HomeMy WebLinkAbout2004 03-16REVISED 3-16-04
CITY OF MERIDIAN
CITY COUNCIL REGULAR MEETING
AGENDA
Tuesday, March 16, 2004 at 7:00 p.m.
City Council Chambers
1. Roll -call Attendance:
X Shaun Wardle X Bill Nary
X Charlie Rountree X Keith Bird
X Mayor Tammy de Weerd
2. Pledge of Allegiance: Tim P.
3. Community Invocation by Pastor Shawn Ragan with The Church of God
Seventh Day: Presented
4. Adoption of the Agenda: Approve Revised Agenda
5. Consent Agenda:
A. Findings of Fact and Conclusions of Law for Approval: AZ 03-
022 Request for annexation and zoning of 5 acres from RT to C -G
zones for Kissler (Deals Parcell by BRS Architects — southeast
corner of East Ustick Road and North Eagle Road: Table to March
23, 2004 Meeting
B. Award of Bid for 2004 Sewer Cleaning ( TV Inspection Project:
Approve
C. HVAC Maintenance Renewal for the Meridian Police Department:
Approve
D. Additional Services — Black Cat Lift Station with JUB: Approve
6. Introduce Miss Meridian Hannah Bankhead: Presented
7. Department Reports:
A. Fire Department — Kenny Bowers
1. Discussion with Fire Department donated extrication
equipment: Update of equipment donated to Yellow Pine
2. Discussion with Fee Schedule: Approve Adjustment
Meridian City Council Agenda— March 16, 2004 Page 1 of 3
All materials presented at public meetings shall become property of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearings
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
REVISED 3-16-04
B. Mayor's Office — Mayor Tammy de Weerd
1. Appointment of Tara Green to Deputy City Clerk: Approve
C. Planning and Zoning Department — Anna Powell
Tingy Brady — Approve Revised Plat: Approve
8. (Items Moved from Consent Agenda)
9. FP 04-015 Request for Final Plat approval of 15 residential building lots and
4 other lots on 4.47 acres in a R4 zone for Woodside Creek Subdivision
by Woodside Properties, LLC —1115 North Ten Mile Road: Table to April 6,
2004 Meeting
10. Continued Public Hearing from March 9, 2004: RZ 03-013 Request for a
Rezone of 5.51 acres from R-4 to C -N zones for proposed Cedar Springs
Professional Center by Kevin Howell — north of West Ustick Road and west
of North Meridian Road: Attorney to prepare Findings of Fact and
Conclusions of Law for Approval
11. Continued Public Hearing from March 9, 2004: PP 03-044 Request for
Preliminary Plat approval of 5 commercial building lots and 1 common lot on
5.51 acres in a proposed C -N zone for proposed Cedar Springs
Professional Center by Kevin Howell — north of West Ustick Road and west
of North Meridian Road: Attorney to prepare Findings of Fact and
Conclusions of Law for Approval
12. Continued Public Hearing from March 9, 2004: CUP 03-067 Request for
a Conditional Use Permit for a Planned Development for four office buildings,
a car wash, two fuel pumps and a drive through coffee stand in a
Neighborhood Center designation for proposed Cedar Springs
Professional Center by Kevin Howell — north of West Ustick Road and west
of North Meridian Road: Attorney to prepare Findings of Fact and
Conclusions of Law for Approval
13. Public Hearing: AZ 03-036 Request for annexation and zoning of 19.7
acres from RUT to R-8 zones for proposed Salisbury Subdivision No. 2 by
Earl, Mason, and Stanfield, Inc. — south of West Ustick Road and west of
North Meridian Road: Attorney to prepare Findings of Fact and
Conclusions of Law for Denial
14. Public Hearing: PP 03-042 Request for Preliminary Plat approval for 72
single-family residential building lots and 2 common lots on 19.7 acres in a
proposed R-8 zone for proposed Salisbury Subdivision No. 2 by Earl,
Mason and Stanfield, Inc. — south of West Ustick Road and west of North
Meridian City Council Agenda — March 16, 2004 Page 2 of 3
All materials presented at public meetings shall become properly of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearings
please contact the City Clerk's Office at 888-0433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
REVISED 3-16-04
Meridian Road: Attorney to prepare Findings of Fact and Conclusions of
Law for Denial
16. Public Hearing: CUP 03-072 Request for a Conditional Use Permit for a
drive-thru window for a proposed coffee shop for Central Park Plaza by
Nahas Enterprises — northeast comer of South Progress Avenue and Central
Drive: Attorney to prepare Findings of Fact and Conclusions of Law for
Approval
16. Water, Sewer and Trash Delinquencies: Approve
17. Ordinance No. 04-1071 Administrative Assistant to the
Mayor: Approve
18. Executive Session per Idaho State Code 67-2346(1)(b)&(c): No
Decision
Meridian City Council Agenda — March 16, 2004 Page 3 of 3
All materials presented at public meetings shall become properly of the City of Meridian.
Anyone desiring accommodation for disabilities related to documents and/or hearings
please conduct the City Clerk's Office at 888.4433 at least 48 hours prior to the public meeting.
Meridian City Council Meeting March16, 2004.
The regular meeting of the Meridian City Council was called to order at 7:10 P.M.,
Tuesday, March 16, 2004, by Mayor Tammy de Weerd.
Members Present: Mayor Tammy de Weerd, William Nary, Keith. Bird, Charlie Rountree
and Shaun Wardle.
Others Present: Jill Holinka, Will Berg, Anna Powell, Brad Watson, Kenny Bowers, Bill
Musser, Gary Smith, and Dean Willis.
Item 1: Roll -call Attendance:
Roll call.
X Shaun Wardle
X Charlie Rountree
X
X Bill Nary
X Keith Bird
Mayor Tammy de Weerd
De Weerd: I will go ahead and call the City Council regular meeting of Tuesday, March
16th, to order. I would like to welcome you all here tonight. We do have a couple of
changes, if you haven't been to Council for a while. We have added the Pledge of
Allegiance and a community invocation to our agenda and we will be proceeding with
that after roll call vote.
Bird: Vote?
De Weerd: I mean attendance.
Item 2: Pledge of Allegiance:
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. We will be led in the pledge by Tim Pastelak. He is
with Troop No. 1. So, if you will, please, stand.
(The Pledge of Allegiance recited.)
Item 3: Community Invocation by Pastor Shawn Ragan with The Church of
God Seventh Day:
De Weerd: Thank you, Tim. I do have a pin for you. I'd like to present you with a
Meridian water tower pin for leading us today. Thank you for joining us. Okay. Today
for the community invocation we have Pastor Ragan with the Church of God Seventh
Day.
Ragan: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, it's a pleasure to be here this evening.
Let us pray. Father, we come before you this evening, Lord, thankful for this time we
have, Lord, thankful for the opportunity in the nation we live in where we can have city
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
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council meetings. Lord, I just pray that you would be with this meeting this evening,
Lord, that you might just guide and direct and give wisdom to the decisions that are
being made. I pray that you would be with our Mayor and members of the City Council,
Lord, not just tonight in the decisions that they are making, Lord, but on a daily basis.
Father, just continue to bless them and their families. Lord, bless our city, our
government, and I just pray to be with our police department, our fire department, the
various administrative offices, Father, that you just might, you know, just really bless
that and, Lord, lead and guide and direct in what is being done. Father, I just once
again thank you. We'd just ask that you be with our community, be with the City of
Meridian. Father, we just -- once, again, we thank you and we praise you in the name
of your Son Jesus Christ, Amen. Thank you.
Item 4: Adoption of the Agenda:
De Weerd: Thank you so much. Okay. Item No. 4 is adoption of the agenda.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: We need to add a couple of items to the deal. Under Department Reports, Item
C, Planning and Zoning, as per an item. Also Item 18 we moved from the pre -Council
meeting, an Executive Session as per Idaho State Code 67-2345(1)(b) and (c). And we
have also been asked by the representative of the developer on Woodside Creek
Subdivision to table that until 4/6/04 and that is Item 9. And with that I would make a
motion that we adopt the revised agenda.
Wardle: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. It's been moved and seconded to adopt the agenda as amended by
Mr. Bird. Any further discussion?
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: On the Consent Agenda, Item 5-A, did we need to --
De Weerd: Table that.
Nary: -- table that?
De Weerd: Uh-huh.
Nary: Did you say that?
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March 16, 2004
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Bird: No, I didn't, but I was going to take care of that when we do the Consent Agenda.
Nary: Okay. Great. I'm sorry. Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Any further discussion? All those in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion
carried.
MOTION CARRIED: THREE AYES. ONE ABSENT.
Item 5: Consent Agenda:
A. Findings of Fact and Conclusions of Law for Approval: AZ 03-
022 Request for annexation and zoning of 5 acres from RT to C -G
zones for Kissler (Deals Parcell by BRS Architects — southeast
corner of East Ustick Road and North Eagle Road: Tabled.
B. Award of Bid for 2004 Sewer Cleaning / TV Inspection Project:
C. HVAC Maintenance Renewal for the Meridian Police
Department:
D. Additional Services — Black Cat Lift Station with JUB:
De Weerd: Item 5 is the Consent Agenda. Mr. Nary.
Nary: No. No. I was just asking a question.
De Weerd: I assume you have a motion, though.
Nary: I guess Item 5-A was asked to be tabled to next -- to the 4/6 meeting? Is that the
date?
De Weerd: No. I think it's just for a week, isn't it?
Bird: It's 3/23.
Nary: Well, we don't have --
Bird: Yeah. We got one 3/23.
Nary: Oh. You're right. You're right. I'm sorry. 3/23. 1 have got another one on my
mind for 4/6. I'm sorry. So, then, I'd move for the approval of Consent Agenda to table
Item 5-A to 3/23 and move approval of Items B, C, and D and for the Mayor to sign and
the Clerk to attest to all the appropriate papers.
Wardle: Second.
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
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De Weerd: Thank you. Its been moved and seconded and approve the Consent
Agenda with removal of Item A to March 23rd. Any further discussion? Mr. Clerk, will
you call roll.
Roll -Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, absent; Wardle, yea; Nary, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: THREE AYES. ONE ABSENT.
Item 6: Introduce Miss Meridian Hannah Bankhead:
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Item 6. 1 would like to introduce you to our Miss
Meridian, Hannah Bankhead. She is a BSU student and a senior in mass
communications; correct?
Bankhead: Correct.
De Weerd: With a minor in political science. I think we could all talk to her about that
one. She grew up and graduated from Cambridge High School and she wanted to
come and talk to you, let you know whom she is, and also the city events, she certainly,
as Miss Meridian, is available and would love to participate. And I didn't put those
words in your mouth; right?
