-negotiable decision for --
of the City Council should be to permanently close North Dashwood Place to through
traffic. For the past two and a half years this developer has bee n trying to fit a square
peg into a round hole. Over the past one and a half years or so Alpine Pointe residents
have submitted countless pages of documentation and many hours of written and oral
testimony supporting the reasons why this application should be denied. If it cannot be
developed without forcing access through North Dashwood Place it does not fit. If it
cannot smoothly provide transition from residential to commercial it does not fit. If this
design cannot facilitate an acceptable connectio n to the Centrepoint Way commercial
collector it does not fit. It's obvious to me that the Delano Subdivision as submitted is just
the wrong development for this in-fill at this time and on two separate occasions,
November 12th, 2019, and May 12th, 2020, Meridian City Council agreed with this
conclusion. Therefore, in conclusion, I -- I request that the Council deny the request for
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July 28, 2020
Page 27 of 81
annexation and zoning of 15.22 acres as submitted and deny the request for the
preliminary plat for Delano Subdivision as submitted. Thank you.
Simison: Thank you, Mr. Clifford. Council, any questions? Appreciate it very much.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, the last of the in advance signups is Mike Bernard. He's coming
into the meeting now.
Simison: Okay. For anyone else who is in the Zoom call, if you would like to testify on
this item, please, raise your hand using the raise hand function at the bottom of your
screen. That way the Clerk can be prepared when it's your time to speak. Mr. Bernard,
if you state your name and address for the record and you will be recognized for three
minutes. Mr. Bernard, we have no audio from you.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Mr. Borton.
Borton: While -- while we are waiting for Mr. Bernard's audio, a short question to our
planning staff and to the applicant. Not to answer now, but at the end and when the
applicant comes back is if Condition 1-F was instead drafted that had phase four could
not commence until Centrepoint Way is connected and that Dashwood would remain
emergency pedestrian only, as opposed to reopening in phase four, if that altered
Condition 1-F would be acceptable or if there were reasons it shouldn't be done that way.
Not to answer now, but to address at the end. Just a heads up with a question that will
come up.
Johnson: Mr. Bernard, try now. We still have no audio -- no audio, but I do have Malissa's
audio on, if you can connect through her.
M.Bernard: Okay. How about now? Can somebody give me an audio check? I apologize
for those technical difficulties. My name is Michael Bernard. I live at 4025 North
Dashwood Place. Now, I prepared comments tonight. Quite honestly I'm surprised we
are here again. I think we all know that this has already been denied -- denied effectively
three times. Once at P&Z, once most recently that you are all familiar with, and, then,
effectively a denial during the last administration that many of you were involved with
where instead of an actual denial, it was remanded back to P&Z. Now, during that
remanded decision the Mayor nearly dressed down the applicant at that time and
reminded him that his development would actually change the character of our
neighborhood and I think you see that's why so many of us are particularly upset with the
resolution. Now, I think a lot of us believe and know we live in a pretty good neighborhood.
But let me give you a little bit of flavor, because I think, unfortunately, since this has been
going on for so long, we forget that this isn't just a thing, this isn't just a development, this
is really about people, this is really about a bunch of citizens. I mean we have over 220
homes here, well over double that. I mean -- and this category of folks that live here are
people that like to live and spend our money locally. The category of people who live here
Meridian City Council
July 28, 2020
Page 28 of 81
routinely vote, right, and we care deeply, not only about the city, but specifically a little
piece of that that we call Alpine Pointe. So, you know, when -- when there is things to
happen -- when there is a snowstorm neighbors shovel snow and there is a community
project. People come together with their shovel and rake in hand. And I'm not talking
young folks, I'm talking old folks. Maybe spend 30 minutes, maybe you spend all day, but
they come in droves. You should see it. And let me tell you quick another story. Now, if
you had audio you would see me grinning a little bit, so don't be afraid to smile. But when
you or on high decided to cancel Fourth of July for us little minions, you know, that was
quite upsetting. I mean during the COVID time. We couldn't celebrate it as we normally
would celebrate. I see you appreciate what I'm saying. Well, there is a young man that
lives in our neighborhood that has some physical challenges. He comes around the
neighborhood doing little chores on his three wheel bicycle, because that's the best mode
of his transport. He was upset about that and he said to Frank, our president, he said,
Frank, we should have a parade. So, within about seven days they organized a parade
and we had like 75 people show up and decorated bicycles and wagons and cars and
people from the next door neighbor -- and that's the flavor of Alpine Pointe. I'm trying to
-- I'm trying to capture what you guys may not be able to understand. We live in a very
tight community. We care very closely about each other. It's nearly family. Th ere is
people walking dogs, riding bikes all over the place all the time and as Mike mentioned
we are getting younger and younger all the time. There is more children. Here is the
point. You have heard this testimony. You know the opposition is overwhelming. There
has been over 45 pieces of written testimony submitted in the last three or four days and
so here is -- here is where I see you guys are at, in my opinion. We need to solve this
and the solution really is only in two ways. One is a four -- ultimately a fourth denial. Now
that hurts everyone involved. That means we need to go through this pain in the future.
That means the current property owners have to continue to deal with how they go about
selling their property. Or maybe we find a solution that maybe isn't perfect , but it's
acceptable for most of them and that is Mr. Clark, the representative of the developer, has
agreed that he doesn't need Dashwood Place until phase four. He doesn't need
Dashwood Place until Centrepoint punches through. So, if he doesn't need it then he
doesn't need it now. We get the connectivity via bicycle and, excuse me, foot traffic. It's
all ADA compatible. So, the folks that live on my street that are in wheelchairs can maybe
access that and maybe go down and have a cup of coffee. So, add those conditions,
either deny it wholeheartedly or add the condition that it be built to emergency access
only specifications and you build it in such a way that it stays that way in perpetuity.
Nobody come back and backtrack on that and, then, reclaim it as a public right of way.
Fix this once and for all tonight. Alpine Pointe can have some rest. The developer can
move forward. You can put this behind you and you can have this special little info project
and the two property owners that have been hung up by this can move on with their lives.
That concludes my prepared statement. I will stand by. If not, I would appreciate your
consideration tonight. I realize this has been a challenge for all involved , both prior
administration and now, but let's make this right. Okay? Let's make this right tonight. As
right as it can possibly be for everyone that's worried or concerned.
Simison: Council, any questions? Thank you very much.
Meridian City Council
July 28, 2020
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Johnson: Mr. Mayor, next is -- listed is Sandy. I think that's Sandy King.
King: Yes. Can you hear me?
Simison: Yes, we can. If you could state your name and address for the record.
King: Great. My name is Sandy King. I live at 2453 East Honeywood Court in Alpine
Pointe. I want to thank the Mayor and all of the Council Members for taking the time to
listen to us. I know you all sort of have a life beyond this and we all do appreciate what
you do and the time you give us. So , I'm going to do more of a ballpoint kind of a
presentation. I'm going to be quick and I'm going to read it to save time. So , I am asking
that the Council and the Mayor -- if the Mayor ends up making a split decision -- to please
deny the Delano application in its current form. I agree with Mike and Laura that
Dashwood needs to be completely closed. If it can be closed for up to ten years it can be
closed permanently to traffic. Whether you allow foot traffic and bicycle, that's kind of an
option. Maybe. Okay? I would like to see it completely closed, but if you are willing to
close it with just the foot traffic it's livable. I think what gets missed is that with the
Brickyards, which are commonly called the Barracks for a good reason, with the traffic
that you see on the street, can you imagine the number of people that would be coming
through Dashwood. They won't be on Centrepoint, because it won't exist and speaking
of Centrepoint, the Centrepoint originally was supposed to cut through to Bald Cypress.
Perhaps that's a better option, because Bald Cypress homes back onto that street, not
face on to it. The other issue would be the apartments. If you limit them to two story, not
three story, that is transition from home to two story apartment, to three story apartment.
I think that is a strong consideration that should be looked at. The daily traffic from the
Brickyard from the homes, from the apartments, from the senior living, from Hobby Lobby,
from the service station, from Dick's Sporting Goods, Kohl's, all of that will funnel through
if Dashwood remains open, because it is going to be the path of least resistance. They
don't want to go to Eagle Road, because you can't go anywhere during rush hour. They
are wanting to get to Locust Grove and McMillan to leave. Delano's ability to exit was
one of the arguments to use Dashwood is not an argument. They just proved that tonight
in their own presentation. There are multiple ways out. So, if the city services are already
on the Cook property, which they are, we zoomed in on Google and you could see the
access is already there, you do not need Dashwood. Please do not ignore the impact to
the neighbors of Alpine Pointe. We are passionate. We are family, quite honestly. We
look like a Norman Rockwell picture in the winter shoveling everyone's driveway and
sidewalk. You will destroy that relationship in our subdivision if it becomes traffic ridden.
Dashwood and the creation of Centrepoint Way did not show up on the master street plan
until 2018. So, there is no way any of us who purchased, you know, prior to 2012 or
during that time frame had no way of knowing that Centrepoint Way was going to exist.
There were no signs. There was no notation on -- on the street map. And --
Simison: Sandy, could you --
King: I guess my last request -- I am wrapping it up and I appreciate your timing. Thank
you. My last request is to please reconsider using Centrepoint Way to Bald
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July 28, 2020
Page 30 of 81
Cress -- Bald Cypress rather than coming up to Wainwright. And, then, it's connected
and you don't have to wait for the Wong property to sell or anything else to be developed.
The streets are already there and you could connect. If you wanted to change the light
and remove it from Wainwright and go to Bald Cypress and Centrepoint Way, you would
have it. It would be a done deal. So, thank you for your time. If you have any questions
let me know. Again, I'm glad you are all safe and healthy and happy summer. Thank you.
Simison: Council, any questions? Okay.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, next is Joy Cameron.
Simison: Joy, if you could state your name and address for the record. You will be
recognized for three minutes. And just need to unmute your microphone.
Cameron: Hi. Joy Cameron. And 4211 North Chelmsford Avenue in Alpine Pointe,
Meridian. Good evening, Mayor and City Council Members. I just want to address just a
couple things and be done. One was the fact that we currently have three entrances and
exits already. So, we have the Wainwright, the Camas Creek at McMillan, but we also
have Settlers Bridge, which also cuts through our neighborhood also. We do have those
three points. Mr. Clark had mentioned that all of the different exits be able to go out of
the shopping center and where the housing is, but with respect to Wainwright that is
actually the only left turn to get onto Eagle Road and so when people are trying to hurry
to get through to the high school, to get down to the grocery store, anywhere else, that's
where they cut through to to hit our light and take a quick left. Every signal is a right turn
only into our neighborhood. And, then, the other thing is that I have brought up before is
going to be school traffic. Hopefully kids will be back in school soon, but we do have a
lot of kids at the Brickyard. There will be even more kids in those houses and the schools
that they will be going to will be off of McMillan and, then, also off Eagle Road, so they
will be cutting through our neighborhood to miss all of that traffic to get down McMillan to
get to the middle schools and the high school and , then, also through Wainwright. And
so with all the kids, with our seniors and everything else, that's a lot of impact traffic of
school buses and carpooling that will definitely -- we also have the preschool that's right
at the beginning of our entrance off of Eagle Road. So, that's additional traffic for those
kids and a lot of times those kids are outside, because they have no place else to go, and
they are playing right on Wainwright at the street there. And, lastly, we have several
families in our neighborhood that have special needs, both intellectual and physical, and
we have several people that are in wheelchairs and so, again, for the safety of our -- our
homeowners and especially there in Dashwood we have several families that have
special needs and I have to agree with keeping Dashwood closed to cars. I feel that that
is in the best interest of the safety of our neighborhood on both sides. So, that's all I have
to say. So, thank you.
Simison: Thank you very much. Council, any questions? All right. Appreciate it very
much.
Cameron: Thank you.
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July 28, 2020
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Johnson: Mr. Mayor, the last person with their hand raised is Mr. Dave Martin.
Martin: Hey, fantastic. Good evening, Mayor, Council -- Council folk. Dave Martin.
Address 2363 Freezeout Road, Caldwell, Idaho. 83607. I represent Stellar Senior Living
and just would love to hear some clarification. So, if you will notice from their map it goes
through our parcel and back out on the north side. Our approval for -- for our development
there is -- is limited on the trips in and out of that parcel. Senior Living has very low trip
count, which is good. It doesn't put too many -- too many trips back on Eagle Road. But
having access through our parcel would -- would be a safety hazard for our residents.
The average age of our residents is 85 and those that come to visit are of very similar
demographic. We are for Delano being developed and we are happy to provide
emergency access and that's what our plans show and that's what Meridian approved is
emergency access through what is currently Jasmine Lane onto their -- onto their parcel.
But we -- it's not part of Meridian's -- or not part of Boise's plan or part of our plan to have
just open access into our parcel, even back out to -- to Wainwright in the future. So, just
want to share that, maybe hear -- hear their thoughts or their plans of how that would
work. But we are more than willing to provide emergency access with -- with a gait or
bollards into -- into their parcel. Thank you.
Simison: Thank you, Mr. Martin. Council, any questions? Is there anybody else who
would like to provide testimony on this application at this time ? If so please indicate by
raising your hand in the Zoom or star nine on the phone. Seeing nobody else from my
end -- Mr. Clerk, can you confirm that as well?
Johnson: Confirmed.
Simison: I will turn this over to the applicant for his final comments, unless, Mr. Bongiorno,
do you have something you need to weigh in at this point in time?
Bongiorno: I do. Mr. Mayor and Council, I just want to make sure that everyone is all on
the same page. Listening to Council Member Bernt speak and to kind of address Council
Member Borton's comment as well -- and I don't know if I'm early, I can wait until after the
applicant speaks, but emergency access -- obviously we in the Fire Department and the
Police Department -- everything is time. Time is golden for us and bollards and gates
and these temporary measures are a barricade for us. So, the best thing for the Fire
Department -- the best thing for Fire EMS is an open roadway and so for ultimate safety
-- yes, bollards work and bollards can be used , but the best thing is an open roadway.
So, I just wanted to make sure that that is -- is brought up. Planning staff and myself are
working with our developers to make sure that -- we are trying to limit these emergency
accesses, because it's best just to get us a road. Get us a road in there. That way if your
house is on fire or your loved one is having a heart attack, there is no barrier or barricade
or bollard or gate that will keep us from getting to your loved ones and so I just wanted to
throw that comment out there to make sure that the best thing for the fire department is
an open road. Thank you.
Simison: Council, any questions for the deputy chief ? Okay.
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Allen: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Yes, Sonya.
Allen: Excuse me. If I could respond to some of the earlier access questions from Council
and comments. There are several comp plan policies that support extension of public
streets and interconnectivity between neighborhoods. So, that's -- that's one of the big
things. The UDC also requires access to be provided from a local street. I believe that's
what one of the Councilmen was referencing earlier. Access should be provided from a
local street when available and that was why staff's requirement for extension of
Dashwood was required. Council can waive that requirement. There is a provision of
code that allows a waiver. However, Council should remember that ACHD is also
requiring extension of Dashwood as a public street as well. So, even if Council approves
this tonight, ACHD would also have to -- excuse me -- approve -- does not require
extension of Dashwood as a public street. ACHD is still requiring it eventually in ten years.