Bankhead: No. Everything is correct. Good evening. I just wanted to thank you guys
so much for having me here before and since the Mayor did such a good job introducing
myself and where I come from, I will just talk a little bit about as to why I'm here. And
there is, basically, a couple different reasons. One is to thank you, because the City of
Meridian has basically -- like you said before, I'm, actually, from another community and
you guys have just -- and everybody behind me has basically just adopted me and I
appreciate that so much, especially since now that the Miss Meridian has kind of
become an independent entity away from the Chamber of Commerce, so we are trying
to build up the program just to be -- work for the Chamber of Commerce, but also for the
entire community, so to broaden that goal. So, thank you so much on just welcoming
me into your community. So, that's one of the things I wanted to say. And, then, also
just to offer any services I can help for the community. Right now I'm volunteering once
every two weeks for the Boys and Girls Club of Meridian, which I can tell you is one of
my favorite things to do on a Thursday afternoon. Basically, what I help out with over
there is I just -- I help with the Power Hour, which is tutoring, whenever the kids,
basically, have issues with that day, whether it's reading, math, whatever. Since I'm a
college student, it's pretty -- it's nice, because most of these kids are from elementary
schools and I can actually help them. It's not over my head yet. But, you know, if there
is anything else that any -- that any of the Council or Mayor herself has -- any issues or
community service ideas, you're welcome to give me a call. I know her secretary has
my number. I'm just like you, I'm a servant of the community and if there is any way or
any activity that you think I can serve the community better, please, I would love to
know and love to find out. I know the Mayor called me to be a judge at the chili feed
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March 16, 2004
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and that was fabulous. I got to meet Mr. Nary and Mr. Wardle and that was a lot of fun
and I don't know if Mr. Bird or Mr. Berg were there, so -- and I don't think I have met you
guys.
Nary: They were more in the background.
Bankhead: Oh. Okay. We had the fun job of actually eating, but -- so, you know, just
to offer my services because, I know that you guys are busy and if there is, you know,
anything that I can help out with, I don't really -- it doesn't have to be -- you know, a lot
of people think, oh, you know, beauty queen must be out in the spotlight, whatever, you
know, always be dressed up, you have something really pretty and dramatic. Really, it's
about serving the community, just like what your job is, and that's basically it. So, if
there is any questions?
De Weerd: Council, do you have any questions?
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Did you say you were at the Boys and Girls Club on Thursday afternoon?
Bankhead: Every other Thursday. Right now I'm also volunteering for the one at Ada
County. So, it's kind of -- and I'm in the process of graduating this May and trying to find
a new job. So, its a little hectic right now. I'm hoping to bring that on a weekly basis
instead of bi-weekly basis, but -- yeah.
Nary: I just want to tell my nine-year-old daughter, because she met you at the chili
feed, too. So, when she can be down there at the Girls and Boys Club.
Bankhead: Oh, is she down there?
Nary: Oh, yeah.
De Weerd: And she just loves Miss Meridian.
Nary: Yes, she does.
Bankhead: Any other questions?
De Weerd: Well, thank you so much for joining us and offering -- and indicating an
interest in being as involved in our community as you can. We appreciate that.
Bankhead: Thank you.
Nary: Thank you.
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
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De Weerd: Thank you, Hannah. Okay
joined us. Nice seeing you.
Rountree: I'm back.
Item 7: Department Reports:
For the record, Councilman Rountree has
A. Fire Department — Kenny Bowers
1. Discussion with Fire Department donated extrication
equipment:
De Weerd: That's scary. Okay. Item No. 7 is the Department Reports. We will begin
with a report from the fire department. Kenny Bowers.
Bowers: Thank you, Mayor.
De Weerd: Discussion of the fire department donated extrication equipment.
Bowers: Madam Mayor, City Council Members, I just wanted to bring you up to date on
the extrication equipment that we donated to Yellow Pine. They have already come
down and picked the equipment up, starting to mount it in some of their emergency rigs
up there. They are really pleased to have some newer equipment to be able to work
with up there. As you know, there was an airplane crash up there awhile back and they
did not have any equipment at all to help the people get out of the plane, so they come
down, took some of our extrication gear, some of our old stuff, some of our old bottles,
and they would like to come back later and possibly pick up some of the radials that we
still have on our list, so I wanted you to get up to speed on that. Thank you.
2. Discussion with Fee Schedule:
De Weerd: Thank you, Chief. We have one other item, it's discussion of the fee
schedule -- you might not have put that on. Maybe I did.
Bowers: Okay.
De Weerd: It was just regarding Deputy Chief Silva's memo regarding the fees that we
passed last year and the process that he recommended in regards to the sprinkler
heads. Kenny, did you want to say anything more about that?
Bowers: Madam Mayor, City Council Members, the state had that -- that does all of our
plans for sprinkler systems -- fire sprinkler systems has a person that will be retiring
soon, so they thought they would get out of the business of doing the check, checking
the plans. Well, as it turns out there is a lot of little departments out there that do not
have their own fire marshals or their own people to take care of this, so they are going
Meridian City CouncE
March 16, 2004
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to stay in the business and we will be able to work with them and they can do our plans.
We did not anticipate this, so we had moved the price up to $4.20 a sprinkler head and
as the state will still be involved and go through all the plans, they also charge two
dollars a head. We did not envision whatsoever of charging the people $6.20 a head,
no way possible. So, I had Deputy Chief Silva contact Attorney Bill Nichols to come up
with a solution and this is the letter that he -- that Joe Silva and Bill Nichols put together
to present in front of you guys. If you have any questions, I'm here to try to answer that
for you.
De Weerd: Council, do you have any questions? Okay. Do we need official action on
that?
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess probably for the department's sake, I guess probably a motion, because
what he's asking is not for an increase of any kind, but, basically, a different way of
calculating it and there is no increase to the person, but I guess he wants to make sure
he has authorization to do it that way, so --
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I would concur with that and I have talked to both Chief Bowers and Deputy Chief
Silva and that is -- I believe that's what we need is just a confirmation that the fee is
going down two dollars a sprinkler head in cost to the contractor or whoever is applying
for the sprinkler heads and with that I would move that we approve the two dollar
decrease in our sprinkler head fees.
Nary: Second.
De Weerd: Now, that would not necessarily be a decrease, it would be offset as long as
we have the relationship with the state; is that correct?
Bowers: Madam Mayor, City Council that is correct. Yes.
De Weerd: Okay. Could you specify -- would that be agreeable to specify that in your
motion?
Bird: Yeah. That's what the letter says there.
De Weerd: Okay. Okay. Is there any further discussion? Mr. Berg, just for the record,
if you will call roll.
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March 16, 2004
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Roll -Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Nary, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
B. Mayor's Office — Mayor Tammy de Weerd
Appointment of Tara Green to Deputy City Clerk:
De Weerd: Thank you. Thanks, chief. Item B is a report from the Mayor's office. I did
want to -- I know each of you received a letter regarding one of our city employees.
This process with the utility billing and with the kind of third party, we received a lot of
comments -- certainly we received one also from the author of this letter. I did want to
give -- and I know Stacy isn't here, but certainly we appreciate the customer service that
has been experienced lately in our billing department and the employee noted is Maria,
she's certainly -- this is not the first time I have heard very positive comments on her
going above and beyond in giving customer service to our public, so I just wanted to
bring that to your attention publicly. And maybe -- I did give this to Pauline to put in her
personnel record as well. So, my item is appointment of Tara Green to the Deputy City
Clerk. We started this process a while ago of asking Council to approve this
appointment, because it is a critical position and that it replaces our city clerk when he is
not available and would be authorized to sign documents in his absence and I believe
that we are appointing a very worthy employee. She's given a lot of time and effort
above and beyond to the city clerk's office. It will be nice that we have someone that
can fill in without -- I think she's filled in for this position on a number of occasions now,
so if you need to hear anything from the director, Will, is there anything you have to
add?
Berg: Madam Mayor, just accolades that she has done far beyond her duty as
department specialist, so this is a very worthy promotion.
De Weerd: Thank you. Council, do you have any questions?
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I don't know, did Mrs. Green want to give a speech or anything? I see you out in
the hallway. I think it's an excellent choice. I really do. I think Tara has been an
excellent employee, I think she's more than capable for this job. So, I guess with that I
would move the approval of the Mayor's appointment of Tara Green as the Meridian
City Deputy Clerk.
Bird: Second.
Rountree: Second.
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
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De Weerd: Okay. It's been moved and seconded to approve the appointment of Tara
Green as Deputy City Clerk. We don't need roll call on this, do we? Okay. All those in
favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carried. Thank you, Tara.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
C. Planning & Zoning.
De Weerd: Okay. We did not have any items moved from the Consent Agenda.
De Weerd: Item 9 has been requested to be postponed until April 6th.
Powell: Madam Mayor? We did have a department report for Planning and Zoning.
De Weerd: Oh, I'm sorry, Anna. Yes, we did. We have a department report from our
Planning and Zoning director.
Powell: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, this issue is regarding the
enlargement of the dental office by Tingey and Brady. It's on Cherry and 11th Street, I
believe, and I think they started, I don't know, three or four months ago. We approved
the addition with the certificate of zoning compliance and those are the two drawings
that you have here. This shaded area is the proposed addition. This is the floor plan of
it. And were it only that easy, they would have been done quite a bit -- a long time ago.
This project was originally done as a condominium plat and for those of you who may
not know how those work is, basically, a condominium plat defines the vertical -- it
defines the space that the building encloses and sets ownerships based on the space of
the structure. So, to modify the condominium plat that was recorded, because it doesn't
include this additional area, we -- Brad and I tried to do kind of a lot line adjustment
thing for them and that didn't work, so we are back here now and, basically, the Ada
county surveyor, who is the one that signs the condo plats, has said that it needs to
have the same signatures as the original plat. So, on that original plat, the city clerk has
signed for the City Council, so all we would ask tonight is that you allow Mr. Berg to
again sign the revised condominium plat for you as being in compliance.
De Weerd: Okay. And that would take a motion.
Powell: Couldn't hurt. Yeah. I guess. Yes.
De Weerd: Council, any questions? Okay. I would entertain a motion.
Wardle: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: I move that we allow the city clerk to sign for the City Council on the
condominium plat for Cherry and 11th Street; is that correct?
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March 16, 2004
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Powell: Tingey Brady.
Wardle: Tingey Brady.
Bird: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. It's been moved and seconded to authorize the clerk to sign the
Tingey Brady amended plan. Any further discussion? Okay. All those in favor say aye.
Okay. All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Powell: Thank you, Council.
Item 8: (Items Moved from Consent Agenda)
Item 9: FP 04-015 Request for Final Plat approval of 15 residential building lots
and 4 other lots on 4.47 acres in a R-4 zone for Woodside Creek
Subdivision by Woodside Properties, LLC —1115 North Ten Mile Road:
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Item 9 has been requested to postpone. Do I have a
motion?
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I would move that we continue -- or I guess it isn't a Public Hearing, so I move that
we table FP 04-015, to April 6th, 2004.
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. It's been moved and seconded to table Item 9 to April
6th, 2004. Any further discussion? All those in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 10: Continued Public Hearing from March 9, 2004: RZ 03-013 Request for
a Rezone of 5.51 acres from R-4 to C -N zones for proposed Cedar
Springs Professional Center by Kevin Howell — north of West Ustick
Road and west of North Meridian Road:
Item 11: Continued Public Hearing from March 9, 2004: PP 03-044 Request for
Preliminary Plat approval of 5 commercial building lots and 1 common lot
on 5.51 acres in a proposed C -N zone for proposed Cedar Springs
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March 16, 2004
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Professional Center by Kevin Howell — north of West Ustick Road and
west of North Meridian Road:
Item 12: Continued Public Hearing from March 9, 2004: CUP 03-067 Request
for a Conditional Use Permit for a Planned Development for four office
buildings, a car wash, two fuel pumps and a drive through coffee stand in
a Neighborhood Center designation for proposed Cedar Springs
Professional Center by Kevin Howell — north of West Ustick Road and
west of North Meridian Road:
De Weerd: Okay. I will go ahead and open Items 10, 11, and 12, continued public
hearings from March gth, 2004, RZ 03-013, PP 03-044, and CUP 03-067 for Cedar
Springs Professional Center and I will start with staff comments.
Powell: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council -- an idea of where we are. We are on
the north side of Ustick in this small -- in this small approximately five -acre area here.
This is the park. This is a future school site as part of Cedar Springs. This is Venable
Lane. This is the proposed plat. And you can see there is five lots. One large lot here,
a private drive, and, then, four office lots. This is a little easier to see this one and better
yet is the color one. There we go. The four -- there would be four buildings on each --
on an individual lot for sale and ownership. The associated parking with each one with
cross -access agreements. And, then, we have a car wash facility with vacuums on this
side. Fuel canopies or fuel islands here. And, then, a small coffee shop with a drive-
thru here. This is the elevations of the structures. The car wash elevation, specifically.
These are the offices. Okay. This is here to show you the layout for the school. The
orientation is different. We have got north going to the right in this instance, so the
proposed subdivision lays here to the left. And, then, the park -- sorry. The north arrow
is on -- we have got north arrows going every direction today, except for down, I
suppose. This is north. So, you have got the project -- there is a small intervening
property here and, then, our project would be over down below.
De Weerd: No.
Bird: No. It's to the west of it.
Powell: Its this side? Oh, I'm sorry. Okay. I've got it now. So, here is the intervening
property here and, then, the property is over there. I'm sorry. I got confused. All right.
Now, let's see. I just wanted to point out -- this is -- they are asking for a detailed CU
and planned development approval for the entire site and that consists of 22,400 square
feet of office space and, then, the auto -oriented services on this lot here, which include
the car wash, fuel island, vacuuming stations, and coffee shop. The Comprehensive
Plan does designate this area as the neighborhood center and I can -- if I can keep on
going here. You can see it here. Its this portion on -- right here. And there is the park
again. The school would be there. So, it is designated as the neighborhood center.
This is the first application that has come through with a neighborhood center property.
The one at Quenzer or Heritage came in before the Comp Plan was adopted, so this is,
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March 16, 2004
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actually, the first neighborhood center to come through since the adoption of the Comp
Plan. And in the staff report I did want to point out that Brad did spend quite a bit of
time on the Comprehensive Plan and the idea of the neighborhood center and what
should -- it should entail. I'm going to skip now to the summary of the Planning and
Zoning Commission. They did recommend approval of the project. Daren Fluke
representing the applicant testified in favor of the application. Joe Semanich, who owns
the property just to the south on the west side of Venable Lane, testified in opposition to
the fuel station next to an elementary school. He also stated his preference for
residential uses and the car wash is not needed in this area of the city. Other key points
of discussion included the width and location of the driveways serving the car wash.
This was the original submittal and if you will notice here that there is an island here and
a landscape island here, but this is -- was kind of an undifferentiated drive aisle area in
both these locations. There was some striping proposed, but no landscaping. The
Planning and Zoning did modify the project. Figure out which way I'm going. There we
go. They did have the applicant modify the project to include additional landscaping
planters to kind of define this private street that goes through the property. The key
Commission changes to the original staff recommendation was to remove the
requirement for a bike lane on Venable Lane here to the west and the requirement for a
fencing plan and they added a condition to the preliminary plat that a new 25 foot wide
cross -access easement be shown on the plat to the out parcel to the east. As I
mentioned before, there is a small kind of intervening property between this one and the
park and it's anticipated that this development will share cross -access with this property
that we are -- is the subject of the hearing tonight. So, they have accommodated that
on their plat. They haven't shown it -- they haven't shown pavement going up to the
east property line, but they have accommodated with a cross -access easement. Also in
your file you will find an update memo from Brad, dated March 11th, and that was in
regard to the revised site plan and how it meets the requirements of the Planning and
Zoning Commission. They did submit a new landscape plan and any approvals tonight
should reflect the revised date as stated there. It was March 8th. The new fuel island
canopy elevations are dated October 2003 and any motion should include the revised
sheet in condition number six. And, then, finally, the revised site plan does not reflect a
couple of the proposed changes and one of those was a detached sidewalk on Ustick
Road, right-of-way landscape improvements adjacent to Ustick Road, and a parallel
parking stall change. So, those are outstanding conditions. Brad felt that they could be
taken care of at the certificate of zoning compliance level. So, with that I think I will end
staffs presentation.
De Weerd: Okay. Council, any questions?
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Anna, would you go back to the site plan that you had up there?
Powell: The vicinity --
Meridian City Council
March 16.2004
Page 13 of 43
Bird: The overall site. The overall site.
Powell: Okay.
Bird: There. There you go. Right there.
Powell: You can see the relationship to the school there.
Bird: That's the park.
Powell: And that's the park. Yeah.
Bird: And that's the school.
Powell: Here is the four lots and there is the --
Bird: And, then, there is the little enclave between the -- at the --
Powell: Right. Correct.
Bird: Okay. Thank you very much, Anna.
De Weerd: So, Anna, what is that -- that lot going to be?
Powell: This one?
De Weerd: Uh-huh.
Powell: Well, it, actually, would be pretty easy just to pop out the parking aisle and put
a small building there and there and I believe Mr. Howell has actually been trying to
acquire that piece of property, so I don't -- or the applicant can testify more to that, but I
think they have looked at how they can incorporate that into this site design, basically.
De Weerd: So, that's under separate ownership?
Powell: Yes. It is not an out parcel from this one. It is under separate ownership and I
believe it has been for quite some time. There is a house toward the front of the
property.
De Weerd: And to the school site, then, how does traffic get to the school site?
Powell: They come up Venable Lane and there is an entrance right there and, then,
they loop around back onto Venable Lane and come back out this way. Would you like
to see the detail of the school site again?
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
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De Weerd: Yeah.
Powell: This is the north boundary of the Cedar Springs Professional Center here.
De Weerd: Okay.
Powell: So, the school -- I believe the bus traffic probably comes through here, out, and
around.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. Any further discussion, Council?
Bird: I have none.
De Weerd: Okay. Would the applicant like to step forward? I guess before I have the
applicant step forward, part of our ordinance is we need to swear people in who desire
to provide testimony on any of these public hearings, so we have been doing it all in one
group motion, so if all those who are looking to testify who would like to provide
testimony on any of the items on our agenda tonight, if you will, please, raise your right
hand. Is the testimony you provide tonight the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the
truth, so help you God? If so, answer I do.
(Affirmative answers.)
De Weerd: Thank you. If you will, please, state your name and address and spell your
last name.
Fluke: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, Daren Fluke, JUB Engineers, 250
South Beechwood in Boise. Fluke is F -1 -u -k -e. Thank you very much for having us here
tonight. We are glad to be here with this application, as Anna stated. She did a good
job of taking you through the parameters of the development. I'll just reemphasize that
this is the first time you have had an application go through your neighborhood center
and we have asked for a C -N zoning designation, which is the least intensive
commercial designation. It does allow office uses and a car wash, fuel island, through
the conditional use process and so that's what we have applied for. Just a couple of
things. I won't belabor the development features, unless you have questions, because
Anna hit those well. The school site, I would just emphasize for you, was purely
conceptual. They have not -- the school district has not decided that that is the layout
and you will receive the layout when they apply for the Conditional Use Permit, but that
was something that they gave us originally when we went through with Cedar Springs,
basically to show what the footprint of the building and the parking would look like, but
how that site is going to be arranged has yet to be decided. We did comply with all the
conditions of approval as required by the Planning and Zoning Commission. We added
a seven -foot sidewalk along here to better accommodate the school, make it more
pedestrian friendly. I would note that this road, Venable Lane, is currently being platted
as a part of Cedar Springs No. 3 and that's under construction right now and so we had
to quickly change the plans and I believe that sidewalk has been installed, that seven
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March 16, 2004
Page 15 of 43
feet, as of now. If it hasn't, it's very close to being poured. We added the landscape
islands as required by the Planning and Zoning Commission here to better delineate
this lot. We took out some striped islands that we had in here in the parking area and
added planters to those. And, then, we added a detached sidewalk along here. It's kind
of difficult to see, but you can see a little strip there right below the sidewalk, which is
the planter strip in between the right of way and the sidewalk and it is noted in the
ACHD staff report as well, that this will accommodate a detached sidewalk on this road
section that they plan on putting here. The bottom line is we don't have a problem with
any of the conditions of approval as recommended by the staff and the Planning and
Zoning Commission and we'd just ask for your approval of the application. Is there any
questions?
De Weerd: Questions, Council? Okay. Thank you. I have a Brent -- and forgive me,
Brent, I can't read your last name. Did you want to provide testimony? There is no
Brent here. Okay. Joe Semanich. If you will, please, state your name and your
address.
Semanich: Thank you. I'm Joe Semanich. I live at 955 West Ustick Road, which is
approximately just across from this property.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Semanich: Are we going to have an access to this property from Ustick Road? Do I
see another access there?
De Weerd: I believe, Mr. Semanich, the access is on the bottom right where that arrow
is.
Semanich: And we are also going to have an access off of Venable Lane? Are we
going to have two accesses into that?
De Weerd: Yes. And that's -- that's also shown -- see where the arrow is?
Semanich: Yes. I wasn't aware we were going to have an access to Ustick Road. But,
in any event, I really don't think that commercial and gas stations and office buildings
are compatible with a grade school. That should be housing. If that were housing, it
would eliminate probably a half a bus load of kids coming from some other area, so I
feel that either the school is in the wrong place or these commercial developments are
in the wrong place and to have a gas station adjacent to a park, residential area -- but
according to the new Comprehensive Plan, you zone those neighborhood commercials,
but it looks like from the circle you draw that it's about 40 acres. Now, if you are going
to have 40 acres of commercial at every half mile line, there is going to be a lot of
vacant property for a long, long time for developers waiting for somebody to want that
for commercial. So, I'd just like for the City Council to consider these things in the future
plans and see if we can't find -- locate these schools where we can have more of a
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 16 of 43
community school, rather than commercial developments and business developments
adjacent to schools. So, that's all I have on this matter and thank you very much.