Simison: Thank you. Council, any questions for Sonya on that point? I see a couple
questioned looks.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I think it's a question for Mr. Nary if that's okay.
Simison: Yes.
Strader: So, I understand what the UDC and the comp plan states and I understand that
it is almost always a preference to have a street, but it sounded like ACHD has confirmed
that Council has the authority to permanently close Dashwood and I would like to know if
Mr. Nary agrees with that, based on the earlier testimony from the ACHD disclaimer and
the feedback that they have provided to an attorney.
Nary: So, thank you. Mr. Mayor, Members of Council, Council Member Strader. So,
ACHD's policy only allows them to make a ten year recommendation. That's what the ten
years is from. So, it isn't -- it's their policy that prohibits them from recommending anything
beyond ten years. You can make it a permanent emergency access . You cannot close
the road. So, the road vacation would be an ACHD decision or it could not be a -- no
longer a roadway. They have their own rules on how that gets done. But you can make
it an emergency access only. So, that is within your purview. So, obviously, the nuances
is what kind of the conversation has been as what authority does the Council have.
Ultimately your authority is the land use approval, the layout of the property, the plat that's
being proposed and the accesses to that and as Sonya pointed out, 11 -3A-3 does have
language that says you can waive that provision that requires access on local streets and
not collectors when local streets are available. So, that is an action you have taken in the
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July 28, 2020
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past or the Council has taken in the past for various projects. So, it is something you can
consider.
Strader: Thank you.
Simison: Councilman Cavener, does that answer your question or did you have additional
questions?
Cavener: Mr. Mayor, no, I think Councilman Strader touched exactly where I was headed.
Simison: Okay. Council, any further questions before I ask the applicant to close? Okay.
Mr. Clark, you are recognized for ten minutes for closing.
Clark: Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Hethe Clark for the record. 251 East Front Street in Boise.
So, it's been a bit of a night and I'm sure we are all kind of struggling at this point. It's
been a long road. I do want to talk about the history here for a second and, then, circle
back on some of these traffic related concerns. So, what is the history? This project was
not denied back in November. It was remanded with direction and that direction was to
go back, talk to the neighbors, address the transition, lose density and -- and reconsider
the connection to Dashwood. As you will recall those connections were previously
inverted and there was a gate down at Jasmine and the project was going to take access
through Dashwood until Centrepoint connected. So, I -- at that point that's when I stepped
firmly into the picture and it's disappointing to me to hear the way that this has been
portrayed in terms of those neighbor conversations. We did have the two meetings. We
-- I gave them everything that they asked for. The only thing I couldn't deliver, because
it's within ACHD's hands and yours, is this -- a permanent closure at Dashwood. We were
asked to lose transit -- lose lots on the northern border. We went from 15 to 11. We
increased the square footage by 50 percent. We made the lot lines match where we
could and the number that was given to me by the board at that point was 6,000 square
feet. We got the 5,800. You know, we gave up 22 percent of the lots. We reoriented
them. We even made the park for Pete's sake, bigger and kept it near Alpine Pointe's
access. So, this is -- you know, it's -- you know, I understand, you know, stepping in and
fighting for your neighborhood, but I -- I'm a little bit disappointed in the way that this has
been described in terms of us not having done any hard work, because I personally have
been involved in all of that since November. One other item before we circle on to traffic.
With regard to the R-40 parcel and the future apartments, there is some things that are
missing from the conversation from the neighbors. You know, one is that that does require
a subsequent conditional use permit where the impacts of those apartments are going to
be studied. Alpine Pointe is separated from those apartments. There is no -- there is no
common boundary there. The common boundary of the apartment parcel are with the
Brickyard and with the senior living center and those are two and three story buildings
right next to it. So, to suggest, then, that something like that is -- is improper, not only
doesn't reflect the facts on the ground, but it doesn't reflect the fact that this is going to
require an additional conditional use permit later. So , let's -- let's circle back on some of
these traffic and safety issues. With regard to the Brickyard and the parking, the
Brickyard's built to city parking standards and we, as anyone knows, that that's a difficult
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thing to make sure you get satisfied. If there are issues with the parking and the Brickyard
or safety concerns, those are addressed by Meridian City Code. Those are not within our
control. If that's the problem, then, that's something that the city needs to look at in terms
of their code provisions or their -- or their code enforcement. You know, as we -- as we
talk about this -- and I think it's important to talk about what the connection is down to the
south into the -- excuse me -- the gridded area that we have talked about, I just want to
show you just a quick picture of what that area looks like and -- with the parking on both
sides. So, this is Centrepoint looking south and just a couple of items to add to what we
discussed previously. A collector is designed for parking on both sides. Parking on a
collector is not a safety issue. Arterials are not parked. The collectors are. And if -- if we
think about this from a practical perspective, empty roads create racetrack. Parking on
the sides of a collector actually slows people down and actually helps with the safety
situation in and of itself. It is safe to be parked on that collector. The -- you know, and,
then, in terms of the -- the capacities, which really we have -- we can't lose sight of that.
The capacity of what are used, identify safety issues here. With regard to Wainwright,
the ACHD finding on that was on -- and I quote: Wainwright Drive west of Eagle Road is
projected to operate within acceptable levels of service planning threshold through all
phases of this development. Close quote. With regard to the -- and ACHD has confirmed,
you know, the -- the sight distances on -- on Wainwright are acceptable. Dashwood.
ACHD has confirmed that Dashwood operate -- will -- will at build out operate within an
acceptable level of service. Centrepoint. ACHD has confirmed that it will operate within
an acceptable level of service at built out. So, that the evidence in the record is that. So,
again, what was the problem that we discussed back in May? The problem was that
Centrepoint to Dashwood connection timing. We have proposed a solution and I just
want to clarify that ACHD has approved -- approved that solution and that approval is not
limited to ten years. The prior temporary was limited to ten years, because it was going
to be ACHD's right of way from the beginning. But because we are holding that out it's
not ACHD's right of way, they don't have the same tenure limitation that we have
discussed. So, it would stay that way until the -- it would stay closed until Centrepoint
actually connects. So, it -- it truly does solve the issue that was the focus of the last
hearing. Now, if this doesn't go, you got to ask yourself what happens next. Because
you just -- you just can't avoid the question. It creates a chicken -- a chicken and the egg
problem. This property and the Wong property are subject to the exact same rationale.
Wainwright is about 55 to 60 percent capacity. Centrepoint will be at 55 to 60 percent
capacity. So, you have the exact same traffic thresholds for both . If you are going to
deny one based on their not being a connection you are going to have to deny the other
and keep in mind that one is within the area of impact of Meridian. The other is in the
area of impact of Boise. So, the likelihood of those two parcels going at the same time is
remote. So, I just -- I just want to close by just saying, again, in-fill is hard. You know, I
have -- I have felt that for a long time. I feel that no more with this app -- than I have with
this application. But -- but, Council Members, you know, your concern at the last hearing
was the timing of the Dashwood connection and we have solved that. The area traffic
capacities are well within hand. So, we are asking for you to approve, because there is
no traffic reason to deny it at this point. We have done we believe what it takes to get an
approval. We appreciate your patience in listening to all this and call it a night. Thanks.
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Simison: Thank you, Mr. Clark. Council, any questions?
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: Hethe, can you comment real briefly on the question that I posed in the middle
of the public testimony with regards to a modified 1-F and in light of Mr. Nary's comments
that -- is it at least an option to have a 1-F condition be -- nothing with phase -- your new
phase four until Centrepoint Way is fully connected and that Dashwood, which will be
emergency access, remains emergency pedestrian access even through phase four.
Clark: Yeah. Mr. Mayor, Council Member Borton, so you will recall that that actually was
my initial proposal was to try to get that to be emergency only. So, we have no opposition
to that. And so I -- I don't have a reason to oppose that at all. The -- I think I will just
leave it at that. You know, we have -- we have been hearing, you know, ACHD's points
on this and we have heard staff's points on this and we have heard what we thought was
Council's points on this, but we have tried to be open to -- to solutions. But, again, we
are not opposed whatsoever to that being an emergency condition -- an emergency only.
Borton: Okay. Thanks.
Simison: Council Woman Perreault, do you have a question?
Perreault: Thank you. Mr. Clark, the mixed use regional comp plan FLUM assignment
to that eastern property, which will be developed in phase three, what other consideration
was made for uses on that property and can you give us a little background in how you
came to the decision -- or how your -- how your client came to the decision that the multi-
family would be the best to use and trade off for another use that's allowed in that -- in
that area?
Clark: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Perreault, thanks for the question. So, you know, the
-- the conversations between the cities and -- and -- that we had between the cities went
on for, you know, quite a while. Back in -- I think it was in October of last year we went in
front of Boise city and the one thing that we heard over and over at -- from a couple of
different council members was that they didn't want to see a low density use of this
property and they were -- they were basically sending a shot across the bow that we are
-- we -- not we, but the city council of Boise was saying we understand that it makes more
sense for this to develop in Meridian, but we want to see it going in high density, because
of the proximity to the transportation corridors and that they deem that to be a better use
of the ground. So, you know, given that direction, you know, their wish -- obviously this
is now in the Meridian area of city impact and it's ultimately your decision, but we did try
to respect that. So, that's the direction that we have gone with the application. Now, keep
in mind, too, that you have the senior center on the east, then, you have residential on
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the south. So, we are looking at that as trying to match -- to match the uses -- you know,
trying to put a commercial use in between all of that I think would be a little bit more
difficult.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, Mr. Clark, could you comment on Mr. Martin's representing Stellar
Senior Living about their -- their access points are not a through to Wainwright?
Clark: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Hoaglun, that is -- that was new information to me
and so I apologize to Mr. Martin if I misspoke there. That was -- we had reviewed the site
plan and that looked to be an access , so if that's the case, then, we understand that.
Regardless, the -- the roadways do still function fully within capacity and, again, there is
a number of entries and exits and it's very porous from Centrepoint all the way down to
Ustick.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, question for staff.
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: I just want to confirm. I had heard that for the apartment portion of the
development that they would require a conditional use hearing. Is that accurate , Sonya?
Allen: Mr. Mayor, Councilman Hoaglun, yes, it would require conditional use permit.
Hoaglun: Okay. Thank you.
Simison: Council, any further questions for the applicant?
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Real quick. I just wanted to make sure, Hethe, at the last hearing when the
motion to approve, which ultimately didn't prevail, but there were some conditions about
keeping trees and the -- that would be the southwest corner for that established
subdivision to that end. I was trying to remember if there was something else. That's the
one that comes to mind. But any -- any comment on those previous conditions that you
recall?
Clark: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Hoaglun, our position hasn't changed on those. The
tree mitigation condition that was identified by staff is acceptable. If you will recall at that
last hearing we did show that a lot of those trees are not in great shape and much of the
area that is in question actually backs up to the Brickyard, whereas Champion --
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Champion Park, I believe the name of -- Champion Park is on our southwest and we have
kind of a 45 degree angle there and our park is located there and we anticipate
maintaining the trees, you know, to the extent we can -- to the extent that they are still
healthy in that location. So, that -- that is not an issue whatsoever.
Hoaglun: Thank you.
Simison: Council, any further questions for the applicant or is there discussion and
thoughts from the Council before we take any action regarding the public hearing?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: I would like to request that we leave the public hearing open during our
discussion in case we have more questions for Mr. Clark, if Council agrees.
Simison: Okay. Sounds good. Mr. Clerk, you can probably take Mr. Clark out for now or
reduce him down.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I will be happy to kick off some discussing. So, one of the things that is a
philosophical thing -- I know our Planning staff feels very strongly that interconnected
neighborhoods are safer neighborhoods, are healthier neighborhoods, and I think most
of the time I agree with that, but I have done a lot of soul searching and I think on this one
-- to me I don't define interconnection as sending a bunch of cars through a neighborhood
that will already be well served by vehicular access back and forth. I think when
Centrepoint is connected that that will provide a great connection for everybody. I
subscribe to the idea that Dashwood is not up to the standards and would become a
collector and I just generally think that having a pedestrian connection and bicycle
connection is the kind of connection that is needed. And I don't define connection as
having to do with cars. I just don't. And so from where I'm sitting I think I'm tracking with
Councilman Borton's question and I'm leaning toward -- you know, now that we know we
could designate Dashwood as permanently emergency only, along the lines of what
Councilman Borton was asking about, I would be supportive of that. I think that makes
the most sense and I also think we need to put the neighbors out of their misery here with
hearing this endlessly and just put it to bed. That's where I'm sitting.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
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Bernt: I don't know if I necessarily disagree with that. I have always been a proponent of
connectivity in this case and there is definitely a strong argument to keep it an emergency
only access. That's fine. My opinion it still doesn't solve the issue of the traffic safety
issue that I feel personally, in my opinion, that this -- this one access point will create. I
thought it was interesting -- Hethe only provided a picture of going south. I would -- I
would love to see what that looks like going north , because that's where the problem is.
The problem is that connection from where that picture was taken north through the
apartment complex. That's where the issue lies and there is going to be a heck of a lot
of cars going in and out of that subdivision, especially when the multi-family project goes
in. I would be okay with this project if the multi-family project was moved to phase four
and I think that that would be a healthy compromise on my part , but seeing a lack of
connectivity in -- in other areas of our city and the problems that it creates in my opinion
is a big deal and I was elected, you know, and -- by my -- our constituents in the City of
Meridian to keep the neighborhood safe as well. That's -- that's one of our number one
responsibilities in my opinion. And I just cannot support something that is, in my opinion,
going to create safety issues in regard to traffic until there is a full connection made from
Centrepoint all the way to Wainwright. So, I have been consistent with this issue and I --
and I stay true to it. So, I appreciate Hethe. You are a good guy, Hethe. Don't take
anything personal. You do a great job. We are just going to have an impasse here. We
are going to -- we are going to agree to disagree on this one.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: I just want to talk briefly. This -- this would be a lot harder decision and
discussion if we were just talking about 66 units and -- and having Dashwood open or
not. Really in my mind what -- what the game changer is is the Brickyard apartments. I
mean that will -- if we leave that access point open that is their route. I think it was Joy
Cameron who said Wainwright is the only left turn onto Eagle. So, unless they go out to
Ustick to turn left, I -- human nature being what it is -- leaves that open. That's how they
would be getting to that and that's a lot of cars and that's -- and, you know, I -- I empathize
with the folks in these neighborhoods who have been there since the mid 2000s and that
that makes it a difficult situation. We need that Centrepoint to be open to allow that.