De Weerd: Thank you. Any questions? Okay. Thank you. Bill Jackson. If you will
state your name and address.
Jackson: Yes. My name is Bill Jackson and my address is 12365 West Ustick in Boise.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Jackson: And I own acreage, which would be east of the proposed area. And my only
comment is I share those of Joe Semanich and that my background has been in
construction, I have worked all over the world, and at one time back in New Jersey I had
the opportunity to be on planning and zoning and one of the things that I think is very
important for the City of Meridian is to have really nice residential communities, not the
commingling of say this proposed car wash, along with the fuel dispensing. We had an
experience where the Ustick and Cloverdale -- the Maverick went in and put in a gas
station and it just did not add to the quality of the area and as we moved forward in
Meridian I hope that is given really careful thought how we manage the
commercialization. You know, much is already in that area and to me that's a good
place to have those areas where kids can feel free to why and not to be threatened by
traffic coming in and out. And that's all I want to say is just give that some very careful
thought. To make Meridian, hopefully, a premier designation city that will have not only
statewide recognition, but, hopefully, national recognition down the road.
De Weerd: Thank you, Mr. Jackson. Any questions? Okay. Thank you, sir. Okay. Is
there anyone else who would like to issue testimony on this application? Mr. Fluke,
would you like to rebut?
Fluke: Thank you, Madam Mayor. I will be brief and just say that the very idea of your
Comprehensive Plan is to begin to get a better mix and a tighter matrix of land uses and
that's exactly what we are trying to do here is mix together some of these uses and get
away from that strict segregation of residential with all those services that you need for
daily life. I would anticipate that this is just a small portion of that neighborhood center
that you would get some more neighborhood -type commercial to the east, which is
vacant, undeveloped land. Currently, it has a dwelling on there. But you will get a
broader range of uses and this is just the first one to come in and I believe that exactly
the opposite of what the gentleman is proposing is what is smart to do here is provide
an integration of land uses and start to provide services that are closer to where people
are living. With regard to putting houses there instead, I'd just say if you look at the
plats of Cedar Springs, there is some 300 dwellings in this. This is Baldwin Park and it
has another couple hundred dwellings and it's being extended down into here. So, all of
this will connect by foot and Cedar Springs North is going on up in here now. You're
going to have in the neighborhood of, I don't know, 800, 1,000 dwelling units all within
about three-quarters of a mile of that school. And I think that's a lot of roof tops to -- for
that to be serving and it does provide the opportunity for kids to walk there and I don't
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 17 of 43
think that this use in any way impedes the school being there. We have good
separation between our use and theirs. These office lots are in the neighborhood of
150 feet deep, I believe, so -- and the school will fence across there. This will be a
neighborhood collector. We will have the wider sidewalks and no parking on there. So,
I think the uses actually fit quite well together.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. Any questions for the applicant? Okay. Is there any
further discussion or comments? Okay. Council, what's your pleasure?
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Hearing nobody jumping out of their chairs wanting to talk, I move that we close
the public hearings on RZ 03-013, PP 03-044, and CUP 03-067.
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. It's been moved and seconded to close the public hearings on Items
10, 11, and 12. All those in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: Discussion? Hearing none --
Rountree: I have none.
De Weerd: Okay.
Wardle: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: I would just like to say, as far as the commercial development and the level of
commercial, we are certainly not looking at a Maverick convenience store, we are
looking at several smaller commercial entities, a car wash, and what I perceive to be a
gas card fuel pump center, which would have probably much less impact than a
convenience store, and so I see that as meeting the needs of Comprehensive Plan.
Bird: I would echo that.
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 18 of 43
Nary: I guess on that same line, Anna, I think I heard Mr. Fluke say that this was the
lowest intense use of zoning for the commercial zoning or neighborhood commercial
zone. I mean is a C store even allowed in that type of zone that's being asked for?
Powell: I believe it actually is. I can't say positively off the top of my head, but I suspect
with a Conditional Use Permit that it would be. Mr. Fluke is looking it up for me, so
that's what the pause was for. I did want to just point out that the purpose of the
neighborhood center was not strictly retail, though, as I'm sure you know, so it's just --
there was a mix of uses geared -- or intended within those neighborhood centers, so --
it's allowed with a conditional use.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
Powell: Its allowed -- apparently it's allowed as a principal permitted use, a
convenience store is.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I agree with Mr. Semanich, I don't like to see gas stations that close to a school,
but in the same token, they do have quite a buffer zone between that and also with a
gas station out in that area -- we have no gas stations out there and people have to
travel quite awhile -- or through quite a few subdivisions to get to one and I think it's
something that we need in these neighborhood commercial developments. We studied
long and hard on the last Comprehensive Plan to incorporate these and I think this was
a very, very good way to start myself.
De Weerd: Okay. Any further discussion?
Bird: I will make a motion if you want.
De Weerd: Okay. Mr. Bird.
Bird: I move that we approve RZ 03-013, Cedar Springs Professional Center, and to
incorporate all staff, applicant, public testimony, and for the attorney to draw up the
proper papers.
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: It's been moved and seconded to approve Item No. 10 for Cedar Springs
Professional Center. Any further discussion? Okay. Hearing none, Mr. Clerk, will you
call roll?
Roll -Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Nary, yea.
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 19 of 43
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Item No. 11. Mr. Bird.
Bird: Thank you. I would move that we approve PP 03-044, Cedar Springs Preliminary
Plat for their professional center and to incorporate all public, applicant, and staff
comments and the attorney to draw up the proper papers.
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. It's been moved and seconded to approve Item No. 11 for Cedar
Springs Professional Center. Any further discussion?
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I know that Mr. Bird includes this when he said staff comments, but just for Mrs.
Holinka's purposes as well, I think when you're also talking about it, that March 11th
memo, as well as the revised --
Bird: Oh, yeah. That was all part of --
Nary: And you meant all of those things, but just to make sure that --
Bird: I'm sorry. I should have dated that. Yes. I'm sorry.
Nary: There is a March 11th memo from Mr. Hawkins -Clark and, then, the revised site
plan.
Bird: Yeah.
Nary: Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you for the clarification. Mr. Berg, will you call roll.
Roll -Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Nary, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Item No. 12.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Meridian City council
March 16, 2004
Page 20 of 43
Bird: I move we approve CUP 03-067, the Conditional Use Permit for Cedar Springs
Professional Center and to incorporate all staff, applicant, and public testimony and for
the attorney to draw up the proper papers.
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. It's been moved and seconded to approve CUP 03-067 for Cedar
Springs Professional Center. Any further discussion? Okay. Mr. Berg.
Roll -Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Nary, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 13: Public Hearing: AZ 03-036 Request for annexation and zoning of 19.7
acres from RUT to R-8 zones for proposed Salisbury Subdivision No. 2
by Earl, Mason, and Stanfield, Inc. — south of West Ustick Road and west
of North Meridian Road:
Item 14: Public Hearing: PP 03-042 Request for Preliminary Plat approval for 72
single-family residential building lots and 2 common lots on 19.7 acres in a
proposed R-8 zone for proposed Salisbury Subdivision No. 2 by Earl,
Mason and Stanfield, Inc. — south of West Ustick Road and west of North
Meridian Road:
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Items 13 and 14 are public hearings on AZ 03-036 and
PP 03-042 for Salisbury Subdivision No. 2. 1 will open with staff comments.
Powell: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, we are not going very far. We are
going across the street today, so you will see none of the audience leaving, so -- this
property is located just south of Ustick Road. This is Waterbury Subdivision. This is the
recently approved preliminary and final plat here on this -- and I have forgotten the
name of the subdivision already. The property is actually comprised of two properties.
There are two existing homes. I did want to point out some interesting things or
challenges to the development of this site. The number one being a small strip of land
still owned by Mr. Venable on which Venable Lane is placed. You have different
properties -- a property right here. The Semaniches own this. This is on the Semanich
family trust here, so you have basically -- if you count this as one property and, then,
three other properties with interest in that private lane. There is further a little bit of
challenge in that were you to take Venable Lane exactly where it is today, ACHD
wouldn't approve it, because they want it to align with Venable Lane across the street in
the property we just looked at. So, it needs to jog onto this property here. This is the
proposed Salisbury Subdivision. It has 72 building lots and, as I mentioned before,
there are two existing houses. It has two stub streets coming into it, one here from
Salisbury Sub, I believe, or Salisbury Park -- Salisbury Lane Subdivision. Excuse me.
And this is Sedgewick Drive. And, then, you have Indian Rocks Creek coming in down
here and that was approved as part of Clearbook Estates. So, this is not yet
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 21 of 43
constructed, but this would provide another access. The overall density for the project
is 3.65 units per acre. They have 5.2 percent of the area in open space, so this is a
straight subdivision in the R-8 zoning district. They have not asked for a planned
development. The original site plan -- I believe this is the original. Yes. And it had a
stub street to Venable Lane for future connection and they did modify the plat at the
request of the neighboring properties to enlarge some of the lots bordering their east
boundary, so that it would tie in a little better with the existing subdivisions. I'm going to
move to the summary sheet from Planning and Zoning Commission, which I don't have
marked. The Planning and Zoning Commission has recommended approval of the
project and there was two separate public hearings, the first being on January 15th -- I
think it actually occurred on January 16th, but we started on January 15th, and the
primary -- I raise -- I already discussed some of the issues. There was really two
different issues discussed. One was just the overall density and the lot sizes, how they
were compatible with the neighboring properties. The other issue was the Venable
Lane. The Venable Lane one was primarily a concern of staff and the Semaniches.
The other testifiers were primarily here from the subdivisions talking about the lot sizes.
There was -- Brad has detailed all the speakers into fairly great length, so I'm not going
to read all of those. We did have to do some re -noticing because of posting problems at
these stub streets. This is the only place you would have been notified, unless you
received notice by mail, because they are not on an arterial, it's just these stub streets
and, actually, this is the only stub street that exists today. The key Commission
changes to staff recommendation were to condition number 16, to require only the
subject property owner to relinquish rights for the use of Venable Lane and I guess to
go back to the Venable Lane issue, it's really -- staff was concerned that this will
become another Wingate Lane. We have four property owners and, then, a fifth
property owner with -- that physically owns the land underneath the lane and staffs
original recommendation was that they put a connection to this and in our preliminary
pre -application meetings with Mr. Stanfield we strongly encouraged that they acquire
this 40 foot strip of land, so that they could put the public street out to Ustick and have a
secondary access. Based on the neighboring testimony and the Planning and Zoning
Commission, they have removed that stub street. Staff still has some questions about
how the city will not have this become a vacant piece of property over time, that just this
vacant 40 foot strip that sits out there. The question is is it something that these folks
need to solve now or is this something we can solve as time goes on. Staff had added
a condition of approval that said that these folks needed to get everybody to relinquish
property -- or relinquish the right to use Venable Lane when such time as the public
street was connected to their property. The Planning and Zoning Commission only
made it a requirement of these properties that are involved with this subdivision. I
guess with -- I'll end the staff presentation with that and answer more specific questions
you may have about Venable Lane or the neighboring concerns. Oh, Mr. Snodgrass did
provide written testimony. He was here earlier, had to leave. The clerk should have
gotten this to you. It, again, addresses their concerns about the size of the lots and the
access issues. There was quite a bit of discussion about construction traffic using
Sedgewick versus using Indian Rocks and whether or not it was appropriate to limited
traffic only to Sedgewick or only to Indiana Rocks. And I think I will end staff
presentation there.
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 22 of 43
De Weerd: Thank you, Anna. Any questions for staff at this point?
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Tell me, again, what were the zoning on those adjacent subdivisions? Were they
are R -4's or R-8?
Bird: They are R -4's
Powell: Yes. They are all R -4's and I did forget to mention that this is the other side of
the neighborhood center. So, when the applicant came in, we did talk about
transitioning some density toward that neighborhood center. As you will notice, the stub
streets all go north, anticipating that we will get this kind of finer grain of street networks
up there and a higher density for that neighborhood center. Yes. They are R-4.
Nary: Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Any further questions? Would the applicant or representative step
forward?
Stanfield: Good evening, Mayor. Scott Stanfield with Earl, Mason & Stanfield
Engineering, 314 Badiola in Caldwell, Idaho. I'm happy to be here tonight.
De Weerd: Were you part of the swearing in ceremony?
Stanfield: No, I don't think I was.
De Weerd: If you will raise your right hand. Is the testimony you are about to give the
truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
Stanfield: Yes.
De Weerd: Thank you very much.
Stanfield: Thank you. Okay. I will just kind of jump into -- and I will give this back to
you, Mr. Berg, when I'm finished here. The biggest issue in P&Z hearings when we had
the two hearings was the Venable Lane. In our initial submittal to the city we had a stub
road to Venable Lane and at that point we did know that Venable Lane was not owned
by any of the surrounding land owners, it was still owned by Mr. Venable, who lives
away from here. But, nonetheless, we did show that stub road. ACHD did not want
that, they did not support that, since nobody but -- fourth, fifth party, if you will, owned
the land which is Venable Lane. So, they did not support it. We had a meeting with the
city staff and myself and ACHD and after that meeting, then, we revised that and
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 23 of 43
eliminated that stub road to the plan that you see presented to you this evening. So, it's
a brief history behind that. What can we do to help prevent another situation with the
previous private road that happened in Meridian a while ago? We have agreed in the
P&Z meeting to go ahead and Woodside Properties will relinquish any rights through
some kind of legal recorded document that he releases the rights to access Venable
Lane at the appropriate time or with us before we plat -- it probably needs to be before
we plat, but at an appropriate time. And with that, that would run with all of the lots that
are purchased in this, since it runs with the land currently anyway and we would release
any ingress -egress, so eliminate any chance of anybody in this project being able to
access Venable Lane. The neighbors are here to testify and I think there is some
confusion as to what is asked from the neighbors on the Planning and Zoning's request
originally about getting their blessing not to access Venable and there is some clouded
issues there, so we are just trying to do what we can do and I would hope that you
would treat the neighboring landowners in the same fashion in the future when -- as
they come in for applications. So, again, we have tried to accommodate all the
agencies and just are kind of stuck in the middle of that, but will do what we can to avoid
a bad thing happening with the city in the future. Regarding some of the neighbors'
comments on Salisbury, again, we are following the city's Comprehensive Plan in this.
We have requested an R-8. We are far below an R-8. I think that's been an R-8 for
quite some time. The neighboring stub streets were provided through neighboring
development, so we are just continuing the city's to and through policy. Jeff Wood, the
developer, is here with Woodside Properties and, in fact, he's purchased the strip down
in the southeast corner that was created some time ago when Landsbury Subdivision
was created. He purchased that strip, which is between us and Clearbrook, Indian
Rocks, out of his own pocket, so that we could complete that stub. I believe
Clearbrook's plat was approved with just a dead end, because they couldn't get through
that strip that wasn't owned by them. So, he's went out of pocket and purchased that
and kind of went above and beyond, in our opinion, to really make these stub streets
work and the traffic patterns work for everybody. So, generally speaking, on Mr.
Snodgrass's letter, we feel we are complying with the Comprehensive Plan, which has
been in place, the stub roads have been in place, and everybody should have been
aware of what was going to happen in the future. And with that I will stand for any
questions.
De Weerd: Council, any questions?
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Mr. Stanfield, part of what I noted in Mr. Snodgrass's letter, as well as his
testimony at the Planning and Zoning Commission, was that there hasn't been any
contact or discussion with the homeowners in Salisbury One.
Stanfield: That's probably -- and I said in the P&Z meeting that that probably is half my
fault. Mr. Wood is out of town a lot on his business needs and so I'm kind of the middle
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 24 of 43
man and the way I left the first P&Z was if their proposed layout has a chance of
working, we would, then, get together, but it didn't work, ACHD pretty much shot it down
with their proposed layout, so with that I just left it to the next hearing and, meanwhile,
Mark and I did trade phone calls back and forth.
Nary: So, there wasn't any -- there wasn't any real attempt, then, to talk about these
compatibility issues, traffic issues --
Stanfield: Nothing beyond Mike and my phone tags, no.
Nary: And all of that was because of their plan and you were waiting to see if their plan
would work?
Stanfield: Yeah. If ACHD said we don't have a problem and the City of Meridian fire
department said we don't have a problem with their plan, then, it's my understanding
from the first P&Z meeting, then, we would step back and regroup. Well, the City of
Meridian fire department didn't have a problem with their plan, but ACHD did. So, felt
we really couldn't accommodate them with their revised layout.
Powell: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, perhaps the piece of information
you're missing is that Mr. Snodgrass did revise the plat, he drew a revised plat himself
and presented it to Mr. Stanfield at one of the Planning and Zoning Commission
hearings and that's the revised one that Mr. Stanfield is referring to now, just so you're
clear.
Nary: And I think I understood that. I guess what I was concerned is why you wouldn't
meet with them without that. I mean why wouldn't you want to meet with these
neighbors to address their concerns?
Stanfield: It's not wanting to, my perception was there -- wrongfully so, that there wasn't
a reason to, because their layout couldn't happen. So, with that I personally didn't move
forward with -- other than phone calls with Mr. Snodgrass. Here is their proposed
layout, if anybody wants a copy of it.
De Weerd: I guess what my question is -- didn't P&Z also ask you to meet with the
homeowners?
Stanfield: Not in their -- in their first hearing, Mayor, that's the way I left it with P&Z was
go ahead and meet with the homeowners -- if the City of Meridian and ACHD doesn't
have a problem with their layout, go ahead and meet with them. They did have a
problem, so, then, we moved forward with the second hearing and, then, the second
hearing we had the recommended approvals, so -- and at the second hearing there was
no discussion brought up that I recall to meet with the neighboring HOA's.
De Weerd: But it's still customary when there is issues and someone mentions to meet
with the homeowners, that our developers have come back after they have met with the
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March 16, 2004
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homeowners, because, apparently, there is still some remaining issues, not just tied to
the plan that they have submitted.
Stanfield: That's correct. And I take full responsibility of that, for not following through
with them. 1 just felt that we -- ACHD shot this layout down, so I -- and I explained at
both P&Z meetings that we can't reduce our lots and make this project work and I was
pretty clear with that, so there is -- in my opinion, since we couldn't reduce the lots --
number of lots, the size of the lots couldn't get bigger, there is -- we both agreed to
disagree. So, there was nothing that could come out of any discussions, other than the
discussions I had with Snodgrass between the two hearings.
De Weerd: Okay. Any other questions, Council? Okay. Thank you
Stanfield: Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. We have several people signed up to testify. Joe Semanich.
Semanich: Can I go later?
De Weerd: You bet. I have a Kevin or Sherry -- Sharon -- and I can't read that last
name either. Okay. Chris and Angela Brower. Do you promise the testimony you
provide tonight is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God.
Brower: I do.
De Weerd: Thank you. Please state your name and address.
Brower: Sure. Chris Brower, 387 West Woodbury Drive in Meridian. Madam Mayor,
Members of the Council, my neighbors and I in the Waterbury Park Subdivision have
two concerns about this project. First, traffic flow. Commissioner Zaremba
acknowledged that the applicant's traffic may not go equally on all four eventual access
roads. This is important, because after we had already moved into our existing
subdivisions, the city's Comprehensive Plan added the idea of a neighborhood center
on Ustick and we brought up our concern that high density neighborhood center traffic
would try to use our stub street in the northwest part of Waterbury Park as its primary
access, rather than using Ustick Road access. We pointed out why would people drive
up through the neighborhood center and its high density to a traffic light or stop sign on
Ustick and other stop sign at Ustick and Meridian to turn onto Meridian Road to go to
the center of town, when all they'd have to do instead is go through our existing
subdivision, since it was more direct. We were told not to worry, that traffic, if these
parcels around the neighborhood center were developed, would primarily use Ustick
Road. To my knowledge, none of the other proposed neighborhood centers is for more
than a semi circle. This is a full circle. The fire department is fine with only two access
roads to this parcel and both of those could be towards Ustick Road. Secondly,
construction. Commissioner Freckleton said that there could be a legal issue trying to
funnel construction access from this development onto Indiana Rocks Road. As we
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March 16, 2004
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saw in the private Wingate Lane, even when it was illegal for the construction trucks and
workers to use Wingate Lane, they did so anyway. The developer asking those trucks
please not use the private lane didn't work. Here the developer will be asking trucks
and construction workers to, please, not use Sedgewick Road, even though it's a public
road, but there is no way to enforce that. The applicant can only encourage all the
trucks and construction workers to use the as yet not even started Indian Rocks Road.
To sum up, our concerns are traffic, the fact that access to Ustick Road isn't the only
primary access for it in construction. We ask you to, please, weigh the concerns of
those of us who lived here years before the neighborhood center was proposed and
would please consider having the primary traffic points for this project to be toward
Ustick Road, as this project will set the precedent for the neighborhood center traffic
pattern in the parcel to the west that would drive through our subdivision. Thank you for
your consideration.
De Weerd: Thank you. Any questions? Okay. Thank you very much. Did Angela
want to provide testimony as well? Okay. Is there anyone else who would like to
provide testimony on this application? Please state your name and address again.
Semanich: Joe Semanich and I live at 955 West Ustick Road.
De Weerd: And, Mr. Semanich, you did participate at the beginning of the meeting;
correct?
Semanich: Yes, I did.
De Weerd: Thank you.