That's -- that's why I can once again support making that a permanent -- making it a
permanent emergency access. Deputy Chief Bongiorno is absolutely right, open roads
are better, allow quicker access, but this is a temporary second emergency access to
make sure as -- as it gets developed they have an alternative route into this site , so --
until that Centrepoint become -- becomes open. So, it's not the main access, it's -- it's
that secondary access and -- and, then, the fact that we are going to have a separate
hearing on the apartments, I think we can address that issue at that time, because the
Brickyard and those -- those traffic issues, that is going to be a major part of the issue I
think that will have to be worked through on that. So, that's why I'm interested to see
what -- what comes of that phase four and closing -- closing Dashwood on a permanent
basis and only allow it for emergency and foot traffic, bike traffic, and that sort of thing.
So, that's -- that's kind of where I am.
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Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: I'm really tracking along with Council Member Hoaglun. I was -- I was thinking
about the very first time I ever came to a Meridian City Council meeting, I was like, I don't
know, 12, maybe 11 years old and I -- as you know I grew up in Old Town and there was
a developer that was going to build a neighbor hood next door and it would have created
a -- essentially cut through to the high school and we came in I think, then, Mr. Nary was
on the City Council and my parents came much like the folks that are here tonight and
said, you know, this is -- this is our neighborhood and we -- we have a great community
here and it's important that we create community first and I'm seeing a lot of parallels to
what I have heard from the citizens, both at previous hearings and here tonight and --
and, honestly, I think that's what the applicant's hoping to achieve as well is to create
community. I had some concerns about the phasing plan that -- the lack of homes with
phase four. If -- if Council is kind of trending where I think that they are about keeping
Dashwood emergency access only and that -- that addresses some of my concerns. I
will kind of wait and see where the conversation goes and if -- if we are trending where I
think, then, it's not necessary, but if -- if we are exploring some other options I have got a
couple of other comments I may want to make. But I appreciate the -- the discussion
from the body here tonight on this particular application. And, frankly, the testimony from
the public tonight.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: So, this is a tough one. This is a tough one and I have spent a lot of time
thinking about everything I read in the public testimony, reading through the staff report
many many times to make sure I was grasping all of the concerns and really trying to
understand the staff's recommendations and the -- the property owners' concerns. I'm
very familiar with Alpine Pointe. I have close friends that live there. I'm familiar with it
regarding their real estate and the real estate values. What I keep going back to is that I
-- and this isn't going to probably be popular to say, but I'm -- I'm in agreement with what
ACHD originally recommended, which is to leave that as emergency access and
pedestrian only until Wainwright is -- is punched through and the reason why is because
I truly believe that -- that people do take the path of least resistance and I think that for
me as a driver I'm going to take Wainwright, which is going to be a higher speed and
easier to -- to get to. Excuse me. Centrepoint. I keep saying Wainwright. But I mean
Centrepoint. I'm going to take Centrepoint to Wainwright and make the right turn out onto
Wainwright to get to the light. I would rather not go north on Dashwood , passed homes,
and as the HOA president presented, she said, hey, there is potential line of sight issues,
there is trees in the way, I'm not going to take that route. I'm not going to take that route,
because it's slower. I'm not going to take that route because there might be some fencing,
some trees in the way, I'm going to take that Centrepoint to get to Wainwright, if that's my
option. That's what I'm going to take if I lived in Delano. So, that's what I really believe
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to be true based on my years as a Planning and Zoning Commissioner, based on my
years of understanding and studying subdivisions and how people move around them , is
that I don't believe people are going to want to use Dashwood as a way to access -- other
than maybe the property owners that are in phase four. I believe that most people will
exit out onto Centrepoint, head north and make a right onto Wainwright to get out of --
onto Eagle Road, essentially. So, I don't -- I don't believe that -- that Dashwood is going
to be a problem once Centrepoint is -- is built all the way through. And I'm not saying that
haphazardly, I'm saying that based on a lot of experience and a lot of just education and
understanding of how these subdivisions are developed. So -- so, I am not -- I'm not
completely against the idea of making it a permanent access -- a permanent emergency
access and pedestrian, but I'm not -- in other words, if that's where Council decides to go,
I would understand that direction, but I'm not completely excited about that possibility,
because I am very concerned about public safety and I am concerned about access for
our Fire and Police Departments. As -- as some of the members of the -- of the public
had mentioned in their testimony there are several -- if there are -- and there are it sounds
like -- like several individuals on that section of Dashwood who have challenges with
accessibility, who maybe are in a wheelchair, they are going to need that emergency
services more than ever and are we going to, then, add an extra two or three minutes to
-- to take the collector road up and around and to get into Dashwood from the north side
or are we going to allow that access to them through -- through Dashwood once
Wainwright has been built. So, I just -- again, I think that the need for that to stay closed
off until phase four is developed and understanding the applicant is proposing that -- that
ACHD doesn't have any ability to put a street in there until phase four, you know,
proceeds. So, those are my thoughts. I have gone back and forth on this. I understand
both sides, but I really truly think that there just will not be a lot of use of Dashwood once
-- once Centrepoint is built.
Simison: Councilman Borton, would you like to add anything to this conversation or move
forward with any other activity at this time?
Borton: Thank you, Mr. Mayor. So, I have been just taking notes of the discussion. It
sounds like considerations that I'm hearing from us collectively is -- and this is with regards
to 1-F. If something were to go forward for approval with this project, it sounds like at
least the vast majority are supporting Dashwood to be a permanent emergency access
only with pedestrian and bike and designed for that being the connection. Emergency
only. And that phase four wouldn't commence until Centrepoint connects. So, that's one
basket of options. And, then, kind of in addition to that is what Councilman Bernt had
said, which means -- which would say -- which would request to include within phase four
the multi-family portion. So, the phase four as currently designed is -- is one
consideration, that that phase four -- seven lots I believe. Wouldn't commence until
Centrepoint. Or does Council want to requests that the multi-family portion be included
in the new phase four. I think that's what Trent was talking about. So, I think that's -- and
under either consideration the other conditions of approval, the tree mitigation, et cetera,
from the previous hearing would be included, but I hear that as sort of a two headed option
if something were to be approved. So, I just -- I just put that out there if that's an accurate
summary. If I have missed something from the six of us in this discussion --
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Simison: Well -- and since it does not appear that my vote will be needed on this one, I
will refrain from some of my comments, but I think part of the reason why phase four
exists was to allow Dashwood to open. If there is no expectation that Dashwood ever
opens up, then, phase four really has no need to exist in all intents and purposes. So, I
would encourage Council to reconsider a phase four. Whether or not you want to put the
apartments into the last phase and make that contingent upon something, but if
Dashwood remains closed phase four has no purpose.
Borton: Mr. Mayor, it does -- to a certain extent it would --
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Borton: -- if it -- if it lessens to some degree the impact on the roads and parking, if you
have got fewer homes that are constructed prior to Centrepoint.
Simison: If that's the rationale. I don't think that was the rationale. The rationale was to
try to encourage the rest of the development to occur in that area, so that they would go
back and finish what they started. My opinion.
Borton: Got it.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Mr. Cavener.
Cavener: I -- I'm tracking where Council Member Borton's at and I appreciate that
conversation about kind of eliminating the necessity of phase four. I'm not one that likes
to come up with phasing plans on the fly, but I guess maybe if Council is going to invite
the applicant to at least chime in about it -- in hearing some of the comments about if
there would be proposed changes to what they have proposed.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun, is there something else related to that for the applicant?
Because I see he is unmuted to answer that question.
Hoaglun: If he's ready to go, let's go.
Simison: Okay. Mr. Clark, do you want to provide comment on that issue?
Clark: There we go. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. So, I think that the -- the question is what is
really the purpose of phase four and -- and does it have a purpose if the emergency only
condition is permanent and, you know, my -- my comment would be that I agree with the
Mayor. The -- that the reason for the phase four was to ensure that Dashwood can't open
prior to Centrepoint, because that's what we heard was the biggest concern. If Dashwood
is just not going to open, then, there is not a reason to hold back that -- that property if --
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if that was the -- that was the entire function of that. So, the -- you know, the pedestrian
connectivity, the bicyclist connectivity, all of that would be there and wouldn't change.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: Hethe, can you comment on including -- can you comment in regard to having the
multi-family move from phase three to phase four?
Clark: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Bernt, I think I would kind of reiterate what we said
before, that's a -- that's a huge imposition on the property without a traffic related
justification for it. You know, I -- I know that you and I don't necessarily see eye to eye on
that question. I -- you know, if I'm able to share the screen I would be happy to show you
the northbound look of Centrepoint, because it looks exactly the same with cars parked
on both sides. So, I just -- I don't see that and we have got two buyers here and -- excuse
me -- two sellars here that -- and it just really puts the project in a bind if we have to hold
the apartment indefinitely and, again, there is not a traffic-related basis to do so.
Strader: Mr. Mayor, I have a question for staff.
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I guess a question for planning staff would be if -- and I think to clarify a question
that Councilman Hoaglun asked -- so, there would need to be a conditional use permit for
the apartment portion of the project, but would there be a public hearing and would that
come before Council as a separate decision or not?
Allen: Mr. Mayor, Council Woman Strader, Council, a conditional use permit does require
a public hearing and it's only heard by the Commission. The Commission is the decision
making body, so it would not go before Council.
Nary: Mr. Mayor. Unless it's appealed. Because they can appeal from the Planning and
Zoning to the Council.
Simison: Did the rest of you hear that on --
Bernt: Yeah. Heard something in there.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: I could be wrong, but I think some of the disconnect might have been in the
previous hearing I think there was a belief that Dashwood had to be opened and that we
-- and we didn't have ultimate control to allow it to be permanently emergency and so we
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were trying to create some way to draft sideboards on it being open, but maybe if that's
the case it sounds like that's clarified now, that we do have the authority despite any
control of ACHD to choose to have Dashwood remain emergency only.
Nary: So, Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, maybe I can help muddy the water. I don't
know. So, when we tie it to a development agreement and you are tying it to phasing or
you are trying it to permitting, the city, then, has that level of control, right, because we
are issuing the permit. ACHD doesn't issue anything. So, unless they -- unless they
decide in their master street program to build that street differently at some point in the
future, they are not going to come back and tear out bollards. They just don't do that.
They don't have the time for it. It's not on their radar. They have no plan to do that. So,
their ten year window is kind of a misnomer. Like I said , it's a -- it's a policy decision for
them, because they don't have a clock that tells them ten years is up and we got to go rip
out bollards all over town. So, they are not going to do it. It just isn't practical for them.
If it's petitioned, if it's requested by the neighbors, if there is a process they can follow,
potentially that could happen. But, again, the neighbors that are opposed to it today may
be different neighbors at that point in time. So, that's why the staff is saying if you tie it to
your development agreement you have some level of control. If you require the
development do it prior to a phase being built, prior to the last CO getting submitted -- or
approved, then, they are incumbent on the developer to do it. If there is no requirement
for the developer to do it, then, no one's going to do. So, in my opinion ACHD doesn't
have -- it doesn't have the land use authority that you do to be able to say this is the --
this is the plat we approved, this is the -- now, if they won't sign the plat, that's an issue
between the developer and ACHD to deal with, because they do have to sign off on the
plat. So, if they have a concern about that they could raise it and deal with the
commissioners at that point. But the commissioners have recognized that, again, you
have a land use authority, they don't, so --
Simison: And my recollection, Councilman Borton, it wasn't so much about whether or
not the city could or couldn't, I think there was disagreement on whether they should or
shouldn't, but it was a lot more on the contingency of the inability to understand
Centrepoint would ever or how it would ever connect. That was my -- that's more my
recollection of the issues, but what do I know.
Hoaglun: And, Mr. Mayor, that was my recollection, too, was the issue of that access of
Centrepoint, when would that be done, and if it would ever be done and what -- what
comes of that. I mean we were kind of holding phase four hostage here to make sure
that gets done and I don't think that's a small matter when the applicant testified earlier
-- and I heard him say that's, you know, a half million dollars worth of inventory there, you
have got street, you have got sewer lines, you have got water lines, why wouldn't you
develop seven lots if it's -- if it's there. It -- it just doesn't make much sense from a
development standpoint not -- not to move forward with that and -- but the -- as we
recognize, the Centrepoint completion is not in their control, so that's the -- that's -- that's
the kicker there. I mean they can't develop that until Centrepoint is developed and -- and
who knows with this senior living center going in, I'm sure other things will follow that as
well, and -- and we will see when that -- what the timing. But to offer the phase four I
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July 28, 2020
Page 44 of 81
think is a legitimate offer to -- to keep that closed until Centrepoint is open, but, then, if
ACHD doesn't have that authority -- I was under the same assumption we were trying to
do something that prevented action by someone prior to that. So, it doesn't sound like
that's -- that's the case now. But they could not develop phase four until Centrepoint is
open.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, I apologize --
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Johnson: -- some members of the public have e-mailed they are having difficulty hearing
Council.
Simison: Okay.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor, Chris, any specific individuals are they having a hard time with?
Johnson: Did not indicate. It was -- just did come in this moment. Some of those --
Councilman Hoaglun or whoever spoke previous to him.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor, I --
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: I'm -- I'm in agreement with Council Woman in a sense that once Centrepoint --
that connection is made to Wainwright Dashwood is going to be a mute point. You're --
you're going to see -- you're going to see very little traffic going through that connection.
It's just -- just my opinion. I was on Planning and Zoning as well for a while and saw thi s
time and time again, people are going to take the path of least resistance. I couldn't agree
more. So, they are going to go straight up that connector from Centrepoint to -- to
Wainwright 90 plus percent of the time. So, if -- just also my opinion, but I will reiterate
what I said before and I will say it again, this -- the success and the safety of -- of those
who will be living in the apartment complex south of this proposed project is totally
determined on the connection from Centrepoint to Wainwright. It's essential in my opinion
and I will leave it at that. Hello? Is the -- is the volume on?
Simison: The volume is good.
Bernt: Okay.
Simison: Just looking for anybody that would like to take --
Bernt: I thought -- I thought I lost everybody. I apologize.
Simison: It was just so brilliant in my opinion that I had nothing to say.
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Bernt: Sorry to ruin the silence.
Perreault: We are all deep in thought.
Simison: Okay. Well, Council, I think I can count and know where the votes are on this
issue, but my -- my denial last time was predicated on the issue of Dashwood alone, so
if you guys believe you're in alignment or agreement on that issue and whatnot, then, I
think that you are probably ready to move forward if you can figure out what you want to
do about the phasing, if that -- where that fits into this conversation. Or we could take a
ten minute break for everyone to gather their thoughts and feelings and --
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: I started work very early this morning and I think I'm on like hour 13, so a short
break to refresh my mind would be great.
Simison: Council, do you need a ten minute break? Okay. Let's go ahead and take a
ten minute recess. We will reconvene at 9:00 o'clock.
(Recess: 8:50 p.m. to 9:01 p.m.)
Simison: Council, I will go ahead and bring us out of recess and we can continue this
conversation or -- the public hearing is still open if you need additional information or
would like to start taking -- taking action on this item.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: I'm going to move this toward the action part and we will see where we go. I
move that we close the public hearing on Item 6-C, H-2019-0027.