Semanich: The Semaniches -- our family has owned the property to the west of this
development, west of Venable Lane. It is my concern that if this project is going to be
excused from having an access to Venable Lane or be involved in the future of Venable
Lane, that the properties to the west and possibly the Jim Ward properties -- the Ward
property should be excused from having to build or rebuild Venable Lane as a collector
street. So, it's our concern that if this property is excused, we should be excused, too,
unless for some reason we would voluntarily want to acquire Venable Lane and improve
it. Now, I'll ask Jim Ward if he agrees with that. So, that's one thing that I think the
Council really should consider is what is going to be required of Venable Lane in the
future, so that the Wards and the Semaniches are not saddled with the building of
Venable Lane. It's really a very important thing. As far as usage for construction, as far
as I'm concerned, the trucks can use Venable Lane, so they water occasionally and
they can access that subdivision for construction. It was also used for construction of
the South Slough sewer line to keep from going through residences. So, that should be
no problem. And another question I have -- I would like the City Council not to approve
the final plat until we have the irrigation system approved. There is a major irrigation
line going through there, it's now a raised ditch. When a subdivision goes in, it will be a
siphon. If anything pokes a hole in it or if not constructed properly, water will be coming
out. It will probably have about a four -foot head on it and the water will be there from --
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
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when the water goes in until it goes out. And, then, it will have to have a drain or it
possibly would freeze and break the pipes and, then, I'm going to have a real mess. So,
that's about all I have at this time. Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Thank you. Any questions, Council? Okay. Is there anyone else
who would like to provide testimony on this application?
Powell: Ma'am Mayor, Members of the Council, just with regard to the construction of
Venable Lane, one of the things I didn't mention is there is an open ditch, so that's part
of what's at -- the concerns about these property owners in the construction of that.
There is an open ditch that would have to be piped, as well as the construction of the
collector road. It is shown as a collector on our Comprehensive Plan, so I just wanted
to add that additional information.
De Weerd: Thank you, Anna. If there is no other testimony, I will ask the applicant to
come up and provide rebuttal if he would like to.
Stanfield: Yes, Mayor. Thank you. Again, I will try to be as brief as I can. Chris
Brower -- I got his name right. I believe the stub road he's talking to is -- if Anna could
point to that for me. The last map you had from Waterbury to the -- would be the
southwest of the Semanich family trust piece. There is a stub road that Waterbury put
in -- if you could go to the overall map.
Powell: Okay. I know what you mean. Here?
Stanfield: Keep going to the west. That's not a stub road there, but if you go to the
west -- right there. There is a stub road that Waterbury put in and I believe Mr. Brower
was concerned with future connections, as Mr. Semanich's property may develop in the
future with traffic patterns, they are going to be like going to Ustick. I believe that the
comments that you heard at P&Z was our first P&Z meeting where we didn't have the
two stub roads going to the north towards Ustick. The layout you have before you we
are providing even distribution within our development and the adjacent development
we have two stubs going to the north and the two the east and stub to the east and we
are pretty much in the middle of that group and those stub streets to Venable, as Mr.
Semanich's ground develops, that road from Waterbury will no doubt be required to
extend to the north towards Ustick. So, it should be a relatively clean shot to Ustick
Road, in my opinion. Construction traffic -- Mr. Brower is right, there is nothing the
developer or I can really do about construction traffic on public right of way. There is
nothing really anybody can do, as long as they are not violating state laws or city
ordinances, but we can encourage them through lot sale documents, purchase
agreements, we can -- Mr. Wood -- Mr. Jeff Wood of Woodside can help put conditions
on the purchases and the construction of the homes, we can mention things during the
pre -con about accesses and really manage the site, so we can help do everything we
can, but, unfortunately, Mr. Brower is right, once it's a public right of way there is not a
lot you can do to stop anybody from using it. Mr. Semanich is concerned about
Venable. I believe in a nutshell Mr. Semanich saying please treat him -- if you approve
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March 16, 2004
Page 28 of 43
this tonight, please, treat him the same way that you're having us do on Venable. Is that
correct? And with that we have already offered tonight to relinquish our rights.
Obviously, if Mr. Semanich chooses to develop his property, he may want to improve
Venable if he purchases it and turn it into a road, but, you know, that would be up to him
if we wants to. But treat him the same way you are us and with that I'll stand for any
questions.
De Weerd: Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: Madam Mayor. Just to clarify, we were talking about this stub street over here.
If I heard correctly, Mr. Browers comments were that if this becomes a congested
intersection, which it is currently, and you put a road here and, then, your straight shot is
here, that becomes the path of least resistance. I didn't hear his comment being here, I
heard it as a shortcut from there to there.
Stanfield: Well, if that's his comment, I apologize, but, sure, that can happen. But,
again, the city's Comprehensive Plan is very clear as to and through and stub road
wherever possible. If you don't want a stub road there, I'll take the stub road off. But
your Comprehensive Plan is very clear on the even distribution of traffic to all properties
around. So, that's why we put it there. But that's a true statement. If there is
congestion there, anything could happen, but that's where the design of the future
neighborhood center would be the key there. Traffic control devices. Curvilinear
streets. Calming devices. Stuff to discourage that short cutting. That's what I would
look for in the City of Meridian review of that future neighborhood center. And is all we
are trying to do with this project is provide a buffer to that future neighborhood center,
which is due north of us -- actually, we clip the north part this project, so the best I can
do is provide a buffer between the existing land uses to the more intense uses of the
neighborhood land center -- or neighborhood center and, then, the neighborhood center
take over from there with proper land use planning, proper roadway alignments and just
followed through.
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Mr. Stanfield, I guess I forgot to ask you when you were up here for the first time,
but could you explain a little bit about the open space in this subdivision?
Stanfield: The open space -- Anna, if you could flip to the preliminary plat. The open
space consists of -- in the southwest corner you see a rather large lot with that one and
an octagon around there, that's not a storm water pond, that's a rather large lot --
actually, to the east yet, that whole -- yeah. That whole lot is an open space lot that will
be landscaped and, then, a pathway along to the south, which will be an extension of
the Clearbrook pathway open space and I think we have also provided whether --
definition of usable or not, we felt we should do it anyway along the westerly boundary
along the majority of the portions of the west boundary do we have a ten foot buffer
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March 16, 2004
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between the existing Venable Lane and the back of these new lots, to kind of create a
buffer, not knowing what's going to happen to Venable in the future. Again, that --
Nary: And this would be the homeowners that are supposed to maintain -- I wonder if
the association is going to maintain this landscape lot along this back road --
Stanfield: No. You're pointing to Venable Lane. To the east of where you're pointing or
to the right there is a ten foot strip and it would be an HOA landscape buffer, just like
any buffer in any residential subdivision.
Nary: How big is this here?
Stanfield: Let me look at my cheat sheet here. I don't have it broken out, but 63,000
square feet is the combination of that and the portions of the drain where we are going
to put a pathway.
Nary: And it's not a drainage lot?
Stanfield: Correct. Correct. If you can refer to the upper right of the preliminary plat
you're going to see a roadway section that you probably haven't seen before. ACHD
just recently adopted that. That's for certain areas that need certain criteria that's driven
by groundwater. This site meets that criteria. So, in a sense, you have a detached
sidewalk with a wide buffer strip between the edge of the road and the face of the
detached, that's a depressed swale with a sand filter strip down the middle with top soil
on the top to act as a grassy borrow ditch in a sense. So, we have no concentrated
storm water systems in this project. So, correct, Councilmember Nary, that won't be a
drainage lot. Provide a nice good access to the pathway.
Nary: Thank you.
Stanfield: Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Any further questions? Okay. Thank you.
Stanfield: Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Council, what's your preference to move on this item?
Wardle: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: I just have a quick comment about the neighborhood association, just from the
items I've seen from Planning and Zoning and this letter here. It seems strange to me
that the developer would, essentially, not pay any attention to what looked to me like a
fairly unified effort for a group to come forward and ask for their ideas to be heard and
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
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so I -- part of the trouble that I have here is the fact that we had a pretty diplomatic
approach by the neighborhood association to express their concerns and even in the
minutes some direction to potentially meet with those members and it wasn't done and
so I'm having a hard time getting by that on this project here.
De Weerd: Thank you, Mr. Wardle. Any other comments or --
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I guess I'd echo the same comments that Mr. Wardle had. I'm just flat out
amazed that you would have the homeowners association come to the Planning and
Zoning Commission -- and I recognize that the plan they may have proposed may not
have worked, but to come to Planning and Zoning Commission, to then have
encouragement from the Planning and Zoning Commission to meet with neighbors and
discuss their concerns and for that never to happen, I am having a hard time. I have
some other concerns about the level of intensity and whether or not this R-8 use is
appropriate in this location as an attempted buffer between developments that haven't
occurred yet and the developments that are, but without meeting with those
homeowners -- and I guess I don't accept Mr. Stanfield's explanation as very valid, so I
can't support this particular application.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I would echo and second those thoughts, because I feel that we have done -- we
need to go back to some R -4's, but -- we need to go back to some R -4's butting up
against R -4's and I think that is it. I think that by not meeting with the homeowners
association was disrespectful after being asked to and I'm like Council Nary, I cannot
support this in the configuration that it's being brought forth.
De Weerd: Thank you. Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: Madam Mayor, not to continue, but I will add my thought in terms of the
adjacent subdivisions, the zoning that's there in terms of an R-4. I think that there ought
to be some consistency in this area. As far as the issues of public streets and access to
this parcel, if it's going to develop, the existing street has to be used, so I don't know
that there is a solution for that, that's what they are for. This is an example of things
kind of working backwards or it would be nice to develop from the core to the arterials,
but that being said, at some point in time when this property develops, exiting city
streets, public streets, are going to have to be utilized. My main concern, though, is to
get consistency with the adjacent zoning and it seems that that whole area is R-4 -- I
don't see any attempts to transition to R-4, other than a few smaller lots -- or larger lots
and I don't see any attempt, possibly, to transition or think about what might happen
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March 16, 2004
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with the community or area, commercial center, as well. So, I can't voice any approval
for this particular project either.
De Weerd: Okay.
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Yeah. I would give one more point I guess to follow up on what Councilman
Rountree said. I mean I understand the rational by the developer of relinquishing the
rights of Venable Lane, but I think I agree with Mr. Semanich, the intent here is, then, to
not have to help develop that in the future and place that burden on the remaining
property owners. Eventually, all of them will do the same and we will have that dead
strip in the middle there that can't be developed and I just can't support that. I just think
it's a bad idea, I think it's bad policy.
De Weerd: And that certainly isn't a solution. We have had a session of your opinions.
The Public Hearing has not been closed, but the application has provided rebuttal.
Would you like to recognize any further testimony? Okay. Would you like to provide
some testimony? Is the testimony you provide tonight the truth, the whole truth, and
nothing but the truth, so help you God?
Wood: Yes, ma'am.
De Weerd: Thank you. Please state your name and address.