Hoaglun: Second the motion.
Bernt: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to close the public hearing. Is there any
discussion on the motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay.
The ayes have it.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
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July 28, 2020
Page 46 of 81
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: We have had a lot of good discussion on this with the applicant and Hethe's done
a really good job and the public has provided extremely valuable input over the various
hearings that we have had and you can see the Council wrestle with these decisions and
considerations, because there is -- there is not a clear bright line policy consideration that
makes some of these issues difficult for us to address, which you can tell that everyone
takes the concerns of the public extremely seriously in trying -- to try and make sure that
we get those addressed. So, we have wrestled with it at length trying to address those
concerns. I think the balance of considerations support approval of this project. I think
it's -- where I find it to be most appropriate is that Condition 1-F which speaks to the new
phasing plan and Dashwood, that it be approved -- that this project be approved and that
phase four does not commence until Centrepoint is connected to the north as the
applicant had proposed and that that Dashwood remain emergency access only in
perpetuity. I think there is -- there is pros and cons to both and we have discussed them
greatly, but the citizens' considerations do weigh heavily on all of us and I think tie goes
into that consideration in this unique circumstance. So, I will make a motion for approval
of H-2019-0027, with the modified 1-F. Again, phase four doesn't commence until
Centrepoint is constructed to the north and connected. Dashwood remains emergency
only access.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: I will second the motion.
Simison: I have a motion and a second. Is there discussion on the motion? Seeing no
one wishing to discuss the motion, I will ask the clerk to call the roll.
Roll call: Bernt, nay; Borton, yea; Cavener, yea; Hoaglun, yea; Strader, yea; Perreault,
yea.
Simison: Five ones, one nay. Motion passes.
MOTION CARRIED: FIVE AYES. ONE NAY.
D. Public Hearing for Hill's Century Farm North (H-2020-0080) by
Kody Daffer, Brighton Development, Inc., Generally Located
South of E. Amity Rd. and East of S. Eagle Rd.
1. Request: Modification to the Existing Development
Agreement (Inst. 2020-059662 – provision #5.1g) to allow
building permits for the commercial portion of the
development to be issued prior to subdivision of the property.
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Page 47 of 81
Simison: Thank you to all the staff and public and the applicant for sticking with the
conversation. Next we will move on to Item 6-D, public hearing for Hill's
Century Farm North, H-2020-0080. I will open this public hearing with staff comment and
turn this over to Sonya.
Allen: Give me just a second, Mayor. All right. Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, the
next application before you is a request for a development agreement modification. This
site is located off the southeast corner of East Amity Road and South Eagle Road. This
property was annexed in 2015 with the requirement of a development agreement , which
has been amended three times previously. A rezone, preliminary plat, planned unit
development for an age restricted 55 and older gated community and a conditional use
permit for a self -service storage facility was approved earlier this year. The
Comprehensive Plan future land use map designation is mixed use neighborhood. The
applicant proposes to amend Provision 5.1G in the existing development agreement to
allow for building permits to be issued in the commercial portion of the development prior
to subdivision of the property as currently required. Because commercial property isn't
typically required to be subdivided prior to issuance of building permit, staff recommends
the existing provision is stricken and alternative language is provided instead that would
simplify the requirements for subdivision of the property, which the applicant agrees
meets their intended purpose as follows: The R-8 and R-15 zoned residential portions of
the annexation area shall be subdivided prior to issuance of any building permits beyond
those required for the community center complex on Lot 101 as shown on the revised
concept development plan dated October 30th, 2019. Building permits for the community
center complex may be issued prior to subdivision of the property. Subdivision of the
C-N and C-C zoned commercial portions of the annexation area is not required prior to
issuance of building permits. Written testimony has been received from the applicant
Mike Wardle, Brighton Corporation. They are in agreement with the staff report. Staff will
stand for any questions.
Simison: Thank you. Council, any questions for staff at this point? Seeing none, I will
turn this over to the applicant for ten minutes. I believe -- I don't know if this will be Mr.
Wardle.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, I have Mr. Phillips in the room as well.
Simison: Okay.
Wardle: Mr. Mayor, Council Members, Mike Wardle, Brighton Corporation, 2929 West
Navigator, Suite 400, Meridian. 83642. Sonya has laid it out perfectly. It was an oversight
when we went through this process just a few months ago not distinguishing between the
commercial and the residential portions and as Sonya noted, typically the commercial
does not require the same type of subdivision platting requirements as a residential does.
So, even though the language that staff has recommended is slightly different from what
we have proposed in our application, we concur with it and ask for your approval.
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July 28, 2020
Page 48 of 81
Simison: Council, any questions for the applicant? Okay. This is a public hearing. Mr.
Clerk, do we have anyone signed up to testify on this application?
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, the only sign-up was James Phillips and he is in, if he has anything
to add.
Simison: Okay. Mr. Phillips, if you would like to provide testimony, you can unmute
yourself and you will be recognized for three minutes. If you could state your name and
address.
Phillips: Thank you. James Phillips. 4140 East Rockhampton Street, Meridian, Idaho.
83642. Hillsdale Creek community. I did have a presentation. I will go ahead and just
share my screen if that's all right.
Johnson: Okay.
Phillips: Let me know when --
Simison: We have it up. Chris, could you reset the timer for three minutes once he starts
speaking.
Phillips: Mr. Mayor, Members of Council, the purpose of this brief presentation is to
provide some insight to specific challenges that southeast Meridian residents are facing
and how the mixed use designations could be best used to address these specific
challenges. To that end I just wanted to show a visual representation of the 2019 new
residential units. As you can see and to the surprise of probably no one, southeast
Meridian is one of the residential hot spots. Examining more closely we see that Ada
county assessor already has over 850 residential lots designated in the Century Farm,
Hillsdale Creek area. Note this does not include the Hill's Century Farm North land that
is being discussed right now. Those numbers also don't include the 850 plus residential
lots that are part of the Sky Mesa development and surrounding neighbors to the west,
the Shelburne development and surrounding neighbors to the north, nor does it include
the preliminary plat plan that we recently received in the mail for development of 355
additional dwelling units that will be -- that's proposed to go across the street from
Hillsdale Elementary. As you know with the growth comes challenges and it's my hope
that the city ensures that the mixed use designation addresses these challenges.
Community Planning Association of Southwest Idaho, COMPASS, specifically calls out
mixed use development as an effective land use strategy for improving transportation and
accessibility to meet the needs of residents. By having commercial in close proximity to
those residents and Meridian's own mixed use neighborhood description it mentions that
mixed use designation can be used to provide the surrounding residents goods and
services that they need on a regular basis and provide employment opportunities. It goes
on to provide sample use for the commercial aspect of the mixed use neighborhood as
you can see there. Currently when the southeast Meridian residents like myself look for
various services, this is often what we see in the Google Map results. Here is an example
of coffee shop, salon, and you can see there is a big vacuum of space just south of Victory.
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July 28, 2020
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Sandwich shop. Ice cream shop. These are all just the different types of uses indicated
in the -- the mixed use neighborhood. A gift shop. Drug store. Here I think there is a
Rite-Aid about a mile north that just so happens to be in your -- in your -- in network. The
2019 new building permits visual shows only a few nonresidential permits, the red dots in
southeast Meridian, which does little to alleviate our concern around the last commercial
goods and services immediately underway. Certainly there are other mixed use
designations in southeast Meridian, for example, the plaza across the street of Eagle and
Amity that's planned to go in, will help. As you can see from the FLUM there are not any
commercial only designation -- designated areas south of Victory. For this reason we
need to embrace the commercial aspect of mixed use designation in southeast Meridian
in order to create a walkable, bikeable, and serviceable community. And that's kind of the
gist of it I guess. In conclusion, I hope the City Council will ride through the -- around
storage units specifically -- while technically are commercial, my question is is whether or
not they are really the best use of mixed use designation, specifically as it pertains to
southeast Meridian, whether it's a general lack of goods or services within close proximity
to its residents. Thank you. Oh, I did look up also the Google Map results of storage
units. There is actually one south of Victory. Last time I rented a storage unit it didn 't
matter whether it was walking distance really or not, I had to bring my truck anyway. It is
a prime commercial location. The primary and secondary arterial roads to kind of go to
waste.
Simison: Mr. Phillips, if you could wrap up, please.
Phillips: Yes. And, in conclusion, that's it. I just wanted to make sure that it was -- I was
able to speak to some of the concerns that I have, along with other people in the
community with -- that live in southeast Meridian around not having a lot of commercial in
this location.
Simison: Thank you. Council, any questions? Okay. Thank you very much, Mr. Phillips.
This is a public hearing. If there is anyone who is still watching online that would like to
testify on this item, if you can indicate your desire to do so by raising your hand. Seeing
no one who would like to testify, I will turn this over to the applicant for final comments.
Wardle: Mr. Mayor, Council Members, thank you. I'm going to ask Sonya to bring back
the site plan, because Mr. Phillips has actually identified the real thrust of our whole
program for what we call Century Farm North. There we go. As noted when you look at
the complex that started out there originally with the YMCA and Hillsdale school, we have
a whole series of commercial parcels available in addition to the self storage that Mr.
Phillips cited. So, all of the uses that he noted in that mixed use neighborhood element
are possibilities. We don't have those committed at this point, but there certainly are
going to be the types of services -- potential retail, as well as professional. So, I believe
that the concept that we have brought forward and will be completed with Hill's
Century Farm North actually accomplishes the objectives that Mr. Phillips was
encouraging the Council to embrace. So, with that, again, we would ask for your change
of that one governing condition, 5.1G, to allow the commercial uses to proceed in advance
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July 28, 2020
Page 50 of 81
or platting, whereas the residential must be platted before building permit requests begin.
Thank you.
Simison: Thank you, Mr. Wardle. Council, any questions? Okay. Any discussion? Or
motions? Or silence.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: I guess to kick things off, I would close the public hearing for H-2020-0080.
Borton: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to close the public hearing. Is there any -- any
discussion on the motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay.
The ayes have it.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, I think this is --
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: -- a fairly -- fairly straightforward change to do some things t hat staff laid out
pretty clearly and put in a format that I think that we could support and so after considering
-- I would move that after considering all staff, applicant, and public testimony I move to
approve file H-2020-0080 as presented in the staff report for July 28, 2020.
Borton: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to approve Item H-2020-0080. Is there any
discussion on the motion? If not, Clerk will call the roll.
Roll call: Bernt, yea; Borton, yea; Cavener, yea; Hoaglun, yea; Strader, yea; Perreault,
yea.
Simison: All ayes. Motion passes.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
E. Public Hearing for Quartet Northeast (H-2020-0017) by
Brighton Development, Inc., Located at 4020 & 4340 N. Black
Cat Rd.
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Page 51 of 81
1. Request: Annexation of a total of 68.73 acres of land with R-8
(48.42 acres) and C-G (20.31 acres); and,
2. Request: A Preliminary Plat consisting of 137 buildable lots
(136 residential and 1 commercial), 19 common lots, and 2
other lots on 66.52 acres of land in the R-8 and C-G zoning
districts.
F. Public Hearing for Quartet Southeast (H-2020-0018) by
Brighton Development, Inc., Located at 4020 and 4340 N.
Black Cat Rd.
1. Request: Annexation of a total of 22.26 acres of land with an
R-8 zoning district; and,
2. Request: A Preliminary Plat consisting of 50 buildable lots and
10 common lots on 19.92 acres of land in the R-8 zoning
district.
Simison: Item 6-E and F are public hearings for Quartet Northeast and Quartet
Southeast, which are H-2020-0017 and 2020-0018. I'm going to open both these public
hearings with staff comment and turn this over to Sonya.
Allen: Thank you, Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council. The next applications before
you --
Bernt: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Bernt.
Bernt: Mr. Mayor. Sorry, Sonya. I didn't mean to interrupt. Before we start these two
applications I feel it's prudent for me to recuse myself from these applications . One of my
customers is involved with the building team that will be potentially building in this
subdivision -- in these two subdivisions, so I think it would be important for me to recuse
myself from these conversations, since I would be directly impacted by it. Thank you.
Simison: Thank you.
Allen: All right. Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, the applications before you are a
request for annexation and zoning and two preliminary plats. A property boundary
adjustment application was recently approved in Ada county that adjusted the boundaries
of the parcels south of the creek in Quartet Southeast to that shown on the proposed
annexation and preliminary plat boundaries per the record of survey shown on the right.
Two separate preliminary plats are required because the Five Mile Creek owned by
Nampa-Meridian Irrigation District lies between the two properties, because both plats
are proposed to develop and be marketed based on the overall project. This site consists
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July 28, 2020
Page 52 of 81
of 86.44 acres of land. It's zoned RUT in Ada county and is located at 4020 and 4340
North Black Cat Road. The Comprehensive Plan future land use designation is medium
density residential, which calls for three to eight dwelling units per acre, and that's --
excuse me -- approximately 50 acres of the site and mixed use nonresidential , which
consists of approximately 41 acres of the site. A city park is also designated on the future
land use map in this general area. The applicant proposes to annex a total of 90.99 acres
of land between the two subdivisions with R-8, which is 70.68 acres and C-G, which is
20.31 acres, zoning and develop 186 single family residential detached homes at a gross
density of 2.8 units per acre and nonresidential commercial uses on the site. The eastern
18 acre residential portion of Quartet Northeast is located within the mixed use
nonresidential designated area, which is a nonresidential designated area that provides
approximately a quarter mile separation and buffer to the city's wastewater treatment
facility. Because the future land use map is not parcel specific, the applicant requests the
medium density residential designation on the western portion of the property is extended
to the collector street North Joy Way, which bisects the eastern portion of the property.
The portion of the property east of the collector street is proposed to be zoned C-G and
developed with nonresidential and commercial uses in accordance with the mixed use
nonresidential designation. At the request of the city the applicant included the .97 acre
outparcel at the southwest corner of Quartet Northeast Subdivision, where a sewer lift
station is located in the annexation boundary. If you can see my cursor it's that little area
right there. A concept development plan was not submitted for a nonresidential
commercial lot proposed to be zoned C-G. The applicant states this lot will be the subject
of future discussion with the city regarding a potential park site as depicted on the future
land use map or consideration of other potential buffer uses determined by the results of
the Public Works noise and odor study, which is planned to take place later this year.