Wood: My name is Jeff Wood. My address is 1282 East Braemere and I had
mentioned to Scott that when we first put our preliminary plans together, we met with
staff and it was actually designed as an R-4 subdivision, with a total of 59 lots. Based
on feedback from staff, they explained to us that because we are so close to the
community center and, in fact, it converges with the north part of this proposed
subdivision, that we go back and revise that plat, which we did. We, then, came back
with a revised plat with 69 lots. So, we, you know, reduced the density, went through
staff review once more and their comment was we need to reduce -- or increase the
density of the subdivision yet again. So, we have now revised the plat I think four or five
times to try to accommodate all the various interests. So, I would just, you know, submit
to you that we have started out as R-4 and, then, ultimately, based on commentary,
feedback, we have, you know, arrived at this configuration. With respect to Venable
Lane, unfortunately, I don't own Venable Lane and Venable Lane is for sale. You know,
one of the options that the city would have would be to purchase Venable Lane and that
might be an alternative that, you know, you could consider, but, you know,
unfortunately, I don't have any control over that piece of property and I can't see how
you would, you know, suspend any activity around Venable Lane while that gets
resolved. So, those are my perspectives. I would be happy to answer any questions.
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
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De Weerd: Any questions?
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Mr. Wood, then, in all that time how long have you been working and revising that
plat?
Wood: We started with this project in -- in -- I believe it was in. June of 2003. So, we
have been actively working to try and come up with a concept that would work for both
the community center, as well as the neighborhood and what we also tried to do was
scale the lots so that we could accommodate a transition from R-4 to R-8 and, then, we
have also got our CC&Rs designed such that the configuration of a house that should
be very compatible with the existing subdivisions.
Nary: And in that nine months you couldn't meet with other homeowners associations
to discuss their concerns?
Wood: To be honest with you, I was not aware of the concerns, other than as Scott had
mentioned, we had been in a number of discussions. I saw the revised plat that the
homeowners had suggested. I didn't see quite how that was going to work and, then,
we pursued, just as Scott had -- Mr. Stanfield had mentioned, through the various
agencies, the fire department and ACRD, to try and determine was that feasible to try
and move forward with that.
Wardle: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: Mr. Wood -- and you say you started this as an R-4 and so this is just kind of a
comment. What I heard from your representative was one of the reasons they did not
meet with the homeowners association is because a reduction in density or to decrease
lots would make this project, essentially, unaffordable to develop and so I guess the fact
that you're now telling us that it was originally an R-4, however, you couldn't go back to
that, even if the homeowners wanted it, it just -- well, it confuses me.
Wood: Yeah. Well, we had a completely different configuration of the roadways and
the streets. We did not have the two stub streets going north, so all of that was taken
into consideration with further, you know, discussion and review. I'm not sure -- I mean
we would have to go back and, you know, revise this again. I don't know that that
makes any sense, but --
Wardle: You can see my concern that not taking into account the homeowners
concerns, because they were asking for a reduction in lots when you tell me you started
out with 59. That doesn't make any sense to me.
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March 16, 2004
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De Weerd: I guess I would just add -- I know where our staff is coming from. With the
neighborhood center it does support higher densities and so I do know what they were
trying to communicate with you and you have tried to do some transitioning and as
Councilman Rountree mentioned, these trips within the subdivision will filter out into the
other surrounding neighborhoods as well and we need that connectivity. I guess my
concern is the same as Council's and I realize I do not have a vote, but I did want to at
least explain from the neighborhood standpoint -- neighborhood center standpoint, the
support of that is such that the higher densities are a part of that. The transitioning from
the surrounding neighborhoods are important and being a good neighbor and
communicating and sitting down with the neighbors is part of an ordinance that we have
adopted. We don't require it, we strongly encourage it, and what I have seen
throughout the process is that has been encouraged throughout the process, yet it
never happened. And so that would be one big concern. And the lane -- I realize you
don't own it, you own an access or an easement to it.
Wood: Correct.
De Weerd: That makes you part of the solution to what happens to it and, again, it
gives us the process to encourage that by denying annexation or zoning and platting
and all of that to encourage people to sit down together, because this is the only tool we
have to encourage neighbors sitting down together and finding solutions before they
become a major issue to our city and it's not to just the three involved, it becomes a
larger issue and we have had experience with that and I don't think any of us want to go
down that -- forgive the pun -- lane again. So -- and that's probably -- we have a history
with this kind of experience and this is our only way of assuring that these kind of things
are worked out.
Wood: I understand. Well -- and I think as Mr. Stanfield mentioned, there was a 30 foot
spite strip, you know, is what I understood it to be called right here and I purchased that,
so that we could, in fact, provide connectivity into Indian Rocks Road. So, you know, I
guess from a developer's standpoint I can only go so far, you know, to try and, you
know, work through all issues. And I do understand that there -- you know, we clearly
should have addressed some of the concerns of the homeowners in Salisbury and we
can certainly go back and do that. I think if -- you know, again, with better
understanding of what we envision for the subdivision, how we are going to provide that
transition, you know, some of those concerns would probably be allayed.
De Weerd: Any further comment?
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
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March 16, 2004
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Rountree: I have a question for Mr. Wood. You indicated that, obviously, you don't own
the lane, but it's for sale. Who owns it and adjacent -- adjacent parcel or is it a separate
described piece of property that's for sale that's long and narrow or what's the situation?
Wood: My understanding it is a long and narrow strip of land and I don't honestly know
who the landowner is, maybe it's Mr. Venable, I mean -- it may be a part of the Venable
family; I'm just not sure. It was my understanding that it was a parcel that was for sale.
Rountree: Okay. Thank you.
Powell: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Anna.
Powell: Commissioner Rountree, it is owned by Erlin and Carl Venable. So, it is owned
by the Venables.
De Weerd: And it is just the lane; correct?
Powell: Correct. I believe it's 40 feet wide.
De Weerd: A valuable piece of property.
Powell: Mr. Stanfield had told us before it was -- its about an acre in area total and it
was -- they were asking about 40,000 or something like that for it the last time it was on
the market. It is not on the market currently, as I understand.
De Weerd: And, again, I guess it would be just -- it would be nice if the three property
owners that are affected by that lane could sit down and discuss how to best proceed
with that. And, again, that's our -- this is our only opportunity to encourage those kind of
gatherings.
Wardle: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: I have a process question for Anna. From what I have heard from the
developer, they are willing to go back and work with the neighbors and maybe redraw
the project. How do we do that from this Public Hearing, if they are willing to do so?
Powell: I believe you can remand it back to the Planning and Zoning Commission for
redesign. If you're trying to get at the Venable Lane issues, that would pull in a lot of
different properties and it would have to be re -noticed and probably start over, really. If
you just want them to address the specifics of this property, then, you probably could
remand that back to the Planning and Zoning Commission after their meeting with the
neighborhood associations.
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
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De Weerd: Thank you.
Powell: Madam Mayor, Councilman Wardle, if you do remand it back, you should be
very clear to the Planning and Zoning Commission on what you're looking for as far as a
revised plat.
De Weerd: Council, what is your pleasure here?
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I got a question for staff. For Anna. When they come in with an R-4, why would
we suggest R-8 when everything around it is an R-4? I realize the higher density is
around the centers, but -- I mean it just don't -- we have battles every time on this and I
don't blame the R-4 people from not wanting smaller lots up against the -- up against
their R-4 property.
Powell: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council the current R-4, if you just develop at
R-4 standards, really gets you less than three units to the acre. The Comprehensive
Plan does call for three to eight units to the acre. The neighborhood centers to support
any type of retail development or commercial development do need a little extra density
around them. If the applicant were to go with an R-4, there wouldn't be an opportunity
to hit the three units to the acre with a straight subdivision. So, staff, because a portion
of the property is within the neighborhood center, did feel it was appropriate to have an
R-8 designation and what we see like -- what we saw on Redfeather the other night was
that they were able to make that transition from some of the larger lots to the smaller
lots and still maintain the density. Now, they had a planned development application
before them, so the designation of R-4 and R-8, effectively, didn't make any difference.
Were the lots the same size or even smaller than the ones you're seeing tonight? Yes,
they were. If we are forcing folks to go into the planned development side of always
having to do a planned development to hit those target densities, it really doesn't have
any -- it doesn't really benefit them. You're getting the same design whether it's R-4 or
R-8. So, I guess staff, in the interest of trying to provide a more predictable, although
perhaps not in this case -- more predictable processing and less additional bureaucratic
papers to go through, does try and get people to a zoning category that matches what
the proposed density should be. Now, if R-8 -- if you could actually hit eight units to the
acre with R-8 -- now that would be a scary thing, but -- well, maybe not, but I mean you
can't even get close to eight units to the acre with the R-8 zoning. The R-4 zoning is
really something less than three units to the acre, once you meet all -- you know, once
you put in 25 percent of it as roads and, then, the landscaping requirements and the
minimum lot width, it just doesn't work out to four units to the acre. I guess that's -- I'm
done justifying my existence here, so I hope you will forgive me for my preaching for a
moment, but that is why we encouraged them to go with an R-8 is to hit some of those
minimum -- minimum densities within the Comprehensive Plan as well.
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 36 of 43
De Weerd: Testimony is over. I'm sorry.
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: Yeah. And I understand where you're coming from, Anna. I think, though, what
Mr. Bird -- which I agree with this. I mean on this end when you are butting up against
existing homes versus this end where you're not, I can understand that. But, you know,
I don't know that you're really impacting this neighborhood center by having a lower
density in this portion. We heard from the prior application there was 1,000 homes right
here, so it's not like it's not going to be able to support this commercial use in this area
there. So, I mean I understand what -- your rational from the staffs standpoint is, but I
mean this is just, you know, a small - two small a piece to try to mix those two policy
types of arguments together in my mind, because you have got those neighbors, you
have got their issues and concerns in the levels of density and, to be honest, I mean
this particular application is about as bare minimum as you can get. I mean 5.2 percent
of open space and -- I mean it is about as sparse and minimum standard as you can get
for what they are wanting in that area, so -- I mean I don't disagree with what your staff
view was and your view is, but I just think in this one when you're talking about butting
up against the other neighbors and the like, there has got to be at least some of that
discussion and that's what was attempted to be done in meeting those property owners
that are adjacent concerns and that didn't get done. And for nine months that never got
done, you know, I'm not very sympathetic to this particular project.
Powell: Madam Mayor, Councilman Nary, I guess all I want to say is that it sometimes -
- well, I believe oftentimes its not the density that's necessarily proposed, it's how it's
proposed. Its the design. And I guess I hate to see the city discouraging 3.65 units to
the acre as being too dense in an area that we have said is suitable for three to eight
units to the acre and just to say that maybe it's a design issue and not the density of the
lots. Perhaps it's the design of the subdivision.
De Weerd: Well, it could be the design and it could be the lack of coordination with the
surrounding neighbors.