Although some residential uses are allowed in the C -G zone, staff recommends as a
provision of the development agreement that no residential uses be developed on that lot
unless a subsequent noise and odor study as conducted by the city determines residential
uses are appropriate in that area. Two preliminary plats are proposed containing an
overall total of 186 residential building lots, one commercial building lot, 29 common lots
and two other lots. The subdivisions are proposed to develop in three overall phases,
with the first two phases located along Black Cat Road and a third and final phase of the
eastern portion of the site. The minimum lot size is 6,866 square feet, with an average
lot size of 9,145 square feet. There are two existing homes, one within each of the
preliminary plat boundaries, that are proposed to remain on lots in the proposed
subdivision. These homes are required to hook up to city water and sewer within 60 days
of services becoming available. Access is proposed via one collector and one local street
from Black Cat Road. The collector street is proposed to extend over the Five Mile Creek
and through the site to the north boundary for future extension to McMillan Road,
consistent with the master street map. A 25 foot wide landscape street buffer is required
along Black Cat Road and a 20 foot wide street buffer is required along the collector
streets. A multi-use pathway is proposed offsite along the north side of the Five Mile
Creek and along the east side of the collector street north of the creek to the north
boundary in accord with the pathways master plan. If Nampa-Meridian Irrigation District
does not allow the pathway and associated landscaping to be located on their property,
the pathway should be provided within a 20 -- minimum 20 foot wide common lot along
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July 28, 2020
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the southern boundary of Quartet Northeast Subdivision. A minimum of ten percent
qualified open space is required to be provided in each subdivision. Six point six five
acres is required in Quartet Northeast. A total of 7.6 acres or 11.5 percent is proposed
and 1.99 acres is required in Quartet Southeast, a total of 3.4 acres, or 17 percent is
proposed, which exceeds UDC standards. Open space consists of half of the street buffer
along the arterial street, the entire buffer along the collector street, a linear open space
and common areas exceeding 50 feet by 100 feet in area. A minimum of one qualified
site amenity is required for developments over five acres in size, within an additional
amenity required for each additional 20 acres of land being developed. Based on 66.52
acres, a minimum of three amenities are required in the northeast portion and based on
19.92 acres a minimum of one amenity is required in the southeast portion, for a minimum
of four amenities overall. A community swimming pool, a tot lot with children's play
equipment, segments of the city's multi-use pathway system and one acre of qualified
open space beyond the minimum requirements is proposed as amenities in the northeast
portion and an additional 1.41 acres of qualified open space beyond the minimum
required is proposed as an amenity in the southeast portion , meeting the minimum
standards. The Creason Lateral runs along the eastern portion of the north boundary of
the northeast portion of the development within a 40 foot wide easement in a common lot
and is proposed to be left open . The Five Mile Creek, which lies between the two plats,
is required to be protected during construction. A portion of the site is within the Five Mile
Creek floodplain. A floodplain permit will be required prior to development of this area.
Conceptual building elevations were submitted as shown for the single family homes.
Homes are a mix of one and two story units with building materials consisting of a variety
of siding styles, with stone and brick veneer accents. No elevations were submitted for
the nonresidential commercial portion of the development, as no development is
proposed at this time. The Commission recommended approval of these applications .
Mike Wardle and Jon Wardle, Brighton Corporation, testified in favor. No one testified in
opposition or commented. Written testimony was received from Carrie Hovey. Concerns
pertaining to traffic and safety of existing two lane roadways and the amount of
development occurring in this area, which is worsening the situation, and impact of more
development on areas schools. Would like these applications to be rejected or at least
postponed until road infrastructure and schools can be prepared to handle the additional
impacts. Key issues of discussion by the Commission were as follows: Concerns
pertaining to growth and traffic and adequacy of existing infrastructure to handle more
development until improvements are made in this area and the option of requiring the
noise and odor study to be completed prior to development of phase three to determine
if residential uses are appropriate in the area current -- currently designated mixed use
nonresidential. The Commission made the following changes to the staff
recommendation. They modified Condition B-1-2 to require the water main in North Joy
Way to continue south through Quartet Southeast to provide a second connection out to
Black Cat Road with the second phase of development , instead of the first phase as
recommended by staff. There are no outstanding issues for Council tonight. Written
testimony since the Commission hearing was received from Mike Wardle, Brighton
Corporation, and they are in agreement with the Commission's recommendation. Staff
will stand for any questions.
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July 28, 2020
Page 54 of 81
Simison: Thank you, Sonya. Council, any questions for staff at this point? Okay. Hearing
no questions --
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Oh, Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Thanks, Mr. Mayor. And not a question maybe for Sonya, but maybe a question
for either -- I see Laurelie is on. I think Dale is here as well. Just give me a sense about
the status or the plan for the noise and odor study. I know it's something the department
has been considering for a while. I'm just curious if you can give us a quick update as to
what the plan is to conduct that and when do you expect it to be complete?
Dolsby: Mr. Mayor, I can do that as well.
Simison: Mr. Dolsby.
Dolsby: Mr. Mayor and Council Member Cavener --
Cavener: Sorry. I didn't know you were on. I'm sorry.
Dolsby: I jumped off and went down to chambers a little while ago, so -- the odor study
has been kicked off. We anticipate to have the sampling for the study done in early August
and towards the end of September we will get some preliminary results from the study,
so that's kind of the schedule we are on right now to complete that study that they
mentioned.
Strader: Mr. Mayor, some follow up.
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: Maybe what would be helpful is kind of walk us through it. Is it an study, enough
information to make a final determination on things? I mean that's -- to me its like a wind
study, you know, like trying to capture the wind and what it's going to do. Is there an
element of discretion involved here where you might require something more than an odor
study ideally to make those final determinations?
Dolsby: Mr. Mayor, Council Woman Strader, so to complete the odor study we do do
some monitoring out at the wastewater treatment facility. Then there is -- we do have
some subjectivity in the results. There is some standards of the industry that you want to
keep odors within a certain level, like say the -- for instance, the odor study we completed
in 2004 had a diagram that showed different levels of odor and as you move farther away
from the plant, obviously, the odor dissipates. The plan that they have shown today that
shows the phase one, two, and three, we measured it and the road on the edge of the
development is about 900 feet from the corner of our property, which if you went by the
study that we completed previously, it would be -- we would be in favor of the plan as it
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July 28, 2020
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stands right now. There is no guarantee that the study we are kicking off now we will say
the -- result in -- have the same result, but I would say that as time goes on we do try to
be cognizant of odors. With new projects we complete at the facility -- we have enclosed
our headworks facility last year, which was a major source of odor that we controlled. We
are looking at that in future projects as well. There is still odor from the facility. Don't
have a high level of complaints right now and we are completing that study as I mentioned.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor, additional question if I may.
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: Clint, recognize the study takes in kind of a moment of time today, how does
the study comprehend future growth and the impact on both noise and odor, recognizing
that the footprint that we have for the W RRF today will not be the same into the future.
Dolsby: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Cavener, so the study will look at the projects we
have planned in probably a ten to 15 year horizon, but, honestly, the -- the monitoring
they are doing is just based on what's built out there today, but we do look at that horizon
when we are looking at the odors that would emanate from the plant and we -- as we do
future projects we are making a real effort to control odors in those projects. I mean there
is no -- I guess there is no guarantee that there wouldn't be odors that would be reported
outside of the areas that we designate, but we are doing everything we can to control
odors as we do future projects at the wastewater plant.
Cavener: Sure. Thanks, Clint.
Simison: Council, any additional questions for staff at this time? Okay. I will turn this
over to the applicant for their comments for 15 minutes.
Wardle: Mr. Mayor, Council Members, again, thank you. Mike Wardle, Brighton
Corporation, 2929 West Navigator, Suite 400, Meridian. 83642. Knowing that Sonya
provides all the necessary information on this particular case, she has done so, we did
not prepare a formal presentation. We do have some slides that perhaps we would refer
to just to articulate a little bit more of the primary issue that you folks looked at and that is
the relationship of the property to the wastewater treatment plant. Sonya, I'm going to
ask if you would bring in the four slides that I have provided to you and it would be the
second slide that I would ask you to focus on . And I have no clue whether it's possible
from here or not, so I will rely on Sonya. Back a couple of slides, Sonya. It would be --
that's number four. So, if you go back to number two. There you go. Perfect. Thank
you. When we sat down with staff in pre-application discussion of the overall site and
property, we knew that this particular issue was going to be a primary point of discussion
and concern. It was staff's opinion during that period of time that there probably could be
some separation, because if you, essentially, connected the quarter mile location or the
quarter section locations, you know, and did an arc around there, it would kind of resemble
what the collector roadway, which becomes the easterly boundary of that project is. So,
we went forward with a design on using that arbitrary line at this point, creating a
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nonresidential parcel for future discussion, knowing that the city would be conducting that
study and leaving the question open to future consideration. An application. So, we are
aware of the issue and I appreciate Clint's statement that based on the prior studies it
would not be an issue with this particular proposal as it has been presented to the Council.
We do agree with the -- the recommended conditions of approval and the Planning
Commission's recommendations for approval of the annexation with the two R-8 and
C-G zones and the approval of the preliminary plat conditioned as presented to you. So,
unless you have further questions, I would stand for your -- I would just end at that point
and allow for your discussion or consideration. I just would note, since Sonya did cite
some of the considerations and discussions that the Planning Commission had, the
school issue -- there was a letter presented and it's in the records from the West Ada
School District that noted that there is an elementary school just nine-tenths of a mile to
the north that will be opening this fall. Hopefully our children and grandchildren will be
going back to school, but that facility is actually located partially on property from our
Cambridge Subdivision project. They also noted that in the middle school situation -- and,
again, it's the Star Middle School, but we don't control their school zones and boundaries,
but there would at this point be 308 spaces available in that middle school situation and
at Meridian High School 439 spaces available based on current enrollment and their
capacity. With regard to the transportation system -- and it was cited that there was a
comment made by Carrie Hovey in June prior to the hearing at the Planning and Zoning
Commission, her concern expressed about, you know, infrastructure. We would just note
-- and, Sonya, if you would go back one more slide -- thank you. There is a little orange
dot kind of hidden in the area to the west side of that parcel and that's -- that's the parcel
that Ms. -- Mrs. Hovey lives and the same mitigation will be provided by Quartet Northeast
as the builder of her home two years ago provided through the impact fee structure of the
Ada County Highway District. We all acknowledge the challenges, but, in reality the
development in this particular case -- and you can see the -- the total of the future property
development that we will be bringing forward -- will provide the infrastructure, sidewalks,
roadway widening and improvements that are required by ACHD along that corridor that
otherwise would sit and wait for some undetermined action in the future. So, acknowledge
the challenges, but the school district has provided information to you, noting that there
are -- there is capacity at this point in time and that we certainly will be contributing 187
times 3,143 dollars in impact fees to the Ada County Highway District for improvements
in addition to those that we will also construct by widening at intersections and adding
sidewalk along Black Cat Road. So, at that point I would conclude and stand for your
questions.
Simison: Thank you. Council, any questions for the applicant at this time?
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: Mike, one question that's come up occasionally and this application begs the
question. On that phase three, which is to be zoned C-G, it's not platted and it's just in a
holding period until the noise study is done. What's the -- the reasoning behind annexing
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that part now, other than it's just all one parcel perhaps? I mean given that a zone, you
know, entitles it to immediate development rights and, you know, the noise study is going
to be done and -- I'm not quite sure how that would formally constrict any future uses. I
get the intent is all good, but help me understand that.
Wardle: Well, Mr. Mayor, Councilman Borton, interesting that when we do bring parcels
we are expected to bring them entirely or in the case of Quartet Southeast we had to do
a property boundary adjustment to create that parcel, but there was already two parcels
south of Five Mile Creek, so we just did an adjustment there. So, we would have had to
have done the same thing in the northeast parcel, but, obviously, the landowner, the
Quenzer family, didn't really want to break it up and create some uncertainty. So, it just
felt like the solution was to bring it forward, but note that it would be at this point
nonresidential. There are three options that will be forthcoming. One would be -- and it's
uncertain as to why the city's recently updated Comprehensive Plan designation actually
does put in a park site designation on that parcel in that nonresidential area, so it could
be a park, if the city so chose, or it could be a buffer in perpetuity if the city determined
that no use would be appropriate , but at that point, obviously, the city would have some
responsibility to secure that buffer or based on a determination through the study that
Public Works is doing some nonresidential use could be brought forward through some
future application. So, it was primarily just because it was an entire parcel and I think you
hit that right in the beginning of your comment.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: That's helpful, Mike. I guess one quick follow up on that is if it's , you know, two
years down the road -- or maybe not too far down the road, but if a noise study says --
the noise and odor study says ultimately uses one, two, and three are appropriate, but
four through ten are not appropriate, so the city says, well, now you can't do four through
ten and you say, well, I have got a C-G zone, I want to do four through ten. I mean how
does that -- how does that disconnect -- you used the phrase the responsibility is to secure
the buffer with the city, I'm just trying to contemplate are there -- are there any unforeseen
circumstances where the city in its study might say we don't think you should do X and
you want to do X and how does that get resolved? How do we secure the buffer?
Wardle: Excuse me. Mr. Mayor, Councilman Borton, through the same process that we
are holding right now and that would be to start with site specific discussions with the
Planning and Public Works staff to determine what uses would or would not be
appropriate. So, it's -- it's a conversation that we know will happen in the future, but it --
I don't know that we can hypothetically dawn any conclusions this evening of what that
may be or may not be, but it's open and it will be discussed and concluded in the future.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
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Borton: The last question on it. And it certainly will probably get resolved and worked out
as you have described and maybe it's a Mr. Nary question, but I just don't understand the
-- what happens if you don't. I mean what are the -- what are the -- what's the structure
built into this request today that allows that to be resolved. Let's say you are having that
meeting and there is -- there is disagreement, is there something in the DA that says while
the -- if there is a disagreement the city has ultimate final say on that issue or the applicant
does or -- I just don't -- I don't understand how that works if there is a disagreement down
the road.
Wardle: Well, Mr. Mayor, Councilman Borton, again, staff's saying that it would -- there
would be no residential uses there. There would possibly be commercial uses that would
be appropriate, we just don't know at this point and we are not concerned at this point
until the studies are completed and we know more of what the options are. So, I -- it's
just a future discussion that we have, but we are not -- we are not at this point making
any determination of exactly what that may be, we are just leaving it open.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: Just some thoughts. I think we are trying to be very forthcoming about our
concerns now with people, with all this COVID out there with life. My main concern in
tying the development of phase three to an odor and noise study is that from speaking
with the Public Works Department I feel that that study is not an adequate determination
of everything we need to know to make that decision. They are not cut and dry. It sounds
like they are very subjective and they -- they can say that a two mile radius has some
odors, that odors are worse the closer you get -- it depends on the way the wind blows.
Just is a lot up in the air. I have been struggling a little bit. I think -- I would need --
personally, I guess I would like the applicant's feedback on is, you know, for phase three,
not only could be contingent on the completion of a noise and odor study to determine
appropriate uses, but I would also need, you know, the Public Works Department to opine
that there is adequate buffer space next to the wastewater treatment plant and I would
love to have them sort of sign off on the plan , if you will. So, sort of struggling a little bit
with just having it contingent on just a study. I just -- I'm not sure that gets me there. I --
my initial reaction was just to delay the whole thing a little while until everyone could come
to agreement and we have that input and from speaking with them it sounded like they
were okay -- and I don't want to speak for them -- they are okay with -- they just said
phases one and two, but I think three maybe not. So, that's -- I would like your feedback
on that, because that's what I'm struggling with.
Wardle: Mr. Mayor, Council Members, I'm going to turn a moment over to Jon Wardle to
address this a little bit further.
J.Wardle: Mr. Mayor, Council, Jon Wardle, 2929 West Navigator, Meridian. 83642. I
appreciate the opportunity to -- to talk about this for just a minute, because I -- I have had
very direct conversations with Mr. Bolthouse and Mr. Stewart on this very issue. It is a
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single parcel. So, let me just address that first that because it is a single parcel we are
bringing it all in, annexing it at this time. But we did sit down very specifically and looked
at that roadway alignment and, basically, established a line that Public Works -- and Clint
can correct me if I'm wrong here and I will let you do that -- but we drew a line basically
saying everything east of that line, which is the road, would be held in a zone that is
compatible with the current Comprehensive Plan until the time that the odor study comes
back and, then, we can sit down and talk through that again. We aren't asking for anything
on that property at this time. We know that residential currently is not acceptable. We do
know that there are conversations that need to be had, but that collector road that will go
from Black Cat eventually all the way to McMillan provides a very good line at this point,
which in our conversations with city staff, was that it was a -- was the delineation and so
based on those conversations that we have had directly we felt like, yes, we could create
the commercial buffer to the east and the residential to the west and those conversations,
which would be, quote, phase three, could be had at a time in the future and we can come
back with a full plan and, like Mike indicated, it could be a variety of things, but at this
point we -- we are not asking for any of those, other than the zoning that would be
acceptable to the city based on the Comprehensive Plan.
Simison: Council, any further questions for the applicant?
Strader: Mr. Mayor, maybe a follow up.
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I guess I'm wondering if -- you know, is there any harm -- or help us understand
your -- your timeline for your phasing and -- we are looking to get started like, you know,
the end of July -- it sounded like there will be some preliminary feedback in early -- so
some point in September -- I'm thinking we are two months away from getting the key
input and possibly this could be a stronger application if you, you know, came with a --
maybe opinion for Public Works about an adequate buffer around the wastewater
treatment plant. Maybe give me some feedback on that in terms of your timing .
J.Wardle: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Strader, thank you for the question. I do want to
restate that we did take this very specific plan to Public Works and the -- the location of
that collector road is not like what -- that was deemed to be a good delineating point, so
-- that we could come back in the future and address what would happen to the east and
as noted by Sonya, we aren't asking for anything on the east of that collector road at this
point in time. With that said, our phasing, however, we would be developing in Quartet
Northeast, north of the Five Mile Creek first, about a 24 acre phase, but it does come
down and it does connect to that collector road. Maybe, Sonya, we can go to the third
slide here. Yeah. Right there is great. So, we would be building from Black Cat Road
north of Five Mile Creek all the way through and making that first connection to the
collector road, which is the buffer and also building a bridge over Five Mile Creek, so that
we could provide secondary access. The timing of this is pretty critical for us. As you
know, as we experienced recently with the construction on Ten Mile, and, then, building
over Five Mile Creek, which also happened in the irrigation season, which also happened
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where we had a lot of rain and things like that , the ideal time for us to be building that
bridge is this winter and so the longer we take to address what's appropriate of that
collector road, which is -- which is a step point, by the way, the collector road as it goes
to the north, that also aligns with a future collector on a -- to the north the existing public
road -- getting this collector set so we can build it over the winter is pretty critical to us,
because we would also be building secondary access out to Black Cat south of Five Mile
and creating -- or finishing that water loop, which was also something that Public Works
wanted us to do. So, we would have that life safety issue as well. So, that kind of -- that's
the timing that we have in play right now.
Strader: Thank you.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Question on the -- on the -- follow-up on the phasing, if you would. That first
phase is in Quartet Northeast and I noticed that there will be -- the secondary emergency
access will be that perimeter road where your -- your boundary is to the buffer and it will
come to Black Cat there out of Quartet Southeast as a gravel road. I was just curious in
future when phase one is completed and Quartet Southeast is phase two, if I remember
correctly, is -- is that entryway off of Black Cat going to be completed for construction or
are they just going to use that for construction? It's just interesting when we do these in-
fill projects, the people that are already there are complaining we want the construction
vehicles to come in a different way and even though it's -- it's empty right now, those folks
will probably be saying the same thing when -- when phase two starts, how come they
are driving through our subdivision -- you know, our part when they could come in another
way. So, I was just curious about the timing or the -- how phase two would be accessed
at that time.
J.Wardle: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Hoaglun, thank you for the question. Ideally
Quartet Southeast would be accessed directly off of Black Cat south of Five Mile Creek
on that -- that collector road that we would be building. We, obviously, will have some
coordination that needs to happen, but for the development work in particular we will be
able to come right off of Black Cat Road to do that construction work. I also think that
when homes are being built in Quartet Southeast, that that obviously -- the construction
-- the direct line to get there would be off of that collector road as well and not coming
through Quartet Northeast. So, I don't think the access from a development perspective
for home construction will impact Quartet Northeast and, then, we move to the balance
of that area of Quartet Northeast we will have that collector road that will come right off of
Black Cat as well. So, I do think that we have -- we will be able to satisfy that and minimize
the impact. We are very well aware of those. It does happen with every single multi ple
phase project we have. You know, the first phase that gets built and phases later on
happen. We do have a very tight builder team and we -- we do talk with them frequently
when these issues come up, so we are aware of it, we do address it, and we will, hopefully,
be able to minimize it over time.
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Hoaglun: Thank you, Mr. Mayor, Mr. Wardle, appreciate it.
J.Wardle: Thank you.
Strader: Mr. Mayor, I have a question for Bill Nary.
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: Hey, Bill, a question for you -- I'm thinking of some conditions of approval around
phase three -- I don't know how the rest of the Council feels about it yet, I haven't proposed
it, but any addition to the study that there is approval by the Pub lic Works Department in
their sole discretion on the adequate configuration of buffer space around the wastewater
treatment plant. I'm just curious along with what Councilman Borton was saying, if the
phase three has a condition and this has a certain zoning, what are the teeth that the city
has to ensure that that happens in the future?
Nary: So, Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, Council Member Strader, there is a couple
of questions in there. First, I wouldn't recommend that you have Public Works be the final
decider. I think ultimately the City Council should be the final decider on what goes there.
The zone that's proposed, again, has some uses. Again, you can put a limitation on that
portion of the DA that basically puts the C-G zone. I think from what I understand from
looking at the staff report and listening to the testimony, the C-G zone would line up,
because, again, that's uses that have previously been allowed here and so it was trying
to be consistent with the current uses that are allowed. So, the concern wasn't that
somebody would build a C-G project there without the Council of viewing it, but if you
wanted something that required the Council to have to review whatever was going to be
proposed there you certainly could do that. I don't know if the applicant would be resistant
to something that -- that stringent, because, again, we have anticipated uses there other
than residential and it's been that way for almost 20 years. So , I think what they are doing
is trying to get some movement that residential could be considered -- Public Works'
consideration of that in those studies. Council ultimately will be the decider on whether
or not residential people will be allowed or any forms of residential, such as -- such as
nursing homes or other types of things. But certainly we can craft the DA in any fashion,
but I think that Council should be the final decision maker on that, with input, obviously,
from Public Works and that we can craft whatever you want in that C-G zone or limitations
on that C-G zone, but, again, in the past we have allowed other things in that C-G zone,
such as storage, for example. That's why it's right there adjacent to it.
Strader: Follow up, Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: Totally appreciate that. I just consider this a very abnormal circumstance
because of its proximity to the wastewater treatment plant and the specific safety and
other concerns around co-locating there. So, if I can confirm, it sounds like a possible
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additional condition could be City Council final approval of any use in phase three with
input from the Public Works Department. Is that right?
Nary: Yes.
Strader: Thank you.
Simison: Council, any further questions for the applicant?
J.Wardle: Mr. Mayor? Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Mr. Wardle.
J.Wardle: If I might, there -- that additional language that Council Member Strader was
recommending, it likely would go into an existing condition that 's there already, which is
A-1-E where it does talk about no residential uses shall be developed on that
nonresidential commercial C-G parcel, including multi-family, vertically integrated
residential, and/or nursing home care, unless the subsequent noise and odor conducted
by the city determines residential uses are appropriate in that area. So, if -- if you are
going to insert something additional, that probably is the spot to put it, just a little bit more
clarification, but we have been reviewing these conditions and we are committed to work
with Public Works and the city on that point, so -- so, that -- that phase three, which we
represent -- it's actually -- we may have more phases in here, but we -- maybe we just
will refer to it as the C-G zone, that nothing happens in that C-G zone until the odor study
is complete. We have worked with Public Works and we come back to the city with an
acceptable solution for that site in the C-G zone and a DA mod.
Bolthouse: Mr. Mayor? This is Dale.
Simison: Mr. Bolthouse.
Bolthouse: I have been -- I have been kind of patiently listening into the conversation
and I do have a couple of comments to make as it relates to kind of the historical process
of this particular designation and I -- I just want to clarify a couple things for the benefit of
-- of Council and the applicant. So, this particular area was developed as part of the 2002
future land use map process and was adopted in August of 2002. The first noise and
odor study that was completed by Public Works at the wastewater treatment, did not occur
until 2004 -- September of 2004. So, the initial designations that were made were a rough
estimate of what might be a reasonable, proper space for nonresidential around the area.
It was not predicated on any kind of noise and /or odor study. That came two years after
this designation was created. Having said that, that study made an attempt to look at the
existing processes at that time, make odor -- do odor analysis around the facility that each
of the component processes that were in place at that time, project them to a future growth
and, then, model based on atmospheric conditions, if you will, on what the probability
would be that you would have odor concentrations and frequency that could constitute
complaints and that overlay study and this designation in the blue map seemed to align
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reasonably well. That study also identified a number of ways that the facility can , in fact,
make investments in the processes to reduce that odor -- reduce those sources of odor
and many of those have been completed over last 15 to 20 years -- I guess 15 years
since that initial study was completed. Clint did mention a few of those that have been
completed -- the largest being most recently with the headworks project where the city
made a significant investment in enclosure of those odor causing processes, as well as
putting in an activated bio-filter system. There have been another -- other similar
movements and just anything we do at the wastewater plant we do take into
consideration, you know, its impact on odor. So, it's with that information that we now
look at where we are at today. We have been planning this odor study for the last couple
of years to get ourself an updated analysis completed to see what that looks like. It is our
opinion that we believe that with the investments we have made in technology at the
facility that it's likely to have improved since the original study was completed back in
2004 and as Clint mentioned that if we were to kind of overlay this d evelopment
recommendation, that -- over the old report that it would likely suggest that the risk of odor
concerns that are lined out here with the development phasing plan, would -- would likely
be an acceptable situation and we hope that that gets confirmed with the study that's
underway. As Clint mentioned that study will be concluded here in the month of August.
We anticipate preliminary results and something to talk off of by the end of September
and look forward to that effort. We did not include noise as part of this study. It did not
go show itself as a significant issue back in 2002 and we have not added any noise
producing operations in our facility that we haven't consciously made efforts to muffle and
enclose and do those kinds of things for noise as well. So, we chose not to include noise,
but rather it's just an odor study at this point in time. We have engaged with Brighton and
Quenzer on this property discussion some time ago as we looked to secure additional
access to the wastewater facility and so one of our options continues to be some kind of
access along Five Mile, whether it followed our pressure sewers from our Black Cat lift
station on through or in this case, you know, the possibility of securing an access way
from the proposed development and the roadway and the bridge that's being proposed
here. So, we have had a lot of conversation over the last few years in terms of how this
property would develop, what kind of access was going to be secured with it and whether
or not we felt like it was going to offer the city adequate buffering space from the no odor
standpoint in the odor study. We have had four odor complaints that we have registered
at the wastewater facility in the last five years. All of those odor complaints are downwind,
if you will, to the east and to the south of the wastewater treatment facility. We have had
no complaints in the other directions and we have had two complaints in 2019, one I
believe in '17 and one in '2016. So, we look at the developed areas to the east and to
the south and we recognize that that appears to be -- even with the prevailing wind, you
know, a pretty adequate buffering situation in those -- in those directions.
Simison: Council, any questions for Mr. Bolthouse?
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
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Hoaglun: Not a question, just a comment to back up the director's comments there right
at the end. For 25 years I have lived directly due east of the plant and it's exactly a half
mile -- not to the edge of the property, but to the waterworks itself. And there were times
that during the year when you could -- you knew the plant was there and I have to say
over the years it has gotten better and better and I can't tell you now when -- when was
the last -- when the last time was that I smelled anything from the sewer plant. So, I think
their mitigation efforts are helping and it certainly is not an issue where there is going to
be a lot of -- a lot of complaints. They do a great job there. I can see, you know -- and
the prevailing winds do tend to come from the northwest and west, so -- and occasionally
the wind may shift, but certainly if they have laid out that buffer area and are going to
explore that, I think that's -- that's a good thing. It's -- I think it's something they need to
do, but with the way our plant's operated I'm fully confident they are not going to find
much, so I'm optimistic about that just based on experience of living there and having that
grow in -- in our neighborhood if you will.
Simison: Thank you, Mr. Hoaglun. Council, any further questions for the applicant?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: So, Jon or Mike, whoever would like to respond to this. I want to start a
conversation in a different direction regarding traffic movement on Black Cat,
transportation in that area. A lot of the information in the ACHD final report was from
earlier in 2020 and -- and prior years and I really don't feel like it reflected -- accurately
reflects what is -- what is going to be happening along Black Cat with the many different
applications that we have had this year. I think we approved three last week off of Black
Cat, something like that, and so we -- we have a lot of residences coming in in a very, you
know, short distance from one another. So, what I specifically was wanting to find out
from you is did you have any conversations with ACHD regarding when their exact
timeline is -- or more specific timeline for the widening of Black Cat between Ustick and
McMillan? I know it's set in the -- the five year plan between '21 and '26. Have you
received any information from them on when they are going to start design, sort of what
the time frame is for that and how -- and, then, could you share with us how it relates to
when you -- when your properties will be complete and ready for sale?
J.Wardle: Mr. Mayor, Council Member Perreault, thank for the question regarding
transportation. We -- we know that is a -- very much a hot item everywhere. Fortunately,
when we did -- and I can't talk to what's happened in the last couple months, but we did
go through a full traffic study on this with ACHD, taking in all of the background of projects
which are -- had been approved and in the pipeline to look at it. So, we -- we are aware
that transportation is something that is very much on the top of everybody's mind. But
you are correct that they -- this -- this segment of Black Cat is in their five year work
program. I do not have a date in terms of when we will be looking at design. We -- we
actually -- and we could probably go back to the previous exhibit that will show it, but we
do control a lot of the frontage here all the way down to Ustick down. At this point in time
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we are only bringing in a small portion of the project, so that we can start making these
life safety connections across Five Mile Creek. We will have more robust conversations
with them as well. There is a roundabout planned at this intersection. There are -- at the
intersection -- at the half mile that we would be completing and working with them and I
would anticipate we would also do a -- a cooperative development agreement to make
these improvements as we are working on the project, so that we are not holding out a
long period of time. Now, there is a quarter mile north of us, which we don't control, so
we will have to have that conversation with ACHD on how to make that happen as well.