Powell: Yes. And that's part of that coordination, yeah, the design fails in that aspect,
so --
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: Just a thought. Anna, as I think a lot of the people don't -- it's not the -- how many
units per acre, it's the size of the lots. There is a lot of difference in the width and the
size of an R-8 zone and an R-4 and when you're backing up to an R-4 subdivision, I
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 37 of 43
mean you're going basically with one and a half lots on every lot of an R-4 if they are
done in the standard 80 -by -100's or 100 -by -80 and your -- because there is difference in
the square footage. Its like with Redfeather, I mean they took and put some awful
large, wide lots where they butted up against the R -2's out there and, then, they did the
other. These have not been done that way in my book and not going before the -- and
meeting with the neighbors, homeowners, like I think other Councilman have said, in
nine months, that's just not acceptable.
De Weerd: So, what is your pleasure on this? What direction do you want to go?
Wardle: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: And since I brought up the -- how do we get the neighbors involved and the
idea to remand that back to Planning and Zoning was brought up, the more testimony I
hear the more I have concerns -- and I think the Council shares this -- about the total
project itself, along with the access to Venable and I agree with Anna, I don't think those
are things that can probably be mitigated with a simple remand to -- I should take that
back, not simple, but with a remand to the Planning and Zoning Commission.
De Weerd: Okay. Would you like to close the Public Hearing, then?
Wardle: Madam Mayor, I move that we close the Public Hearing on Items 13 and 14.
Nary: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. It's been moved and seconded to close the public hearings on Items
13 and 14. All those in favor say aye. Okay. All ayes. Motion carried.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: Is there any further discussion before I hear a motion? If not, I would
entertain a motion.
Wardle: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Wardle.
Wardle: I move that we deny AZ 03-036, Salisbury Subdivision No. 2, and incorporate
all staff, public, and applicant comments.
Nary: Second.
Bird: Madam Mayor?
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 38 of 43
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: When we have denials you have got to give specific reasons, Shaun, in your
motion.
Nary: I think -- I guess from the second's standpoint, I think the specific reasons is the
lack of coordination with the surrounding property owners, both on the east and western
boundaries of this property, trying to incorporate some planning for the uses along
Venable Lane, as well as access or improvements in the future on Venable Lane, as
well as the -- I guess the preliminary plat would be the compatibility of the zone. So, I
think probably for the purposes of annexation is that adequate do you think, Mrs.
Holinka?
Bird: I think that's --
Holinka: Yes.
Nary: Okay.
Wardle: And the maker of the motion would like to add that to his motion, if the second
agrees.
Nary: I would concur.
De Weerd: Thank you. What a great team you are. Okay. It's been moved and
seconded to deny AZ 03-036. Is there any further discussion? Hearing none, Mr.
Clerk, will you call roll.
Roll -Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Nary, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
De Weerd: Okay. Item 14. Mr. Wardle. I guess this is immaterial, because we don't
have an annexation, but we still need a motion.
Wardle: Madam Mayor, I move that we deny PP 03-042, preliminary plat for Salisbury
Subdivision No. 2, because we did not annex the property into the city.
Nary: Second.
De Weerd: It's been moved and seconded to deny PP 03-042. Any further discussion?
Okay. Mr. Berg.
Roll -Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Nary, yea.
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 39 of 43
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 15: Public Hearing: CUP 03-072 Request for a Conditional Use Permit for a
drive-thru window for a proposed coffee shop for Central Park Plaza by
Nahas Enterprises — northeast corner of South Progress Avenue and
Central Drive:
De Weerd: Okay. Item 16 -- or 15, I'm sorry, is Public Hearing on CUP 03-072 for
Central Park Plaza. We will start with staff comments.
Powell: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, we are not on Venable Lane any
longer. There we are. We are -- sorry about that. The subject property is a portion of
what is on the one lot within an existing subdivision. It's -- Winco is right here and
Home Depot down here, so -- and this is the canal going back through. So, it's currently
an undeveloped site. The subject application is, actually, just on a portion of what's
outlined here. They are still working on the final plat, I believe. So, as you see here,
this is the lot. This is the proposed building. It is 16,490 square feet for the entire retail
building. The proposed coffee shop that will -- that will have the drive-thru is 1,500
square feet and it's located right down here. So, the drive-thru portion is right along
there and, then, comes back out onto this kind of large shared drive that goes up to
Progress Avenue. They have shown the whole site here. They are coming in for a
number of certificates of zoning compliance. This is the only one with a proposed drive-
thru, so this is the only one that's subject to the applicant, but we did want to let you see
the entire site. There is an odd little parking area here that was discussed at the
Planning and Zoning Commission. This, as you will note, is not connected to the rest of
the parking drive aisles. Tony Roma's, which is going in this location here, requires that
their staff have a separate parking area separate from the parking that will be used by
customers. So, this is the parking for this structure here and that was discussed
probably more than Mr. Strite would have wanted at the last hearing. Billy Ray Strite of
BRS Architects was at the Planning and Zoning Commission hearing. He did testify in
favor of the application. No one spoke in opposition. The request for the drive-thru
does come forward with a recommendation of approval from the Planning and Zoning
Commission. As I said, there was some discussion about the cross -access between
these two lots. Staff was pushing for a cross -access agreement. In the event that this
changed ownerships, we didn't like the idea of having a parking lot here that you
couldn't get to the rest of the parking area. It's just kind of considered, in general, poor
planning. There was a reason for it right now, but we thought that there might not be a
reason in the future, so the Commission is recommending that the applicant revise the
development CC&Rs to include a cross -access agreement between the subject
property and the joint parking lot for Tony Roma's. And with that I will end staffs
presentation.
De Weerd: Thank you, Anna. Any questions at this point? Thank you. Bill Ray, were
you here when I swore everyone in? Apparently not. Is the testimony you provide
tonight the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 40 of 43
Strite: It is.
De Weerd: Thank you. Please state your name and address.
Strite: Madam Mayor, Members of the Council, Billy Ray Strite, 1010 Allante, Boise,
Idaho. I really don't have very much to say. I think the first page of the staff report was
-- as outstanding issues for City Council, none. I will suggest to you that we did change
the CC&Rs and, as a matter of fact, the REAS are revised and provided -- I believe
those are in the staffs hands now, which did, in fact, create lots -- what we referred to
as D and E, that being the southeast corner of that site, the Tony Roma's, quote, private
parking, is now a part of the REAS throughout and cross -access is, in fact, available if
something should happen and Tony Roma's should not use the site any further. The
remainder of the staff report is fine. We agreed to all the conditions. It comes before
you with a recommendation for approval. So, unless you have any questions of me, I'm
going home. Thank you.
De Weerd: Any questions for Billy Ray before he goes home?
Nary: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Nary.
Nary: I was pretty ambivalent until I saw Tony Roma's on this thing, but -- but on the
building that we are actually concerned with where the drive-thru is, is the rest of that
building just going to be detached from that coffee area or is it just -- is it going to be like
separated like a smaller shopping complex -- I mean separated stores or is it just one
big building -- oh, there it is. Okay. I guess I missed that one. So, that's all I wanted. I
just didn't know how it was divided up, but -- all right. Thank you.
De Weerd: Okay. Any further questions? Thank you very much
Strite: Thank you.
De Weerd: Is there anyone else who would like to provide testimony on this
application? Okay. Council?
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: I move we close the Public Hearing for Item 15, CUP 03-072.
Bird: Second.
De Weerd: It's been moved and seconded to close the Public Hearing on Item 15. All
those in favor say aye. All ayes. Motion carried.
Meridian Clty Council
March 16, 2004
Page 41 of 43
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: Hearing no discussion, I move that we approve Item 15 for a Conditional Use
Permit, 03-072, for Central Park Plaza, incorporating all staff comments and testimony
received tonight by applicant.
Bird: Second.
De Weerd: It's been moved and seconded to approve CUP 03-072 for Central Park
Plaza. Any further discussion? Mr. Clerk.
Roll -Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Nary, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 16: Water, Sewer and Trash Delinquencies:
De Weerd: Goodnight, Billy Ray. Okay. Item 16 is water, sewer, trash delinquencies.
This is to inform you in writing, if you so choose, that you have the right to a pre-
termination hearing at 7:30 p.m., Tuesday, March 16th, 2004, before the Mayor and City
Council to appear in person to be judged on the facts and to defend the claim made by
this city that your water, sewer, and trash bill is delinquent. You may retain counsel.
Your service will be discontinued on March 17th, 2004, unless payment is received in
full. Is there anyone present who wishes to contest his or her water, sewer, and trash
delinquency? Seeing none, they are hereby informed that they may appeal or have the
decision of the city reviewed by the Fourth Judicial District Court pursuant to Idaho
State Code. Even though they appeal, their water will be shut off. The amount of the
turn-off list is $33,205.24. Council, do I have a motion?
Bird: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I move we approve the turn-off list for delinquency to be discontinued on March
17th, 2004, unless payment is received in full. The amount of delinquency is
$33,205.24.
De Weerd: Do I have a second?
Nary: Second.
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 42 of 43
De Weerd: Its been moved and seconded to approve the delinquency turn-off list. Mr.
Clerk, will you call roll.
Roll -Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Nary, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
Item 17: Ordinance No. Administrative
Assistant to the Mayor:
De Weerd: Thank you. Okay. Item 17 is an Ordinance No. 04-1071, Administrative
Assistant to the Mayor Ordinance. Mr. Clerk, will you, please, read this by title only.
Berg: Thank you, Madam Mayor, Members of the Council. Ordinance No. 04-1071, an
Ordinance of the City of Meridian enacting this new Section 4 of Chapter 6 of Title 1,
Mayor, to be known as administrative assistant to the Mayor, providing for
administrative assistant to the Mayor as an at -will employee, providing for section of the
administrative assistant, providing for the administrative assistant salary to be in
conformity with the city wide salary range, providing for conflict, validity, savings clause,
and providing for an effective date.
De Weerd: We had this on our agenda last week. This is just the clean up to have the
position as it was intended to be, so it's -- yeah, six years ago. Just more of a clean up.
Is there any discussion or do I have a motion to approve this ordinance?
Rountree: Madam Mayor?
De Weerd: Mr. Rountree.
Rountree: I move that we approve Ordinance 04-1071 with suspension of rules.
Bird: Second.
De Weerd: Okay. It's been moved and seconded to approve Ordinance 04-1071. Mr.
Clerk, will you call roll.
Roll -Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Nary, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES
Item 18: Executive Session.
De. Weerd: Thank you. Okay. We added an Item 18 and that is the executive session
carried over from the pre -Council meeting. Do I have a motion?
Bird: Madam Mayor?
Meridian City Council
March 16, 2004
Page 43 of 43
De Weerd: Mr. Bird.
Bird: I move we go into executive session as per Idaho State Code 67-2345(1)(b) and
(c).
Rountree: Second.
De Weerd: It's been moved and seconded to adjourn into Executive Session. It is, I
think, ten after 9:00. Mr. Clerk, will you call roll.
Roll -Call: Bird, yea; Rountree, yea; Wardle, yea; Nary, yea.
MOTION CARRIED: ALL AYES.
EXECUTIVE SESSION:
MEETING ADJOURNED AT 10:39 P.M.
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