So, we -- we very much are aware of the traffic situation and we will continue to work with
ACHD like they have with other projects to expedite improvements as much as we
possibly can.
Simison: Council, any further questions? This is a public hearing. Mr. Clerk, did we have
anybody sign up to provide testimony on this item?
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, we had nobody sign up in advance.
Simison: Okay.
Johnson: We do have a hand raised.
Simison: Okay.
Johnson: That is Denise LaFever and she's coming in no w.
Simison: Okay. Denise, if you can provide your name and address for the record and
you will be recognized for three minutes. You will have to unmute yourself.
LaFever: Got it. My name is Denise LaFever. I'm at 6706 North Salvia Way. I do have
some comments back. I was present at all the comp steering committee meetings and I
took them seriously. On the day that the future land use map was discussed, Mr. Turnbull
and Mr. Wardle were both there. I asked the committee to allow both of them to
participate. The mixed use nonresidential that's -- that's shown on the application was
later specifically discussed at a later meeting. The developers present voiced their
concerns. The consultant, Brian and Caleb, based on comments from the city staff folks
all held to keeping this area mixed use nonresidential due to the plant use not being
compatible with residents. Residential complaints. And the biggest concern was future
plant expansion. They held very strongly to keep it the way it was. In addition to that, I
also have concern of just blanketly taking a C-G zoning without any idea or concept of
what is going to be built there. That just really puts a real bite into what if they go back to
it and want apartments, unless it's conditioned that there is no residential in there. What
if the use is really high and now we didn't take into compact that -- take into consideration
the additional liability that that may cause for this addition. In addition to that, on the north
-- the northwest area, it wasn't really clear what that's going to be developed. Was that
-- was that designated float -- floated to mixed use -- mixed use residential? Is that -- I
just don't see -- I just don't see where it's really clear what these large chunks of lands
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are going to be developed as, which causes a lot of angst for residents in the future,
especially those residents that move in to those subdivisions that think that they are going
to go back through and have something developed over there , only to find out that the
use -- they think they moving into a subdivision and now all of a sudden they have storage
or -- or a big commercial use or some other use that they weren't anticipating. I just don't
think it's right for the residents. But, furthermore, this was discussed at length at our
meeting and it was decided to keep this mixed use non residential. That's all I have to
say.
Simison: Thank you. Council, any questions? All right. Seeing no one else on the call
who would be able to testify to my knowledge and no one in the room, I will turn this over
to Mr. Wardle for -- the other Mr. Wardle for closing comments.
J.Wardle: Mr. Mayor, again, Jon Wardle for the record. Thank you very much for the
opportunity to testify. I -- candidly, yes, we were very much at the table during the comp
plan discussions. We had submitted not only verbal conversations in those meetings, but
also letters regarding this issue. We made a very concerted effort to go meet with Mr.
Bolthouse and with Mr. Stewart regarding this issue. I think Mr. Bolthouse has already
addressed this, but the location of the collector road that we are showing here really is
where the city feels like this impact is -- we don't have an impact. So, the collector really
is a good designation for this and that's why it's delineated exactly where it is. It provides
over 900 feet from the corner as it exists currently from the wastewater treatment plant
corner. So, we have not gone into this with -- with some level of understanding. We -- it
was also stated to us at the time that the comp plan was going forward that the city wanted
to initiate this odor study and, therefore, at that point they didn't want to make a change
to that. So, what we are proposing here as part of this annexation and zoning request is
to use the collector road as the point. East of it would be C-G. West of it would be
residential. We -- we are committed to not proposing any residential on that until there is
some sort of consensus as what the appropriate buffer should be on the wastewater
treatment plant. And we also know that the city has recently acquired land directly north.
There may be a portion of that that -- that truly needs to be the buffer and we understand
that as well. So, there is conversations that need to happen , but the C-G zone is
appropriate. There is a condition in there that holds very clearly that no residential uses
can be proposed. That will be in the development agreement and we -- you know, we
agree with that. There is more work to be done, but that C-G zone will come back to the
city in the future and we will discuss the appropriate uses and any modification to the
development agreement which would be appropriate at that time. We do request your
approval. We are excited to be able to propose Quartet and to provide additional
opportunities in Meridian, which is a great place to be. One of the things that's kind of
overlooked here, but it's important where we have been very focused on with all of our
communities is how do we connect people in a nonvehicular way. Five Mile Creek is -- is
something that we control quite a bit of. The city controls Five Mile Creek and we are
going to be able to create another regional pathway that will connect from Black Cat to
Ten Mile where you have connections the other direction already. That's something that
we probably should have talked about a little earlier, but that's a great community asset.
Not just a Quartet asset, but a community asset for all of Meridian to continue these
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regional pathway systems. We do request your approval of the Quartet projects and I
would stand for any other questions you might have for me tonight.
Simison: Thank you. Council, any additional final questions for the applicant? Okay.
Thank you, Mr. Wardle.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I would be happy to kick off a discussion or happy to close the public hearing,
but we have had a bad track record of doing that, but looking around should we just
discuss? So, I -- I think in my opinion I really would like -- if we move forward with this
project for me to be comfortable I would need not only the completion of the odor study,
but I really feel to be comfortable I would, then, need City Council approval on any future
use for phase three with input from the Public Works Department. I just think that this
location is critical -- an extra critical infrastructure and having their input on the
configuration of buffer space is essential and we only have one chance to get it right. I
wouldn't even be comfortable tying it to one of the other conditions . I think it should just
be in blanket condition for City Council approval on any future use for phase three.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: The battery in my iPad is going to die, so I will share my comments before I
maybe relocate back into Council Chambers. I really like the idea of this project.
Brighton's got a good track record in our community, but, man, I -- I have some really
strong reservations -- not even about phase three. There is elements of phase one and
two that I think are -- are, frankly, too close to the wastewater treatment plant that without
current updated data it's really hard for me to get on board with this project right now. I'm
supportive of having a conversation about limiting anything in phase three. I appreciate
what the applicant has done and relying on data and engaging Public Works early on, I
just think that some of this is a little premature without a sound and -- and odor study
being complete.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Yeah. I'm -- I'm less reticent about moving forward. From the standpoint where
we have had Public Works engaged in this, we have had them out there -- there has been
a previous odor study. Although it's been a while and it definitely needs to be updated
and they feel comfortable with that -- where that boundary is to put out there and they are
-- they are marking that off, they are not going to put any residential in that eastern
part --
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Simison: Councilman Hoaglun, it seems like they are having a hard time hearing you.
Try a little less is more.
Hoaglun: A little less is more. How is that? Less is more? Can you hear me? Kind of?
Cavener: That's better.
Hoaglun: This is too much; right? How is this?
Cavener: Not great.
Hoaglun: How is this?
Cavener: Even worse.
Hoaglun: How is this? Better?
Cavener: Wonderful. Yeah.
Hoaglun: New Microphone. Okay. Yeah, they just wore out. I was just saying I'm less
reticent about having this move forward from the standpoint that they have engaged
Public Works, they looked at where the areas of impact could be -- possibly be. They
have done previous odor studies. I would like to think Public Works, if it had concerns
about this would have made certain that they would be known and -- and Mr. Bolthouse
had talked about and gave us some background on -- on how it all transpired and whatnot.
The technology at the facility, as I have experienced firsthand, has -- has improved
tremendously and I think the covering of the -- the unit -- and I can't remember what it's
called, the waterworks one, has -- has reduced some of that odor immensely. I mean we
have Five Mile Creek right there and we have a -- our pathway system is going through
that and we certainly don't want people -- what my son would call when he was three
years old -- stink your nose. You know, hold your nose when you walk by. So, you know,
we -- that's -- that's a city amenity. So, we know we have to make sure that that facility is
operating well within tolerances of -- so people won't have to stink their nose and -- and
that means people who live nearby and there is other development that's going to happen.
The area around that is a -- is a commercial application, because we can feel comfortable
that offices, warehouses, whatever is in those areas under our C-G zoning will be within
-- well within means. They aren't going to be there at midnight and if there is a burp from
a methane tank or something, whatever might happen, no one -- no one is going to notice
that. So, I'm -- like I said, I'm less reticent. I mean I'm open to ideas on some of this, but
I just don't have as much angst over it, but I'm willing to certainly discuss it further.
Simison: Council, my two cents for your consideration is -- you know, we often hear about
people that buy a piece of property that expect a house -- they see an empty field and,
then, they didn't know what's going to go in next to it. In this case we have a developer
who will have a fully functioning wastewater treatment plant in operation where people
will be purchasing a homes yet to be built and will have the opportunity to be on premise
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first hand and see, hear, and smell before a single home is ever purchased. If that's not
buyer beware I don't know what is and, quite frankly, I can't think that a developer is going
to put homes in an area that are going to -- you know, knowingly before they are ever sold
be -- be subject to those circumstances. Now, I could be wrong. Maybe there is a market
for smelly homes that I'm not aware of, but I do think that sometimes common sense and
practicality does weigh out and the, you know, future buyers of these homes have one
hundred percent full disclosure of the situation, more so than a vacant field that may turn
into something else that they don't like.
Cavener: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Cavener.
Cavener: I -- I couldn't agree with you more. But, then, I -- I recall I think when I worked
for the city watching what happened in the city of Nampa with the Lactalis Cheese Factory
and development occurred around that and suddenly the people that moved around the
cheese factory were upset about the noise and the smell coming out of the cheese factory.
The piece that causes me pause is that we are not done building the W RRF. As Meridian
grows and expands so, too, will our need to expand out on that campus and we know that
citizens will have an expectation based on when they move out there, but any changes
or shifts I think will likely be met with a lot of public resistance that I just don't think is
appropriate. So, I hear you and I think that you are correct, although other municipalities
where the public would understand, haven't necessarily come to that same conclusion.
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: I -- I think I'm tracking mostly with my fellow Council Members' concerns, but I
want to throw a couple of -- of things out there. First of all, there is -- there is a lot of
residential already built around the existing treatment plant to the east. All along Ten Mile
there is -- there is a lot of -- of subdivisions and residences already there and I trust that
Mr. Bolthouse when he says that they have had four complaints in the last five years, that
he's done his research on that and that there wo uld have been more complaints from
those residents that will be just as close -- or that will be about the distance, probably, as
the residences on the east side of Ten Mile. We already know that people live in and near
the plant -- the plant as it is and that we can use that information as a -- that history as an
indication of what the public's concerns are regarding the wastewater treatment plant. In
addition, we still live in a rural agricultural area and I don't know if you have ever lived
downwind from a dairy, but it smells a heck of a lot worse than a wastewater treatment
plant does and we are not having conversations about whether we are building -- we are
building subdivisions next to dairies or building subdivisions next to cattle ranches or
building subdivisions on old potato fields. So, I'm not trying to be Devil's advocate, but,
truly, I mean -- I under -- I do understand the concerns, but it's kind of like, okay, if we are
going to have these discussions for this applicant about the wastewater treatment plant,
then, we need to be having other discussions about other uses that are creating just as
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much of an issue with -- with smell. So, I would say I -- I agree with the Mayor in terms
of -- from a real estate standpoint the wastewater treatment plant is existing. There is
nothing between this and there is nothing that -- that the consumer would be unaware of
going into this and now for the individual who did live in -- in subdivisions 15 years ago
and didn't know that -- that Meridian was going to expand, didn't know that there was
going to be an additional 40 acres that were purchased to make -- you know, to grow that
wastewater treatment plant, that's a different story. At that time there was no way to know.
But now that information is going to be available to everybody that comes through there.
So, I'm not saying that as a -- specifically advocating for approval of this, because my
concerns are very much surrounding the traffic and transportation in that area. I have
lived off of Black Cat for 11 years, I have seen the changes that have happened and my
-- my primary concern is that we will create a similar situation to what's happening on --
near Century Farm, which is another Brighton community right there on Taconic where
we have one subdivision on the east side of the road, we have another subdivision on the
west side of the road and we have what is slated to be a roundabout in between, which
currently there is nothing in between, it's just a -- a HAWK signal I think it what's out there.
And so I'm very concerned that we are going to create that same scenario between what's
existing on the east side and the future site that will exist on the west side and that we
are going to be back having conversations just like we have been having over and over
and over again with Sky Mesa and Century Farm on a two lane rural road where we have
a lot of traffic coming in and out of there on a daily basis and the re are safety concerns
and there is concerns about kids getting to school, because we have an elementary
school going in on the east side of Black Cat and all these new developments coming in
on the west side of Black Cat where there is no crossing across Black Cat whatsoever
and there is already Coleman Homes going in there on the west side. The Oaks is
expanding. We have more -- we have an entire -- there is 700 homes in the Oaks North.
There is a couple of more subdivisions that are slated for that area with absolutely no
crossing for our elementary school kids to go into Pleasant View. Those are the kind of
concerns that I'm really having with this application, more so than -- than the wastewater
treatment plant, because those are things that -- that -- that a homeowner or home buyer
can know.
Simison: And if Council Woman Perreault just opened up the conversation about
roundabouts, let's go. I'm ready for that one.
Perreault: Let's not. It's 10:30 at night. Mr. Mayor, follow up.
Simison: Council Woman Perreault.
Perreault: It seems we oftentimes comes back to this conversation about is it fair to deny
or to continue or hold off on a particular application , because we will -- when we didn't
hold off on other prior applications because of transportation challenges and we -- we
have this conversation really frequently -- it's a conversation about transportation, the
conversation we have about schools, which is why we are doing an awesome job with --
with getting more staffing to help manage the city concerns. But, honestly, I'm aware of
the -- the fact that it is a challenge to decide where do we stop, where do we draw that
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line, what's safe, what's not safe. And I understand all applicant concerns when we start
having conversations about how many is too many when past ones have been approved
and -- approved and, yet, it doesn't seem like the highway district is -- is -- you know, is
-- gives a report where the traffic concerns are going to be worse than D or E or whatever
-- whatever the -- that -- you know, whatever the requirement is to -- to do the widening
prior to having more residences come in.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: One of the -- the remarks Council Woman Strader had an idea that -- that had
great merit with regards to phase three I think. I'm comfortable moving forward on this
application. But I think that suggestion of the standalone DA provision that -- that required
what it sounded like -- might confirm it if that's correct. It sounded like whatever future
use would be contemplated on phase three, that would -- the DA provision would be
written to require that to come back to City Council for ultimate approval. You would work
it out with Public Works and staff and -- but, nonetheless, the ultimate decision of what
would go in phase three and how it would go in phase three, that portion, that would come
back for a future Council in the form of a DA modification request to permit that specific
use to be determined at that time. I think that's what I heard and if that were to be the
way that condition would go forward, Mike, is that something that you would be supportive
of? Or comfortable with? Living with?
J.Wardle: Mr. Mayor, we have got a question directed at us. The simple answer,
Councilman Borton, is, yes, we would be comfortable bringing back -- back to you
specifically on the C-G zoned parcel -- we keep saying phase three, but the C-G zoned
parcel, we would work it out with Public Works and we would come back and the City
Council would have an opportunity to review that as well.
Borton: Thanks, Mike. I think that's what I heard and I think --
Simison: Jon. You said Mike, but it's Jon.
Borton: Oh, Jon. Sorry. I'm just reading. It's late.
J.Wardle: I have been called worse.
Borton: I apologize.
J.Wardle: No need to apologize. It's all the same.
Borton: Thank you for clarifying that, so --
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
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Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I move that we close the public hearing on this application.
Borton: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to close the public hearing. Is there any
discussion on the motion?
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Is this closing the public hearing on both of the applications?
Simison: It would be if the first makes that so and the second agrees.
Borton: Second agrees.
Strader: I agree. Close the public hearing on both.
Simison: Okay. All those in favor signify by saying aye. Opposed nay. The ayes have
it.
MOTION CARRIED: FIVE AYES. ONE RECUSED.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I want to give this a try and I'm counting on Councilman Borton to correct me if
I go astray. All right. After considering all staff, applicant, and public testimony, I move to
approve file number H-2020-0017 and H-2022-0018 as presented in the staff report for
the hearing date of July 28th, 2020, with the following two additional conditions. Number
one, that the noise -- that the odor study is determined prior to the development of these
three. To determine if residential uses are appropriate in the area currently designated
mixed use nonresidential and the second condition that the approval of City Council will
be required for any future use for the C-G zoned parcel and that we will take into account
input from the Public Works Department and other city staff at that time.
Borton: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second. Is there any discussion on the motion?
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Nary: Mr. Mayor? Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, Council Woman Strader, I think
both section and references need to be C-G zoned parcel, rather than to phase three.
But other than that I think that's fine.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Strader: I agree and will amend the motion.
Simison: Does the maker of the motion agree with Mr. Nary --
Borton: Second agrees.
Simison: Second agrees. Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, I just want to make sure I heard correctly. Was that the noise study
or odor study?
Strader: Odor.
Hoaglun: Odor study. Thank you.
Simison: Is there any discussion on the motion?
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: Just -- just kind of a brief comment. I -- this applicant's done great work in our
community for a while and we belabor the point a bit, but fully trust that the applicant
understands the intent of the city and the desire and concern on the buffer consideration.
So, we appreciate the -- kind of the cooperative commitment that you have made to
continue that with that intent. It's much appreciated.
Hoaglun: Agreed.
Simison: Any further discussion?
Allen: Mr. Mayor, may I clarify the motion, please?
Simison: Yes, you may.
Allen: Odor study prior to development of phase three and that is the residential portion
in the mixed use nonresidential designated area on the west side of the collector we are
referencing; correct?
Strader: Yes.
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Allen: And, then, that would not require a modification to the development agreement,
that would just require the odor study prior to development to ensure residential uses are
appropriate in that area; correct?
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, it looks like they are having difficulty hearing us. You want to come
back in the room I think we -- we can shift you in there if you need to speak again, but
otherwise --
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, question for Sonya on that. Did you say west side of the collector?
Allen: Yeah. There has been a bunch of discussion about phase three and the
commercial portion of the development. I just want to make sure we are all on the same
page. So, phase three is the residential portion of the development on the west side of
the collection street. The commercial is on the east side of the collector street and it's not
shown on the phasing plan as a phase. So, if -- if the concern is that the proposed
residential uses in the mixed use nonresidential designated area on the west side of
collector, the odor study is shown to impact that area, then, that's what I'm asking. Or is
it the commercial portion you are talking about?
Strader: Mr. Mayor, can I clarify my motion?
Simison: Yes. Go to the maker of the motion, please, to clarify. Council Woman Strader.
Strader: Okay. I will give it a try. So, my rationale is that the residential portion of phase
three is slightly inside of the 900 to 1,000 foot buffer and so my thought was that we need
the odor study to move forward on phase three and that we need the odor study to also
move forward on any other uses that are not in phases one and two. If that makes sense.
And, then, further that the city would approve any future use for the C-G zone as a
separate condition. Does that make sense? I will look to Councilman Borton if I'm
tracking there.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: I think that -- I thought we were -- we were framing the -- the limitation on future
development to the C-G zone and C-G zone was that portion of this project to the east of
the collector road and that -- so, that portion of the C-G zone would have a DA limitation
preventing any future development until the odor study is completed and a DA mod
application is filed specifying here is what we intend to do in light of those results and any
other data that we have.
Simison: So, it sounds like the first and the second are not in alignment as to the motion
at this point in time.
Borton: That's why you have to clarify it.
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Simison: So, I guess I would go either to the maker of the motion to say if she wants to
stick with her viewpoint or if the second wan ts to retract his second if it -- if she believes
phase three of what we just saw should not move forward. Council Woman Strader.
Strader: So, the way I look at it would be that phase three is closer to the area of concern,
but I'm okay with moving forward with just having the odor study for the -- I mean I -- I'm
not going to fall on my sword over that point. Because I get that we are more comfortable.
I just needed that phase three is phase three for a reason and we need to have that input
from the odor study.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor? I was --
Allen: Mr. Mayor, if I could clarify. Mr. Borton, the -- the C-G portion is -- is right here, if
you can see my cursor. The phase three -- the C-G portion is not included on the phasing
plan. So, that was the clarification I was making. And approximately -- if you look at the
residential area that they are proposing here on the phases one and three, there is -- if
you look at the future land use map that's the -- the brown area is the mixed use
nonresidential designated area. So, what I understand is that the -- the Council would
like to have the development agreement modified prior to any development occurring in
the C-G zoned portion of the site to included a development plan.
Borton: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Borton.
Borton: I think that's correct and maybe the motion and the second weren't aligned on
that issue, but I think the first part, which is -- it's my mistake to -- I think I missed the
additional limitation on phase three development, so -- maybe we can make the motion
again and we will -- we will clarify it. I apologize, I might have created confusion.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: So, from a process standpoint --
Strader: Shall I try again or --
Simison: Would you like to -- would the second and first take away their motion and we
try it one more time.
Borton: Do it.
Simison: Okay. We will make it so. All right. Council Woman Strader, do you want to
take another crack at it?
Strader: I think so. So, after considering all staff, applicant, and public testimony, I move
to approve files H-2020-0017 and H-2020-0018 as presented in the staff report for the
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hearing date of July 28, 2020, with the following additional two conditions. The first
condition being that the odor study should be completed prior to development of phase
three to determine if residential uses are appropriate in the area currently designated
mixed use-residential and that the second condition that the approval of City Council will
be required for any future use in the C-G part of the parcel. The parcels.
Borton: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second. To my untrained ear that seemed like the same
motion as the first one, phase three limitations, so is it -- was that clear? Because -- is
the C-G part of phase three or not? So, we are back at the same place we were in the
first motion, just so we are clear.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, if I might ask Council Woman Strader on that first one that the odor
study be completed before phase three construction can begin and, then, there was a
second part to it and my brain was starting to cogitate on that and, then, you had a second
part to that first -- first bullet point.
Strader: I think there is just two conditions. The first condition is the one that was in the
-- in the staff report or the hearing outline, which is requiring the odor study to be
completed for the development of phase three and, then, separately the condition that
City Council approve any future use for the C-G zone, which is the area outside of the
first three phases, with the thought behind that being that we need the Public Works
Department to opine on the configuration of adequate buffer space around the
wastewater treatment plant.
Hoaglun: So, yeah, Mr. Mayor, that -- to me that seems like, okay, they do the odor study
and if things are fine, phase three just goes on as planned , but if they find issues that
might -- that boundary might have to change slightly if they -- if they find something that
that occurs. Thank you.
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Is there further discussion on the motion?
Allen: Mr. Mayor, further clarification on Mr. Hoaglun's comment just now. If the odor
study -- prior to development of phase three determines that residential uses will be
impacted in the mixed use nonresidential designated area on the west side of the
collector, would that require a modification to the development agreement at that time? I
would assume to change the development plan for that area.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
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Hoaglun: Sonya raises a good point. I think we would have to have a mechanism in
place to -- to allow that to -- to happen.
Borton: Mr. Nary?
Nary: Mr. Mayor, Members of the Council, probably the easiest way I can think of is -- the
purpose of the odor study is to determine where the residential line can be. So, that's
going to take both consultant, city, and adjoining property owners to participate. So, they
are all going to know where the line is going to be, so the -- the line -- and I think Mr.
Borton brought this up earlier. What's the trigger to move that lin e then? So, if the -- if
the -- if the condition in the development agreement is that the odor study is completed
and will allow residential use in phase three as depicted, then, they can proceed. If it
won't allow residential units in any part of phase three , they will have to come back for a
modification. So, they can't proceed with phase three if it doesn't allow for all of it to be
residential, because there -- as Council Woman Strader pointed out, a small portion of
that is in the area that's previously designated as mixed use nonresidential.
Simison: Council, further --
Strader: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Yes, Council Woman Strader.
Strader: I guess I would just amend my motion slightly taking into account Mr. Nary's
feedback that they complete -- that the phase three study is required to allow residential
uses and if the city staff and the report and others do not agree, then, they would have to
come back for a development modification and if this doesn't work, I'm giving up and Mr.
Borton can try.
Simison: Does the second agree with that modification?
Borton: Second agrees.
Simison: Second agrees. Is there further discussion on the motion? If not, clerk will call
the roll.
Roll call: Bernt, recuse; Borton, yea; Cavener, yea; Hoaglun, yea; Strader, yea; Perreault,
yea.
Simison: All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: FIVE AYES. ONE RECUSE.
Item 7: Ordinances [ Action Item]
A. Ordinance No. 20-1886: An Ordinance (H-2020-0030 – McKay
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July 28, 2020
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Farms Subdivision) for Annexation of a Parcel Located in the
NE of the SE ¼ of Section 32, Township 3 North, Range 1 East,
Boise Meridian, Ada County, Idaho, as Described in Attachment
"A" and Annexing Certain Lands and Territory, Situated in Ada
County, Idaho, and Adjacent and Contiguous to the Corporate
Limits of the City of Meridian as Requested by the City of
Meridian; Establishing and Determining the Land Use Zoning
Classification of 10.501 Acres of Land From RUT to R-8 (Medium
Density Residential) Zoning District in the Meridian City Code;
Providing That Copies of This Ordinance Shall Be Filed with the
Ada County Assessor, the Ada County Recorder, and the Idaho
State Tax Commission, as Required by Law; and Providing for
a Summary of the Ordinance; and Providing for a Waiver of the
Reading Rules; and Providing an Effective Date
Simison: We will move on to 7-A, Ordinance No. 20-1886 -- and I'm tired -- and I will ask
the Clerk to read this ordinance by title.
Johnson: Thank you, Mr. Mayor. This is an ordinance related to H -2020-0030. McKay
Farm Subdivision for annexation of a parcel located in the NE 1/4 of the SE 1/4 of Section
32, Township 3 North, Range 1 East, Boise Meridian, Ada County, Idaho, as described in
Attachment "A” and annexing certain lands and territory, situated in Ada county, Idaho,
and adjacent and contiguous to the corporate limits of the City of Meridian as requested
by the City of Meridian; establishing and determining the land use zoning classification of
10.501 acres of land from RUT to R-8 (Medium Density Residential) Zoning District in the
Meridian City Code; providing that copies of this ordinance shall be filed with the Ada
County Assessor, the Ada County Recorder, and the Idaho State Tax Commission, as
required by law; and providing for a summary of the ordinance; and providing for a waiver
of the reading rules; and providing an effective date.
Simison: Thank you. You have heard this ordinance read by title. Is there anyone present
who would like it read in its entirety? Seeing and hearing no one with that request, do I
have a motion?
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Perreault: Mr. Mayor?
Hoaglun: Oh, go ahead.
Perreault: I move we approve Ordinance No. 20-1886 with the suspension of rules.
Hoaglun: Second the motion.
Strader: Second.
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Simison: I have a motion and a second to approve Ordinance No. 20 -1886 under
suspension of the rules. Is there any discussion on the motion? If not, all those in favor
say signify by saying aye. Those opposed nay. The ayes have it.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 8: Development Agreements [ Action Items]
A. Development Agreement for McKay Farm Subdivision (H-2020-
0030) with HBU Investments, LLC (Owner) and Fairbourne
Development, LLC (Developer), Located at 5875 S. Eagle Rd.
Simison: Item 8-A, development agreement for McKay Farm Subdivision, H-2020-0030.
Johnson: Mr. Mayor, typically this is on the Consent Agenda.
Simison: Right.
Johnson: Between Mr. Nary and I we had some confusion and moved it after the
annexation, when, indeed, it should have actually come before. So, this just requires a
motion and approval.
Simison: So, do I have a motion for this item?
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: I move approval of the development agreement for McKay Farm Subdivision,
H-2020-0030.
Strader: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to approve Item 8-A. Is there discussion on the
motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Those opposed nay. The ayes
have it.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 9: Future Meeting Topics
Simison: Is there any item for No. 9 under future meeting topics?
Item 10 [Amended on to Agenda]: Executive Session per Idaho Code 74-
206A(1)(a) To deliberate on a labor contract offer or to formulate a
counteroffer
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Simison: If not, we will move on to Item 10.
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: I move that we go into Executive Session per Idaho State Code 74-2064(1)(a).
Borton: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to go into Executive Session. Is there any
discussion on the motion? If not, Clerk will call the roll.
Roll call: Bernt, yea; Borton, yea; Cavener, yea; Hoaglun, yea; Strader, yea; Perreault,
yea.
Simison: All ayes. Motion carries.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
EXECUTIVE SESSION: (10:59 p.m. to 11:38 p.m.)
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor?
Simison: Councilman Hoaglun.
Hoaglun: I make a motion to come out of Executive Session.
Cavener: Second.
Simison: Motion and second to come out of Executive Session. Any discussion on the
motion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. The ayes have it. We are out of
Executive Session.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. TWO ABSENT (Perreault. Bernt).
Hoaglun: Mr. Mayor, I move to adjourn the meeting.
Cavener: Second.
Simison: I have a motion and a second to adjourn the meeting. All those in favor signify
by saying aye. Opposed nay. The ayes have it we. We are adjourned.
MOTION CARRIED: FOUR AYES. TWO ABSENT (Perreault. Bernt).
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 11:38 P.M.
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(AUDIO RECORDING ON FILE OF THESE PROCEEDINGS)
_______________________________ ______/______/______
MAYOR ROBERT SIMISON DATE APPROVED
ATTEST:
_____________________________________
CHRIS JOHNSON - CITY CLERK